Khabibulin and LeCavalier [Archive]

Sotnos

09-20-2003, 01:04 PM

Lecavalier
goals:43
assists:50
points:93
+/-:-5
PIM:105
GWG:11
PP pts: 41

Khabibulin
Wins:29
GAA:2.38
SV%:912
SO's:7
I'd put the points for Vinny a little lower, but 93 is within reach. PIMs around 40-50, no way does he get 100 IMO. GWG he only had 3 last year, so not too sure on that one. Only had 24 PPP last year, but if he gets around 90 pts that will definitely go higher.

I'd put Khabi's wins slightly higher, he had 30 last year in 65 games, should get 30-35 this year. His save and GAA I'd hope would be higher, but not sure, we're thinking he'll rebound and get that save % around .92

monster_bertuzzi

09-20-2003, 06:24 PM

I'd put the points for Vinny a little lower, but 93 is within reach. PIMs around 40-50, no way does he get 100 IMO. GWG he only had 3 last year, so not too sure on that one. Only had 24 PPP last year, but if he gets around 90 pts that will definitely go higher.

I'd put Khabi's wins slightly higher, he had 30 last year in 65 games, should get 30-35 this year. His save and GAA I'd hope would be higher, but not sure, we're thinking he'll rebound and get that save % around .92

^Didnt Lecavalier get into several fights last year? I think he will hit 100+PIM's because, if I remember correctly, he has a temper and sticks up for his teammates (being a big guy).

Erack82

09-20-2003, 06:33 PM

I think both 100 and 40 are a little off. I say around the ballpark of 70 is more realistic.

Sotnos

09-20-2003, 06:54 PM

He got in one fight that I can recall, averages one or two a year.

He only had 40 PIMs last year, but now that I look, he had around 60 the two years previous. Somewhere around there is more likely than 40 now that I think about it.

100? I really doubt it. He sticks up for his teammates by delivering a nice check to whoever was messing with them (ocassionally), but he's not exactly an enforcer. :) Temper? Nah, not particularly, Andre Roy is the one with the temper on this team! :D Vinny won't get pushed around, but rarely does he go ballistic on someone.

Shappa

09-20-2003, 10:38 PM

PhoPhan

09-21-2003, 05:06 AM

Thanks guys.

Vincent_TheGreat

10-15-2003, 11:12 AM

I'd put the points for Vinny a little lower, but 93 is within reach. PIMs around 40-50, no way does he get 100 IMO. GWG he only had 3 last year, so not too sure on that one. Only had 24 PPP last year, but if he gets around 90 pts that will definitely go higher.

I'd put Khabi's wins slightly higher, he had 30 last year in 65 games, should get 30-35 this year. His save and GAA I'd hope would be higher, but not sure, we're thinking he'll rebound and get that save % around .92

I agree 93 is atainable, I would say 85-90 and 7 game winners.

joeminus

10-15-2003, 04:34 PM

I agree 93 is atainable, I would say 85-90 and 7 game winners.

With Affy and Feds as his wingers, you guys are really confident Vinny can score 40G and 90 points? Wow. Maybe I'm overly pessimistic, but I strongly disagree.

didjuicythat

10-15-2003, 04:39 PM

With Affy and Feds as his wingers, you guys are really confident Vinny can score 40G and 90 points? Wow. Maybe I'm overly pessimistic, but I strongly disagree.

I agree with your disagreement. I too doubt very highly Lecavalier will reach the 90 points plateau this season, unless he can put up good numbers on the powerplay unit. You can't expect too much from the guy, as he's playing with Fedotenko and Afanasenkov on the 2nd line.

With that being said, I think 75 points is more realistic for Vinny.

Sotnos

10-16-2003, 04:23 AM

With Affy and Feds as his wingers, you guys are really confident Vinny can score 40G and 90 points? Wow. Maybe I'm overly pessimistic, but I strongly disagree.
This thread is from a month ago, joe, I was probably assuming Stillman-Lecav-Willis. :D

You could put Vinny's #s lower now that we know who he's playing with, but then again the way Coach changes up the lines, that might not even last through one more game!

I still say no way to 100 PIMs, however.

joeminus

10-16-2003, 08:58 AM

This thread is from a month ago, joe ...

Whoops. :)

Rschmitz

10-16-2003, 11:05 AM

Your all right about one thing, none of you have any faith in Afenasenkov, Fedotenko, and especially Vinny. Lecavalier helped make Prospal into the teams leading scorer, and considering Fed's had 19 last year when he played primarily with the emphatic duo of Alexeev and Svitov with time on the pk the second half of the season; should reassure the fact that he wasn't given the greatest oppurtunity to succeed(not saying his play warranted a spot next to Lecavalier last season though). Afenasenkov has great offensive tools as well, a true sniper that Lecavalier hasn't had since his second year in the league with Modin.

I don't think 80-90 points and 30-40 G's is out of the question, and as long as Fed's and Afenasenkov stay on his line I think Fed's can have 20 G's and 40 pts and Afenasenkov can have around 25-30 goals too. Its not like they are throwing Cigar, Richer, or Todd Warriner on the ice; these guys have offensive weapons and something to prove.

Oceanic39*

10-16-2003, 11:46 AM

25-30 goals for Afanasenkov?

Are you serious?

A true sniper? Ummm... no. He's got a great shot and is in that mold, but if he was a true sniper he would have had 2-3 goals last game (he had some prime opportunities) and this would not be the first time he's starting the year in the NHL.

While he may be on pace for 82 goals, let's let Afanasenkov try to stay in the league for the first month or two of the season before we have him as a 30 goal guy. If the guy can pot 15 I'll be ecstatic, and I've been a fan of Afanasenkov since his days with Sherbrooke.

Lecavalier helped Prospal's assist numbers, yes, by potting a few goals. Lecavalier is not going to get that kind of passing from either Fedotenko (not a good passer) or Afanasenkov (below average creater).

We've seen Lecavalier with inferior linemates in the past and he's struggled. He needs at least one top-notch guy with him. Why Torts doesn't move STL to that line, or gives Stillman another try, is beyond me.

The predictions from the majority here are pretty correct.

Rschmitz

10-16-2003, 04:53 PM

He's got a great shot and is in that mold

which is essentially what im trying to say

and this would not be the first time he's starting the year in the NHL.

yeah it would

Unless you had a blind fold on for the whole Pheonix game you all would have seen the passes and oppurtunities Afenasenkov was in. Hitting the cross bar after manuevering his way around the Coyote defenseman and deeking Boucher only to hit the crossbar. Then the pass he sent to Vinny on a wide open net after he had the Pheonix defenseman and goalie...and unfortunatly even Lecavalier fooled that he was going to shoot.

You can say your an Afenasenkov fan all you want, but the fact that all of you didn't even want the kid signed yet alone are hounding on him now that Willis is in the AHL is remarkable. Im sticking by my 25-30 goal prediction, and I SERIOUSLY won't be surprised if he gets it. Id be ecstatic if he got 15 goals on the third line..but on the first line I think its damn near inevitable he will atleast hit the 20 goal plateau, as long as Tortorella doesn't shake up the line for no reason.

Vinny as a center was drafted as a playmaker, and the fact that he hasn't had a sniper on his line has turned him into a goal scorer first. Prospal was a playmaker here and now maybe Vinny can finally do better now that he has a legit sniper on his line.

No I don't mean a proven sniper, but someone who knows what to do with the puck when he get s a pass on his stick with an open net.

Afenasenkov for the Calder trophy

joeminus

10-16-2003, 05:12 PM

... considering Fed's had 19 last year when he played primarily with the emphatic duo of Alexeev and Svitov with time on the pk the second half of the season ...

Fedotenko only played with Svitov and Alexeev for, like, two weeks or so. The line was such a hit at first that TBL.com even held a contest to "Name That Line" (I believe "The Iron Curtain" was the winner), but they had to cancel the contest because Tortorella broke up the line before they even had a chance to look over the entries.

I'd reckon that Fedotenko played no less than 75 percent of his even-strength shifts last year with Lecavalier and Prospal. And while 19 goals is nice, it's not his nose for the net that bothers me. It's his utter lack of offensive instincts or creativity in the offensive zone, his extremely ordinary passing skills and his bewildering inconsistency. The guy's a great two-way forward and I think we'll be able to count on him to chip in 15-20 goals for years to come, but he's not someone you want to cast as the feature winger for one of the brightest young centers in all of hockey.

Neither is Affy. He could be down the road (and even that's a long shot), but not right now. He's played well through two games, but there are 80 more to go. And don't look now but if you include the pre-season, Vinny Lecavalier is on a pretty long goal-scoring schneid. And of his 3 regular-season assists, 2 have come with different linemates on the PP.

I'm not saying Affy-Vinny-Rusty absolutely WILL NOT work, but it's certainly a risky bet.

petec1978*

10-16-2003, 06:12 PM

That "Iron Curtain" name was horrible. Jesus someone in the marketing/PR department should've been fired for being such a lame *** and picking that name.

Affy/Lecavalier is working from what I see. Fedotenko remains kind of a third wheel. He's very good and moving the puck up with speed through the neutral zone but once he hits the other team's blueline he turns stupid. He's also not terribly strong on the puck or particularly crafty along the walls which means he's only mediocre at times keeping the puck alive cycling it.

The trade-off is that he's responsible defensively. Affy isn't. Lecavalier isn't entirely. They got hemmed in a couple times tonight because of Affy and Lecavalier TO's or miscues. If you move a guy like Willis onto that line, he's got to be a little better than servicable defensively because the other two aren't bluechippers in their own end.

That said, I'd still love to see Lecavalier get TWO scoring wingers for longer than the span of a single playoff series to see what he could do.

-Pete Choquette

joeminus

10-16-2003, 07:47 PM

The trade-off is that he's responsible defensively. Affy isn't. Lecavalier isn't entirely. They got hemmed in a couple times tonight because of Affy and Lecavalier TO's or miscues. If you move a guy like Willis onto that line, he's got to be a little better than servicable defensively because the other two aren't bluechippers in their own end.

Good point. I found it amusing that Lecavalier got the "defensive play of the game" for diving back to poke that puck away. Only reason he had to dive was because he'd been floating earlier on the play looking for a breakaway. But, hey, at least he made the effort and got it done (a year ago he probably wouldn't have). I'm sure he knew Torts would chew his ass if that guy got a shot off.

petec1978*

10-16-2003, 08:14 PM

I'm sure he knew Torts would chew his ass if that guy got a shot off.

I would've been pretty upset too... it was Fairy. It was a big enough indignity that bum got that tip in goal on us.

-Pete Choquette

Oceanic39*

10-17-2003, 04:57 AM

Afanasenkov (notice the spelling, TB FAN, if you're going to pimp the guy, you've got to spell his name right :) ) played very well last night in the offensive zone. He battles along the walls and is somewhat successful. He did create a lot of chance. He also had a goal on his stick with the goalie out of position and took so long to curl his stick for the wrister he lost control of it and blew the scoring chance. That was a sure goal. That's not to take away from him hitting the elbow of the post or him deking out a dman on the end line and coming out in front for a chance before losing the puck.

The kid's good, but 25 goals as a guarantee is a stretch for him.

Erack82

10-17-2003, 06:45 AM

Im sticking by my 25-30 goal prediction, and I SERIOUSLY won't be surprised if he gets it. Id be ecstatic if he got 15 goals on the third line..but on the first line I think its damn near inevitable he will atleast hit the 20 goal plateau, as long as Tortorella doesn't shake up the line for no reason.

25-30 Goal prediction? Wow that is mighty generous. If he sticks around the whole season he could get 15 or so, but almost 30? Yikes.

Rschmitz

10-17-2003, 06:19 PM

heh, I don't have a reputation to uphold so I won't get shelled if im wrong. Affy; Afenasenkov, Afanasenkov, a fan a sink of, w/e the hell his name is =P ...don't get me wrong, maybe my perception is skewed...but its been an awfully LONG time since I've seen someone who could actually deke out a goal tender and get a shot off that it might be getting to my head(well, there was a this little stretch during the playoffs :) ). Im not that surprised; nay, I believe that the correlation between Vinny being one of the bright young up and coming super stars in the league for his first two years and then dropping off production wise and maturity wise the following two years had more to do with Modin being switched to Richards line then Lecavalier actually getting hit with the C and first line duties.

I agree with Fedotenko's assessment, he is deffinatly the weak link offensivly for sure. He can't create anything and only attribute is being able to carry the puck with speed, but even then he looks befuddled. Kind of reminds me of Alexeev-size+defensive awareness+exp to get in position to score the goals. He should get 20 by just skating around the net having pucks bounce off his stick inadvertantly. IMO id much rather have a Willis or even a Clymer on Vinny's line, but if Fedotenko can become a little more aggressive(though he probably would have to sacrifice his D) and acquire some skills with the puck, he COULD be the perfect fit. 20 G's I don't think would be that big of a stretch for him by any means, probably would have had it if he would have spent 90% instead of 75% of the plays on Vinny's line last year.

petec1978*

10-17-2003, 07:14 PM

15-20 goals and 40-45 points would be my prohibitive ceiling on Affy from what I've seen so far. That's not too bad though, because its about what I thought Eero could've given us if he meshed quickly in his rookie season.

-Pete Choquette

aapbolt

10-18-2003, 06:04 PM

While Affy continues to impress- sort of with his play I think he needs to shoot more but he appears to be coming along. The guy who deserves a vote for the calder is Cibak. He is really energizing that third line with clymer and modin. I am really impressed with his ability so far. While Affy might be better Cibak is really doing the job so far. That goal he scored against Broduer tonight was really nice, not hard but a perfect sort of shot that caught Broduer off guard.