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Accord 02-14-2005, 03:20 AM This coming Sunday (2/20) at 8:00 PM on ESPN there is going to be a special PTI episode about the 25th anniversary of the Miracle on Ice followed directly by the actual game itself at 8:30 PM, this is one of the very rare times you'll get to see the actual game... again, ESPN will be showing the actual game, not the movie.
UPDATE: There will be replays of the game on Tuesday night at 8PM and then again at 11:30PM on ESPN Classic. The game will be replayed for a third time on Thursday night at 8PM on ESPN Classic.
shadoz19 02-14-2005, 05:20 AM Sweet, thanks so much. I'll set my Tivo up. :D
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-14-2005, 09:44 AM Cool -- and I recommend the Kurt Russell movie that came out in 2004, too.
ALF AmericanLionsFan 02-14-2005, 09:50 AM Awesome. I can finally tape it. Thanks
Marshall 02-14-2005, 10:07 AM SCORE. Thanks for the heads-up.
Accord 02-14-2005, 06:30 PM If ESPN wasn't owned by Disney, I doubt we'd be seeing it :lol.
Ronnie Bass 02-14-2005, 08:46 PM Sweet, thanks so much. I'll set my Tivo up. :D
Me too!!
:banana:
coyoteshockeyfan 02-14-2005, 08:56 PM You sure its the entire game? It looks like they only have an hour alloted for the special. I really hope I am wrong on this one though.
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tvlistings/schedule?date=20050220&network=1
Accord 02-16-2005, 01:58 PM You sure its the entire game? It looks like they only have an hour alloted for the special. I really hope I am wrong on this one though.
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tvlistings/schedule?date=20050220&network=1
An hour an 18 minutes actually. Yeah, it's the entire game. Back in the glory days games didn't take 3.5 hours, didn't have commercial timeouts, etc. and plus we'll be seeing it with no real stoppages in between periods. 1:18 is more than sufficient to show the whole game.
PecaFan 02-16-2005, 02:44 PM Damn. Board ate my response. Anyways, here we go again.
There's no way that can be a full game. That's 18 minutes over full time. Six minutes a period. Think about it. First off, you have seven goals. That's easily a minute each to celebrate, change lines, drop the puck again.
Which would mean the rest of the game is played at almost real time. No stoppages. Almost no pucks shot into the crowd. Almost no pucks frozen by the goalie. Almost no penalties called.
How about the end of the game? The buzzer goes, they fade to black and end the show? Hardly, there has to be some celebration shown.
No, this will be like other "classic games", they'll cut out sections, those they deem "boring".
MaLockFan 02-16-2005, 03:13 PM I taped this last year when it came on. Its basically the game minus all of the parts that were boring.
Keep in mind that the olympics back then only cut to games here and there so actually the entire game was never broadcast start to finish
IkeaMonkey* 02-16-2005, 05:34 PM Damn. Board ate my response. Anyways, here we go again.
There's no way that can be a full game. That's 18 minutes over full time. Six minutes a period. Think about it. First off, you have seven goals. That's easily a minute each to celebrate, change lines, drop the puck again.
Which would mean the rest of the game is played at almost real time. No stoppages. Almost no pucks shot into the crowd. Almost no pucks frozen by the goalie. Almost no penalties called.
How about the end of the game? The buzzer goes, they fade to black and end the show? Hardly, there has to be some celebration shown.
No, this will be like other "classic games", they'll cut out sections, those they deem "boring".
I'm with this. There is absolutely no possible way there is only 18 minutes overage between the gameclock and real time.
David Puddy 02-16-2005, 05:50 PM I taped this last year when it came on. Its basically the game minus all of the parts that were boring.
Keep in mind that the olympics back then only cut to games here and there so actually the entire game was never broadcast start to finishAre you sure that ABC didn't broadcast the whole game? They wanted it to be played live at 8:00 P.M., but the Soviets blocked that. I was very young at the time, and such things would have been lost on me.
Accord 02-20-2005, 01:27 AM Are you sure that ABC didn't broadcast the whole game? They wanted it to be played live at 8:00 P.M., but the Soviets blocked that. I was very young at the time, and such things would have been lost on me.
This is true, the game was scheduled for 3pm in the afternoon and the Americans wanted to reschedule it for primetime at 8pm but the Soviets did not approve, so the game was played at 3pm and ABC aired it on tape delay during prime time at like 8pm or so.
...Either way, we'll find out later tonight :).
David Puddy 02-20-2005, 05:19 AM This is true, the game was scheduled for 3pm in the afternoon and the Americans wanted to reschedule it for primetime at 8pm but the Soviets did not approve, so the game was played at 3pm and ABC aired it on tape delay during prime time at like 8pm or so.The start time was 5:00 PM. ABC wanted to show it at 8:00 PM. According to Wayne Coffey's book, The Boys of Winter, ABC had agreed to pay the IIHF $125,000 to allow the game to be rescheduled. ABC also checked with four teams, offering them $12,500 each.
Three of the four teams agreed to the deal. The Soviets blocked it because 8:00 PM would be 4:00 AM in Moscow.
What I wanted to know is if the 8:00 PM tape delay was interupted to go to bobsledding or cross-country skiing? I really can't believe that they would have, with the exception of intermissions.
Accord 02-20-2005, 07:32 PM It's starting now, so I guess we're about to find out...
LoveForDaAvs 02-20-2005, 07:40 PM Bah, not the full game :(
Nothing happens during the second period, so I came down here.
Tikanov was dumb to pull Tretiak, even though it appears he was dogging it to get back at the Soviet government for not giving him his work release to join the NHL(or did that happen afterwards, I forgot the story)
ESPN is titling this as the 1980 olympic Semifinal, and almost anytime you hear the media talk about it, it refers to it as the semifinal and the Finland game as the final, but if I'm not mistaken, wasn't it really a round robin format between the 4 finalists with the medals decided by the points teams earn in those games?
stanleycaps98 02-20-2005, 08:37 PM You are correct...the US got a win and a tie before playing Finland ion the last (but not "final") game.
Rails 02-20-2005, 08:42 PM Do you believe in Miracles? YES!
johnny cool 02-20-2005, 08:42 PM every damn time i watch the last ten seconds of this game, I get chills. truly one of the greatest moments in sports history.
Reilly311 02-20-2005, 08:45 PM every damn time i watch the last ten seconds of this game, I get chills. truly one of the greatest moments in sports history.
the call is what makes the entire thing. :handclap:
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-20-2005, 09:41 PM This is a game story from a 1980 edition of The Washington Post. It talks about the complicated medal round system, too:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/longterm/olympics1998/history/memories/80-hock.htm
Ronnie Bass 02-20-2005, 09:57 PM This is a game story from a 1980 edition of The Washington Post. It talks about the complicated medal round system, too:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/longterm/olympics1998/history/memories/80-hock.htm
Great find.
By the way, has anybody remember or know when else Al Micheals did play by play for hockey? Because he's not bad at it at all and I can't recall him ever doing games after that or before it.
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-20-2005, 10:01 PM Great find.
By the way, has anybody remember or know when else Al Micheals did play by play for hockey? Because he's not bad at it at all and I can't recall him ever doing games after that or before it.
Thanx, Lou. I am not sure about hockey but as you probably know he did Reds' baseball in the early 70s right before Marty Brennaman.
Great find.
By the way, has anybody remember or know when else Al Micheals did play by play for hockey? Because he's not bad at it at all and I can't recall him ever doing games after that or before it.
I think he did the 1984 olympics for hockey as well.
Ronnie Bass 02-20-2005, 10:08 PM I think he did the 1984 olympics for hockey as well.
I'm more wondering if he did any play by play before 1980, he had to polish his skills somewhere.
(lone)Yashinfan#79 02-20-2005, 10:29 PM perhaps i am overstating the obvious, but this was THE game of my generation and i grew up on Soviet Hockey (and then Gretzky, like most of us).
any word on when/if there is a re-air of the PTI special?
Kornhoser?
are you out there?
kdb209 02-20-2005, 11:12 PM perhaps i am overstating the obvious, but this was THE game of my generation and i grew up on Soviet Hockey (and then Gretzky, like most of us).
any word on when/if there is a re-air of the PTI special?
Kornhoser?
are you out there?
Well, I missed the broadcast today, but had tivo search for a rebroadcast.
I didn't find a repeat on ESPN, but it came up that ESPN Classic is showing both the USSR game (Tues) and the Finland game (Thurs). Both are 2 hr 30 min, so it looks like the complete games.
clefty 02-20-2005, 11:31 PM Dammit.
Wish I saw this thread on Saturday.
Accord 02-21-2005, 01:37 AM perhaps i am overstating the obvious, but this was THE game of my generation and i grew up on Soviet Hockey (and then Gretzky, like most of us).
any word on when/if there is a re-air of the PTI special?
Kornhoser?
are you out there?
Unfortunately they aren't going to show a repeat of the PTI special, but there will be a couple replays of the actual game itself over the next few days.
Basically a recap of the PTI episode was this:
-They talked about events leading up to the game
-They talked about the political significance of it
-They talked about the actual game itself
-They talked about what it was like after the game as word spread that the USA beat the Soviets
-Then they interviewed Mike Eruzione for 5 minutes and he talked about the team and everything we've all heard before
-Then they had the foodchain segment where they ranked the top 5 upsets in sports history, then they came back and closed out the show.
Wilbon ranked the 1980 Miracle on Ice THIRD, he thinks Cassius Clay beating Sonny Liston and the USSR beating the USA in basketball in the 1972 olympics were both bigger than the 1980 Miracle on Ice :shakehead.
Accord 02-21-2005, 01:41 AM Dammit.
Wish I saw this thread on Saturday.
There will be replays of the game, I just updated the first post in the thread with the replay schedules.
Wilbon ranked the 1980 Miracle on Ice THIRD, he thinks Cassius Clay beating Sonny Liston and the USSR beating the USA in basketball in the 1972 olympics were both bigger than the 1980 Miracle on Ice :shakehead.
Yeah, Wilbon makes himself look dumber every day. He's such a blatant hockey hater. How is the best boxer of all time beating the guy who was the best before him count as the biggest upset ever? And the Basketball game was rigged.
John Flyers Fan 02-21-2005, 11:27 AM Well, I missed the broadcast today, but had tivo search for a rebroadcast.
I didn't find a repeat on ESPN, but it came up that ESPN Classic is showing both the USSR game (Tues) and the Finland game (Thurs). Both are 2 hr 30 min, so it looks like the complete games.
Damn, I don't get ESPN Classic where I live. I'd love to see a replay of the US-Finland game, because I was there. I was young at the time and wish I remembered more:
I can recall waving an little American flag all game long.
They were losing 2-1 after two periods.
Our seats were right at the top of the circle.
Mark Johnson scoring, not sure if it was the tying or winning goal.
John Flyers Fan 02-21-2005, 11:30 AM Nothing happens during the second period, so I came down here.
Tikanov was dumb to pull Tretiak, even though it appears he was dogging it to get back at the Soviet government for not giving him his work release to join the NHL(or did that happen afterwards, I forgot the story)
I don't get why he gets killed for yanking Tretiak as much as he does. Tretiak gave up two brutal goals in the first period. The move seemed to wake the Soviets up as they dominated the 2nd period. Only the brilliance of Craig kept it a one goal game after two periods.
Myshkin (sp?) wasn't an untested goalie. He was in net for game 3 of the NHL - Soviet Challange Cup in 1979, and he beat the NHL stars 6-0.
Matt Foley* 02-21-2005, 11:53 AM I'm more wondering if he did any play by play before 1980, he had to polish his skills somewhere.
I'm pretty sure that Michaels had never called a hockey game in his life before the 1980 Winter Games. I'll try to find a link that testifies to that thought, if I can.
Edit: no links found yet, I'll keep trying. My recollection was that his stock as a broadcaster went through the roof after that Olympics only in part because of the "Do you believe in miracles?" quote, but also for doing such an excellent job calling a sport he had no prior experience working in.
If I also remember correctly, his assignment to the hockey venue was because he was pretty much the low man on the totem pole experience-wise at ABC (that's how low hockey was perceived as by the network compared to other sports, like figure skating and skiing, covered that Olympics). His background was in baseball; ABC hired him in the late 70's as a regional announcer for Monday Night Baseball, I'm pretty sure.
rekrul 02-21-2005, 12:19 PM I don't get why he gets killed for yanking Tretiak as much as he does. Tretiak gave up two brutal goals in the first period. The move seemed to wake the Soviets up as they dominated the 2nd period. Only the brilliance of Craig kept it a one goal game after two periods.
Myshkin (sp?) wasn't an untested goalie. He was in net for game 3 of the NHL - Soviet Challange Cup in 1979, and he beat the NHL stars 6-0.
About the only thing of new I herd in the PTI interview with Erozione was that in his opinion pulling Tretiak was not as big of a deal as it was. He said " its like they pulled Patrick Roy but put in Marty Brodour". Pretty good point I think, also Ken Dryden, who should know a thing or two about Goaltending, during the comentary was pointing out that Tretiak was having a pretty lousy ( by his world class standards ) tourney. In real time anlysis Dryden thought it was a pretty bold but perhaps needed move.
Ronnie Bass 02-21-2005, 12:40 PM I'm pretty sure that Michaels had never called a hockey game in his life before the 1980 Winter Games. I'll try to find a link that testifies to that thought, if I can.
Edit: no links found yet, I'll keep trying. My recollection was that his stock as a broadcaster went through the roof after that Olympics only in part because of the "Do you believe in miracles?" quote, but also for doing such an excellent job calling a sport he had no prior experience working in.
If I also remember correctly, his assignment to the hockey venue was because he was pretty much the low man on the totem pole experience-wise at ABC (that's how low hockey was perceived as by the network compared to other sports, like figure skating and skiing, covered that Olympics). His background was in baseball; ABC hired him in the late 70's as a regional announcer for Monday Night Baseball, I'm pretty sure.
Wow, if he never called a hockey game before the 1980 Olympics that's damn impressive, hockey games is one of the most difficult sports to call play by play.
Matt Foley* 02-21-2005, 12:48 PM I remember seeing an interview with Michaels (with Roy Firestone, perhaps?) some years ago where the interviewer asked him about that Olympics and the interviewer being flabbergasted to learn Al had no prior experience calling a hockey game before. When asked what he did to prepare for the games, Al said something to the effect that he spent a lot of time watching games on tape (in part to reinforce his understanding of the rules) and that his goal was to not embarrass himself. Just my recollection.
David Puddy 02-21-2005, 12:52 PM ESPN is titling this as the 1980 olympic Semifinal, and almost anytime you hear the media talk about it, it refers to it as the semifinal and the Finland game as the final, but if I'm not mistaken, wasn't it really a round robin format between the 4 finalists with the medals decided by the points teams earn in those games?Here's the deal with the 1980 Olympic hockey format.
There were two divisions of six teams. They played round-robin (one game against each divisional opponent.) The top two teams in each division advanced to the Medal Round, bringing their game against the other advancing team into that round. A team would then play the two teams from the other division to basically create a round-robin Medal Round.
Red Division
USSR (5-0-0 10 PTS) 1st
Finland (3-2-0 6 PTS) 2nd Defeated Canada
Canada (3-2-0 6 PTS)
Poland (2-3-0 4 PTS)
Holland (1-3-1 3 PTS)
Japan (0-4-1 1 PT)
Blue Division
Sweden (4-0-1 9 PTS) 1st Better goal differential than USA
USA (4-0-1 9 PTS) 2nd
Czechloslovakia (3-2-0 6 PTS)
Romania (1-3-1 3 PTS)
West Germany (1-4-0 2 PTS)
Norway (0-4-1 1 PT)
Start of the Medal Round
1. USSR (1-0-0 2 PTS) 4 GF, 3 GA
2. Sweden (0-0-1 1 PT) 2 GF, 2 GA
2. USA (0-0-1 1 PT) 2 GF, 2 GA
4. Finland (0-1-0 0 PTS) 3 GF, 4 GA
After Feb. 22 Games
1. USA (1-0-1 3 PTS) 6 GF, 5 GA
2. USSR (1-1-0 2 PTS 7 GF, 7 GA
2. Sweden (0-0-2 2 PTS) 5 GF, 5 GA
4. Finland (0-1-1 1 1 PT) 6 GF, 7 GA
It was possible for any of the teams to win the gold or to finish 4th and not win a medal heading into the final two games on February 22.
Final Standings
1. USA (2-0-1 5 PTS) GOLD
2. (USSR 2-1-0 4 PTS) SILVER
3. Sweden (0-1-2 2 PTS) BRONZE
4. Finland (0-2-1 1 PT)
------------------------------------------------------------
5. Czechloslovakia (4-2-0) Defeated Canada 6-1 in the 5th-Place Game.
6. Canada (3-3-0) See above.
So the US' tie against Sweden in the qualifying round carried over as their head-to-head in the medal round(same goes for USSR/Finland)?
John Flyers Fan 02-21-2005, 01:04 PM So the US' tie against Sweden in the qualifying round carried over as their head-to-head in the medal round(same goes for USSR/Finland)?
Yes.
Alright, makes sense now.
Matt Foley* 02-21-2005, 02:05 PM What I wanted to know is if the 8:00 PM tape delay was interupted to go to bobsledding or cross-country skiing? I really can't believe that they would have, with the exception of intermissions.
I think the entire game was broadcast in that time slot, with other sports covered during what would have been the intermissions.
ABC caught a lot of grief from the national media the next day for broadcasting the game that Friday night as if it was happening live. However, if you listened to what Jim McKay said at the beginning of the broadcast, it was pretty clear that the game had already been decided and that the network didn't want to ruin it for anyone who wanted to watch the game without knowing the final score.
Yeah, I loved McKay's "If there's one person in America who doesn't know the outcome of this game, then...I don't want to be the one to tell you."
Oilers Chick 02-21-2005, 02:24 PM Damn, I don't get ESPN Classic where I live. I'd love to see a replay of the US-Finland game, because I was there. I was young at the time and wish I remembered more:
I can recall waving an little American flag all game long.
They were losing 2-1 after two periods.
Our seats were right at the top of the circle.
Mark Johnson scoring, not sure if it was the tying or winning goal.
Johnson scored the game-tying goal. Mike Eruzione scored the game-winner.
BTW, I caught the tail end of PTI and I can't believe that Wilbon picked the game 3rd! What the......???? (Lemme guess, Kornheiser had something to do with it too, right?)
John Flyers Fan 02-21-2005, 03:15 PM Johnson scored the game-tying goal. Mike Eruzione scored the game-winner.
BTW, I caught the tail end of PTI and I can't believe that Wilbon picked the game 3rd! What the......???? (Lemme guess, Kornheiser had something to do with it too, right?)
That was the Soviet game, I was speaking about the US-Finland game, I don't believe Eruzione scored against Finland
EDIT: I found it Johnson scored the 4th goal vs. the Finns
Verchota tied it early in the 3rd.
McClanahan scored the game winner from Johnson
Johnson sealed the game and gold medal with 3 and half minutes remaining.
Johnson scored the game-tying goal. Mike Eruzione scored the game-winner.
BTW, I caught the tail end of PTI and I can't believe that Wilbon picked the game 3rd! What the......???? (Lemme guess, Kornheiser had something to do with it too, right?)
Kornheiser put that #1. He said they were getting paid to do that show and he had to do that :p:
Yeah, I loved McKay's "If there's one person in America who doesn't know the outcome of this game, then...I don't want to be the one to tell you."
That would have ruined it for me. I would have known right away.
Whose grand idea was it to tape delay the game anyways? Was it because it was an afternoon game?
Ol' Dirty Chinaman* 02-21-2005, 03:50 PM That would have ruined it for me. I would have known right away.
Whose grand idea was it to tape delay the game anyways? Was it because it was an afternoon game?
The cold war was still in full swing. That should be reason enough.
And the Basketball game was rigged.
Not to go way off topic, but has anyone seen the HBO special '3 seconds from gold'? Yes, it was clear that FIBA tried to rig the game, but if the Americans didn't lose their composure on the last play, this would have never happened.
If anyone wants me to explain it, I will. I actually did and the board ate my response, essentially wasting 10 minutes of my life.
clefty 02-21-2005, 04:13 PM There will be replays of the game, I just updated the first post in the thread with the replay schedules.
Dammit.
I don't have ESPN Classic.
PecaFan 02-21-2005, 04:16 PM Yeah, go ahead and post it. But I've never bought the "rigged stuff". When I watched it at the time, I don't remember being "shocked or stunned" when the refs made their calls. I wasn't into basketball much though, so I must admit I don't know if they actually had the authority to reset the clock.
Yeah, go ahead and post it. But I've never bought the "rigged stuff". When I watched it at the time, I don't remember being "shocked or stunned" when the refs made their calls. I wasn't into basketball much though, so I must admit I don't know if they actually had the authority to reset the clock.
They also talk about the hostage situation, and how the Soviet players were upset (I think) they weren't allowed to attend the memorial service because the Soviet Union didn't recognize Israel as a nation, so they held a practice.
Well what happened was that one of the directors of FIBA, who wasn't even an on-court official had instructed the clock to be reset. Why was this such a big deal? There was only supposed to be 1 second left instead of 3.
First of all, let's start at the top. During the 2nd half, the Soviets, for whatever reason had sent in their 12th guy on the team (for people who have tapes of the game, I beleive he wears #11). Not too much longer later, he and the USA's top center (#7 I think) were both ejected because they got into a fight. That upset the USA because they claim that that was a plan.
Now, with 1 second left, Doug Collins is fouled (and nearly decapitated). He makes both free throws (I forget his name, but the guy who got suspended from Around the Horn who writes for the Boston Globe claims these were the 2 most pressure packed free throws in the history of the game). If you listen to the game, as he is taking his 2nd shot, a buzzer sounds. The Soviet coach had called a time out, but wasn't granted it, because the button he was supposed to use was broken, so he went to the scorers table and threw a fit. When Collins was handed the ball, the ball is in play and the time out is not supposed to be granted. The Soviets inbound the ball, nothing doing, the game ends. The 1st time. 50-49.
Now HBO points this out great, because if anyone has the tape you can see this. On the bottom along the near side line, around half court, there is a man who stands up and holds up 3 fingers (his thumb and first 2 fingers). He had told an offical that there should be 3 seconds left, and not 1. This is the director of FIBA, who had no business making this decision, but since he is the boss, he got his way (since FIBA really didn't want the USA to win). The narrarator's even says it during the piece "he wanted to give the Soviets something more valuable. More time, he wanted to go by what was fair and not what was in the rules." While the time keeper was fixing this, the ref had missed this, he thought it was just a time out, and handed the ball to one of the Soviets, who inbounded the ball, nothing doing, the game ends. The 2nd time. 50-49. But if you look up at the clock, (the tape even shows this) it doesn't say ':03' it says something different (like 50:09 or something). During the inbound play you hear the same buzzer that you hear while Collins was shooting the free throw. It is not the same buzzer to signal the end of the game, it was the signal that there was a problem and there needed to be an officials time out because the clock wasn't ready.
They finally fix the clock, and they go back and inbound a 3rd time, and this is where it gets really fishy. The referee waves his hand before he blows the whistle between the Soviet inbounder and the American guarding him. For whatever reason, when the referee does this, the American backs off. The American player claims that the referee told him to back off. The referee (who is interviewed by HBO, you do get his take, he also talked about the buzzers going off) said he has no right to do that. He said he was signalling where the baseline was, which he does for EVERY inbound play. This was the American not knowing the rules, and the Soviet inbounder even says that without the American backing off he would have never hit the guy (#14) down the court. #14 for the Soviets, some will say that he fouled an American guaring him, and threw another out of position and there should have been a foul before he made the shot, but if you watch the coverage, there is no way there should have ever even been a shot. However, he does make the shot. The game ends. The 3rd time. 51-50.
I'm not defending anyone here, but HBO gave it an objective look. I think FIBA tried to rig it, but if the Americans kept their composure on the last play, they could have still won. One of the players said he put it in his will that no member of his family is ever allowed to accept the silver medal he "won". The silver medals still sit in a vault in wherever the museum for the Olymipics is (somewhere in Europe) waiting to be claimed.
I think that's the whole story, if i missed anything or I see it again, I'll come back and fix it.
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-21-2005, 06:56 PM I don't get why he gets killed for yanking Tretiak as much as he does. Tretiak gave up two brutal goals in the first period. The move seemed to wake the Soviets up as they dominated the 2nd period. Only the brilliance of Craig kept it a one goal game after two periods.
Myshkin (sp?) wasn't an untested goalie. He was in net for game 3 of the NHL - Soviet Challange Cup in 1979, and he beat the NHL stars 6-0.
Eruzione likened it to replacing Patrick Roy with Marty Brodeur.
David Puddy 02-21-2005, 08:33 PM "How can you do that?" It's one thing to put me on the bench, or even to put Mikhailov on the bench, but to put Tretiak on the bench? It felt like a big hole had been put in our team."
-- Sergei Starikov, defenseman, 1980 Soviet National Team
The whole team was not happy when Tikhonov made the switch. It was the worst mooment of Vlady's career. Tikhonov was panicking. He couldn't control himelf. That's what it was--panic."
-- Sergei Makarov, right wing, 1980 Soviet National Team
"I've known Tikhonov twenty-five or thiry years and I couldn't believe he did that."
-- Bill Torrey, General Manager of the New York Islanders, 1972-1992, at USA-USSR game
"The biggest mistake of my career was replacing Tretiak with Myshkin. Tretiak always played better after he gave up a goal. The decision was a reult of getting caught up in emotions. After Tretiak gave up the rebound and let in the soft goal by Mark Johnson, my blood was boiling. It was my worst mistake, my biggest regret."
-- Viktor Tikhonov, head coach, 1980 Soviet National Team
all quotes from Wayne Coffey's The Boys of Winter, New York: Crown, 2005. pages 90-91.
Eruzione likened it to replacing Patrick Roy with Marty Brodeur.Wow! I can't believe that Eruzione thinks Myshkin was better than Tretiak.
Matt Foley* 02-21-2005, 09:00 PM Whose grand idea was it to tape delay the game anyways? Was it because it was an afternoon game?
The USA / USSR game began on a Friday afternoon at 5:00; Olympic coverage on weekdays via ABC typically was only from 8:00 PM to 11:00PM on weeknights and from noon to 11:00 PM on the weekends.
They did show the gold medal game live on the following Sunday morning at 11:00 AM, however. In addition, ABC also was going to show the entire USSR / Sweden game that followed, but once the Soviets got up by about 7 or 8 goals, ABC changed over to something else.
but once the Soviets got up by about 7 or 8 goals, ABC changed over to something else.
What was the score of the 2 games Sweden was invovled in?
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-21-2005, 09:17 PM Here is another summary that explains, among other things, the tie-breaking procedure and the mindset of the team as the Olympics developed. It is interesting:
http://lakeplacidhockey.com/hockeygame.html
rwilson99 02-21-2005, 09:24 PM The start time was 5:00 PM. ABC wanted to show it at 8:00 PM. According to Wayne Coffey's book, The Boys of Winter, ABC had agreed to pay the IIHF $125,000 to allow the game to be rescheduled. ABC also checked with four teams, offering them $12,500 each.
Three of the four teams agreed to the deal. The Soviets blocked it because 8:00 PM would be 4:00 AM in Moscow.
What I wanted to know is if the 8:00 PM tape delay was interupted to go to bobsledding or cross-country skiing? I really can't believe that they would have, with the exception of intermissions.
I've actually watched the full broadcast at the Mesuem of Radio & TV in New York. The game was broken up into chunks, with other events cutting in and out, and portions of the game were edited out. The ESPN broadcast on Sunday had very limited commericial as well.
Great broadcast. One of my first ever memories was hearing about the game on a Saturday morning at my Grandmother's house. It will be great to revisit the game over and over.
Matt Foley* 02-21-2005, 09:36 PM What was the score of the 2 games Sweden was invovled in?
Sweden tied Finland 3-3 in the first medal round game, and then they got their butts kicked by a very angry Soviet team 9-2 in the second game, which wasn't even that close; it was total and complete domination by the Soviets. Sweden earned the bronze medal by virtue of their 0-1-2 record against the medal round teams vs. Finland's 0-2-1 record.
Accord 02-22-2005, 01:32 AM Johnson scored the game-tying goal. Mike Eruzione scored the game-winner.
BTW, I caught the tail end of PTI and I can't believe that Wilbon picked the game 3rd! What the......???? (Lemme guess, Kornheiser had something to do with it too, right?)
Kornheiser said something along the lines of "Wilbon your list is crap blah blah blah" and ripped down Wilbon's list and put his own up with the Miracle on Ice as #1.
David Puddy 02-22-2005, 04:56 AM What was the score of the 2 games Sweden was invovled in?Here is a Japanese page (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.aya.or.jp/~polaris/winter_olympic/html/results/13_lake_placid/13_icehockey.htm&prev=/search%3Fq%3D1980%2BXIII%2BOlympic%2BWinter%2BGame s%2BLake%2BPlacid%2BMcclanahan%26num%3D30%26hl%3De n%26lr%3D%26as_qdr%3Dall) (translated with Google) that shows the results of all the hockey games of the XIII Winter Olympics in Lake Placid.
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-22-2005, 06:14 PM Here are a list of tie-breakers for the 1980 Olympics (as listed in a newspaper I kept):
1. Goal differential (goals for MINUS goals against) in games involving the four teams battling in the medal round (Finland, USSR, USA and Sweden).
2. Goal quotient (goals scored DIVIDED by goals against) with the same four teams.
3. Goal differential in all games.
4. Goal quotient in all four games.
So, the way I understand it is that Finland could have defeated the US in that last game and still not won the Gold medal. If the Swedes and Soviets tied in their last game, then all four teams would have ended up with three points (points from medal round games) and the medals would have been determined by goal differential.
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-22-2005, 06:19 PM Here is a February 10, 1980 Boston Globe article as written by Peter Gammons, the day after the Soviets won 10-3 over the US in a prelim:
"Hockey is simply not the place for the evocation of political passion, not when it involves the Soviets. That was yesterday's first lesson. The second was that no one in the Olympics is going to challenge them. And the third, as the yawning 10-3 rout of the US Olympians dragged on, was that when the Americans make their run for a medal against Sweden and Czechoslovakia, they are going to have to play a lot better under more difficult circumstances than they did yesterday or the great American Selling of Herb Brooks is going to be a major disappointment."
Here is a February 10, 1980 Boston Globe article as written by Peter Gammons, the day after the Soviets won 10-3 over the US in a prelim:
"Hockey is simply not the place for the evocation of political passion, not when it involves the Soviets. That was yesterday's first lesson. The second was that no one in the Olympics is going to challenge them. And the third, as the yawning 10-3 rout of the US Olympians dragged on, was that when the Americans make their run for a medal against Sweden and Czechoslovakia, they are going to have to play a lot better under more difficult circumstances than they did yesterday or the great American Selling of Herb Brooks is going to be a major disappointment."
Heh, another gem from Gammons...that's up there with his free agent predictions(Pavano is definitely going to the Red Sox, if not, then the Tigers. The Yankees are going to officially sign Pedro Martinez tomorrow...)
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-22-2005, 11:07 PM To those who have asked why the USSR-US game wasn't broadcast live, I found another interesting article (written by Jack Craig of the Boston Globe). This one mentioned three reasons why the game wasn't shown live and I am summarizing greatly:
1. From 5-7 PM, that air time belonged to local network affiliates. They were reluctant to show the game because they made a load of money from TV ads during this time. Reruns, syndicated shows, etc. were big money makers.
2. The national network news would be scrubbed.
3. The FCC needed to waive the 7:30-8:00 local access period.
As far as the game time possibly changing to later that night, ABC blamed the Lake Placid Olympic Committee which assured the network 18 months prior to the Games that changes could be made for TV purposes -- meaning that the times of events were flexible. But the final authority was in the hands of the International Ice Hockey Federation who claimed they were contacted late in the negotiations. They then said all four teams in the final round would have to agree to a time change but at least one team privately (some say the Soviets, some say the Soviets and Finns) blocked the move.
David Puddy 02-23-2005, 02:14 AM So, the way I understand it is that Finland could have defeated the US in that last game and still not won the Gold medal. If the Swedes and Soviets tied in their last game, then all four teams would have ended up with three points (points from medal round games) and the medals would have been determined by goal differential.Your right that Finland could have won against the US and still not gotten a medal, but there was a way Finland could have won the gold medal. Below are the standing after the first medal-round game, plus the preliminary game that counted towards the medal, team (record points) goals for-goals allowed:
1. U.S.A. (1-0-1 3) 6-5
2. U.S.S.R. (1-1-0 2) 7-7
2. Sweden (0-0-2 2) 5-5
4. Finland (0-1-1 1) 5-7
If the Soviets and Sweden finished in a tie, they would have both had three points and an even goal differential.
If Finland defeated the US by three or more goals, both of these teams would also have three points. However, the US would then have a goal differential of -2, and Finland would have a goal differential of +1, the highest among the four tied teams.
Under this scenario, Finland would have won the gold, Soviets would have gotten the bronze (by virtue of goal differential in all games) and Sweden the bronze. The US would have had a negative goal differential, and we would not have won a medal.
Also, thank you for posting the tie-breaking procedure. I had pieced together the procedure from various things that I have read over the years, but never knew the diffinitive rules.
Tricolore#20 02-23-2005, 10:56 AM I watched Miracle again last night, I was wondering why the US players came off the bench to celebrate Rizo's goal in the 3rd. I could understand the Johnson goal, as it was at the end of the 2nd period, but why for Eruzione? Or is this just something that happened in the movie?
I think the movie did a great job in trying to create the sense that USA were underdogs. All of the US players looked like kids, compared to the experienced look of Mikhailov, Kharmalov, etc... Even as a Canadian, I probably really would have loved this team had I been around. Herb Brooks is a genius, and the only shame is that he wasn't around to see the final take of the movie.
Ronnie Bass 02-23-2005, 10:59 AM I watched Miracle again last night, I was wondering why the US players came off the bench to celebrate Rizo's goal in the 3rd. I could understand the Johnson goal, as it was at the end of the 2nd period, but why for Eruzione? Or is this just something that happened in the movie?
They did it for just about every goal, at the time it wasn't illegal to do so.
svetovy poharu 02-23-2005, 11:51 AM Here is the official game summary from 1980 USA-URS game:
DATE: 02.22.80 (Friday)
OLYMPIC FIELDHOUSE - GAME 32
GAME TIME: START: 17.06, END: 19.26, LENGTH OF GAME: 2:20
TEAM A: USA DRESS: WHITE...............TEAM B: URS DRESS: RED
# 1 G JANASZAK, Steve.....................# 1 G MYSHKIN, Vladimir
#30 G *CRAIG, James..........................#20 G *TRETJAK, Vladislav
# 3 D *MORROW, Kenneth...................# 2 D *FETISOV, Viacheslav
# 5 D *RAMSEY, Michael.....................# 5 D PERVUKHIN, Vasili
# 6 D BAKER, William (A)...................# 6 D VASILIEV, Valeri (A)
#17 D O'CALLAHAN, John....................# 7 D *KASATONOV, Aleksei
#20 D SUTER, Bob............................#12 D STARIKOV, Sergei
# 8 F *SILK, David............................#14 D BILJALETDINOV, Zinetula
# 9 F BROTEN, Neal..........................# 9 F KRUTOV, Vladimir
#10 F *JOHNSON, Mark........................#10 F MALTSEV, Alexander
#11 F CHRISTOFF, Steven..................#11 F LEBEDEV, Juri
#15 F WELLS, Mark...........................#13 F *MIKHAILOV, Boris (C)
#16 F PAVELICH, Mark.......................#16 F *PETROV, Vladimir
#19 F STROBEL, Eric..........................#17 F *KHARLAMOV, Valeri
#21 F ERUZIONE, Michael (C)..............#19 F BALDERIS, Helmut
#23 F CHRISTIAN, David.....................#22 F ZHLUKTOV, Victor
#24 F *McCLANAHAN, Robert................#23 F GOLIKOV, Aleksander
#25 F SCHNEIDER, William...................#24 F MAKAROV, Sergei
#27 F VERCHOTA, Philip......................#25 F GOLIKOV, Vladimir
#28 F HARRINGTON, John....................#26 F SKVORTSOV, Aleksander
*starters
SCORING: USA-URS 4:3 (2:2, 0:1, 2:0)
SHOTS ON GOAL: USA-URS 16:39 (8:18, 2:12, 6:9)
PENALTY MINUTES: USA-URS 6:6 (0:2, 6:2, 0:2)
POWER PLAY GOALS/ATTEMPTS: USA: 1-of-2, URS: 1-of-2
GOALIES: USA: CRAIG......60:00, 36 SAVES, 3 GA
GOALIES: URS: TRETJAK...19:59, 6 SAVES, 2 GA
GOALIES: URS: MYSHKIN...40:01, 6 SAVES, 2 GA
REFEREE: KAISLA (FIN), LINESMEN: LAROCHELLE (CAN), TOEMEN (NED)
ATTENDANCE: 10,000
SCORING:
09:12 URS 9 KRUTOV..........ASSISTS: 7 KASATONOV
14:03 USA 25 SCHNEIDER......ASSISTS: 16 PAVELICH
17:34 URS 24 MAKAROV........ASSISTS: 23 A. GOLIKOV
19:59 USA 10 JOHNSON........ASSISTS: 23 CHRISTIAN, 8 SILK
22:18 URS 10 MALTSEV........ASSISTS: 9 KRUTOV *PowerPlay goal
48:39 USA 10 JOHNSON........ASSISTS: 8 SILK *PowerPlay goal
50:00 USA 21 ERUZIONE.......ASSISTS: 16 PAVELICH, 28 HARRINGTON
PENALTIES:
03:25 URS 13 MIKHAILOV.......2:00 -- HOOKING
20:58 USA 28 HARRINGTON.....2:00 -- HOLDING
29:50 USA 30 CRAIG..............2:00 -- DELAY GAME *served by Strobel
37:08 URS 11 LEBEDEV..........2:00 -- UNSPORT-CONDUCT
37:08 USA 3 MORROW.........2:00 -- CROSS-CHECK
46:47 URS 9 KRUTOV..........2:00 -- HI-STICK
NOTES:
19:59 URS GOALIE CHANGE: MYSHKIN REPLACES TRETJAK
Jeez, Slava Fetisov has been around forever, hasn't he?
svetovy poharu 02-23-2005, 12:22 PM Here is the official game summary from 1980 USA-FIN game:
DATE: 02.24.80 (Sunday)
OLYMPIC FIELDHOUSE - GAME 34
GAME TIME: START: 11.08, END: 13.29, LENGTH OF GAME: 2:21
TEAM A: USA DRESS: BLUE.................TEAM B: FIN DRESS: WHITE
# 1 G JANASZAK, Steve...................# 1 G KIVELA, Antero
# 30 G *CRAIG, James........................# 19 G *VALTONEN, Jorma
# 3 D *MORROW, Kenneth.................# 3 D *SUORANIEMI, Seppo
# 5 D *RAMSEY, Michael...................# 4 D SAARINEN, Olli
# 6 D BAKER, William (A).................# 6 D *HAAPALAINEN, Hannu
#17 D O'CALLAHAN, John..................# 9 D ELORANTA, Kari
#20 D SUTER, Bob..........................#10 D LITMA, Lasse
# 8 F *SILK, David...........................#12 F PELTONEN, Esa (A)
# 9 F BROTEN, Neal........................#13 F VILLA, Ismo
#10 F *JOHNSON, Mark.....................#15 F *LEINONEN, Mikko
#11 F CHRISTOFF, Steven................#16 F *KIIMALAINEN, Markku
#15 F WELLS, Mark..........................#17 F KURRI, Jari
#16 F PAVELICH, Mark......................#20 F KOSKILAHTI, Jukka
#19 F STROBEL, Eric........................#21 F KOSKINEN, Hannu
#21 F ERUZIONE, Michael.................#23 F HAKULINEN, Markku
#23 F CHRISTIAN, David...................#25 F *PORVARI, Jukka (C)
#24 F *McCLANAHAN, Robert.............#28 F MAKITALO, Jarmo
#25 F SCHNEIDER, William.................#29 F SUSI, Timo
#27 F VERCHOTA, Philip
#28 F HARRINGTON, John
*starters
SCORING: USA-FIN 4:2 (0:1, 1:1, 3:0)
SHOTS ON GOAL: USA-FIN 29:23 (14:7, 8:6, 7:10)
PENALTY MINUTES: USA-FIN 10:4 (0:2, 4:2, 6:0)
POWER-PLAY GOALS/ATTEMPTS: USA: 0-of-2 (1 SHGF), FIN: 1-of-5
GOALIES: USA: CRAIG.......60:00, 21 SAVES, 2 GA
GOALIES: FIN: VALTONEN..60:00, 25 SAVES, 4 GA
REFEREE: SUBRT (CZE), LINESMEN: HOLLETT (CAN), TOEMEN (NED)
ATTENDANCE: 10,000
SCORING:
09:20 FIN 25 PORVARI...........ASSISTS: 15 LEINONEN, 10 LITMA
24:39 USA 11 CHRISTOFF.......ASSISTS: UNASSISTED
26:30 FIN 15 LEINONEN.........ASSISTS: 6 HAAPALAINEN, 16 KIIMALAINEN *PPG
42:25 USA 27 VERCHOTA........ASSISTS: 23 CHRISTIAN
46:05 USA 24 McCLANAHAN.....ASSISTS: 10 JOHNSON, 23 CHRISTIAN
56:25 USA 10 JOHNSON...........ASSISTS: 11 CHRISTOFF *SHORTHANDED GOAL
PENALTIES:
04:54 FIN 21 KOSKINEN............2:00 -- HOOKING
22:37 USA 5 RAMSEY..............2:00 -- ROUGHING
26:00 USA 25 SCHNEIDER..........2:00 -- SLASHING
35:52 FIN 3 SUORANIEMI.........2:00 -- DELAY-GAME
46:48 USA 9 BROTEN...............2:00 -- HOOKING
48:54 USA 23 CHRISTIAN...........2:00 -- TRIPPING
55:45 USA 27 VERCHOTA...........2:00 -- ROUGHING
NOTES:
FIN SCRATCHES: # 8, D - LEVO, Tapio....#22, F - LEPPANEN, Reijo
USA SCRATCHES: NONE
svetovy poharu 02-23-2005, 12:40 PM acr, yes you are quite right...
Slava was 21 years old (just 2 months shy of his 22nd birthday) when he played in the 1980 Olympics. It was his first Olympics but he had already played in 2 World Championships and 3 World Juniors prior to these games. He went on to score 5 goals and 4 assists, plus racked up 10 penalty minutes in 7 games at the '80 games.
Started his junior career in 1975 with CSKA Moscow and finally retired in 1998 with Detroit. Long, impressive career.
Did Tretiak play the game against Sweden, or did Tikhanov keep Myshkin in there?
Wild Thing 02-23-2005, 03:00 PM I just wanted to point out that if anyone wants to catch the actual gold medal game against Finlad, they're running that on Thursday night at 7 PM Central. I've already got my TiVo all set up and ready to record.
John Flyers Fan 02-23-2005, 03:03 PM I just wanted to point out that if anyone wants to catch the actual gold medal game against Finlad, they're running that on Thursday night at 7 PM Central. I've already got my TiVo all set up and ready to record.
If anyone could tape that game and put it on a CD/DVD ... i'd gladly pay for the shipping and cost of the disc. I haven't seen that game since I was there in person.
David Puddy 02-23-2005, 03:32 PM I just wanted to point out that if anyone wants to catch the actual gold medal game against Finlad, they're running that on Thursday night at 7 PM Central. I've already got my TiVo all set up and ready to record.8 PM/ 7 PM Central on ESPN Classic.
Accord 02-23-2005, 07:23 PM I watched Miracle again last night, I was wondering why the US players came off the bench to celebrate Rizo's goal in the 3rd. I could understand the Johnson goal, as it was at the end of the 2nd period, but why for Eruzione? Or is this just something that happened in the movie?
I think the movie did a great job in trying to create the sense that USA were underdogs. All of the US players looked like kids, compared to the experienced look of Mikhailov, Kharmalov, etc... Even as a Canadian, I probably really would have loved this team had I been around. Herb Brooks is a genius, and the only shame is that he wasn't around to see the final take of the movie.
Because it was the go-ahead and game winning goal.
Also, scoring even 1 goal against the Soviets was a huge deal and cause for celebration in itself.
Ronnie Bass 02-23-2005, 08:42 PM I just wanted to point out that if anyone wants to catch the actual gold medal game against Finlad, they're running that on Thursday night at 7 PM Central. I've already got my TiVo all set up and ready to record.
Be nice if they would show the Gold Medal ceremony too. Maybe they will.
svetovy poharu 02-24-2005, 09:40 AM acr asked:
Did Tretiak play the game against Sweden, or did Tikhanov keep Myshkin in there?
Yes, Tikhonov played Myshkin in the 9-2 silver medal winning game against Sweden on 24.02.80. In the 7 games played, Myshkin played in 4 of them (started in 2 of them - vs. Holland on 14.02 and vs. Sweden on 24.02). He actually ended up with a higher save percentage than Tretiak -- .896 (8 goals allowed in 4 games, 200 minutes) for Myshkin as opposed to a .840 save percentage (9 goals allowed in 5 games, 220 minutes) for Tretiak.
In addition to relieving Tretiak in the USA game, Myshkin also played the last two periods in the 16-0 victory over Japan on 12.02.80 in the opening game of the Olympics for the USSR.
rwilson99 02-24-2005, 09:41 AM This coming Sunday (2/20) at 8:00 PM on ESPN there is going to be a special PTI episode about the 25th anniversary of the Miracle on Ice followed directly by the actual game itself at 8:30 PM, this is one of the very rare times you'll get to see the actual game... again, ESPN will be showing the actual game, not the movie.
UPDATE: There will be replays of the game on Tuesday night at 8PM and then again at 11:30PM on ESPN Classic. The game will be replayed for a third time on Thursday night at 8PM on ESPN Classic.
Thursday night is the game against Finland... set your DVR twice!
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-24-2005, 09:47 AM acr asked:
Did Tretiak play the game against Sweden, or did Tikhanov keep Myshkin in there?
Yes, Tikhonov played Myshkin in the 9-2 silver medal winning game against Sweden on 24.02.80. In the 7 games played, Myshkin played in 4 of them (started in 2 of them - vs. Holland on 14.02 and vs. Sweden on 24.02). He actually ended up with a higher save percentage than Tretiak -- .896 (8 goals allowed in 4 games, 200 minutes) for Myshkin as opposed to a .840 save percentage (9 goals allowed in 5 games, 220 minutes) for Tretiak.
In addition to relieving Tretiak in the USA game, Myshkin also played the last two periods in the 16-0 victory over Japan on 12.02.80 in the opening game of the Olympics for the USSR.
In one of the newspaper clips I kept over the years, going into the US-USSR game, there was a line in a story (the day prior to the game I believe) saying that the Soviets were expected to play Myshkin against the USA.
John Flyers Fan 02-24-2005, 09:59 AM Be nice if they would show the Gold Medal ceremony too. Maybe they will.
It wasn't right after the U.S.-Finland game ... the medal ceremony was held after the Soviet-Sweden game, which followed US-Finland.
If anyone can tape a copy of US-Finland onto a CD/DVD .. please send me a PM.
svetovy poharu 02-24-2005, 02:02 PM Some interesting insights from an article this week:
After the game, as Americans celebrated on the village's main street, coach Viktor Tikhonov stalked the dressing room, assigning blame. "This is your loss," he repeatedly told his star players.
In his new book, The Boys of Winter, Wayne Coffey describes reaction to the stunning defeat: "In the next day's edition of Pravda, the Communist party newspaper, there was no mention of the game with the United States -- nor in the [Olympic] wrap-up article of Feb. 25. ... After the Russians cleared out of their rooms in the Lake Placid Olympic Village, clean-up workers found 121 empty vodka bottles in the dropped ceilings of their units, the detritus of despondence."
When they arrived home, the silver-medal team was ignored by fans and Communist Party leaders clamoring to be photographed with the athletes who accounted for the 10 gold medals of the 22 total.
"We were demonstratively shoved aside, and rightly so," Tretiak wrote in his 1987 autobiography, The Legend. Tretiak was benched by Tikhonov at the end of the first period after giving up the goal that tied the game 2-2.
"I don't think I should have been replaced in that game," Tretiak wrote. "I had made so many mistakes already, I was confident my play would only improve. [Vladimir Myshkin] is an excellent goalie, but he wasn't prepared for the struggle, he wasn't 'tuned in' to the Americans."
But if Soviet political bosses were unhappy with Tikhonov's strategy and the players' execution, they kept their displeasure to themselves.
"There was no significant fallout, not in terms of the coach losing his job or the players being cut," Pelletier said. "If anything the coach, Tikhonov, might have become more of a dictator than he already was, punishing his players with grueling hockey and army commitments and taking away already sparse family or leisure time. Tikhonov held that much political power back then."
The coach, now 74, acknowledged in his autobiography that he made a mistake, and hinted he had been influenced by Communist party bosses. But he never offered an explanation to his players.
A stony Tikhonov refused to answer questions about his decision to remove Tretiak at a news conference at the 1988 Winter Games, the last appearance by the Soviet Union. Before the 2002 Winter Games in Salt Lake City, Tretiak, by then the Russian team's goalies coach, still voiced resentment.
"I would have had four gold medals if not for Tikhonov's bad judgment," he told a reporter for the International Ice Hockey Federation. "Yes, I will never forget that as long as I live."
Pavel 02-24-2005, 04:52 PM Just caught this off of ESPN. They renamed the arena the game was played in, to honor Herb Brooks.
http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/news/story?id=1998718
David Puddy 02-24-2005, 04:58 PM Here is a great article, "Their Miracle, His Misery (http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/news/ledger/stories/020204miracle.html)," from February 2004 about Soviet player Sergei Starikov going to see the movie Miracle.
Matt Foley* 02-24-2005, 09:07 PM Too bad they didn't show the gold medal ceremony - that was one of the most memorable scenes, along with the celebration after the USSR game.
It was fun seeing Jari Kurri playing for Finland. I didn't get to watch all of the game - were there any other future NHL players on the Finnish team that anyone recognized?
Ronnie Bass 02-24-2005, 09:12 PM Too bad they didn't show the gold medal ceremony - that was one of the most memorable scenes, along with the celebration after the USSR game.
Yeah me too, would have been nice.
Ronnie Bass 02-24-2005, 09:19 PM It wasn't right after the U.S.-Finland game ... the medal ceremony was held after the Soviet-Sweden game, which followed US-Finland.
I know.
svetovy poharu 02-24-2005, 09:28 PM Matt Foley asked:
It was fun seeing Jari Kurri playing for Finland. I didn't get to watch all of the game - were there any other future NHL players on the Finnish team that anyone recognized?
In addition to Kurri, there were 4 Finnish players on that 1980 squad that went on to play in the NHL.
Kari Eloranta, a defenceman who played between 1981-82 and 1986-87, 252 games with Calgary and 12 games with St. Louis.
Mikko Leinonen, a centre who played 159 games with NY Rangers from 1981-82 to 1983-84, and played 3 games with Washington in 1984-85.
Tapio Levo, a defenceman who played 34 games in 1981-82 with Colorado Rockies and then 73 games with New Jersey in 1982-83.
Jukka Porvari, a RW who played 31 games with Colorado Rockies in 1981-82 and then 8 games with New Jersey in 1982-83
Matt Foley* 02-24-2005, 09:34 PM Thanks - I knew Eloranta's name was familiar.
MiamiScreamingEagles 02-24-2005, 09:36 PM Your right that Finland could have won against the US and still not gotten a medal, but there was a way Finland could have won the gold medal. Below are the standing after the first medal-round game, plus the preliminary game that counted towards the medal, team (record points) goals for-goals allowed:
1. U.S.A. (1-0-1 3) 6-5
2. U.S.S.R. (1-1-0 2) 7-7
2. Sweden (0-0-2 2) 5-5
4. Finland (0-1-1 1) 5-7
If the Soviets and Sweden finished in a tie, they would have both had three points and an even goal differential.
If Finland defeated the US by three or more goals, both of these teams would also have three points. However, the US would then have a goal differential of -2, and Finland would have a goal differential of +1, the highest among the four tied teams.
Under this scenario, Finland would have won the gold, Soviets would have gotten the bronze (by virtue of goal differential in all games) and Sweden the bronze. The US would have had a negative goal differential, and we would not have won a medal.
Also, thank you for posting the tie-breaking procedure. I had pieced together the procedure from various things that I have read over the years, but never knew the diffinitive rules.
David, I was aware Finland could have won the Gold but I guess the real first tie-breaker was head-to-head competition (in addition to the four I mentioned in the earlier post). Finland and Canada each had 3-2-0 records in the prelims and I assume Finland advanced to the Medal Round because of their win over Canada. Canada had a better goal differential. Also, Al Michaels kept saying that the US (in an event of a tie) would want the Soviets to beat Sweden; this would have given the US the Gold (in that scenario, the US and Soviets would have ended with 4 points but the USSR would have a better goal differential). So, I guess, the actuall first tie-breaker was head-to-head followed by the four I listed from the newspaper.
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