All-time draft continued

Pages : [1] 2

John Flyers Fan
09-22-2003, 03:37 PM
The Philadelphia Flyers are again pleased to select one of their own.:

from the Brandon Wheat Kings:

The Brandon Bopper

Brian Propp

Offensive leader for the Flyers that went to 3 Stanley Cups in the 1980's.

Selected as the best LW of all-time from the Canadian Major Junior Hockey Leagues.

Philadelphia Flyers

Propp-Gretzky-Jagr
Barber-Fedorov-Makarov
Goulet-Malone-Larmer
Gillies-Cowley-xxxxx

Potvin-Lidstrom
Park-Ching Johnson
xxxxxx-xxxxxx

Johnny Bower
xxxxxxx

monkey_00*
09-22-2003, 03:51 PM
John Flyers Fan - Philadelphia Flyers
Laperriere22 - Boston Bruins
Dr. Love- Vancouver Millionaires
GB Editor - Montreal Canadians
Oilers94 - Colorado Rockies
Maxwell Edison - Quebec Norqiques
Gilmour's Way - Toronto Maple Leafs
BM67 - New Jersey Devils
Spitfire11 - Detroit Red Wings
Herby - Los Angeles Kings
Monkey_00 - Winnipeg Jets
JDB3939 - Pittsburgh Penguins

** Dr. Love has replaced Fedz
** Monkey00 has replaced Learning_to_fly
** Laperriere22 has replaced MacDaddy




Round #1
1 Detroit Red Wings - Bobby Orr
2 Philadelphia Flyers - Wayne Gretzky
3 Quebec Nordiques - Gordie Howe
4 Vancouver Millionaires - Mario Lemieux
5 Boston Bruins - Doug Harvey
6 Toronto Maple Leafs - Maurice Richard
7 Colorado Rockies - Jean Beliveau
8 Montreal Canadiens - Raymond Bourque
9 Winnipeg Jets - Guy LaFleur
10 Los Angeles Kings - Eddie Shore
11 Pittsburgh Penguins - Patrick Roy
12 New Jersey Devils - Bobby Hull

Round #2
13 New Jersey Devils - Mark Messier
14 Pittsburgh Penguins - Mike Bossy
15 Los Angeles Kings - Marcel Dionne
16 Winnipeg Jets - Martin Brodeur
17 Montreal Canadiens - Peter Stastny
18 Colorado Rockies - Paul Coffey
19 Toronto Maple Leafs - Terry Sawchuck
20 Boston Bruins - Ted Lindsay
21 Vancouver Millionaires - Bryan Trottier
22 Quebec Nordiques - Dominik Hasek
23 Philadelphia Flyers - Denis Potvin
24 Detroit Red Wings - Phil Esposito

Round #3
25 Detroit Red Wings - Stan Mikita
26 Philadelphia Flyers - Jaromir Jagr
27 Quebec Nordiques - Valeri Kharlamov
28 Vancouver Millionaires - Chris Chelios
29 Boston Bruins - Howie Morenz
30 Toronto Maple Leafs - Ron Francis
31 Colorado Rockies - Jacques Plante
32 Montreal Canadiens - Glenn Hall
33 Winnipeg Jets - Larry Robinson
34 Los Angeles Kings - Vladislav Tretiak
35 Pittsburgh Penguins - Viacheslav Fetisov
36 New Jersey Devils - Red Kelly

Round #4
37 New Jersey Devils - Ken Dryden
38 Pittsburgh Penguins - Jari Kurri
39 Los Angeles Kings - Steve Yzerman
40 Winnipeg Jets - Bobby Clarke
41 Montreal Canadiens - Frank Mahovlich
42 Colorado Rockies - Henri Richard
43 Toronto Maple Leafs - Al MacInnis
44 Boston Bruins - Tim Horton
45 Vancouver Millionaires - Bernie Parent
46 Quebec Nordiques - Gilbert Perreault
47 Philadelphia Flyers - Nicklas Lidstrom
48 Detroit Red Wings - Cam Neely

Round #5
49 Detroit Red Wings - Joe Sakic
50 Philadelphia Flyers - Brad Park
51 Quebec Nordiques - Peter Forsberg
52 Vancouver Millionaires - Brett Hull
53 Boston Bruins - Milt Schmidt
54 Toronto Maple Leafs - Scott Stevens
55 Colorado Rockies - Darryl Sittler
56 Montreal Canadiens - Dale Hawerchuk
57 Winnipeg Jets - Luc Robitaille
58 Los Angeles Kings - Pavel Bure
59 Pittsburgh Penguins - Dino Ciccarelli
60 New Jersey Devils - Dickie Moore

Round #6
61 New Jersey Devils - Charlie Conacher
62 Pittsburgh Penguins - Pat Lafontaine
63 Los Angeles Kings - Chris Pronger
64 Winnipeg Jets - Borje Salming
65 Montreal Canadiens - Serge Savard
66 Colorado Rockies - Johnny Bucyk
67 Toronto Maple Leafs - Doug Gilmour
68 Boston Bruins - Bernie 'Boom Boom' Geoffrion
69 Vancouver Millionaires - Mats Naslund
70 Quebec Nordiques - Max Bentley
71 Philadelphia Flyers - Sergei Makarov
72 Detroit Red Wings - Pierre Pilote

Round #7
73 Detroit Red Wings - Valeri Vasiliev
74 Philadelphia Flyers - Joe Malone
75 Quebec Nordiques - Dit Clapper
76 Vancouver Millionaires - Mark Howe
77 Boston Bruins - Bill Durnan
78 Toronto Maple Leafs - Wendel Clark
79 Colorado Rockies - Syl Apps
80 Montreal Canadiens - Rod Gilbert
81 Winnipeg Jets - Alex Delvecchio
82 Los Angeles Kings - Bill Cook
83 Pittsburgh Penguins - Boris Mikhailov
84 New Jersey Devils - Nels Stewart

Round #8
85 New Jersey Devils - Andy Bathgate
86 Pittsburgh Penguins - Rob Blake
87 Los Angeles Kings - Brian Leetch
88 Winnipeg Jets - Marcel Pronovost
89 Montreal Canadiens - Lanny McDonald
90 Colorado Rockies - Larry Murphy
91 Toronto Maple Leafs - Busher Jackson
92 Boston Bruins - Bob Gainey
93 Vancouver Millionaires - Alexander Mogilny
94 Quebec Nordiques - King Clancy
95 Philadelphia Flyers - Sergei Fedorov
96 Detroit Red Wings - Adam Oates

Round #9
97 Detroit Red Wings - Teemu Selanne
98 Philadelphia Flyers - Bill Cowley
99 Quebec Nordiques - Aleksander Maltsev
100 Vancouver Millionaires - Cyclone Taylor
101 Boston Bruins - Newsy LaLonde
102 Toronto Maple Leafs - Mats Sundin
103 Colorado Rockies - Toe Blake
104 Montreal Canadiens - Aurel Joliat
105 Winnipeg Jets - Igor Larionov
106 Los Angeles Kings - Denis Savard
107 Pittsburgh Penguins - Sergei Gonchar
108 New Jersey Devils - Earl Seibert

Round #10
109 New Jersey Devils - Lionel Conacher
110 Pittsburgh Penguins - Bill Smith
111 Los Angeles Kings - Scott Niedermayer
112 Winnipeg Jets - Vladimir Krutov
113 Montreal Canadiens - Rod Langway
114 Colorado Rockies - Mike Gartner
115 Toronto Maple Leafs - Doug Wilson
116 Boston Bruins - George Hainsworth
117 Vancouver Millionaires - Tom Johnson
118 Quebec Nordiques - Doug Bentley
119 Philadelphia Flyers - Michel Goulet
120 Detroit Red Wings - Guy LaPointe

Round #11
121 Detroit Red Wings - Brendan Shanahan
122 Philadelphia Flyers - Clark Gillies
123 Quebec Nordiques - Vladimir Petrov
124 Vancouver Millionaires - Sid Abel
125 Boston Bruins - Emile Bouchard
126 Toronto Maple Leafs - Eric Lindros
127 Colorado Rockies - Harry Howell
128 Montreal Canadiens - Red Horner
129 Winnipeg Jets - Yvan Cournoyer
130 Los Angeles Kings - Tim Kerr
131 Pittsburgh Penguins - Peter Bondra
132 New Jersey Devils - Turk Broda

Round #12
133 New Jersey Devils -Alexei Kasatonov
134 Pittsburgh Penguins -Ulf Samuelson
135 Los Angeles Kings -Adam Foote
136 Pittsburgh Penguins -Sidney Crosby
137 Montreal Canadiens -Elmar Lach
138 Colorado Rockies - Phil Housley
139 Toronto Maple Leafs - Grant Fuhr
140 Boston Bruins - Jean Ratelle
141 Vancouver Millionaires - Jacques Laperriere
142 Quebec Nordiques - Claude Provost
143 Philadelphia Flyers - Johnny Bower
144 Detroit Red Wings - Vladamir Konstantinov

Round #13
145 Detroit Red Wings - Paul Kariya
146 Philadelphia Flyers - Bill Barber
147 Quebec Nordiques - Walter "Babe" Pratt
148 Vancouver Millionaires - Harry "Whipper" Watson
149 Boston Bruins - Bill Barilko
150 Toronto Maple Leafs - Randy Carlysle
151 Colorado Rockies - Glenn Anderson
152 Montreal Canadiens - Ken Hodge
153 Winnipeg Jets - Rick MacLeish
154 Los Angeles Kings - Ziggy Palffy
155 Pittsburgh Penguins - John Leclair
156 New Jersey Devils - Dave Keon

Round #14
157 New Jersey Devils - Vaclav Nedomansky
158 Pittsburgh Penguins - Sergei Zubov
159 Los Angeles Kings - Rick Tocchet
160 Winnipeg Jets - Mark Recchi
161 Montreal Canadiens - Guy Carbonneau
162 Colorado Rockies - Joe Mullen
163 Toronto Maple Leafs - Dave Andreychuk
164 Boston Bruins - Woody Dumart
165 Vancouver Millionaires - Bernie Federko
166 Quebec Nordiques - Esa Tikkanen
167 Philadelphia Flyers - Ivan "Ching" Johnson
168 Detroit Red Wings - Kent Nilsson

Round #15
169 Detroit Red Wings - Gary Suter
170 Philadelphia Flyers - Steve Larmer
171 Quebec Nordiques - Vladimir Lutchenko
172 Vancouver Millionaires - Allan Stanley
173 Boston Bruins - Bobby Bauer
174 Toronto Maple Leafs - Rick Vaive
175 Colorado Rockies - Dale Hunter
176 Montreal Canadiens - Syd Howe
177 Winnipeg Jets - Tony Esposito
178 Los Angeles Kings - Joe Thornton
179 Pittsburgh Penguins - Dany Heatley
180 New Jersey Devils - Ted "Teeder" Kennedy

Round #16
180 New Jersey Devils - Sprague Cleghorn
181 Pittsburgh Penguins - Jason Allison
182 Los Angeles Kings - Dave Taylor
183 Winnipeg Jets - Terry O'Reilly
184 Montreal Canadiens - Joe Hall
185 Colorado Rockies - Bill Quackenbush
186 Toronto Maple Leafs - Carl Brewer
187 Boston Bruins - Mike Modano
188 Vancouver Millionaires - Roy Conacher
189 Quebec Nordiques - Bill Mosienko
190 Philadelphia Flyers - Brian Propp
191 Detroit Red Wings - Ed Belfour

Round #17
192 Detroit Red Wings - Keith Tkachuk
193 Philadelphia Flyers - Bryan Hextall
194 Quebec Nordiques - Pelle Lindbergh
195 Vancouver Millionaires - Punch Broadbent
196 Boston Bruins - Rob Ramage
197 Toronto Maple Leafs - Derian Hatcher
198 Colorado Rockies - Ebbie Goodfellow
199 Montreal Canadiens - Pete Mahovlich
200 Winnipeg Jets - Todd Bertuzzi
201 Los Angeles Kings - Markus Naslund
202 Pittsburgh Penguins - Ilya Kovalchuk
203 New Jersey Devils - Rick Middleton

Round #18
204 New Jersey Devils - Bill Gadsby
205 Pittsburgh Penguins - Alexei Kovalev
206 Los Angeles Kings - Jovanovski
207 Winnipeg Jets - Zdeno Chara
208 Montreal Canadiens - Jimmy Foster
209 Colorado Rockies - Dave "Tiger" Williams
210 Toronto Maple Leafs - Ken Linesman
211 Boston Bruins - Bob Probert
212 Vancouver Millionaires - Kenny Reardon
213 Quebec Nordiques - Kevin Stevens
214 Philadelphia Flyers - Eric Desjardins
215 Detroit Red Wings -Jacques Lemaire

Round #19
216 Detroit Red Wings - Gary Roberts
217 Philadelphia Flyers - Kevin Lowe
218 Quebec Nordiques - Al Iafrate
219 Vancouver Millionaires - Herbie Lewis
220 Boston Bruins - Brian Sutter
221 Toronto Maple Leafs - Joel Otto
222 Colorado Rockies - Dave Schultz
223 Montreal Canadiens - Hakan Loob
224 Winnipeg Jets - Kjell Samuelsson
225 Los Angeles Kings - John Madden
226 Pittsburgh Penguins - Sandis Ozolinsh
227 New Jersey Devils - "Babe" Siebert

Round #20
228 New Jersey Devils - John Tonelli
229 Pittsburgh Penguins - Claude Lemieux
230 Los Angeles Kings - Mike Richter
231 Winnipeg Jets - Butch Goring
232 Montreal Canadiens - Leo Boivin
233 Colorado Rockies - Cecil "Tiny" Thompson
234 Toronto Maple Leafs - Joe Nieuwendyk
235 Boston Bruins - Marty McSorley
236 Vancouver Millionaires - Roy Worters
237 Quebec Nordiques - Jan Suchy
238 Philadelphia Flyers -
239 Detroit Red Wings -

Leaf Lander
09-22-2003, 04:37 PM
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/logos/tor.gif


9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson #10 Ron Francis #9 Maurice Richard



#17 Wendel Clark #93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin



#25 Dave Andreychuk#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive


# Joel Otto #13 Ken Linesman #25 Joe Nieuwendyk


#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens

#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle

#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur

Spitfire11
09-22-2003, 05:11 PM
With pick #191, the Detroit Red Wings will finally select our starter, goaltender Ed Belfour.

And with the next pick Detroit selects yet another power forward, LW Keith Tkachuk.

Nilsson-Mikita-Esposito
Shanahan-Sakic-Neely
Kariya-Oates-Selanne
Tkachuk-???-???

Orr-Konstantinov
Pilote-Lapointe
Vasiliev-Suter

Belfour
???

BM67
09-22-2003, 05:17 PM
NEW JERSEY DEVILS

Bobby Hull - Mark Messier - Charlie Conacher
Dickie Moore - Nels Stewart - Andy Bathgate
------ - Ted Kennedy - Vaclav Nedomansky
------ - Dave Keon - Rick Middleton

Red Kelly - Earl Seibert
Alexei Kasatonov - Lionel Conacher
Sprague Cleghorn - Bill Gadsby

Ken Dryden
Turk Broda

Hart:
Hull – 65, 66 Runner-up: 60, 64
Messier – 90, 92; Runner-up: 96
Kelly – Runner-up: 54
Dryden – Runner-up: 72
C. Conacher – Runner-up: 35
Stewart – 26, 30
Bathgate – 59; Runner-up: 58
L. Conacher – Runner-up: 34, 37
Kennedy – 55; Runner-up: 50
Cleghorn – Runner-up: 24, 26

Art Ross (scoring leader pre-48):
Hull – 60, 62, 66; Runner-up: 64, 67, 69
Messier – Runner-up: 90
Moore – 58, 59
C. Conacher – 34, 35
Stewart – 26; Runner-up: 29
Bathgate – Runner-up: 62, 63
Nedomansky - Czech.: 67, 71, 72, 74

Conn Smythe (*THN pick pre-65, pg 22-23, June 27 issue):
Messier - 84
Kelly - *54
Dryden - 71
C. Conacher - *32
Stewart - *26
L. Conacher - *34
Broda - *49
Keon - 67
Kennedy - *47, *48

Norris (*top all-star vote getter 31-53):
Kelly – *51,*52, *53, 54 Runner-up: 55, 57
Seibert – *42, *43, *44 Runner-up: *35
L. Conacher – Runner-up: *34
Kasatonov - Best Defenseman: WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 83
Gadsby - Runner-up: 56, 58, 59

Vezina:
Dryden - 73, 76, 77, 78, 79
Broda - 41, 48 Runner-up: 42, 43, 47

Calder:
Hull - Runner-up: 58
Dryden - 72
Keon - 61

Lady Byng:
Hull - 65
Kelly - 51, 53, 54, 61 Runner-up: 50, 52
Keon - 62, 63 Runner-up: 64, 67, 71
Middleton - 82 Runner-up: 83, 84

Lester B Pearson:
Messier - 90, 92

Lester Patrick:
Hull - 69

Gary Davidson (WHA MVP):
Hull - 73, 75

Paul Daneau (WHA Most Gentlemenly Player):
Keon - 77, 78
Nedomansky - 76

All-star Teams:
Hull - 1st: 60, 62, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 72 (WHA) 73, 74, 75
2nd: 63, 71 (WHA) 76, 78
Messier - 1st: 82, 83, 90, 92 2nd: 84
Kelly - 1st: 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 57 2nd: 50, 56
Dryden - 1st: 73, 76, 77, 78, 79 2nd: 72
Moore - 1st: 58, 59 2nd: 61
C. Conacher - 1st: 34, 35, 36 2nd: 32, 33
Bathgate - 1st: 59, 62 2nd: 58, 63
Seibert - 1st: 35, 42, 43, 44 2nd: 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41
L. Conacher - 1st: 34 2nd: 33, 37
Kasatonov - WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 82, 83, 85, 86, 91 USSR: 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88 Canada Cup: 81
Broda - 1st: 41, 48 2nd: 42
Keon - 2nd: 62, 71
Nedomansky - WEC-A: 69, 70, 74 Best Forward WEC-A: 74
Kennedy - 2nd: 50, 51, 54
Middleton - 2nd: 82
Gadsby - 56, 58, 59 2nd: 53, 54, 57, 65

Goals leader:
Hull - 60, 62, 64, 66, 67, 68, 69 WHA: 75
Moore - 58
C. Conacher - 31, 32, 34, 35, 36
Stewart - 26, 37
Nedomansky - Czech.: 67, 70, 71, 72, 74

Assists leader:
Moore - 59
Bathgate - 62, 64
Kennedy - 51
Cleghorn - NHA: 15

Cup Rings (*Captain):
Hull - 61 WHA: 76, 78
Messier - 84, 85, 87, 88, *90, *94
Kelly - 50, 52, 54, 55, 62, 63, 64, 67
Dryden - 71, 73, 76, 77, 78, 79
Moore - 53, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60
C. Conacher - 32
Stewart - 26
Bathgate - 64
Seibert - 33, 38
L. Conacher - 34, 35
Broda - 42, 47, 48, 49, 51
Keon - 62, 63, 64, 67
Kennedy - 45, 47, 48, *49, *51
Cleghorn - 20, 21, *24

monkey_00*
09-22-2003, 06:02 PM
<>

monkey_00*
09-22-2003, 06:36 PM
<Center>Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-*********
(D)-************* (D)-********

(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-*********** (C)-Sydney Crosby (RW)-Mark Recchi</Center>

Norris Trophy

Larry Robinson -MTL (2) 1977, 1980

Vezina Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI (3) 1970, 1972, 1974
Martin Brodeur -NJ (1) 2003
(Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons)

William M.Jennings trophy

Martin Brodeur -NJ (3) 1997, 1998, 2003

Art Ross trophy

Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1975
Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1983

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Alex Delvecchio -DET (3) 1959, 1966, 1969

Hart Memorial Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (3) 1973, 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (2) 1977, 1978

Calder Memorial Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI; 1970
Luc Robitaille -LA; 1987

Conn Smythe Trophy

Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (1) 1973
Guy LaFleur -MTL (1) 1977
Larry Robinson -MTL (1) 1978

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (1); 2003
Tony Esposito -CHI (3); 1970, 1972, 1980
Larry Robinson -MTL (3); 1977, 1979, 1980
Borje Salming -TOR (1); 1977
Marcel Pronovost -DET (2); 1960, 1961
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (6); 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980
Luc Robitaille (5); 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993

Second Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (2); 1997, 1998
Tony Esposito -CHI(2); 1973, 1974
Larry Robinson -MTL (2); 1978, 1981
Borje Salming (5); 1975, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980
Marcel Pronovost (2); 1958, 1959
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1973, 1974
Luc Robitaille (3); 1987, 1992, 2001
Alex Delvecchio -DET (2); 1953, 1959
Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (4); 1969, 1971, 1972, 1973
Mark Recchi -PIT/PHA(1); 1992

Frightened Inmate #2
09-22-2003, 06:40 PM
Quebec Nordique (Maxwell Edison)
(G)- Dominik Hasek
(G)- Pelle Lindbergh

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)-Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)-************* (D)-********

Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-*********** (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost


Norris Trophy

N/A

Vezina Trophy

Dominik Hasek - 1994, 1995, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2001

William M.Jennings trophy

Dominik Hasek - 1994, 2001

Art Ross trophy

Doug Bentley - 1943 (scoring leader)
Max Bentley - 1946, 1947 (scoring leader)
Gordie Howe - 1951, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1957, 1963
Peter Forsberg - 2003

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Dominik Hasek - 1997, 1998

Frank J. Selke Trophy

N/A

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Gilbert Perreault - 1973
Bill Mosienko- 1945

Hart Memorial Trophy

Babe Pratt - 1944
Max Bentley - 1946
Dominik Hasek - 1997, 1998
Gordie Howe - 1952, 1953, 1957, 1958, 1960, 1963
Peter Forsberg - 2003

Calder Memorial Trophy

Gilbert Perreault - 1971
Peter Forsberg - 1994

Conn Smythe Trophy

N/A

Bill Masterton

Claude Provost -1968

Frightened Inmate #2
09-22-2003, 06:51 PM
NHL First All Star Team
Dominik Hasek - 1994, 1995, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2001
Gordie Howe - 1951, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1957, 1958, 1960, 1963, 1966, 1968, 1969, 1970
Peter Forsberg - 1998, 1999, 2003
Dit Clapper - 1939, 1940, 1941
King Clancey - 1931, 1934
Babe Pratt - 1944
Doug Bentley - 1943, 1944. 1947
Max Bentley - 1946

Second Team All Star
Gordie Howe - 1949, 1950, 1956, 1959, 1961, 1962, 1964, 1965, 1967
Dit Clapper - 1931, 1935, 1944
Babe Pratt - 1945
Bill Mosienko - 1945, 1946
Doug bentley - 1949,
Max bentley - 1947
Gilbert perreault - 1976, 1977

Will Post Russian Awards Later

monkey_00*
09-22-2003, 07:03 PM
Here you go:

http://www.bov.ch/hockey/allstar.html

GB
09-23-2003, 02:03 AM
Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Player Unknown-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Player Unknown

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Player Unknown

Glenn Hall
Player Unknown

John Flyers Fan
09-23-2003, 05:02 AM
The Philadelphia Flyers select from Grenfell, Sask.

Bryan Hextall

This hard nosed right winger was the

NHL goal scoring leader in 1940 & 41.
Points leader in 1942. (pre Art Ross trophy)
Three time 1st all-star selection as well as one second team nod.

Scored the Stanley Cup winning goal in game 6, 1940 for the Rangers last Cup win in 54 years.

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?mem=p196902&type=Player&page=bio&list=ByPosition&pos=RW#photo

Propp-Gretzky-Jagr
Barber-Fedorov-Makarov
Goulet-Malone-Larmer
Gillies-Cowley-Hextall

Potvin-Lidstrom
Park-Ching Johnson
xxxxxx-xxxxxx

Johnny Bower
xxxxxxx

Frightened Inmate #2
09-23-2003, 07:35 AM
Quebec Selects a man who had a great career cut short due to a car crash, Pelle Lindbergh.

Dr Love
09-23-2003, 02:10 PM
Quebec Selects a man who had a great career cut short due to a car crash, Pelle Lindbergh.

*******!!! I was hoping to nab him as my backup. :mad:

I'll be making my selection shortly.

Frightened Inmate #2
09-23-2003, 02:21 PM
*******!!! I was hoping to nab him as my backup. :mad:

I'll be making my selection shortly.

I was watching some old footage of him and what a player he was. Sad about his death.

Dr Love
09-23-2003, 02:29 PM
I was watching some old footage of him and what a player he was. Sad about his death.

Yeah. I was hoping to have an all-Flyer Vezina goalie duo. Oh well.

Vancouver selects RW Punch Broadbent. Rough and tough and a deadly scorer in his time.

Laperriere22*
09-23-2003, 03:00 PM
The Boston Bruins select Rob Ramage with their next pick. Solid defenseman with good offensive ability and more than his fair share of toughness. Being an ex-Blue and ex-Rockie certainly doesn't hurt either.

Leaf Lander
09-23-2003, 03:43 PM
The Toronto Maple Leafs are very pleased to select
#2 Derian Hatcher

http://www.joyofhockey.com/00251.jpg

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/PHOTOFILE/AADI015.jpg


The Toronto Maple Leafs thus far

9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson #10 Ron Francis #9 Maurice Richard



#17 Wendel Clark #93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin



#25 Dave Andreychuk#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive



#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur

BM67
09-23-2003, 03:47 PM
The Boston Bruins select Rob Ramage with their next pick. Solid defenseman with good offensive ability and more than his fair share of toughness. Being an ex-Blue and ex-Rockie certainly doesn't hurt either.


I think he's a decent pick, but man have you ever looked at his +/-? He's a career -171. He was only a + in 3 of his 15 years. I know he played on some bad teams, but ouch.

Leaf Lander
09-23-2003, 05:51 PM
B]9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson #10 Ron Francis #9 Maurice Richard



#17 Wendel Clark #93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin



#25 Dave Andreychuk#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive



#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur[/B][/SIZE][/QUOTE]

I gotthe best d imo!!!


#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher

Dream team Defence wins Champioships

now if only there was a game where we could drop all these players into a program and see what they would do against each other.

Laperriere22*
09-23-2003, 06:05 PM
I think he's a decent pick, but man have you ever looked at his +/-? He's a career -171. He was only a + in 3 of his 15 years. I know he played on some bad teams, but ouch.

Nope, I don't bother with stats much, especially +/-. Doesn't surprise me though; not only did he play on a lot of bad teams, he played with a lot of bad players too. Always thought he was a heck of a defenseman in spite of that.

BM67
09-23-2003, 06:31 PM
I gotthe best d imo!!!

#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


Detroit:
Orr -Pilote
Vasiliev - Lapointe
Konstantinov - Suter

LA:
Shore - Pronger
Leetch - Niedermayer
Foote - ?TBD?

I think I'd take Detroit.

Leaf Lander
09-23-2003, 07:10 PM
Detroit:
Orr -Pilote
Vasiliev - Lapointe
Konstantinov - Suter

LA:
Shore - Pronger
Leetch - Niedermayer
Foote - ?TBD?

I think I'd take Detroit.

i dint know neidermyer and foote had won any awards for d :)

all my guys got good offensive #'s and decent speed
not to mention toughness

John Flyers Fan
09-24-2003, 04:22 AM
Detroit:
Orr -Pilote
Vasiliev - Lapointe
Konstantinov - Suter

LA:
Shore - Pronger
Leetch - Niedermayer
Foote - ?TBD?

I think I'd take Detroit.

Neither are stopping my forwards

Propp-Gretzky-Jagr
Barber-Fedorov-Makarov
Goulet-Malone-Larmer
Gillies-Cowley-Hextall

BM67
09-24-2003, 05:03 AM
i dint know neidermyer and foote had won any awards for d :)

all my guys got good offensive #'s and decent speed
not to mention toughness


I wasn't aware that Hatcher or Brewer had won any either. :)

BM67
09-24-2003, 05:05 AM
Neither are stopping my forwards

Propp-Gretzky-Jagr
Barber-Fedorov-Makarov
Goulet-Malone-xxxxx
Gillies-Cowley-Hextall

I don't know. I think Shore and Pronger would put a good pounding on your bunch of softies. ;)

John Flyers Fan
09-24-2003, 05:10 AM
I don't know. I think Shore and Pronger would put a good pounding on your bunch of softies. ;)


Gillies & Hextall can certainly mix it up.

Also I have a feeling that Shore might have a little trouble keeping up with Gretz, Jagr, Fedorov & Makarov .... :p

BM67
09-24-2003, 05:24 AM
Gillies & Hextall can certainly mix it up.

Also I have a feeling that Shore might have a little trouble keeping up with Gretz, Jagr, Fedorov & Makarov .... :p

You are aware that Shore was a fine rushing defenseman aren't you? Besides they have to come to him, he doesn't have to chase them down. ;)

John Flyers Fan
09-24-2003, 05:32 AM
You are aware that Shore was a fine rushing defenseman aren't you? Besides they have to come to him, he doesn't have to chase them down. ;)


Yes, I'm aware, but few in the world have ever skated like Fedorov or Makarov.

Gretz is too smart, and Jagr is both bigger and faster than Shore. :D

Frightened Inmate #2
09-24-2003, 06:12 AM
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-*********** (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost

I like my forward lines. Two of the best Soviet Scorers on the top line along with one of the purest playmakers in NHL history.
Second line is the famous pony line, need i say more. Skill and speed all around.
Checking. Hell any line with Gordie Howe is guarentted to be good but combine his reckless playing style and scoring ability with Forsberg who can play very tough and you have 2/3 of a great line.
Grind/ Two way/ Agitating line - best agitator all time in Tikkanen IMO along with Petrov who is considered by many to be the best two way player fromt he sovie union and Provost who was the top two way player in the 1950's i believe.


Defense is weak as there is no player who is a pure goalscorer but it is still quite good.

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)-Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)-************* (D)-********

Goaltenders are great if you ask me

Hasek in his prime was amazing if you ask me. He could win games on his own.
Pelle well he would be one of the all time greats if it wasn't for a car wreck.

monkey_00*
09-24-2003, 12:58 PM
Who's next up for the Draft?

Herby
09-24-2003, 01:05 PM
I tried to build my team with a defense first type of attitude.

Shore and Pronger, both top defenseman and former league MVP's.

Niedermayer one of the great and unheralded dman of his generation, amazing skater, gritty, great defensively and good skills.

Leetch, one of the best offensive d-man of his era. Also a clutch player, his performance in the 94 Stanley Cup Playoffs is maybe the best I have seen any player in any sport play in a postseason.

Foote, I hate the guy but respect him. Everyteam needs a guy like Foote.

And ofcourse the great Vladislav Tretiak in goal.

Oiler94
09-24-2003, 01:14 PM
Who's next up for the Draft?

I am, I'll make my pick soon..

Oiler94
09-24-2003, 01:36 PM
The Colorado Rockiespick their 6th defenceman from Ottawa, Ontario, Ebbie Goodfellow.
http://www.beehivehockey.com/images/player_images_group1/ebbiegoodfellow1.jpg
Goodfellow was named a First-Team All-Star twice with Detroit, while being named a Second Team All-Star earlier in his career, and won the Hart Trophy in 1940. Goodfellow retired after winning his 3rd Stanley Cup in 1942-43.

Toe Blake-Jean Beliveau-Henri Richard "The Canadien Line"
Johnny Bucyk-Darryl Sittler-Mike Gartner
Jari Kurri-Syl Apps-Joe Mullen
TBA-Dale Hunter-TBA

Paul Coffey-Larry Murphy
Harry Howell-Phil Housley "The 'H' Pair"
Bill Quackenbush-Ebbie Goodfellow "The Long Name Duo"

Jacques Plante

monkey_00*
09-24-2003, 02:04 PM
Next Up.............GB Editor.........

Oiler94
09-24-2003, 02:33 PM
Norris Trophy

Paul Coffey -EDM (3), 1986, 1986, 1995
Harry Howell -NYR, 1967

Vezina Trophy

Jaques Plante -MTL (7) 1956, 1957, 1958, 1959, 1960, 1962, 1969

William M.Jennings trophy

(Plante retired before this trophy was awarded)

Art Ross trophy

Jean Beliveau -MTL, 1956

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

N/A

Frank J. Selke Trophy

N/A

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Syl Apps -TOR, 1942
Toe Blake -MTL, 1946
Bill Quackembush- DET, 1949
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1971
Jari Kurri -EDM, 1985
Joe Mullen -CGY (2) 1987, 1989

Hart Memorial Trophy

Toe Blake -MTL, 1939
Ebbie Goodfellow -DET, 1940
Jean Beliveau -MTL (2) 1956, 1964
Jacques Plante -MTL, 1962

Calder Memorial Trophy

Syl Apps -TOR, 1937

Conn Smythe Trophy

Jean Beliveau -MTL, 1965

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Ebbie Goodfellow -DET (2) 1937, 1940
Syl Apps -TOR (2) 1939, 1942
Toe Blake -MTL (3) 1939, 1940, 1945
Bill Quackenbush -DET (3) 1948, 1949, 1951
Jean Beliveau -MTL (6); 1955, 1956, 1957, 1959, 1960, 1961
Jacques Plante -MTL (3); 1956, 1959, 1962
Henri Richard -MTL, 1958
Harry Howell -NYR, 1967
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1971
Jari Kurri -EDM, 1985, 1987,
Paul Coffey -EDM, PITT, DET (3) 1985, 1986, 1989, 1995
Joe Mullen -CGY, 1989

Second Allstar Team Selections

Ebbie Goodfellow -DET, 1936
Syl Apps -TOR (3) 1938, 1941, 1943
Toe Blake -MTL, 1938
Jacques Plante -MTL (2) 1960, 1971
Henri Richard -MTL (2) 1961, 1963
Jean Beliveau -MTL (3) 1964, 1966, 1969
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1968
Darryl Sittler -TOR, 1978
Paul Coffey -EDM (4) 1982, 1983, 1984, 1990
Jari Kurri -EDM (3) 1984, 1986, 1989
Larry Murphy -WAS (3) 1987, 1993, 1995
Phil Housley -WPG, 1992

Oiler94
09-24-2003, 03:29 PM
Norris Trophy

Paul Coffey -EDM (3), 1986, 1986, 1995
Harry Howell -NYR, 1967

Vezina Trophy

Jaques Plante -MTL (7) 1956, 1957, 1958, 1959, 1960, 1962, 1969

William M.Jennings Trophy

(Plante retired before this trophy was awarded)

Art Ross trophy

Jean Beliveau -MTL, 1956

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

N/A

Frank J. Selke Trophy

N/A

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Syl Apps -TOR, 1942
Toe Blake -MTL, 1946
Bill Quackenbush- DET, 1949
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1971
Joe Mullen -CGY (2) 1987, 1989

Hart Memorial Trophy

Toe Blake -MTL, 1939
Ebbie Goodfellow -DET, 1940
Jean Beliveau -MTL (2) 1956, 1964
Jacques Plante -MTL, 1962

Calder Memorial Trophy

Syl Apps -TOR, 1937

Conn Smythe Trophy

Jean Beliveau -MTL, 1965

NHL-All Star Game MVP

Jean Beliveau -MTL, 1964
Henri Richard -MTL, 1967

First Team All-Star Selections

Ebbie Goodfellow -DET (2) 1937, 1940
Syl Apps -TOR (2) 1939, 1942
Toe Blake -MTL (3) 1939, 1940, 1945
Bill Quackenbush -DET (3) 1948, 1949, 1951
Jean Beliveau -MTL (6); 1955, 1956, 1957, 1959, 1960, 1961
Jacques Plante -MTL (3); 1956, 1959, 1962
Henri Richard -MTL, 1958
Harry Howell -NYR, 1967
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1971
Paul Coffey -EDM, PITT, DET (3) 1985, 1986, 1989, 1995
Joe Mullen -CGY, 1989

Second Team All-Star Selections

Ebbie Goodfellow -DET, 1936
Syl Apps -TOR (3) 1938, 1941, 1943
Toe Blake -MTL, 1938
Jacques Plante -MTL (2) 1960, 1971
Henri Richard -MTL (2) 1961, 1963
Jean Beliveau -MTL (3) 1964, 1966, 1969
Johnny Bucyk -BOS, 1968
Darryl Sittler -TOR, 1978
Paul Coffey -EDM (4) 1982, 1983, 1984, 1990
Larry Murphy -WAS (3) 1987, 1993, 1995
Phil Housley -WPG, 1992

monkey_00*
09-24-2003, 03:43 PM
These are great!..........It's great to see what types of awards and How many times each of our players have been voted on first and second team Allstars.

GB
09-24-2003, 11:07 PM
Montreal selects, from Timmins Ontariio, Left Winger:

Pete Mahovlich (http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php3?pid%5B%5D=3324)

http://www.beehivehockey.com/images/player_images_group3/petemahovlich3.jpg

Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Pete Mahovlich-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Player Unknown

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Player Unknown

Glenn Hall
Player Unknown

monkey_00*
09-25-2003, 01:18 AM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to select from Sudbury Ontario....Drafted #23 overall in the 1993 NHL Entry Draft..........One of the toughest and also one of the Top Power Forwards in National Hockey League today...from the Vancouver Canucks;

#44 TODD BERTUZZI

<Center><IMG height=225 src="http://www.insidehockey.com/bennett/bertuzzi_todd_01.jpg" width=200>

Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-*********
(D)-************* (D)-********

(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Sydney Crosby (RW)-Mark Recchi

<Center><IMG height=355 src="http://www.joyofhockey.com/03305.jpg" width=250>

monkey_00*
09-25-2003, 01:44 AM
Norris Trophy

Larry Robinson -MTL (2) 1977, 1980

Vezina Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI (3) 1970, 1972, 1974
Martin Brodeur -NJ (1) 2003
(Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons)

William M.Jennings trophy

Martin Brodeur -NJ (3) 1997, 1998, 2003

Art Ross trophy

Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1975
Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1983

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Alex Delvecchio -DET (3) 1959, 1966, 1969

Hart Memorial Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (3) 1973, 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (2) 1977, 1978

Calder Memorial Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI; 1970
Luc Robitaille -LA; 1987

Conn Smythe Trophy

Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (1) 1973
Guy LaFleur -MTL (1) 1977
Larry Robinson -MTL (1) 1978

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (1); 2003
Tony Esposito -CHI (3); 1970, 1972, 1980
Larry Robinson -MTL (3); 1977, 1979, 1980
Borje Salming -TOR (1); 1977
Marcel Pronovost -DET (2); 1960, 1961
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (6); 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980
Luc Robitaille (5); 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993
Todd Bertuzzi (1); 2003

Second Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (2); 1997, 1998
Tony Esposito -CHI(2); 1973, 1974
Larry Robinson -MTL (2); 1978, 1981
Borje Salming (5); 1975, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980
Marcel Pronovost (2); 1958, 1959
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1973, 1974
Luc Robitaille (3); 1987, 1992, 2001
Alex Delvecchio -DET (2); 1953, 1959
Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (4); 1969, 1971, 1972, 1973
Mark Recchi -PIT/PHA(1); 1992

Laperriere22*
09-25-2003, 09:51 AM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to select from Sudbury Ontario....Drafted #23 overall in the 1993 NHL Entry Draft..........One of the toughest and also one of the Top Power Forwards in National Hockey League today...from the Vancouver Canucks;

#44 TODD BERTUZZI
</center>


Good luck in the playoffs; you're going to need it.

Herby
09-25-2003, 12:48 PM
Los Angeles Kings select, the man that should have been the NHL's MVP last season. From the Vancouver Canucks.

Markus Naslund

Herby
09-25-2003, 01:02 PM
Los Angeles Kings

Forwards

Tim Kerr / Marcel Dionne / Pavel Bure

Bill Cook / Steve Yzerman / Denis Savard

Markus Naslund / Joe Thornton / Ziggy Palffy

Dave Taylor / TBA / Rick Tocchet


Defenseman

Eddie Shore / Scott Niedermayer

Chris Pronger / TBA

Adam Foote / Brian Leetch


Goaltenders

Vladislav Tretiak
TBA

Herby
09-25-2003, 02:04 PM
Kings Award Winners & Accomplishments

Hart Trophy (League MVP)

Eddie Shore (4)- 1933, 1935, 1936, 1938
Chris Pronger (1)- 2000


Lester Pearson Trophy (NHLPA MVP)

Marcel Dionne (2)- 1979, 1980
Steve Yzerman (1)- 1989
Markus Naslund (1)- 2003


Art Ross Trophy (Leading Scorer)

Marcel Dionne (1)- 1980


Norris Trophy (Best Defenseman)

Brian Leetch (2)- 1992, 1997
Chris Pronger (1)- 2000


Maurice Rocket Richard Trophy (Top Goal-scorer)

Pavel Bure (2)- 2000, 2001


Conn Smythe Trophy (MVP of the Stanley Cup Playoffs)

Brian Leetch (1)- 1994
Steve Yzerman (1)- 1998


Calder Trophy (Rookie of the Year)

Brian Leetch (1)- 1989
Pavel Bure (1)- 1992


Frank J. Selke Trophy (Top Defensive Forward)

Steve Yzerman (1)- 2000


Lady Byng Trophy (Most Gentlemanlly Conduct)

Marcel Dionne (1)- 1977

Leaf Lander
09-25-2003, 05:47 PM
JDB3939 on the CLOCK

BM67 on deck

JDB3939 double deck
BM67 clean up

Oiler94
09-26-2003, 02:24 PM
JDB3939 on the CLOCK

BM67 on deck

JDB3939 double deck
BM67 clean up

24 hours later...

BM67 can now make his pick

BM67
09-26-2003, 05:50 PM
Time is up for JDB3939. I'll make my picks in a moment and then he will be on the clock for two picks.

BM67
09-26-2003, 06:12 PM
The Devils are proud to select a solid two-way right winger from the Boston Bruins:

Rick Middleton

http://www.bruins-legends.com/M/images/middleton.jpg

The Devils are also pleased to round out our defense with an all-time great who had the misfortune to have his peak years at the same time as Doug Harvey and Red Kelly. This HHoFer still managed to make 3 first and 4 second all-star teams.

Bill Gadsby

http://www.beehivehockey.com/images/player_images_group2/billgadsby2n.jpg

JDB3939
09-26-2003, 06:28 PM
The Pittsburgh Penguins will continue with youth and select Ilya Kovalchuk and Alexei Kovalev.

monkey_00*
09-26-2003, 07:57 PM
The Pittsburgh Penguins will continue with youth and select Ilya Kovalchuk and Alexei Kovalev.
Pittsburgh only allowed to select one player not two.........which one will it be Buds?

Frightened Inmate #2
09-26-2003, 08:07 PM
monkey he had two picks. one at end of round, one at the beginning of the next

monkey_00*
09-26-2003, 09:54 PM
monkey he had two picks. one at end of round, one at the beginning of the next
Ya but so did the last guy before him.......2 guys with 2-picks in a row???

Leaf Lander
09-26-2003, 10:06 PM
Ya but so did the last guy before him.......2 guys with 2-picks in a row???


yes

monkey_00*
09-26-2003, 10:10 PM
yes
So what happened here?.......Did they flip flop their selections?.........I don't understand.

GB
09-26-2003, 11:57 PM
So what happened here?.......Did they flip flop their selections?.........I don't understand.
JDB3939 had the 2nd last pick in round 17 and the 2nd pick in round 18. His pick in round 17 was skipped, so BM67 selected twice, with the last pick in round 17 and the first pick in round 18. After this JDB3939 was up with his pick in round 18, but still had his round 17 pick, in effect giving him two consecutive picks.

Liam

monkey_00*
09-27-2003, 07:32 AM
JDB3939 had the 2nd last pick in round 17 and the 2nd pick in round 18. His pick in round 17 was skipped, so BM67 selected twice, with the last pick in round 17 and the first pick in round 18. After this JDB3939 was up with his pick in round 18, but still had his round 17 pick, in effect giving him two consecutive picks.

Liam
Oh ok buds........Now I understand........thanks for clearing that up for me.

Cheers!~

Rick

GB
09-27-2003, 07:53 AM
Oh ok buds........Now I understand........thanks for clearing that up for me.

Cheers!~

Rick
No problem

Leaf Lander
09-27-2003, 06:16 PM
Herby on the clock

Monkey on deck

GBEditor double deck

BM67
09-28-2003, 05:14 AM
Herby has had about 36 hours to make his pick.

Monkey you can take your pick anytime.

GB
09-28-2003, 05:26 AM
Herby has had about 36 hours to make his pick.

Monkey you can take your pick anytime.
I PM'd Herby and monkey this morning to tell them they're both up. It's just a wait until one of them comes online now.

Liam

monkey_00*
09-28-2003, 08:01 AM
I PM'd Herby and monkey this morning to tell them they're both up. It's just a wait until one of them comes online now.

Liam
OK Thanks Liam...I'll make my selection in just a second.

monkey_00*
09-28-2003, 08:09 AM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to select from Trencin, Slovakia ....Drafted #56 overall in the 1996 NHL Entry Draft (3rd-round)..........The biggest player in the NHL today and also one of the Top blueliners in National Hockey League today...standing at 6-foot 9-inches and weighing in at 256-pounds, from the Ottawa Senators;

#3 ZDENO CHARA

<Center><IMG height=192 src="http://www.nhlpa.com/Player_Pics/6194.jpg" width=128>

Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-Zdeno Chara
(D)-************* (D)-********

(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Sydney Crosby (RW)-Mark Recchi

<Center><IMG height=334 src="http://www.sportsphotos.com/hockey/top98/Chara.jpg" width=355>

monkey_00*
09-28-2003, 08:31 AM
Norris Trophy

Larry Robinson -MTL (2) 1977, 1980

Vezina Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI (3) 1970, 1972, 1974
Martin Brodeur -NJ (1) 2003
(Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons)

William M.Jennings trophy

Martin Brodeur -NJ (3) 1997, 1998, 2003

Art Ross trophy

Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1975
Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1983

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Alex Delvecchio -DET (3) 1959, 1966, 1969

Hart Memorial Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (3) 1973, 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (2) 1977, 1978

Calder Memorial Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI; 1970
Luc Robitaille -LA; 1987

Conn Smythe Trophy

Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (1) 1973
Guy LaFleur -MTL (1) 1977
Larry Robinson -MTL (1) 1978

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (1); 2003
Tony Esposito -CHI (3); 1970, 1972, 1980
Larry Robinson -MTL (3); 1977, 1979, 1980
Borje Salming -TOR (1); 1977
Marcel Pronovost -DET (2); 1960, 1961
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (6); 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980
Luc Robitaille (5); 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993
Todd Bertuzzi (1); 2003

Second Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (2); 1997, 1998
Tony Esposito -CHI(2); 1973, 1974
Larry Robinson -MTL (2); 1978, 1981
Borje Salming (5); 1975, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980
Marcel Pronovost (2); 1958, 1959
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1973, 1974
Luc Robitaille (3); 1987, 1992, 2001
Alex Delvecchio -DET (2); 1953, 1959
Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (4); 1969, 1971, 1972, 1973
Mark Recchi -PIT/PHA(1); 1992

GB
09-28-2003, 08:49 AM
Montreal selects their 3rd and final British born player. This was a tough choice between two Scottish goalies, one of whom captained Chicago to the Stanley Cup and is in the Hall of Fame, the other however is my choice.

From Greenock in Scotland, the greatest British goalie ever:

Jimmy Foster (http://www.bihwa.co.uk/hall_of_fame/foster.htm)

http://www.bihwa.co.uk/images/Foster.gif

Now I'm sure most of you have never heard of him, so here's a brief pen portrait of him and his achievements (Sorry if it's patchy, but I'm writing it mostly from memory):

Foster, nicknamed The Parson, was born in 1905. His family moved to Winnipeg where he grew up and learnt hockey. He played hockey for the University of Manitoba and upon graduation joined the Moncton Hawks in 1932. As with many players at the time Foster played amatuer hockey and worked, part-time in the season and full-time in the off-season, which gave him more money than a full-time NHL'er.

In 1932 the 5'8" 157lb Foster became the first goalie to record back-to-back shut-outs in the Allen Cup, in fact he went 417 minutes without conceding a goal. In 1933 and 1934 Foster led Moncton to consecutive Allen Cup wins. Foster missed only 1 game in 220 while at Moncton. However his greatest moment was still to come.

In 1935 Foster returned to the United Kingdom when he signed to gaurd the nets of the Richmond Hawks, who he led to joint top of the English league in points, although the Wembley Lions won the league on the first tie-breaker. Foster was named an A-Team All-Star. He continued to dominate and become the undisputed best goalie in Britain the following season when he joined the Haringey Greyhounds, who he back-stopped to the League and London Cup in 1939. During his time in Britain he recorded 24 shut-outs.

However it was for his performance at the international level that Foster will always be most famous for. In 1936 Foster lead GB to the Triple Crown of the World Championship, European Championship and Olympic Gold, conceding only 3 goals and keeping 4 shut-outs in Nazi Germany. Foster also led GB to the European Championships in 1937 and 1938, the last such Championships for some years. Foster appeared in 31 World Championship games for GB, registering 16 shut-outs.

Foster returned to Canada in 1940 and finished his career with the Quebec Aces after also playing for the Glace Bay Miners.

Foster was elected to the British Hockey Hall of Fame in 1950.


Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Pete Mahovlich-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Player Unknown

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Player Unknown

Glenn Hall
Jimmy Foster

BM67
09-28-2003, 12:53 PM
Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Player Unknown-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Player Unknown

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Player Unknown

Glenn Hall
Jimmy Foster

You left out "the little m", Pete Mahovlich.

Oiler94
09-28-2003, 01:28 PM
The Colorado Rockies select in the 17th round from Weyburn, Saskatchewan, Dave "Tiger" Williams.
http://www.nshl.com/teams/tigerwilliams.jpg

Williams is the all-time penalty leader with 3,966 PIM. Not only could Tiger throw punches, but he's also been to the All-Star game the year he scored a career-high 35 goals, and scored 20 goals 4 other seasons (well, okay, two of those were 19, but close enough). Williams has amassed over 500 points.

Toe Blake-Jean Beliveau-Henri Richard (The "Canadien" Line)
Johnny Bucyk-Darryl Sittler-Mike Gartner
Glenn Anderson-Syl Apps-Joe Mullen
Tiger Williams-Dale Hunter-TBA (The "Goony" Line)

Larry Murphy-Paul Coffey
Harry Howell-Phil Housley
Bill Quackenbush-Ebbie Goodfellow (The "Long Name" Duo)

Jacques Plante

GB
09-28-2003, 01:30 PM
You left out "the little m", Pete Mahovlich.
Thanks, I copied the roster from the wrong post. Good catch.

Liam

Leaf Lander
09-28-2003, 06:20 PM
The Toronto Maple Leafs are proud to select Center
#13 Ken Linesman

http://www.bruins-legends.com/L/images/linseman.jpg



The Toronto Maple Leafs thus far


9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson #10 Ron Francis #9 Maurice Richard




#17 Wendel Clark #93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin




#25 Dave Andreychuk#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive


#13 Ken Linesman



#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur

Herby
09-28-2003, 06:27 PM
Sorry guys, I was in Vegas this weekend for the Kings-Avs game. I'll make my pick in a few minutes.

Leaf Lander
09-28-2003, 06:41 PM
we are having a hurricane in ns

I pick linesman

as i see leclair is gone

monkey_00*
09-28-2003, 07:16 PM
<Center><IMG height=348 src="http://www.bruins-legends.com/L/images/linseman.jpg" width=235>

Herby
09-29-2003, 06:35 AM
Los Angeles Kings select from Windsor, ONT and the Vancouver Canucks.

D-Man Ed "Jovo Cop" Jovanovski.

http://tsn.ca/images/stories/20020912/jovanovski_59268.jpg


Forwards

Tim Kerr / Marcel Dionne / Pavel Bure

Bill Cook / Steve Yzerman / Denis Savard

Markus Naslund / Joe Thornton / Ziggy Palffy

Dave Taylor / TBA / Rick Tocchet


Defenseman

Eddie Shore / Scott Niedermayer

Chris Pronger / Brian Leetch

Adam Foote / Ed Jovanovski


Goaltenders

Vladislav Tretiak
TBA

Laperriere22*
09-29-2003, 07:54 AM
For fear that Oiler94 might be eyeing this man as his next selection, the Boston Bruins will now make their selection. This player was one of the most intimidating players of his era and one of the absolute best enforcers to ever play. Believing that the Bruins could use some top notch grit and intimidation on the fourth line, the Bruins select the legendary:

http://www.angelfire.com/sports/AtlantaCTCHL/images/Bob_Probert1.jpg

LW Bob Probert

Leaf Lander
09-29-2003, 11:22 AM
<Center><IMG height=348 src="http://www.bruins-legends.com/L/images/linseman.jpg" width=235>

Thanks for the pic monkey:D

Leaf Lander
09-29-2003, 11:24 AM
Sorry guys, I was in Vegas this weekend for the Kings-Avs game. I'll make my pick in a few minutes.


are yah napping;)

monkey_00*
09-29-2003, 11:40 AM
Thanks for the pic monkey:D

no problem...anytime....wow that was a great pick...Ed Jovonovski!....for whatever reason I thought he was already selected.

JDB3939
09-29-2003, 12:07 PM
The Pittsburgh Penguins:
John Leclair - Pat Lafontaine - Mike Bossy
Peter Bondra - Boris Mikhailov - Jari Kurri
Ilya Kovalchuk - Jason Allison - Dany Heatley
Dino Ciccarelli - - Alexei Kovalev

Viacheslav Fetisov - Rob Blake
Ulf Samuelson - Sergei Zubov
Sergei Gonchar -

Patrick Roy
Billy Smith

Oiler94
09-29-2003, 12:56 PM
For fear that Oiler94 might be eyeing this man as his next selection, the Boston Bruins will now make their selection. This player was one of the most intimidating players of his era and one of the absolute best enforcers to ever play. Believing that the Bruins could use some top notch grit and intimidation on the fourth line, the Bruins select the legendary:

http://www.angelfire.com/sports/AtlantaCTCHL/images/Bob_Probert1.jpg

LW Bob Probert

grrr..

Laperriere22*
09-29-2003, 02:21 PM
grrr..

So my fears were well-founded. He's been on my radar since I took over for MacDaddy. Once I saw Tiger Williams selected, I knew Probert was in danger of being taken and I took him earlier than I had planned on doing.

Dr Love
09-29-2003, 04:53 PM
Vancouver selects D Kenny Reardon.

Frightened Inmate #2
09-29-2003, 05:32 PM
Quebec Selects one of the best power forwards of all time to fill out the checking line Kevin Stevens.
http://www.neutralzonehockey.com/photos/stevensk.jpg

Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-Kevin Stevens (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)-Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)-************* (D)-********

Starting Goaltender - Dominik Hasek
Backup Goaltender - Pelle Lindbergh

Leaf Lander
09-29-2003, 05:52 PM
John Flyers Fan on the Clock


Spitfire11 On deck
John Flyers Fan double deck
spirtfire clean up
Maxwell edison on the batters circle

Frightened Inmate #2
09-29-2003, 05:55 PM
Just so you don't blow a gasket I did PM John Flyers Fan I just suspose he is taking a little longer than expected (he was online). But do we select 13 forwards or 12?

BM67
09-29-2003, 06:22 PM
Just so you don't blow a gasket I did PM John Flyers Fan I just suspose he is taking a little longer than expected (he was online). But do we select 13 forwards or 12?

12 forwards, 6 D and 2 goalies

Oiler94
09-29-2003, 06:23 PM
2 more rounds

Frightened Inmate #2
09-29-2003, 08:06 PM
We should do 13 forwards (1 spare) just like a true NHL roster. Just m opinion though, i don't know if anyone would be interested in 1 more round?

BM67
09-30-2003, 03:20 AM
We should do 13 forwards (1 spare) just like a true NHL roster. Just m opinion though, i don't know if anyone would be interested in 1 more round?

NHL rosters have three extra players, unless you're the Leafs, so it wouldn't be just one round.

John Flyers Fan
09-30-2003, 04:25 AM
The Philadelphia Flyers are again proud to select one of their own.

The 2nd best defenseman in Flyers history:

Eric Desjardins

Propp-Gretzky-Jagr
Barber-Fedorov-Makarov
Goulet-Malone-Larmer
Gillies-Cowley-Hextall

Potvin-Lidstrom
Park-Desjardins
"Ching" Johnson- xxxx

Bower

Spitfire11
09-30-2003, 10:25 AM
Kind of suprised he's still around, with our 19th selection, Detroit selects one of the best two-way players of all time:

C Jacques Lemaire

Spitfire11
09-30-2003, 10:27 AM
Kind of suprised he's still around, with our 18th selection, Detroit selects one of the best two-way players of all time:

C Jacques Lemaire

Spitfire11
09-30-2003, 10:29 AM
With our 19th selection, Detroit takes another player to put up 50 goals with 200+ PIM, another great two-way player, and all-around mean SOB:

Forward Gary Roberts

Spitfire11
09-30-2003, 10:32 AM
Detroit Red Wings:

Nilsson-Mikita(A)-Esposito
Shanahan-Sakic(C)-Neely
Kariya-Oates-Selanne
Tkachuk-Lemaire-Roberts

Orr-Pilote(A)
Vasiliev-Lapointe
Konstantinov-Suter

Belfour
???

John Flyers Fan
09-30-2003, 10:55 AM
The Philadelphia Flyers complete their defense corps by selecting

Kevin Lowe


Philadelphia Flyers
a.k.a. the best team

Brian Propp - Wayne Gretzky - Jaromir Jagr
Michel Goulet - Joe Malone - Sergei Makarov
Bill Barber - Sergei Fedorov - Steve Larmer
Clark Gillies - Bill Cowley - Bryan Hextall Sr.

Denis Potvin - Nik Lidstrom
Brad Park - Eric Desjardins
Ivan "Ching" Johnson - Kevin Lowe

Johnny Bower
xxxxxxxx

Frightened Inmate #2
09-30-2003, 02:20 PM
In the off chance that we extend the draft by a few player in order to make it more of an NHL roster I am very proud to select Hakan Loob. I searched his name and coundn't find anything but if he isn't taken i am amazed.

EDIT: If it is not allowed just PM me and i will change it

Leaf Lander
09-30-2003, 05:34 PM
I was going to take loob with my next selection:)

Frightened Inmate #2
09-30-2003, 07:19 PM
Gilmours Way you can take Loob and I will change my pick to Al Iafrate, this man had a laser of a shot and if he had any knees whatsoever he would have been an all time great PP quaterback instead of a just being good for a few years.

Leaf Lander
10-01-2003, 10:16 AM
Gilmours Way you can take Loob and I will change my pick to Al Iafrate, this man had a laser of a shot and if he had any knees whatsoever he would have been an all time great PP quaterback instead of a just being good for a few years.


AL "Wild Thing" Iafrate

I remember him well!!

I too thoguht of taking him
but I already took a player like him in Clark.

monkey_00*
10-01-2003, 10:25 AM
I've noticed that a couple of people have been talking about the idea of adding some EXTRA players to our rosters; as many as 3-extra....what's the official word on this?....will we be allowed to select the extra players?....Or will we be sticking with the original plan of selecting 12-forwards, 6-defencemen and 2-goalies?

Thanks

Rick

Spitfire11
10-01-2003, 10:30 AM
I've noticed that a couple of people have been talking about the idea of adding some EXTRA players to our rosters; as many as 3-extra....what's the official word on this?....will we be allowed to select the extra players?....Or will we be sticking with the original plan of selecting 12-forwards, 6-defencemen and 2-goalies?

Thanks

Rick

I say stick to the original since that's what we've been going by from the start.

John Flyers Fan
10-01-2003, 10:31 AM
Agreed

12 forwards
6 defenseman
2 goalies

monkey_00*
10-01-2003, 12:29 PM
I say stick to the original since that's what we've been going by from the start.

I was hoping for at least one extra player since I wasn't the one that originally selected Crosby onto my team.

Dr Love
10-01-2003, 02:53 PM
Vancouver selects LW Herbie Lewis.

Spitfire11
10-01-2003, 04:23 PM
I was hoping for at least one extra player since I wasn't the one that originally selected Crosby onto my team.

I'd say it's alright if you want to dump Crosby

BM67
10-01-2003, 04:47 PM
I'd say it's alright if you want to dump Crosby

I'd second that.

Laperriere22*
10-01-2003, 05:09 PM
The Boston Bruins select, from Viking, Alberta, a tenacious and gritty LW and all-time PIM leader for the St. Louis Blues:

http://www.stlouisblues.com/history/images/retired/pix_ret_sutter7879.jpg

Brian Sutter

http://www.stlouisblues.com/history/retired/retired_sutter.html

Oiler94
10-01-2003, 06:27 PM
I'd second that.

I'll third that

Leaf Lander
10-02-2003, 11:32 AM
The Toronto Maple Leafs

are proud to select

# Joel Otto

http://www.joyofhockey.com/04211.jpg

9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson #10 Ron Francis #9 Maurice Richard



#17 Wendel Clark #93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin



#25 Dave Andreychuk#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive

#13 Ken Linesman



#2 Al MacInnis #4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson #8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer #2 Derian Hatcher


#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur

Oiler94
10-02-2003, 01:43 PM
The Colorado Rockies select their final forward, and final member of the "Goony Line", Dave "The Hammer" Schultz.
http://www.abdcards.com/pf1513c.jpg
In just over 500 NHL games, Schultz had earned almost 2300 PIM, and over 400 PIM in the playoffs.


Toe Blake-Jean Beliveau-Henri Richard "The Canadien Line"
Johnny Bucyk-Darryl Sittler-Mike Gartner
Glenn Anderson-Syl Apps-Joe Mullen
Dave Schultz-Dale Hunter-'Tiger' Williams "The Goony Line"

Paul Coffey-Larry Murphy
Harry Howell-Phil Housley
Bill Quackenbush-Ebbie Goodfellow (The Long Name duo)

Jacques Plante

GB
10-02-2003, 11:01 PM
Montreal selcets, from Slite, Right Winger:

Hakan Loob (http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php3?pid=3198)


Sorry I can't find a decent picture of him.


Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Pete Mahovlich-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Hakan Loob

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Player Unknown

Glenn Hall
Jimmy Foster

Frightened Inmate #2
10-03-2003, 04:01 AM
Gone round 8

GB
10-03-2003, 04:21 AM
IE search didn't pick it up. I'll change now it.

monkey_00*
10-03-2003, 01:33 PM
So what's the official word...will I be allowed to drop Crosby and replace him with someone else?

Thanks

monkey_00*
10-03-2003, 01:41 PM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to select from Tyngsryd, Sweden ....Drafted #119 overall in the 1984 NHL Entry Draft (6th-round)..........The biggest player in the NHL in his day...standing at 6-foot 6-inches and weighing in at 236-pounds;

#28 Kjell Samuelsson

<Center><IMG height=124 src="http://www.smalands-ishockey.g.se/80-talet.jpg" width=90>

Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-Zdeno Chara
(D)-Kjell Samuelsson (D)-********

(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Sydney Crosby (RW)-Mark Recchi

<Center><IMG height=400 src="http://w1.620.telia.com/~u62006182/samuelsson2.jpg" width=260>

monkey_00*
10-03-2003, 04:17 PM
Norris Trophy

Larry Robinson -MTL (2) 1977, 1980

Vezina Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI (3) 1970, 1972, 1974
Martin Brodeur -NJ (1) 2003
(Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons)

William M.Jennings trophy

Martin Brodeur -NJ (3) 1997, 1998, 2003

Art Ross trophy

Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1975
Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1983

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Alex Delvecchio -DET (3) 1959, 1966, 1969

Hart Memorial Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (3) 1973, 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (2) 1977, 1978

Calder Memorial Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI; 1970
Luc Robitaille -LA; 1987

Conn Smythe Trophy

Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (1) 1973
Guy LaFleur -MTL (1) 1977
Larry Robinson -MTL (1) 1978

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (1); 2003
Tony Esposito -CHI (3); 1970, 1972, 1980
Larry Robinson -MTL (3); 1977, 1979, 1980
Borje Salming -TOR (1); 1977
Marcel Pronovost -DET (2); 1960, 1961
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (6); 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980
Luc Robitaille (5); 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993
Todd Bertuzzi (1); 2003

Second Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (2); 1997, 1998
Tony Esposito -CHI(2); 1973, 1974
Larry Robinson -MTL (2); 1978, 1981
Borje Salming (5); 1975, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980
Marcel Pronovost (2); 1958, 1959
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1973, 1974
Luc Robitaille (3); 1987, 1992, 2001
Alex Delvecchio -DET (2); 1953, 1959
Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (4); 1969, 1971, 1972, 1973
Mark Recchi -PIT/PHA(1); 1992

Leaf Lander
10-03-2003, 05:20 PM
9, 11, 17 Busher Jackson
#10 Ron Francis
#9 Maurice Richard
#17 Wendel Clark
#93Doug Gilmour
#13 Mats Sundin
#25 Dave Andreychuk
#88 Eric Lindros
#22 Rick Vaive
#13 Ken Linesman
#2 Al MacInnis
#4 Scott Stevens
#24 Doug Wilson
#8 Randy Carlysle
#2 Carl Brewer
#2 Derian Hatcher
#25Terry Sawchuck
#31 Grant Fhur

Norris Trophy



Vezina Trophy



William M.Jennings trophy



Art Ross trophy



Lester B. Pearson Trophy



Frank J. Selke Trophy



Lady Byng Memorial Trophy



Hart Memorial Trophy



Calder Memorial Trophy


Conn Smythe Trophy



NHL Allstar Game MVP


First Allstar Team Selections

Maurice Richard 8 1944-45 1945-46 1946-47 1947-48 1948-49 1949-50 1954-55 1955-56 1957-58

Harvey Jackson 4 1931-32 1933-34 1934-35 1935-36 1936-37
Terry Sawchuk 3 1950-51 1951-52 1952-53

Carl Brewer 1962-63

Randy Carlyle 1980-81
Doug Wilson 1981- 82
Scott Stevens 1987-88 1993-94
Grant Fuhr 1987-88
Al MacInnis 1989-90 1990-91
Eric Lindros 1994-95

Second Allstar Team Selections

Maurice Richard Montreal 6 1943-44 1950-51 1951-52 1952-53 1953-54 1956-57
Terry Sawchuk 4 1954-55 1953-54 1958-59 1962-63
Harvey Jackson 1 1932-33

Carl Brewer 1964-65 1969-70
Doug Wilson 1984-85 1989-90
Al MacInnis 1986-87 1988-89 1993-94
Scott Stevens 1991-92 1996-97
Eric Lindros 1995-96

All Star Appearences

13-- Maurice Richard from 1947 through 1959

11 -- Terry Sawchuk from 1950-1968

6 -- Grant Fuhr from 1982-1989

All Rookie Team


C Eric Lindros, Philadelphia 1992-93
LW Wendel Clark, Toronto 1985-86
D Scott Stevens, Washington 1982-83

Stanley Cup Winning Goals

1992 Ron Francis, Pittsburgh
1989 Doug Gilmour, Calgary
1984 Ken Linseman, Edmonton


Working on it:)

http://www.lcshockey.com/archive/

BM67
10-04-2003, 01:51 PM
24 hours are up for Herby.

JDB3939 is now on the clock.

Herby
10-04-2003, 02:00 PM
Los Angeles Kings select, as their defensive stopper from Barrie, ONT.

John Madden

http://www.onlinesports.com/images/phf-aafr010.jpg

Herby
10-04-2003, 02:11 PM
Forwards

Tim Kerr / Marcel Dionne / Pavel Bure

Markus Naslund / Steve Yzerman / Denis Savard

Bill Cook / Joe Thornton / Ziggy Palffy

Dave Taylor / John Madden / Rick Tocchet


Defenseman

Eddie Shore / Scott Niedermayer

Chris Pronger / Brian Leetch

Adam Foote / Ed Jovanovski


Goaltenders

Vladislav Tretiak
TBA

JDB3939
10-05-2003, 05:45 AM
To finish up their corps of blueliners the Pittsburgh Penguins select Sandis Ozolinsh.

BM67
10-05-2003, 08:41 AM
With the 228th pick we select one of the most complete left wingers of all-time, the Hart Trophy winner of 1937:

"Babe" Siebert

http://www.gfg.com/baseball/33ice8.jpg

With the 229th pick we select the MVP of the 84 Canada Cup Tournament:

John Tonelli

http://www.bbshockey.com/bw/zislpen.jpg

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to be able to round out their team with the addition of two such fine players. These rugged players give us by far the most physically dominant team.

JDB3939
10-05-2003, 08:59 AM
My next choice is by no means a finesse player, but he is clutch and one of the best antagonizers in the history of hockey. The Pittsburgh Penguins select with their final draft pick, 1995 Conn Smyth winner, Claude Lemieux.

The Pittsburgh Penguins final roster:
John Leclair - Pat Lafontaine - Mike Bossy
Peter Bondra - Boris Mikhailov - Jari Kurri
Ilya Kovalchuk - Jason Allison - Alexei Kovalev
Dino Ciccarelli - Dany Heatley - Claude Lemieux

Viacheslav Fetisov - Sandis Ozolinsh
Ulf Samuelson - Sergei Zubov
Sergei Gonchar - Rob Blake

Patrick Roy
Billy Smith

(Note: Heatley was experimented with at center last year if I'm not mistaken. So I placed him there to make the best possible lines.)

BM67
10-05-2003, 10:13 AM
NEW JERSEY DEVILS

Bobby Hull - Mark Messier - Charlie Conacher
Dickie Moore - Nels Stewart - Andy Bathgate
John Tonelli - Ted Kennedy - Vaclav Nedomansky
Babe Siebert - Dave Keon - Rick Middleton

Red Kelly - Earl Seibert
Alexei Kasatonov - Lionel Conacher
Sprague Cleghorn - Bill Gadsby

Ken Dryden
Turk Broda

Power play:
Hull - Stewart- Conacher - Kelly - Gadsby
Moore - Messier - Nedomansky - Bathgate - Kasatonov

Penalty kill:
Keon - Middleton - Seibert - Conacher
Kennedy - Siebert - Cleghorn - Kelly

Hart:
Hull – 65, 66 Runner-up: 60, 64
Messier – 90, 92; Runner-up: 96
Kelly – Runner-up: 54
Dryden – Runner-up: 72
C. Conacher – Runner-up: 35
Stewart – 26, 30
Bathgate – 59; Runner-up: 58
L. Conacher – Runner-up: 34, 37
Kennedy – 55; Runner-up: 50
Cleghorn – Runner-up: 24, 26
Siebert - 37

Art Ross (scoring leader pre-48):
Hull – 60, 62, 66; Runner-up: 64, 67, 69
Messier – Runner-up: 90
Moore – 58, 59
C. Conacher – 34, 35
Stewart – 26; Runner-up: 29
Bathgate – Runner-up: 62, 63
Nedomansky - Czech.: 67, 71, 72, 74

Conn Smythe (*THN pick pre-65, pg 22-23, June 27 issue):
Messier - 84
Kelly - *54
Dryden - 71
C. Conacher - *32
Stewart - *26
L. Conacher - *34
Broda - *49
Keon - 67
Kennedy - *47, *48

Norris (*top all-star vote getter 31-53):
Kelly – *51,*52, *53, 54 Runner-up: 55, 57
Seibert – *42, *43, *44 Runner-up: *35
L. Conacher – Runner-up: *34
Kasatonov - Best Defenseman: WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 83
Gadsby - Runner-up: 56, 58, 59
Siebert - *37 Runner-up: *36, *38

Vezina:
Dryden - 73, 76, 77, 78, 79
Broda - 41, 48 Runner-up: 42, 43, 47

Calder:
Hull - Runner-up: 58
Dryden - 72
Keon - 61

Lady Byng:
Hull - 65
Kelly - 51, 53, 54, 61 Runner-up: 50, 52
Keon - 62, 63 Runner-up: 64, 67, 71
Middleton - 82 Runner-up: 83, 84

Lester B Pearson:
Messier - 90, 92

Lester Patrick:
Hull - 69

Gary Davidson (WHA MVP):
Hull - 73, 75

Paul Daneau (WHA Most Gentlemenly Player):
Keon - 77, 78
Nedomansky - 76

All-star Teams:
Hull - 1st: 60, 62, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 72 (WHA) 73, 74, 75
2nd: 63, 71 (WHA) 76, 78
Messier - 1st: 82, 83, 90, 92 2nd: 84
Kelly - 1st: 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 57 2nd: 50, 56
Dryden - 1st: 73, 76, 77, 78, 79 2nd: 72
Moore - 1st: 58, 59 2nd: 61
C. Conacher - 1st: 34, 35, 36 2nd: 32, 33
Bathgate - 1st: 59, 62 2nd: 58, 63
Seibert - 1st: 35, 42, 43, 44 2nd: 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41
L. Conacher - 1st: 34 2nd: 33, 37
Kasatonov - WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 82, 83, 85, 86, 91 USSR: 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88 Canada Cup: 81
Broda - 1st: 41, 48 2nd: 42
Keon - 2nd: 62, 71
Nedomansky - WEC-A: 69, 70, 74 Best Forward WEC-A: 74
Kennedy - 2nd: 50, 51, 54
Middleton - 2nd: 82
Gadsby - 56, 58, 59 2nd: 53, 54, 57, 65
Siebert - 36, 37, 38
Tonelli - 2nd: 82, 85 Canada Cup: 84 Canada Cup MVP: 84

Goals leader:
Hull - 60, 62, 64, 66, 67, 68, 69 WHA: 75
Moore - 58
C. Conacher - 31, 32, 34, 35, 36
Stewart - 26, 37
Nedomansky - Czech.: 67, 70, 71, 72, 74

Assists leader:
Moore - 59
Bathgate - 62, 64
Kennedy - 51
Cleghorn - NHA: 15

Defensive leaders:
Kelly: Goals: 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57 Assists: 51, 52, 54 Points: 50, 51, 52, 53, 54
Seibert - Goals: 34 Assists: 43
Conacher - Goals: 28 Assists: 37 Points: 37
Cleghorn: Goals: 19, 20 Assists: NHA: 15 Points: 20
Gadsby - Goals: 58 Assists: 56, 58, 59 Points: 56, 58, 59

Cup Rings (*Captain):
Hull - 61 WHA: 76, 78
Messier - 84, 85, 87, 88, *90, *94
Kelly - 50, 52, 54, 55, 62, 63, 64, 67
Dryden - 71, 73, 76, 77, 78, 79
Moore - 53, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60
C. Conacher - 32
Stewart - 26
Bathgate - 64
Seibert - 33, 38
L. Conacher - 34, 35
Broda - 42, 47, 48, 49, 51
Keon - 62, 63, 64, 67
Kennedy - 45, 47, 48, *49, *51
Cleghorn - 20, 21, *24
Siebert - 26, 33
Tonelli - 80, 81, 82, 83

Captains: Messier, Kelly, C. Conacher, Stewart, Bathgate, Seibert, L. Conacher, Keon, Nedomansky, Kennedy, Cleghorn, Middleton, Gadsby, Siebert

Oiler94
10-05-2003, 04:11 PM
The New Jersey Devils are pleased to be able to round out their team with the addition of two such fine players. These rugged players give us by far the most physically dominant team.

Oh really, more physically dominent than
Dave "The Hammer" Schultz-Dave Hunter-Tiger Williams (The Goony Line)?

Bring it.

Leaf Lander
10-05-2003, 05:01 PM
[QUOTE=JDB3939]My next choice is by no means a finesse player, but he is clutch and one of the best antagonizers in the history of hockey. The Pittsburgh Penguins select with their final draft pick, 1995 Conn Smyth winner, Claude Lemieux.



I was going to take him next

BM67
10-05-2003, 05:01 PM
Oh really, more physically dominent than
Dave "The Hammer" Schultz-Dave Hunter-Tiger Williams (The Goony Line)?

Bring it.

With Hull, Messier, Charlie and Lionel Conacher, Stewart, Seibert, Siebert, Tonelli, Cleghorn, Gadsby and Moore I don't have to fear your "goons" and I don't have to sacrifice offense or defense to play a physical game. I have at least one guy on each of my lines/pairings that wouldn't hesitate to take on one of your heavies and they don't have to fight to punish the opponents. If you played your "goons" to match my physical play I'd bury you on the scoreboard. Even my Europeans and "softies" are mostly big boys.

Spitfire11
10-05-2003, 05:09 PM
The New Jersey Devils are pleased to be able to round out their team with the addition of two such fine players. These rugged players give us by far the most physically dominant team.

Nah, Detroit has the most physically dominant team.

BM67
10-05-2003, 05:27 PM
Nah, Detroit has the most physically dominant team.

You've got some decent size and some players that will throw the body around, but when it comes time to drop the gloves to defend your stars you don't have any real heavyweights. I've got some nasties on my team that wouldn't hesitate to take liberties with your players and the fists to keep you from making them sorry.

John Flyers Fan
10-05-2003, 05:41 PM
Who cares about the most physical team.

I have the best team. Any foolish penalties and the greatest PP you've ever seen, will run up the score.

Jagr-Gretzky-Makarov

Potvin & Lidstrom

JDB3939
10-05-2003, 05:41 PM
I was going to take him next

I waited on him for a good part of the draft. My team is playoff built. 2 clutch goalies and a whole line of playoff performers up top in Kurri, Lemieux, and Bossy. 3 of the best playoff players of the past 20 years.

JDB3939
10-05-2003, 05:43 PM
Who cares about the most physical team.

I have the best team. Any foolish penalties and the greatest PP you've ever seen, will run up the score.

Jagr-Gretzky-Makarov

Potvin & Lidstrom

No big man down low. You need a big man in front to knock in the rebounds and you'd be set for the powerplay.

John Flyers Fan
10-05-2003, 05:48 PM
No big man down low. You need a big man in front to knock in the rebounds and you'd be set for the powerplay.

I could put Gillies in the slot of I want, but with that line-up I would be just fine. I could also stick Jagr in the slot, remember he's bigger than Gordie Howe ever was.

Frightened Inmate #2
10-05-2003, 07:17 PM
I could put Gillies in the slot of I want, but with that line-up I would be just fine. I could also stick Jagr in the slot, remember he's bigger than Gordie Howe ever was.

Are you saying Jagr was more physically dominant than Howe. howe was quite possibly the fittest hockey player ever. he could score and he could fight like you couldn't believe.

BM67
10-05-2003, 07:52 PM
Who cares about the most physical team.

I have the best team. Any foolish penalties and the greatest PP you've ever seen, will run up the score.

Jagr-Gretzky-Makarov

Potvin & Lidstrom

Your bunch of softies will care when they have to crawl off the ice.

I'd say my PP is just as good as yours.

Hull - Stewart - Conacher

Kelly - Gadsby

Three forwards that led the league in goals and points and two defensemen that led all D in goals, assists and points, with a center who is one of the most dominant face-off men of all-time.

That is another area where I have the best team, face-offs. Stewart and Kennedy are two of the best and Messier and Keon are both excellent.

John Flyers Fan
10-06-2003, 02:17 AM
Are you saying Jagr was more physically dominant than Howe. howe was quite possibly the fittest hockey player ever. he could score and he could fight like you couldn't believe.


No just pointing out that Jagr isn't exactly slim pickings out there.

monkey_00*
10-06-2003, 07:44 AM
Has Herby made his pick?....Is his time up?.....Do I get to pick next???

Thanks

Rick

monkey_00*
10-06-2003, 07:48 AM
Who cares about the most physical team.

I have the best team. Any foolish penalties and the greatest PP you've ever seen, will run up the score.

Jagr-Gretzky-Makarov

Potvin & Lidstrom
My Powerplay is not too shabby either:

Bertuzzi-Clarke-LaFleur
Robinson-Salming

I then can go with the 2-Russians for the Penalty killing:

PK1-Larionov-Krutov
PK2-Clarke-Cournoyer

Not only that but everytime the other team dumps the puck down into our zone Martin Brodeur will be right there to dump it back out just as fast as it was dumped into our Zone.

BM67
10-06-2003, 08:20 AM
Has Herby made his pick?....Is his time up?.....Do I get to pick next???

Thanks

Rick

Herby hasn't made his pick and his 24 hours will be up in about 40 minutes. Then it will be your pick.

Herby
10-06-2003, 11:44 AM
Los Angeles Kings complete their team by selecting from Abington, PA.

Mike Richter

http://www.bbshockey.com/world/celbrate.jpg

http://www.bbshockey.com/world/mess2.jpg

Herby
10-06-2003, 11:51 AM
Forwards

Tim Kerr / Marcel Dionne / Pavel Bure

Markus Naslund / Steve Yzerman / Denis Savard

Bill Cook / Joe Thornton / Ziggy Palffy

Dave Taylor / John Madden / Rick Tocchet


Defenseman

Eddie Shore / Brian Leetch

Chris Pronger / Scott Niedermayer

Adam Foote / Ed Jovanovski


Goaltenders

Vladislav Tretiak
Mike Richter


National Breakdown

Canada- 14
USA- 2
Russia- 2
Sweden- 1
Slovakia- 1

Spitfire11
10-06-2003, 12:16 PM
Who cares about the most physical team.

I have the best team. Any foolish penalties and the greatest PP you've ever seen, will run up the score.

Jagr-Gretzky-Makarov

Potvin & Lidstrom

Neely-Esposito-Selanne

Orr-Lapointe

Esposito parks in front of the net(thing he does best)
Neely works the boards
Selanne is the "sniper"

I'd still give your pp the edge, but not by much.

John Flyers Fan
10-06-2003, 01:12 PM
Neely-Esposito-Selanne

Orr-Lapointe

Esposito parks in front of the net(thing he does best)
Neely works the boards
Selanne is the "sniper"

I'd still give your pp the edge, but not by much.


You need a playmaker to get either Neely or Espo the puck.

Spitfire11
10-06-2003, 03:38 PM
You've got some decent size and some players that will throw the body around, but when it comes time to drop the gloves to defend your stars you don't have any real heavyweights. I've got some nasties on my team that wouldn't hesitate to take liberties with your players and the fists to keep you from making them sorry.

We'll see who gets Arankys' vote :D

Spitfire11
10-06-2003, 03:41 PM
You need a playmaker to get either Neely or Espo the puck.

Yeah. Switch up Selanne with Oates or Mikita.

Oiler94
10-06-2003, 06:52 PM
Someone make a pick!

BM67
10-07-2003, 02:23 AM
Monkey is on the clock.

GB is on deck.

Oiler94 is waiting patiently. ;)

monkey_00*
10-07-2003, 06:15 AM
OK I'll make my selction in just a second.

Thanks

Rick

monkey_00*
10-07-2003, 06:26 AM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to select from Boniface, Manitoba Canada....Drafted #51 overall in the 1969 NHL Entry Draft (5th-round)..........winner of the 1978 Lady Byng trophy, 1978 Bill Masterton trophy and the 1981 Conn Smythe trophy winner and 4-time Stanley Cup Champion with the New York Islanders;

#91 Butch Goring

<Center><IMG height=230 src="http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/search/graphics/goring.jpg" width=113>

Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Zdeno Chara
(D)-Kjell Samuelsson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-********

(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Butch Goring (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Mark Recchi

<Center><IMG height=271 src="http://images.auctionworks.com/hi/54/53964/7644.jpg" width=204>

monkey_00*
10-07-2003, 06:30 AM
Norris Trophy

Larry Robinson -MTL (2) 1977, 1980

Vezina Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI (3) 1970, 1972, 1974
Martin Brodeur -NJ (1) 2003
(Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons)

William M.Jennings trophy

Martin Brodeur -NJ (3) 1997, 1998, 2003

Art Ross trophy

Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1975
Guy LaFleur -MTL (3) 1976, 1977, 1978

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (1) 1983

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Alex Delvecchio -DET (3) 1959, 1966, 1969
Butch Goring -NYI (1) 1978

Hart Memorial Trophy

Bobby Clarke -PHA (3) 1973, 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (2) 1977, 1978

Calder Memorial Trophy

Tony Esposito -CHI; 1970
Luc Robitaille -LA; 1987

Bill Masterton trophy

Butch Goring -NYI (1) 1978

Conn Smythe Trophy

Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (1) 1973
Guy LaFleur -MTL (1) 1977
Larry Robinson -MTL (1) 1978
Butch Goring - NYI (1) 1981

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Mark Recchi -MTL (1); 1997

First Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (1); 2003
Tony Esposito -CHI (3); 1970, 1972, 1980
Larry Robinson -MTL (3); 1977, 1979, 1980
Borje Salming -TOR (1); 1977
Marcel Pronovost -DET (2); 1960, 1961
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1975, 1976
Guy LaFleur -MTL (6); 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980
Luc Robitaille (5); 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993
Todd Bertuzzi (1); 2003

Second Allstar Team Selections

Martin Brodeur -NJ (2); 1997, 1998
Tony Esposito -CHI(2); 1973, 1974
Larry Robinson -MTL (2); 1978, 1981
Borje Salming (5); 1975, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980
Marcel Pronovost (2); 1958, 1959
Bobby Clarke -PHA (2); 1973, 1974
Luc Robitaille (3); 1987, 1992, 2001
Alex Delvecchio -DET (2); 1953, 1959
Yvan Cournoyer -MTL (4); 1969, 1971, 1972, 1973
Mark Recchi -PIT/PHA(1); 1992

GB
10-07-2003, 08:42 AM
Montreal selects, from Prescott in Ontario, Hall of Fame defenceman:

Leo Boivin (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?type=Player&mem=P198601&list=ByPosition&pos=D#photo)


http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/members/splash/P198601S.jpg

Boivin, nick-named the Fireplug, captained the Bruins for 4 years. He was a tough, stay at homew defenceman whom Tim Horton believed was "The toughest blueliner to beat in a one-on-one situation."

This concludes Montreal's draft. I'll post a list of individual awards and achievements later on.


Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Pete Mahovlich-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Hakan Loob

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Leo Boivin

Glenn Hall
Jimmy Foster

Oiler94
10-07-2003, 01:16 PM
The Colorado Rockies make their final pick, their backup goaltender from Sandon, BC, Cecil "Tiny" Thompson.
http://www.vintagesportscollectables.com/thompson.jpg.

-Thompson is ranked 5th in all-time shutouts with 81 in just 553 games!
-Thompsons career GAA is only 2.08!
-In 1935-36, Cecil became the first National Hockey League goaltender to be credited with an assist on a scoring play.
-5-time All-Star (Named First-Team and Second-Team All-Star twice each)
-4-time Vezina Trophy winner
-Five times in his career, Thompson led all NHL goaltenders in wins, ringing up a career won-loss-tie record of 284-194-75 during the regular season.
-Inducted in the Hockey Hall of Fame in 1959

How was this guy not picked?



Toe Blake-Jean Beliveau-Henri Richard
Johhny Bucyk-Darryl Sittler-Mike Gartner
Glenn Anderson-Syl Apps-Joe Mullen
Dave "The Hammer" Schultz-Dale Hunter-Dave "Tiger" Williams

Paul Coffey-Larry Murphy
Harry Howell-Phil Houlsey
Bill Quackenbush-Ebbie Goodfellow

Jacques Plante
Cecil "Tiny" Thompson

Leaf Lander
10-07-2003, 01:22 PM
The TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS are proud to select
# 25 JOE Nieuwendyk


http://www.joyofhockey.com/joen.jpg

Stanley Cup Rings
2002-03 New Jersey Devils
98-99 Dallas Stars
88-89 Calgary Flames



Played in NHL All-Star Game (1988-90, 1994)
Won Olympic Gold Medal Team Canada (2002)
Won Calder Memorial Trophy (1988)
Won King Clancy Memorial Trophy (1995)
Won Dodge Ram Tough Award (1988)
NHL All-Rookie Team (1988)
ECAC First All-Star Team (1986, 1987)
NCAA East First All-American Team (1986, 1987)

Leaf Lander
10-07-2003, 01:49 PM
Busher Jackson

#10 Ron Francis

Stanley Cup Rings
91-92 Pittsburgh Penguins
90-91 Pittsburgh Penguins

Hartford's 1st pick in the 1981 Entry Draft (4th Overall).
Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1983, 1985, 1990, 1996)
Won Lady Byng Trophy (1995, 1998)
Won Frank J. Selke Trophy (1995)
Won Alka-Seltzer Plus Award (1995

#9 Maurice Richard

#17 Wendel ClarkToronto's 1st pick in the 1985 Entry Draft (1st Overall).

Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1986)
NHL All-Rookie Team (1986)
WHL East First All-Star Team (1985)



#93Doug Gilmour

Stanley Cup Rings
1988-89 Calgary Flames
St. Louis' 4th pick in the 1982 Entry Draft (134th Overall).

Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1993, 1994)
Won Frank J. Selke Trophy (1993)
OHL First All-Star Team (1983)


#13 Mats Sundin

Quebec's 1st pick in the 1989 Entry Draft (1st Overall).
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1996-99, 2000-02)
NHL Second All-Star Team (2002)
Swedish World All-Star Team (1991, 1992, 1994, 1997

#25 Dave Andreychuk
Buffalo's 3rd pick in the 1982 Entry Draft (16th Overall).

Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Team (1990, 1994)

#88 Eric Lindros

Quebec's 1st pick in the 1991 Entry Draft (1st Overall).

Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1994, 1996-99, 2000)
Won Olympic Gold Medal Team Canada (2002)
NHL Second All-Star Team (1996)
Won Hart Trophy (1995)
Won Lester B. Pearson (1995)
NHL First All-Star Team (1995)
NHL/Upper Deck All-Rookie Team (1993)
Canadian Major Junior Player of the Year (1991)
OHL First All-Star Team (1991)
Memorial Cup All-Star Team (1990


#22 Rick Vaive

# Joel Otto

#13 Ken Linesman

#25 Joe Nieuwendyk

Stanley Cup Rings
2002-03 New Jersey Devils
98-99 Dallas Stars
88-89 Calgary Flames
Calgary's 2nd pick in the 1985 Entry Draft (27th Overall).
Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1988-90, 1994)
Won Olympic Gold Medal Team Canada (2002)
Won Calder Memorial Trophy (1988)
Won King Clancy Memorial Trophy (1995)
Won Dodge Ram Tough Award (1988)
NHL All-Rookie Team (1988)
ECAC First All-Star Team (1986, 1987)
NCAA East First All-American Team (1986, 1987)


#2 Al MacInnis

Stanley Cup Rings
88-89 Calgary Flames

Calgary's 1st pick in the 1981 Entry Draft (15th Overall).

Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1985, 1988, 1990-92, 1994, 1996-99, 2000)
Won Olympic Gold Medal Team Canada (2002)
Won James Norris Memorial Trophy (1999)
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1985, 1988, 1990-92, 1994, 1996-99, 2000)
NHL First All-Star Team (1990, 1991, 1999)
Won Conn Smythe Trophy (1989)
NHL Second All-Star Team (1987, 1989, 1994)
OHL First All-Star Team (1982, 1983)


#4 Scott Stevens


Stanley Cup Rings
2002-03 New Jersey Devils
99-2000 New Jersey Devils
94-95 New Jersey Devils

Washington's 1st pick in the 1982 Entry Draft (5th Overall).
Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1985, 1989, 1991-94, 1996-99, 2000-01)
Won Conn Smythe Trophy (2000)
Won Alka-Seltzer Plus Award (1994)
NHL Second All-Star Team (1992, 1997, 2001)
NHL First All-Star Team (1988, 1994)
NHL All-Rookie Team (1983)


#24 Doug Wilson

#8 Randy Carlysle

#2 Carl Brewer

#2 Derian Hatcher
Stanley Cup Rings
98-99 Dallas Stars

Minnesota's 1st pick in the 1990 Entry Draft (8th Overall).
Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1997

#25Terry Sawchuck

#31 Grant Fhur

Stanley Cup Rings
87-88 Edmonton Oilers
86-87 Edmonton Oilers
84-85 Edmonton Oilers
83-84 Edmonton Oilers

Edmonton 1st pick in the 1981 Entry Draft (8th Overall).



Other Accomplishments:
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1982, 1984-86, 1988, 1989)
Shared William M. Jennings Trophy with Dominik Hasek (1994)
Won Vezina Trophy (1988)
NHL First All-Star Team (1988)
NHL Second All-Star Team (1982)
WHL First All-Star Team (1980, 1981)

Laperriere22*
10-07-2003, 05:05 PM
With their final selection, the Boston Bruins select a true character guy and tough guy along with a fair amount of skill for his position. He left the game under a cloud of controversy, but the Bruins are happy to select him. At defense, from Hamilton Ontario, the Bruins present Marty McSorley.


Final line-up:

G
George Hainsworth
Bill Durnan

D
Doug Harvey-Butch Bouchard
Tim Horton-Bill Barilko
Rob Ramage-Marty McSorley

F
Ted Lindsay-Mike Modano-Howie Morenz (yeah, I switched him to wing)
Woody Dumart-Milt Schmidt-Bobby Bauer
Bob Gainey-Jean Ratelle-Bernie Geoffrion
Brian Sutter-Newsy LaLonde-Bob Probert


I wouldn't mind doing a draft like this (with some changes of course) down the road. I came in so late that I felt like I was coming in to coach one of Robbie Ftorek's teams.

BM67
10-07-2003, 05:06 PM
Cecil "Tiny" Thompson

How was this guy not picked?


I passed on him for Broda because of his losing playoff record. He and the Bruins won 5 American Division titles but he only made it to the Cup Final twice and only won it once. Turk on the other hand took a Leafs team that won one Canadian Division title and one first place finish to the Final 8 times and won 5 Cups.

I wanted a "money" goalie. Most everybody else is probably going "They had goalies back then?"
:rolly:

GB
10-08-2003, 11:31 AM
Frank Mahovlich-Peter Stantsy-Rod Gilbert
Aurel Joliat-Dale Hawerchuk-Lanny McDonald
Pete Mahovlich-Elmer Lach-Ken Hodge
Syd Howe-Guy Carbonneau-Hakan Loob

Raymond Bourque-Rod Langway
Serge Savard-Red Horner
Joe Hall-Leo Boivin

Glenn Hall
Jimmy Foster


Awards:

Calder Memorial Trophy:

Glenn Hall 1955-56
Frank Mahovolich 1957-58
Ray Bourque 1979-80
Peter Stastny 1980-81
Dale Hawerchuk 1981-82

James Norris Trophy:

Rod Langway 1982-83
Rod Langway 1983-84
Ray Bourque 1986-87
Ray Bourque 1987-88
Ray Bourque 1989-90
Ray Bourque 1990-91
Ray Bourque 1993-94

Frank J. Selke Trophy:

Guy Carbonneau 1987-88
Guy Carbonneau 1988-89
Guy Carbonneau 1991-92

Art Ross Trophy:

Elmer Lach 1944-45
Elmer Lach 1947-48

King Clancy Memorial Trophy:

Lanny McDonald 1987-88
Ray Bourque 1991-92

Bill Masterton Trophy:

Rod Gilbert 1975-76
Serge Savard 1978-79
Lanny McDonald 1982-83

Lester Patrick Trophy:

Rod Gilbert - 1990-91

Vezina Trophy:

Glenn Hall 1962-63
Glenn Hall 1966-67
Glenn Hall 1968-69

Conn Smythe Trophy:

Glenn Hall 1967-68
Serge Savard 1968-69

Hart Memorial Trophy:

Aurel Joliat 1933-34
Elmer Lach 1944-45


All-Star Selections:

First Team:

Aurel Joliat LW 1930-31
Elmer Lach C 1944-45
Elmer Lach C 1947-48
Elmer Lach C 1951-52
Glenn Hall G 1956-57
Glenn Hall G 1957-58
Glenn Hall G 1959-60
Frank Mahovlich LW 1960-61
Glenn Hall G 1962-63
Frank Mahovlich LW 1962-63
Glenn Hall G 1963-64
Glenn Hall G 1965-66
Glenn Hall G 1968-69
Ken Hodge RW 1970-71
Rod Gilbert RW 1971-72
Frank Mahovlich LW 1972-73
Ken Hodge RW 1973-74
Ray Bourque D 1979-80
Ray Bourque D 1981-82
Rod Langway D 1982-83
Rod Langway D 1983-84
Ray Bourque D 1983-84
Ray Bourque D 1984-85
Ray Bourque D 1986-87
Ray Bourque D 1987-88
Ray Bourque D 1989-90
Ray Bourque D 1990-91
Ray Bourque D 1991-92
Ray Bourque D 1992-93
Ray Bourque D 1993-94
Ray Bourque D 1995-96
Ray Bourque D 2000-01

Second Team:

Aurel Joliat LW 1931-32
Aurel Joliat LW 1933-34
Aurel Joliat LW 1934-35
Elmer Lach C 1943-44
Syd Howe LW 1944-45
Elmer Lach C 1945-46
Glenn Hall G 1955-56
Glenn Hall G 1960-61
Glenn Hall G 1961-62
Frank Mahovlich LW 1961-62
Frank Mahovlich LW 1963-64
Frank Mahovlich LW 1964-65
Frank Mahovlich LW 1965-66
Glenn Hall G 1966-67
Rod Gilbert RW 1967-68
Frank Mahovlich LW 1968-69
Frank Mahovlich LW 1969-70
Lanny McDonald RW 1976-77
Serge Savard D 1978-79
Ray Bourque D 1980-81
Ray Bourque D 1982-83
Lanny McDonald RW 1982-83
Rod Langway D 1984-85
Dale Hawerchuk C 1984-85
Ray Bourque D 1985-86
Ray Bourque D 1988-89
Ray Bourque D 1994-95

Hall Of Fame Honoured Members:

Aurel Emile Joliat - 1947
Joseph Henry (Joe) Hall - 1961
George Reginald (Red) Horner - 1965
Sydney Harris (Syd) Howe - 1965
Elmer James Lach - 1966
Glenn Henry Hall - 1975
Francis William (Frank) Mahovlich - 1981
Rodrigue Gabriel (Rod) Gilbert - 1982
Leo Joseph Boivin - 1986
Serge Savard - 1986
Lanny King McDonald - 1992
Peter Stastny - 1998
Dale Hawerchuk - 2001
Rod Corry Langway - 2002

Not to bad for a team with 3 Brits in it. I'll probably add Olympic Medals and Stanley Cup Rings later if I can find a site with all of the Cup winners on it.

Dr Love
10-08-2003, 01:10 PM
Vancouver selects G Roy Worters. 1931 Vezina, 1929 Hart Trophy.

Frightened Inmate #2
10-08-2003, 04:01 PM
To complete their roster the Quebec Nordique select a man often called the European Bobby Orr, from Czechoslovakia Defensemen Jan Suchy.

jiggs 10
10-08-2003, 09:06 PM
To complete their roster the Quebec Nordique select a man often called the European Bobby Orr, from Czechoslovakia Defensemen Jan Suchy.

For God's sake, GET RID OF THIS STUPID THREAD!!!! This is probably the longest, most useless thread on these boards!

By the way, I used to be in a band called "Maxwell Edison". We were big Beatles' fans,

Leaf Lander
10-09-2003, 03:31 AM
For God's sake, GET RID OF THIS STUPID THREAD!!!! This is probably the longest, most useless thread on these boards!

By the way, I used to be in a band called "Maxwell Edison". We were big Beatles' fans,


can we ban this ass from this thread?

Gee Wally
10-09-2003, 05:00 AM
For God's sake, GET RID OF THIS STUPID THREAD!!!! This is probably the longest, most useless thread on these boards!

By the way, I used to be in a band called "Maxwell Edison". We were big Beatles' fans,


jiggs 10...since your PM is not activated as it should be. You leave me no other alternative..

Consider this a formal WARNING for trolling.

Further activity as this and YOU WILL BE BANNED !

Wally

Dr Love
10-09-2003, 10:29 AM
For God's sake, GET RID OF THIS STUPID THREAD!!!! This is probably the longest, most useless thread on these boards!

If you don't like it, don't read it, and don't reply to it. No one forced you to click on it.

John Flyers Fan
10-09-2003, 11:32 AM
For the 20th and final selection the Philadelphia Flyers are proud to select:

Gerry Cheevers

2 time Stanley Cup Champion, member of the HHoF

Playoff Record of 53-34 for a sweet .609 win%

Propp - Gretzky - Jagr
Goulet - Malone - Makarov
Barber - Fedorov - Larmer
Gillies - Cowley - Hextall

Potvin - Lidstrom
Park - Desjardins
Lowe - "Ching" Johnson

Bower
Cheevers

I will post my teams awards tomorrow, not sure if one page is enough to capture all of my teams accolades. :yo: :yo:

Leaf Lander
10-09-2003, 01:51 PM
hmm are we not picking 4 bench players :)

Frightened Inmate #2
10-09-2003, 04:49 PM
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-Kevin Stevens (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)- Vladimir Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)- Al Iafrate (D)- Jan Suchy

Starting Goaltender - Dominik Hasek
Backup Goaltender - Pelle Lindbergh

RUSSIANS

Hall of Fame Members
- Valeri Kharlamov - IIHF Hall of Fame 1998, Merited Sports Master (USSR ZMS) 1969 (From what I can gather this is the soviet hall of fame)
- Aleksander Maltsev - IIHF Hall of Fame 1999, Merited Sports Master (USSR ZMS) 1971.
- Vladimir Lutchenko - Merited Sports Master (USSR ZMS) 1970.

All Star Teams
- Valeri Kharlamov - USSR All Stars 1971-1976, 1978. IIHF All Stars 1972, 1973, 1975, 1976
- Aleksander maltsev - IIHF All Stars 1970-1972, 1978, 1981. USSR All Stars 1970-1972, 1974, 1978, 1980-1981.
- Vladimir Lutchenko - USSR All Stars 1971-1977, I am lacking info on the Russian Awards.

Team Awards
- Valeri Kharlamov - WC Gold: 1969-1971, 1973-1975, 1978-1979. USSR Gold (11): 1968, 1970-1973, 1975, 1977-1981. Olympics Gold: 1972, 1976.
- Aleksander Maltsev - Olympics Gold: 1972, 1976, WC Gold: 1969-1971, 1973-1975, 1978-1979.

Individual Awards.
- Valeri Kharlamov - World Championship (WC) Best Forward 1976, MVP USSR League 1972, Scoring Leader (G) 1971, Scoring Leader (PTS) 1972,
- Aleksander Maltsev - WC Scoring Leader 1970, 1972. WC Best Forward 1970, 1972, 1981. MVP USSR League 1972.


Norris Trophy

N/A

Vezina Trophy

Pelle Lindbergh - 1985
Dominik Hasek - 1994, 1995, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2001

William M.Jennings trophy

Dominik Hasek - 1994, 2001 (Runner up 1998)

Art Ross Trophy/Scoring Leader

Doug Bentley - 1943 (Runner Up: 1944, 1949)
Max Bentley - 1946, 1947
Gordie Howe - 1951, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1957, 1963 (Runner Up: 1956,
Peter Forsberg - 2003 (Runner Up: 1998)
Kevin Stevens - (Runner Up: 1992)

Lester B. Pearson Trophy

Frank J. Selke Trophy

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy

Gilbert Perreault - 1973
Bill Mosienko- 1945

Hart Memorial Trophy

Babe Pratt - 1944
Max Bentley - 1946
Dominik Hasek - 1997, 1998 (Runner Up: 1994)
Gordie Howe - 1952, 1953, 1957, 1958, 1960, 1963 (Runner Up: 1959)
Peter Forsberg - 2003

Calder Memorial Trophy

Gilbert Perreault - 1971
Peter Forsberg - 1994

Conn Smythe Trophy

NHL Allstar Game MVP

Gordie Howe - 1965 (record for games played)

Will Finish Later

Leaf Lander
10-09-2003, 05:00 PM
http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/memorial/tml/brewer3901.jpg

Spitfire11
10-09-2003, 05:10 PM
To close out the draft, Detroit selects our backup

2 time cup winner
conn smythe and Jennings winner

G Mike Vernon

BM67
10-09-2003, 06:05 PM
12. BM67------------- New Jersey Devils

Bobby Hull, LW – 5’10”, 195 lbs, Age: 27
RS: 65-*54-43-*97-70 PO: 6-2-2-4-10
He won the Hart Trophy and was named to the 1st All-Star team, while setting new records for most goals (54) and points (97) in a season in 1965-66. His goals and points totals dwarfed the runners-up, F. Mahovlich with 32 goals, and his teammate S. Mikita with 78 points. A truly dominant player with blazing speed, bullish strength and a booming shot.

Mark Messier, C – 6’1”, 205 lbs, Age: 29
RS: 79-45-84-129-79 PO: 22-9-*22-*31-20
Won the Hart Trophy, the Lester B. Pearson, was runner-up for the Art Ross Trophy, was named to the 1st All-Star Team in 1989-90. He captained the Oilers to victory and led all playoff scorers in assists and tied for the point lead. An inspirational leader who was dominant in all facets of the game, he was a true complete player.

Red Kelly, D – 6’0”, 195 lbs, Age: 26
RS: 62-16-33-49-18 PO: 12-5-1-6-0
Won the first Norris Trophy, leading all defensemen in goals, assists and points, finished 6th in league scoring and was runner-up for the Hart Trophy, as well as taking home the Lady Byng in 1953-54. Led Detroit in playoff goals and contributed a point in each win in the Cup Final victory over Montreal. His fast, powerful skating and fine play-making skills made him one of the best two-way players of all-time.

Ken Dryden, G – 6’4”, 205 lbs, Age: 29
RS: 62-*42-10-8-3580-121-*8-*2.03 PO: *13-*12-1-*780-25-1-*1.92
Led the league in wins, shutouts and GAA, winning the Vezina and being named to the 1st All-Star Team, and lost only 1 game in leading Montreal to the first of 4 straight Stanley Cups in 1975-76. The large list of accomplishments this “damn octopus” with the “7 foot legs” accumulated in his brief 8-year career is testament to his dominance.

Dickie Moore, LW – 5’10”, 185 lbs, Age: 28
RS: 70-41-*55-*96-61 PO: 11-5-*12-*17-8
Was named to the 1st All-Star Team and won the Art Ross Trophy in setting a new record for points in a season with 96 in 1958-59. He followed that up with a just as impressive playoff run. “Digging Dicker” was a passionate player that could hit, fight and make beautiful touch passes on the fly. He was one the best clutch playoff performers of all-time.

Charlie Conacher, RW – 6’1”, 202 lbs, Age: 22
RS: 44-*34-14-48-66 PO: 7-*6-2-8-6
Led the league in goals during the regular season and playoffs leading Toronto to the Stanley Cup in 1931-32. “The Big Bomber” had a hard heavy shot, could make nifty moves around the crease, and was willing to go through the goalie and the net to score. He also acted as the policeman for the Leafs.

Nels Stewart, C – 6’1”, 200 lbs, Age: 23
RS: 36-*34-8-*42-119 PO: 4-*6-1-*7-14
Led the league in goals in winning the Hart Trophy and the scoring title, while ranking second in PIM in 1925-26. Then scored 6 goals, including the Cup winner, and 7 points in a 4 game playoff victory over the Victoria Cougars as a rookie. Earning the nickname “Old Poison” because of his deadly accurate shot, he combined talent and physical play at a level rarely seen in league history. He was also dominant on face-offs.

Andy Bathgate, RW – 6’0”, 180 lbs, Age: 26
RS: 70-40-48-88-48
Finished 3rd in goals and points, 2nd in assists and won the Hart Trophy in 1958-59. He was a wizard with the puck, manning the point on a deadly New York PP. He had one of the hardest slap shots ever seen, and was a tricky, weaving skater. He was also an effective, even dangerous penalty killer.

Earl Seibert, D – 6’2”, 198 lbs, Age: 26
RS: 48-8-13-21-38 PO: 10-5-2-7-12
While Chicago struggled to make the playoffs, and Seibert only made the 2nd All-star team, the playoffs were another story. He was such a huge factor in the Hawks Stanley Cup win that owner Major McLaughlin reportedly gave him a piece of the team. Earl was a strong, fast skater, an intimidating force with his stick and body, and was one of the best shot-blockers around. He also owned excellent puck-handling skills and was almost impossible to knock off his skates.

Lionel Conacher, D – 6’2”, 195 lbs, Age: 32
RS: 48-10-13-23-87 PO: 8-2-0-2-4
“The Big Train” was a 1st All-Star Team member, and runner-up for the Hart Trophy as he anchored the Chicago defense in 1933-34. He was 3rd on the team in goals, and 4th in points on a team that won the Stanley Cup on the strength of its Vezina winning defense. Lionel was a legendary all-around athlete, a brick wall on defense, and a ferocious fighter, once famously thrashing his own brother Charlie.

Turk Broda, G – 5’9”, 180 lbs, Age: 33
RS: 60-*32-15-13-*3600-143-5-*2.38 PO: 9-*8-1-557-20-*1-*2.15
Broda had perhaps his finest season in winning the Vezina, making the 1st All-Star Team, and leading the Leafs to the 2nd of three straight Cup victories with only one playoff loss in 1947-48. A true money goalie Turk led the Leafs to 5 Cups and 8 Cup Final appearances in 11 years sandwiched around 2+ years of wartime service.

Alexei Kasatonov, D – 6’1”, 215 lbs, Age: 24
CC: 7-1-*10-11-8 USSR: 46-12-27-39-45 WEC-A: 10-0-3-3-6
Alexei was an All-Star in the USSR, at the 81 Canada Cup and the 82 World Championships in 1981-82. He led all players with 10 assists at the Canada Cup, and finished one point behind Gretzky’s leading total of 12 points. A big, agile defender he team with Fetisov to form one of the best defensive pairings of all-time.

Dave Keon, C – 5’9”, 165 lbs, Age: 27
RS: 66-19-33-52-2 PO: 12-3-5-8-0
While not having his best scoring season his defensive play, penalty killing and brilliance at taking face-offs were invaluable to the Leafs in winning their last Cup in 1966-67, and earning Keon the Conn Smythe Trophy.

Vaclav Nedomanksy, RW/C – 6’2”, 210 lbs, Age: 30
Czech: 44-*46-28-*74-na WEC-A: 10-*10-3-13-4
A speedy power forward with one of the best wrist shots in the world, “Big Ned” led the Czech. League in goals and points and led the World Championships in goals and was named the Best Forward of the Tournament in 1973-74.

Ted “Teeder” Kennedy, C – 5’10”, 180 lbs, Age: 25
RS: 63-18-*43-61-32 PO: 11-4-5-9-6
Teeder led the league in assists, was named to the 2nd All-Star Team and captained the Leafs to the Cup in 1950-51. He was an exceptional playmaker, an excellent defensive center, the best face-off man in the NHL, and a “thoroughbred plow-horse” in the words of Howie Meeker.

Sprague Cleghorn, D – 5’10”, 190 lbs, Age: 30
RS: 21-16-5-21-85 PO: 5-0-1-1-4
Sprague had as many goals as any other defender had points and led a powerful Ottawa defense as they captured the Cup in 1919-20. He was one of the finest defenders the game of hockey has ever know, able to make effortless transitions between the physical game and whirling rushes. He captained the Canadiens to the Stanley Cup and was runner-up for the inaugural Hart Trophy in 1924 at the age of 34.

Rick Middleton, RW – 5’11”, 170 lbs, Age: 29
RS: 80-49-47-96-8 PO: 17-11-22-33-6
“Slick” put up his usual solid numbers during the regular season, but he exploded in the playoffs, finishing second to Gretzky in scoring, as his Bruins came as close as anyone to derailing the Islanders dynasty in 1982-83. Rick was a methodical, thinking man’s type player. He was a solid two-way player, who was very fast, with excellent passing and shooting skills.

Bill Gadsby, D – 6’0”, 185 lbs, Age: 30
RS: 65-14-32-46-48 PO: 6-0-3-3-4
Bill led all defensemen in goals, assists and points and finished 2nd to Harvey in Norris voting in 1957-58. He was a powerful, raw-boned man with a rugged style, adept at shot blocking and clearing the crease. He was one of the better play making defenders of his day, with a heavy point shot.

Babe Siebert, LW/D – 5”10”, 200 lbs, Age: 28
RS: 48-21-18-39-64 PO: 4-0-1-1-4
As a member of the “S’ Line” Siebert finished in the top 10 in goals and points in 1931-32. His primary role was to forecheck like a fiend and feed Nels Stewart. He was a fierce competitor who combined tireless backchecking with speed and playmaking ability. After the “S’ Line” was broken up in 32 he was converted to defense and went on to be named a 1st Team All-Star 3 times and won the Hart Trophy in 1937.

John Tonelli, LW – 6’1”, 200 lbs, Age: 28
CC: 8-3-6-9-2 RS: 80-42-58-100-95 PO: 10-1-8-9-10
John was name MVP of the 84 Canada Cup, then went on to be named to the 2nd All-Star Team in 1984-85. An unsung hero of the Islanders dynasty, he possessed an uncanny knack for digging out the puck in close quarters, and was an intimidating physical presence.

Only three of these players are not in either the HHoF or the IIHF HoF, Mark Messier, Rick Middleton and John Tonelli.

GB
10-09-2003, 10:19 PM
For the 20th and final selection the Philadelphia Flyers are proud to select:

Gerry Cheevers



You just made an old man (Gee Wally) very happy :)

monkey_00*
10-10-2003, 11:58 AM
<Center>The Winnipeg Jets (and their new manager) are proud to make their last selection from Glascow Scotland....Drafted #111 overall in the 1981 NHL Entry Draft (6th-round)...participated in the 1991 Allstar game and picked up 2-Stanley Cup rings with the Edmonton Oilers...standing at 6-foot 3-inches and weighing in at 215-pounds...

#5 Steve Smith

<Center><IMG height=80 src="http://sportsmed.starwave.com/i/teamlogos/nhl/pg2/pp_nhl_edm.gif" width=80>

Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Zdeno Chara
(D)-Kjell Samuelsson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-Steve Smith

(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Butch Goring (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Mark Recchi

<Center><IMG height=300 src="http://i9.ebayimg.com/03/i/00/ba/49/ba_1.JPG" width=400>

GB
10-10-2003, 12:21 PM
Nice pick. Their is still a much better Scot out there though.

Frightened Inmate #2
10-10-2003, 01:41 PM
could it be a goaltender who led chicago to a stanley cup?

Frightened Inmate #2
10-10-2003, 01:46 PM
I really wanted to select Pat Verbeek. I wish i could trade mosienko in but whats done is done.

BM67
10-10-2003, 06:07 PM
The All-Unpicked Team:

Goal: Frank Brimsek - "Mr Zero" the only goalie to win the Calder, Vezina, and the Stanley Cup and be a 1st team all-star in the same year

Defense: Harry Cameron - twice led the NHL in assists and had 139 points in 128 NHL games, 88 goals

Defense: "Black Jack" Stewart - the most feared hitter of the forties and one of the best defenders

Center: Frank Boucher - led the NHl in asssists 3 times and won the Lady Byng 7 times in 8 years and was given the original trophy to keep

Right Wing: Babe Dye - won to scoring titles and led the NHL in goals 3 times

Left Wing: Cy Denneny - led the NHl in goals once, assists twice. won the scoring title once but was the runner-up 6 times

Leaf Lander
10-10-2003, 07:44 PM
I wated craig mactavish trevor linden anders hedberg or thomas steen

d-man ian turnbull ken danyeko

GB
10-11-2003, 12:36 AM
could it be a goaltender who led chicago to a stanley cup?
Yes it could :) I was realy tempted to pick him, but IMHO Foster was better. I am a little suprised that no-one picked him up though.

Liam

Spitfire11
10-11-2003, 06:00 AM
Defense: "Black Jack" Stewart - the most feared hitter of the forties and one of the best defenders


This one suprised me. I also thought Gadsby lasted a lot longer than he should have.

Frightened Inmate #2
10-11-2003, 10:32 AM
Calder Memorial Trophy:

Gilbert Perreault - 1971
Peter Forsberg - 1994

James Norris Trophy:

N/A

Frank J. Selke Trophy:

N/A

Art Ross Trophy:

Doug Bentley - 1943 (Runner Up: 1944, 1949)
Max Bentley - 1946, 1947
Gordie Howe – 1951
Gordie Howe – 1952
Gordie Howe – 1953
Gordie Howe – 1954
Gordie Howe – 1957
Gordie Howe - 1963
Peter Forsberg – 2003

Runner Ups.
Peter Forsberg - 1998
Kevin Stevens - 1992
Gordie Howe - 1956

King Clancy Memorial Trophy:

N/A

Lester B. Person

Dominik Hasek – 1997
Dominik Hasek - 1998

Bill Masterton Trophy:

Claude Provost - 1968

Vezina Trophy:

Pelle Lindbergh - 1985
Dominik Hasek – 1994
Dominik Hasek – 1995
Dominik Hasek – 1997
Dominik Hasek – 1998
Dominik Hasek – 1999
Dominik Hasek – 2001



Conn Smythe Trophy:

N/A

Hart Memorial Trophy:

Max Bentley – 1946
Babe Pratt - 1944
Dominik Hasek – 1997
Dominik Hasek - 1998
Gordie Howe – 1952
Gordie Howe – 1953
Gordie Howe – 1957
Gordie Howe – 1958
Gordie Howe – 1960
Gordie Howe – 1963


Peter Forsberg - 2003

Runner Ups
Dominik Hasek - 1994
Gordie Howe – 1959
Doug Bentley –1943
Dit Clapper – 1941


All-Star Selections:

First Team:

Peter Forsberg – 2003
Peter Forsberg – 1998
Pelle Lindbergh – 1985
Dominik Hasek - 1994
Dominik Hasek – 1995
Dominik Hasek – 1997
Dominik Hasek – 1998
Dominik Hasek – 1999
Dominik Hasek - 2001
Gordie Howe - 1951
Gordie Howe – 1952
Gordie Howe – 1953
Gordie Howe – 1954
Gordie Howe – 1957
Gordie Howe – 1958
Gordie Howe – 1960
Gordie Howe – 1963
Gordie Howe – 1966
Gordie Howe – 1968
Gordie Howe – 1969
Gordie Howe – 1970
Dit Clapper – 1939
Dit Clapper – 1940
Dit Clapper – 1941
King Clancey – 1931
King Clancey – 1934
Babe Pratt – 1944
Doug Bentley – 1943
Doug Bentley – 1944
Doug Bentley – 1947
Max Bentley – 1946
Claude Provost – 1965
Kevin Stevens - 1992

Second Team:

Gilbert Perreault – 1977
Gilbert Perreault – 1976
Kevin Stevens – 1993
Kevin Stevens – 1991
Gordie Howe – 1949
Gordie Howe – 1950
Gordie Howe – 1956
Gordie Howe – 1959
Gordie Howe – 1961
Gordie Howe – 1962
Gordie Howe – 1964
Gordie Howe – 1965
Gordie Howe – 1967
Dit Clapper – 1931
Dit Calpper –1935
Dit Clapper – 1944
Babe Pratt – 1945
Bill Mosienko – 1945
Bill Mosienko – 1946
Doug Bentley – 1949
Max Bentley – 1947
King Clancey – 1933
King Clancey – 1932


Hall Of Fame Honoured Members:

Doug Bentley 1964
Max Bentley 1966
King Clancy 1958
Dit Clapper 1947
Gordie Howe 1972
Bill Mosienko 1965
Gilbert Perreault 1990
Babe Pratt 1966

On the Top 50 List (THN)
3. Gordie Howe
41. Dit Clapper
47. Gilbert Perreault
48. Max Bentley

Gee Wally
10-11-2003, 01:43 PM
You just made an old man (Gee Wally) very happy :)



you betcha !!!!!!

Leaf Lander
10-11-2003, 05:04 PM
bench players?:)

BM67
10-12-2003, 04:06 AM
On the Top 50 List (THN)
3. Gordie Howe
41. Dit Clapper
47. Gilbert Perreault
48. Max Bentley

My Top 50 List members:
8. Bobby Hull
12. Mark Messier
22. Red Kelly
25. Ken Dryden
31. Dickie Moore
36. Charlie Conacher

Top 100 Guys:
51. Nels Stewart
57. Ted Kennedy
58. Andy Bathgate
60. Turk Broda
69. Dave Keon
72. Earl Seibert
88. Sprague Cleghorn
99. Bill Gadsby

They are listed in a thread in this forum if anybody else wants to look them up.

Leaf Lander
10-14-2003, 05:07 PM
Spitfire11

and john flyers fan

do you two need to make a new selection?

monkey_00*
10-15-2003, 07:09 AM
<Center>Winnipeg JETS (monkey_00)

(G)-Martin Brodeur
(G)-Tony Esposito

(D)-Larry Robinson (D)-Zdeno Chara
(D)-Kjell Samuelsson (D)-Borje Salming
(D)-Marcel Pronovost (D)-Steve Smith

(LW)-Rick MacLeish (C)-Bobby Clarke (RW)-Guy LaFleur
(LW)-Todd Bertuzzi (C)-Butch Goring (RW)-Terry O'Reilly
(LW)-Vladimir Krutov (C)-Igor Larionov (RW)-Yvon Cournoyer
(LW)-Luc Robitaille (C)-Alex Delvecchio (RW)-Mark Recchi

Specialty teams:

<Center>PP1- MacLeish-Clarke-LaFleur
Robinson-Salming

PP2- Bertuzzi-Delvecchio-Recchi
Smith-Pronovost

PK1- Larionov-Krutov
Samuelsson-Chara

PK2- Goring-Cournoyer
Robinson-Salming

BM67
10-17-2003, 12:10 PM
Hart Trophy winners, and runner-ups by team:

Winners: ** is with USSR Player of the Year winners

1. Detroit Red Wings: 4 - Bobby Orr (3), Phil Esposito (2), Stan Mikita (2), Joe Sakic
2. Philadelphia Flyers: 4 - Wayne Gretzky (9), Jaromir Jagr, Sergei Fedorov, Bill Cowley (2) **5 – Sergei Makarov (3)
3. Quebec Nordiques: 5 - Gordie Howe (6), Dominik Hasek (2), Peter Forsberg, Max Bentley, Babe Pratt **7 – Valeri Kharlamov, Aleksander Maltsev
4. Vancouver Millionaires: 4 - Mario Lemieux (2), Bryan Trottier, Sid Abel, Roy Worters
5. Boston Bruins: 3 - Howie Morenz (3), Milt Schmidt, Bernie Geoffrion
6. Toronto Maple Leafs: 2 - Maurice Richard, Eric Lindros
7. Colorado Rockies: 4 - Jean Beliveau (2), Jacques Plante, Toe Blake, Ebbie Goodfellow
8. Montreal Canadiens: 2 - Aurel Joliat, Elmer Lach
9. Winnipeg Jets: 2 - Guy Lafleur (2), Bobby Clarke (3) **4 – Igor Larionov, Vladimir Krutov
10. Los Angeles Kings: 2 - Eddie Shore (4), Chris Pronger **3 – Vladislav Tretiak (5)
11. Pittsburgh Penguins: 0 **2 - Viachaslav Fetisov, Boris Mikhailov (2)
12. New Jersey Devils: 6 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier (2), Nels Stewart (2), Andy Bathgate, Ted Kennedy, Babe Siebert

Runner-ups: #(#) is minus players on the above list of winners

1. Detroit Red Wings: 2(1) - Phil Esposito (2), Paul Kariya
2. Philadelphia Flyers: 6(3) - Wayne Gretzky, Denis Potvin, Jaromir Jagr (3), Bill Cowley, Johnny Bower, Ching Johnson
3. Quebec Nordiques: 4(2) - Gordie Howe, Dominik Hasek, Dit Clapper, Doug Bentley
4. Vancouver Millionaires: 4(1) - Mario Lemieux (3), Bryan Trottier (2), Bernie Parent, Roy Worters
5. Boston Bruins: 4(2) – Doug Harvey, Howie Morenz, Milt Schmidt, Bill Durnan
6. Toronto Maple Leafs: 3(2) - Maurice Richard (2), Doug Gilmour, Grant Fuhr
7. Colorado Rockies: 2(1) - Jean Beliveau (4), Syl Apps Sr. (3)
8. Montreal Canadiens: 4(3) - Ray Bourque (2), Dale Hawerchuk, Rod Langway, Elmer Lach
9. Winnipeg Jets: 3(1) - Guy Lafleur, Bobby Clarke, Tony Esposito
10. Los Angeles Kings: 4(3) - Eddie Shore, Marcel Dionne, Bill Cook (2), Markus Naslund
11. Pittsburgh Penguins: 1 - Patrick Roy
12. New Jersey Devils: 9(5) - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier, Red Kelly, Ken Dryden, Charlie Conacher, Andy Bathgate, Lionel Conacher (2), Ted Kennedy, Sprague Cleghorn (2)


Unselected winners (8):

Frank Nighbor
Billy Burch
Herb Gardiner
Tom Anderson
Buddy O’Connor
Charlie Rayner
Al Rollins
Jose Theodore

Unselected runner-ups (16):

Ace Bailey
Lionel Hitchman
Hooley Smith
Paul Thompson
Gaye Stewart
Frank Brimsek
Al Rollins
Harry Lumley
Tod Sloan
Norm Ullman
Ed Giacomin
Rogatien Vachon
Mike Liut
Pete Peeters
Alexei Yashin
Jarome Iginla

Spitfire11
10-17-2003, 12:29 PM
Spitfire11

and john flyers fan

do you two need to make a new selection?

no, i think we're done

Frightened Inmate #2
10-19-2003, 08:12 PM
I was just wondering how everyone here would rate the teams in the following categories

Offensive Ability
Defensive Ability
Team Toughness
Goaltending
Overall

BM67
10-20-2003, 03:23 PM
NHL goal scoring leaders:

1. Spitfire11 - Detroit Red Wings: 3 - Phil Esposito (6), Teemu Selanne (3), Keith Tkachuk
2. John Flyers Fan - Philadelphia Flyers: 3 - Wayne Gretzky (4), Joe Malone (2), Bryan Hextall (2)
3. Maxwell Edison - Quebec Nordiques: 2 - Gordie Howe (5), Doug Bentley (2),
4. Dr. Love - Vancouver Millionaires: 6 - Mario Lemieux (3), Brett Hull (3), Alexander Mogilny, Sid Abel, Roy Conacher, Punch Broadbent
5. Laperriere22 - Boston Bruins: 4 - Ted Lindsay, Howie Morenz, Bernie Geoffrion (2), Newsy Lalonde
6. Gilmour's Way - Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Maurice Richard (5)
7. Oiler94 - Colorado Rockies: 1 - Jean Beliveau (2)
8. GB Editor - Montreal Canadiens: 0
9. monkey_00 - Winnipeg Jets: 1 - Guy Lafleur
10. Herby - Los Angeles Kings: 2 - Pavel Bure (3), Bill Cook (2)
11. Jbd3939 - Pittsburgh Penguins: 3 - Mike Bossy (2), Jari Kurri, Peter Bondra (2)
12. BM67 - New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (7), Dickie Moore, Charlie Conacher (5), Nels Stewart (2)

Undrafted leaders:

Charlie Simmer
Danny Gare
Blaine Stoughton
Steve Shutt
Reggie Leach
Norm Ullman
Bronco Horvath
Gaye Stewart
Lynn Patrick
Gordon Drillon
Larry Aurie
Bill Thoms
Cooney Weiland
Ace Bailey
Babe Dye (3)
Cy Denneny

More of the "The All-Undrafted Team":

The "60 goal scorer line":
Steve Shutt (60) - Bernie Nicholls (70) - Reggie Leach (61)

BM67
10-21-2003, 04:27 PM
I was just wondering how everyone here would rate the teams in the following categories

Offensive Ability
Defensive Ability
Team Toughness
Goaltending
Overall

Well I've made a start, and it needs some revisions, since even I don't think my rankings are right. :confused:

I've started by rating the players out of 10 in each area. When I've done all 12 teams, I'll have to make a review, and then probably weight things like starter/backup, and actually have to decide who I think is the top goalie of all-time. A lot of goalies rated at 9.5 right now. :rolleyes:

Any how just to get some thoughts flowing:

Offense:
1 - Quebec Nordiques
1 - New Jersey Devils
3 - Vancouver Millionaires
4 - Philadelphia Flyers
5 - Toronto Maple Leafs
5 - Colorado Rockies
7 - Detroit Red Wings
7 - Boston Bruins

Defense:
1 - Boston Bruins
2 - Vancouver Millionaires
3 - Philadelphia Flyers
3 - Colorado Rockies
3 - New Jersey Devils
6 - Quebec Nordiques
7 - Toronto Maple Leafs
8 - Detroit Red Wings

Toughness:
1 - Boston Bruins
2 - Toronto Maple Leafs
3 - Colorado Rockies
4 - New Jersey Devils
5 - Detroit Red Wings
6 - Vancouver Millionaires
7 - Philadelphia Flyers
8 - Quebec Nordiques

Goaltending:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Vancouver Millionaires
2 - Boston Bruins
2 - Toronto Maple Leafs
2 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Colorado Rockies
6 - Winnipeg Jets
8 - Philadelphia Flyers
8 - Quebec Nordiques
8 - Los Angeles Kings
11 - Montreal Canadiens
12 - Detroit Red Wings

Overall:
1 - Philadelphia Flyers
1 - New Jersey Devils
3 - Quebec Nordiques
3 - Boston Bruins
5 - Vancouver Millionaires
6 - Toronto Maple Leafs
6 - Colorado Rockies
8 - Detroit Red Wings

I think my ratings might be getting worse rather than better. Remember still in the rough draft phase. :teach:

Leaf Lander
10-22-2003, 04:57 PM
sawchuck is in the roy territory

no one else compares yet

fhur won 4 cups

both my golaies got over 400 wins



I think there shouyld be arule no rankign your team#1 :)

BM67
10-22-2003, 06:29 PM
sawchuck is in the roy territory

no one else compares yet

fhur won 4 cups

both my golaies got over 400 wins



I think there shouyld be arule no rankign your team#1 :)

You mean Roy is in the Sawchuk territory. Since we're looking at them in their prime only their best year applies, not the career numbers, so most everybody is comparable. I have to say that Goalie is the one area where it is neccesary to look at career almost as much as the best year to get a true perspective.

Fuhr won 5 Cups, but didn't play a game in one Cup run, and Sawchuk won 4, but they both played for about 20 years. 9 Cups in 40 is nothing compared to Dryden and Broda with 11 in 22 years.

Goalie - Cups - Years
Dryden - 6 - 8
Plante - 6 - 18
Broda - 5 - 14
Fuhr - 5 - 19
Bower - 4 - 15
Roy - 4 - 18
Smith - 4 - 18
Sawchuk - 4 - 21
Brodeur - 3 - 11
Durnan - 2 - 7
Hainsworth - 2 - 11
Parent - 2 - 13
Cheevers - 2 - 14
Vernon - 2 - 19
Hasek - 1 - 12
Thompson - 1 - 12
Belfour - 1 - 15
Richter - 1 - 15
Esposito - 1 -16
Hall - 1 - 18
Tretiak - 0 - 0
Foster - 0 - 0
Lindbergh - 0 - 5
Worters - 0 - 12

I can't match your 400+ wins but then again nobody can match Dryden's career 57 losses. :bow: Dryden/Broda combined have fewer losses than Fuhr.

Oiler94
10-23-2003, 06:56 AM
Well I've made a start, and it needs some revisions, since even I don't think my rankings are right. :confused:

I've started by rating the players out of 10 in each area. When I've done all 12 teams, I'll have to make a review, and then probably weight things like starter/backup, and actually have to decide who I think is the top goalie of all-time. A lot of goalies rated at 9.5 right now. :rolleyes:

Any how just to get some thoughts flowing:

Offense:
1 - Quebec Nordiques
1 - New Jersey Devils
3 - Vancouver Millionaires
4 - Philadelphia Flyers
5 - Detroit Red Wings

Defense:
1 - Vancouver Millionaires
2 - Philadelphia Flyers
2 - New Jersey Devils
4 - Quebec Nordiques
5 - Detroit Red Wings

Toughness:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Detroit Red Wings
3 - Vancouver Millionaires
4 - Philadelphia Flyers
5 - Quebec Nordiques

Goaltending:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Vancouver Millionaires
2 - Boston Bruins
2 - Toronto Maple Leafs
2 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Colorado Rockies
6 - Winnipeg Jets
8 - Philadelphia Flyers
8 - Quebec Nordiques
8 - Los Angeles Kings
11 - Montreal Canadiens
12 - Detroit Red Wings

Overall:
1 - Philadelphia Flyers
1 - New Jersey Devils
3 - Quebec Nordiques
4 - Vancouver Millionaires
5 - Detroit Red Wings

You really think Plante and Thompson deserve 6th?

Plante is probably the best goalie after Roy and Sawchuk, and is in the top 5 goaltenders all-time in shutouts.

Just so happens you have the same exact 5 teams in each category too..

Frightened Inmate #2
10-23-2003, 02:18 PM
you are also underestimating Hasek and Lindbergh. If Pelle didn't ram himself into a pole he would be one of the top goaltenders of the 80's hell he had a 63 - 30 - 3 record. Just because he died at a young age is no reason to look down on him.

BM67
10-23-2003, 04:18 PM
You really think Plante and Thompson deserve 6th?

Plante is probably the best goalie after Roy and Sawchuk, and is in the top 5 goaltenders all-time in shutouts.

Just so happens you have the same exact 5 teams in each category too..

As I said I've made a start. I have rated 5 teams (7 now but I have to add them) totally and all teams in goaltending, and yes it needs some work. As of right now I have most of the starters at 9.5 out of 10 and the difference is in the backups. I probably will have to weight it in favor of the starters somehow, and I have to decide who deserves 10s.

Yeah, I might have to upgrade Thompson, but I do have him rated the same as Cheevers.

BM67
10-23-2003, 04:53 PM
you are also underestimating Hasek and Lindbergh. If Pelle didn't ram himself into a pole he would be one of the top goaltenders of the 80's hell he had a 63 - 30 - 3 record. Just because he died at a young age is no reason to look down on him.

Yeah, looking at the score I gave Lidbergh, I might have left him a little low, but he didn't do anything in his short career to put him above any of the others taken. He never won a Cup or a Hart. He didn't lead the league in GAA or shutouts. His 87-49-15 and 12-10 playoff record are good/very good but not great. He won the AHL MVP award, but Maine didn't win the Calder Cup that year.

Frightened Inmate #2
10-24-2003, 05:09 PM
I can understand it being low though thanks to the number of years he actually played. He was a hell of a goaltender who IMO was one of the top 3 from the 80's (Fuhr and Roy the other and Fuhr is debateable)

but Dryden losing so few games is because he played on what is quite possibly the best NHL team ever assembled.

BM67
10-25-2003, 03:06 AM
I can understand it being low though thanks to the number of years he actually played. He was a hell of a goaltender who IMO was one of the top 3 from the 80's (Fuhr and Roy the other and Fuhr is debateable)

but Dryden losing so few games is because he played on what is quite possibly the best NHL team ever assembled.

It's not so much his short career as his lack of "glory" that have him rated low. Compare his best year to Pete Peeters' and Ron Hextall's just before and after his. Peeters was runner-up for the Hart and Hextall won the Conn Smythe and both were 1st team and Vezina winners. Lindbergh showed signs of being a very good goalie, but he didn't get the chance to prove himself as an all-time great. There's a fine line between giving him credit for what he might have done and giving him too much or to little credit. Right now I've ranked him equal to Vernon and Richter so it's not like I give him no credit.

As for Dryden compare him to Durnan and Thompson. Durnan in 7 years won 6 Vezinas and was named 1st all-star 6 times, but he only won 2 Cups. Thompson won only 1 Cup on a team that won something like 5 straight American Division titles. Dryden's record is helped by the team he played on but you don't have the best team of all-time without an all-time great goalie. He won the Conn Smythe and was runner-up for the Hart in his first two years as a pro, before the Candiens became a great team, and this shows that he wasn't just the product of his team. With Dryden the Habs won 6 Cups in 8 years. They didn't win in the year before or after he was there, and they din't win the year he sat out.

Leaf Lander
10-25-2003, 04:36 PM
You mean Roy is in the Sawchuk territory. Since we're looking at them in their prime only their best year applies, not the career numbers, so most everybody is comparable. I have to say that Goalie is the one area where it is neccesary to look at career almost as much as the best year to get a true perspective.

Fuhr won 5 Cups, but didn't play a game in one Cup run, and Sawchuk won 4, but they both played for about 20 years. 9 Cups in 40 is nothing compared to Dryden and Broda with 11 in 22 years.

Goalie - Cups - Years
Dryden - 6 - 8
Plante - 6 - 18
Broda - 5 - 14
Fuhr - 5 - 19
Bower - 4 - 15
Roy - 4 - 18
Smith - 4 - 18
Sawchuk - 4 - 21
Brodeur - 3 - 11
Durnan - 2 - 7
Hainsworth - 2 - 11
Parent - 2 - 13
Cheevers - 2 - 14
Vernon - 2 - 19
Hasek - 1 - 12
Thompson - 1 - 12
Belfour - 1 - 15
Richter - 1 - 15
Esposito - 1 -16
Hall - 1 - 18
Tretiak - 0 - 0
Foster - 0 - 0
Lindbergh - 0 - 5
Worters - 0 - 12

I can't match your 400+ wins but then again nobody can match Dryden's career 57 losses. :bow: Dryden/Broda combined have fewer losses than Fuhr.


I cant help it if my players were superb atheltes mentally and physically and thus had extended careers:)

When i drafted I wanted a high # of career wins and Stanley Cuos and shut outs with mr shutout Terry Sawchuk

Leaf Lander
10-25-2003, 05:10 PM
Busher Jackson

636 241 234 475 437

PLAYOFFS
41 6 7 13 28

#10 Ron Francis

1657 537 1222 1759 965

PLAYOFFS
159 46 93 139 93

**Still Active**

#9 Maurice Richard

978 544 421 965 1285

PLAYOFFS
133 82 44 126 188

#17 Wendel Clark)

793 330 234 564 1690
PLAYOFFS

95 37 32 69 201





#93 Doug Gilmour

1474 450 964 1414 1299

PLAYOFFS
182 60 128 188 235


**Still Active**


#13 Mats Sundin

1012 434 582 1016 823

PLAYOFFS
74 31 34 65 64

**Still Active**



#25 Dave Andreychuk

1520 613 669 1282 1067

PLAYOFFS
139 42 41 83 148

**Still Active**

#88 Eric Lindros

644 348 439 787 1237

PLYOFFS
50 24 33 57 118

**Still Active**


#22 Rick Vaive

WHA Totals 75 26 33 59 248
NHL Totals 876 441 347 788 1445

Playoffs 54 27 16 43 111


# Joel Otto

943 195 313 508 1936

PLAYOFFS
122 27 47 74 205

#13 Ken Linesman

WHA Totals 71 38 38 76 126 5 2 2 4 15
NHL Totals 860 256 551 807 1727

Playoffs
113 43 77 120 325


#25 Joe Nieuwendyk

1120 513 502 1015 603

PLAYOFFS 1
49 60 50 110 87


**Still Active**

#2 Al MacInnis

1416 340 934 1274 1501

PLAYOFFS
177 39 121 160 255

**Still Active**

#4 Scott Stevens

1603 193 703 896 2765

PLAYOFFS 233 26 92 118 402

**Still Active**


#24 Doug Wilson

1024 237 590 827 830

PLAYOFFS 95 19 61 80 86



#8 Randy Carlysle

NHL Totals 1055 148 499 647 1400
PlayOFFS 69 9 24 33 120



#2 Carl Brewer

WHA Totals 77 2 23 25 42
PlayOFFS 12 0 4 4 11

NHL Totals 604 25 198 223 1037
PLAYOFFS 72 3 17 20 146


#2 Derian Hatcher

Games 830 G 70 A 225 P 295 PIM 1382

PLAYOFFS 100 6 21 27 183

**Still Active**

#25Terry Sawchuck

#31 Grant Fhur

BM67
11-02-2003, 03:26 PM
Offense:
1 - Quebec Nordiques
2 - Philadelphia Flyers
3 - New Jersey Devils
4 - Vancouver Millionaires
5 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Detroit Red Wings
7 - Colorado Rockies
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Toronto Maple Leafs
10 - Boston Bruins
11 - Winnipeg Jets
12 - Montreal Canadiens

Defense:
1 - Montreal Canadiens
2 - Winnipeg Jets
3 - Boston Bruins
4 - New Jersey Devils
5 - Vancouver Millionaires
6 - Philadelphia Flyers
7 - Detroit Red Wings
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Quebec Nordiques
10 - Toronto Maple Leafs
11 - Colorado Rockies
12 - Pittsburgh Penguins

Toughness:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Boston Bruins
3 - Toronto Maple Leafs
4 - Colorado Rockies
5 - Detroit Red Wings
6 - Winnipeg Jets
7 - Montreal Canadiens
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Vancouver Millionaires
10 - Philadelphia Flyers
11 - Pittsburgh Penguins
12 - Quebec Nordiques

Goaltending:
1 - Toronto Maple Leafs
2 - Colorado Rockies
3 - New Jersey Devils
4 - Vancouver Millionaires
5 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Winnipeg Jets
7 - Boston Bruins
8 - Quebec Nordiques
9 - Los Angeles Kings
10 - Montreal Canadiens
11 - Philadelphia Flyers
12 - Detroit Red Wings

Overall:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Philadelphia Flyers
3 - Vancouver Millionaires
4 - Boston Bruins
5 - Quebec Nordiques
6 - Los Angeles Kings
7 - Montreal Canadiens
8 - Colorado Rockies
9 - Winnipeg Jets
10 - Pittsburgh Penguins
11 - Detroit Red Wings
12 - Toronto Maple Leafs

It is much easier to decide who is last in each area than it is to decide who is first, and in most cases top to bottom isn't much of a spread.

The rankings don't figure for Detroit playing Orr 30+ minutes a game, which is the most likely strategy. Goal is the only area where I gave extra value to the starter over the backup.

Overall also doesn't fully account for any glaring weaknesses that might cripple a team, such as Quebec having a 5'7" defender, four 5'8" players, including a defender, and two 5'9" skaters, plus another handful under 6'. Kharlamov can skate like the wind and be a force on offense, but Clancy and Suchy are going to have trouble clearing the crease.

Is anybody else even making a stab at ranking the teams?

Frightened Inmate #2
11-03-2003, 04:54 AM
I am going to put a list up in a week or so. its really tough because the comparing of different eras. I was usign the total hockey adjusted stats for a while but they are flawed to a certain degree.

John Flyers Fan
11-03-2003, 05:14 AM
Is anybody else even making a stab at ranking the teams?


I'll rank the teams, I've been a little busy at work, but I'll get to it within the next few days.

Leaf Lander
11-04-2003, 09:55 AM
Offense:
1 - Quebec Nordiques
2 - Philadelphia Flyers
3 - New Jersey Devils
4 - Vancouver Millionaires
5 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Detroit Red Wings
7 - Colorado Rockies
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Toronto Maple Leafs
10 - Boston Bruins
11 - Winnipeg Jets
12 - Montreal Canadiens

Defense:
1 - Montreal Canadiens
2 - Winnipeg Jets
3 - Boston Bruins
4 - New Jersey Devils
5 - Vancouver Millionaires
6 - Philadelphia Flyers
7 - Detroit Red Wings
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Quebec Nordiques
10 - Toronto Maple Leafs
11 - Colorado Rockies
12 - Pittsburgh Penguins

Toughness:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Boston Bruins
3 - Toronto Maple Leafs
4 - Colorado Rockies
5 - Detroit Red Wings
6 - Winnipeg Jets
7 - Montreal Canadiens
8 - Los Angeles Kings
9 - Vancouver Millionaires
10 - Philadelphia Flyers
11 - Pittsburgh Penguins
12 - Quebec Nordiques

Goaltending:
1 - Toronto Maple Leafs
2 - Colorado Rockies
3 - New Jersey Devils
4 - Vancouver Millionaires
5 - Pittsburgh Penguins
6 - Winnipeg Jets
7 - Boston Bruins
8 - Quebec Nordiques
9 - Los Angeles Kings
10 - Montreal Canadiens
11 - Philadelphia Flyers
12 - Detroit Red Wings

Overall:
1 - New Jersey Devils
2 - Philadelphia Flyers
3 - Vancouver Millionaires
4 - Boston Bruins
5 - Quebec Nordiques
6 - Los Angeles Kings
7 - Montreal Canadiens
8 - Colorado Rockies
9 - Winnipeg Jets
10 - Pittsburgh Penguins
11 - Detroit Red Wings
12 - Toronto Maple Leafs

It is much easier to decide who is last in each area than it is to decide who is first, and in most cases top to bottom isn't much of a spread.

The rankings don't figure for Detroit playing Orr 30+ minutes a game, which is the most likely strategy. Goal is the only area where I gave extra value to the starter over the backup.

Overall also doesn't fully account for any glaring weaknesses that might cripple a team, such as Quebec having a 5'7" defender, four 5'8" players, including a defender, and two 5'9" skaters, plus another handful under 6'. Kharlamov can skate like the wind and be a force on offense, but Clancy and Suchy are going to have trouble clearing the crease.

Is anybody else even making a stab at ranking the teams?


My team is last over all ? based up what ?

My teams a great team and you just dont have any insight

since yo uranked my team last

tear my team apart and rate each of my players vs the team that is the best


Yes you will get a rebuttal.
#2 Al MacInnis top 5 d-man from 80's till present

1416 340 934 1274 1501

PLAYOFFS
177 39 121 160 255

**Still Active**

#4 Scott Stevens Top d-man of 1990's till present

1603 193 703 896 2765

PLAYOFFS 233 26 92 118 402

**Still Active**


#24 Doug Wilson Top 5 d-man of 1980's

1024 237 590 827 830

PLAYOFFS 95 19 61 80 86



#8 Randy Carlysle norris trophy winner top 5 d-man of 1980's

NHL Totals 1055 148 499 647 1400
PlayOFFS 69 9 24 33 120



#2 Carl Brewer top 1- d-man in 60's ...the origional 6 era.

WHA Totals 77 2 23 25 42
PlayOFFS 12 0 4 4 11

NHL Totals 604 25 198 223 1037
PLAYOFFS 72 3 17 20 146


#2 Derian Hatcher top d-man of 90's to presnt

Games 830 G 70 A 225 P 295 PIM 1382

PLAYOFFS 100 6 21 27 183



maybe my team is suffering cause alot of my great players are still adding awards cup and points to their amazing totals.


when school is over I'll go calulate everyoens total points too I'm sure my team wil leb a top 5 team.

GB
11-04-2003, 10:35 AM
Is anybody else even making a stab at ranking the teams?

I'm not going to rank the other teams because there are to many players on the other teamsd that I don't know enough about to give an accurate ranking. I'm not whining here but I would like to ask a couple of questions about my teams ranking.

Bottom offense. I decided to go for a solid contribution from my forwards, rather than a couple of Super-Stars so I have a more balanced attack. Stantsy and Hawerchuck were my two big lynchpins with plenty of scoring from the wings. Also my 3rd line centre (Lach) retired as NHL all-time leading scorer. I also have the highest scoring defenceman ever, so I don't think they'd struggle to score.

10th Goaltending. Is this because of Foster, or do you not like Hall either?

That's it really.

Liam

John Flyers Fan
11-04-2003, 10:38 AM
#24 Doug Wilson Top 5 d-man of 1980's

1024 237 590 827 830

PLAYOFFS 95 19 61 80 86



#8 Randy Carlysle norris trophy winner top 5 d-man of 1980's

NHL Totals 1055 148 499 647 1400
PlayOFFS 69 9 24 33 120


Wilson top 5 in the 80's is very debateble ... probably more like 10th or so.

Carlyle also would not make the top 5, and probably not the top 10 of the 80's.

BM67
11-04-2003, 03:35 PM
I'm not going to rank the other teams because there are to many players on the other teamsd that I don't know enough about to give an accurate ranking. I'm not whining here but I would like to ask a couple of questions about my teams ranking.

Bottom offense. I decided to go for a solid contribution from my forwards, rather than a couple of Super-Stars so I have a more balanced attack. Stantsy and Hawerchuck were my two big lynchpins with plenty of scoring from the wings. Also my 3rd line centre (Lach) retired as NHL all-time leading scorer. I also have the highest scoring defenceman ever, so I don't think they'd struggle to score.

10th Goaltending. Is this because of Foster, or do you not like Hall either?

That's it really.

Liam

Offense: You have one player that won the Art Ross in Lach. He is the only player on your team to lead the NHL in assists, and you have no players that led the league in goals. Add in that after Bourque you lack attack from the defense, although I think I underrated Hall, but probably not enough to move you up to more than a tie for 11th or 10th. As I say mostly the teams are closely bunched in ratings, but you lack in top end offense, and your depth isn't any better than most.

Goaltending: Hall's single Cup win did hurt him in my end rankings, and Foster didn't earn you any extra points. I think I ranked him in a three or four way tie for last so he didn't bury you. I think you might take some solice in that you are actually tied for 8th but I took ties out and if I did it again might move you up.

BM67
11-04-2003, 04:01 PM
My team is last over all ? based up what ?

My teams a great team and you just dont have any insight

since yo uranked my team last

tear my team apart and rate each of my players vs the team that is the best

Yes you will get a rebuttal.

maybe my team is suffering cause alot of my great players are still adding awards cup and points to their amazing totals.

when school is over I'll go calulate everyoens total points too I'm sure my team wil leb a top 5 team.

Overall is based on each player being rated out of 10 and then totalled. So your team rates 156.5 out of 200, which is a good team, but not great compared to the rest. One problem with this is that goalies only make up 10% of the total, and since you were rated #1 in goaltending you suffered the most from that. I may have to figure out some kind of weighted system.

Any way on to tearing your team apart. :teach:

Hart winners:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 2 - Maurice Richard, Eric Lindros
New Jersey Devils: 6 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier (2), Nels Stewart (2), Andy Bathgate, Ted Kennedy, Babe Siebert
Runner-ups:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 3 - Maurice Richard (2), Doug Gilmour, Grant Fuhr
New Jersey Devils: 9 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier, Red Kelly, Ken Dryden, Charlie Conacher, Andy Bathgate, Lionel Conacher (2), Ted Kennedy, Sprague Cleghorn (2)

You have 4 players that were winners/runner-ups for the Hart. I have 11.

Art Ross (scoring leader pre-48):
Winners:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Busher Jackson
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (3), Dickie Moore (2), Charlie Conacher (2), Nels Stewart
Runner-ups:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 3 - Maurice Richard (5), Busher Jackson, Eric Lindros,
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (3), Mark Messier, Nels Stewart, Andy Bathgate (2)

NHL goal scoring leaders:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Maurice Richard (5)
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (7), Dickie Moore, Charlie Conacher (5), Nels Stewart (2)

NHL assists leaders:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Ron Francis (2)
New Jersey Devils: 3 - Dickie Moore, Andy Bathgate (2), Ted Kennedy

Also note that I have could add in leaders from other leagues. Hull led the WHA in goals, Nedomansky led the Czech. league in goals and points, Cleghorn led the NHA in assists.

THN Top 100 Players List members:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 5 - 5. Maurice Richard, 9. Terry Sawchuck, 54. Eric Lindros, 55. Busher Jackson, 70. Grant Fuhr
New Jersey Devils: 14 - 8. Bobby Hull, 12. Mark Messier, 22. Red Kelly, 25. Ken Dryden, 31. Dickie Moore, 36. Charlie Conacher, 51. Nels Stewart, 57. Ted Kennedy, 58. Andy Bathgate, 60. Turk Broda, 69. Dave Keon, 72. Earl Seibert, 88. Sprague Cleghorn, 99. Bill Gadsby

All-stars:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1st: 10 - Maurice Richard (8), Terry Sawchuck (3), Al MacInnis (4), Scott Stevens (2), Busher Jackson (4), Doug Wilson, Eric Lindros, Grant Fuhr, Randy Carlyle, Carl Brewer 2nd: 11 - Maurice Richard (6),Terry Sawchuck (4), Al MacInnis (3), Scott Stevens (3), Busher Jackson, Mats Sundin, Doug Wilson (2), Eric Lindros, Grant Fuhr, Carl Brewer (3), Derian Hatcher
New Jersey Devils: 1st: 12 - Bobby Hull (10), Mark Messier (3), Red Kelly (6), Ken Dryden (5), Dickie Moore (2), Charlie Conacher (3), Andy Bathgate (2), Earl Seibert (4), Lionel Conacher, Turk Broda (2), Bill Gadsby (3), Babe Siebert (3) 2nd: 15 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier, Red Kelly (2), Ken Dryden, Dickie Moore, Charlie Conacher (2), Andy Bathgate (2), Earl Seibert (6), Lionel Conacher (2), Turk Broda, Dave Keon (2), Ted Kennedy (3), Rick Middleton, Bill Gadsby (4), John Tonelli (2)

You have 8 players that have not been either a 1st or 2nd all-star, and they are all modern NHLers. I have 3, and two of them were international all-stars, Kasatonov and Nedomansky, and the other played before the introduction of the all-star teams in 31, Cleghorn.

I'll add more later.

JDB3939
11-04-2003, 04:59 PM
Which goaltandem is more clutch than Roy and Smith. I'd like to know.

Spitfire11
11-05-2003, 10:57 AM
Which goaltandem is more clutch than Roy and Smith. I'd like to know.

Pittsburg should be #1 in goaltending no matter how you look at it.

Lard_Lad
11-05-2003, 01:50 PM
Grades and rankings from a neutral observer. I used the best non-all-star team I could think of, the late 70's Canadiens, as a template for what a team with a 'C' grade would look like, so the grades are relative to that. It turned out that there weren't any huge differences - the overall grades worked out to two B's, five B+'s, and 5 A-'s.

Boston-
Goal: C+. Impressive stats, but both played in a different era and would be in tough against modern shooters playing by modern rules.
Defence: B-. McSorley drags them down.
Forwards: A-. Well-balanced, several guys who can score but backcheck, too.
Overall: B.

Colorado-
Goal: A-. Both were overshadowed by the talented teams in front of them, but nothing wrong with either.
Defence: B. Skilled, but might be a little vulnerable to big forwards.
Forwards: B+. Strong down the middle, but that fourth line would be handing out a lot of power plays to very skilled opponents.
Overall: B+.

Detroit-
Goal: B. Both won cups, but neither was the kind of goalie you'd want to depend on with everything on the line.
Defence: A+. The best defenceman ever, and five other guys with well-rounded games.
Forwards: A-. Lots of possibilities for interesting line combinations. A true checking forward might fit better with the rest of the group than a floater like Nilsson, though.
Overall: A-.

Los Angeles-
Goal: B+. Both were good, but had a tendency to be inconsistent.
Defence: A. No apparent weaknesses, and the defensive pairings fit well.
Forwards: A-. Biggest problem is a lack of true LW's other than Naslund, but that's not a huge issue.
Overall: A-.

Montreal-
Goal: B-. Hall was great and is underrated nowadays, but Foster drags the rating down.
Defence: B+. Could use just a little more skill.
Forwards: B+. Scoring and skill, but not many guys who'd dig in the corners, and other than Carbonneau, not many who'd backcheck.
Overall: B.

New Jersey-
Goal: A-. Two proven winners, whose strengths cover the suspect parts of each other's games.
Defence: B+. No true superstar, but very well-rounded.
Forwards: B+. Good, but a little unbalanced - too many shooters, not enough playmakers.
Overall: B+.

Philadelphia-
Goal: B+. Neither one's a superstar, but both are excellent clutch goalies.
Defence: A. Great mix of skill, toughness, and defensive ability.
Forwards: A-. A little limited in the toughness (just Gillies) and checking (just Fedorov) departments, but 99 keeps the grade high.
Overall: A-.

Pittsburgh-
Goal: A. The best big-game pair selected.
Defence: B. Very skilled, decent toughness, but I'd be a little nervous about Ozo and Zubov handing over turnovers to this kind of opposition.
Forwards: B. Talented, but they'd have trouble standing up physically to most of the other teams.
Overall: B+.

Quebec-
Goal: A. Mostly because the Dominator, at his peak, was as good as anybody has ever been.
Defence: B-. Good skill, but suspect defensively.
Forwards: A. Skill, toughness, defence, good balance.
Overall: A-.

Toronto-
Goal: A. Both had extended runs as the best goalie in the league.
Defence: A-. Skill, smarts, toughness. Wilson and MacInnis would make a scary PP pair.
Forwards: B-. Good size, fine defensively, but doesn't match up well offensively against the other teams.
Overall: B+.

Vancouver-
Goal: A-. Parent in his prime was one of the best ever, but Worters never played on a team that had any real success.
Defence: B+. Good first pair, but the bottom four might be suspect against a fast opponent.
Forwards: A-. Lots of scoring, could be a bit tougher.
Overall. A-.

Winnipeg-
Goal: B+. Two solid goalies, but I was never a Tony O fan.
Defence: B-. Size, but not a lot of skill after Robinson and Salming.
Forwards: A-. No superstars, but a nice mix of scoring, checking, and toughness, with no obvious weaknesses.
Overall: B+.

Predicted order of finish:
1-Philadelphia
2-Los Angeles
3-Quebec
4-Vancouver
5-Detroit
6-Pittsburgh
7-Winnipeg
8-New Jersey
9-Colorado
10-Toronto
11-Boston
12-Montreal

BM67
11-05-2003, 07:06 PM
New Jersey-
Goal: A-. Two proven winners, whose strengths cover the suspect parts of each other's games.
Defence: B+. No true superstar, but very well-rounded.
Forwards: B+. Good, but a little unbalanced - too many shooters, not enough playmakers.
Overall: B+.


It's your rating, and you're welcome to your opinion but I will take exception to a couple of your statements.

No superstar? What is Red Kelly? He was only rated the 22nd best NHL player of all-time by THN, 6th among defensemen and ahead of Robinson and Coffey.

3 Hart runner-ups, and Cleghorn probably would have won at least one if it was introduced earlier.

Hart:
Kelly – Runner-up: 54
L. Conacher – Runner-up: 34, 37
Cleghorn – Runner-up: 24, 26

Only one Norris winner, but Seibert and Cleghorn would have won it if had of been there when they played.

Norris (*top all-star vote getter 31-53):
Kelly – *51,*52, *53, 54 Runner-up: 55, 57
Seibert – *42, *43, *44 Runner-up: *35
L. Conacher – Runner-up: *34
Kasatonov - Best Defenseman: WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 83
Gadsby - Runner-up: 56, 58, 59

4 players that were 1st team all-stars, plus a meriad of international honors for Kasatonov, and of course the only name missing is Cleghorn who played before the NHL started naming all-stars in 1931. He was 34 when he was the runner-up for the first Hart Trophy in 1924.

All-star Teams:
Kelly - 1st: 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 57 2nd: 50, 56
Seibert - 1st: 35, 42, 43, 44 2nd: 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41
L. Conacher - 1st: 34 2nd: 33, 37
Kasatonov - WJC-A: 79 WEC-A: 82, 83, 85, 86, 91 USSR: 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88 Canada Cup: 81
Gadsby - 56, 58, 59 2nd: 53, 54, 57, 65

Kasatonov is the only one of my defenders not to have led all NHL defensemen in goals or assists at least once, and he and Seibert are the only ones not to have led in points. Cleghorn led the NHA in assists in 1915 with 12, not just the D, and also chipped in 21 goals in 19 games. Kelly is tied with Orr for the longest run of leading D in goals at 7 years, and is second only to Orr in Leading D in goals and points at 5 straight.

Defensive leaders:
Kelly: Goals: 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57 Assists: 51, 52, 54 Points: 50, 51, 52, 53, 54
Seibert - Goals: 34 Assists: 43
Conacher - Goals: 28 Assists: 37 Points: 37
Cleghorn: Goals: 20 Assists: 19 NHA: 15 Points: 20
Gadsby - Goals: 58 Assists: 56, 58, 59 Points: 56, 58, 59

4 of my D are on the top 100 list, and Kasatonov would make anybody's all-time international team.

THN Top 100 NHL Players List members:
22. Red Kelly
72. Earl Seibert
88. Sprague Cleghorn
99. Bill Gadsby

In short the line you gave for the Philly D is more appropriate:
"Defence: A. Great mix of skill, toughness, and defensive ability"

Now for the forwards. I'll admit I have 4 guys that are primarily snipers, but more than half of my forwards are very fine passers, so I don't see any great imbalance. I have at least one playmaker on each line. I have at least one corner man on each line. I have at least one defensively aware player on each line, and a complete checking line. I have probably the best line of centers as far as faceoffs are concerned. Add in that my primary snipers all score in different ways and I don't see that I lack in any area at forward.

BM67
11-05-2003, 07:11 PM
Pittsburg should be #1 in goaltending no matter how you look at it.

If you rate Roy as the best of all-time, which I don't.

Lard_Lad
11-06-2003, 06:38 AM
No superstar? What is Red Kelly? He was only rated the 22nd best NHL player of all-time by THN, 6th among defensemen and ahead of Robinson and Coffey.

And I don't agree with them. Robinson had a more complete game than Kelly, and if I'm going to take a defenseman whose primary contribution was offence, I'd take Coffey and his significantly bigger offensive upside. Kelly was a star, certainly, but the defensive superstar of the fifties was Doug Harvey, not him.

As for Cleghorn, he was one of the best of his era, but how well would a 5'10 physical defenseman who never had to defend against forward passing do against somebody like Beliveau or Mario?

Leaf Lander
11-06-2003, 12:43 PM
Overall is based on each player being rated out of 10 and then totalled. So your team rates 156.5 out of 200, which is a good team, but not great compared to the rest. One problem with this is that goalies only make up 10% of the total, and since you were rated #1 in goaltending you suffered the most from that. I may have to figure out some kind of weighted system.

Any way on to tearing your team apart. :teach:

Hart winners:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 2 - Maurice Richard, Eric Lindros
New Jersey Devils: 6 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier (2), Nels Stewart (2), Andy Bathgate, Ted Kennedy, Babe Siebert
Runner-ups:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 3 - Maurice Richard (2), Doug Gilmour, Grant Fuhr
New Jersey Devils: 9 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier, Red Kelly, Ken Dryden, Charlie Conacher, Andy Bathgate, Lionel Conacher (2), Ted Kennedy, Sprague Cleghorn (2)

You have 4 players that were winners/runner-ups for the Hart. I have 11.

Art Ross (scoring leader pre-48):
Winners:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Busher Jackson
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (3), Dickie Moore (2), Charlie Conacher (2), Nels Stewart
Runner-ups:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 3 - Maurice Richard (5), Busher Jackson, Eric Lindros,
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (3), Mark Messier, Nels Stewart, Andy Bathgate (2)

NHL goal scoring leaders:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Maurice Richard (5)
New Jersey Devils: 4 - Bobby Hull (7), Dickie Moore, Charlie Conacher (5), Nels Stewart (2)

NHL assists leaders:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1 - Ron Francis (2)
New Jersey Devils: 3 - Dickie Moore, Andy Bathgate (2), Ted Kennedy

Also note that I have could add in leaders from other leagues. Hull led the WHA in goals, Nedomansky led the Czech. league in goals and points, Cleghorn led the NHA in assists.

THN Top 100 Players List members:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 5 - 5. Maurice Richard, 9. Terry Sawchuck, 54. Eric Lindros, 55. Busher Jackson, 70. Grant Fuhr
New Jersey Devils: 14 - 8. Bobby Hull, 12. Mark Messier, 22. Red Kelly, 25. Ken Dryden, 31. Dickie Moore, 36. Charlie Conacher, 51. Nels Stewart, 57. Ted Kennedy, 58. Andy Bathgate, 60. Turk Broda, 69. Dave Keon, 72. Earl Seibert, 88. Sprague Cleghorn, 99. Bill Gadsby

All-stars:
Toronto Maple Leafs: 1st: 10 - Maurice Richard (8), Terry Sawchuck (3), Al MacInnis (4), Scott Stevens (2), Busher Jackson (4), Doug Wilson, Eric Lindros, Grant Fuhr, Randy Carlyle, Carl Brewer 2nd: 11 - Maurice Richard (6),Terry Sawchuck (4), Al MacInnis (3), Scott Stevens (3), Busher Jackson, Mats Sundin, Doug Wilson (2), Eric Lindros, Grant Fuhr, Carl Brewer (3), Derian Hatcher
New Jersey Devils: 1st: 12 - Bobby Hull (10), Mark Messier (3), Red Kelly (6), Ken Dryden (5), Dickie Moore (2), Charlie Conacher (3), Andy Bathgate (2), Earl Seibert (4), Lionel Conacher, Turk Broda (2), Bill Gadsby (3), Babe Siebert (3) 2nd: 15 - Bobby Hull (2), Mark Messier, Red Kelly (2), Ken Dryden, Dickie Moore, Charlie Conacher (2), Andy Bathgate (2), Earl Seibert (6), Lionel Conacher (2), Turk Broda, Dave Keon (2), Ted Kennedy (3), Rick Middleton, Bill Gadsby (4), John Tonelli (2)

You have 8 players that have not been either a 1st or 2nd all-star, and they are all modern NHLers. I have 3, and two of them were international all-stars, Kasatonov and Nedomansky, and the other played before the introduction of the all-star teams in 31, Cleghorn.

I'll add more later.

Tally your teams points and stats and then come compare them to mine

A team is more then just awards :)


Toronto-
Goal: A. Both had extended runs as the best goalie in the league.
Defence: A-. Skill, smarts, toughness. Wilson and MacInnis would make a scary PP pair.
Forwards: B-. Good size, fine defensively, but doesn't match up well offensively against the other teams.
Overall: B+.

-B + -A + A = A in my bookthe first 2 cancel each other out :teach:

BM67
11-06-2003, 05:22 PM
And I don't agree with them. Robinson had a more complete game than Kelly, and if I'm going to take a defenseman whose primary contribution was offence, I'd take Coffey and his significantly bigger offensive upside. Kelly was a star, certainly, but the defensive superstar of the fifties was Doug Harvey, not him.

As for Cleghorn, he was one of the best of his era, but how well would a 5'10 physical defenseman who never had to defend against forward passing do against somebody like Beliveau or Mario?

You disagree to what extent? You'd have to drop him quite a way from 22 to remove him from superstar status.

Robinson has a physical element that Kelly lacks, so yes he is more complete, but Kelly was better offensively and wasn't far behind defensively, despite not being a bone crusher.

So there can only be one superstar in a decade? Harvey is one of the top defensemen of all-time and Kelly was right on his heels for top defender of the 50s.

Well Bourque, Morris and Harvey are all listed at 5'11", so I doubt one inch will kill Cleghorn, and Domi's being 5'10" doesn't stop him from being a heavy weight. I'd certainly regard his size as less of a problem than Ching Johnson's lack of foot speed, which you seem to have had no problem with, and I might point out that he also is 5'11".

BM67
11-06-2003, 05:41 PM
Tally your teams points and stats and then come compare them to mine

A team is more then just awards :)


A team is also more that just stats. If you just look at goal/point totals, Mike Gartner is a better player than Rocket Richard, which is obviously absurd.

I'll keep adding to the list above when I get the time.

BM67
11-09-2003, 09:23 AM
Forwards:Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard 978 544 421 965 1285 PO 133 82 44 126 188
Ron Francis 1651 536 1222 1758 965 PO 156 46 93 139 93 WC-A 10 2 5 7 2
Doug Gilmour 1474 450 964 1414 1301 PO 182 60 128 188 235 CanCup 8 2 0 2 4 WC-A 9 1 4 5 18 Switz 9 2 13 15 16
Wendel Clark 793 330 234 564 1690 PO 95 37 32 69 201
Busher Jackson 633 241 234 475 437 PO 71 18 12 30 53
Mats Sundin 1005 434 580 1014 817 PO 74 31 34 65 64 WC-A 40 19 26 45 30 CanCup 6 2 4 6 16 WCup 4 4 3 7 4 OLY 8 8 4 12 14 Swe 46 17 10 27 30 PO 8 7 0 7 4
Eric Lindros 639 346 439 785 1225 PO 50 24 33 57 118 WC-A 8 11 6 17 10 OLY 12 3 3 6 10 WCup 8 3 3 6 10
Dave Andreychuk 1515 613 668 1281 1067 PO 139 42 41 83 148 WC-A 10 3 2 5 18
Rick Vaive WHA 75 26 33 59 248 NHL 876 441 347 788 1445 PO 54 27 16 43 111 WC-A 19 9 3 12 28
Ken Linseman WHA 71 38 38 76 126 PO 5 2 2 4 15 NHL 860 256 551 807 1727 PO 113 43 77 120 325 CanCup 4 0 1 1 4 Italy 5 3 3 6 4
Joel Otto 943 195 313 508 1934 PO 122 27 47 74 207 WC-A 19 4 5 9 10 CanCup 13 4 2 6 6 WCup 7 1 2 3 6 OLY 4 0 0 0 0
Joe Nieuwendyk 1113 511 501 1012 601 PO 149 60 50 110 87 WC-A 1 0 0 0 0 OLY 12 3 4 7 2
Forwards: New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull NHL 1,063 610 560 1170 640 PO 119 62 67 129 102 WHA 411 303 335 638 183 PO 60 43 37 80 38 Sum74 8 7 2 9 0 CanCup 7 5 3 8 2
Mark Messier NHL 1680 676 1168 1844 1868 PO 236 109 186 295 244 WHA 52 1 10 11 58 WC-A 6 3 3 6 8 CanCup 25 5 16 21 24 WCup 7 1 4 5 12
Dickie Moore 719 261 347 608 652 PO 135 46 64 110 122
Charlie Conacher 459 225 173 398 523 PO 49 17 18 35 49
Nels Stewart 650 324 191 515 953 PO 54 15 13 28 61
Andy Bathgate NHL 1069 349 624 973 624 PO 54 21 14 35 76 WHA 11 1 6 7 2
Dave Keon NHL 1296 396 590 986 117 PO 92 32 36 68 6 WHA 301 102 189 291 20 PO 36 13 23 36 8
Vaclav Nedomansky NHL 421 122 156 278 88 PO 7 3 5 8 0 WHA 252 135 118 253 43 PO 6 3 1 4 9 Czech* 419 369 159 528 55 PO 22 16 9 25 9 WC-A 80 67 34 101 51 OLY 13 13 5 18 4
Ted Kennedy 696 231 329 560 432 PO 78 29 31 60 32
Rick Middleton 1005 448 540 988 157 PO 114 45 55 100 19 CanCup 14 5 6 11 0
Babe Siebert 592 140 156 296 982 PO 53 8 7 15 65
John Tonelli NHL 1028 325 511 836 911 PO 172 40 75 115 200 WHA 224 64 86 150 278 PO 34 11 14 25 38 CanCup 8 3 6 9 2
Totals
NHL: GP 12,480 G 4,897 A 6,474 Pts 11,371 PIM 14,494 PO GP 1,182 G 497 A 607 Pts 1,104 PIM 1,830
NHL: GP 10,678 G 4,107 A 5,345 Pts 9,452 PIM 7,947 PO GP 1,163 G 427 A 571 Pts 998 PIM 976
WHA: GP 146 G 64 A 71 Pts 135 PIM 374 PO GP 5 G 2 A 2 Pts 4 PIM 15
WHA: GP 1,251 G 606 A 744 Pts 1,350 PIM 584 PO GP 136 G 70 A 75 Pts 145 PIM 93
Eur: GP 60 G 22 A 26 Pts 48 PIM 50 PO GP 8 G 7 A 0 Pts 7 PIM 4
Eur*: GP 419 G 369 A 159 Pts 528 PIM 55 PO GP 22 G 16 A 9 Pts 25 PIM 9
WC-A: GP 116 G 46 A 51 Pts 97 PIM 116
WC-A: GP 86 G 70 A 37 Pts 107 PIM 59
CanCup: GP 31 G 8 A 7 Pts 15 PIM 30
CanCup: GP 54 G 18 A 31 Pts 49 PIM 28
WCup: GP 19 G 8 A 8 Pts 16 PIM 20
WCup: GP 7 G 1 A 4 Pts 5 PIM 12
OLY: GP 36 G 14 A 11 Pts 25 PIM 26
OLY: GP 13 G 13 A 5 Pts 18 PIM 4
Sum74: GP 8 G 7 A 2 Pts 9 PIM 0
All: GP 12,888 G 5,149 A 6,648 Pts 11,797 PIM 15,110 PO GP 1,195 G 506 A 609 Pts 1,015 PIM 1,849
All*: GP 12,516 G 5,191 A 6,327 Pts 11,518 PIM 8,689 PO GP 1,321 G 513 A 655 Pts 1,168 PIM 1,078
* incomplete stats

Defensemen: Toronto Maple Leafs
Al MacInnis 1413 340 932 1272 1495 PO 177 39 121 160 255 WC-A 9 1 3 4 10 CanCup 8 2 4 6 23 OLY 12 2 0 2 10
Scott Stevens 1597 193 703 896 2763 PO 233 26 92 118 402 WC-A 27 3 6 9 18 CanCup 8 1 0 1 4 WCup 8 0 2 2 4 OLY 6 0 0 0 2
Doug Wilson 1024 237 590 827 830 PO 95 19 61 80 88 CanCup 7 2 1 3 4
Randy Carlyle 1055 148 499 647 1400 PO 69 9 24 33 120 WC-A 9 1 4 5 4
Carl Brewer WHA 77 2 23 25 42 PO 12 0 4 4 11 NHL 604 25 198 223 1037 PO 72 3 17 20 146 WC-A 7 1 6 7 10 Fin 20 4 14 18 53
Derian Hatcher 827 71 223 294 1380 PO 100 6 21 27 161 WC-A 6 1 2 3 8 WCup 6 3 2 5 10 OLY 8 0 4 4 12
Defensemen: New Jersey Devils
Red Kelly 1316 281 542 823 327 PO 164 33 59 92 51
Alexei Kasatonov 383 38 122 160 326 PO 33 4 7 11 40 USSR 576 124 219 343 386 PO 1 0 0 0 0 WC-A 77 18 34 52 69 SuperS 24 4 12 16 18 OLY 21 7 14 21 8 Can Cup 27 3 19 22 20
Earl Seibert 645 89 187 276 746 PO 66 11 8 19 76
Lionel Conacher 498 80 105 185 882 PO 25 2 2 4 34
Sprague Cleghorn NHA 115 84 33 117 265 PO 2 0 0 0 17 NHL 259 83 55 138 538 PO 39 7 7 14 25
Bill Gadsby 1248 130 438 568 1539 PO 67 4 23 27 92
Totals
NHL: GP 6,520 G 1,014 A 3,145 Pts 4,159 PIM 8,905 PO GP 746 G 102 A 336 Pts 438 PIM 1,172
NHL: GP 4,349 G 701 A 1,449 Pts 2,141 PIM 4,358 PO GP 394 G 61 A 106 Pts 167 PIM 318
WHA: GP 77 G 2 A 23 Pts 25 PIM 42 PO GP 12 G 0 A 4 Pts 4 PIM 11
NHA: GP 115 G 84 A 33 Pts 117 PIM 265 PO GP 2 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 17
Eur: GP 20 G 4 A 14 Pts 18 PIM 53
Eur: GP 576 G 124 A 219 Pts 343 PIM 386 PO GP 1 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 0
WC-A: GP 58 G 7 A 21 Pts 28 PIM 50
WC-A: GP 77 G 18 A 34 Pts 52 PIM 69
CanCup: GP 23 G 5 A 5 Pts 10 PIM 31
CanCup: GP 27 G 3 A 19 Pts 22 PIM 20
WCup: GP 14 G 3 A 4 Pts 7 PIM 14
SuperS: GP 24 G 4 A 12 Pts 16 PIM 18
OLY: GP 26 G 2 A 4 Pts 6 PIM 24
OLY: GP 21 G 7 A 14 Pts 21 PIM 8
All: GP 6,738 G 1,037 A 3,216 Pts 4,253 PIM 9,119 PO GP 758 G 102 A 340 Pts 442 PIM 1,183
All: GP 5,189 G 941 A 1,780 Pts 2,721 PIM 5,124 PO GP 397 G 61 A 106 Pts 167 PIM 335

Goalies: Toronto Maple Leafs
Terry Sawchuck 972 446 332 171 2.51 103 PO 106 54 48 2.54 12
Grant Fuhr 868 403 295 114 3.38 25 PO 150 92 50 2.92 6 WC-A 5 1 3 1 3.62 1 CanCup 11 7 1 3 3.00 0
Goalies: New Jersey Devils
Ken Dryden 397 258 57 74 2.24 46 PO 112 80 32 2.40 10 WC-A 2 1 1 0 2.00 1 Sum72 4 2 2 0 4.75 0
Turk Broda 629 302 224 101 2.53 62 PO 101 60 39 1.98 13
Totals
NHL: GP 1,840 W 849 L 627 T 285 GAA 2.91 SO 128 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
NHL: GP 1,026 W 560 L 281 T 175 GAA 2.42 SO 108 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23
WC-A: GP 5 W 1 L 3 T 1 GAA 3.62 SO 1
WC-A: GP 2 W 1 L 1 T 0 GAA 2.00 SO 1
CanCup: GP 11 W 7 L 1 T 3 GAA 3.00 SO 0
Sum72: GP 4 W 2 L 2 T 0 GAA 4.75 SO 0
All: GP 1,856 W 857 L 631 T 289 GAA 2.91 SO 129 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
All: GP 1,032 W 563 L 284 T 175 GAA 2.43 SO 109 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23

Team: GP 19,626 G 6,186 A 9,864 Pts 16,050 PIM 24,229 PO GP 1,953 G 608 A 949 Pts 1,557 PIM 3,032
Team*: GP 17,687 G 6,132 A 8,107 Pts 14,239 PIM 13,813 PO GP 1,718 G 574 A 761 Pts 1,335 PIM 1,413

When you consider all the players I selected from when scoring was down and assists were given sparingly, I'm surprised how well I stack up. The defense is so short of assists that it's pretty hard to compare the two teams there, but the forwards come out pretty even, and any adjustments for era would likely leave me well ahead there.

One thing that really stands out is that Toronto needs a major upgrade on the PK unit, because they take a huge pile of penalties. They take over 60% more than my team per RS game and it climbs to almost 90% more in the playoffs.

monkey_00*
11-09-2003, 03:44 PM
Grades and rankings from a neutral observer. I used the best non-all-star team I could think of, the late 70's Canadiens, as a template for what a team with a 'C' grade would look like, so the grades are relative to that. It turned out that there weren't any huge differences - the overall grades worked out to two B's, five B+'s, and 5 A-'s.

Boston-
Goal: C+. Impressive stats, but both played in a different era and would be in tough against modern shooters playing by modern rules.
Defence: B-. McSorley drags them down.
Forwards: A-. Well-balanced, several guys who can score but backcheck, too.
Overall: B.

Colorado-
Goal: A-. Both were overshadowed by the talented teams in front of them, but nothing wrong with either.
Defence: B. Skilled, but might be a little vulnerable to big forwards.
Forwards: B+. Strong down the middle, but that fourth line would be handing out a lot of power plays to very skilled opponents.
Overall: B+.

Detroit-
Goal: B. Both won cups, but neither was the kind of goalie you'd want to depend on with everything on the line.
Defence: A+. The best defenceman ever, and five other guys with well-rounded games.
Forwards: A-. Lots of possibilities for interesting line combinations. A true checking forward might fit better with the rest of the group than a floater like Nilsson, though.
Overall: A-.

Los Angeles-
Goal: B+. Both were good, but had a tendency to be inconsistent.
Defence: A. No apparent weaknesses, and the defensive pairings fit well.
Forwards: A-. Biggest problem is a lack of true LW's other than Naslund, but that's not a huge issue.
Overall: A-.

Montreal-
Goal: B-. Hall was great and is underrated nowadays, but Foster drags the rating down.
Defence: B+. Could use just a little more skill.
Forwards: B+. Scoring and skill, but not many guys who'd dig in the corners, and other than Carbonneau, not many who'd backcheck.
Overall: B.

New Jersey-
Goal: A-. Two proven winners, whose strengths cover the suspect parts of each other's games.
Defence: B+. No true superstar, but very well-rounded.
Forwards: B+. Good, but a little unbalanced - too many shooters, not enough playmakers.
Overall: B+.

Philadelphia-
Goal: B+. Neither one's a superstar, but both are excellent clutch goalies.
Defence: A. Great mix of skill, toughness, and defensive ability.
Forwards: A-. A little limited in the toughness (just Gillies) and checking (just Fedorov) departments, but 99 keeps the grade high.
Overall: A-.

Pittsburgh-
Goal: A. The best big-game pair selected.
Defence: B. Very skilled, decent toughness, but I'd be a little nervous about Ozo and Zubov handing over turnovers to this kind of opposition.
Forwards: B. Talented, but they'd have trouble standing up physically to most of the other teams.
Overall: B+.

Quebec-
Goal: A. Mostly because the Dominator, at his peak, was as good as anybody has ever been.
Defence: B-. Good skill, but suspect defensively.
Forwards: A. Skill, toughness, defence, good balance.
Overall: A-.

Toronto-
Goal: A. Both had extended runs as the best goalie in the league.
Defence: A-. Skill, smarts, toughness. Wilson and MacInnis would make a scary PP pair.
Forwards: B-. Good size, fine defensively, but doesn't match up well offensively against the other teams.
Overall: B+.

Vancouver-
Goal: A-. Parent in his prime was one of the best ever, but Worters never played on a team that had any real success.
Defence: B+. Good first pair, but the bottom four might be suspect against a fast opponent.
Forwards: A-. Lots of scoring, could be a bit tougher.
Overall. A-.

Winnipeg-
Goal: B+. Two solid goalies, but I was never a Tony O fan.
Defence: B-. Size, but not a lot of skill after Robinson and Salming.
Forwards: A-. No superstars, but a nice mix of scoring, checking, and toughness, with no obvious weaknesses.
Overall: B+.

Predicted order of finish:
1-Philadelphia
2-Los Angeles
3-Quebec
4-Vancouver
5-Detroit
6-Pittsburgh
7-Winnipeg
8-New Jersey
9-Colorado
10-Toronto
11-Boston
12-Montreal
------------------------------
Lard_Lad.............

Fair grades on all the teams but I must add here that I only joined up with this draft slightly past the halfway mark.......

There's some great players that were picked on my team at the start like LaFleur, Clarke, Robinson, Brodeur and Salming but after that the picks by the original GM of my team really went downhill.......I mean I had to almost beg on my hands and knees to replace a Non-NHL player like Crosby with Butch Goring.....and I'm almost certain that I wouldn't have selected MacLeish and Rechhi....I would have used those slots in the draft to select a talented defenceman......having said that I have 4-Conn Smythe trophy winners on my squad (Cournoyer, Robinson, LaFleur and Goring) How many other teams have more than that?........and the other thing to consider with my team is the size of the players on my Blueline.......alot of the flashier players from the earlier Era of the NHL were on the smallish side and some of the smaller teams in this Pool I feel would have alot of problems playing against the top-4 GIANTS on my defence like:

6-10...Zdeno Chara
6-6....Kjell Samuelson
6-4....Larry Robinson
6-3....Steve Smith
-------------------
6-1....Borje Salming
5-11...Marcel Pronovost

Cheers!~

monkey_00

Frightened Inmate #2
11-09-2003, 04:42 PM
------------------------------
Lard_Lad.............

Fair grades on all the teams but I must add here that I only joined up with this draft slightly past the halfway mark.......

There's some great players that were picked on my team at the start like LaFleur, Clarke, Robinson, Brodeur and Salming but after that the picks by the original GM of my team really went downhill.......I mean I had to almost beg on my hands and knees to replace a Non-NHL player like Crosby with Butch Goring.....and I'm almost certain that I wouldn't have selected MacLeish and Rechhi....I would have used those slots in the draft to select a talented defenceman......having said that I have 4-Conn Smythe trophy winners on my squad (Cournoyer, Robinson, LaFleur and Goring) How many other teams have more than that?........and the other thing to consider with my team is the size of the players on my Blueline.......alot of the flashier players from the earlier Era of the NHL were on the smallish side and some of the smaller teams in this Pool I feel would have alot of problems playing against the top-4 GIANTS on my defence like:

6-10...Zdeno Chara
6-6....Kjell Samuelson
6-4....Larry Robinson
6-3....Steve Smith
-------------------
6-1....Borje Salming
5-11...Marcel Pronovost

Cheers!~

monkey_00

The probllem with your defense is they are lacking in terms of footspeed with Chara and Samuelson. The Nordiques would absolutely kill those two guys and blow right by them. They would be quite good at taking the body however although Chara isn't much of a hitter.

is there anyway in which someone could place the rosters on the same page (like was done at first) that would really help with rating them.

BM67
11-09-2003, 06:28 PM
1. Spitfire11-----------Detroit Red Wings
Bobby Orr, D – Hart, Art Ross, Norris, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, assists (2)
Phil Esposito, C – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals, assists (18)
Stan Mikita, C – Hart, Art Ross, , 1st All-star, assists (17)
Joe Sakic, C – Hart, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (94)
Cam Neely, RW – 2nd All-star
Pierre Pilote, D – Norris, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (59)
Valeri Vasiliev, D - ** 1st All-star
Adam Oates, C – 2nd All-star, assists
Teemu Selanne, RW – Richard, 1st All-star, goals
Guy Lapointe, D – 1st All-star
Brendan Shanahan, LW – 1st All-star
Vladimir Konstantinov, D – 2nd All-star
Paul Kariya, LW – 1st All-star
Kent Nilsson, C/LW –
Gary Suter, D – 2nd All-star
Eddie Belfour, G – Vezina, Jennings, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA
Keith Tkachuk, LW – 2nd All-star, goals
Jacques Lemaire, C –
Gary Roberts, LW –
Mike Vernon, G – Jennings, Conn Smythe, 2nd All-star, wins

2. John Flyers Fan ----- Philadelphia Flyers
Wayne Gretzky, C – Hart, Art Ross, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (1)
Denis Potvin, D – Norris, 1st All-star (19)
Jaromir Jagr, RW – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star, assists (37)
Brad Park, D – 1st All-star (49)
Nicklas Lidstrom, D – Norris, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star
Sergei Makarov, RW - **Hart, **Art Ross, **1st All-star
Joe Malone, C – Art Ross, goals (39)
Sergei Fedorov, C – Hart, Selke, 1st All-star
Bill Cowley, C – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, assists (53)
Michel Goulet, LW – 1st All-star
Clark Gillies, LW – 1st All-star
Johnny Bower, G – Vezina, 1st All-star, wins, GAA (87)
Bill Barber, LW – 1st All-star
Ching Johnson, D – *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star
Steve Larmer, RW –
Brian Propp, LW –
Bryan Hextall, RW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals
Eric Desjardins, D – 2nd All-star
Kevin Lowe, D –
Gerry Cheevers, G –

3. Maxwell Edison ------Quebec Nordiques
Gordie Howe, RW – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (3)
Domink Hasek, G – Hart, Vezina, Jennings, 1st All-star, shutouts, GAA (95)
Valeri Kharlamov, LW - ** MVP, 1st All-star, goals, points
Peter Forsberg, C – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star
Gilbert Perreault, C – 2nd All-Star (47)
Max Bentley, C – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star (48)
Dit Clapper, D/RW - *Norris, 1st All-star (41)
King Clancy, D – 1st All-star, assists (52)
Aleksander Maltsev, C - ** MVP, 1st All-star
Doug Bentley, LW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals, assists (73)
Vladimir Petrov, C – **1st All-star, goals, points
Claude Provost, RW – 1st All-star
Babe Pratt, D – Hart, *Norris, 1st All-star (96)
Esa Tikkanen, LW –
Vladimir Lutchenko, D –
Bill Mosienko, RW – 2nd All-star
Pelle Lindbergh, G – Vezina, 1st All-star, wins
Kevin Stevens, LW – 1st All-star
Al Iafrate, D – 2nd All-star
Jan Suchy, D –

4. Dr. Love ------------Vancouver Millionaires
Mario Lemieux, C – Hart, Art Ross, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (4)
Bryan Trottier, C – Hart, Art Ross, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, assists (30)
Chris Chelios, D – Norris, 1st All-star (40)
Bernie Parent, G – Vezina, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (63)
Brett "No Goal" Hull, RW – Hart, 1st All-star, goals (64)
Mats Naslund, RW – 2nd All-star
Mark Howe, D – 1st All-star
Alexander Mogilny, RW – 2nd All-star, goals
Cyclone Taylor, Rover – PCHL goals, assists, points
Tom Johnson, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Sid Abel, C/LW – Hart, 1st All-star, goals (85)
Jacques Laperriere, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Harry Watson, LW –
Bernie Federko, C –
Allan Stanley, D – 2nd All-star
Roy Conacher, LW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals
Punch Broadbent, RW – Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, goals
Kenny Reardon, D – *Norris, 1st All-star
Herbie Lewis, LW –
Roy Worters, G – Hart, Vezina, 2nd All-star, GAA

5. Laperriere22 ----------Boston Bruins
Doug Harvey, D – Norris, 1st All-star (6)
Ted Lindsay, LW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals, assists (21)
Howie Morenz, C – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (15)
Milt Schmidt, C – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, assists (27)
Tim Horton, D - *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (43)
Boom Boom Geoffrion, RW – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals (42)
Bill Durnan, G – Vezina, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (34)
Bob Gainey, LW – Selke, Conn Smythe (86)
Newsy Lalonde, C – Art Ross, 1st All-star (PCHA), goals, assists (32)
George Hainsworth, G – Vezina, *1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (46)
Emile Bouchard, D – *Norris, 1st All-star
Jean Ratelle, C – 2nd All-star
Bill Barilko, D –
Woody Dumart, LW – 2nd All-star
Bobby Bauer, RW – 2nd All-star
Mike Modano, C – 2nd All-star
Rob Ramage, D – *1st All-star
Bob Probert, LW –
Brian Sutter, LW –
Marty McSorley, D –

6. Gilmour's Way -------Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard, RW – Hart, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals (5)
Terry Sawchuck, G – Vezina, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (9)
Ron Francis, C – Selke, assists
Al MacInnis, D – Norris, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star
Scott Stevens, D – Conn Smythe, 1st All-star
Doug Gilmour, C – Selke
Wendel Clark, LW –
Busher Jackson, LW – Art Ross, 1st All-star (55)
Mats Sundin, C – 2nd All-star
Doug Wilson, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Eric Lindros, C – Hart, 1st All-star, points (54)
Grant Fuhr, G – Vezina, Jennings, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts (70)
Randy Carlyle, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Dave Andreychuk, LW –
Rick Vaive, RW –
Carl Brewer, D – 1st All-star
Derian Hatcher, D – 2nd All-star
Ken Linseman, C –
Joel Otto, C –
Joe Nieuwendyk, C – Conn Smythe

7. Oiler94---------------Colorado Rockies
Jean Beliveau, C – Hart, Art Ross, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (7)
Paul Coffey, D – Norris, 1st All-star (28)
Jacque Plante, G – Hart, Vezina, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (13)
Henri Richard, C – 1st All-star, assists (29)
Darryl Sittler, C – 2nd All-star (93)
John Bucyk, LW – 1st All-star (45)
Syl Apps Sr, C – 1st All-star, assists (33)
Larry Murphy, D – 2nd All-star
Toe Blake, LW – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star (66)
Mike Gartner, RW – (89)
Harry Howell, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Phil Housley, D – 2nd All-star
Glenn Anderson, RW –
Joe Mullen, RW – 1st All-star
Dale Hunter, C –
Bill Quackenbush, D – *Norris, 1st All-star
Ebbie Goodfellow, D/C – Hart, 1st All-star
Dave “Tiger” Williams, LW –
Dave Schultz, LW –
Tiny Thompson, G – Vezina, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA

8. GB Editor -------------Montreal Canadiens
Raymond Bourque, D – Norris, 1st All-star (14)
Peter Stastny, C – Czech POY, Czech 1st All-star (56)
Glenn Hall, G – Vezina, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (16)
Frank Mahovlich, LW – 1st All-star (26)
Dale Hawerchuk, C – 2nd All-star
Serge Savard, D – Conn Smythe, 2nd All-star (81)
Rod Gilbert, RW – 1st All-star
Lanny McDonald, RW – 2nd All-star
Aurel Joliat, LW – Hart, 1st All-star (65)
Rod Langway, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Red Horner, D –
Elmer Lach, C – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star, assists (68)
Ken Hodge, RW – 1st All-star
Guy Carbonneau, C – Selke
Syd Howe, C/LW – 2nd All-star
Joe Hall, D – *1st All-star
Pete Mahovlich, C –
Jimmy Foster, G –
Hakan Loob, RW – 1st All-star
Leo Boivin, D –

9. monkey_00 ----Winnipeg Jets
Guy Lafleur, RW – Hart, Art Ross, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals, assists (11)
Martin Brodeur, G – Vezina, Jennings, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA
Larry Robinson, D – Norris, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (24)
Bobby Clarke, C – Hart, Selke, 1st All-star, assists (23)
Luc Robitaille, LW – 1st All-star
Borje Salming, D – 1st All-star (74)
Alex Delvecchio, C/LW – 2nd All-star (82)
Marcel Pronovost, D – 1st All-star
Igor Larionov, C – **Hart, **1st All-star
Vladimir Krutov, LW – **Hart, **1st All-star
Yvon Cournoyer, RW – Conn Smythe, 2nd All-star (98)
Sidney Crosby, F – Dropped
Rick MacLeish, C –
Mark Recchi, RW – 2nd All-star, assists
Tony Esposito, G – Vezina, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (79)
Terry O’Reilly, RW –
Todd Bertuzzi, RW/LW – 1st All-star
Zdeno Chara, D –
Kjell Samuelsson, D –
Butch Goring, C – Conn Smythe
Steve Smith, D –

10. Herby -------------Los Angeles Kings
Eddie Shore, D – Hart, *Norris, 1st All-star (10)
Marcel Dionne, C – Art Ross, 1st All-star (38)
Vladislav Tretiak, G - ** MVP, 1st All-star
Steve Yzerman, C – Selke, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (78)
Pavel Bure, RW – Richard, 1st All-star, goals
Chris Pronger, D – Hart, Norris, 1st All-star
Bill Cook, RW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals, assists* (*WCHL) (44)
Brian Leetch, D – Norris, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (71)
Denis Savard, C – 2nd All-star
Scott Niedermayer, D – 2nd All-star
Tim Kerr, RW/C – 2nd All-star
Adam Foote, D –
Ziggy Palffy, RW –
Rick Tocchet, RW –
Joe Thorton, C – 2nd All-star
Dave Taylor, RW – 2nd All-star
Markus Naslund, LW/RW – 1st All-star
Ed Jovanovski, D –
John Madden, C – Selke
Mike Richter, G – wins

11. Jbd3939 --------- Pittsburgh Penguins
Patrick Roy, G - Vezina, Jennings, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (35)
Mike Bossy, RW – Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, goals (20)
Viachaslav Fetisov, D - **Hart, **Norris, **1st All-star
Jari Kurri, RW – 1st All-star, goals (50)
Dino Ciccarelli, RW –
Pat Lafontaine, C – 2nd All-star
Boris Mikhailov, RW - ** MVP, Scoring, 1st All-star
Rob Blake, D – Norris, 1st All-star
Sergei Gonchar, D – 2nd All-star
Billy Smith, G – Vezina, Jennings, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins (80)
Peter Bondra, RW – goals
Ulf Samuelsson, D –
John LeClair, LW – 1st All-star
Sergei Zubov, D –
Dany Heatley, RW –
Jason Allison, C –
Ilya Kovalchuk, LW –
Alexei Kovalev, RW –
Sandis Ozolinsh, D – 1st All-star

12. BM67------------- New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull, LW – Hart, Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals (8)
Mark Messier, C – Hart, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (12)
Red Kelly, D – Norris, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star (22)
Ken Dryden, G – Vezina, Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (25)
Dickie Moore, LW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals, assists (31)
Charlie Conacher, RW – Art Ross, 1st All-star, goals (36)
Nels Stewart, C – Hart, Art Ross, *Conn Smythe, goals (51)
Andy Bathgate, RW – Hart, 1st All-star, assists (58)
Earl Seibert, D - *Norris, 1st All-star (72)
Lionel Conacher, D – *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star
Turk Broda, G – Vezina, *Conn Smythe, 1st All-star, wins, shutouts, GAA (60)
Alexei Kasatonov, D – **1st All-star
Dave Keon, C – Conn Smythe, 2nd All-star (69)
Vaclav Nedomanksy, RW/C –
Ted “Teeder” Kennedy, C – *Conn Smythe, 2nd All-star, assists (57)
Sprague Cleghorn, D – (88)
Rick Middleton, RW – 2nd All-star
Bill Gadsby, D – 1st All-star (99)
Babe Siebert, LW/D – Hart, 1st All-star
John Tonelli, LW – 2nd All-star

monkey_00*
11-09-2003, 08:45 PM
The probllem with your defense is they are lacking in terms of footspeed with Chara and Samuelson. The Nordiques would absolutely kill those two guys and blow right by them. They would be quite good at taking the body however although Chara isn't much of a hitter.

is there anyway in which someone could place the rosters on the same page (like was done at first) that would really help with rating them.
================

What makes you think I would play those two together?........If you look at my line combinations and How I have my defencemen paired up I have Chara paired up with Larry Robinson and then my second pairing of defencemen are the two Swedes; Kjell Samuelsson and Borje Salming.......I also think that a couple of you guys here are under-estimating my Two Goalies.......First Martin Brodeur is the best Goalie today and secondly Tony Esposito (my backup) holds the modern day record for Goalie shutouts with 15 which he set in the 1969-70 NHL season..........

Again I only became the GM of this team later on in the draft and there's a few players that I'm almost certain that I would have not selected like Rick MacLeish and Mark Recchi as well as Marcel Pronovost on defence........when Pronovost was selected in the draft there were quite a few other defencemen that I would have selected if I was GM of this team from the start of the draft............

The other thing as well is before I was involved with the draft I was sending over some ideas for players to draft for Gilmour's_Way team cause at that stage I wasn't GM yet of my Winnipeg Jets......He ended up drafting quite a few players that I had suggested he draft......and those would have been players that I would have selected as well like Doug Wilson on defence for example and Rick Vaive up front.......Oh well.....that's just the way it goes I guess............

Larionov and Krutov I don't mind having cause the would be from their pre-NHL days when they were in their prime and adding the Roadrunner to that line almost guarantees right there that I have the fastest skating line of ALL the teams in this draft so I would have these 3 guys on the ice whenever Samuelsson or Chara was out on the ice for my defence........I also have a pretty awsome Crash-and-Bang line that can also scores points with Goring Centering Bertuzzi and O'Reilly.....My top line is as good as anybodies out there with Bobby Clarke centering Guy LaFleur and probably the most under-rated leftwinger of alltime Luc Robitaille..........My fourth line consist of players that I didn't draft and that I would never have drafted if I was involved with this draft right from the start.............

M.Brodeur
T.Esposito

L.Robinson-Z.Chara
K.Samuelsson-B.Salming
S.Smith-M.Pronovost

L.Robitaille-B.Clarke-G.LaFleur
V.Krutov-I.Larionov-Y.Cournoyer
T.Bertuzzi-B.Goring-T.O'Reilly
R.MacLeish-A.Delvecchio-M.Recchi

The players in bold were the players I drafted......when I first took over this team I noticed right away that they were a bit on the smallish-side (excluding Robinson) so I felt I had to do something to remedy the situation or my team was going to be pushed around..........

Players that I would have not drafted if I was involved with this draft from the start include:

M.Pronovost
R.MacLeish
A.Delvechhio
M.Recchi

...and even though I don't mind having the two Russians on my squad I'm almost positive that I would have not gone for Larionov and Krutov as well............

I like the first few guys that were drafted like Lafleur, Clarke, Robinson, Salming and Brodeur......but if I was involved with this draft from the start I would have been targeting players like Dominic Hasek as my starting Goalie...........Robinson and Salming would be 2 that I would aim on the blueline as well I would have gone for Doug Wilson cause he was deadly on the Powerplay with that slapper of his.....others would be Rod Langway........and maybe Reed Larson and Craig Hartsburg would be others on my Radar..........as far as the forwards go I like Lafleur and Bobby Clarke and I also would have aimed for Denis Savard of the Hawks, Howie Morenz and Joe Malone of the Habs and Hamilton native and 1920s Goal scoring machine Cecil babe Dye which I could have drafted when I took over this team of mine but seeing how small they were overall I felt I had to draft BIGGER players so that's why I went with Todd Bertuzzi and Terry O'Reilly.....Rick Vaive is another I would have been aiming for as well........

Anyhow this draft was alot of fun...........thanks.

Cheers!~

monkey_00

monkey_00*
11-09-2003, 08:57 PM
............One more thing.........since I took over this team as it's new Owner and GM I would now like to transfer this Winnipeg Jets team of mine to my hometown of Hamilton Ontario and call them the Hamilton Tigers..........thanks.........also my Captain is Bobby Clarke and my 2-assistant captains are Larry Robinson and Todd Bertuzzi.

Cheers!~

monkey_00
:D

Frightened Inmate #2
11-10-2003, 03:23 PM
M.Brodeur
T.Esposito

L.Robinson-Z.Chara
K.Samuelsson-B.Salming
S.Smith-M.Pronovost

L.Robitaille-B.Clarke-G.LaFleur
V.Krutov-I.Larionov-Y.Cournoyer
T.Bertuzzi-B.Goring-T.O'Reilly
R.MacLeish-A.Delvecchio-M.Recchi

Brodeur is a great goaltender but I don't think he is an all time great. He has yet to prove to me that he can win behind a weak team and carry a team on his back. And Tony Esposito got the 15 shutouts when the average goals scored in a game was like 1.5 for each team and they often faced teams such as St. Louis and the Oakland Seals who were in all honesty crap, it would be interesting to see who he played for those shutouts actually.

------------------------------------------------------------------

I would take Hasek over Brodeur just becuase he has shown he can carry a team (Buffalo) to the cup finals.

Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-Kevin Stevens (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)- Vladimir Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)- Al Iafrate (D)- Jan Suchy

Starting Goaltender - Dominik Hasek
Backup Goaltender - Pelle Lindbergh

There is also no way in which V.Krutov-I.Larionov-Y.Cournoyer is faster than the Kharlamov - Perreault - Maltsev line and the Pony Line at the same time is nothing to look down upon in terms of speed. I know this sounds like i am tooting my own horn but there is no doubt in my mind that I have the best set of forwards in this draft. howe was a great fighter, one of the best if not the best of his time and Stevens was also very tough and Forsberg can play a tough game at times too. And the Fourth Line is what seperates me from the pack The best Pest in NHL History bar none (who could also score pretty darn good) with one of the best two way palyer in soviet history and Provost who was considered to be the best defensive forward during his time.

The Defense isn't bad but they are not physically imposing in any way which is a problem. However Iafrate would be money on the PP just due to his shot and Clapper is no slouch at the same time when it comes to offensive abilities.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Some ratings

Detroit Red Wings
Defense - A+ very well ballensed and Bobby is the best d-man ever.
Forwards - B+ Very good and well rounded but lacking a pest and a two way player line (other than Lemaire)
Goaltender - C+ Vernon and Belfour just don't cut it, both barely make top 7 of their generation
Overall - B+

Detroit Red Wings
Defense - B+ Lowe and Desjardins are two very glaring weaknesses.
Offense - A- Very Small that is the only real problem, good depth (well there better be) and skill but there is no real power forward.
Goaltender - B Cheevers is just not a top end goaltender (very clutch though)
Overall B+

Quebec Nordiques
Defence - C+ Lacking size is a major concern. Suchy is a very good pcik however for his puck rushing skills (he is often called the European Bobby Orr) and they would be very good on the PP
Forwards - A+ I know I am biased but the only weak spot might be the right wing on the second line but it is still filled with a very good player who was shown to have chemistry with the Bentleys. Good toughness and peskieness.
Goaltenders - B Hasek was the best of his time IMO and could carry a team. Pelle showed he could be great in the short time he was around.
Overall - A-

Vancouver Millionaires
Forwards - B Too many players from early years and it just seems to me as though it was an entirely different game. Tough guys also lacking.
Defense - B - Bottom four does look weak.
Goaltender - B - Roy Worters is the weak link in my opinion.

Boston Bruins
Goal - C they played in a different time and i don't think that Hainsworth in particular would fare well.
Defence: B- Bottom Two are very weak.
Forwards: B+ Very good (it takes a lot to get an A from me
Overall: B

Will Do the Rest Later, Until then it is off to study Sauve v. R. Any lawyers in the house.

BM67
11-10-2003, 06:35 PM
And Tony Esposito got the 15 shutouts when the average goals scored in a game was like 1.5 for each team and they often faced teams such as St. Louis and the Oakland Seals who were in all honesty crap, it would be interesting to see who he played for those shutouts actually.

Vancouver Millionaires
Forwards - B Too many players from early years and it just seems to me as though it was an entirely different game. Tough guys also lacking.

Boston Bruins
Goal - C they played in a different time and i don't think that Hainsworth in particular would fare well.


Tony had 15 shutouts and the next best was 6, so it wasn't just the year he was playing in. He also led the league in GAA, 2.17 (so your 1.5 is a bit off), and wins, 38. The fact that he didn't follow it up with a great playoff is one thing that seperates him from those ahead of him on the all-time greats list.

Don't be so quick to dismiss the old time players, put most of the modern players in old skates and on bad ice and they probably wouldn't fair too good against a lot of the oldies.

Frightened Inmate #2
11-10-2003, 07:26 PM
Todays athletes are much better trained and they spend quite frankly half of their lives preparing for the game of hockey. it would be quite nieve to think they didn't possess more abilities than someone 80 years ago if you ask me.

BM67
11-11-2003, 05:50 AM
Todays athletes are much better trained and they spend quite frankly half of their lives preparing for the game of hockey. it would be quite nieve to think they didn't possess more abilities than someone 80 years ago if you ask me.

It's rather naive to think that when they complain about travel today, when they tavel in luxury, that they would like to travel by train.

There's one HoFer, not sure who right now, that played on six teams at the same time, and won six championships. Do you really think he wasn't prepared to play hockey?

Give the oldtimers a month of training camp and they'll make more of an adjustment to our game than most modern players will to the "barbaric" conditions of back then.

Bobby Hull didn't have the modern advantages that Brett has now, but he could still shoot and skate better than his son can.

The oldtime players didn't have the slapshot as a weapon, so they had to rely on accuracy rather than power, although their wristshots could still be hard and heavy. Players from the 70s were much better at roofing the puck than players are today, so they would be better prepared to handle modern goalies that go down much more than they did in the past.

How would Hasek fair with small pads and no mask, against players that can put the puck up better than they can today?

In the old days players that started the game only came off for short rests, playing for 40-50 minutes a game. Like to see the modern players, that take shifts of less than a minute, try that.

You don't have to equate a dominant oldtimer to the same level as a dominant modern player, but you can't just say he's an oldtimer so he's a cut below. If you can, then we might as well redo this just taking modern players.

Frightened Inmate #2
11-11-2003, 06:40 AM
It's rather naive to think that when they complain about travel today, when they tavel in luxury, that they would like to travel by train.

There's one HoFer, not sure who right now, that played on six teams at the same time, and won six championships. Do you really think he wasn't prepared to play hockey?

Give the oldtimers a month of training camp and they'll make more of an adjustment to our game than most modern players will to the "barbaric" conditions of back then.

Bobby Hull didn't have the modern advantages that Brett has now, but he could still shoot and skate better than his son can.

The oldtime players didn't have the slapshot as a weapon, so they had to rely on accuracy rather than power, although their wristshots could still be hard and heavy. Players from the 70s were much better at roofing the puck than players are today, so they would be better prepared to handle modern goalies that go down much more than they did in the past.

How would Hasek fair with small pads and no mask, against players that can put the puck up better than they can today?

In the old days players that started the game only came off for short rests, playing for 40-50 minutes a game. Like to see the modern players, that take shifts of less than a minute, try that.

You don't have to equate a dominant oldtimer to the same level as a dominant modern player, but you can't just say he's an oldtimer so he's a cut below. If you can, then we might as well redo this just taking modern players.

Well if you read any statements from the old guys they themselves say the game had changed and the players of the 50s were faster stronger and better hockey players. I will look up the interview for you but its just my opinion that the players of today are better players.

and when i say today i mean from about the 40s/50s - today

BM67
11-11-2003, 07:28 AM
Well if you read any statements from the old guys they themselves say the game had changed and the players of the 50s were faster stronger and better hockey players. I will look up the interview for you but its just my opinion that the players of today are better players.

and when i say today i mean from about the 40s/50s - today

Yes players are generally bigger and stronger, but that is true going from the 70s to the 90s as well.

Doug Harvey was one of the strongest players in his day, and he was only 5'11", 175. Would that make him a liability to his team?

Lionel Conacher is a HoFer in hockey, football, & lacrosse and was an undefeated boxer and wrestler, do you really think he'd have trouble with the players of today?

Are you going to give Dave Andrechuk bigger marks for his 600+ goals, over Charlie Conacher's five goal scoring titles in the 30's, because modern players are better skaters? :lol:

Most of the things that give modern players an advantage will be equalized when we have to grow these guys from test tubes anyway.

Frightened Inmate #2
11-11-2003, 01:06 PM
Well who were the better players overall and I believe the todays players are vastly superiour to those of years gone by (early NHL) just due to the increased skill.

You can argue but it was a different game where there was a freaking rover and the players were drifters.

BM67
11-11-2003, 02:13 PM
Well who were the better players overall and I believe the todays players are vastly superiour to those of years gone by (early NHL) just due to the increased skill.

You can argue but it was a different game where there was a freaking rover and the players were drifters.

Todays players are not vastly superiour in skill. They have have better diet, equipment and training, and they can spend their off season training instead of working another job, but they are only marginally more skilled, if at all, than players from the first years of the NHL. They are bigger and stronger because of nutrition and workouts to add muscle, but Bobby Hull broke into the League almost 50 years ago and there's still nobody that can skate and shoot better than him, even with the new skates and sticks. When Bobby was in his prime it was said the major difference between watching him and Howie Morenz skate was the colour of their jerseys.

The Rover was dropped by the NHA in 1911, and was never used in the NHL. The PCHA used the rover up until 1926 and as such it was sometimes used in Stanley Cup matches between the leagues until then. I can think of only 3 selected players off the top of my head that played before 1911 or in the PCHA.

Leaf Lander
11-11-2003, 03:18 PM
Forwards:Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard 978 544 421 965 1285 PO 133 82 44 126 188
Ron Francis 1651 536 1222 1758 965 PO 156 46 93 139 93 WC-A 10 2 5 7 2
Doug Gilmour 1474 450 964 1414 1301 PO 182 60 128 188 235 CanCup 8 2 0 2 4 WC-A 9 1 4 5 18 Switz 9 2 13 15 16
Wendel Clark 793 330 234 564 1690 PO 95 37 32 69 201
Busher Jackson 633 241 234 475 437 PO 71 18 12 30 53
Mats Sundin 1005 434 580 1014 817 PO 74 31 34 65 64 WC-A 40 19 26 45 30 CanCup 6 2 4 6 16 WCup 4 4 3 7 4 OLY 8 8 4 12 14 Swe 46 17 10 27 30 PO 8 7 0 7 4
Eric Lindros 639 346 439 785 1225 PO 50 24 33 57 118 WC-A 8 11 6 17 10 OLY 12 3 3 6 10 WCup 8 3 3 6 10
Dave Andreychuk 1515 613 668 1281 1067 PO 139 42 41 83 148 WC-A 10 3 2 5 18
Rick Vaive WHA 75 26 33 59 248 NHL 876 441 347 788 1445 PO 54 27 16 43 111 WC-A 19 9 3 12 28
Ken Linseman WHA 71 38 38 76 126 PO 5 2 2 4 15 NHL 860 256 551 807 1727 PO 113 43 77 120 325 CanCup 4 0 1 1 4 Italy 5 3 3 6 4
Joel Otto 943 195 313 508 1934 PO 122 27 47 74 207 WC-A 19 4 5 9 10 CanCup 13 4 2 6 6 WCup 7 1 2 3 6 OLY 4 0 0 0 0
Joe Nieuwendyk 1113 511 501 1012 601 PO 149 60 50 110 87 WC-A 1 0 0 0 0 OLY 12 3 4 7 2
Forwards: New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull NHL 1,063 610 560 1170 640 PO 119 62 67 129 102 WHA 411 303 335 638 183 PO 60 43 37 80 38 Sum74 8 7 2 9 0 CanCup 7 5 3 8 2
Mark Messier NHL 1680 676 1168 1844 1868 PO 236 109 186 295 244 WHA 52 1 10 11 58 WC-A 6 3 3 6 8 CanCup 25 5 16 21 24 WCup 7 1 4 5 12
Dickie Moore 719 261 347 608 652 PO 135 46 64 110 122
Charlie Conacher 459 225 173 398 523 PO 49 17 18 35 49
Nels Stewart 650 324 191 515 953 PO 54 15 13 28 61
Andy Bathgate NHL 1069 349 624 973 624 PO 54 21 14 35 76 WHA 11 1 6 7 2
Dave Keon NHL 1296 396 590 986 117 PO 92 32 36 68 6 WHA 301 102 189 291 20 PO 36 13 23 36 8
Vaclav Nedomansky NHL 421 122 156 278 88 PO 7 3 5 8 0 WHA 252 135 118 253 43 PO 6 3 1 4 9 Czech* 419 369 159 528 55 PO 22 16 9 25 9 WC-A 80 67 34 101 51 OLY 13 13 5 18 4
Ted Kennedy 696 231 329 560 432 PO 78 29 31 60 32
Rick Middleton 1005 448 540 988 157 PO 114 45 55 100 19 CanCup 14 5 6 11 0
Babe Siebert 592 140 156 296 982 PO 53 8 7 15 65
John Tonelli NHL 1028 325 511 836 911 PO 172 40 75 115 200 WHA 224 64 86 150 278 PO 34 11 14 25 38 CanCup 8 3 6 9 2
Totals
NHL: GP 12,480 G 4,897 A 6,474 Pts 11,371 PIM 14,494 PO GP 1,182 G 497 A 607 Pts 1,104 PIM 1,830
NHL: GP 10,678 G 4,107 A 5,345 Pts 9,452 PIM 7,947 PO GP 1,163 G 427 A 571 Pts 998 PIM 976
WHA: GP 146 G 64 A 71 Pts 135 PIM 374 PO GP 5 G 2 A 2 Pts 4 PIM 15
WHA: GP 1,251 G 606 A 744 Pts 1,350 PIM 584 PO GP 136 G 70 A 75 Pts 145 PIM 93
Eur: GP 60 G 22 A 26 Pts 48 PIM 50 PO GP 8 G 7 A 0 Pts 7 PIM 4
Eur*: GP 419 G 369 A 159 Pts 528 PIM 55 PO GP 22 G 16 A 9 Pts 25 PIM 9
WC-A: GP 116 G 46 A 51 Pts 97 PIM 116
WC-A: GP 86 G 70 A 37 Pts 107 PIM 59
CanCup: GP 31 G 8 A 7 Pts 15 PIM 30
CanCup: GP 54 G 18 A 31 Pts 49 PIM 28
WCup: GP 19 G 8 A 8 Pts 16 PIM 20
WCup: GP 7 G 1 A 4 Pts 5 PIM 12
OLY: GP 36 G 14 A 11 Pts 25 PIM 26
OLY: GP 13 G 13 A 5 Pts 18 PIM 4
Sum74: GP 8 G 7 A 2 Pts 9 PIM 0
All: GP 12,888 G 5,149 A 6,648 Pts 11,797 PIM 15,110 PO GP 1,195 G 506 A 609 Pts 1,015 PIM 1,849
All*: GP 12,516 G 5,191 A 6,327 Pts 11,518 PIM 8,689 PO GP 1,321 G 513 A 655 Pts 1,168 PIM 1,078
* incomplete stats

Defensemen: Toronto Maple Leafs
Al MacInnis 1413 340 932 1272 1495 PO 177 39 121 160 255 WC-A 9 1 3 4 10 CanCup 8 2 4 6 23 OLY 12 2 0 2 10
Scott Stevens 1597 193 703 896 2763 PO 233 26 92 118 402 WC-A 27 3 6 9 18 CanCup 8 1 0 1 4 WCup 8 0 2 2 4 OLY 6 0 0 0 2
Doug Wilson 1024 237 590 827 830 PO 95 19 61 80 88 CanCup 7 2 1 3 4
Randy Carlyle 1055 148 499 647 1400 PO 69 9 24 33 120 WC-A 9 1 4 5 4
Carl Brewer WHA 77 2 23 25 42 PO 12 0 4 4 11 NHL 604 25 198 223 1037 PO 72 3 17 20 146 WC-A 7 1 6 7 10 Fin 20 4 14 18 53
Derian Hatcher 827 71 223 294 1380 PO 100 6 21 27 161 WC-A 6 1 2 3 8 WCup 6 3 2 5 10 OLY 8 0 4 4 12
Defensemen: New Jersey Devils
Red Kelly 1316 281 542 823 327 PO 164 33 59 92 51
Alexei Kasatonov 383 38 122 160 326 PO 33 4 7 11 40 USSR 576 124 219 343 386 PO 1 0 0 0 0 WC-A 77 18 34 52 69 SuperS 24 4 12 16 18 OLY 21 7 14 21 8 Can Cup 27 3 19 22 20
Earl Seibert 645 89 187 276 746 PO 66 11 8 19 76
Lionel Conacher 498 80 105 185 882 PO 25 2 2 4 34
Sprague Cleghorn NHA 119 135 23 158 268 PO 2 0 0 0 12 NHL 181 95 34 129 142 PO 25 9 2 11 11
Bill Gadsby 1248 130 438 568 1539 PO 67 4 23 27 92
Totals
NHL: GP 6,520 G 1,014 A 3,145 Pts 4,159 PIM 8,905 PO GP 746 G 102 A 336 Pts 438 PIM 1,172
NHL: GP 4,271 G 713 A 1,428 Pts 2,141 PIM 3,962 PO GP 380 G 63 A 101 Pts 164 PIM 304
WHA: GP 77 G 2 A 23 Pts 25 PIM 42 PO GP 12 G 0 A 4 Pts 4 PIM 11
NHA: GP 119 G 135 A 23 Pts 158 PIM 268 PO GP 2 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 12
Eur: GP 20 G 4 A 14 Pts 18 PIM 53
Eur: GP 576 G 124 A 219 Pts 343 PIM 386 PO GP 1 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 0
WC-A: GP 58 G 7 A 21 Pts 28 PIM 50
WC-A: GP 77 G 18 A 34 Pts 52 PIM 69
CanCup: GP 23 G 5 A 5 Pts 10 PIM 31
CanCup: GP 27 G 3 A 19 Pts 22 PIM 20
WCup: GP 14 G 3 A 4 Pts 7 PIM 14
SuperS: GP 24 G 4 A 12 Pts 16 PIM 18
OLY: GP 26 G 2 A 4 Pts 6 PIM 24
OLY: GP 21 G 7 A 14 Pts 21 PIM 8
All: GP 6,738 G 1,037 A 3,216 Pts 4,253 PIM 9,119 PO GP 758 G 102 A 340 Pts 442 PIM 1,183
All: GP 5,115 G 1,004 A 1,749 Pts 2,753 PIM 4,731 PO GP 383 G 63 A 101 Pts 164 PIM 316

Goalies: Toronto Maple Leafs
Terry Sawchuck 972 446 332 171 2.51 103 PO 106 54 48 2.54 12
Grant Fuhr 868 403 295 114 3.38 25 PO 150 92 50 2.92 6 WC-A 5 1 3 1 3.62 1 CanCup 11 7 1 3 3.00 0
Goalies: New Jersey Devils
Ken Dryden 397 258 57 74 2.24 46 PO 112 80 32 2.40 10 WC-A 2 1 1 0 2.00 1 Sum72 4 2 2 0 4.75 0
Turk Broda 629 302 224 101 2.53 62 PO 101 60 39 1.98 13
Totals
NHL: GP 1,840 W 849 L 627 T 285 GAA 2.91 SO 128 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
NHL: GP 1,026 W 560 L 281 T 175 GAA 2.42 SO 108 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23
WC-A: GP 5 W 1 L 3 T 1 GAA 3.62 SO 1
WC-A: GP 2 W 1 L 1 T 0 GAA 2.00 SO 1
CanCup: GP 11 W 7 L 1 T 3 GAA 3.00 SO 0
Sum72: GP 4 W 2 L 2 T 0 GAA 4.75 SO 0
All: GP 1,856 W 857 L 631 T 289 GAA 2.91 SO 129 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
All: GP 1,032 W 563 L 284 T 175 GAA 2.43 SO 109 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23

Team: GP 19,626 G 6,186 A 9,864 Pts 16,050 PIM 24,229 PO GP 1,953 G 608 A 949 Pts 1,557 PIM 3,032
Team*: GP 17,613 G 6,195 A 8,076 Pts 14,271 PIM 13,420 PO GP 1,704 G 576 A 756 Pts 1,332 PIM 1,394

When you consider all the players I selected from when scoring was down and assists were given sparingly, I'm surprised how well I stack up. The defense is so short of assists that it's pretty hard to compare the two teams there, but the forwards come out pretty even, and any adjustments for era would likely leave me well ahead there.

One thing that really stands out is that Toronto needs a major upgrade on the PK unit, because they take a huge pile of penalties. They take over 60% more than my team per RS game and it climbs to almost 90% more in the playoffs.


Good job

NHL: GP 6,520 G 1,014 A 3,145 Pts 4,159

PIM 8,905

PO GP 746 G 102 A 336 Pts 438 PIM 1,172

NHL: GP 4,271 G 713 A 1,428 Pts 2,141

PIM 3,962

PO GP 380 G 63 A 101 Pts 164 PIM 304

Comparing your team NHL Point totals to mine is ridiculous.

My team I blow your team out of the water. My team including nhl Playoff point totals is doubled yours.


This is what I based my team on then adding some quality performers at the end. Some of my players are still active so I beleive that I will infact double your reg season point totals eventually.


I'll compare my teams NHL Point totals with any other teams.

If you keep the puck out of the net and shut the other teamsdown with good d-man and put the puck i nthe net more then other teams .You will win!

sorry been pretty much away from the boards because of school
All teams are great and #12 could beat #1 any day

I think we should all make note of that!

monkey_00*
11-11-2003, 03:29 PM
[QUOTE=Maxwell Edison]Brodeur is a great goaltender but I don't think he is an all time great. He has yet to prove to me that he can win behind a weak team and carry a team on his back. And Tony Esposito got the 15 shutouts when the average goals scored in a game was like 1.5 for each team and they often faced teams such as St. Louis and the Oakland Seals who were in all honesty crap, it would be interesting to see who he played for those shutouts actually.

------------------------------------------------------------------

I would take Hasek over Brodeur just becuase he has shown he can carry a team (Buffalo) to the cup finals.

Scoring 1 - (LW)-Valeri Kharlamov (C)-Gilbert Perreault (RW)- Aleksander Maltsev
Scoring 1 - (LW)-Doug Bentley (C)-Max Bentley (RW)- Bill Mosienko
Checking - (LW)-Kevin Stevens (C)-Peter Forsberg (RW)-Gordie Howe
Grind/Two Way - (LW)- Esa Tikkanen (C)- Vladimir Petrov (RW)- Claude Provost

(D)-Dit Clapper (D)- King Clancey
(D)- Vladimir Lutchenko (D)- Babe Pratt
(D)- Al Iafrate (D)- Jan Suchy

Starting Goaltender - Dominik Hasek
Backup Goaltender - Pelle Lindbergh

There is also no way in which V.Krutov-I.Larionov-Y.Cournoyer is faster than the Kharlamov - Perreault - Maltsev line and the Pony Line at the same time is nothing to look down upon in terms of speed. I know this sounds like i am tooting my own horn but there is no doubt in my mind that I have the best set of forwards in this draft. howe was a great fighter, one of the best if not the best of his time and Stevens was also very tough and Forsberg can play a tough game at times too. And the Fourth Line is what seperates me from the pack The best Pest in NHL History bar none (who could also score pretty darn good) with one of the best two way palyer in soviet history and Provost who was considered to be the best defensive forward during his time.

The Defense isn't bad but they are not physically imposing in any way which is a problem. However Iafrate would be money on the PP just due to his shot and Clapper is no slouch at the same time when it comes to offensive abilities.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Matin Brodeur NOT an Alltime great?.........Ummmm ok.....at 31 he's already got 3-Stanley Cups in a 30-team NHL....and the way athletes take care of themselves these days he could go on playing until he's 40-years of age.......You say that Brodeur hasn't had to carry the Devils like Hasek did with the Sabres but that's not entirely true either...No one on the Devils squad exactly sticks out at you.........I mean they won 3-Stanley Cups but you don't see any Mario Lemieux, Wayne Gretzky or Gordie Howe-type of players playing with New jersey either.....If you ask anybody on that New jersey team who their team MVP is I'm almost willing to bet you anything that MOST of them will tell you that it's Martin Brodeur........as well Brodeur holds NHL record for most consecutive 30+ wins seasons with (8) and this season could make it 9-straight seasons.......Hasek was great and I love the guy BUT Brodeur has 3-Stanley Cups against Hasek's 1........If you ask me I think between are two starters I might make it a draw cause you can't forget the amount of Vezinas Hasek won..........the next thing you have to look at are the backups........Lindberg only played 157-games in the NHL in 5-seasons and 2 of those 5-seasons he played only 8-games each and they being his first and last seasons in the NHL.......on the other hand Tony Esposito played in 16 NHL seasons and registered 70-shutouts in his stellar career compared to only 5-shutouts for Lindbergh........I think it's safe to say here that my tandem of Brodeur-Esposito is better overall than the tandem of Hasek-Lindberg.........

Someone mentioned something about "foot speed" when it came to my defencemen.....all I have to say here is I have the biggest group of defenders of ALL the teams in this draft and that would be to my advantage if we would somehow be able to have a little tournament between all of our teams here........the players in today's NHL are bigger and stronger than ever and the reason the trend has continued in this direction with NHL clubs drafting bigger players is because most of the time if you have 2-teams of equal talents and skill playing against each other the bigger stronger teams more times than not come out on top......Guys like Samuelsson and Chara make up for this lack of speed with great positional play plus I also have each of these two Giants paired up with someone else that's a better skater like Robinson with Chara AND Samuelsson with Salming........on the powerplay I would keep the Robinson-Chara duo intact however I would replace Samuelsson with Steve Smith and pair him up with Salming on the second unit.......another thing that I could do if I was coaching this team and we had the powerplay and were pressed to score a goal I would even pair up Robinson with Salming and have Pronovost with Smith on the second unit..........

My powerplay would also cause some serious damage.....I can have Bobby Clarke who is probably one of the best 2-way players of all time paired up with Lafleur who was deadly on Montreal's powerplay and have a big power-forward like Todd Bertuzzi stand in front of the other team's Net causing all sorts of havoc there...........

Getting to your point about comparing the speed of my Krutov-Larionov-Cournoyer line against your line of Valeri Kharlamov-Gilbert Perreault-Aleksander Maltsev.........my two Russians would be the ones from their PRE-NHL days cause that's when they were both in their primes...most people in here might be assuming that they are the Larionov and the Krutov from their NHL days which I wouldn't use...they would be from their pre-NHL days and I say they are just as fast as your 2-Russian hockey players......so it boils down to comparing the speed of Gilbert Perreault and Yvon Cournoyer......Cournoyer in his day was the fastest skater in the NHL...they didn't call him the "Roadrunner" for nothing......both our lines are fast but I would give the edge here to mine.............

If our two clubs were playing one another and I was the home team; meaning I get the last chance for line changes, I would match-up my lines to yours as follows:

Your line on the ice: V Kharlamov-G Perreault-A Maltsev
My line on the ice: V.Krutov-I.Larionov-Y.Cournoyer
My defence on ice: K.Samuelsson-B.Salming

Your line on the ice: K Stevens-P Forsberg-G Howe
My line on the ice: T.Bertuzzi-B.Goring-T.O'Reilly
My defence on ice: L.Robinson-Z.Chara

Your line on the ice: D Bentley-M Bentley-B Mosienko
My Line on the ice: L.Robitaille-B.Clarke-G.Lafleur
My defence on ice: S.Smith-M.Pronovost

Your line on the ice: E Tikkanen-V Petrov-C Provost
My line on the ice: R.MacLeish-A.Delvecchio-M.Recchi

The other thing to remember here is Martin Brodeur is a better handler of the puck than either Hasek or Lindbergh which comes in nice and handy when were killing off the Penalty minutes.........

My Powerplay units are as follows:

1) Bertuzzi-Clarke-Lafleur...Robinson-Salming
2) Krutov-Larionov-O'Reilly...Smith-Pronovost

I'd have at least one of my Big guys stand in front of your Net during the powerplay sessions....Bertuzzi on the 1st-unit and O'Reilly on the 2nd......

My Penalty killing units are as follows:

1) Goring-Cournoyer...Robinson-Chara
2) Recchi-Robitaille...Samuelsson-Salming

This is fun.

Cheers!~

monkey_00

Frightened Inmate #2
11-11-2003, 07:20 PM
First thing could you change your font it is killing me to read.

I know you were talking about their pre-NHl days by the way but I heard they were not the fastest soviet players even in their hayday. And think of the defence on that line. Cournoyer was the worst forward in his own end (if he ever met it) and only really made up for it with his offensive abilities.

Brodeur may have great stats but he has been playing behind a great team, i don't see how you can question that. From the 80's/90's I would rather have: Fuhr, Roy, or Hasek. At his prime there is no way he would be better than Hasek. No offense but the New Jersey teams he played with had players including Elias, Gomez, Mogilny, Arnott, Sykora, Stevens, Niedermayer, Madden, Holik, Guerin, Gilmour. They has a very stong team which IMO greatly improved his statistics. Two years ago he was not considered a great and it was a question mark if he would make the olympics. Hasek singlehandidly (spelling) won a freaking olympic gold medal. He is vastly superiour to that of Brodeur.

Those are weak looking PK units by the way. Cournoyer is not very good at defense.

monkey_00*
11-11-2003, 09:24 PM
First thing could you change your font it is killing me to read.

I know you were talking about their pre-NHl days by the way but I heard they were not the fastest soviet players even in their hayday. And think of the defence on that line. Cournoyer was the worst forward in his own end (if he ever met it) and only really made up for it with his offensive abilities.

Brodeur may have great stats but he has been playing behind a great team, i don't see how you can question that. From the 80's/90's I would rather have: Fuhr, Roy, or Hasek. At his prime there is no way he would be better than Hasek. No offense but the New Jersey teams he played with had players including Elias, Gomez, Mogilny, Arnott, Sykora, Stevens, Niedermayer, Madden, Holik, Guerin, Gilmour. They has a very stong team which IMO greatly improved his statistics. Two years ago he was not considered a great and it was a question mark if he would make the olympics. Hasek singlehandidly (spelling) won a freaking olympic gold medal. He is vastly superiour to that of Brodeur.

Those are weak looking PK units by the way. Cournoyer is not very good at defense.-
------------------------------------------

Maxwell Edison..........

I like this new Font of mine......sorry.........

Getting back to the Hockey talk.........You make it sound like Yvon Cournoyer was Chop Liver or something....Let's not forget the guy did win a Conn Smythe trophy.......I would use him on my Penalty killing unit cause of the chances he would be able to create with his speed when my team was short-handed.........

Hasek I would give the edge over Brodeur and if this was my team to draft right from the start then that would have my first choice on my team and he would have been selected in the very first round...Brodeur is alot better Goalie then what Most people give him credit for including yourself....It's about time he won the Vezina last season he was long overdue.........and those players you listed for Jersey are good players, they are a good group but How many in that group would you say are future Hall-of-Famers? (excluding Gilmour and Mogilny cause these 2-players were there in Jersey for a Cup of tea and a biscuit)........The other question you should be asking yourself is "Where would the Devils be without the services of Martin Brodeur between the pipes?"....again I would give the edge to Hasek here but not by much but getting back to my original point regarding the Goaltending tandem, I still think my combo of Brodeur and Esposito are far more Superior to the tandem of Hasek-Lindbergh...........

The games I saw Larionov and Krutov play in Hamilton during the Canada Cups (Pre-NHL) these 2 guys looked like very fast skaters to me as well.......I still think you are going by their NHL days....by that time they were past their primes....you say that you "heard they were not the fastest soviet players even in their hayday"...where exactly did you hear this from anyways?....Just curious to see what source that you are using here.

Cheers!~

monkey_00

Frightened Inmate #2
11-12-2003, 05:41 AM
MY EYES!!!

but i am using a hockey encylopedia that i bought at chapters a while ago. Oh well different opinions regarding Brodeur I guess.

BM67
11-12-2003, 06:53 PM
Good job

NHL: GP 6,520 G 1,014 A 3,145 Pts 4,159 PIM 8,905 PO GP 746 G 102 A 336 Pts 438 PIM 1,172

NHL: GP 4,271 G 713 A 1,428 Pts 2,141 PIM 3,962 PO GP 380 G 63 A 101 Pts 164 PIM 304

Comparing your team NHL Point totals to mine is ridiculous.

My team I blow your team out of the water. My team including nhl Playoff point totals is doubled yours.

This is what I based my team on then adding some quality performers at the end. Some of my players are still active so I beleive that I will infact double your reg season point totals eventually.

I'll compare my teams NHL Point totals with any other teams.

All teams are great and #12 could beat #1 any day

I think we should all make note of that!

The stats you quoted are only the defensemen. If you drafted some players from other leagues besides the NHL, your stats would drop too. Consider that Cleghorn finished second in the league with 6 assists in 1920 and you'll see why my stats are so far behind. I will point out that my D is ahead of yours in goals per game as a better measure of comparison.

Just comparing stats is no way to rate teams. Who are the two best goal scorers on our teams? Hull and Richard easily. Yet Messier and Andrechuk have the highest goal totals. Most of you players played in one of the highest scoring periods in NHL history, and your stats are inflated because of it. Vaives 50 goal seasons are a pale imitation of Richard's and Hull's.

Season breakdown:
D: NHL: 100 WHA: 1 Fin: 1 Total: 102 F: NHL: 191 WHA: 2 Swe: 1 Ita: 1 Total: 195
D: NHL: 83 NHA: 7 USSR: 16 Total: 106 F: NHL: 178 WHA: 18 Czech: 13 Total: 209
Decade breakdown: D/F
1910-19: 0/0 8/0
1920-29: 0/0 13/8
1930-39: 0/10 16/30
1940-49: 0/12 12/10
1950-59: 2/10 20/24
1960-69: 7/1 15/35
1970-79: 10/3 3/31
1980-89: 35/53 10/33
1990-99: 36/81 8/13
2000-03: 12/24 0/4

Leaf Lander
11-16-2003, 09:08 AM
The stats you quoted are only the defensemen. If you drafted some players from other leagues besides the NHL, your stats would drop too. Consider that Cleghorn finished second in the league with 6 assists in 1920 and you'll see why my stats are so far behind. I will point out that my D is ahead of yours in goals per game as a better measure of comparison.

Just comparing stats is no way to rate teams. Who are the two best goal scorers on our teams? Hull and Richard easily. Yet Messier and Andrechuk have the highest goal totals. Most of you players played in one of the highest scoring periods in NHL history, and your stats are inflated because of it. Vaives 50 goal seasons are a pale imitation of Richard's and Hull's.

Season breakdown:
D: NHL: 100 WHA: 1 Fin: 1 Total: 102 F: NHL: 191 WHA: 2 Swe: 1 Ita: 1 Total: 195
D: NHL: 83 NHA: 7 USSR: 16 Total: 106 F: NHL: 178 WHA: 18 Czech: 13 Total: 209
Decade breakdown: D/F
1910-19: 0/0 8/0
1920-29: 0/0 13/8
1930-39: 0/10 16/30
1940-49: 0/12 12/10
1950-59: 2/10 20/24
1960-69: 7/1 15/35
1970-79: 10/3 3/31
1980-89: 35/53 10/33
1990-99: 36/81 8/13
2000-03: 12/24 0/4

My point was thats how I choose my team by stats and character Not by awards

so if i go and start looking at teams and grading them in comparison to mine. In that regards my team will prob be the greatest ever ;)

I don't got alot of time since I am in college but i was thinkign why were the point totals so low Francis and Gilmour have 3100 career points between them. I 'll do my tallies maybe later today for my team.

The important thing is we all picked players whom we like. Personally I would had loved to add Eddie shack or Tie Domi

BM67
11-16-2003, 09:50 AM
Equalized a bit by using adjusted scoring from Total Hockey. Only for NHL through 1999-2000 season, and only for regular season.

BY: is Best Year and is based only on highest adjusted point total
Forwards:Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard 18 677 497 1174 BY: 53 39 92
Ron Francis 19 442 869 1311 BY: 27 76 103
Doug Gilmour 17 395 701 1096 BY: 27 66 93
Wendel Clark 15 321 197 518 BY: 43 23 66
Busher Jackson 15 392 409 801 BY: 47 56 103
Mats Sundin 10 348 398 746 BY: 44 47 91
Eric Lindros 8 318 344 662 BY: 51 61 112
Dave Andreychuk 18 518 484 1002 BY: 49 36 85
Rick Vaive 13 367 424 609 BY: 42 28 70
Ken Linseman 14 210 383 593 BY: 19 45 64
Joel Otto 14 179 241 420 BY: 20 23 43
Joe Nieuwendyk 14 436 349 785 BY: 37 43 80
Forwards: New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull 16 699 535 1234 BY: 62 44 106
Mark Messier 21 572 847 1419 BY: 39 60 99
Dickie Moore 14 322 366 688 BY: 50 56 106
Charlie Conacher 12 396 332 728 BY: 64 36 100
Nels Stewart 15 594 496 1090 BY: 62 54 116
Andy Bathgate 17 421 641 1062 BY: 49 49 98
Dave Keon 18 419 521 940 BY: 38 32 70
Vaclav Nedomansky 6 103 110 213 BY: 30 28 58
Ted Kennedy 14 280 396 676 BY: 23 53 76
Rick Middleton 14 373 382 755 BY: 38 40 78
Babe Siebert 14 249 424 673 BY: 28 53 81
John Tonelli 14 270 358 628 BY: 34 40 74
Totals
Seasons 175 G 4,603 A 5,296 Pts 9,899 BY: G 459 A 543 Pts 1,002
Seasons 175 G 4,698 A 5,408 Pts 10,106 BY: G 517 A 545 Pts 1,062

Defensemen: Toronto Maple Leafs
Al MacInnis 19 287 628 915 BY: 26 57 83
Scott Stevens 18 161 505 666 BY: 17 47 64
Doug Wilson 16 198 415 613 BY: 31 31 62
Randy Carlyle 17 124 350 474 BY: 12 45 57
Carl Brewer 12 29 189 218 BY: 2 35 37
Derian Hatcher 9 61 144 205 BY: 7 24 31
Defensemen: New Jersey Devils
Red Kelly 20 349 600 949 BY: 23 49 72
Alexei Kasatonov 7 36 103 139 BY: 9 24 33
Earl Seibert 15 131 261 392 BY: 10 33 43
Lionel Conacher 12 147 292 439 BY: 14 47 61
Sprague Cleghorn 10 129 242 371 BY: 14 42 56
Bill Gadsby 20 161 480 641 BY: 12 50 62
Totals
Seasons 91 G 860 A 2,231 Pts 3,091 BY: G 95 A 239 Pts 334
Seasons 84 G 953 A 1,978 Pts 2,931 BY: G 82 A 245 Pts 327

Team
Seasons 266 G 5,445 A 7,527 Pts 12,990 BY: G 554 A 782 Pts 1,336
Seasons 259 G 5,651 A 7,386 Pts 13,037 BY: G 599 A 790 Pts 1,389

BM67
11-16-2003, 10:07 AM
My point was thats how I choose my team by stats and character Not by awards

so if i go and start looking at teams and grading them in comparison to mine. In that regards my team will prob be the greatest ever ;)

I don't got alot of time since I am in college but i was thinkign why were the point totals so low Francis and Gilmour have 3100 career points between them. I 'll do my tallies maybe later today for my team.

The important thing is we all picked players whom we like. Personally I would had loved to add Eddie shack or Tie Domi

Lindros is a "character" alright, but I sure wouldn't pick him based on his character.

Clark gives you goal scoring, leadership and a physical element, although not at a HoF level, but he is not very good at skating, passing or defense. I have several players that aren't as good as I'd like at skating, or defense, but you have more that I'd be concerned about in each case.

I have a solid checking/two-way line, while you don't, or at least I don't see one, and with the number of penalty minutes you're going to amass, you have a huge need for one.

I put the team totals at the end after the goalies, as I almost forgot to add them.

Leaf Lander
11-16-2003, 10:19 AM
Lindros is a "character" alright, but I sure wouldn't pick him based on his character.

Clark gives you goal scoring, leadership and a physical element, although not at a HoF level, but he is not very good at skating, passing or defense. I have several players that aren't as good as I'd like at skating, or defense, but you have more that I'd be concerned about in each case.

I have a solid checking/two-way line, while you don't, or at least I don't see one, and with the number of penalty minutes you're going to amass, you have a huge need for one.

I put the team totals at the end after the goalies, as I almost forgot to add them.


clark was a defenseman his prime years were the late 80's(Which was a dif brand of hockey then what you probably recall. I suspect you base your judgements on him based on his career from 94 and on but if you ask me he was just a shadow of his formerself.) which are the years I based the pick on and he does have chracter and leadership skills correct ty.

Your team will never get through my defense and will never score on my goalies

I win :D

BM67
11-16-2003, 11:03 AM
clark was a defenseman his prime years were the late 80's(Which was a dif brand of hockey then what you probably recall. I suspect you base your judgements on him based on his career from 94 and on but if you ask me he was just a shadow of his formerself.) which are the years I based the pick on and he does have chracter and leadership skills correct ty.

Your team will never get through my defense and will never score on my goalies

I win :D

Clark was drafted as a defenseman, but there's a reason he was moved to LW. :)

Clark's best years were probably 92 to 94. In the late 80s he was too stupid to not punch people in the helmet with a broken hand. :p

I'd give my team a better chance of getting through your defense and scoring on your goalies, than I would your team doing it against mine.

You win a lovely parting gift maybe! :shakehead

Leaf Lander
11-16-2003, 08:18 PM
Clark was drafted as a defenseman, but there's a reason he was moved to LW.

Clark's best years were probably 92 to 94. In the late 80s he was too stupid to not punch people in the helmet with a broken hand. :p

I'd give my team a better chance of getting through your defense and scoring on your goalies, than I would your team doing it against mine.

You win a lovely parting gift maybe! :shakehead


ok We will leave it to the hockey Gods

and we all know who God's Team is

The Toronto Maple Leafs :teach: :yo: :lol:

BM67
11-17-2003, 04:32 PM
Forwards:Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard 978 544 421 965 1285 PO 133 82 44 126 188
Ron Francis 1651 536 1222 1758 965 PO 156 46 93 139 93 WC-A 10 2 5 7 2
Doug Gilmour 1474 450 964 1414 1301 PO 182 60 128 188 235 CanCup 8 2 0 2 4 WC-A 9 1 4 5 18 Switz 9 2 13 15 16
Wendel Clark 793 330 234 564 1690 PO 95 37 32 69 201
Busher Jackson 633 241 234 475 437 PO 71 18 12 30 53
Mats Sundin 1005 434 580 1014 817 PO 74 31 34 65 64 WC-A 40 19 26 45 30 CanCup 6 2 4 6 16 WCup 4 4 3 7 4 OLY 8 8 4 12 14 Swe 46 17 10 27 30 PO 8 7 0 7 4
Eric Lindros 639 346 439 785 1225 PO 50 24 33 57 118 WC-A 8 11 6 17 10 OLY 12 3 3 6 10 WCup 8 3 3 6 10
Dave Andreychuk 1515 613 668 1281 1067 PO 139 42 41 83 148 WC-A 10 3 2 5 18
Rick Vaive WHA 75 26 33 59 248 NHL 876 441 347 788 1445 PO 54 27 16 43 111 WC-A 19 9 3 12 28
Ken Linseman WHA 71 38 38 76 126 PO 5 2 2 4 15 NHL 860 256 551 807 1727 PO 113 43 77 120 325 CanCup 4 0 1 1 4 Italy 5 3 3 6 4
Joel Otto 943 195 313 508 1934 PO 122 27 47 74 207 WC-A 19 4 5 9 10 CanCup 13 4 2 6 6 WCup 7 1 2 3 6 OLY 4 0 0 0 0
Joe Nieuwendyk 1113 511 501 1012 601 PO 149 60 50 110 87 WC-A 1 0 0 0 0 OLY 12 3 4 7 2
Forwards: New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull NHL 1,063 610 560 1170 640 PO 119 62 67 129 102 WHA 411 303 335 638 183 PO 60 43 37 80 38 Sum74 8 7 2 9 0 CanCup 7 5 3 8 2
Mark Messier NHL 1680 676 1168 1844 1868 PO 236 109 186 295 244 WHA 52 1 10 11 58 WC-A 6 3 3 6 8 CanCup 25 5 16 21 24 WCup 7 1 4 5 12
Dickie Moore 719 261 347 608 652 PO 135 46 64 110 122
Charlie Conacher 459 225 173 398 523 PO 49 17 18 35 49
Nels Stewart 650 324 191 515 953 PO 54 15 13 28 61
Andy Bathgate NHL 1069 349 624 973 624 PO 54 21 14 35 76 WHA 11 1 6 7 2
Dave Keon NHL 1296 396 590 986 117 PO 92 32 36 68 6 WHA 301 102 189 291 20 PO 36 13 23 36 8
Vaclav Nedomansky NHL 421 122 156 278 88 PO 7 3 5 8 0 WHA 252 135 118 253 43 PO 6 3 1 4 9 Czech* 419 369 159 528 55 PO 22 16 9 25 9 WC-A 80 67 34 101 51 OLY 13 13 5 18 4
Ted Kennedy 696 231 329 560 432 PO 78 29 31 60 32
Rick Middleton 1005 448 540 988 157 PO 114 45 55 100 19 CanCup 14 5 6 11 0
Babe Siebert 592 140 156 296 982 PO 53 8 7 15 65
John Tonelli NHL 1028 325 511 836 911 PO 172 40 75 115 200 WHA 224 64 86 150 278 PO 34 11 14 25 38 CanCup 8 3 6 9 2
Forwards: Philadelphia Flyers
Wayne Gretzky NHL 1487 894 1963 2857 577 PO 208 122 260 382 66 WHA 80 46 64 110 19 PO 13 10 10 20 2 WC-A 10 6 8 14 0 CanCup 31 17 40 57 8 WCup 8 3 4 7 2 OLY 6 0 4 4 2
Jaromir Jagr 950 506 729 1235 661 PO 146 67 87 154 123 WC-A 20 7 8 15 6 CanCup 5 1 0 1 0 WCup 3 1 0 1 2 OLY 10 3 7 10 6 Eur 89 42 63 105 18* PO: 19 13 9 22 0*
Sergei Makarov 424 134 250 384 317 PO 34 12 11 23 8 WC-A 91 56 67 123 85 SuperS 18 9 10 19 0 CanCup 22 16 15 31 12 OLY 22 11 17 28 18 Eur 525 325 390 715 292
Joe Malone NHL 126 143 32 175 57 PO 9 6 0 6 3 NHA/Oth 148 201 27 228 144 PO 6 14 0 14 0
Sergei Fedorov 908 394 554 948 587 PO 162 50 113 163 113 WC-A 20 10 5 15 20 CanCup 5 2 2 4 6 WCup 5 3 3 6 2 SuperS 5 2 2 4 11 OLY 12 3 7 10 12 USSR 184 47 34 81 99
Bill Cowley 549 195 353 548 143 PO 64 12 34 46 22
Michel Goulet NHL 1089 548 604 1152 825 PO 92 39 39 78 110 WHA 78 28 30 58 65 WC-A 10 1 8 9 6 CanCup 16 7 9 16 0
Clark Gillies 958 319 378 697 1023 PO 164 47 47 94 287 CanCup 7 2 5 7 8
Bill Barber 903 420 463 883 623 PO 129 53 55 108 109 WC-A 10 8 1 9 10 CanCup 7 2 0 2 4
Steve Larmer 1006 441 571 1012 532 PO 140 56 75 131 89 WC-A 10 5 3 8 4 CanCup 8 6 5 11 4
Brian Propp 1016 425 579 1004 830 PO 160 64 84 148 151 WC-A 20 7 5 12 10 CanCup 9 2 2 4 2 Switz 24 21 6 27 32
Bryan Hextall 449 187 175 362 227 PO 37 8 9 17 19
Forwards: Colorado Rockies
Jean Beliveau 1125 507 712 1219 1029 PO 162 79 97 176 211
Henri Richard 1256 358 688 1046 928 PO 180 49 80 129 181
Darryl Sittler 1096 484 637 1121 948 PO 76 29 45 74 137 WC-A 20 7 4 11 14 CanCup 7 4 2 6 4
John Bucyk 1540 556 813 1369 497 PO 124 41 62 103
Syl Apps Sr 423 201 231 432 56 PO 69 25 29 54 8
Toe Blake 577 235 292 527 272 PO 58 25 37 62 23
Mike Gartner NHL 1432 708 627 1335 1159 PO 122 43 50 93 125 WHA 78 27 25 52 123 PO 3 0 2 2 2 WC-A 35 14 7 21 38 CanCup 17 5 4 9 16
Glenn Anderson 1129 498 601 1099 1120 PO 225 83 121 214 442 WC-A 12 4 3 7 20 CanCup 15 3 5 8 20 OLY 6 2 2 4 4 Eur 43 26 22 48 161
Joe Mullen 1062 502 561 1063 241 PO 143 60 46 106 42 WC-A 8 7 1 8 2 CanCup 18 6 6 12 2
Dale Hunter 1407 323 697 1020 3565 PO 186 42 76 118 729
Dave “Tiger” Williams 962 241 272 513 3966 PO 83 12 23 35 455
Dave Schultz 535 79 121 200 2294 PO 73 8 12 20 412
Forwards: Boston Bruins
Ted Lindsay 1068 379 472 851 1808 PO 133 47 49 96 194
Howie Morenz 550 271 201 472 546 PO 47 21 12 33 66
Milt Schmidt 776 229 346 575 466 PO 86 24 25 49 60
Boom Boom Geoffrion 883 393 429 822 689 PO 132 58 60 118 88
Bob Gainey 1160 239 262 501 585 PO 182 25 48 73 151 WC-A 20 2 7 9 2 CanCup 12 3 3 6 4
Newsy Lalonde NHL 99 124 41 165 183 PO 12 21 24 45 26 NHA/OML 237 329 45 374 665 PO 16 7 0 7 96
Jean Ratelle 1281 491 776 1267 276 PO 123 32 66 98 24 Sum72 6 1 3 4 0
Woody Dumart 772 211 218 429 99 PO 88 12 15 27 23
Bobby Bauer 327 123 137 260 36 PO 48 11 8 19 6
Mike Modano 1025 444 618 1062 668 PO 139 50 74 124 90 WC-A 14 3 3 6 4 CanCup 8 2 7 9 2 WCup 7 2 4 6 4 OLY 10 2 6 8 4
Bob Probert 935 163 221 384 3300 PO 81 16 32 48 274
Brian Sutter 779 303 333 636 1786 PO 65 21 21 42 249

Forward Totals
NHL: GP 12,480 G 4,897 A 6,474 Pts 11,371 PIM 14,494 PO GP 1,182 G 497 A 607 Pts 1,104 PIM 1,830
NHL: GP 10,678 G 4,107 A 5,345 Pts 9,452 PIM 7,947 PO GP 1,163 G 427 A 571 Pts 998 PIM 976
NHL: GP 9,865 G 4,606 A 6,651 Pts 11,257 PIM 6,402 PO GP 1,345 G 536 A 814 Pts 1,350 PIM 1,100
NHL: GP 12,544 G 4,692 A 6,252 Pts 10,944 PIM 16,075 PO GP 1,501 G 496 A 678 Pts 1,174 PIM 2,868
NHL: GP 9,655 G 3,370 A 4,054 Pts 7,444 PIM 10,442 PO GP 1,136 G 338 A 434 Pts 772 PIM 1,251
WHA: GP 146 G 64 A 71 Pts 135 PIM 374 PO GP 5 G 2 A 2 Pts 4 PIM 15
WHA: GP 1,251 G 606 A 744 Pts 1,350 PIM 584 PO GP 136 G 70 A 75 Pts 145 PIM 93
WHA: GP 158 G 74 A 94 Pts 168 PIM 84 PO GP 13 G 10 A 10 Pts 20 PIM 2
WHA: GP 78 G 27 A 25 Pts 52 PIM 123 PO GP 3 G 0 A 2 Pts 2 PIM 2
NHA/OML: GP 148 G 201 A 27 Pts 228 PIM 144 PO GP 6 G 14 A 0 Pts 14 PIM 0
NHA/OML: GP 237 G 329 A 45 Pts 374 PIM 665 PO GP 16 G 7 A 0 Pts 7 PIM 96
Eur: GP 60 G 22 A 26 Pts 48 PIM 50 PO GP 8 G 7 A 0 Pts 7 PIM 4
Eur*: GP 419 G 369 A 159 Pts 528 PIM 55 PO GP 22 G 16 A 9 Pts 25 PIM 9
Eur: GP 822 G 435 A 493 Pts 928 PIM 441* PO GP 19 G 13 A 9 Pts 22 PIM 0*
Eur: GP 43 G 26 A 22 Pts 48 PIM 161
WC-A: GP 116 G 46 A 51 Pts 97 PIM 116
WC-A: GP 86 G 70 A 37 Pts 107 PIM 59
WC-A: GP 191 G 100 A 105 Pts 205 PIM 141
WC-A: GP 75 G 32 A 15 Pts 47 PIM 74
WC-A: GP 34 G 5 A 10 Pts 15 PIM 6
CanCup: GP 31 G 8 A 7 Pts 15 PIM 30
CanCup: GP 54 G 18 A 31 Pts 49 PIM 28
CanCup: GP 110 G 55 A 78 Pts 133 PIM 44
CanCup: GP 57 G 18 A 17 Pts 35 PIM 42
CanCup: GP 20 G 5 A 10 Pts 15 PIM 6
WCup: GP 19 G 8 A 8 Pts 16 PIM 20
WCup: GP 7 G 1 A 4 Pts 5 PIM 12
WCup: GP 16 G 7 A 7 Pts 14 PIM 6
WCup: GP 7 G 2 A 4 Pts 6 PIM 4
OLY: GP 36 G 14 A 11 Pts 25 PIM 26
OLY: GP 13 G 13 A 5 Pts 18 PIM 4
OLY: GP 50 G 17 A 35 Pts 52 PIM 38
OLY: GP 6 G 2 A 2 Pts 4 PIM 4
OLY: GP 10 G 2 A 6 Pts 8 PIM 4
Sum74: GP 8 G 7 A 2 Pts 9 PIM 0
SuperS: GP 23 G 11 A 12 Pts 23 PIM 11
Sum72: GP 6 G 1 A 3 Pts 4 PIM 0
All: GP 12,888 G 5,149 A 6,648 Pts 11,797 PIM 15,110 PO GP 1,195 G 506 A 609 Pts 1,015 PIM 1,849
All*: GP 12,516 G 5,191 A 6,327 Pts 11,518 PIM 8,689 PO GP 1,321 G 513 A 655 Pts 1,168 PIM 1,078
All: GP 11,383 G 5,506 A 7,502 Pts 13,008 PIM 7,311* PO GP 1,383 G 573 A 833 Pts 1,406 PIM 1,102*
All: GP 12,803 G 4,797 A 6,333 Pts 11,130 PIM 16,479 PO GP 1,504 G 496 A 680 Pts 1,176 PIM 2,870
All: GP 9,969 G 3,714 A 4,132 Pts 7,846 PIM 11,127 PO GP 1,152 G 345 A 434 Pts 779 PIM 1,347
* incomplete stats

Defensemen: Toronto Maple Leafs
Al MacInnis 1413 340 932 1272 1495 PO 177 39 121 160 255 WC-A 9 1 3 4 10 CanCup 8 2 4 6 23 OLY 12 2 0 2 10
Scott Stevens 1597 193 703 896 2763 PO 233 26 92 118 402 WC-A 27 3 6 9 18 CanCup 8 1 0 1 4 WCup 8 0 2 2 4 OLY 6 0 0 0 2
Doug Wilson 1024 237 590 827 830 PO 95 19 61 80 88 CanCup 7 2 1 3 4
Randy Carlyle 1055 148 499 647 1400 PO 69 9 24 33 120 WC-A 9 1 4 5 4
Carl Brewer WHA 77 2 23 25 42 PO 12 0 4 4 11 NHL 604 25 198 223 1037 PO 72 3 17 20 146 WC-A 7 1 6 7 10 Fin 20 4 14 18 53
Derian Hatcher 827 71 223 294 1380 PO 100 6 21 27 161 WC-A 6 1 2 3 8 WCup 6 3 2 5 10 OLY 8 0 4 4 12
Defensemen: New Jersey Devils
Red Kelly 1316 281 542 823 327 PO 164 33 59 92 51
Alexei Kasatonov 383 38 122 160 326 PO 33 4 7 11 40 USSR 576 124 219 343 386 PO 1 0 0 0 0 WC-A 77 18 34 52 69 SuperS 24 4 12 16 18 OLY 21 7 14 21 8 Can Cup 27 3 19 22 20
Earl Seibert 645 89 187 276 746 PO 66 11 8 19 76
Lionel Conacher 498 80 105 185 882 PO 25 2 2 4 34
Sprague Cleghorn NHA 115 84 33 117 265 PO 2 0 0 0 17 NHL 259 83 55 138 538 PO 39 7 7 14 25
Bill Gadsby 1248 130 438 568 1539 PO 67 4 23 27 92
Defensemen: Philadelphia Flyers
Denis Potvin 1060 310 742 1052 1356 PO 185 56 108 164 253 WC-A 7 1 4 5 6 CanCup 14 3 13 16 28
Brad Park 1113 213 683 896 1429 PO 161 35 90 125 217 Sum72 8 1 4 5 2
Nicklas Lidstrom 935 163 525 688 258 PO 156 32 77 109 38 WC-A 14 4 3 7 6 CanCup 6 1 1 2 4 WCup 4 2 1 3 0 OLY 8 2 6 8 2 Swe 109 14 39 53 24 PO 6 0 1 1 6
Ching Johnson 436 38 48 86 808 PO 61 5 2 7 161
Eric Desjardins 1050 131 408 539 673 PO 162 22 54 76 87 CanCup 8 1 2 3 6 WCup 8 1 2 3 4 OLY 6 0 0 0 2
Kevin Lowe 1254 84 347 431 1498 PO 214 10 48 58 192 WC-A 9 1 1 2 2 CanCup 7 0 4 4 8
Defensemen: Colorado Rockies
Paul Coffey 1409 369 1135 1531 1802 PO 194 59 137 196 264 WC-A 10 1 6 7 10 CanCup 25 6 18 24 12 WCup 8 0 7 7 12
Larry Murphy 1615 287 929 1216 1084 PO 215 37 115 152 201 WC-A 17 2 9 11 8 CanCup 16 1 7 8 4
Harry Howell NHL 1411 94 324 418 1298 PO 38 3 3 6 32 WHA 170 7 36 43 58 PO 7 1 0 1 12
Phil Housley 1495 338 894 1232 822 PO 85 13 43 56 36 WC-A 46 9 15 24 18 CanCup 11 0 4 4 4 WCup 1 0 1 1 0 OLY 6 1 4 5 0 Switz 10 6 8 14 34
Bill Quackenbush 774 62 222 284 95 PO 80 2 19 21 8
Ebbie Goodfellow 557 134 190 324 511 PO 45 8 8 16 65
Defensemen: Boston Bruins
Doug Harvey 1113 88 452 540 1216 PO 137 8 64 72 152
Tim Horton 1446 115 403 518 1611 PO 126 11 39 50 183
Emile Bouchard 785 49 144 193 863 PO 113 11 21 32
Bill Barilko 252 26 36 62 456 PO 47 5 7 12 104
Rob Ramage NHL 1044 139 425 564 2226 PO 84 8 42 50 218 WHA 80 12 36 48 165 WC-A 8 0 1 1 0
Marty McSorley 961 108 251 359 3381 PO 115 10 19 29 374

Defensemen Totals
NHL: GP 6,520 G 1,014 A 3,145 Pts 4,159 PIM 8,905 PO GP 746 G 102 A 336 Pts 438 PIM 1,172
NHL: GP 4,349 G 701 A 1,449 Pts 2,141 PIM 4,358 PO GP 394 G 61 A 106 Pts 167 PIM 318
NHL: GP 5,848 G 939 A 2,753 Pts 3,692 PIM 6,022 PO GP 939 G 160 A 379 Pts 539 PIM 948
NHL: GP 7,261 G 1,284 A 3,694 Pts 4,978 PIM 5,612 PO GP 657 G 122 A 325 Pts 447 PIM 606
NHL: GP 5,601 G 525 A 1,711 Pts 2,236 PIM 9,753 PO GP 622 G 53 A 192 Pts 245 PIM 1,063
WHA: GP 77 G 2 A 23 Pts 25 PIM 42 PO GP 12 G 0 A 4 Pts 4 PIM 11
WHA: GP 170 G 7 A 36 Pts 43 PIM 58 PO GP 7 G 1 A 0 Pts 1 PIM 12
WHA: GP 80 G 12 A 36 Pts 48 PIM 165
NHA: GP 115 G 84 A 33 Pts 117 PIM 265 PO GP 2 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 17
Eur: GP 20 G 4 A 14 Pts 18 PIM 53
Eur: GP 576 G 124 A 219 Pts 343 PIM 386 PO GP 1 G 0 A 0 Pts 0 PIM 0
Eur: GP 109 G 14 A 39 Pts 53 PIM 24 PO GP 6 G 0 A 1 Pts 1 PIM 6

Eur: GP 10 G 6 A 8 Pts 14 PIM 34
WC-A: GP 58 G 7 A 21 Pts 28 PIM 50
WC-A: GP 77 G 18 A 34 Pts 52 PIM 69
WC-A: GP 30 G 6 A 8 Pts 14 PIM 14
WC-A: GP 73 G 12 A 30 Pts 42 PIM 36
WC-A: GP 8 G 0 A 1 Pts 1 PIM 0
CanCup: GP 23 G 5 A 5 Pts 10 PIM 31
CanCup: GP 27 G 3 A 19 Pts 22 PIM 20
CanCup: GP 35 G 5 A 20 Pts 25 PIM 46
CanCup: GP 52 G 7 A 29 Pts 36 PIM 20
WCup: GP 14 G 3 A 4 Pts 7 PIM 14
WCup: GP 12 G 3 A 3 Pts 6 PIM 4
WCup: GP 9 G 0 A 8 Pts 8 PIM 12
SuperS: GP 24 G 4 A 12 Pts 16 PIM 18
Sum72: GP 8 G 1 A 4 Pts 5 PIM 2
OLY: GP 26 G 2 A 4 Pts 6 PIM 24
OLY: GP 21 G 7 A 14 Pts 21 PIM 8
OLY: GP 14 G 2 A 6 Pts 8 PIM 4
OLY: GP 6 G 1 A 4 Pts 5 PIM 0
All: GP 6,738 G 1,037 A 3,216 Pts 4,253 PIM 9,119 PO GP 758 G 102 A 340 Pts 442 PIM 1,183
All: GP 5,189 G 941 A 1,780 Pts 2,721 PIM 5,124 PO GP 397 G 61 A 106 Pts 167 PIM 335
All: GP 6,056 G 970 A 2,833 Pts 3,803 PIM 6,116 PO GP 945 G 160 A 380 Pts 540 PIM 954
All: GP 7,581 G 1,317 A 3,809 Pts 5,126 PIM 5,772 PO GP 664 G 123 A 325 Pts 448 PIM 618
All: GP 5,689 G 537 A 1,748 Pts 2,285 PIM 9,918 PO GP 622 G 53 A 192 Pts 245 PIM 1,063

Team: GP 19,626 G 6,186 A 9,864 Pts 16,050 PIM 24,229 PO GP 1,953 G 608 A 949 Pts 1,557 PIM 3,032
Team*: GP 17,687 G 6,132 A 8,107 Pts 14,239 PIM 13,813 PO GP 1,718 G 574 A 761 Pts 1,335 PIM 1,413
Team: GP 17,439 G 6,476 A 10,335 Pts 16,811 PIM 13,427* PO GP 2,328 G 733 A 1,213 Pts 1,946 PIM 2,056*
Team: GP 23,384 G 6,114 A 10,142 Pts 16,256 PIM 22,251 PO GP 2,168 G 619 A 1,005 Pts 1,624 PIM 3,488
Team: GP 15,658 G 4,251 A 5,880 Pts 10,131 PIM 21,045 PO GP 1,774 G 398 A 626 Pts 1,024 PIM 2,410

Goalies: Toronto Maple Leafs
Terry Sawchuck 972 446 332 171 2.51 103 PO 106 54 48 2.54 12
Grant Fuhr 868 403 295 114 3.38 25 PO 150 92 50 2.92 6 WC-A 5 1 3 1 3.62 1 CanCup 11 7 1 3 3.00 0
Goalies: New Jersey Devils
Ken Dryden 397 258 57 74 2.24 46 PO 112 80 32 2.40 10 WC-A 2 1 1 0 2.00 1 Sum72 4 2 2 0 4.75 0
Turk Broda 629 302 224 101 2.53 62 PO 101 60 39 1.98 13
Goalies: Philadelphia Flyers
Johnny Bower 552 250 195 90 2.51 37 PO 74 35 34 2.47 5
Gerry Cheevers NHL 418 230 102 74 2.89 26 PO 88 53 34 2.69 8 WHA 191 99 78 9 3.12 14 PO 19 7 12 3.28 0 Sum74 7 1 3 3 3.43 0
Goalies: Colorado Rockies
Jacques Plante NHL 837 435 247 145 2.38 82 PO 112 71 36 2.14 14 WHA 31 15 14 1 3.32 1
Tiny Thompson 553 284 194 75 2.08 81 PO 44 20 24 1.88 7
Goalies: Boston Bruins
Bill Durnan 383 208 112 62 2.36 34 PO 45 27 18 2.07 2
George Hainsworth NHL 465 246 145 74 1.93 94 PO 52 22 25 2 1.93 8 WCHL/WHL 88 48 35 5 2.36 10 PO 4 0 2 2 2.41 0

Goalie Totals
NHL: GP 1,840 W 849 L 627 T 285 GAA 2.91 SO 128 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
NHL: GP 1,026 W 560 L 281 T 175 GAA 2.42 SO 108 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23
NHL: GP 970 W 480 L 297 T 164 GAA 2.67 SO 63 PO GP 162 W 88 L 68 GAA 2.59 SO 13
NHL: GP 1,390 W 719 L 441 T 220 GAA 2.26 SO 163 PO GP 156 W 91 L 60 GAA 2.06 SO 21
NHL: GP 848 W 454 L 257 T 126 GAA 2.12 SO 128 PO GP 97 W 49 L 43 T 2 GAA 1.99 SO 10
WHA: GP 191 W 99 L 78 T 9 GAA 3.12 SO 14 PO GP 19 W 7 L 12 GAA 3.28 SO 0
WHA: GP 31 W 15 L 14 T 1 GAA 3.32 SO 1
WCHL/WHL: GP 88 W 48 L 35 T 5 GAA 2.36 SO 10 PO GP 4 W 0 L 2 T 2 GAA 2.41 SO 0
WC-A: GP 5 W 1 L 3 T 1 GAA 3.62 SO 1
WC-A: GP 2 W 1 L 1 T 0 GAA 2.00 SO 1
CanCup: GP 11 W 7 L 1 T 3 GAA 3.00 SO 0
Sum72: GP 4 W 2 L 2 T 0 GAA 4.75 SO 0
Sum74: GP 7 W 1 L 3 T 3 GAA 3.43 SO 0
All: GP 1,856 W 857 L 631 T 289 GAA 2.91 SO 129 PO GP 256 W 146 L 98 GAA 2.76 SO 18
All: GP 1,032 W 563 L 284 T 175 GAA 2.43 SO 109 PO GP 213 W 140 L 71 GAA 2.20 SO 23
All: GP 1,168 W 580 L 362 T 187 GAA 2.75 SO 77 PO GP 232 W 95 L 80 GAA 2.66 SO 13
All: GP 1,421 W 734 L 455 T 221 GAA 2.28 SO 164 PO GP 156 W 91 L 60 GAA 2.06 SO 21
All: GP 936 W 502 L 292 T 131 GAA 2.14 SO 138 PO GP 101 W 49 L 45 T 4 GAA 2.01 SO 10

BM67
11-17-2003, 04:33 PM
ok We will leave it to the hockey Gods

and we all know who God's Team is

The Toronto Maple Leafs :teach: :yo: :lol:

So the last 36 years would be the trials of Job?
:D

BM67
11-17-2003, 06:21 PM
I was a little concerned that I only had 1 right handed shot on my D and only 5 on the team.

Toronto has 1 on their D, and 6 on the team

Philly has 1 on their D and that's it. Only 1 righty on the whole team.

Interesting.

BM67
11-17-2003, 07:03 PM
Equalized a bit by using adjusted scoring from Total Hockey. Only for NHL through 1999-2000 season, and only for regular season.

BY: is Best Year and is based only on highest adjusted point total
Forwards:Toronto Maple Leafs
Maurice Richard 18 677 497 1174 BY: 53 39 92
Ron Francis 19 442 869 1311 BY: 27 76 103
Doug Gilmour 17 395 701 1096 BY: 27 66 93
Wendel Clark 15 321 197 518 BY: 43 23 66
Busher Jackson 15 392 409 801 BY: 47 56 103
Mats Sundin 10 348 398 746 BY: 44 47 91
Eric Lindros 8 318 344 662 BY: 51 61 112
Dave Andreychuk 18 518 484 1002 BY: 49 36 85
Rick Vaive 13 367 424 609 BY: 42 28 70
Ken Linseman 14 210 383 593 BY: 19 45 64
Joel Otto 14 179 241 420 BY: 20 23 43
Joe Nieuwendyk 14 436 349 785 BY: 37 43 80
Forwards: New Jersey Devils
Bobby Hull 16 699 535 1234 BY: 62 44 106
Mark Messier 21 572 847 1419 BY: 39 60 99
Dickie Moore 14 322 366 688 BY: 50 56 106
Charlie Conacher 12 396 332 728 BY: 64 36 100
Nels Stewart 15 594 496 1090 BY: 62 54 116
Andy Bathgate 17 421 641 1062 BY: 49 49 98
Dave Keon 18 419 521 940 BY: 38 32 70
Vaclav Nedomansky 6 103 110 213 BY: 30 28 58
Ted Kennedy 14 280 396 676 BY: 23 53 76
Rick Middleton 14 373 382 755 BY: 38 40 78
Babe Siebert 14 249 424 673 BY: 28 53 81
John Tonelli 14 270 358 628 BY: 34 40 74
Forwards: Philadelphia Flyers
Wayne Gretzky 20 779 1480 2259 BY: 42 111 153
Jaromir Jagr 10 420 511 931 BY: 52 80 132
Sergei Makarov 7 130 196 326 BY: 21 45 66
Joe Malone 7 193 120 313 BY: 47 35 82
Sergei Fedorov 10 310 373 683 BY: 52 50 102
Bill Cowley 13 255 471 726 BY: 26 66 92
Michel Goulet 15 457 425 882 BY: 45 44 89
Clark Gillies 14 271 272 543 BY: 30 41 71
Bill Barber 12 363 339 702 BY: 44 46 90
Steve Larmer 15 388 419 807 BY: 40 43 83
Brian Propp 15 354 407 761 BY: 35 37 72
Bryan Hextall 11 256 209 465 BY: 32 38 70
Forwards: Colorado Rockies
Jean Beliveau 20 615 722 1337 BY: 66 49 115
Henri Richard 20 413 663 1076 BY: 35 54 89
Darryl Sittler 15 422 474 896 BY: 41 56 97
John Bucyk 23 595 740 1335 BY: 51 55 106
Syl Apps Sr 10 280 333 613 BY: 35 47 82
Toe Blake 14 309 374 683 BY: 43 36 79
Mike Gartner 19 623 463 1086 BY: 41 35 76
Glenn Anderson 16 427 437 864 BY: 39 39 78
Joe Mullen 16 443 418 861 BY: 43 42 85
Dale Hunter 19 286 517 803 BY: 25 38 63
Dave “Tiger” Williams 14 201 193 394 BY: 27 18 45
Dave Schultz 9 71 92 163 BY: 19 13 32
Forwards: Boston Bruins
Ted Lindsay17 485 561 1046 BY: 39 62 101
Howie Morenz 14 508 619 1127BY: 69 105 174
Milt Schmidt 16 316 465 781 BY: 37 48 85
Boom Boom Geoffrion 16 493 458 951 BY: 59 44 103
Bob Gainey 16 201 187 388 BY: 18 16 34
Newsy Lalonde 6 172 174 346 BY: 42 58 100
Jean Ratelle 21 484 643 1127 BY: 46 55 101
Woody Dumart 16 295 295 590 BY: 37 33 70
Bobby Bauer 9 177 194 371 BY: 28 41 69
Mike Modano 11 356 394 750 BY: 40 45 85
Bob Probert 14 142 158 300 BY: 25 24 49
Brian Sutter 12 250 233 483 BY: 35 28 63

Forward Totals
Seasons 175 G 4,603 A 5,296 Pts 9,899 BY: G 459 A 543 Pts 1,002
Seasons 175 G 4,698 A 5,408 Pts 10,106 BY: G 517 A 545 Pts 1,062
Seasons 149 G 4,176 A 5,222 Pts 9,398 BY: G 466 A 636 Pts 1,102
Seasons 195 G 4,685 A 5,426 Pts 10,111 BY: G 465 A 482 Pts 947
Seasons 168 G 3,879 A 4,381 Pts 8,260 BY: G 475 A 559 Pts 1,034

Defensemen: Toronto Maple Leafs
Al MacInnis 19 287 628 915 BY: 26 57 83
Scott Stevens 18 161 505 666 BY: 17 47 64
Doug Wilson 16 198 415 613 BY: 31 31 62
Randy Carlyle 17 124 350 474 BY: 12 45 57
Carl Brewer 12 29 189 218 BY: 2 35 37
Derian Hatcher 9 61 144 205 BY: 7 24 31
Defensemen: New Jersey Devils
Red Kelly 20 349 600 949 BY: 23 49 72
Alexei Kasatonov 7 36 103 139 BY: 9 24 33
Earl Seibert 15 131 261 392 BY: 10 33 43
Lionel Conacher 12 147 292 439 BY: 14 47 61
Sprague Cleghorn 10 129 242 371 BY: 14 42 56
Bill Gadsby 20 161 480 641 BY: 12 50 62
Defensemen: Philadelphia Flyers
Denis Potvin 15 265 538 803 BY: 27 51 78
Brad Park 17 192 521 713 BY: 24 47 71
Nicklas Lidstrom 9 134 330 464 BY: 22 49 71
Ching Johnson 12 68 134 202 BY: 20 34 54
Eric Desjardins 12 108 293 401 BY: 16 38 54
Kevin Lowe 19 73 254 327 BY: 3 29 32
Defensemen: Colorado Rockies
Paul Coffey 20 351 863 1214 BY: 38 61 99
Larry Murphy 20 265 704 969 BY: 20 42 62
Harry Howell 21 110 324 434 BY: 14 27 41
Phil Housley 18 287 647 934 BY: 15 55 70
Bill Quackenbush 14 76 267 343 BY: 6 29 35
Ebbie Goodfellow 14 231 375 606 BY: 51 71 122
Defensemen: Boston Bruins
Doug Harvey 19 111 501 612 BY: 8 50 58
Tim Horton 24 134 401 535 BY: 12 26 38
Emile Bouchard 15 56 165 221 BY: 11 27 38
Bill Barilko 5 33 45 78 BY: 9 12 21
Rob Ramage 15 116 296 412 BY: 8 38 46
Marty McSorley 17 98 206 304 BY: 5 27 32

Defensemen Totals
Seasons 91 G 860 A 2,231 Pts 3,091 BY: G 95 A 239 Pts 334
Seasons 84 G 953 A 1,978 Pts 2,931 BY: G 82 A 245 Pts 327
Seasons 84 G 840 A 2,070 Pts 2,910 BY: G 112 A 248 Pts 360
Seasons 107 G 1,320 A 3,180 Pts 4,500 BY: G 144 A 285 Pts 429
Seasons 95 G 548 A 1,614 Pts 2,162 BY: G 53 A 158 Pts 211

Team
Seasons 266 G 5,445 A 7,527 Pts 12,990 BY: G 554 A 782 Pts 1,336
Seasons 259 G 5,651 A 7,386 Pts 13,037 BY: G 599 A 790 Pts 1,389
Seasons 233 G 5,016 A 7,292 Pts 12,308 BY: G 578 A 884 Pts 1,462
Seasons 302 G 6,005 A 8,606 Pts 14,611 BY: G 609 A 767 Pts 1,376
Seasons 263 G 4,427 A 5,995 Pts 10,422 BY: G 528 A 717 Pts 1,245

Leaf Lander
11-20-2003, 10:18 PM
[QUOTE=BM67]Equalized a bit by using adjusted scoring from Total Hockey. Only for NHL through 1999-2000 season, and only for regular season.


by doignthat u r scuringthe results

alot of my players have extended careers

thus u r no countign their points to give u r team an advantage
when in fact there is no such limit

we were not pickign teams that were great to 2000


it is al ltiem and that includes last 3 yrs
if u did that soem young players would have no points represented at all

and no other leagues are not comparable to nhl. IMO

wolrd cup and olympics are fancyii stats but they mean nothing since this is a nhl fantasy draft.

u compare teams mention the yr 1967 so i suspec tte hstanley cup is in your mind

thus it is NHL which we are drafting for!

BM67
11-21-2003, 04:07 AM
by doignthat u r scuringthe results
alot of my players have extended careers

So you should have picked Mike Gartner instead of Rocket Richard because he scored more goals? Vaive is better than Richard because he had three 50 goal seasons to Richard's one? Orr went with the first pick in the draft because he was a better player, but it's obvious that Gretzky had the better career. Adjusted stats equalize for overall scoring and length of schedule. You'll notice that Richard went from 544 goals to 677.


thus u r no countign their points to give u r team an advantage
when in fact there is no such limit
we were not pickign teams that were great to 2000

I don't care about the points, I picked players for overall play, not just their scoring. I'd be just as happy to go back to comparing awards. :D

We were picking players on how good they were in their prime, not how long their career was. Did you select any players that has had their best year after 2000? Hatcher is probably the only one.


it is al ltiem and that includes last 3 yrs
if u did that soem young players would have no points represented at all

It is a draft of the all-time best players based on their prime not of there ability to play till they're 40 or 50. If I had the adjusted stats for 2001 and on I'd give them too. I'd like to have them for the WHA and other leagues too.


and no other leagues are not comparable to nhl. IMO
wolrd cup and olympics are fancyii stats but they mean nothing since this is a nhl fantasy draft.

So guys that drafted players like Makarov, Tretiak, Kharlamov and other guys that played their best hockey outside of the NHL all made bad picks?

Career stats shouldn't even come into this. I only did this because this is what you aksed for. This should be a list of their best year, or maybe best three years, not their career stats. I put a list of my players "best" years, on page 8 or so of this thread, but I probably wouldn't pick the same years as you would for your players, so I'm not going to do it for anybody else.

Frightened Inmate #2
11-22-2003, 09:40 AM
So guys that drafted players like Makarov, Tretiak, Kharlamov and other guys that played their best hockey outside of the NHL all made bad picks?

They are no wendel clarkes...

Leaf Lander
11-22-2003, 10:47 AM
clark was just as a good pick as iafrate imo



I dontthink you can count tournmanet stats or junior or ahl and some euro leagues

competition their isnt the same as the night nin and night out grind of the elite leage The NHL

Leaf Lander
11-22-2003, 10:54 AM
[QUOTE=BM67]

I took richard cause he was themost dynamic player and only top 5 player left when my selection occured

really i go another top 10 pick with my first golaie sawchuk

U take playersthat are available

also you should take players that have a connection/meaning to your team Since Im picking for a origional six team with alot of history I choose players that i feel would represent Toronto well. Many played for the Leafs. Many I was just a fan of!


Pick all you want your teams is a shadow towards mine:)