Lundy and Carter to get a look flipping lines???

as per Dellapina.

I know alot of people are looking for Jamie to get a look up with Lindros but I for one think that Lindros needs at least one guy who goes to the net and bangs in some goals from within 5 ft infront of the net and Anson fills that role where Jamie is to slight to do it effectively.

A Rucinsky-Lindros-Lundy line would be too much perimieter play IMO and that doesn't make sense to me.

Also interesting note was him mentioning how unlikely it would be for Lacouture to remain w/Holik due to his lack of hands(cough..Aneirin).

With the depth at forward this year I think they'll be some mixing and matching until guys really find the spot they fit best and even then we'll see some mixing according to game situations.We finally do have 4 lines full of guys that are capable players and this will be a big benifit this year in times of injuries and 3 games in 4 night situations.

the question that should be asked is if Lundmark should be concentrating more on his offense, or should be be worried about what Patrik Elias may be doing, or if Lidstrom's going to sneak in behind him. Carter may be better suited for that role.

Actually Lundmark is pretty good at gettting in front of the net. He did it a lot last year and was pretty effective.

I'm of 2 minds on it. On the one hand, I want to see Lundmark get as much top 2 line time as possible. On the other, I have to say that I agree w/ JR (somewhere out there, there is a place where every tree just withered) and that placing Lundmark on the top line w/ Lindros & Rosie would make that line WAY too much of a perimeter line. Plus, I thikn that Carter's effectiveness will be pared down if he is placed on a checking line. This guy has been a top 2 line player his entire career, why bump him down?

Frankly, I'm not that impressed with anything Carter has done as a Ranger, I haven't heard anything about him through camp and he hasn't done anything in preseason. Tell me again why he deserves a top line spot ahead of the lone goal scorer from Sunday's blowout?

I'm also confused by the perception that Anson plays a gritty, physcial game. Carter's a skater and a sniper. Put him with Holik and let him do just that.

Frankly, I'm not that impressed with anything Carter has done as a Ranger, I haven't heard anything about him through camp and he hasn't done anything in preseason. Tell me again why he deserves a top line spot ahead of the lone goal scorer from Sunday's blowout?

I'm also confused by the perception that Anson plays a gritty, physcial game. Carter's a skater and a sniper. Put him with Holik and let him do just that.

Carter hasn't been impressive in his time with us both last yr and it seems he isn't making much noise this year as well but the fact still remains that his style of play is a better fit with Lindros' more so than any other winger we have unfortunately.

Anson does get the rugged power forward tag which isn't all that accurate but what is accurate is that he does go hard to the net and scores the bulk of his goals from within 5 ft of the net and cashes in on a ton of rebounds and garbage goals which is something desperately needed on Lindros' line.

Anson is a 2-way proven player who was edmonto0n's leading scorer when traded last year.He is a top 2 line player and to put him w/Holik on a 3rd line wouldn't be maximizing what he brings IMO.

Yes, he needs to put it all together as a NYR but to me he and the team both will experience the best results on the Lindros line.

As for putting Jamie there it would be underutilizing Lindros again by placing him with 2 finesse perimeter players.Who's go to the net on that line--Lindros only.Who would crash the net to cash in on rebounds--Lindros only again.

They'd have a tough time establishing any sort of cycle as they'd lack the size and to me they just wouldn't compliment eachothers game well.

If Lundy were to be moved up he'd fit much better on a skill line such as Nedved's but being their meshing so well there is no shot at that nor should there be.

Lundmark is NOT a perimeter player. Perhaps he was a bit tenative in his first couple seasons at the NHL level, but Jamie was a nightmare around the net in Jrs.

Also, at this point he and Carter are about the same size. Carter has never had the size to be a real power forward and his injuries reflect that.

There is also this myth that Lindros needs to play with big wingers. Have you all forgotten how great he was with Mike York and Theo Fleury? He and York played great together, they were the best line in the NHL for a good chunk of the season.

York is also great around the net and he's 5-10/185, smaller than Lundmark by a good margin. For those of you who didn't see Jaime in Vermont, trust me when I say he's gotten quite big and strong, and his speed he not been effected. He's also no defensive chump.

All I'm saying is don't count it out before we see it. Carter has done nothing to warrent top line duty at this point.

Lundmark is NOT a perimeter player. Perhaps he was a bit tenative in his first couple seasons at the NHL level, but Jamie was a nightmare around the net in Jrs.

Also, at this point he and Carter are about the same size. Carter has never had the size to be a real power forward and his injuries reflect that.

There is also this myth that Lindros needs to play with big wingers. Have you all forgotten how great he was with Mike York and Theo Fleury? He and York played great together, they were the best line in the NHL for a good chunk of the season.

York is also great around the net and he's 5-10/185, smaller than Lundmark by a good margin. For those of you who didn't see Jaime in Vermont, trust me when I say he's gotten quite big and strong, and his speed he not been effected. He's also no defensive chump.

All I'm saying is don't count it out before we see it. Carter has done nothing to warrent top line duty at this point.

I'll take your word on Lundmark, but to date he has not shown the tenacity of either York or Fleury.

he got pushed around a bit and was most effective in the slot. He needs to play with a couple guys that'll open up the ice for him so he can be free to get open for a shot. Unless he's a good deal stronger than last season, he's not likely to be much along the boards. I had originally wanted him to the left of Lindros with Kovalev on the right, which I thought forced a couple things: one, to get Lindros to crash the net, and the other, keep defenders to the center/right side of the ice which leaves Lundmark free to roam. That all left Carter to play with Nedved, and I actually thought Carter and Nedved played pretty well together in limited action.

Fletch, what you had suggested made sense to me, however at this point Hlavac, Nedved, Kovalev looks pretty damn good.

Yeah, i don't touch the Hlavac-Nedved-Kovie line until further notice. Maybe too much dipsi-dooing for you but they've shown chemistry which is what the team so badly needs. Why mess with one of the only bright spots so far this preseason.

On the Lundmark situation. I guess he'll get a chance on both lines and which ever he clicks with will be where he starts the season. i personally don't have a preference as long as he hopefully clicks with one of them and then stays there for a while.

Although York and Fleury could be classified as grittier then Lundmark i wouldn't say by much and there game was predicated on speed and nice passing. It's interesting that Lindros has had his most success as a Ranger first on the FLY line and then with Rucinsky and Bure. So he can perform well with players that aren't exactly muckers. On Carter, I have little worries about him. He's performed well wherever he's been and has always been a top 2 line foward. I'd expect the normal out of him.

I know alot of people are looking for Jamie to get a look up with Lindros but I for one think that Lindros needs at least one guy who goes to the net and bangs in some goals from within 5 ft infront of the net and Anson fills that role where Jamie is to slight to do it effectively.

---I've never understood why people think of Anson Carter as though he's a combination of John Leclair and Cam Neely. He is NOT a power forward. Never has been.

And I continue the find all of this talk about finding Lindros someone to do the dirty work on his line amusing. When we acquired him, it was because it was supposed to be him going to the net and being a physcial presence.

When we acquired him, it was because it was supposed to be him going to the net and being a physcial presence.

...and what IDIOT thought he could do that after 6 concussions?!?!....oh wait.

I think what JR is saying is that he's the closest thing we have to a PF on the right side as of right now.

I actually think that Lunmark and Carter play rather similar games when all is said and done. or am I competely off my rocker by saying that? Both have decent speed, can get off good shots, have enough offensive capabilities to score in the mid 20s in goals. Not overly good defensively but not bad. Not overly physical but can get into the corners from time to time and dig out the puck. Hell I wouldn't be surprised if Jamie grew some Dreads in the next couple of years.

---I've never understood why people think of Anson Carter as though he's a combination of John Leclair and Cam Neely. He is NOT a power forward. Never has been.

And I continue the find all of this talk about finding Lindros someone to do the dirty work on his line amusing. When we acquired him, it was because it was supposed to be him going to the net and being a physcial presence.

What I find amusing is that you chime in w/o reading the full post or you'd CLEARLY have understood that I've pointed out that I don't classify Anson as a PF but rather simply point out that he undeniably makes his living by going hard to the net and scores the vast majority of his goals from withing 5 ft of the goal net.Is there something you don't understand about that?

As for the want for another big body to play with Lindros to do the dirty work when that's what we acquired him for let's think about that for a second----when Lindros was playing the best hockey of his carreer who was he doing it with, smurfs and perimeter guys like Theo, York, Rosie, Lundy or was it with a 6'5 235lbs LeClair and a 6'3 215lbs Renberg?

What is so hard to follow in the thought process of having MORE THAN ONE big body makes the line almsot impossible to contain down low?One guy draws a double team in the corner but is strong enough and big enough to shield the puck away to move it to the other big body who is now in asingle coverage and is also too hard to physically handle down low and round and round it goes.

I guess you never saw the endless cycle the Flyers were able to create with just such a scenario.

Having Lindros w/a Rosie and Lundy expecting Lindros to be the only one able to develop a cycle or play a physical game is just ridiculous and if you think we got him to play with finesse and perimeter guys while he did all the dirty work then I don't know what to tell you other then that makes zero sense.

The FLY line was the first thing I thought of when I read the title of this thread.

It's atleast worth a shot in preseason. That line hasn't done anything yet so it's not like we're ruining something good right now.

Lundmark also is more of a goal scorer then Carter in my eyes. He also does get down low, but besides that, it's Lindros who needs to get in front of the net, not Lundmark or Carter. Jamie is not as finesse as you guys think, he's more of a gritty player ala smaller version of Jeremy Roenick.

The difference b/w Lundy and Carter at this time is this--

Lundy is more of a speedster, a skilled player who makes his living more off the rush and w/creativity as oppossed to grinding it out and getting to the front of the net.

The biggest shortcoming he has in his game right now is strength on his skates at the NHL level.Too easily taken off the puck and is the type of player at this time that needs other guys to open up significant space for him.Having a Holik and a Simon or Barnaby bulling to the net and digging pucks to feed it to Jamie to handle and then the big boys try to get in scoring position for either a shot or a rebound is what would bring Jamie success.He'd provide the speed, puck carrying and offensive dimension to the line while the other to would do the dirty work and open up space.

Carter is also a slick skater that has good offensive skills but his game isn't all that fancy.He's an underated passer and knows where his game is---within a couple of feet of the net to get shots and cash in on rebounds with a knack for the timely ones.

He isn't a rugged overpowering guy but is very strong on his skates and handles himself well in the corners and infront of the net.

I don't classify Anson as a PF but rather simply point out that he undeniably makes his living by going hard to the net and scores the vast majority of his goals from withing 5 ft of the goal net.
Again, I have to concur here (Whoa, twice in one day that me and JR are on the same page). I liken Carter to Glen Murray. Is Murray a PF? Absolutely not. However, he drives to the net and scores most of his goals from within 5 ft. No, he does not physically punish people, but he does cycle very well w/ the puck and makes his living by creating havoc near the net.

glen murray minus 20 goals.

glen murray minus 20 goals.
Did I compare stats? I said that they are SIMILAR players.

Did I compare stats? I said that they are SIMILAR players.
in what way they both shoot righthanded? carter is more of a mellanby when mellanby was with the panthers. i personally wouldnt mind trading carter for a good defenseman

"in what way they both shoot righthanded?"

In that they are both big, neither is overly physical, and both make their living in front of the net and in the corners.

"carter is more of a mellanby when mellanby was with the panthers"

If Carter was half as physical and mean as Mellanby was, you could make somewhat of a case.

glen murray minus 20 goals.

Glenn Murray pre being paired with Big Joe struggled to net 20 goals.He had one season that he had 29 I think sandwiched b/w 2 17 goal seasons if I remember correctly.

He exploded ala Leclair when paired with Thornton just as John did when paired with Lindros.

And I agree with TB that they have similarities in their games.Murray has a heavier shot and alittle more goalscoring but they go about the game in similar ways IMO.

'A Rucinsky-Lindros-Lundy line would be too much perimieter play IMO and that doesn't make sense to me.'

Lundmark goes to the net at least as much as Carter and how is this 'bounce back' year for Lindros going to occur if he's strictly 'perimeter'?

Lundy goes to the net at least as much as Carter????

Do you even watch these games b/c either you say these things just to be different or you aren't very observant.

As for Lindros and you perimeter comment, reread it as I never said Eric would be too perimeter but the line as a whole would be.

Rosie while being decent on the boards doesn't play a go hard to the net, grind type of game and Lundy's biggest weakness is strength on his skates.Lundy is a speedster but his game is more off the rush and skating as oppossed to getting open in the slot for chances or being able to stand infront of the net to back in some loose pucks and IMO Eric needs one of those guys to thrive with.

Lundmark goes to the net at least as much as Carter
Huh? Lundmark goes to the net as much as Carter does? When?

'Lundy is more of a speedster, a skilled player who makes his living more off the rush and w/creativity as oppossed to grinding it out and getting to the front of the net.'

Carter does not grind it out. Where the hell does this come from? Carter and Lundmark both go to the net and both of them get the majority of their goals by receiving passes as they drive to the net. Neither of them pick up the kind of garbage goals you seem to be talking about where the player jams himself into a scrum and keeps whacking away at the puck. They'll both pounce on rebounds and are both quick to see the play develop but this thought that somehow Carter goes to the front of the net and creates havoc has no basis. It seems to me to be more wishful thinking than anything else.


You said it better than I ever could. You are exactly right.

'Lundy is more of a speedster, a skilled player who makes his living more off the rush and w/creativity as oppossed to grinding it out and getting to the front of the net.'

Carter does not grind it out. Where the hell does this come from? Carter and Lundmark both go to the net and both of them get the majority of their goals by receiving passes as they drive to the net. Neither of them pick up the kind of garbage goals you seem to be talking about where the player jams himself into a scrum and keeps whacking away at the puck. They'll both pounce on rebounds and are both quick to see the play develop but this thought that somehow Carter goes to the front of the net and creates havoc has no basis. It seems to me to be more wishful thinking than anything else.

How many rebounds have you seen Lundy score??How many by going hard to the net????


THE GUY HAS 8 ****ING GOALS IN HIS CAREER so what the F are you talking about??? :dunno:

Of the 8 I know that at least 3 came off the rush and another 2 at least out of getting open in the slot for a quick release wrister.

You saying he scores goals by recieving passes while going hard to the net is hysterical.

As for Carter not scoring almsot all of his goals from rebounds and getting to the front of the net why don't you go and educate yourself over at the Oiler board as to just how Anson scored 25 and 28 goals the last 2 yrs.

I would personally like Sather to try Lundmark next to Rosie and Lindros for a couple pre-season games. Again, that would also allow Moore to crack the 3rd line if he continues his strong camp. Two young guys wont play with Holik but if Anson was on one flank then I think Sather could try Moore on the other. If they dont click then put Anson back...

How many rebounds have you seen Lundy score??How many by going hard to the net????


THE GUY HAS 8 ****ING GOALS IN HIS CAREER so what the F are you talking about??? :dunno:

As for Carter not scoring almsot all of his goals from rebounds and getting to the front of the net why don't you go and educate yourself over at the Oiler board as to just how Anson scored 25 and 28 goals the last 2 yrs.

I dont think he's saying that Lundmark CAN do it, but he is saying that Anson CANNOT. Anson Carter is not Jonh Leclair as much as we want him too be. Neither Carter nor Lundmark are true power forwards

Neither Carter nor Lundmark are true power forwards
And no one is saying that Carter is. However to say that Lundmark goes to the net as much as Carter does is simply not true. Do you consider Glen Murray a true power forward? If you do, I'd like to know why. The point is that Carter's game is similar to Murray, but NEITHER of them can be considered a true PF. But BOTH play their size correctly when it comes to being around the net.

And no one is saying that Carter is. However to say that Lundmark goes to the net as much as Carter does is simply not true. Do you consider Glen Murray a true power forward? If you do, I'd like to know why. The point is that Carter's game is similar to Murray, but NEITHER of them can be considered a true PF. But BOTH play their size correctly when it comes to being around the net.

Correct me if I'm wrong but didnt Lindros have his most NYR success on the FLY line and with Rucinski and Bure? Why not try Lundmark? If Carter is also more of a grinder then why not drop him to Holik to help grind the puck in the corners... he'd be a little more reliable then Lundmark on defense which could help against Sundin type lines. Whats the harm in testing it for a couple games? You could always move them back.

I dont think he's saying that Lundmark CAN do it, but he is saying that Anson CANNOT. Anson Carter is not Jonh Leclair as much as we want him too be. Neither Carter nor Lundmark are true power forwards

And for the 100th time nobody is saying Anson is a PF BUT it is undeniable that he scores the vast majority of his goals from within 5 ft of the net.

He does get the garbage goals, the rebounds infront and the slam dunks in the goal mouth and anybody saying Jamie plays the same way is either out of their minds or they simply don't watch the games.It's as simple as that.

JR, I'm not saying Lundmark is like an Adam Graves or stands 2 feet from the goalie but he's not afraid to get in close either, that's the only point I was trying to make. And trust me, I'm watching. :)

would you do a Comrie for Lundmark trade Comrie we know has good chemestry with Carter? :dunno:

would you do a Comrie for Lundmark trade Comrie we know has good chemestry with Carter? :dunno:

No

They wouldn't be on the same line anyways

would you do a Comrie for Lundmark trade Comrie we know has good chemestry with Carter? :dunno:

Of coarse we would.

And since your here Brew how would you describe how Anson scores his goals?

Are they not of the garbage variety, the majority of the time from within 5 ft of the net?

Are they not clean up goals and slam dunks from infront of the net?

There is a good argument for wanting Cater with Lundmark and Jamie with Holik, and equally as good as argument for wanting to try Lundmark with Lindros and putting Carter with Holik. Just realize that none of this will really matter if Eric Lindros repeats his crap from last year. He'll just likely drag down the production of whoever plays with him anyway.

JR, I'm not saying Lundmark is like an Adam Graves or stands 2 feet from the goalie but he's not afraid to get in close either, that's the only point I was trying to make. And trust me, I'm watching. :)

Lundy's biggest weakness jhas been undenaible not being strong enough on his skates.

He DOES NOT set up 2 ft from the goalie nor should he.That's not his game.

And the whole point of this is the ridiculous comment that Lundy who has scored all of 8 F'in goals in his career DOES NOT go to the net as Anson does and does not score goals from within 5 ft of the net on rebounds and dunks.

The guy doesn't even have enough goals to even establish a track record to back up such a false statement as Aneirin's and of his 8 MAYBE one was from going to the net for a rebound or slamdunk opportunity.

Know one knows who Lindros plays better with. I say give Jamie a shot and if hes better then let him stay and if not move Anson back. It's not as if that line has been lighting it up. Who would have thought that York and Lindros or Rucinsky and Lindros would play well together. Can't hurt to try it.

Of coarse we would.

Why?

This "picking up players for the main reason of getting someone else going" crap is starting to get ridiculous. Where would he play with Carter anyways? No room at center which he his normal position and has played for the most part of his career if I'm not mistaken and I very well could be. We already picked up Rucinsky to get Lindros going, can't put Comrie on LW as well to get Anson going now too.

I understand he might be a better player, but so we trade for him..what then? I thought everybody already had enough of picking up players now and figuring out where to play them later. Lets just stick with players that already fit and see what they can do first.

'THE GUY HAS 8 ****ING GOALS IN HIS CAREER so what the F are you talking about???'

Someone needs some anger management. Perhaps you've forgotten that we've also seen him score some goals in Hartford and some goals in pre-season. I'm pretty sure I can notice a trend. Like the way he likes driving hard to the net down the left side, taking the pass and dropping down on one knee to power roof it to the far side. Yeah, I think I've watched Lundmark and seen how he likes scoring goals. Also seems to me that getting open in the slot usually means you're driving to the net (unless you're Lindros and are sort of drifting around).

'As for Carter not scoring almsot all of his goals from rebounds and getting to the front of the net'

Did I not say that he pounces on rebounds. You seem to be under the impression that he sets up shop on the crease and is immovable and scores most of his goals that way. Maybe you should go educate yourself a bit.

Oh, so now preseason goals and AHL goals convert to being able to doing the same thing during the regular season against ALL "A" squads I guess??? :joker:

And just how many goals did you see him score in Hartford and how did you view them???On what Channel?And being that only 3 preseason games were tevelised last yr how did you see all those goals to know how they were scored and in what manner??

And that goal you described was off an ODDMAN RUSH, not relevant to the situation at all!!!!Too funny.


And as for the Carter stuff, Your grasping here.I made it 100% clear how I decribed Carter's play and you come in with your nonsense stance that Jamie goes to the net and is as effective in doing so then Anson has been which is complete BS plain and simple.

And show me one psrt of this thread or any other where I say Anson sets up shop and is an immovable force infront of the net ala LeClair or Tkachuk.

Anson is a consistent 20+ goal scorer and the bulk of them all come front the front of the net.You want to dispute that be my guess but it's a losing battle.

Why?
I understand he might be a better player, but so we trade for him..what then?
.

There is no might in that sentence.Comrie IS the better player by a good margin at this point and there would be no way in hell Lowe would ship Comrie for Lundy alone.

That's usually a sign that you make the trade if somehow offered which it wouldn't be but for arguements sake.

Even if he didn't fit into our lineup he is a significantly more valuable asset then is Lundy and we can even flip him for an upgrade somewhere else that fits into our plans.

\Yes, Lundmark drives the net at least as much as Carter. No bout adoubt it.

Classic! :lol:

Correct me if I'm wrong but didnt Lindros have his most NYR success on the FLY line and with Rucinski and Bure? Why not try Lundmark? If Carter is also more of a grinder then why not drop him to Holik to help grind the puck in the corners... he'd be a little more reliable then Lundmark on defense which could help against Sundin type lines. Whats the harm in testing it for a couple games? You could always move them back.
I am not saying not to give anything a shot. I am just saying that Carter and Lundmark have 2 different games and that Carter is a similar player to Glen Murray. If Murray was here, would you throw him on a 3rd line so that Lundmark can play w/ Lindros?
Don't get me wrong, I think that Jaime is going to be a top 2 line player for us for many years (providing Jackass does not trade him). However, I don't know if he is the better option THIS year to play w/ Lindros instead of Carter. I did not say not to try this during preseason to see how it works. I am just saying that Anson may be the better option there THIS year.

Both Anson and Jamie have done nothing to warrant that 1st line spot. Jamie does have more offensive flair and could create chemistry with Rucinsky. The point of a line isnt to piece together 3 different players with 3 different styles, its to find 3 guys with chemistry. Just because Lindros and Rucinsky aren't board and crease mongers it doesn't mean play a guy who is with them. Right now, would you split up the Hlavac-Nedved-Kovalev line just because no one is a PF, crease type of a guy? No. They have chemistry together and know each others next move. So take Carter away from the offensive stars and he is a regular 3rd-4th liner. Thats why he should be off to Minnesota. ;) :p

Some internet source, NJ Journal perhaps, said that Sather might move Moore to wing. If Lundmark doesn't stick with Rucinsky and Lindros, then its Moore's turn.

Carter and Murray in the same sentence? What i miss the past several years. They belong in the same sentence the same way Ryan Smyth and Ethan Moreau belong in the same sentence as corner wingman.

In theory Carter is the best fit for for Lindros but if it aint working, it aint working. Not amount of talent of "Style" changes the fact that there has been little spark between em.

Carter always has been and always will be overrated. He's not a bad player, just overrated. He was never a power forward in fact ever since his Washington days the biggest complaint was from people expecting him to be a power forward. On his own he is a 20 goal, 40 point player, a nice second or third line player. Most of his production in Edmonton was the benefit of the players he played with. They made him better, NOT the other way around. And there was a reason edmonton fans werent exactly crying that they lost a 25 goal guy. He is very inconsistent and tends to disappear during big games. He isnt physical all the time and he himself often hangs around the perimeter so i dont know where everyone thought he was the defensive/crashing winger for the top line. He was never that type of player to begin with.

Lundmark on the other hand is inexperienced and showed a willingness to hang out in front of the net. There is no size difference between the two. Carter is 6'1,195 ish and Lundmark is 6'0 ,195 {and regardless of reports might be closer to 200}. I dont think 1 inch makes a difference.

Will Lundmark succeed there? Who knows, but he certainly can't have any less chemistry then what Carter has shown on that line.

I still truly believe that carter doesnt want to be here, his heart just isn't here and as funny {and early} as this statement may be, i can easily see him becoming trade bait in a hurry, esp. if Lundmark clicks on that top line.

Both Anson and Jamie have done nothing to warrant that 1st line spot. Jamie does have more offensive flair and could create chemistry with Rucinsky.

.

Anson is a legit top 2 line guy and has been a consistent 20+ goal scorer and 50pt guy.

To say Jamie has more offensive flair at this point is not accurate IMO.Anson is in his prime and has proven to be an effective offensive player, being the leading scorer on a playoff bound Oiler team last yr.

Jamie has scored all of 8 goals in his career.I wouldn't put Jamie above Anson at THIS point in time in any catergory.

Anson is a legit top 2 line guy and has been a consistent 20+ goal scorer and 50pt guy.

To say Jamie has more offensive flair at this point is not accurate IMO.Anson is in his prime and has proven to be an effective offensive player, being the leading scorer on a playoff bound Oiler team last yr.

Jamie has scored all of 8 goals in his career.I wouldn't put Jamie above Anson at THIS point in time in any catergory.


Well no rookie starts above an established player, but by getting ice time you see if they surpase the players currently ahead of them.

in this case Carter hasnt proven anything so lundmark is going to get a chance, he at least deserves that. He's not going to go anywhere or pass anyone if they never give him a shot.

If he doesnt work, he doesnt work but you gotta at least find out. You cant just keep throwing carter out there because he "should" work with that line combo.

And having watched carter very closely for years in edmonton he benefited a lot from a lack of forward depth and from playing with names like smyth, weight and comrie.

Anson is a legit top 2 line guy and has been a consistent 20+ goal scorer and 50pt guy.

To say Jamie has more offensive flair at this point is not accurate IMO.Anson is in his prime and has proven to be an effective offensive player, being the leading scorer on a playoff bound Oiler team last yr.

Jamie has scored all of 8 goals in his career.I wouldn't put Jamie above Anson at THIS point in time in any catergory.

Jamie shouldn't be put in a category with Anson just because of his inexperience.

And yes, Jamie does have more offensive flair than Carter. Carter has put up points over the years, but he does not have Lundmark's creativity nor his offensive skills.

Carter has no shot at all. From EDM, to the last ten games with Rangers, to this years training camp. I havent seen a shot comparable to Lundmark's. Carter cannot stickhandle and does not have Lundmark's "new school" type of moves. Carter is not a fast skater. Carter does not play a crash and bang style suitable on the 3rd-4th lines. Carter is good on a bad team.

Anson Carter is not the RW for Lindros' line. If he gets pushed down to Holik's line he is still taking up a spot from a guy that has even only a single element to his game. Moore should be on the team and Carter should be gone for a pick or prospect(s).

This situation is what separates the good GM's from the bad. Sather should be maximizing his assets and shipping Carter out of here pronto. A guy like Moore or Stals has shown that he can play with team. There is no use to have Carter around so now Sather can add to the system without taking away anything from the team by getting a good prospect and pick.

Well i cant say i thing carter should be shipped out but i think he might be a good fit with holik.

I dunno why people think carter on an important third line role is some kind of demotion?

He can pop in 20 goals and play a smart role on the team, as the article it was mentioned in states, the third line cant be an afterthought. It will play an important role this season, or at least SHOULD. Now if they wanted him on the 4th line thats a different story.

If he doesnt work, he doesnt work but you gotta at least find out. You cant just keep throwing carter out there because he "should" work with that line combo.

And having watched carter very closely for years in edmonton he benefited a lot from a lack of forward depth and from playing with names like smyth, weight and comrie.

Never said that Carter should be kept w/Lindros if he doesn't start clicking with him.The debate became who's game is more suited for Lindros' wing.

And as for the Carter in EDM thing, I'm fully aware that he is a guy who feeds off of who he plays with and that's why he scores the bulk of his goals from within 5 ft of the net with rebounds of others shots and slamdunks off of others setups and that's why I think he'd do good as a cleanup man going to the net as he does playing with Lindros-Rosie.

There is no use to have Carter around so now Sather can add to the system without taking away anything from the team by getting a good prospect and pick.

I totally disagree with that. I'm not a huge Carter fan either, but his versatility could prove to be invaluable when injuries strike the top 2 lines. Besides, what can his value possibly be right now with a number of quality UFA's left on the market?

Never said that Carter should be kept w/Lindros if he doesn't start clicking with him.The debate became who's game is more suited for Lindros' wing.

And as for the Carter in EDM thing, I'm fully aware that he is a guy who feeds off of who he plays with and that's why he scores the bulk of his goals from within 5 ft of the net with rebounds of others shots and slamdunks off of others setups and that's why I think he'd do good as a cleanup man going to the net as he does playing with Lindros-Rosie.


Honestly i think lundmark MIGHT {keyword} be a better fit. He camps in front of the net and he's hungry. Now thats not a gurantee but its certainly worth a look.

But see Carter was never a slam the puck in from 5 feet type of guy, that was smythy. Carter, as funny as this sounds, was just kinda there. The oilers havent really missed him because he didnt bring anything "special" to the lineup. he was a good player but borderline as a core player.

I think he could be use on a line with holik and would add some offensive punch to the line, whereas that touch might not be quite a fit for the top line.

Carter cannot stickhandle and does not have Lundmark's "new school" type of moves. Carter is not a fast skater. Carter does not play a crash and bang style suitable on the 3rd-4th lines. Carter is good on a bad team.

Anson Carter is not the RW for Lindros' line. If he gets pushed down to Holik's line he is still taking up a spot from a guy that has even only a single element to his game. Moore should be on the team and Carter should be gone for a pick or prospect(s).

Jsut what exactly are these "new school" moves that Jamie performers so well?? :dunno:

And Carter is a good player on a bad team?I guess being the LEADING scorer on a PLAYOFF team makes him not good enough for us???Or being a very good player on a playoff Boston team where he was good enough to return a in-his prime Guerin straight up backs up your point.

You're killing me here with this.Now not only Jamie should bump Carter off the line but Moore should now bump him off the team??? :dunno:

I'm not even going to bother with this stuff.

Honestly i think lundmark MIGHT {keyword} be a better fit. He camps in front of the net and he's hungry.
.

When have you seen Jamie "camp" infront of the net as a NYR????

Has never happened.

But see Carter was never a slam the puck in from 5 feet type of guy, that was smythy. Carter, as funny as this sounds, was just kinda there.
.

So what kind of goals did Anson pump in to net 25 and 28 goals the last 2 yrs???

They weren't breakaway's, they weren't slappers, they were the garbage goals from right infront of the net and the word that came up time after time after the trade from Edm fans describing his play was "garbage goals", often timely ones.

And when you say"just kinda there" doing it 28 times in season seems like a hell of alot of luck and the only way you score a goal by "just kinda being there" is it it takes place right infront of the net.

they were often in the slot as smyth distracted everyone and comrie set up a play. all he had to do was stand there, the other two guys did 95% of the work. Even then most edmonton fans wanted to rip their heads off because he'd do nothing through most of the game and walk away with a goal.

just like there are some guys who do a ton of things and dont show up on a scorecard, there are other who it's the reverse.


I am not saying Carter is worthless but with the rangers first line you dont have someone standing in the net freeing space for him, and Carter is NOT going to be the guy who does that job.

Lundmark on the other hand DOES create havoc in front of the net, it's not a matter of who is necessarily the best player at the moment but rather which player is the best for what is needed. Carters style doesnt match that. Now if this was 7 years ago and Graves was standing in the net and messier was "Creating" offense then yes, but Rucinsky certainly isnt going to standing in the net so carter's "game" is compromised in that situation much the same way that i dont want to see Lundmark or moore as a third line checking winger.

they were often in the slot as smyth distracted everyone and comrie set up a play. all he had to do was stand there, the other two guys did 95% of the work.


Lundmark on the other hand DOES create havoc in front of the net,


I think your getting carried away and understating Carter';s game.You don't put up that many goals and become a team leading scorer by other's doing 95% of the work.

And if Smyth and Carter both were in the goal mouth that's a pretty damn crowded net.

As for the Lundy stuff, look I'm a fan of the kid but some of this stuff is getting out of hand with analyzing his play.

I'd love to hear of one example where he "created havoc" infront of the net or how he "camps out infront of the net" b/c both are simply untrue.

I think your getting carried away and understating Carter';s game.You don't put up that many goals and become a team leading scorer by other's doing 95% of the work.

And if Smyth and Carter both were in the goal mouth that's a pretty damn crowded net.

As for the Lundy stuff, look I'm a fan of the kid but some of this stuff is getting out of hand with analyzing his play.

I'd love to hear of one example where he "created havoc" infront of the net or how he "camps out infront of the net" b/c both are simply untrue.

1. Nope watched him for several years as an oiler fan. Go over there and ask em if they miss him if ya wanbt.

2. He was the leading scorer because Smyth spent 15 some odd games on the DL. Eric Lindros was out number two scorer, but how many opportunities did he create?

3. You're right that is crowded net, which is why i said carter wasnt in the net, NOR was he in the net after smyth went out. Kind funny how the line went down after smyth was out. Carter didnt go to the net and just standing there didnt help much. Thus marchant and york become the most valuable players. So based on that, at BEST Carter was the number 5 guy on the chart behind Smyth, Comrie,Marchant, and York. And considering Comrie {i've made it and dont have to work hard} is ahead of him says something.

4. Analyzing his play? How do you mean? He goes to the net and stands there, he goes in the corners and he has enough skill in his game that he could possibly be a fit on the line. What are we supposed to analyze? His hair cut?

5. As for the front of the net, watch shifts where he was out there with an offensive player that roamed around {Bure, Kovalev, even Nedved} almost time after time he went right to the net to see if he knock something in, if another player went to the net, he went to work the corners. There was a game in march against the mighty ducks that the rangers won 5-2 or something like that. I remember watching him do that all night. I use that an example because that was one of the few nights the rangers looked to have a game plan and it worked. They dominated a team that played a 7th game for the cup.

That wasnt the only time but it was a good example {i cant recall specific games, i'm not a machine}. This year he is a little wiser, a little older, a bit stronger and the lindros line is looking for exactly that type of play from the RW.

Again one cant say whether it will work but its certainly worth a look. Carter doesnt play the style that RW needs to. I dont know if lundmark will consistently either, but we arent going to find out by not trying it.

JR, I'm starting to think you don't watch that close. Don't yell, I mean that nicely. Jamie's first goal as a Ranger was a tap in, to the left of the net. He scored 2 goals in the Washington game, both were deflections from in front of the net. He IS in front of the net a lot and has been even in the AHL. A friend of mine who went to a LOT of Hartford games even made the comment that he liked the way Jamie set up in front of the net. Does he crash in and stand there like Graves did? NO, at least not all the time. But to say he never does is wrong.

I'll take your word on Lundmark, but to date he has not shown the tenacity of either York or Fleury.

I'll back crack puck on Lundmarks' style of play in Juniors. Although I've never seen Lundmark play in Juniors, his profile stated that he would rarely score the pretty goal but releyed heavily on going to the net hard. Also Lindros has had success with Rucinsky and Bure as well, so I don't think it's correct to say that he needs a power winger to go to the net. I think trying Lundmark at RW on Lindros' line is worth a try; he plays a North-South game and cycles well.

i think the point that all of us are missing here is that it's only a tryout. Nothing more nothing less, if it works awesome, if not, ah well.

Whether you think he is more of a perimeter player or goes hard to the net it's worth a shot. I don't care if he shoots the puck out of his @$$ if it goes in and the line works.

If it doesn't then they try something else.

Personally i don't believe carter is a fit.

Honestly i dont know if lundmark is a fit {we're all gonna find out}.

Interested in the idea of Moore as a RW, in college he came off that right side strongly and though i don't think he is a first line player, character might just be enough to push him a little further than his talents which are pretty good as is.

It's worth a shoot trying Lundmark. Maybe he'll have the enthusiasm to kickstart Lindros. If nothing else he'll get alot of minutes.

Whether you think he is more of a perimeter player or goes hard to the net it's worth a shot. I don't care if he shoots the puck out of his @$$ if it goes in and the line works.



Well that certainly would be an interesting sight to see now wouldn't it! But seriously you're right. There is know hurt in trying to see if Lundmark would work better on the top line then Carter. If he doesn't then hopefully he stays on Holik's right side.

JR, I understand that Lindros has had his best 'career' success with a guy like Leclair but that was pre concussions. This isn't the same player that played in Philly. he can't afford to go crashing into the zone like that bull in the china shop. I still believe he can be effective WHEN healthy but he's different now. He's ammended his game to use the great skill that he has to survive in the NHL. Remember he was dubbed the next great thing because he brought a skill set that nobody had seen on a man that size. At the age of 30 (31?) I believe he still has that skill set which I think he could use just as well with Lundmark as Carter.

i'd like to think either way Lundmark is going to have a bigger role this season.....but i know i am probably asking for too much.