NFL Offseason Thread v2.0

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Jason MacIsaac
04-29-2005, 02:29 PM
- Mike Heimerdinger is our new Offensive Coordinator and anything other then Hackett is a huge improvment.

- We traded Moss to Washington for Pennington's favorite target Laveranues Coles, depends how he holds up.

- Our young defense which lead us into the playoffs will only get better and younger.

- Mike Nugget will give us a foot that can convert 45+ yard attempts with ease and is one of the better foots to come along in a good time.

- We aquired Doug Jolley which gives us one of the better offensive attacks from the TE position in the league.

- Justin Miller has the potential to be the shutdown CB that the Jets have needed the past few years and with Strait allready emerging as a great back.

Are expectations of the Jets going to be the highest in quite some time. I think we have a good shot to make the super bowl this year.

JCD
04-29-2005, 02:34 PM
It's too bad they have to share the division with the defending Patriots and rising Bills.

Might be one of the top-4 teams in the AFC and still have to settle on a WC berth.

GKJ
04-29-2005, 02:35 PM
Yeah that AFC East is gonna be tough to get out of

Dr Love
04-29-2005, 02:41 PM
- We aquired Doug Jolley which gives us one of the better offensive attacks from the TE position in the league.
Uh, no. In no order... Tony Gonzalez, Antonio Gates, Todd Heap, Bubba Franks, Randy McMichael, Alge Crumpler, Dallas Clark, Marcus Pollard, Jason Witten, Eric Johnson, LJ Smith, Jeremy Shockey, Kellen Winslow*, and Jermaine Wiggins/Jimmy Kleinsasser, are all better threats. Guys like Jerramy Stevens, Ben Troupe, Jeb Putizer, and Chris Cooley are on his level, if not better, and could be better next year. Doug Jolley is, at best, a mid level starting TE.

*Should be, no reason not to think so.

GKJ
04-29-2005, 02:42 PM
At least the Jets have the most entertaining coach in the league...

Dr Love
04-29-2005, 02:45 PM
At least the Jets have the most entertaining coach in the league...
Martz is more fun to watch, although he really dropped off last year in his overt hatred and annoyance with refs. Hopefully he'll throw a few challenge flags out there in the first 2 minutes of a game again.

GKJ
04-29-2005, 02:47 PM
Hopefully he'll throw a few challenge flags out there in the first 2 minutes of a game again.


When did this happen? :biglaugh:

Jason MacIsaac
04-29-2005, 02:48 PM
Uh, no. In no order... Tony Gonzalez, Antonio Gates, Todd Heap, Bubba Franks, Randy McMichael, Alge Crumpler, Dallas Clark, Marcus Pollard, Jason Witten, Eric Johnson, LJ Smith, Jeremy Shockey, Kellen Winslow*, and Jermaine Wiggins/Jimmy Kleinsasser, are all better threats. Guys like Jerramy Stevens, Ben Troupe, Jeb Putizer, and Chris Cooley are on his level, if not better, and could be better next year. Doug Jolley is, at best, a mid level starting TE.

*Should be, no reason not to think so.
Really, from what I heard he was top 10. I think he will work better then the Jets system then Oakland because unlike Oakland, the jets have a two way attack in the air and ground. Oakland didn't exactly have a good running game. 12/13 yards per reception is good enough, much better then what we had.

Dr Love
04-29-2005, 02:48 PM
When did this happen? :biglaugh:Two years ago. I don't remember the game or exactly when it happened, but in the first few minutes of a game Martz, coming off a pair of games that he was livid with the refs about, got in their face almost immediately--over a dinky call too. I'll try and find a recap of the game.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/7730919

I remember we were doing a Rams game last year on FOX. In the first quarter of a scoreless game, Rams receiver Torry Holt (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133310) caught a 5-yard out pass and ran up the sideline for another four yards. The official marked him four yards short of where he actually went out of bounds, so Rams coach Mike Martz throws his flag to challenge the spot.

Gee Wally
04-29-2005, 02:50 PM
Flutie close to becoming a Patriot


http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2005/04/29/flutie_close_to_becoming_a_patriot/



:D

Jason MacIsaac
04-29-2005, 02:51 PM
Flutie close to becoming a Patriot


http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2005/04/29/flutie_close_to_becoming_a_patriot/



:D
I guess that makes Brady expendable......trade him to.....hrmmmm......Dallas. :)

Nifty=HHOF
04-29-2005, 02:59 PM
- Are expectations of the Jets going to be the highest in quite some time. I think we have a good shot to make the super bowl this year.


Not until you prove you can beat the elite teams in the league which you couldn't last year. What was the Jets record against playoff teams (2-4) last year vs their record vs non-playoff (8-2) teams? You were a combined 0 - 4 against the two best teams in the AFC (N.E. and Pitt). Are the changes you suggested enough to get the Jets to be able to beat 2 of NE/Indy/Pitt in January most likely on the road? Given questions about Pennington's health and Martin's age, sorry I just don't see it.

NYRangers
04-29-2005, 02:59 PM
Flutie is close to becoming a Giant according to the paper lol. I read it today.

Anyway, the Jets are in trouble. No safety. No right tackle. No defensive end opposite Ellis. No defensive tackle.

I am a Jets fan, but don't expect much of an improvement.

FlyersGuy69
04-29-2005, 03:37 PM
I guess that makes Brady expendable......trade him to.....hrmmmm......Dallas. :)
were waiting by the phone... :thumbu:

PredsFan77*
04-29-2005, 03:39 PM
- Mike Heimerdinger is our new Offensive Coordinator and anything other then Hackett is a huge improvment.



- Justin Miller has the potential to be the shutdown CB that the Jets have needed the past few years and with Strait allready emerging as a great back.



Wait for Heimerdinger to jump ship like he did this year....adios I say.

Justin Miller went to clemson thus he sucks....all bias aside, he shut down Troy Williamson at the USC/Clemson game. Troy only had as I recall (I was trashed) 1-2 catches the entire game.

loveshack2
04-29-2005, 04:26 PM
It's official

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/3580558

"Doug Flutie, who won a Heisman Trophy at Boston College and played for the Patriots during a well-traveled professional career, has signed a one-year deal to return to New England."

MontrealCruiser_83*
04-29-2005, 04:33 PM
Since when has Pennington stopped to suck?

I guess I missed the memo.

MLH
04-29-2005, 05:17 PM
They should be good enough for third in the AFC East.

Jason MacIsaac
04-29-2005, 07:05 PM
Since when has Pennington stopped to suck?

I guess I missed the memo.
He sucks? The guy is a top 10 quarterback in a fugly offensive system. With Coles comming back wait for him next year.

MontrealCruiser_83*
04-29-2005, 07:34 PM
He sucks? The guy is a top 10 quarterback in a fugly offensive system. With Coles comming back wait for him next year.
To be honest, I was baiting for somebody to come out and say that he's a top-10 QB. Well, how does it feel? He'll start the season at 29 years old and it's safe to say that his top-end "potential" will never materialize. I thought he was ready coming out of college and that sitting him for two years was a waste of his development. Don't blame the system, he's just never been able to consistently bring the offence to the next level.

FlyersGuy69
04-29-2005, 09:21 PM
PHILADELPHIA -- With Terrell Owens absent, Donovan McNabb didn't miss his target.

While Owens skipped Philadelphia's first mini-camp practice on Friday, McNabb responded sternly to the All-Pro wide receiver's stinging comments about the quarterback's performance in the Eagles' 24-21 loss to New England in the Super Bowl.

"I don't play games in the media," McNabb said. "I'm not going to sit here and try to have a war of words. I'm a man at what I do. If there's a problem with anyone, and they feel the need to lash out, they know how to get in touch with me and we can handle it like men."

Conti... (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2049794)

NICE! its good to see McNabb draw the line with TO. we all know there was no reason to make the comment about McNabb being tired in the Super Bowl or trying to throw one of your teamates under the bus but that is the type of guy TO is. TO isn't playing with Jeff Garcia (who wouldn't defend himself), anymore.

Sal Palantonio has also reported that TO has dug his heals in and is prepared to sit out for the year. source WIP610

Vic Rattlehead*
04-29-2005, 09:23 PM
TO is such an a$$.

Gibsons Finest
04-29-2005, 09:34 PM
I doubt Philly will let TO sit out all season. And by that I am most certainly not implying they will give in. If he sits out, he's as good as gone IMO.

So, you now must wonder, where does TO end up in, should Philly decide to trade him? Hotlanta and Minny are two great fits, but I doubt Philly sends him to either. I'm guessing he's AFC bound, should he be traded, with either KC or NY being the two best fits IMO.

FlyersGuy69
04-29-2005, 10:02 PM
I doubt Philly will let TO sit out all season. And by that I am most certainly not implying they will give in. If he sits out, he's as good as gone IMO.

So, you now must wonder, where does TO end up in, should Philly decide to trade him? Hotlanta and Minny are two great fits, but I doubt Philly sends him to either. I'm guessing he's AFC bound, should he be traded, with either KC or NY being the two best fits IMO.
agreed.
also, it will probably be contingent on him getting a new deal too...so that will have a big part in were he goes.

JCD
04-29-2005, 10:14 PM
I doubt Philly will let TO sit out all season. And by that I am most certainly not implying they will give in. If he sits out, he's as good as gone IMO.

So, you now must wonder, where does TO end up in, should Philly decide to trade him? Hotlanta and Minny are two great fits, but I doubt Philly sends him to either. I'm guessing he's AFC bound, should he be traded, with either KC or NY being the two best fits IMO.

Vikes just got rid of Randy because of his distraction factor and drafted a WR 7th overall. I don't think they will be interested in Owens.

Hockeyfan02
04-29-2005, 10:16 PM
I love the player TO, but the guy is a total jackass as a person. The guy has no respect for his QBs. He said he left San Fran to play with a real QB (after he had taken numerous jabs at Garcia and wanted Rattay to be the starter) and then he goes out and makes comments about Mcnabb in the media. I really thought the guy had changed after this season and his comeback in the SB. But I guess the more things change, the more they stay the same. I doubt Philly gives in on his contract demands. He'll come back after TC to play and start collecting his paychecks.

Jason MacIsaac
04-29-2005, 10:18 PM
To be honest, I was baiting for somebody to come out and say that he's a top-10 QB. Well, how does it feel? He'll start the season at 29 years old and it's safe to say that his top-end "potential" will never materialize. I thought he was ready coming out of college and that sitting him for two years was a waste of his development. Don't blame the system, he's just never been able to consistently bring the offence to the next level.
When you have Hackett calling 8 yard plays 3rd and 10 then I don't think any Quarterback will get the job done. Pennington is a great quarterback and when they use him in different ways other then dump passes then you will see how good he can be.

Nikkowar
04-30-2005, 12:28 AM
This T.O thing is ridculous. Last time I checked,he was signed for 7 years(either that,or my eye sight has gone down the drain),and if I remember,7 years hasn't passed. I saw this coming to,my idea is,if he does sit out,trade his ass outta here.

Oil_slick9416*
04-30-2005, 12:35 AM
Ron mexico?

Troy McClure
04-30-2005, 01:14 AM
TO isn't worth whatever he's demanding. That much he's made clear.

The Flash
04-30-2005, 01:37 AM
I'd like to see the Eagles rip up his contract and give him a 1 year deal based on his play the previous season. If he plays well he gets a larger salary next year. If he stinks it up he gets paid lower or sees himself unemployed. But, we all know that won't happen because TO is all about TO.

He's a great player, just a ****** teammate and an ******* of a person.

Anthony*
04-30-2005, 02:01 AM
TO isn't worth whatever he's demanding. That much he's made clear.uh

how so

PredsFan77*
04-30-2005, 04:27 AM
McNabb, 'Just keep the ball out of my hands when the game is on the line.'

Chilly Willy*
04-30-2005, 06:05 AM
TO is an asset to the organization, is there anyway that the Philadelphia Eagles can sue Terrell and make him pay the team back?

There has to be some way, the player is under contract is he not? that means he is obliged to play barring any injuries or health/mental problems, he has problems but arrogance is not a mental disease.

I would love to see the Eagles sue Terell because he draws fans and the team is losing revenue because of his stupidity and he is under contract. I'm not Mr Law-talking-guy so i wouldn't know but there has to be a way that the team can sue a player that is under contract.

Chilly Willy*
04-30-2005, 06:10 AM
Trade him to the Detroit Lions, he'll suffer there.

Nifty=HHOF
04-30-2005, 06:11 AM
Pennington is a great quarterback and when they use him in different ways other then dump passes then you will see how good he can be.

What have you seen from Pennington to make you think he is capable of being great? The Pennington I've seen so far is a good NFL QB, but quite a ways from being great.

JCD
04-30-2005, 06:30 AM
To be honest, I was baiting for somebody to come out and say that he's a top-10 QB. Well, how does it feel? He'll start the season at 29 years old and it's safe to say that his top-end "potential" will never materialize. I thought he was ready coming out of college and that sitting him for two years was a waste of his development. Don't blame the system, he's just never been able to consistently bring the offence to the next level.

I think you are being overly harsh here. Pennington is not elite in the Manning sense of the word, but you would be hard pressed to name 10 better than he is.

Dr Love
04-30-2005, 07:01 AM
His comments weren't just about TO.

Enoch
04-30-2005, 09:02 AM
Its not just TO - Its Rosenhaus. TO is an idiot and to pull this stunt is, in a word, ridiculous. However, Rosenhaus has a huge list of players sitting out and wanting new contracts. In fact, if you read ESPNs article on training camps, you will notice that many of the teams have a star player (represented by Rosenhaus) sitting out.

JCD
04-30-2005, 09:59 AM
I am shocked how many people actually thought TO had changed his ways. He was a self-centered, crybaby and HORRIBLE teammate in San Fran, is the same self-centered crybaby, HORRIBLE teammate in Philly. He may be talented, but there is a reason the Niners were quite happy to wash their hands of one of the top-4 receivers in the game today.

Just when you think TO isn't so bad, he does something to remind you. Even after he was getting so many props for his gutsy Super Bowl performance, he goes out and reminds you he is TO immediately afterwards. (For those that don't know, in the post-game interviews he told everybody that he played to prove his critics wrong, he didn't say it was to help his team win).

If the Eagles wanted to move TO, I am sure they could. He is exceedingly talented, but that would be cause serious cap issues and I doubt the Eagles will cow-tow to TO's demands.

You almost have to feel bad for McNabb in this. Sure he choked (figuratively and literally), but he is still a respected player and leader for that team. He doesn't deserve this crap.

Motown Beatdown
04-30-2005, 10:35 AM
The Eagles knew what they were getting when they traded for TO. So really i dont feel sorry for them. Whens TO gonna start calling McNabb gay??

FlyersGuy69
04-30-2005, 11:37 AM
TO is an asset to the organization, is there anyway that the Philadelphia Eagles can sue Terrell and make him pay the team back?

There has to be some way, the player is under contract is he not? that means he is obliged to play barring any injuries or health/mental problems, he has problems but arrogance is not a mental disease.

I would love to see the Eagles sue Terell because he draws fans and the team is losing revenue because of his stupidity and he is under contract. I'm not Mr Law-talking-guy so i wouldn't know but there has to be a way that the team can sue a player that is under contract.
Sal Palantonio said one espn, that the Eagles could sue to get part of his signing bonus back. I think it was 1. something million dollars.

also, the Eagles could just let him sit and rot, the guy is 32 and really can't afford to waste to many of these years. positions like RB and WR tend to jrop off quickly when they get into their early 30's.

I myself, can't imagine any team out there willing to give this guy a long term contract after what he's pulled in San Fran and now Philly. for a player like him, you couldn't ask for a better situation than Philly.

EDIT: the only team may be the Raida's...

Dr Love
04-30-2005, 11:42 AM
the only team may be the Raida's... I could see Dan Snyder giving him a contract. Or Jerry Jones. And I didn't even take into account that they're in the same division.

Fire Sather
04-30-2005, 12:05 PM
Meh, when was it when a contract was a contract?

FlyersGuy69
04-30-2005, 12:32 PM
I could see Dan Snyder giving him a contract. Or Jerry Jones. And I didn't even take into account that they're in the same division.
Snyder yes. Jones no.

they have both made their share of boneheaded moves but Jones isn't making the moves now, Parcells is. Parcells has said that he is to old to deal with self centered players, thugs and hoodlums and TO fits in there somewhere. so I don't see anyway he comes to the Cowboys, putting the fact that they are in the Eagles division aside.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 12:42 PM
']Meh, when was it when a contract was a contract?

TO should be in camp since he signed the contract last offseason, but teams don't honor contracts when they release players.

mmbt
04-30-2005, 12:49 PM
EDIT: the only team may be the Raida's...

Not as long as they have Moss. Moss may be a little flaky, but while he can cause teammates to pull their hair out sometimes he doesn't give them nearly as much reason to hate his guts. Don't think he's ever held out while under contract either, has he?

Really, Moss is less of a headache, at this point is less of a cap hit, is younger, and has been more productive.

If there was only one taker for Moss (who negotiated his deal down to give the Raiders more cap space), how much of a market will there be for a TO that wants a pay RAISE? Not much.

Sammy*
04-30-2005, 01:01 PM
TO should be in camp since he signed the contract last offseason, but teams don't honor contracts when they release players.
What are you talking about. Its a term of their CBA that the contracts are not guaranteed. Its not a term of their contracts or CBA that a player can, on his own accord, not play when he is contractually obliged to.
Good lord, its very elementary.

MontrealCruiser_83*
04-30-2005, 01:11 PM
I think you are being overly harsh here. Pennington is not elite in the Manning sense of the word, but you would be hard pressed to name 10 better than he is.
In a general order:
Manning
Brady
Culpepper
McNabb
Green
Vick
Favre
Delhomme
McNair
Brees

You can also make a case for Hasselbeck.

Imo, Pennington is in Plummer, Bulger, Brooks class. Around the 15 range.

He's injury prone, inconsistent, and nearing 30. We've pretty much seen his ceiling.

JCD
04-30-2005, 01:23 PM
In a general order:
Manning
Brady
Culpepper
McNabb
Green
Vick
Favre
Delhomme
McNair
Brees

You can also make a case for Hasselbeck.

Imo, Pennington is in Plummer, Bulger, Brooks class. Around the 15 range.

He's injury prone, inconsistent, and nearing 30. We've pretty much seen his ceiling.

I think you are being rather inconsistent here. Lets go over some of the guys on your list:

Trent Green- Trent Green will be 35 this year. If you are worried about Pennington at 29, this guy has to scare the crap out of you. Despite being in a far more productive offense, he isn't that much more productive than Pennington. Furthermore, Trent Green didn't start a game until he was 28 years old. Didn't join the Chiefs until he was 31. Didn't get mentioned as a worthwhile starter until he was 33. If you are pimping Green whose career didn't take off until he was OLDER than Pennington is, then you have to give Pennington some credit.

Jake Delhomme- Know how many games Delhomme had started when he was Pennington's age? TWO, as a second year player. He was Pennington's age when he joined the Panthers. I don't see how you can say Pennington has reached his potential and then pimp a guy like Delhomme who had shown NOTHING when he was Pennington's age.

Drew Brees- I would highly contest this selection. Drew Brees has ONE good season in his 4-year career. He could very well be another Scott Mitchell, a 1-year-wonder. Pennington has been just as impressive as his best (2002) but has been more consistent.

How can you say that Pennington is as good as he will ever be (a career 93.7 QB rating is pretty damn good), and then say guys like Green and Delhomme are better? Clearly, 29 is not the end-of-the-line for a QB. Your choices of Delhomme and Green prove it.

Say you leave all those 10 on, you are still admitting that Pennington is right behind them in the 11-15 range. That is still a good QB, far from 'sucking' as you claimed he does. Pennington is not a weak link.

PredsFan77*
04-30-2005, 01:27 PM
In a general order:
Manning
Brady
Culpepper
McNabb
Green
Vick
Favre
Delhomme
McNair
Brees

You can also make a case for Hasselbeck.

Imo, Pennington is in Plummer, Bulger, Brooks class. Around the 15 range.

He's injury prone, inconsistent, and nearing 30. We've pretty much seen his ceiling.


Brees has just had one great year...hardly top 10 status.



Delhomme is a bum, plus I hate his guts so we'll leave him out...but he's not in top 10 status.

I'd take Pennington over him and probably Green.

MontrealCruiser_83*
04-30-2005, 01:36 PM
I think you are being rather inconsistent here. Lets go over some of the guys on your list:

Trent Green- Trent Green will be 35 this year. If you are worried about Pennington at 29, this guy has to scare the crap out of you. Despite being in a far more productive offense, he isn't that much more productive than Pennington. Furthermore, Trent Green didn't start a game until he was 28 years old. Didn't join the Chiefs until he was 31. Didn't get mentioned as a worthwhile starter until he was 33. If you are pimping Green whose career didn't take off until he was OLDER than Pennington is, then you have to give Pennington some credit.

Jake Delhomme- Know how many games Delhomme had started when he was Pennington's age? TWO, as a second year player. He was Pennington's age when he joined the Panthers. I don't see how you can say Pennington has reached his potential and then pimp a guy like Delhomme who had shown NOTHING when he was Pennington's age.

Drew Brees- I would highly contest this selection. Drew Brees has ONE good season in his 4-year career. He could very well be another Scott Mitchell, a 1-year-wonder. Pennington has been just as impressive as his best (2002) but has been more consistent.

How can you say that Pennington is as good as he will ever be (a career 93.7 QB rating is pretty damn good), and then say guys like Green and Delhomme are better? Clearly, 29 is not the end-of-the-line for a QB. Your choices of Delhomme and Green prove it.

Say you leave all those 10 on, you are still admitting that Pennington is right behind them in the 11-15 range. That is still a good QB, far from 'sucking' as you claimed he does. Pennington is not a weak link.
My concern with age isn't about the QB breaking down, but instead in terms of development. Delhomme is a Volek kind of guy. Both were backups but had the necessary tools all along and were able to step in right away. Green was solid early on in his career, stalled for 2-3 years due to injuries, and then broke out as an excellent QB. Sure his system works to his benefit, but all he has is Gonzy to throw to.

Pennington was ready when he came out of college, but they stalled his development. He had the potential to be in the 3-10 range, but the fact that he isn't makes him a disappointment in my eyes. Again, I was baiting by saying that he sucks because he clearly doesn't, but I'm aware of many Jet fans that think he's a great QB. Which he isn't. He hasn't brought the Jets to the next level despite having an adequate supporting cast. Admit it, if he has a dismal season, the Jets are looking for a replacement. He's not "safe".

Chilly Willy*
04-30-2005, 01:39 PM
']Meh, when was it when a contract was a contract?


Doesn't exist.

PredsFan77*
04-30-2005, 01:46 PM
My concern with age isn't about the QB breaking down, but instead in terms of development. Delhomme is a Volek kind of guy. Both were backups but had the necessary tools all along and were able to step in right away. Green was solid early on in his career, stalled for 2-3 years due to injuries, and then broke out as an excellent QB. Sure his system works to his benefit, but all he has is Gonzy to throw to.

Pennington was ready when he came out of college, but they stalled his development. He had the potential to be in the 3-10 range, but the fact that he isn't makes him a disappointment in my eyes. Again, I was baiting by saying that he sucks because he clearly doesn't, but I'm aware of many Jet fans that think he's a great QB. Which he isn't. He hasn't brought the Jets to the next level despite having an adequate supporting cast. Admit it, if he has a dismal season, the Jets are looking for a replacement. He's not "safe".

He's a quality classy QB that has a touch on the football....he's not a thrower...he's a passer..his mind is aheaddd of what the defense is and if the Jets can support him they will win the championship.

He's struggaliiiing.


and I want to kiss you.

jacketracket*
04-30-2005, 02:12 PM
I'm really looking forward to seeing how well Nugent does with the Jets. He was about as automatic as kickers come, his last 3 seasons at Ohio State.

Nice grab by jets brass, IMO.

JCD
04-30-2005, 02:13 PM
My concern with age isn't about the QB breaking down, but instead in terms of development. Delhomme is a Volek kind of guy. Both were backups but had the necessary tools all along and were able to step in right away. Green was solid early on in his career, stalled for 2-3 years due to injuries, and then broke out as an excellent QB. Sure his system works to his benefit, but all he has is Gonzy to throw to.

Pennington was ready when he came out of college, but they stalled his development. He had the potential to be in the 3-10 range, but the fact that he isn't makes him a disappointment in my eyes. Again, I was baiting by saying that he sucks because he clearly doesn't, but I'm aware of many Jet fans that think he's a great QB. Which he isn't. He hasn't brought the Jets to the next level despite having an adequate supporting cast. Admit it, if he has a dismal season, the Jets are looking for a replacement. He's not "safe".

He is good, not great. Maybe we are quibbling over semantics here. I would put Pennington in the 7-12 range myself, I don't think that is too far off the 10-15 range you would rank him.

I don't see Pennington as a weak link. He can't carry a team, but he can certainly carry his weight. That supporting cast isn't as great as you make it seem. If he were a mediocer player being carried by the talent around him, wouldn't that talent make Testeverde and Carter seem at least passable? Both of them had more success with the meager Dallas talent than they did with what Pennington had to work with. I would reverse that and say that Pennington is making the talent around him look better than it is (ala the aging Martin and the prodical child Coles). Without Pennington, the team struggled.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 02:50 PM
What are you talking about. Its a term of their CBA that the contracts are not guaranteed. Its not a term of their contracts or CBA that a player can, on his own accord, not play when he is contractually obliged to.
Good lord, its very elementary.

I know players can do that, they do it all the time. Woodson, Peterson, Mccardell sat out TC just to name a few while Mccardell sat out in to the season until he got traded. I'm just saying based on that he signed the contract last offseason, I feel he should be in mini camp now. If he didn't like the contract then, he shouldn't have signed it. If he didn't feel like he was going to be paid like a top WR then why did he sign it? I usually support players when they hold out when people say they should honor a contract, because teams don't honor contracts. In this case, because he signed the contract just 12 months ago, I do not support his case. Especially when he is already being payed like he is a top WR.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 02:56 PM
Delhomme is a bum, plus I hate his guts so we'll leave him out...but he's not in top 10 status.

Delhomme is a good QB, despite youre bias against him and the Panthers.

Pennington is a top 10 QB, but just barly. You can make a case for him being top 10 and you can make a case for 10 guys being better than him.

Blackjack
04-30-2005, 03:18 PM
Not until you prove you can beat the elite teams in the league which you couldn't last year. What was the Jets record against playoff teams (2-4) last year vs their record vs non-playoff (8-2) teams? You were a combined 0 - 4 against the two best teams in the AFC (N.E. and Pitt). Are the changes you suggested enough to get the Jets to be able to beat 2 of NE/Indy/Pitt in January most likely on the road? Given questions about Pennington's health and Martin's age, sorry I just don't see it.

Yeah, and there were lots of teams beating Pittsburgh and NE last year right? They played Pittsburgh toe to toe only losing on a blown FG (two, actually). They may not be a best team in the league, but they definatly have the talent to make a SB run.

I'm not worried about Martin or Pennington, they will be fine.

Flutie is close to becoming a Giant according to the paper lol. I read it today.

Anyway, the Jets are in trouble. No safety. No right tackle. No defensive end opposite Ellis. No defensive tackle.

I am a Jets fan, but don't expect much of an improvement.

What do you mean no safety? They have Coleman and McGraw, a couple of very good safeties. Yes McGraw is injury prone, but they have Kerry Rhodes for depth.

Adrian Jones is the RT, you can't have a veteran at every position, and the coaching staff seems to love Jones and thinks he is ready. I'm pretty sure John Abraham will be lining up opposite Ellis when all is said and done, even if he's not, Brian Thomas played very well last year and is ready to break out. As for DT, Ferguson only looked good last year because he was playing next to Robertson, Pouha will be fine and is a bit bigger than Ferguson anyway.

Look at how much we upgraded TE, CB, WR, PK, KR, and most importantly: Offensive Coordinator

MLH
04-30-2005, 03:22 PM
Look at how much we upgraded TE, CB, WR, PK, KR, and most importantly: Offensive Coordinator

Is Miller your "upgrade" at CB or am I forgetting an acquisition?

Blackjack
04-30-2005, 03:30 PM
Is Miller your "upgrade" at CB or am I forgetting an acquisition?

Well, Mickens is healthy now, Strait was injured last year, but looked good in the few games he played, he will probably start this year. I'm not sure what your problem with Miller is, but I'd consider a projected 1st round CB to be an upgrade as well.

Fire Sather
04-30-2005, 03:46 PM
J-e-t-s Jets Jets Jets

Nifty=HHOF
04-30-2005, 03:55 PM
Yeah, and there were lots of teams beating Pittsburgh and NE last year right? They played Pittsburgh toe to toe only losing on a blown FG (two, actually). They may not be a best team in the league, but they definatly have the talent to make a SB run.

I'm not worried about Martin or Pennington, they will be fine.


That's my point, to go to the Super Bowl from the AFC they probably have to beat 2 of NE/Pitt/Indy plus maybe a SD or Baltimore in the Wild Card round.

You're correct about almost beating Pittsburgh, but they were also a missed FG away from losing to SD in the first round.

A 32 y.o. RB (who lost his back-up) and a QB coming off of surgery on his throwing shoulder should be at least a concern.

Playoff team - Most Likely, Super Bowl - Sorry, I still don't see it - maybe if they were an NFC team.

MLH
04-30-2005, 04:04 PM
Well, Mickens is healthy now, Strait was injured last year, but looked good in the few games he played, he will probably start this year. I'm not sure what your problem with Miller is, but I'd consider a projected 1st round CB to be an upgrade as well.

I don't have a problem with Miller and it was a good value pick, but I don't think you should be relying on the 10th cornerback chosen to immediately upgrade your secondary.

What's the latest on John Abraham?

Blackjack
04-30-2005, 04:26 PM
I don't have a problem with Miller and it was a good value pick, but I don't think you should be relying on the 10th cornerback chosen to immediately upgrade your secondary.

What's the latest on John Abraham?

IMO, he's much better than the 10th best CB in that class. Guys like Washington and Routt were chosen for their combine speed (one of the worst reasons to draft a DB) and Williams and Webster never should have been drafted ahead of a talent like Miller. Also, considering it was a draft very deep in DBs, and Donnie Henderson's ability to mold the secondary, I like Miller's odds this year.

Nothing's going on with Abraham as far as I can tell. I think he'll get signed eventually, because I think both sides just have too much to lose. (Then again, that's what I thought about the NHL :madfire:

Blackjack
04-30-2005, 04:38 PM
That's my point, to go to the Super Bowl from the AFC they probably have to beat 2 of NE/Pitt/Indy plus maybe a SD or Baltimore in the Wild Card round.

You're correct about almost beating Pittsburgh, but they were also a missed FG away from losing to SD in the first round.

A 32 y.o. RB (who lost his back-up) and a QB coming off of surgery on his throwing shoulder should be at least a concern.

Playoff team - Most Likely, Super Bowl - Sorry, I still don't see it - maybe if they were an NFC team.

Eh, I'm not concerned about Indy or SD. Sure, they are quality teams, and on any given Sunday could beat The Jets. But I think that the Jets are a better team than either.

I agree that NE and Pittsburgh are still better, but I think that NY is closer than most people realise.

I'm not worried about Martin because Heimerdinger's offense and Derrick Blaylock should mean fewer carries. Pennington was injured down the strech last year, he should only be better now that he is past the surgery.

Gibsons Finest
04-30-2005, 05:48 PM
Now I'm not sure of Philly's cap situation, but if it's not good enough, then maybe this is only if TO is traded for someone that is paid less than TO's $7 million or so. This would also be contingent that Indy trade for someone like Travis Henry:

To Philly: Edgerrin James

To Indy: Corey Simon


Last I heard(and please correct me if I'm wrong), Simon is unhappy with his contract, as is Brian Westbrook. Indy, last I heard, doesn't want to pay James his contract, but could use a guy like Simon, especially since they didn't draft a DT untill the later rounds. This could allow Philly to trade Westbrook for something else. With Edge, the run game would be better, and while Westbrook brings alot to the table as a receiver coming out of the backfield, Edge is no slouch in that department(1st all time IIRC in yards from scrimmage).

Nifty=HHOF
04-30-2005, 06:13 PM
What's the latest on John Abraham?

He did not report for the Jets minicamp this week. I don't have a link to a story, but it was in the paper on Thursday/Friday. He still hasn't signed his one year contract.

Nifty=HHOF
04-30-2005, 06:27 PM
Here's a link for the Abraham story from the New York Daily News. It's at the bottom under Notes;

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/story/305065p-261060c.html

BROADSTREETBULLY
04-30-2005, 06:37 PM
you have me stumped .....from what i here ,Simon has lost his starting job going into camp with the pick of Mike Patterson from USC.....Simon was franchised i believe...not sure what that means if they release him..Simon has not lived up to his hype and has actually goten worse each year (had a nice rookie year,52 tackles,9.5 sacks....but fell to 32 and 5.5 this year)...I wont miss Simon..anyway..I think Philly has more to worry about(TO)
and as for the salary cap...no problem..philly is like 8 million under(before the draft anyway)
http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/numbers.asp

Sammy*
04-30-2005, 06:42 PM
I know players can do that, they do it all the time. Woodson, Peterson, Mccardell sat out TC just to name a few while Mccardell sat out in to the season until he got traded. I'm just saying based on that he signed the contract last offseason, I feel he should be in mini camp now. If he didn't like the contract then, he shouldn't have signed it. If he didn't feel like he was going to be paid like a top WR then why did he sign it? I usually support players when they hold out when people say they should honor a contract, because teams don't honor contracts. In this case, because he signed the contract just 12 months ago, I do not support his case. Especially when he is already being payed like he is a top WR.
I think you & I agree but teams do honor the contracts even when they get cut. Its a term of the contracr/CBA that they can cut the guy & not have to pay them.
Players dont & I would love to see a judge hammer a player in punitive damages for doing this sort of crap that is all too common.
Then maybe those agents & players would stop pulling these stunts.

Gibsons Finest
04-30-2005, 06:47 PM
IMO, TO oughta shut his mouth and play. Like I said before, Philly will trade him if he sits out, and I'm not sure how much he'd like it if he was traded to a team like Buffalo or Miami. While this is no knock on either team, he's in a great situation in Philly, with a great QB in McNabb, and why screw it up and then get traded to a team with a below-average QB?

TVanek26*
04-30-2005, 06:48 PM
Bills Eagles Talking Trade

The Buffalo Bills are looking into a possible trade with the Philadelphia Eagles, that would send disgruntled running back Travis Henry to the Eagles with a late round draft pick for defensive tackle Corey Simon. The NFC champions selected Southern California defensive tackle Mike Patterson in the first round to possibly replace Simon and are looking into acquiring Henry for a possible replacement to Brian Westbrook. The Bills, also are pretty thin at the defensive tackle position with losing Pat Williams to free agency and an unproven Ron Edwards being there projected starter opposite of Sam Adams. Both Brown and Henry are entering the last year in there contracts and would both teams would have to agree on an extension if a deal would be close to finalized.


http://www.profootballcentral.com/


I hope this is true :)

Gibsons Finest
04-30-2005, 06:51 PM
Bills Eagles Talking Trade

The Buffalo Bills are looking into a possible trade with the Philadelphia Eagles, that would send disgruntled running back Travis Henry to the Eagles with a late round draft pick for defensive tackle Corey Simon. The NFC champions selected Southern California defensive tackle Mike Patterson in the first round to possibly replace Simon and are looking into acquiring Henry for a possible replacement to Brian Westbrook. The Bills, also are pretty thin at the defensive tackle position with losing Pat Williams to free agency and an unproven Ron Edwards being there projected starter opposite of Sam Adams. Both Brown and Henry are entering the last year in there contracts and would both teams would have to agree on an extension if a deal would be close to finalized.


http://www.profootballcentral.com/


I hope this is true :)


Well, maybe I was on to something, minus the Edge going to Philly and Henry going to Indy. That'd be a good trade for both teams, although it'd definetely leave less of a market for Edge to be traded in, and a potential replacement for Edge would be taken off the market.

blah
04-30-2005, 07:13 PM
The Eagles don't need Henry after getting Moats in the 3rd round. I hope they dump Simon for whatever picks they can get though. Maybe work out a trade for a conditional pick, so they get a higher pick if Simon resigns with the team he's dealt to.

loveshack2
04-30-2005, 07:16 PM
They should trade him to Baltimore.

flamesfan01800
04-30-2005, 07:27 PM
Why don't they just keep Westbrook he seems to do the job for them quite well

Gibsons Finest
04-30-2005, 07:29 PM
Why don't they just keep Westbrook he seems to do the job for them quite well

I believe he wants a new contract too. He missed mini-camp, along with TO, Simon, and Freddie Mitchell.

JCD
04-30-2005, 07:48 PM
I don't know what to think about this trade. James is a much better back than Westbrook, making Westbrook expendable. Value-wise, this would favor the Eagles IMO. However, it is a flooded RB market and the Colts lack cap room. Perhaps they lack the cap room to accomodate Simon though.

As for Moats, he is nearly identical in style to Westbrook. Henry is still a viable option since he is the between-the-tackles compliment Westbrook needs. I don't consider Buckhalter worth mentioning. Henry for Simon makes more sense. Henry would be cheaper and compliment Westbrook rather than replace him.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 08:07 PM
Its a term of the contracr/CBA that they can cut the guy & not have to pay them.


I know. Doesn't make it right what they do to a player. A guy signs a 3 year/ 3 million dollar deal, player holds out after the 2nd year and gets criticized for not honoring the contract. A player signs 3 years/6 million dollar deal, gets cut after the first year and the team doesn't have to pay him what they said they would in the contract. Not exactly honoring the contract that they would pay them for the full 3 years. I usually(not in this TO situation) side with the players for asking for more money in the NFL because not much money is guranteed and you can be gone the next day and the team doesn't have to pay you a cent. These guys don't have much time as a professional football player and injuries they could suffer might make it hard for them to find a job when football is over, so they should go for the most money they can. Just my opinion.

The Flash
04-30-2005, 08:41 PM
I know. Doesn't make it right what they do to a player. A guy signs a 3 year/ 3 million dollar deal, player holds out after the 2nd year and gets criticized for not honoring the contract. A player signs 3 years/6 million dollar deal, gets cut after the first year and the team doesn't have to pay him what they said they would in the contract. Not exactly honoring the contract that they would pay them for the full 3 years. I usually(not in this TO situation) side with the players for asking for more money in the NFL because not much money is guranteed and you can be gone the next day and the team doesn't have to pay you a cent. These guys don't have much time as a professional football player and injuries they could suffer might make it hard for them to find a job when football is over, so they should go for the most money they can. Just my opinion.

It's all about guaranteed money. If the players have that clause in their contract they will get paid no matter what the team does to them.

But, in TO's case he has no leg to stand on. The team gave him a big contract last season when they were under no obligation to do so. I also seem to remember TO giving Andy Reid his word that he would not cause any problems. Now less than 12 months later we have Owens already running his mouth. In TO's case he does not deserve anything more. He broke his word already, now the Eagles should make him honor his contract.

I would love to see them pull an Ottawa Senators/Alexei Yashin on him. Either he plays or he owes them 6 more years once he decides to return.

thestonedkoala
04-30-2005, 08:59 PM
I am really PO at TO...I hope to god he never goes to Canton, he doesn't deserve it at all.

Send him to Miami or Tampa Bay or some other team with a developing quarterback and make him suffer.

Or hell just let him sit out for the next 6 years...and tell him that no one wants him....

blah
04-30-2005, 09:17 PM
I think this is Westbrook's last season with the Eagles. He obviously wants more than they have him valued at. Banner and co. won't budge for anybody.

They're somewhat similiar, Moats runs a bit more between the tackles and is nowhere near the receiver Westbrook is. I think they can get by with them this season.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 09:32 PM
from what i here ,Simon has lost his starting job going into camp with the pick of Mike Patterson from USC

I highly doubt Patterson is slated to be the starter over Simon.

Vic Rattlehead*
04-30-2005, 09:49 PM
']J-e-t-s Jets Jets Jets

Oh God, not that again. :D

blah
04-30-2005, 10:07 PM
If Simon holds out until the season starts he'll be behind a couple of players.

Hockeyfan02
04-30-2005, 10:40 PM
If Simon holds out until the season starts he'll be behind a couple of players.

Obviously, but if he were to sign right now (which is doubtful) he wouldn't be behind Patterson.

FlyersGuy69
05-01-2005, 01:51 AM
But, in TO's case he has no leg to stand on. The team gave him a big contract last season when they were under no obligation to do so. I also seem to remember TO giving Andy Reid his word that he would not cause any problems. Now less than 12 months later we have Owens already running his mouth. In TO's case he does not deserve anything more. He broke his word already, now the Eagles should make him honor his contract.

also, the NFLPA told TO before he signed with the Eagles that it was a bad deal and advised TO not to sign the deal, but he did anyway.

GKJ
05-01-2005, 08:31 AM
I believe he wants a new contract too. He missed mini-camp, along with TO, Simon, and Freddie Mitchell.


A little off topic. But just so everyone knows, Andy Reid told Fred-ex to stay home.

JCD
05-01-2005, 09:38 AM
I think this is Westbrook's last season with the Eagles. He obviously wants more than they have him valued at. Banner and co. won't budge for anybody.

They're somewhat similiar, Moats runs a bit more between the tackles and is nowhere near the receiver Westbrook is. I think they can get by with them this season.

Moats is a small scat back like Westbrook. He is not a good NFL between-the-tackles runner.

Henry is would be.

Moose Head
05-01-2005, 10:01 AM
The Eagles don't need Henry after getting Moats in the 3rd round. I hope they dump Simon for whatever picks they can get though. Maybe work out a trade for a conditional pick, so they get a higher pick if Simon resigns with the team he's dealt to.

Huh? A 3rd round rookie is going to get you 1000-1300 yards, something Henry has proven he can do. Maybe down the road, but most likely not this year. Be realistic.

JCD
05-01-2005, 10:34 AM
Huh? A 3rd round rookie is going to get you 1000-1300 yards, something Henry has proven he can do. Maybe down the road, but most likely not this year. Be realistic.

Sharing time with Westbrook, I doubt Henry would do that either. Still, a Westbrook-Henry pairing looks a whole heck of a lot more potent than a Westbrook-Moats pairing.

Troy McClure
05-01-2005, 10:42 AM
Not to spark another pissing match about the guy, but the Dallas Morning News had a nice bit about Demarcus Ware. When asked how he's feeling, he said he was exhausted.

He has four finals this week and had a paper due before he flew out for this weekend's Cowboys workouts. After those finals, he'll graduate with his Business Information Systems degree and will be the first college graduate in his family. That's a good example of a guy making use of his scholarship.

FlyersGuy69
05-01-2005, 12:12 PM
Not to spark another pissing match about the guy, but the Dallas Morning News had a nice bit about Demarcus Ware. When asked how he's feeling, he said he was exhausted.

He has four finals this week and had a paper due before he flew out for this weekend's Cowboys workouts. After those finals, he'll graduate with his Business Information Systems degree and will be the first college graduate in his family. That's a good example of a guy making use of his scholarship.
lol, he is also Parcells new waterboy...

Parcells informed Ware of his responsibility by telling him, "I don't like orange Gatorade."

"It's weird," Ware said. "I was like, 'So what does that mean?' He was like, 'You've got to get me water every day on my breaks.' I was like, 'I'll be glad to get you water.' When I gave it to him, he gave me some junk. He was like, 'Get used to it.' "

Thus far, Ware has been quicker than cornerback Terence Newman was two years ago at getting the water to Parcells.

"Hey, I'm just terrified," Ware said. "You don't want to disappoint Parcells. Believe me, you don't want to disappoint him."

X8oD
05-01-2005, 10:23 PM
Got this from the lions board I frequent. I didnt capture it, but here is a link. 42 and change Megs. Captured from Fox Sports Report here in Detroit.

Roy Williams reaches BEHIND dre Bly, catches the ball with 1 hand, takes the ball behind his back, then changes directions puling the ball back infront of him.

i dont think my words can do it justice. Check out the catch.

http://s34.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0AY78DCDR0IJW0UI2VPBSFWUQX

Habsfan 32
05-01-2005, 10:25 PM
Wow!! :eek:

The Mars Volchenkov
05-01-2005, 10:59 PM
That was rediculous.

Cloned
05-01-2005, 11:51 PM
Damn. Exceeded downloaded limit. Can anyone put another link up? :)

Hockeyfan02
05-01-2005, 11:52 PM
I'm still wondering how he didn't drop it behind his back. That was unbelieveable. :eek:

Nifty=HHOF
05-02-2005, 12:07 AM
It's coming up as blocked for me - does anyone have another link to this???

Grift69
05-02-2005, 12:53 AM
Got this from the lions board I frequent. I didnt capture it, but here is a link. 42 and change Megs. Captured from Fox Sports Report here in Detroit.

Roy Williams reaches BEHIND dre Bly, catches the ball with 1 hand, takes the ball behind his back, then changes directions puling the ball back infront of him.

i dont think my words can do it justice. Check out the catch.

http://s34.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0AY78DCDR0IJW0UI2VPBSFWUQX (http://s34.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0AY78DCDR0IJW0UI2VPBSFWUQX)what lions messageboard?

X8oD
05-02-2005, 01:35 AM
what lions messageboard?

http://mb4.scout.com/flionsfansfrm1

The Den

and so far no other file link. ill keep my eyes open

Jason MacIsaac
05-02-2005, 11:13 AM
How can people not think New York is a contender for the Super Bowl. They were a young team last year who only got better defensivly this year. They added a much better TE and new offensive Coor. Most of all, they have a good boot. Do people forget they dominated Pittsburgh for the most part in that game. The Jets almost have a good enough defense to win games last year. Their offense wil be respectable this year also.

Motown Beatdown
05-02-2005, 11:26 AM
Damn. Exceeded downloaded limit. Can anyone put another link up? :)


http://rapidshare.de/files/1530508/rc.rm.html

Motown Beatdown
05-02-2005, 11:27 AM
http://mb4.scout.com/flionsfansfrm1

The Den

and so far no other file link. ill keep my eyes open


X8oD check out this message board. It's set up like hf but with some added features.

http://www.sports-boards.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=54

MLH
05-02-2005, 11:46 AM
How can people not think New York is a contender for the Super Bowl. They were a young team last year who only got better defensivly this year. They added a much better TE and new offensive Coor. Most of all, they have a good boot. Do people forget they dominated Pittsburgh for the most part in that game. The Jets almost have a good enough defense to win games last year. Their offense wil be respectable this year also.

Curtis Martin will most likely not have the same caliber year he had last year. McKenzie is a big loss and Blaylock isn't as good of a backup as Jordan. Coles for Moss is a wash, but that receiving corps doesn't scare anyone. The offense is average at best.

Defensively, losing Jason Ferguson is a big blow. Vilma's production could go down Donnie Abraham was old, but still effective. I think everything will be eventually with John Abraham, but if it isn't then 10 sacks are gone from an already average pass rush.

Brien made for a nice scapegoat, but the guy did go 11-13 from 40 yards and longer. Moss was also the Jets top punt returner. Your starting punter is gone too.

I think the Jets are worse than last year's team which wa slucky to make the playoffs. Hardly a Super Bowl contender in my book.

SpinTheBlackCircle
05-02-2005, 12:18 PM
Apparently Cleveland Browns WR/TE Kellen Winslow wrecked his bike yesterday going 35 MPH in a parking lot, being thrown over the handlebars.

The team says the injuries weren't life threatening, but wouldn't say anything else.

http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_fullstory.asp?id=34232

SpinTheBlackCircle
05-02-2005, 12:20 PM
Not to mention that Pennington just had surgery on his rotator cuff in Feb. and won't throw until at least June.

Brodeur
05-02-2005, 12:27 PM
"I'M A SOLDIER!!!!!"

Sorry, somebody was gonna do it.

MontrealCruiser_83*
05-02-2005, 12:38 PM
After Jayson Williams, you'd think these idiots would learn.

He doesn't even deserve an NFL roster spot after this. Ridiculous.

Rick Middleton
05-02-2005, 12:48 PM
Apparently Cleveland Browns WR/TE Kellen Winslow wrecked his bike yesterday going 35 MPH in a parking lot, being thrown over the handlebars.

The team says the injuries weren't life threatening, but wouldn't say anything else.

http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_fullstory.asp?id=34232
Don't most contracts have restrictions on what players can do in the offseason (i.e. no high risk sports or activities)? I wonder if he breached his contract in any way?

JCD
05-02-2005, 12:48 PM
How can people not think New York is a contender for the Super Bowl. They were a young team last year who only got better defensivly this year. They added a much better TE and new offensive Coor. Most of all, they have a good boot. Do people forget they dominated Pittsburgh for the most part in that game. The Jets almost have a good enough defense to win games last year. Their offense wil be respectable this year also.

But they lost to Pittsburgh.

Jets were a Wild Card team whose improvement is debatable. Jolley is a better receiving TE, but Becht was a better blocking one. I don't think it was that much of an upgrade. Your gains in the passing department are off-set by your loses in the running department.

Jets are not a Super Bowl contender in the Patriots sense of the word. They are lumped in with about 6-8 other teams as a possibility, but by no means a favorite.

Furthermore, they will likely have to go the distance as a Wild Card team (behind the Pats), meaning they would be on the road every round. No team has ever won the SuperBowl going on the road for all 3 play-off games (4, if you include the SuperBowl itself).

Pavel
05-02-2005, 01:02 PM
How dumb do you have to be to wear the helmet but not have it strapped on?

Rick Middleton
05-02-2005, 01:06 PM
How dumb do you have to be to wear the helmet but not have it strapped on?
The answer, obviously, is Kellen Winslow dumb. :p:

thestonedkoala
05-02-2005, 01:08 PM
Can we say bust?

Who was that prospect for the Bulls that basically ended his career because of something this stupid?

Pavel
05-02-2005, 01:13 PM
Can we say bust?

Who was that prospect for the Bulls that basically ended his career because of something this stupid?

MontrealCruiser already alluded to the person you are thinking of, Jayson Williams.

thestonedkoala
05-02-2005, 01:30 PM
There needs to be less Williams in the NBA damn it without the first name Jayson or Jason!

ACC1224
05-02-2005, 01:32 PM
MontrealCruiser already alluded to the person you are thinking of, Jayson Williams.

Didn't he shoot his butler?????

Safir*
05-02-2005, 01:42 PM
Didn't he shoot his butler?????

I thought he killed his wife. :dunno:

V for Voodoo
05-02-2005, 01:54 PM
I thought he killed his wife. :dunno:

No, Colonel Mustard did that. With a candlestick.

Pavel
05-02-2005, 01:56 PM
Didn't he shoot his butler?????

Wrong Jayson Williams and it was his driver.

ACC1224
05-02-2005, 02:05 PM
Wrong Jayson Williams and it was his driver.

he killed his Butler with his driver?

Mr Brownstone
05-02-2005, 02:05 PM
Doesn't matter. The Browns were going 5-11 with or without Winslow anyways.

Hockeyfan02
05-02-2005, 02:09 PM
he killed his Butler with his driver?

No. He killed his limo driver. It is a different Jayson Williams than the one being talked about who was injured in a motorcycle wreck.

TVanek26*
05-02-2005, 02:18 PM
Jay Williams is the former Chicago/Duke player who pretty much ended his career when he crashed his motorcycle.

Jayson Williams is the one who shot his driver with a shotgun.

Impossibles
05-02-2005, 02:49 PM
:biglaugh: @ thread failure.

Huge hit for cleveland though, what a waste of a pick, and the guy has barely played any football for them. Factor in the fact that there's a new GM in town, and Winslow's probably going to have his contract voided and will have to repay some of his signing bonus back.

GoM
05-02-2005, 02:53 PM
he killed his Butler with his driver?

:joker:

HughJass*
05-02-2005, 03:16 PM
Jay Williams was at Duke recently doing some project with children...I didn't quite catch the news story but he looked very out of shape. I guess definitely his career is over, but it's a good thing he didn't lose his life that day.

Going Back to Cally
05-02-2005, 04:10 PM
I wonder if he has a 'no motocycles' clause in his contract.

pitkanen>bouwmeester
05-02-2005, 04:16 PM
Don't most contracts have restrictions on what players can do in the offseason (i.e. no high risk sports or activities)? I wonder if he breached his contract in any way?

I think that when Karl Malone played, there was something in his contract that he wasn't allowed to drive monster trucks :biglaugh:

Dr Love
05-02-2005, 05:43 PM
he killed his Butler with his driver?
No, I think it was a 3 iron.

Patty Ice
05-02-2005, 06:07 PM
Huge hit for cleveland though, what a waste of a pick, and the guy has barely played any football for them. Factor in the fact that there's a new GM in town, and Winslow's probably going to have his contract voided and will have to repay some of his signing bonus back.

What's truly great is that they gave Detroit a second rounder to move up 1 spot for a guy the Lions weren't even goin to draft.

The Flash
05-02-2005, 08:16 PM
:biglaugh: @ thread failure.

Huge hit for cleveland though, what a waste of a pick, and the guy has barely played any football for them. Factor in the fact that there's a new GM in town, and Winslow's probably going to have his contract voided and will have to repay some of his signing bonus back.

If he only broke his ribs like the article says, I seriously doubt that they are going to cut Winslow. He will be fine by training camp. First injury was a fluke, the second injury was out of stupidity, but both injuries are ones that a player can come back from.

Edit: Reading from other reports, Winslow has swelling in the shoulder and the knee. I still don't see him getting released unless he had a Willis Macghee type knee injury

FlyersGuy69
05-02-2005, 11:17 PM
minor news
A-Train Thomas signs with Dallas.

good back up, good change of pace to Jones since he is the prototypical "power back".

A-Train to Dallas (espn) (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2051923)

chris_dub
05-03-2005, 10:49 PM
For any Lions fans out there, check this out:

http://badblocks.biz/~jcdenton/RoyWilliams-MinicampCatch(Short).mpg

Roy Williams makes an incredible behind-the-back catch at mini camp. I don't care if its 7-on-7 no contact practice, this is just awesome.

This kid is one of my favourite receivers in the league & I hope to see this from him for years to come. He can bring excitement to the game.

FlyersGuy69
05-03-2005, 11:46 PM
For any Lions fans out there, check this out:

http://badblocks.biz/~jcdenton/RoyWilliams-MinicampCatch(Short).mpg

Roy Williams makes an incredible behind-the-back catch at mini camp. I don't care if its 7-on-7 no contact practice, this is just awesome.

This kid is one of my favourite receivers in the league & I hope to see this from him for years to come. He can bring excitement to the game.
yeah, somebody posted this a few pages back...its a sick catch. the guys a highlight reel for sure.

Going Back to Cally
05-04-2005, 11:37 AM
http://tinypic.com/4twykz

Troy McClure
05-04-2005, 12:43 PM
For any Lions fans out there, check this out:

Roy Williams makes an incredible behind-the-back catch at mini camp. I don't care if its 7-on-7 no contact practice, this is just awesome.
With Harrington throwing the ball, he's going to get a lot of opportunities to show off.

Nifty=HHOF
05-05-2005, 08:37 AM
Patriots release DT Keith Traylor. In a related story, the Massachusetts dept of Public health reported the average weight of Massachusetts fell 5% yesterday.

JCD
05-05-2005, 08:53 AM
There are unconfirmed reports that Kellen 'Da Soulja' Winslow tore his ACL during his little Evel Knievel homage and will miss the entire 2005 NFL season.

Rick Middleton
05-05-2005, 08:53 AM
Don't most contracts have restrictions on what players can do in the offseason (i.e. no high risk sports or activities)? I wonder if he breached his contract in any way?
Just browsing through ESPN.com and came across this ...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2053370


Winslow's use of a motorcycle may have violated standard NFL player contract language that prohibits players from engaging in dangerous activities. If so, Cleveland could require him to pay back a $4.4 million signing bonus he received in March.

The Browns have declined to comment on his contract


Having already lost $5.3 million in bonus money last year, he may be on the block for his $4.4 million signing bonus. Well, at least he got to ride a motorbike :biglaugh:

Dr Love
05-05-2005, 08:55 AM
There are unconfirmed reports that Kellen 'Da Soulja' Winslow tore his ACL during his little Evel Knievel homage and will miss the entire 2005 NFL season. On radio yesterday I heard there were reports of something major, perhaps internal bleeding. Torn ACL is something major, I guess they were off.

Regardless, Winslow messed himself up something good. What a dolt.

Hockeyfan02
05-05-2005, 11:51 AM
On radio yesterday I heard there were reports of something major, perhaps internal bleeding. Torn ACL is something major, I guess they were off.

Regardless, Winslow messed himself up something good. What a dolt.

Internal bleeding was not too serious according to John Clayton on Sportscenter a few nights ago.

Dr Love
05-05-2005, 11:55 AM
Internal bleeding was not too serious according to John Clayton on Sportscenter a few nights ago.
I don't trust John Clayton as far as I can throw him, and he's pretty scrawny so I could probably throw him a good distance. This is a guy who reported that Donovan McNabb's improved accuracy was in part due to him getting laser eye correction over the offseason. Anyone who has seen more than, oh, three McNabb pressers could tell he was joking about the laser eye surgery.

Detox
05-05-2005, 12:15 PM
Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but Santana Moss was given a 6 year, 31 million dollar deal with a 11 million dollar signing bonus:

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-nfl05may05,0,3949270.story?coll=sfla-sports-headlines


He cashed in quick, I bet his numbers will be similar to that of last years totals considering the QB situation which leads to the question on why the Skins would pay him so ****in much...good job Snyder

MontrealCruiser_83*
05-05-2005, 12:45 PM
Sad news out of Carolina...

http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/CAR/8446643

Rick Middleton
05-05-2005, 12:52 PM
Sad news out of Carolina...

http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/CAR/8446643
Damn that sucks. Poor guy can't catch a break.

GKJ
05-05-2005, 10:24 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2053827




2nd time in 3 years. :(

clefty
05-05-2005, 10:44 PM
Tampa Bay signs Ike Hilliard.
http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/8444197

No.3 receiver behind Clayton and Galloway.

Ronnie Bass
05-05-2005, 11:15 PM
ESPNews just reported that the Browns think Winslow tore his ACL in that bike accident and is out for the year. What a bonehead.

Nifty=HHOF
05-05-2005, 11:46 PM
Damn that sucks. Poor guy can't catch a break.

Say a prayer for Mark Fields and wish for a full recovery. Tough offseason to be a LB (Bruschi's stroke and this)

Jared Ramsden
05-06-2005, 12:10 AM
yeah, somebody posted this a few pages back...its a sick catch. the guys a highlight reel for sure.

That was absolutely sick....And he made it look so easy that's what's really scary.....

Detox
05-06-2005, 01:32 AM
Joe Horn resigns with the Saints 42 million over 6 years with a 7 million signing bonus:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=fanball-saintshornsignsasixy&prov=fanball&type=lgns

Motown Beatdown
05-06-2005, 06:59 AM
There are unconfirmed reports that Kellen 'Da Soulja' Winslow tore his ACL during his little Evel Knievel homage and will miss the entire 2005 NFL season.


Atleast he has another Purple Heart to look forward too.

Mathletic
05-06-2005, 08:12 AM
http://profootballtalk.com/scoot.jpg

Motown Beatdown
05-06-2005, 08:25 AM
http://profootballtalk.com/scoot.jpg

Picture of the actual crash


http://www.tech-sol.net/humor/crash.jpg?SSImageQuality=Full]link

IkeaMonkey*
05-06-2005, 01:48 PM
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/homeNewsDetail.jsp?id=27562

:cry: :cry:

Vic Rattlehead*
05-06-2005, 01:53 PM
Man, poor Fields :(. I hope he'll be able to fight his way to perfect health.


As for Winslow, what an idiot. What a waste of a pick by the Browns.

GKJ
05-06-2005, 03:52 PM
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/homeNewsDetail.jsp?id=27562

:cry: :cry:


No suprise there.



I'm calling he will end up in Pittsburgh. Just a hunch.

Big McLargehuge
05-06-2005, 04:06 PM
No suprise there.



I'm calling he will end up in Pittsburgh. Just a hunch.

0_o

Mitchell is the anti-Steeler. No way in hell. The Steelers already have enough receivers anyways.

JCD
05-06-2005, 04:17 PM
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/homeNewsDetail.jsp?id=27562

:cry: :cry:

The way Mitchell runs his mouth, he may find work tough to get. I can't see too many teams interested in an egotistical, underachieving loudmouth who backstabs his teammates for more than a 1-year, league minimum contract.

Dr Love
05-06-2005, 05:36 PM
Mitchell ran his mouth to get cut. Mission accomplished.

FlyersGuy69
05-06-2005, 06:04 PM
I say Mitchell signs with the Los Angeles Avengers...he finally becomes the #1 receiver he knew he was. :handclap:

Nifty=HHOF
05-06-2005, 07:21 PM
I say Mitchell signs with the Los Angeles Avengers...he finally becomes the #1 receiver he knew he was. :handclap:

You're generous, I was thinking more along the lines of the Almaden Valley Rams of the Northern Cal Lawman league

IkeaMonkey*
05-06-2005, 08:11 PM
This doesnt really have to do with the offseason...more or less in relation to the Winslow incident though...

Big Ben not as smart as people percieve him to be???

http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/PIT/8449812

"Obviously Pennsylvania doesn't think people need to (wear a helmet)," he said. "There's a law you've got to wear it in football."

"I'll just continue to be careful. I told him we don't ever ride alone, we always ride in a group of people, and I think it makes it even more safe."

Yea, you know like....whenever you crack your head open on the pavement, being in a group cushions the blow...

Dr Love
05-06-2005, 08:14 PM
There's no law in PA for wearing a helmet while riding a motorcycle. While Roethlisberger isn't doing anything wrong, it is pretty dumb. Frankly, I'm surprized he's allowed to ride it, usually teams put that kind of stuff in the contract as an out clause.

$20K bike? Jesus. That's upper echelon.

Big McLargehuge
05-06-2005, 08:21 PM
Big Ben's ego is astronomical right now. Not hard to fathom considering everyone in this damn city holds him to a higher light than God, Jesus, and Johnny Depp combined...

Fish on The Sand
05-06-2005, 08:54 PM
quote of the day

"If I fall off a Jet Ski, I hit the water, and I like my odds," Porter said. "I'm going to get wet. What I say about motorcycles is that concrete is undefeated."

Big McLargehuge
05-06-2005, 09:01 PM
I love Joey Porter. :biglaugh:

Nifty=HHOF
05-06-2005, 10:03 PM
ESPNews reports the Patriots sign LB Chad Brown to a 2 year deal. Anyone know the health status of Brown? He's obviously missed alot of games the last three years. Seahawks fans :help:

Enoch
05-06-2005, 11:36 PM
quote of the day

"If I fall off a Jet Ski, I hit the water, and I like my odds," Porter said. "I'm going to get wet. What I say about motorcycles is that concrete is undefeated."
:biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh:

MontrealCruiser_83*
05-07-2005, 10:26 AM
Some news/speculation on Winslow... not looking good (career ender?):

CLEVELAND -- Browns tight end Kellen Winslow's injuries are much more serious than first thought, NewsChannel5 reported.

5 On Your Side Health Team Anchor Lee Jordan reported sources close to the Winslow story said the Sunday motorcycle accident left Winslow with a broken tibia and femur, along with a fracture to the large bone in his thigh. His ACL was damaged, possibly torn and there are lacerations on his liver and kidney.

NewsChannel5's source continues to stand by the information.

One media outlet is even suggesting Winslow's football career is over, WEWS reported.

Winslow previously had two surgeries on the right leg the he broke last fall.

Eat It
05-07-2005, 05:00 PM
Tom Brady signs extention with the Pats- 6 years 60 mil....13.5 average over the 1st 3 years per espn.

Nifty=HHOF
05-07-2005, 06:43 PM
Tom Brady signs extention with the Pats- 6 years 60 mil....13.5 average over the 1st 3 years per espn.

It's an interesting way they structured it. $14.5 million bonus this year with another 12m option bonus next year. ESPN reports his cap number next year would be over 14.4m. I have a hard time seeing the pats let one player count that much against the cap.

Jared Ramsden
05-10-2005, 12:42 AM
Some news/speculation on Winslow... not looking good (career ender?):

CLEVELAND -- Browns tight end Kellen Winslow's injuries are much more serious than first thought, NewsChannel5 reported.

5 On Your Side Health Team Anchor Lee Jordan reported sources close to the Winslow story said the Sunday motorcycle accident left Winslow with a broken tibia and femur, along with a fracture to the large bone in his thigh. His ACL was damaged, possibly torn and there are lacerations on his liver and kidney.

NewsChannel5's source continues to stand by the information.

One media outlet is even suggesting Winslow's football career is over, WEWS reported.

Winslow previously had two surgeries on the right leg the he broke last fall.


Thank GOD the Lions drafted Roy Williams instead of him......

Patty Ice
05-10-2005, 10:04 AM
Thank GOD the Lions drafted Roy Williams instead of him......

and that they gave em a second rounder to do it...which was used to get Kevin Jones. There's always a silver lining to every situation.

sveiglar
05-10-2005, 10:20 AM
Big Ben's ego is astronomical right now. Not hard to fathom considering everyone in this damn city holds him to a higher light than God, Jesus, and Johnny Depp combined...

I went on a vacation to the southwestern US last month and connected in Pittsburgh to get there. Every airport newsstand has a corner or wall of Steelers merchandise, but the "Legends of the Game" edition Roethelisberger bobblehead was one of the funniest things I've seen in quite a while.

MontrealCruiser_83*
05-10-2005, 10:28 AM
Thank GOD the Lions drafted Roy Williams instead of him......
There's also this extremely unsubstantiated rumour that after Winslow's 2nd leg surgery last year, he was told that his career may very well be over... This would partly explain why he'd be willing to void his contract by getting on a bike. Neighbors stated that he still had a significant limp leading up to his Sunday joyride.

Tuggy
05-10-2005, 10:39 AM
and that they gave em a second rounder to do it...which was used to get Kevin Jones. There's always a silver lining to every situation.

Pretty easy to see who won that trade :biglaugh:

ap215
05-10-2005, 11:19 AM
http://theredzone.org/news/showarticle.asp?ArticleID=2675

Hockeyfan02
05-10-2005, 04:05 PM
Winslow finally released from the hospital. Browns still have not disclosed the injuries. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2057205

Brodeur
05-10-2005, 04:09 PM
and that they gave em a second rounder to do it...which was used to get Kevin Jones. There's always a silver lining to every situation.

Just being nitpicky, the Lions used the Browns' 2nd rounder on LB Teddy Lehman. The Lions traded their own 2nd rounder to move up to grab Jones.

Patty Ice
05-11-2005, 02:22 AM
Just being nitpicky, the Lions used the Browns' 2nd rounder on LB Teddy Lehman. The Lions traded their own 2nd rounder to move up to grab Jones.

That's what I thought initially as well until I read on the Lions' Mlive page that it was use in the trade for Jones...but after doing a quick search, the Browns' 2nd rounder was used on Lehman. I guess don't believe everything you read :D

JCD
05-11-2005, 06:46 AM
From the 'Can they really be that stupid' deparment,

Onterrio Smith was busted trying to sneak The Original Whizzinator through an airport. This 'device' is supposed to help you beat a drug test and includes a fake penis and vials of fake urine.

Being caught with masking agents typically equates to a positive test. This is the self-proclaimed "Steal of the Draft's" third positive in under 24 months.

Welcome to the CFL, you dumbass.
http://vikings.kfan.com/sports/nflguide/local/story.aspx?content_id=A24E369D-C735-400F-B383-3F6FADD11858

Motown Beatdown
05-11-2005, 09:49 AM
Lions | Law Visits - from www.KFFL.com
Wed, 11 May 2005 05:19:55 -0700

The Boston Globe reports free agent CB Ty Law (Patriots) spent Tuesday, May 10 visiting with Detroit Lions coach Steve Mariucci and general manager Matt Millen at the Lions' team headquarters in Michigan. There was no immediate word on the Lions' intentions. According to a team source, Law had a very good visit and showed enough physically for Detroit to make a decision.




http://www.kffl.com/hotw/nfl

Jared Ramsden
05-11-2005, 01:24 PM
http://www.kffl.com/hotw/nfl


http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2005/05/11/lions_show_interest_in_law/

Speculation seems to be IF the Lions do sign Law, which is still pretty iffy at this point, Frenando Bryant may be in trouble.....the Lions are already loaded at corner so somebody would have to either be cut or move to safety........

TVanek26*
05-11-2005, 03:48 PM
Law is damaged goods...

Eat It
05-11-2005, 05:07 PM
Law is damaged goods...
Damaged real goods though...

TVanek26*
05-11-2005, 05:33 PM
Peter Boulware gets cut...interesting.

Gibsons Finest
05-11-2005, 06:18 PM
Peter Boulware gets cut...interesting.

Damn, we could use him in Indy. While Thornton's decent, and June is not totally terrible, hopefully he could come in and make a nice tandem with Thornton, and maybe let June play on special teams. Like every other defensive free agent, though, he'll go elsewhere.

Jared Ramsden
05-11-2005, 06:48 PM
Law is damaged goods...

I highly doubt he is going to get signed until he is healthy....he's damaged goods right now, but he's rehabbing an injury. What do you expect???

Jared Ramsden
05-11-2005, 06:50 PM
Peter Boulware gets cut...interesting.

If he's healthy, he'll be a good player for some team. Redskins also signed a vet linebacker today, Warrick Holdman....http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-redskins-holdman&prov=ap&type=lgns

john g
05-11-2005, 08:17 PM
Onterrio Smith this time

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/vikings/2005-05-11-smith-drug-kit_x.htm?POE=SPOISVA

Going Back to Cally
05-11-2005, 08:30 PM
Onterrio Smith this time

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/vikings/2005-05-11-smith-drug-kit_x.htm?POE=SPOISVA

Cut his ass. If droping to day 2 after he had the talent to go high in round 2 wasn't a wake up call for him nothing will wake him up.

JCD
05-11-2005, 08:54 PM
I don't think cutting him is even an option. He has to serve a mandatory 1-year suspension first, THEN he will be cut.

This is actually Smith's third freaking violation in less than two years in the league. He was kicked off his first college team over drugs as well.

Clearly, this is a dumbass we are dealing with.

This bust actually occured before the draft, it is just hitting the news now. Bennett's agent dropped hints about it (paraphrased: he said Bennett was in a good position for a new contract as Smith has dropped out of the starting race). It is also likely way the Vikes were eager to trade up for Fason in the 4th round.

For Fantasy Footballers, this makes Bennett the odds-on favorite to be the featured back in a run-first offense. The question is can he stay healthy. It is still a buyer-beware situation as Bennett will be splitting carries. Bennett starts and plays 1st/2nd downs; Moore is the change-of-pace/3rd down option/KR; Williams plays 3rd downs/Short-yardage/Special Teams; Fason gets 4th quarter mop-up/Short-yardage.

Lobstertainment
05-11-2005, 08:58 PM
He's begging to be suspended.

MontrealCruiser_83*
05-11-2005, 09:10 PM
Owens won't get his contract re-negotiated.

I'd be worried as an Eagles fan. That offence could become lethargic very quickly.

Jared Ramsden
05-12-2005, 12:09 AM
He's begging to be suspended.

You have the best display picture ever! :biglaugh:

Going Back to Cally
05-12-2005, 06:03 AM
Owens won't get his contract re-negotiated.

I'd be worried as an Eagles fan. That offence could become lethargic very quickly.

Its nice not to see a team cave in to a player.

JCD
05-12-2005, 08:50 AM
Owens won't get his contract re-negotiated.

I'd be worried as an Eagles fan. That offence could become lethargic very quickly.

Owens holding out
Simon tagged and unsigned
Westbrook an unsigned RFA looking for big money
Hollis Thomas wanting a trade (minor impact)
People's Chump gone (though this is arguably addition by subtraction)
Chad Lewis a UFA whose career could be over

Been a rocky off-season thus far. They were clearly the best team in the NFC last year, but likely have lost ground this off-season. The success catches up to every team, has it happened to them?

Matt Foley*
05-12-2005, 09:08 AM
The success catches up to every team, has it happened to them?

As a Lions fan, I've been asking this question about the Packers for quite some time, now. As a Vikings fan, I'm sure you've been doing the same. :)

I'm beginning to equate Brett Favre more and more with those Jason / Michael Myers-type movie characters. There's just no keeping that guy down. It would seem fitting if he starting wearing a hockey mask under his helmet. :eek:

Blackjack
05-12-2005, 01:45 PM
Just a bit of humor, hope this wasn't posted already...

http://gorillamask.net/ronmexico/

My name was Stark Kazakhstan

Edit: Yeah, so I guess there's already a pretty big thread for this :(

Patty Ice
05-12-2005, 06:40 PM
Just a bit of humor, hope this wasn't posted already...

http://gorillamask.net/ronmexico/

My name was Stark Kazakhstan

Edit: Yeah, so I guess there's already a pretty big thread for this :(

Great, now I can't use the "Man invents wheel" joke :cry:

Gibsons Finest
05-12-2005, 06:49 PM
I don't think cutting him is even an option. He has to serve a mandatory 1-year suspension first, THEN he will be cut.

This is actually Smith's third freaking violation in less than two years in the league. He was kicked off his first college team over drugs as well.

Clearly, this is a dumbass we are dealing with.

This bust actually occured before the draft, it is just hitting the news now. Bennett's agent dropped hints about it (paraphrased: he said Bennett was in a good position for a new contract as Smith has dropped out of the starting race). It is also likely way the Vikes were eager to trade up for Fason in the 4th round.

For Fantasy Footballers, this makes Bennett the odds-on favorite to be the featured back in a run-first offense. The question is can he stay healthy. It is still a buyer-beware situation as Bennett will be splitting carries. Bennett starts and plays 1st/2nd downs; Moore is the change-of-pace/3rd down option/KR; Williams plays 3rd downs/Short-yardage/Special Teams; Fason gets 4th quarter mop-up/Short-yardage.

Will Onterrio be suspended? I'm not familiar whatsoever with the drug policy, but can you be suspended for having The Original Whizzinator in your possession? And also, even though it seems obvious it was for himself, they'll have a tough time proving he was intending to use it, and not give it to his cousin, like he said he was.

Either way, once he's active, he's as good as cut.

Nifty=HHOF
05-12-2005, 07:44 PM
Will Onterrio be suspended? I'm not familiar whatsoever with the drug policy, but can you be suspended for having The Original Whizzinator in your possession? And also, even though it seems obvious it was for himself, they'll have a tough time proving he was intending to use it, and not give it to his cousin, like he said he was.

Either way, once he's active, he's as good as cut.

I don't have any links for this, but on the Mike & Mike show on ESPN radio in the morning they qouted a NFL rep as saying something to the effect of, "possessing drug testing masking agents when not traveling to or from a drug test is not a violation of the NFL policy"

Rick Middleton
05-12-2005, 09:06 PM
Great, now I can't use the "Man invents wheel" joke :cry:
I've heard good things about this 'fire' thingy

chris_dub
05-12-2005, 10:26 PM
I've heard good things about this 'fire' thingy

I duno. I hear this "internet" thing is really something.

Nifty=HHOF
05-13-2005, 12:47 PM
Ty Law visited the Miami Dolphins on Wendesday. He has reportedly recieved interest from the Dolphins, Jets, Steelers, Colts and Lions

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2005/05/13/law_visited_dolphins_on_wednesday/

Brodeur
05-13-2005, 12:51 PM
I duno. I hear this "internet" thing is really something.

Do they have the internet on computers yet?

Onto actual NFL news, USC DT Manuel White apparently is going to declare for the supplemental draft because he's academically ineligible for the season. He had a couple of starts this season, and most figured he'd be the main guy to replace Mike Patterson and Shaun Cody.

The supplemental process is a bit more complex than it would seem, but here's the general gist of it (to the best of my understanding). NFL goes down the list (SF, Mia, Clev, etc) and teams will either select a player or pass. The caveat is that if you select somebody in the 1st round of the supplemental draft, you forfeit your 1st round selection in the 2006 draft. And apparently the order isn't necessarily the 2005 draft order, but there's some tiers involved to re-order, but those are probably details we can ignore.

I think John Clayton mentioned that Green Bay would be interested in possibly using a 1st rounder on this guy, especially since they picked Aaron Rodgers when they had glaring needs on D. Should be interesting.

In recent years, the Texans used a 2nd rounder on RB Tony Hollings.......although that one sorta backfired. The Texans had their own 2nd rounder and the Raiders' 2nd rounder. Houston selected Hollings with the Raiders' pick, anticipating that it would be late in the 2nd round since the Raiders were coming off a Super Bowl appearance. Instead the Raiders' pick ended up being at the top of the 2nd round, where I'm pretty sure Houston could have found a better player.

johnny cool
05-13-2005, 01:05 PM
Ty Law visited the Miami Dolphins on Wendesday. He has reportedly recieved interest from the Dolphins, Jets, Steelers, Colts and Lions

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2005/05/13/law_visited_dolphins_on_wednesday/
aka everyone that can't beat the pats, and the lions

Patty Ice
05-13-2005, 05:17 PM
I'm reading Law could be a Lion come Tuesday according to John Clayton.

Hockeyfan02
05-13-2005, 07:00 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2059715

"I've always been competitive, I've always been in sports," said Newton, a six-time Pro Bowl offensive lineman who retired after the 2000 season. "I couldn't see myself not being the biggest dope man."

Nifty=HHOF
05-13-2005, 08:04 PM
aka everyone that can't beat the pats, and the lions

Using that criteria, that's about every team in football

Gibsons Finest
05-13-2005, 08:10 PM
aka everyone that can't beat the pats, and the lions

The Pats lost two games last season, and both were to teams that you think "can't beat the pats".

Count of DannyKristo
05-13-2005, 08:46 PM
http://www.jaguars.com/story/4364.asp

Let's start with that. Who will be the disappointment teams of this season?

Shock factor team of the year : New England. The Patriots have lost the heart and soul of their defense, Tedy Bruschi, and a whole lot of other guys who made that team great. All of a sudden, Tom Brady is making the big buck and that'll shine a different light on him and the Pats' salary cap. What's to like about what the Pats have done in the offseason? I sense a high degree of panic. I don't like their draft or much of anything else that has happened to that team this offseason. Both coordinators are gone, too. In my shock factor pick of the year, I say the Pats don't even make the playoffs.

Disappointment team of the year II : Denver. What would cause a team to pick up Cleveland's defensive line rejects? Cleveland was last in the league against the run last year, while the Broncos were fourth. The Broncos traded away their first-round pick and did almost nothing to help themselves in the draft. Jake Plummer isn't the answer at quarterback and it's not likely he'll make it through another season before Mike Shanahan pulls the plug. The Broncos are also coming off another postseason humiliation and that's the kind of thing that eats at the heart of a franchise.

Moderate surprise team of the year : Cincinnati. Carson Palmer is the real thing and he has big-time weapons on offense. The issue in Cincinnati is Marvin Lewis' defense, which collapsed into a barrage of points allowed late last season. Lewis addressed that need on defense in the draft by selecting David Pollack and Odell Thurman. The Steelers and Ravens better watch out for the Bengals. They're about to become a playoff team.

Major surprise team of the year : Minnesota. The Vikings will become a better team without Randy Moss than they could've ever been with him. The cancer has been removed from the Vikings and they will flourish. With Moss gone, Daunte Culpepper will have a chance to make this his team, which it always should've been. Culpepper is a true star. He's the guy who drives the Vikings and it won't hurt that he'll be quarterbacking a team that will be decidedly better on defense. They could go all the way.

Teams on the radar : Bills, Chiefs, Jaguars, Jets and Panthers. Buffalo has a lot of pieces in place but putting those pieces together may be too much to expect of young quarterback J.P. Losman. All of a sudden, Larry Johnson looks like the second coming of Priest Holmes and if Kansas City got anything done on defense this offseason it's possible the Chiefs could get back to the playoffs. Making the playoffs is absolutely the expectation in Jacksonville but that will require a full recovery from offseason knee surgery by Fred Taylor. The Jets took a big step forward last season but does Chad Pennington have a postseason arm? Carolina showed a lot of grit in its comeback effort last season and the Panthers drafted awfully well last month.


Thoughts?

Nifty=HHOF
05-13-2005, 09:40 PM
Shock factor team of the year : New England. The Patriots have lost the heart and soul of their defense, Tedy Bruschi, and a whole lot of other guys who made that team great. All of a sudden, Tom Brady is making the big buck and that'll shine a different light on him and the Pats' salary cap. What's to like about what the Pats have done in the offseason? I sense a high degree of panic. I don't like their draft or much of anything else that has happened to that team this offseason. Both coordinators are gone, too. In my shock factor pick of the year, I say the Pats don't even make the playoffs.

Thoughts?

Before I start, let me say I don't think the Pats are going to keep up the 34-4 pace they've had over the last 2 years and yes I am a Pats fan, but let's take this one at a time

Patriots have lost the heart and soul of their defense, Tedy Bruschi, and a whole lot of other guys who made that team great.

The Patriots have not lost Tedy Bruschi as of yet. No official announcement or public statements have been made by anybody official as to his future. There are just as many stories saying he will play as he won't play. If he does sit out the year, it is a big loss but not one this team can't overcome. He has missed time before (he only started 18 games between 2000-2001). This defense is about alot more than one person. As pats fans we've heard you can't win without; Law, Milloy, Seymour, Colvin, etc

Tom Brady is making the big buck and that'll shine a different light on him and the Pats' salary cap.


Yes he's is making big money, but his cap number dropped 1.5 million for the upcoming season. Yes he's making big money, but he could have held the Pats up for a hell of alot more (see Payton Manning and the Colts salary cap). He's had the spotlight on him for three years now, not sure what's going to be different this year. :help:

What's to like about what the Pats have done in the offseason? I sense a high degree of panic. I don't like their draft or much of anything else that has happened to that team this offseason.


The Patriots have done the same thing they've been doing since BB and Co. got here. Acquiring alot of vets knowing some will and some will not work out. This team won a super bowl with the likes of Randall Gay (undrafted rookie FA who didn't start in college), Asanti Samual, Don Davis (converted LB) and Troy Brown (converted WR)all playing big roles in the defensive backfield. Are Chad Scott and Duane Starks going to be worse that that? In the draft and FA they added depth which is what they need. Some of these veteran's will be busts, but the recent history of the Pats is that some of them will also play key roles for this team.


Both coordinators are gone, too


This is a very legitmate concern, only time will tell how this plays out. Eric Mangini is probably going to be a very good def coordinator, in his first year - we'll see what happens.

In my shock factor pick of the year, I say the Pats don't even make the playoffs.


In this day and age of the NFL, it is certainly a possibility. But let me ask this, who's going to beat them in the AFC east? The Pats have been undercredited for years now and sooner or latter people are going to realize this is a damn good team. I think there's a much better chance this team is playing in the SB again as opposed to missing the playoffs, but either can certainlly happen. I wonder if this writer in Jax is one of the "experts" who said the Pats can't stop Manning, or will repeat their disaster in Pittsburgh or will lose to Philly?

Hockeyfan02
05-13-2005, 09:45 PM
The Pats have been undercredited for years now and sooner or latter people are going to realize this is a damn good team.

They're called a dynasty and the best organization in sports by some people. What more credit can they get? It's one guys opinion.

Tuggy
05-14-2005, 09:56 AM
They're called a dynasty and the best organization in sports by some people. What more credit can they get? It's one guys opinion.

I agree as a Pats fan, I am tired of some of my fellow fans whining about people not giving the Pats credit. The media/fans have giving the Pats plenty of credit for what they have accomplished over the last few years.

Gibsons Finest
05-15-2005, 01:40 AM
In this day and age of the NFL, it is certainly a possibility. But let me ask this, who's going to beat them in the AFC east? The Pats have been undercredited for years now and sooner or latter people are going to realize this is a damn good team. I think there's a much better chance this team is playing in the SB again as opposed to missing the playoffs, but either can certainlly happen. I wonder if this writer in Jax is one of the "experts" who said the Pats can't stop Manning, or will repeat their disaster in Pittsburgh or will lose to Philly?

I'm not sure what to think of them. You see, the Pats have won 3 Super Bowls proving everyone wrong. Now that few people doubt them, and they are in many peoples' eyes a modern day dynasty, do they being to lose? Or, after possibly losing Bruschi, losing Law, and Brady getting a big contract, do people start to doubt them, and they prove everyone wrong again?

We'll definetely have to see.

stanley
05-15-2005, 02:01 AM
I agree as a Pats fan, I am tired of some of my fellow fans whining about people not giving the Pats credit. The media/fans have giving the Pats plenty of credit for what they have accomplished over the last few years.
Amen. Nothing is more overplayed in New England. It becomes a popular rallying point that lacks substance. I can't even talk to my friends after Christmas. When I suggest that they have had success over the past four years because they have really good players with a clear gameplan developed by a focused coaching staff, they insist it is because the Patriots are "special" people, the kind that saves kitty cats and helps old ladies across the street before getting to the stadium to kick the snot out of the infidel opposition.

The idea that the Patriot organization has had success because they are somehow better people offends me. They're successful because they've scored more points than the other team after Christmas in three out of the four past years. It's not more complex than that.

stanley
05-17-2005, 11:26 AM
Some light reading: http://slate.msn.com/id/2092863

Matt Foley*
05-17-2005, 12:39 PM
For what it's worth (not much, IMO, but I'm bored), here's ESPN's new NFL power rankings as of today:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/powerranking

Jared Ramsden
05-18-2005, 09:37 PM
If your a Browns fan, prepare to spaz and get something to break or punch :D......

Browns | Winslow Out for the Season - from www.KFFL.com
Wed, 18 May 2005 16:34:17 -0700

Jim Donovan, of WKYC.com, reports Cleveland Browns TE Kellen Winslow Jr. (knee) will miss the entire 2005 season. His station, Channel 3 News, has learned that Winslow has a significant right knee injury. Results of Winslow's MRI have not been released, but Donovan is reporting sources told him the results show an injury to his ACL. The Winslow family will not allow the information to become public.

JCD
05-18-2005, 10:00 PM
In other news, the Cardinals released Tackle LJ Shelton and TE Diamond.

Shelton is a starter-grade tackle and should find work rather quickly. That he was released instead of traded is a bit surprising.

Ronnie Bass
05-18-2005, 10:09 PM
In other news, the Cardinals released Tackle LJ Shelton and TE Diamond.

Shelton is a starter-grade tackle and should find work rather quickly. That he was released instead of traded is a bit surprising.
Might be a nice pick-up for Miami.

Tuggy
05-19-2005, 10:26 AM
If your a Browns fan, prepare to spaz and get something to break or punch :D......

Browns | Winslow Out for the Season - from www.KFFL.com
Wed, 18 May 2005 16:34:17 -0700

Jim Donovan, of WKYC.com, reports Cleveland Browns TE Kellen Winslow Jr. (knee) will miss the entire 2005 season. His station, Channel 3 News, has learned that Winslow has a significant right knee injury. Results of Winslow's MRI have not been released, but Donovan is reporting sources told him the results show an injury to his ACL. The Winslow family will not allow the information to become public.

Wow. I think we all knew it was coming but now it's pretty much official. Talk about bad luck for the Brownies but I have no sympathy for Winslow. He's just a moron.

sveiglar
05-19-2005, 10:38 AM
Might be a nice pick-up for Miami.

Or Buffalo.. now that they won't have to trade Henry to get him.

JCD
05-19-2005, 11:31 AM
Might be a nice pick-up for Miami.
Or Buffalo.. now that they won't have to trade Henry to get him.

Or Pittsburgh.

Shelton is a decent starter, just not as good as he was expected (or paid) to be. An average guy. He can play either right or left, but struggled when tried at guard. For the right price, he makes for a good pick-up.

IMO, he would immediately start for the Bills (Gandy is who OurLads has as the current starter, he was terrible for the Bears, so bad that they cut him from the team mid-season and he went unemployed for the rest of the year) and be on par with Jennings (not a big Jennings fan either). Gandy looks like a better guard than tackle to me. Shelton would round out the line quite well.

Miami is a tough call. McDougle, Carey and McIntosh are already slugging it out to start. McDougle is versatile enough to slide over to Right Guard, I believe McIntosh can as well. Putting Shelton at LT, McDougle at RT with James and McIntosh inside and Carey backing them up across the board (or pushing them to start) and the Dolphins line looks to be the best they have fielded in years.

Steelers cut the entire right side of their line and look thin as hell with injury concerns to boot. Max Starks is expected to start, but he is a total unknown that could bomb out horribly. Simmons has not played a game in two years. Hartings knees are all but shot, he has played the last 3 years on borrowed time. Only back-ups worth mentioning are Okobi and Brooks. Both sorely career back-ups who are liabilities as long-term starters. Adding Shelton means they don't have to live-or-die with the Rookie Starks and gives them a fall back if/when they get a linemen hurt.

Unless there is some unknown medical concern, I would be surprised to see Shelton on the market too long. Tackles are always in high demand.

Gibsons Finest
05-19-2005, 07:04 PM
Not sure if this was mentioned, but Todd Sauerbrun got traded to Denver for Jason Baker and a 7th rounder.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/8486136

FlyersGuy69
05-20-2005, 02:20 PM
SI.com breakout players in '05...pretty good feature on the up and coming young stars in the NFL.

just hit the arrows(next/back).
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/05/19/nfl/content.16.html

Nifty=HHOF
05-20-2005, 03:22 PM
SI.com breakout players in '05...pretty good feature on the up and coming young stars in the NFL.

just hit the arrows(next/back).
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/05/19/nfl/content.16.html


Only offensive skill position players

Nifty=HHOF
05-21-2005, 09:11 PM
Pats resign Troy Brown :handclap: :handclap:

Veteran wide receiver Troy Brown, whose sacrifice in serving double duty on defense for the New England Patriots in 2004 epitomized the selflessness of the Super Bowl champions, is returning to the team for a 13th season.

Brown has reached agreement, ESPN.com has learned, on a one-year contract. Financial details were not immediately available but the contract, which will be officially signed next week, is believed to be worth more than the league minimum.

Unholy Diver
05-22-2005, 12:20 PM
Former Ram and Cowboy David Lang was shot and killed in suburban Atlanta....


http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2065737

Jared Ramsden
05-22-2005, 02:51 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=bearsedinger&prov=st&type=lgns

clefty
05-22-2005, 06:15 PM
You know you've lost it when Doug Brien replaces you.

The Flash
05-23-2005, 06:58 AM
You know you've lost it when Doug Brien replaces you.

I read elsewhere that he requested his release once they decided to bring in other kickers to compete with him.

Sebastien Centomo
05-23-2005, 01:45 PM
As result of the questions surrounding Tim Bowens and Larry Chester's ability to play next year, the Dolphins sign DT/senior citizen Keith Traylor to a two-year deal.

http://www.miamidolphins.com/pressbox/pressreleases/pressreleases.asp?contentID=3878

He's old and fat, but he can still stuff the middle so he'll be a welcome addition to a defense that was looking like Jeff Zgonina might have been a starter.

GKJ
05-23-2005, 02:58 PM
You know you've lost it when Doug Brien replaces you.

I thought Edinger was good.



By far the most entertaining kicker in the league.

clefty
05-23-2005, 07:37 PM
He kicked at like 60% last year, and wasn't that much better the prior year. Yeah his kicking style is fun to watch, but he's just not that good anymore.

Having said that though, I wouldn't complain if the Bucs released Bryant and signed Edinger to compete with Todd France. Edinger has at least been good as a kicker at one point as opposed to Bryant. Just thinking out loud, France is probably pencilled in as our kicker anyway.

GKJ
05-23-2005, 10:16 PM
R.W. McQuarters released by Da Bears.



If I am the Eagles or Saints I am all over him.

Nifty=HHOF
05-23-2005, 11:20 PM
R.W. McQuarters released by Da Bears.



If I am the Eagles or Saints I am all over him.

Was he a salary cap cut or a talent (or lack thereof) cut?

Jared Ramsden
05-23-2005, 11:44 PM
man....these guys really are stupid somtimes :shakehead

Titans' Tyrone Calico accused of having sex in public with 18-year-old

May 23, 2005
NASHVILLE, Tenn. (AP) -- Tennessee Titans wide receiver Tyrone Calico has been cited for public indecency for having sex with an 18-year-old woman in his sport utility vehicle.

Metro Nashville police said Calico, 24, was issued the misdemeanor citation early on May 12 near Nashville's Music Row area. A police officer found the player and Domonike Wheeler, 18, having sex in the back seat of Calico's Cadillac Escalade, police spokesman Don Aaron said Monday.

Both Calico and Wheeler are scheduled to appear in court May 26. She also is charged with public indecency.

Calico is entering his third season with the Titans.

IkeaMonkey*
05-24-2005, 01:07 AM
man....these guys really are stupid somtimes :shakehead

Titans' Tyrone Calico accused of having sex in public with 18-year-old

May 23, 2005
NASHVILLE, Tenn. (AP) -- Tennessee Titans wide receiver Tyrone Calico has been cited for public indecency for having sex with an 18-year-old woman in his sport utility vehicle.

Metro Nashville police said Calico, 24, was issued the misdemeanor citation early on May 12 near Nashville's Music Row area. A police officer found the player and Domonike Wheeler, 18, having sex in the back seat of Calico's Cadillac Escalade, police spokesman Don Aaron said Monday.

Both Calico and Wheeler are scheduled to appear in court May 26. She also is charged with public indecency.

Calico is entering his third season with the Titans.


Other than it being in public, I dont see what the problem is. It's not like she was 13 or something. He's not even 25 and shes 18, seems perfectly fine other than the place, to me.

Detox
05-24-2005, 03:31 AM
Other than it being in public, I dont see what the problem is. It's not like she was 13 or something. He's not even 25 and shes 18, seems perfectly fine other than the place, to me.
who ever that cop was who charged him is quite the *******, unless he was commiting the act in heavily visible area with a ton of traffic coming through.

I dont see the point of giving him a citiation for getting it on other then hes just another athlete playing in the majors to add to the list of the other screwups whove tarnished their names doing even more stupid stuff.

JCD
05-24-2005, 06:10 AM
R.W. McQuarters released by Da Bears.



If I am the Eagles or Saints I am all over him.

R-dub is a poor coverage CB. He is, at best, a nickel DB. He makes a bigger contribution as a return man than as a corner. I wouldn't get too worked up about him, he is no prize.

JCD
05-24-2005, 06:14 AM
Was he a salary cap cut or a talent (or lack thereof) cut?

He was replaced by Vashar (sp?) in the line-up. He was going to be, at best, the teams dimeback and was earning WAY too much money fot that.

Blackjack
05-24-2005, 11:02 AM
Troy Brown, whose sacrifice in serving double duty on defense for the New England Patriots in 2004 epitomized the selflessness of the Super Bowl champions

Does this make anyone else just want to vomit?

Sacrifice? Selflessness? The guy is a ****** FOOTBALL PLAYER.

sveiglar
05-24-2005, 12:09 PM
Does this make anyone else just want to vomit?

Sacrifice? Selflessness? The guy is a ****** FOOTBALL PLAYER.


He's not just a football player, he's a Patriot... and the Pats are completely underappreciated the world over. (tongue firmly in cheek)

GB
05-24-2005, 06:31 PM
Edinger lands in Minnesota: http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/MIN/8500942

JCD
05-24-2005, 06:36 PM
Edinger lands in Minnesota: http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/MIN/8500942

When your current kicker is horrible (Elling), even a bad one is a welcome upgrade.