Slegr Or Allen?

So who do you think is going to be our #6 D-man, Slegr or Allen? Who has looked better so far for those of you who have been to the games or camp?

IMO, Slegr looked pretty good when I saw the coyotes game.

He's really much more physical than i thought he'd be. He must of had 3 or 4 good hits in the game.

Allen didn't play that game, and that's the only one i've seen.

I vote Slegr.

I'm starting to think that Slegr Might steal Allen's Job just under his nose and though short term he'S a great solution, I'm afraid of the Impact on Allen's career.

allen, slegr should never have been signed in the first place.

sorry, im just bitter. i want to see allen given a real shot at this for once.

Slegr. Take a vet over a rookie.

It'll be Allen. Management wouldn't be so stupid as to hold back Allen even more.

Allen. With the loss of Murray Baron, the Canucks need to replace his toughness back on the blueline. Allen provides that and has the potential to be a top 4 defender as well. Slegr will most likely assume Allen's role of last season.

Allen has to finally be given the opportunity to play consistent top six minutes. At least early in the season. If he's slow to improve once again, Slegr can be worked in as #6 more often as the season progresses. Call it a optimistic hunch, but I think this is the year Allen solidifies an NHL roster spot for good.

Without a doubt in my mind, Bryan Allen wins the job. Jiri Slegr is too soft, and takes very untimely, dumb penalties. We dealt with it years ago, and now we have to deal with it again.

Slegr lacks the physical aspect of his game to match othe rplayers in the NHL, so he gets beaten by forwards, and is forced to clutch, hold, grab, hook, and trip. I don't like the acquisition of Jiri Slegr, to me I thought we needed someone more physical, and reliable, Slegr also tries to make too many passes in our own end, while Allen can just put it off the boards and out, which is something I think this team needs to start doing.

The games I've seen, Slegr has been brutal, giveaway after giveaway, penalty after penalty.

Allen is getting paid too much to sit in the press box

Without a doubt in my mind, Bryan Allen wins the job. Jiri Slegr is too soft, and takes very untimely, dumb penalties. We dealt with it years ago, and now we have to deal with it again.

Slegr lacks the physical aspect of his game to match othe rplayers in the NHL, so he gets beaten by forwards, and is forced to clutch, hold, grab, hook, and trip. I don't like the acquisition of Jiri Slegr, to me I thought we needed someone more physical, and reliable, Slegr also tries to make too many passes in our own end, while Allen can just put it off the boards and out, which is something I think this team needs to start doing.

The games I've seen, Slegr has been brutal, giveaway after giveaway, penalty after penalty.

umm... well Allen is injury prone and has zero experience!!

oh you mean that we discount what happened with Allen years ago then?? ;)

Slegr isn't the same player he was years ago... I've heard a lot of things about him, but soft isn't one of them!! They guy, from everything I've heard is pretty solid, well built and knows how to hit... this is the first time I'm hearing about stupid penalties.

I'm going to give Slegr the benefit of the doubt right now... I haven't seen him much in the last couple seasons, so it would be stupid to make a judgement on him based on how he was when he was with the Canucks (which was even before Peca was a Canuck, and look at him now compared to back then!!).

I am a bit disappointed with the signing only if it affects Allen's development, who IMO has real top 4 potential and is on the verge right now!! but until I've seen Slegr in some real season action playing on a solid team like our's I will reserve judgement on his game and what he can bring to the lineup.

Without a doubt in my mind, Bryan Allen wins the job. Jiri Slegr is too soft, and takes very untimely, dumb penalties. We dealt with it years ago, and now we have to deal with it again.

Slegr lacks the physical aspect of his game to match othe rplayers in the NHL, so he gets beaten by forwards, and is forced to clutch, hold, grab, hook, and trip. I don't like the acquisition of Jiri Slegr, to me I thought we needed someone more physical, and reliable, Slegr also tries to make too many passes in our own end, while Allen can just put it off the boards and out, which is something I think this team needs to start doing.

The games I've seen, Slegr has been brutal, giveaway after giveaway, penalty after penalty.

Totally wrong on Slegr. His drawbacks are a poor outlet pass, questionable hockey sense, and dumb lapses in concentration (a la Sopel) at times. Granted, some of his penalties are lazy. But you could lump Bertuzzi, Naslund, both Sedins, Arvedson, Allen, Sopel, Ruutu, May, Malik, and many other Canucks as players who often take dumb penalties.

Slegr's toughness is not even remotely in question. He has much better than average strength and will clear the front of the net better than many of our d-men. He's a good hitter and possesses plenty of grit. And he also fights a few times a year. Not the same player you're used to. Ask Penguin fans about his peak years in Pittsburgh. If he wasn't European, would we even be having this discussion?

If he wasn't European, would we even be having this discussion?

:handclap:

I'd also like to see him and Salo on the point on our #2 PP unit. Two very hard shooting defenseman...just hope slegr has learned to keep his shots down. :D

Totally wrong on Slegr. His drawbacks are a poor outlet pass, questionable hockey sense, and dumb lapses in concentration (a la Sopel) at times. Granted, some of his penalties are lazy.

You said he was totally wrong, then completely backed up his argument. Poor passing, questionable hockey sense, bad penalties. You're absolutely right, Slegr's all of those things.

By December, the rest of you will be calling for his head if he gets any significant time on this team.

Personally...I'd go with Allen...can't just think this year...
He can be a HUGE part of this team for YEARS...and a SLIGHT improvement in veteran presence and play should not change that...

Please play Allen. PLEASE.

Please play Allen. PLEASE.

Ok ... Allen :D

Slegr's shot gets talked about a lot, but Allen's is pretty underrated. He did score 8 goals last year, and I can remember a good chuck on those came from shots the point. Good, low, hard shot that is usually on net.

I like Slegr and I like the signing, but as a #7 depth defenseman, who if he plays well allows us to think about moving a defenseman in a trade .... maybe.

Allen needs to play every game this season.

Gotta play Allen until he screws up enough to take him out of the lineup or deal him. It's a make it, or break it year for Allen. I don't blame Burke for going out and acquiring an insurance guy in Slegr, because honsetly, Allen hasn't proved that he can play consistantly in the NHL.

Slegr's shot gets talked about a lot, but Allen's is pretty underrated. He did score 8 goals last year, and I can remember a good chuck on those came from shots the point. Good, low, hard shot that is usually on net.


Allen had 5 goals last year (8pts, with 3 assists)... albiet in only 48 games, and in many of those didn't get a lot of icetime.

He's still primarily a defensive dman though... which I think is more valuable to us anyways... we have 3 dmen who are offensive guys in Jovo, Sopel and Salo, and Ohlund and Malik have also been a part of our offense as well... it's more important that Allen develops into a top notch defensive dman than anything else for us.

Allen had 5 goals last year (8pts, with 3 assists)... albiet in only 48 games, and in many of those didn't get a lot of icetime.

He's still primarily a defensive dman though... which I think is more valuable to us anyways... we have 3 dmen who are offensive guys in Jovo, Sopel and Salo, and Ohlund and Malik have also been a part of our offense as well... it's more important that Allen develops into a top notch defensive dman than anything else for us.

Yep, you are right, but the point to me remains the same .... his shot is underrated. At least I think so :).

You said he was totally wrong, then completely backed up his argument. Poor passing, questionable hockey sense, bad penalties. You're absolutely right, Slegr's all of those things.

By December, the rest of you will be calling for his head if he gets any significant time on this team.


Uh, no I'm not supporting his argument. I took issue with his questioning Slegr's physical play. That's mostly what he refers to, and he's off base in that regard. I included some of Slegr's actual deficiencies, as I'm not a big fan of the guy either. In an earlier post I mention that Allen has to be given the #6 spot over Slegr.

Malik is a pylon, soft as well, if it wasn't for his reach he'd be playing in some backwater like Toronto or New York, Allen's a pylon, he's tough enough but the reason he doesn't hit more is it takes him a week to get back to his zone responsibilities, and he's certainly not going to support on the rush... Sopel thinks he's Coffee but without the wheels or the shot or the soft hands or the passing... Slegr has the wheels, his shot is light years ahead of his first stint with the Canucks and certainly can hit in open ice and on the boards but has cement hands and uses his stick to make up for positional lapses (hooking). Look folks we have 3 legitimate defencemen... the rest are filler... Be worried... the only reason we don't have 300 goals against is we have some very good backchecking forwards... (Any combination of "Nasland and Bertuzzi" and checking are oxymorons)

Malik is a pylon, soft as well, if it wasn't for his reach he'd be playing in some backwater like Toronto or New York, Allen's a pylon, he's tough enough but the reason he doesn't hit more is it takes him a week to get back to his zone responsibilities, and he's certainly not going to support on the rush... Sopel thinks he's Coffee but without the wheels or the shot or the soft hands or the passing... Slegr has the wheels, his shot is light years ahead of his first stint with the Canucks and certainly can hit in open ice and on the boards but has cement hands and uses his stick to make up for positional lapses (hooking). Look folks we have 3 legitimate defencemen... the rest are filler... Be worried... the only reason we don't have 300 goals against is we have some very good backchecking forwards... (Any combination of "Nasland and Bertuzzi" and checking are oxymorons)

think you should be watching the Canucks a little more closely this season... Malik was fine last year, as was Allen... Sopel thinking he's Coffee?? or do you mean Coffey? did you ever watch Coffey play?? Sopel plays nothing like him - forget the skill, he doesn't play the same style or the same instincts... it's like saying that Cooke thinks he's Gretzky!

our defense isn't a worry... as you said our top 3 are fine - few teams have as good a top 2 as we do in Ohlund and Jovo... Salo is a good enough #3... compare our #4-7 with other team's 4-7, and you'll see we're fine there too...

no team is comprised of 6 or 7 top pairing guys... we have 2 legit top pairing guys, 2 guys who are legit 2nd pairing dmen, and another 3 who are at least as good as any team's bottom pairing guys.

the problem isn't the players - not the forwards or the dmen... the problem is the system... there is too much emphasis on offense, and not enough on defense... we have had the top offensive defense group in the NHL for the past couple years... last year, despite the problems with injuries to Ohlund and Jovo, and Sopel going from a +21 to a -13, we still managed on improving to being the 10th best team in the league in team defense... a little more focus on this again, and we'll improve again.

This is a 104 point team that just replaced Baron with Slegr, Klatt with Arvedson, Letowski with Ruutu and Skudra with Hedberg... they are still one of the youngest teams in the league that is getting more experienced each year.

Why worry about them not playing well, when all they've done consistently is improve??

The worry, for me at least, is if they've matured enough to take another step in the playoffs... the regular season shouldn't hold many surprises, unless you think they're actually a worse team than they were last year?

Malik is a pylon, soft as well, if it wasn't for his reach he'd be playing in some backwater like Toronto or New York, Allen's a pylon, he's tough enough but the reason he doesn't hit more is it takes him a week to get back to his zone responsibilities, and he's certainly not going to support on the rush... Sopel thinks he's Coffee but without the wheels or the shot or the soft hands or the passing... Slegr has the wheels, his shot is light years ahead of his first stint with the Canucks and certainly can hit in open ice and on the boards but has cement hands and uses his stick to make up for positional lapses (hooking). Look folks we have 3 legitimate defencemen... the rest are filler... Be worried... the only reason we don't have 300 goals against is we have some very good backchecking forwards... (Any combination of "Nasland and Bertuzzi" and checking are oxymorons)

Say what? Worst analysis of the Canuck D I have seen yet...especially if you are being serious. And please, do not misspell Paul Coffey again...

Malik is a pylon, soft as well, if it wasn't for his reach he'd be playing in some backwater like Toronto or New York, Allen's a pylon, he's tough enough but the reason he doesn't hit more is it takes him a week to get back to his zone responsibilities, and he's certainly not going to support on the rush... Sopel thinks he's Coffee but without the wheels or the shot or the soft hands or the passing... Slegr has the wheels, his shot is light years ahead of his first stint with the Canucks and certainly can hit in open ice and on the boards but has cement hands and uses his stick to make up for positional lapses (hooking). Look folks we have 3 legitimate defencemen... the rest are filler... Be worried... the only reason we don't have 300 goals against is we have some very good backchecking forwards... (Any combination of "Nasland and Bertuzzi" and checking are oxymorons)

I have to agree with the other comments...

This has to be THE worst analysis of the Canuck D I have seen yet. Off-base on everything outside our top 3.

[QUOTE=nuckfan in TO]think you should be watching the Canucks a little more closely this season... Malik was fine last year, as was Allen... Sopel thinking he's Coffee?? or do you mean Coffey? did you ever watch Coffey play?? Sopel plays nothing like him - forget the skill, he doesn't play the same style or the same instincts... QUOTE]

Sorry about the misspelling of Coffey... I watched Coffey for 18 years... my comparison is the way Coffey would release from his responsibilities to support the play... it would be foolish to compare the two ... or the teams they played for... Sopel releases early as well but doesn't have the wheels to make up for his mistakes... worse he makes the same mistakes again...

Yes I watched these players last year and Allen and Malik were always in trouble when the Canucks played against the faster teams... it's been the same this year... watch the action in their own end... watch their coverage responsibilities down low... see where they get OOP and put pressure on the rest of the coverage...

Yes I do agree with you the system is not favourable to large slow footed defence... or for the defense period... and it's nice that we still have such a huge +goal differential... that doesn't make these guys good...

My concern is the top 3 are getting huge minutes all year, it's no wonder they end up blowing tires... they need some support so the Canucks can go into the post season with healthy players (which is why I like the Hedberg acquisition, if nothing more than giving Cloutier a better chance to go into postseason healthy) and I don't see the bottom 3-4 stepping up...

And for those of you who beleive the analysis is flawed, I will put my national coaching certificate against yours any time... ;)

Sopel releases early as well but doesn't have the wheels to make up for his mistakes... worse he makes the same mistakes again...

I'd agree with your assessment of Sopel. His defensive coverage is by far the worst of any of our D and he makes the biggest gaffes time and time again. He's constantly tripping over his own feet, leading to odd-man rushes and we all know he doesn't have the speed to recover. With Slegr's PP abilities (shot, decent passing) I see Sopel as very expendable. He makes our defense worse and I think Slegr/Allen sharing the PP time can make up for his offense. Jovanovski looks ready for a career year after the playoffs he had this summer. I also think Ohlund has the ability to contribute more offensively... especially if he didn't have to worry about cleaning up after Sopel.

Yes I watched these players last year and Allen and Malik were always in trouble when the Canucks played against the faster teams... it's been the same this year... watch the action in their own end... watch their coverage responsibilities down low... see where they get OOP and put pressure on the rest of the coverage...
While Allen certainly had his share of rookie mistakes last year, I have to disagree with your assessment of Malik. The number of times he recovered for Jovanovski, or broke up a play with that reach of his far outweighs the occasional speedy winger that beat him to the outside. He is a solid PKer and from a defensive defenseman you can't help but like the 1-in-10-games scoring rush he leads.

Let's give Allen his make-or-break year and go from there.