What's the Difference?

CoyoteBaloney
10-06-2003, 01:08 AM
Just surfin' around some articles on hockey tonight and came across this one. Same things the Coyotes did this summer. Both teams bulked up. Both teams got faster. Both teams got deeper.

So why is there hope in Edmonton and not in Phoenix??? Is the Oilers' roster really so much better than the Coyotes' roster so that Edmonton has hope and Phoenix is already talking about the lottery pick before the first puck of the season is dropped?



http://www.canoe.ca/Slam031005/nhl_edm-cp.html
Oilers bigger and with speed to burn
By DARCY HENTON -- Canadian Press
EDMONTON -- Speed has always been the hallmark of the Edmonton Oilers, but the young team will be bigger and even faster this season.

The Oilers revved up and bulked up at the trade deadline last March with deals that brought in fleet-footed forwards Raffi Torres, Radek Dvorak and Brad Isbister as well as six-foot-five defenceman Cory Cross.

hbk
10-06-2003, 04:35 AM
Canadian optimism? Seriously, who is the first line center in Edmonton? Ryan Smyth right now. We tried that with Doan and it didn't work too well and I'm not convinced it will in Edmonton this year.

However, they do have a more mature defence corps (although Phoenix's projects to be better in the long run) and some very exciting young prospects (in particular Ales Hemsky who Phoenix passed over to select Sjostrom - he's a dynamite offensive talent). Their farm team played very well last year and appears to have supplied a slew of younger players who are on the cusp of making the team (Jarret Stoll, Jani Rita). Throw in a couple of deals where they acquired some more youth with some very good potential (Dvorak, Torres, Isbister) and it is hard not to get excited about these guys. Although, I'm not a fan of Salo and my enthusiasm takes an abrupt nose dive at the mention of his name.

I'm not convinced that the oilers will make the playoffs. I think they are capable of scoring some goals but am not as convinced they can stop them. Like Phoenix their depth on forward is impressive. The difference in styles is interesting as Phoenix plays a more defensive style while Edmonton still likes to run and gun to a certain extent. As mentioned in a previous post this likely has something to do with the ice conditions at American west arena which inhibits skill play.

CoyoteBaloney
10-06-2003, 08:36 AM
It was really a rhetorical question. I am just sick and tired of Coyotes fans being so pessimistic. It seems that the Coytotes fans always expecting the worst. They complain about the franchise' winningest coach. All he does is guide the team to three 90+ point seasons out of 4 and he still gets no respect from the fans. He wins the Jack Adams trophy and they claim he rode the goalie. (BTW, what Adams Trophy winning coach doesn't ride the backs of the players?) He sufferes through a franchise 462 man games missed because of injury and it is somehow his fault. I am amazed at how gloom and doom the fans of this franchise are. I call it The eye Symdrome.

eye
10-06-2003, 09:55 AM
It was really a rhetorical question. I am just sick and tired of Coyotes fans being so pessimistic. It seems that the Coytotes fans always expecting the worst. They complain about the franchise' winningest coach. All he does is guide the team to three 90+ point seasons out of 4 and he still gets no respect from the fans. He wins the Jack Adams trophy and they claim he rode the goalie. (BTW, what Adams Trophy winning coach doesn't ride the backs of the players?) He sufferes through a franchise 462 man games missed because of injury and it is somehow his fault. I am amazed at how gloom and doom the fans of this franchise are. I call it The eye Symdrome.

Take the blinders off CT. The Oilers could have the identical record as the Yotes but they are still 10 times more entertaining to watch and they have a lot more speed and creative players than we do. They have a legit top 6 at Fwd. to compete and skate with anyone. They have poor goaltending like hbk indicated and an average at best defense corps but still slightly better than the Yotes. If they had Burke instead of Salo they would win some playoff rounds. It's not about being pessimistic or blind optimism, just being truthful. I would love nothing better than to come on this board full of praise and optimism if I thought it was warranted. I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel like you seem to.

Gwyddbwyll
10-06-2003, 12:52 PM
I seriously dont get why the Oilers are so optimistic about making it but I guess making the playoffs last year covers a multitude of sins.

They certainly do not have a legit top 6 to compete with anyone. They have one legitimate center, no 60 points from Marchant this year, no Carter, no Niinimaa and no Comrie.. and are relying very heavily on production from a lot of rookies.. far too much even if they are good rookies. Their defense is fairly solid and they can play team defense well (concede less goals than almost anyone but COL I believe) but losing Niinimaa is not an improvement. Goaltending is mediocre and a definite weakness when stacked up against rivals for the last playoff spot - Burke, Cechmanek, Vokoun, Minny's tandem, Denis.

Colorado, Dallas, Detroit, St.Louis and Vancouver are locks to take five spots. Anaheim and Los Angeles are very impressive and should claim two more. That leaves one the rest will be fighting over and my money wont be on Edmonton.

The Viking
10-06-2003, 01:10 PM
I seriously dont get why the Oilers are so optimistic about making it but I guess making the playoffs last year covers a multitude of sins.

They certainly do not have a legit top 6 to compete with anyone. They have one legitimate center, no 60 points from Marchant this year, no Carter, no Niinimaa and no Comrie.. and are relying very heavily on production from a lot of rookies.. far too much even if they are good rookies. Their defense is fairly solid and they can play team defense well (concede less goals than almost anyone but COL I believe) but losing Niinimaa is not an improvement. Goaltending is mediocre and a definite weakness when stacked up against rivals for the last playoff spot - Burke, Cechmanek, Vokoun, Minny's tandem, Denis.

Colorado, Dallas, Detroit, St.Louis and Vancouver are locks to take five spots. Anaheim and Los Angeles are very impressive and should claim two more. That leaves one the rest will be fighting over and my money wont be on Edmonton.

Don't count out Calgary. I don't think they will make the cut but I think they will be a markedly improved team and they will be in the hunt for a playoff spot.

Guest
10-06-2003, 01:22 PM
I don't see Edmonton being as strong as they were last year, a bubble team for the playoffs, and I don't see Calgary improving enough on last year to jump into the playoffs. I see LA making the playoffs, and the rest probably stays the same as this season. Minnesota likely will fall to a bubble team, they might be able to hold on, but I think Edmonton has a better shot.

CoyoteBaloney
10-06-2003, 01:27 PM
Take the blinders off CT. The Oilers could have the identical record as the Yotes but they are still 10 times more entertaining to watch and they have a lot more speed and creative players than we do.
Thx for proving the point! :handclap:

eye
10-06-2003, 03:01 PM
Thx for proving the point! :handclap:

My only point is that the Oilers are at least exciting to watch and it doesn't matter as much if they compete for the cup or not. At least you never get cheated on effort and rarely on excitment. The comment about identical records was strickly hypothetical. Not sure how that proves your point but if you feel it does, it was totally accidental.

CoyoteBaloney
10-06-2003, 04:46 PM
My only point is that the Oilers are at least exciting to watch and it doesn't matter as much if they compete for the cup or not. At least you never get cheated on effort and rarely on excitment. The comment about identical records was strickly hypothetical. Not sure how that proves your point but if you feel it does, it was totally accidental.
Because you have already come to the conclusion that the Coyotes won't be exciting to watch. Your comment about that the Oilers never get cheated on effort is really saying that the Coyotes do cheat their fans by not giving a full effort. You have concluded that before the first pregame of the season. So you see, my point about The eye Syndrome (Coyotes fans being pessimisits) seems to be true.

XX
10-06-2003, 05:54 PM
So you see, my point about The eye Syndrome (Coyotes fans being pessimisits) seems to be true.

Eye? a Fan? :D

PhoPhan
10-06-2003, 06:21 PM
The similarity between Phoenix and Edmonton is that both are currently dealing with financial situations. The difference is that Edmonton has an established fan base, but a weak economy, while the Coyotes lack the fans-because they are such a new team-but have a lot of economic potential. This means that for Edmonton to break out of its money woes, it needs help from the city, the province, or the country, but there is little the team can do. The Coyotes on the other hand have the ball in their court. There is a lot they can do to make money.

Dancing Chicken
10-06-2003, 07:33 PM
"weak economy" Not really, they are an Oil city, half poor and half that have more money then they know what to do with..

gibber1600
10-06-2003, 08:21 PM
"weak economy" Not really, they are an Oil city, half poor and half that have more money then they know what to do with..
Weak economy as far as the rest of the NHL cities(exchange rate), is what was meant.

_Del_
10-06-2003, 10:28 PM
It was really a rhetorical question. I am just sick and tired of Coyotes fans being so pessimistic. It seems that the Coytotes fans always expecting the worst. They complain about the franchise' winningest coach. All he does is guide the team to three 90+ point seasons out of 4 and he still gets no respect from the fans. He wins the Jack Adams trophy and they claim he rode the goalie. (BTW, what Adams Trophy winning coach doesn't ride the backs of the players?) He sufferes through a franchise 462 man games missed because of injury and it is somehow his fault. I am amazed at how gloom and doom the fans of this franchise are. I call it The eye Symdrome.

I hated Francis long before the man games missed to injury... After the first season he was here I would've sacked him. I gave him a chance, but wasn't impressed...
Sidenote, I remember being the only one here not on the Francis bandwagon, so I don't want to hear about it :p

CoyoteBaloney
10-07-2003, 09:51 AM
Sidenote, I remember being the only one here not on the Francis bandwagon, so I don't want to hear about it :p
The problem is not with those (and by those I mean only one -- you) who didn't like Francis before last season but those whose feelings for Francis are on a game-by-game basis.

ALA YotesPhan
10-07-2003, 10:01 AM
Del you are not alone. I have not been a Francis fan for just as long as you.

ulf
10-07-2003, 12:13 PM
short of scotty bowman their is no guarantee type coach,and you wouldn't be calling scotty charasmatic.

booby is better than most and should be endorsed if not embraced for his efforts while this team finds it's identity.[mgts mismgt in my op]

exciting firebrand hockey is usually a result of the teams cast of characters,mgmt hasn't supplied the coaching staff with enough of those type players for us to expect booby to produce that type of team.....hell even our choice of captain is slow and honest,steady as she goes, grind away shane doan[i love this guy] but come on he doesn't exactly inspire firebrand hockey.we don't have a talent so great that he can pick this team up by himself like messier once could or gary roberts still can. when the youth is ready then booby's day of rekoning will come.