Aki Berg

I have seen some differing opinions here in the last few threads I haveb een reading. Berg has been slotted in anywhere from 4th to 7th on this team. Where do you think he fits. Myself, I'm not certain and I think it will have to do a lot with chemistry of pairings. We have a clear-cut top 2 in Kaberle and McCabe, I doubt anyone but sluggo disputes that. IMO, Klee is a pretty set #3 a notch above the other three guys. I'd say Jackman, Berg and Marchment are a tossup and could slot in just about anywhere depending on who plays well with whom. The picture gets muddier if Kondratiev plays well and sticks beyond McCabe's return. I'd split up Kaberle and McCabe to split up our two ost offensive blueliners. Klee would be with one of them by default. I really liked Jackman with McCabe last year. Berg could go there as well, but I don't really want Marchment to get that many minutes. So my guess on the pairings when McCabe returns would be

Kaberle - Klee
McCabe - Jackman
Berg - Marchment

Having Kondratiev on board, I really can't made an educated guess, but I'd have to say that he'd be paired with Marchment.

Opinions?

Agree with everything you've said. Berg I think is an ideal 5/6 guy right now and Id pair him with Marchment for most of the season. However seeing as how he is still in his 20's, Id give a chance or two to see if he can handle more. Not all at once, and I certainly wouldnt *count* on him for those minutes, but Id be curious to see if he could take an increased responsibility if challenged by the coaching staff. With McCabe out for a month I think this is the time to see who can step up. Whether it be Jackman, Berg, Kondratiev, whatever. At least one or two guys who might not really deserve it are going to get top-4 minutes and a chance to show the coach what they can do. If none of them can handle the job then at least we know what we've got.

Right now with McCabe out i would use Berg with Marchment as the 3/4 guys.Once McCabe comes back i would likely move Berg down to the 5/6 position.For now i would also use Berg on the PP and on the 2nd PK unit.However i would not hesitate for a moment to bump either Jackman or Kondratiev up to 2nd pairing status if they show they can cut it in the first dozen games.IMO what we have on D are a debatable #1 in Kaberle who i personally feel will solidify himself as a bonafide #1 by seasons end.An ok #2 in McCabe,A solid #3 in Klee and 2 #5s in Marchment and Berg and 2 guys that could end up anywhere in the 4-7 range in Kondratiev and Jackman.Belak i would prefer be used strictly as a forward unless there is a midgame emergency need to use him on the back end.

There are so many possible scenarios such as trades,the emergence of a younger guy,injuries etc. that could change my entire rankings but with the way things are today thats the way i see our defense.

To answer your question in nutshell form i see berg as a #5.

You assume Kondratiev will play, but remember that Quinn had Colaiacovo sit in the press box for the first ~12 games of the NHL season without playing him before sending him back to St. John's, so anything is possible.

Gut feeling here is that Kondratiev plays, though, and Jackman sits. Quinn just doesn't really seem to trust in Jackman as much as, say, this board (including me) does.

I think Berg could be a 4-5 defenceman. He is still young and once was thought to be a #3-4 defenceman. It diden't work out, but I think is still a very good 5-6 man with a little bit of PP, and Pk time as well, and when needed, I believe he could fill in at the # 4 role.

"I doubt anyone but sluggo disputes that"

Bill Watters disbutes that too.

It depends on whether Kondratiev stays with the Leafs or not. If he does you almost have to put him Kaberle since Kaberle is the only defenseman who can communicate with him (unless Klee speaks Russian). Thats fine, the two played well together and are friends off the ice, which hopefully can help him get used to and playing in the NHL faster. Klee and McCabe would make a good pairing. First if McCabe can bounce back this year he could become a #1 defenseman (better on defense then Kaberle), second we all saw last year how playing with a vet. who knew what to do (Wesley) helped McCabe at the end of last year, hopefully Klee would have the same effect. Marchment has been wirten in, in ink, as the #6 guy thats his spot. Then the guy whos playing better Jackman or Berg (and I would be on Jackman) gets the #5 spot.

McCabe-Klee
Kondratiev-Kaberle
Marchment-Jackman
Berg, Belak

With McCabe hurt someone else needs to be moved into the top pairing. Now the same problem applys with Kondratiev, he pretty much has to play with Kaberle because of the language problems, so either Marchment, Berg or Jackman has to be moved up (and none of them is a top pairing guy) but out of those 3 I'd rather put Jackman with Klee. So for the first couple weeks the defense would be

Jackman-Klee
Kondratiev-Kaberle
Marchment-Berg

I like Berg as a #5 or #6 for the Leafs.

The problem that he has is that sometimes he loses his concentration on the ice and makes a dumb play or gets out of position. But there aren't many #6 d-men in the league who never make mistakes.

I've always felt if someone gave him the opportunity to get a lot of icetime he could really blossom. Perhaps even to #3 status. But I can't see that happening in Toronto.

Look at Olli Jokinen in Florida. He was terrible until Keenan arrived. Now he's developing into a legit #1 center. It's because Keenan put pressure on him, gave him a load of responsibility and gave him a ton of ice time. Jokinen responded to Keenan's pushing and proding.

I think that Berg could thrive under similar circumstances, but to a lesser extent.

I think the parings should be as such...

Kaberle - Klee
Kondratiev - Jackman
Berg - Marchment

I really don't think Kondratiev's language barrier is going to cause that much problems with him on the ice. I didn't really notice much problems in the pre season.

Well Kondratiev did play with Kaberle for a lot of the pre-season, and in the artical in the Sun they did say that Kaberle had to help Kondratiev on the ice, making sure he was up on everything that was going (ie- line changes, when plays changed etc...). You'd want to keep those two together.

And a Kondratiev/Jackman pairing? Thats 2 pretty inexperienced defensemen out there, one who know almost no english. You really need to keep the inexperienced guys like that with guys who have experience, and again Kaberle and Kondratiev make a good pairing in that reguard.

Boy, we've got some differing opinions.

Mine is different again. I am a big Ric Jackman fan (being the third man behind the net in game 2 against detroit and backhanding the puck across Center ice giving Schneider a shot notwithstanding).

This guy just needs minutes. I question whether Quinn feels the same way, but I hope he does.

When McCabe returns I see Jackman as the #4 guy with Klee while McCabe and Kaberle are on the #1 pairing.

I view Berg as an excellent #5 guy with Marchment as a good #6 guy.

Jackman will flourish with Klee as a partner.

But with McCabe injured... I see the following:

Kaberle/Klee (best 2 for sure - each gets 25 minutes)
Berg/Marchment (a horrible 2nd pair but Quinn will defer to their experience to eat up minutes)
Jackman/Kondriatev (these guys will get 12 minutes or so, plus each will get a lot of powerplay time - Jackman will be given the "opportunity" to earn the second pairing with Klee when McCabe returns)

You read it here first. :p

Right now with McCabe out i would use Berg with Marchment as the 3/4 guys.Once McCabe comes back i would likely move Berg down to the 5/6 position.For now i would also use Berg on the PP and on the 2nd PK unit.However i would not hesitate for a moment to bump either Jackman or Kondratiev up to 2nd pairing status if they show they can cut it in the first dozen games.IMO what we have on D are a debatable #1 in Kaberle who i personally feel will solidify himself as a bonafide #1 by seasons end.An ok #2 in McCabe,A solid #3 in Klee and 2 #5s in Marchment and Berg and 2 guys that could end up anywhere in the 4-7 range in Kondratiev and Jackman.Belak i would prefer be used strictly as a forward unless there is a midgame emergency need to use him on the back end.

There are so many possible scenarios such as trades,the emergence of a younger guy,injuries etc. that could change my entire rankings but with the way things are today thats the way i see our defense.

To answer your question in nutshell form i see berg as a #5.

totally agree

I have seen some differing opinions here in the last few threads I haveb een reading. Berg has been slotted in anywhere from 4th to 7th on this team.


That's a good question. There was an article in the hockey news where they made the point that if you asked people to name "#1" defencemen, etc around the league, you would end up with about 10 named, whereas by definition, there had to be 30 ( 1 per team ). So the problem is people were defining "#1" to mean "like Bobby Orr".

Personally, I like to categorize d-men as either "Top 4" or "depth" ( too many pools ? ) and on the Leafs there are 2 "Top 4" Guys ( I haven't seen Klee play, so I'm undecided ) .

Based on Berg's last 2 seasons with the Leafs, he plays at the level
of a depth guy: competent, few mistakes, good defensive zone positioning and 1 on 1 play, but not outstanding. Berg would be a top-4 guy if he played like Sylvain Lefebvre when he was with the Leafs, or Yuskie, with the attitude that he owns the def zone, and any opposing forward better keep his head up ( imagine tucker's brain in berg's body !! ) Usually this is called "Playing with emotion/intensity", but since I don't live in his brain, it's not fair to say that he doesn't.

Right now however, Berg is probably #4 on the Leafs depth chart

Kaberle, McCabe, Klee, Berg, Marchment/Jackman/Kondra

Given that Berg's pretty young, he can still become better, but so can Jackman and Kondratiev, and that would make Berg the #6 dman. Marchment I'll have to see on a regular basis, but maybe he'll surpise everyone.

berg is big, thats all.

he doesnt even use his size, so why bother

Berg is pretty much useless. Trade him and put in a young guy!

I see Berg as being a slightly below average #5 D-Man right now, with peak potential being as a #4 D-Man.

I'm content with him being in our third D pairing, and filling in on the 2nd pairing when injuries strike.

Right now with McCabe out i would use Berg with Marchment as the 3/4 guys.Once McCabe comes back i would likely move Berg down to the 5/6 position.For now i would also use Berg on the PP and on the 2nd PK unit.However i would not hesitate for a moment to bump either Jackman or Kondratiev up to 2nd pairing status if they show they can cut it in the first dozen games.IMO what we have on D are a debatable #1 in Kaberle who i personally feel will solidify himself as a bonafide #1 by seasons end.An ok #2 in McCabe,A solid #3 in Klee and 2 #5s in Marchment and Berg and 2 guys that could end up anywhere in the 4-7 range in Kondratiev and Jackman.Belak i would prefer be used strictly as a forward unless there is a midgame emergency need to use him on the back end.

There are so many possible scenarios such as trades,the emergence of a younger guy,injuries etc. that could change my entire rankings but with the way things are today thats the way i see our defense.

To answer your question in nutshell form i see berg as a #5.

There is no way Quinn (unless he's been on the sauce) puts out Jackman (a relatively inexperienced, unproved, inconsistent guy) with a rookie, even for 10 minutes a game. Kondratiev, when he plays, will see time with one of the vets - either Marchment or Klee, or perhaps Kaberle if Quinn feels a need for speed. Not only will this help Kondratiev's positional game, it allows Jackman to play with someone who's game is more solid so he can come into his own with confidence rather than trying to cover up for Kondratiev's (inevitable) rookie mistakes.