Nash

Mack
10-24-2003, 11:05 AM
i was watching the leafs game last night and MY GOD this guy has to be one of the most annoying little punks out there! i knew of his reputation but i never really sat down and watched a full game with him in it...he drew like 6 penalties, and wont fight! lol

winnipegjets4life
10-24-2003, 11:10 AM
well....im glad we have him then....as long as naz and the other big guys dont mind fightin for him. i seem to recall hearing that when claude lemieux played for colorado......guys go sick of having to stick up for him......dont remember hearing n e of that with the coyotes tho...

Boomhower
10-24-2003, 12:00 PM
i was watching the leafs game last night and MY GOD this guy has to be one of the most annoying little punks out there! i knew of his reputation but i never really sat down and watched a full game with him in it...he drew like 6 penalties, and wont fight! lol
If you've only watched him play one full game, how can you say he won't fight?
Sure the guy is annoying and plays on the edge, but thats his job and a player can't be expected to fight EVERY night. I'm not sure if he has thrown down in a Phoenix jersey yet, but when he was with the blues it seemed he always fought against the Wings...Off the top of my head he had fights against Avery and Shannahan last season.

hbk
10-24-2003, 12:52 PM
great game by Nash. His best as a Coyote. Game before though the refs were calling him for everything he did. Too bad Phoenix didn't cash in enough on those PP's though.

Mack
10-24-2003, 01:02 PM
If you've only watched him play one full game, how can you say he won't fight?


his reputation around here. and other NHL places.
when I say he wont fight i dont mean EVER! i mean with the tyope of work he does he should be fighting more. but oh well. it suits him better to be a pest. no big deal. just pointing out he did his job well.

Hordichuk_24
10-24-2003, 01:33 PM
I hate the guy. He takes just as many penalties as he draws. And when we can't score on the PP or kill any penalties it doesn't really help any.

CoyoteBaloney
10-25-2003, 06:33 AM
I love his play so far and his intelligence for the game. He draws penalties and creates PP opportunities. Yeah, he also takes a few penalties, but I have not seen it equal to what he draws yet.

ulf
10-25-2003, 07:41 AM
if your going to be an a-hole in the nhl you better provide energy and grit....so far so good

Hordichuk_24
10-25-2003, 01:20 PM
I love his play so far and his intelligence for the game. He draws penalties and creates PP opportunities. Yeah, he also takes a few penalties, but I have not seen it equal to what he draws yet.

They you aren't playing close enough attention.

Dancing Chicken
10-25-2003, 01:38 PM
Hordi I think this is the first time we disagree.. I am fast becoming a huge Nash fan.. I really like players that give it there all.. If I get a new jersey his name might be on it..

Guest
10-25-2003, 02:05 PM
Here are the official results, I researched penalties taken when Nash is on the ice, and also penalties Nash takes.

Nash has taken 7 penalties in 6 games, and been on the ice when 15 penalties were taken by the opposing team.

Here's a breakdown and details.

vs. STL, Game 1, 2 for 0 against
Nickulas & Low's penalties

vs. ANA, Game 2, 2 for 0 against
Holmqvist & Krog penalties

vs. FLA, Game 3, 4 for, 2 against
Bednar, Ritchie, Odelein, and Horton's penalties

vs. TB, Game 4, 1 for 3 against
Dingman's penalty

vs. PHI, Game 5, 2 for 2 against
Primeau & Pitkanen's penalties

vs. TOR, Game 6, 4 for 0 against
Roberts, Antropov, and Tucker's penalties as well as when Jackman & Ference fought.

The early stats look very favorable for Nash IMO. :D

The Viking
10-25-2003, 02:16 PM
[QUOTE=GoCoyotes]Here are the official results, I researched penalties taken when Nash is on the ice, and also penalties Nash takes.

Nash has taken 7 penalties in 6 games, and been on the ice when 15 penalties were taken by the opposing team.

Here's a breakdown and details.

vs. STL, Game 1, 2 for 0 against
Nickulas & Low's penalties

vs. ANA, Game 2, 2 for 0 against
Holmqvist & Krog penalties

vs. FLA, Game 3, 4 for, 2 against
Bednar, Ritchie, Odelein, and Horton's penalties

vs. TB, Game 4, 1 for 3 against
Dingman's penalty

vs. PHI, Game 5, 2 for 2 against
Primeau & Pitkanen's penalties

vs. TOR, Game 6, 4 for 0 against
Roberts, Antropov, and Tucker's penalties as well as when Jackman & Ference fought.

The early stats look very favorable for Nash IMO. :D[/QUOTEU

Unless you can isolate the penalties called while Nash is on the ice and determine that they were "instigated" by Nash, you really can't make any sort of judgement as to whether or not Nash is having a positive effect in terms of penalties taken vs drawn.

In order to make it a fair comparison you would have to compare penalties called against the opposition to the penalties the whole team takes while Nash is on the ice.

I don't think this is going to provide you with much in terms of useful info. but, nevertheless you should "compare apples to apples" so to speak.

Hordichuk_24
10-25-2003, 05:06 PM
Hordi I think this is the first time we disagree.. I am fast becoming a huge Nash fan.. I really like players that give it there all.. If I get a new jersey his name might be on it..

I just don't like Nash type players. I never have. Same goes for guys like Lemieux, etc. The only one I actually like is Sean Avery of the Kings.

Hordichuk_24
10-25-2003, 05:09 PM
Here are the official results, I researched penalties taken when Nash is on the ice, and also penalties Nash takes.

Nash has taken 7 penalties in 6 games, and been on the ice when 15 penalties were taken by the opposing team.

Here's a breakdown and details.

vs. STL, Game 1, 2 for 0 against
Nickulas & Low's penalties

vs. ANA, Game 2, 2 for 0 against
Holmqvist & Krog penalties

vs. FLA, Game 3, 4 for, 2 against
Bednar, Ritchie, Odelein, and Horton's penalties

vs. TB, Game 4, 1 for 3 against
Dingman's penalty

vs. PHI, Game 5, 2 for 2 against
Primeau & Pitkanen's penalties

vs. TOR, Game 6, 4 for 0 against
Roberts, Antropov, and Tucker's penalties as well as when Jackman & Ference fought.

The early stats look very favorable for Nash IMO. :D

Thanks for the stats. I should have clarified what I was trying to say from the begining. I know Nash has drawn just as many if not more penalties than he has taken. But what I was trying to say was he may draw a lot of penalties but while trying to do so, he is going to pick up quite a few as well. And its obvious our PK isn't the best. I would rather have someone in there that won't put us on the PK as much as Nash will. The PP opportunities are nice I admit. But it isn't going to be like this all year long. Nash is a hot head at times, he will continue to take stupid penalties all year long.

_Del_
10-26-2003, 12:00 PM
Nash is a hot head at times, he will continue to take stupid penalties all year long.


The other thing in this penalty taken, penalty drawn, debate is that if you'll care to notice, certain ref's have his number, and while in one game he may get away with murder and still draw penalties, in another game, he'll costs us 3 penalties. I'd rather not have to take the gamble everynight on whether we'll get the short end of the officiating/Nash battle.

hbk
10-26-2003, 12:20 PM
The other thing in this penalty taken, penalty drawn, debate is that if you'll care to notice, certain ref's have his number, and while in one game he may get away with murder and still draw penalties, in another game, he'll costs us 3 penalties. I'd rather not have to take the gamble everynight on whether we'll get the short end of the officiating/Nash battle.

every team needs an aggitating presence to get their team into the game. we've been searching for three years for such a presence (see Darcy Hordichuk experiment). I don't expect Nash to be a long-term solution but he offers us time to groom a replacement (Ben Eager). Nash has played some good hockey but he will cost this team at points during the season. Thus far though his benefits have exceeded his costs.

Hordichuk_24
10-26-2003, 01:00 PM
The other thing in this penalty taken, penalty drawn, debate is that if you'll care to notice, certain ref's have his number, and while in one game he may get away with murder and still draw penalties, in another game, he'll costs us 3 penalties. I'd rather not have to take the gamble everynight on whether we'll get the short end of the officiating/Nash battle.

Exactly. At least a guy like Nazarov doesn't really take any penalties that hurt us any. If he takes a penalty it is usually a 5 minute major which doesn't put us on the PK (unless of course an instigator is called which doesn't happen often with him).

XX
10-26-2003, 03:26 PM
Its not always fun to watch a down and out coyotes team, until you see Nash just level someone for fun. Or get mauled in front of the net, or get in a pushing match.

I think hes great, he doesnt fight as much as May, but Ill take him.

_Del_
10-26-2003, 03:45 PM
Its not always fun to watch a down and out coyotes team, until you see Nash just level someone for fun. Or get mauled in front of the net, or get in a pushing match.

I think hes great, he doesnt fight as much as May, but Ill take him.

... he also signed for 3 times as much as May....

Guest
10-26-2003, 03:48 PM
... he also signed for 3 times as much as May....

No doubt the leadership May brought to us, and what he contributed, I would have gladly paid 1/3 of Nash's salary for May instead. Plus we could have kept our asset that we traded for Nash.

_Del_
10-26-2003, 03:58 PM
No doubt the leadership May brought to us, and what he contributed, I would have gladly paid 1/3 of Nash's salary for May instead. Plus we could have kept our asset that we traded for Nash.

You would think, wouldn't you...

But mgmnt is on it's own path....

hbk
10-26-2003, 04:41 PM
wasn't May asking for 2 million/year from Phoenix? I know he didn't get it this year but how much are we paying Nash?

_Del_
10-26-2003, 05:02 PM
wasn't May asking for 2 million/year from Phoenix? I know he didn't get it this year but how much are we paying Nash?

1.8M

Even if May was asking for 2M, it'd be better spent than the 1.8 for Nash, imo.

While I heard he was looking for 2M, he signed for 600k, I believe in VAN. It'll be avail on NHLPA, but I'm too lazy to look it up at the moment. Assuming he wanted to stay in PHX, or even if it would've taken more to sign him (800-900k), I think I'd rather have kept May and not traded the pick for Nash...


EDIT: I lied, I'm not too lazy, I looked it up. NHLPA.com shows Nash at 1.3M roughly and May at 1.1M. Lower and Higher than I'd seen previously. I could've sworn that he was listed at 1.8 earlier. :shrugs:

Dancing Chicken
10-26-2003, 05:07 PM
I am sorry but I like Nash more then May.. I lost all respect for May after the whole bar thing.. Not only that Nash is great to watch, as I said befor I do not care if my team always wins as long as they give there 100% and play exciting hockey.. I am loving this season so far..

_Del_
10-26-2003, 05:19 PM
I am sorry but I like Nash more then May.. I lost all respect for May after the whole bar thing.. Not only that Nash is great to watch, as I said befor I do not care if my team always wins as long as they give there 100% and play exciting hockey.. I am loving this season so far..

No accounting for taste ;)


hehe

Dancing Chicken
10-26-2003, 06:02 PM
Lmao

Hordichuk_24
10-26-2003, 09:02 PM
I would take May over Nash anyday of the week. Not only is he a better fighter, but a way better player as well. Nash has pretty much zero skill, LOL. He is a good skater though.

CoyoteBaloney
10-26-2003, 10:33 PM
Nash over May. Nash is entering his prime years while May is on the decline.

hbk
10-27-2003, 04:42 AM
May played very well last year when he was looking for that fat contract. Prior to that though he wasn't nearly as effective.

I'd take Nash over May but it's close and May is by far the superior fighter. Nash has more to prove so I think we'll see more consistent effort than what we used to get with May who really only played well when he wanted the new contract.