is the comrie for lupul story BS? [Archive]

Seachd

11-09-2003, 05:20 PM

I wouldn't be at all shocked if Edmonton ASKED for Lupul, but I seriously doubt the Ducks offered him. If they did offer Lupul, then in all likelihood Edmonton would have taken it immediately.

I don't think that's true. What if Lowe's still trying to weasel Coburn out of Atlanta? Lupul vs. Coburn? Maybe Lowe prefers the big d-man. Maybe he's looking somewhere else at other players. And he's probably getting offers we're not hearing about. He's not going to accept a deal without looking for the best offer, Lupul or not.

Basically, I think the chances of Lupul being offered to the Oilers are 50/50. There's as much reason to believe it as there is not to, and vice versa. It's been reported, but I don't know if it's been reported concretely enough times to automatically believe it. But when I look at other players rumoured to be offered, I believe Lupul is too. (Although I'm not saying any of these players are actually being offered.)

EDIT: After reading this over, I decided my post is pretty unbelieveable, although I believe it, because I believe what I type to be believeable.

cheesymc

11-09-2003, 10:21 PM

why increase the salary cap and offer potential youth? I know the ducks need offense, but one player cant change everything.... and they are already losing over 12 million a year.

If the ducks are offering a player it would be someone like Prospal and Sauer

id do something like

Prospal, Sauer, Krog/Andy, 2nd rounder for Comrie and Isbister/Torres

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-09-2003, 10:31 PM

Lupul and Comrie (putatively) have similar contracts, since Comrie's on record saying he'd sign for around the qualifying offer, 1.3-ish. Lupul makes just over 1.

If Lowe's holding out for Coburn, he's probably got quite a wait ahead of him.

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 01:08 AM

Kevin Forbes

11-10-2003, 01:34 AM

I doubt Edmonton wants any of those players...they want a young up and coming talent. None of those 4 players are what Edmonton is looking for.

especially because of the salary constraints of Edmonton, they couldn't afford a player like Prospal. The deal makes little sense

Seachd

11-10-2003, 05:26 AM

Lupul and Comrie (putatively) have similar contracts, since Comrie's on record saying he'd sign for around the qualifying offer, 1.3-ish. Lupul makes just over 1.

They said on HNIC that Comrie would probably sign for $500,000 this year. That might be pretty tempting to some teams.

BIG FAN

11-10-2003, 05:45 AM

They said on HNIC that Comrie would probably sign for $500,000 this year. That might be pretty tempting to some teams.

On HNIC, they actually said that Comrie would sign for $500,000 less than what he is asking for to stay with Edmonton. I don't think there is any way that the Ducks would give Lupul - he's has far more potential than Comrie. People are saying that Lupul is going to be a 40 goal scorer in 3 years. As for Coyburn - Wadell probably hung up the phone as soon as Lowe mentioned his name.

I think Lowe is overvaluing Comrie. He's a 60-point player with a history of getting hurt. You're not going to get a blue-chip prospect for that in this day and age in the NHL.

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 05:55 AM

In OC Register today Bryan Murray says that he has talked to Edmonton a number of times about Comrie,and that he was told by the Oilers GM that he is not in a hurry to get a trade done.

Murray verified that Edmonton has asked about Lupul but has also asked about a number of players and or combinations.

Apparently another player Edmonton may be interested in is Ryan Getzlaf, according to the Register.

A trade could be close, but as Lowe says, he will take his time to make the right trade that will help his team.

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 05:58 AM

Now its officially in print that Murray has discussed Joffrey Lupul's name in regards to a trade for Mike Comrie...That must be great psychologically for the Duck's rookie. :shakehead

FacelessButcher

11-10-2003, 06:18 AM

Now its officially in print that Murray has discussed Joffrey Lupul's name in regards to a trade for Mike Comrie...That must be great psychologically for the Duck's rookie. :shakehead
um, I think he would be happy to play here it is his home-town he was expecting to get picked up by Lowe in his draft year. Lowe tried to move up for Bouwmeester then for Lupul but couldn't get either, the rumour is Lupul was originally quite unhappy when Anaheim drafted him and was very much hoping to play with the Oilers.

Brodeur

11-10-2003, 06:23 AM

I think Lowe is overvaluing Comrie. He's a 60-point player with a history of getting hurt. You're not going to get a blue-chip prospect for that in this day and age in the NHL.

He's a 23 (just turned 23) year old center that already has hit 60 points and he got hurt ONCE. I hardly categorize that with injury prone. You can call him smurfish, but one broken thumb doesn't mean that he's suddenly Saku Koivu-level injury prone (missing 15 games a year on a consistent basis).

If Lupul (or Chistov) hits 60 points in the next couple of seasons, I'm sure you would justifiably be quite happy.

You can look at Marc Savard and how he only got Calgary a 2nd tier prospect in Ruslan Zainullin. Savard and Comrie are similar, but at the time Savard was under contract and the Flames didn't have the most patient of GMs.

If you look at Edmonton's needs, they definitely need a cornerstone defenseman more than anything. Right now they're already having trouble finding ice time for younger guys like Rita and Stoll. Plus they drafted yet another forward with their top pick this past summer.

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 06:28 AM

um, I think he would be happy to play here it is his home-town he was expecting to get picked up by Lowe in his draft year. Lowe tried to move up for Bouwmeester then for Lupul but couldn't get either, the rumour is Lupul was originally quite unhappy when Anaheim drafted him and was very much hoping to play with the Oilers.

I meant a rookie getting his name involved in trade talks...not the specifics of him possibly playing in his hometown.

Healthy Scratch

11-10-2003, 06:43 AM

I'd be willing to bet a mortgage payment on Loops NOT being traded. He's significantly cheaper than Comrie and the Ducks are already at $45-50 million in payroll.

BTW, great article on Lupul in the Ducks game program last night. Anyone see it?

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 07:00 AM

um, I think he would be happy to play here it is his home-town he was expecting to get picked up by Lowe in his draft year. Lowe tried to move up for Bouwmeester then for Lupul but couldn't get either, the rumour is Lupul was originally quite unhappy when Anaheim drafted him and was very much hoping to play with the Oilers.

At the draft without a surprising trade Lupul was either going to get taken by Pittsburgh,Nashville or Anaheim. Can't see him wishing he had been drafted by those other two.

mmbt

11-10-2003, 07:10 AM

He's a 23 (just turned 23) year old center that already has hit 60 points and he got hurt ONCE. I hardly categorize that with injury prone. You can call him smurfish, but one broken thumb doesn't mean that he's suddenly Saku Koivu-level injury prone (missing 15 games a year on a consistent basis).

True, but he's still a smallish player who hasn't made any impact in the playoffs, and this isn't the first time there have been problems getting him signed.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 07:23 AM

um, I think he would be happy to play here it is his home-town he was expecting to get picked up by Lowe in his draft year. Lowe tried to move up for Bouwmeester then for Lupul but couldn't get either, the rumour is Lupul was originally quite unhappy when Anaheim drafted him and was very much hoping to play with the Oilers.
The whole "local boy" thing didn't do much for Comrie.

Seachd

11-10-2003, 07:24 AM

On HNIC, they actually said that Comrie would sign for $500,000 less than what he is asking for to stay with Edmonton.

Nope. We don't know what Comrie's asking for to stay in Edmonton. But since he doesn't want to play there, I'd say it's approaching infinity.

Oake said Comrie will sign for "significantly less" than the Oilers' qualifying offer of $1.3 million, probably as low as $500,000.

FacelessButcher

11-10-2003, 07:28 AM

The whole "local boy" thing didn't do much for Comrie.
Ya he's a special case :( .

Seachd

11-10-2003, 07:36 AM

A trade could be close, but as Lowe says, he will take his time to make the right trade that will help his team.

Well, this is good news for Oiler fans if Lowe's maximizing the return. But I'm starting to worry that maybe Lowe will wait too long. I'm getting a tad antsy. Anyway, the Edmonton Journal said today (actually Rich Winter said) that Lowe wants two players in return for Comrie (or I would assume Comrie+ depending on the players). I guess we'll have to wait and see what shakes down.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 08:13 AM

Winter doesn't seem to be helping the process along.

mysteryman

11-10-2003, 08:25 AM

In OC Register today Bryan Murray says that he has talked to Edmonton a number of times about Comrie,and that he was told by the Oilers GM that he is not in a hurry to get a trade done.

The OC Register covers hockey? You could have fooled me.
Randy Youngman should be beaten.....

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 08:28 AM

The Register does the best job of covering the Ducks IMO.

The editorialists don't give a crap about hockey either way, but when its hot they'll try to cash in on it. They just do so in an ignorant way.

Brodeur

11-10-2003, 08:40 AM

True, but he's still a smallish player who hasn't made any impact in the playoffs, and this isn't the first time there have been problems getting him signed.

With all due respect, Comrie's only been to the playoffs twice. First time was his rookie year, when Doug Weight was still around, so Comrie definitely wasn't the focal point of the Edmonton attack. Still managed 3 points in 6 games, which isn't too bad for a rookie.

Last year, he broke his thumb late in the year which really messed up his season statistically. From most reports, it never healed properly before the playoffs. If I recall correctly, Comrie said he couldn't get much power on his shots/passes because of it......although who really is 100% come playoff time.

As for the difficulty in getting Comrie to sign his rookie contract.......it was perfectly within his rights to have transferred from Michigan to the WHL to expedite a contract signing. He was merely just gaining the same draft rights as any other CHL player. I think it's way too easy as fans to sit back from our chairs and say "Man, that was a crappy thing to do. He should have just signed for 3rd round money."

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 11:13 AM

mmbt

11-10-2003, 01:16 PM

With all due respect, Comrie's only been to the playoffs twice. First time was his rookie year, when Doug Weight was still around, so Comrie definitely wasn't the focal point of the Edmonton attack. Still managed 3 points in 6 games, which isn't too bad for a rookie.

Last year, he broke his thumb late in the year which really messed up his season statistically. From most reports, it never healed properly before the playoffs. If I recall correctly, Comrie said he couldn't get much power on his shots/passes because of it......although who really is 100% come playoff time.

Okay, so at best you can say he's a playoff unknown. But even playoffs aside, is he the type of player likely to put up the same numbers playing for Babcock that he does playing in Edmonton?

As for the difficulty in getting Comrie to sign his rookie contract.......it was perfectly within his rights to have transferred from Michigan to the WHL to expedite a contract signing. He was merely just gaining the same draft rights as any other CHL player. I think it's way too easy as fans to sit back from our chairs and say "Man, that was a crappy thing to do. He should have just signed for 3rd round money."

Lots of players could take advantage of that loophole, but few do. He may be within his rights, but it still says something about him that he pushed it to that point.

In any case, the fact remains that if he were truly worth a star player's return (a blue-chip prospect and possibly more), Edmonton would not have had any hesitation in paying him what he was asking for ... it would have been considered a bargain. Clearly, they don't think he's worth it.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 01:25 PM

Okay, so at best you can say he's a playoff unknown.

What's Lupul?

But even playoffs aside, is he the type of player likely to put up the same numbers playing for Babcock that he does playing in Edmonton?

His system allowed an undersized perimeter player to rack up 81 points.

In any case, the fact remains that if he were truly worth a star player's return (a blue-chip prospect and possibly more), Edmonton would not have had any hesitation in paying him what he was asking for ... it would have been considered a bargain. Clearly, they don't think he's worth it.

But its not a given that that opinion is due to Comrie specifically or the larger financial picture in Edmonton. How many times have they traded away young players before their first big contract increases? It's a pattern of theirs. Comrie's attitude might be exacerbating the situation, but its not really fair to assume that he's causing it.

Brodeur

11-10-2003, 02:23 PM

Lots of players could take advantage of that loophole, but few do. He may be within his rights, but it still says something about him that he pushed it to that point.

I dunno, it's sort of a double standard between CHL players and NCAA players.

I don't think anybody cried foul when Kurt Sauer failed to come to terms with the Avalanche and in turn signed a relatively lucrative deal with the Ducks. I don't think anybody was that mad when Scott Parker refused to agree to a deal with the Devils, then re-entered the 1998 draft and got picked in the 1st round by the Avs. I don't think I've heard anybody question Kurt Sauer's character. I think most figure Parker made the correct decision in re-entering the draft.

I wouldn't necessarily say greed was Comrie's primary concern when he jumped from school. Maybe he felt that he was ready for the NHL, but the Oilers were kinda lagging in negotiations realizing they owned his rights until his college eligibility was up. Plus give Comrie a little credit for working his tail off and reaching all his bonuses.

mmbt

11-10-2003, 03:41 PM

What's Lupul?

Also unproven, but if prospects are always less worthwhile than semi-established players, why even bother drafting at all? Just trade all your picks and prospects for solid but not great players. Of course, if you do that, you'll end up with a solid but never great team. Upside matters, and Lupul's upside is better than Comrie's.

His system allowed an undersized perimeter player to rack up 81 points.

And his worst goal scoring season ever, no?

But its not a given that that opinion is due to Comrie specifically or the larger financial picture in Edmonton. How many times have they traded away young players before their first big contract increases? It's a pattern of theirs. Comrie's attitude might be exacerbating the situation, but its not really fair to assume that he's causing it.

But it's not as if he's asking a huge amount of money, and if he were truly considered a star player, even financially-strapped Edmonton would love to have him at $3 mil or less.

I just think if you're going to trade Lupul, you might as well throw in more and land a real star player like we did in the original Selanne trade.

Jerky Leclerc

11-10-2003, 03:46 PM

The question I think few of us have asked is whether the Ducks really need Comrie. Yes we can use Comrie but is he worth giving up a top talent like Lupul? I can't answer that. I won't answer that. I don't believe in mortgaging the future. And Lupul is the future. Will Comrie make that much of a difference? I don't think he will. We got some good offensive players on this team who just hasn't found the net yet. But when we do, the Ducks should be alright. I'm not too worried about our record.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 04:01 PM

Also unproven, but if prospects are always less worthwhile than semi-established players, why even bother drafting at all? Just trade all your picks and prospects for solid but not great players. Of course, if you do that, you'll end up with a solid but never great team. Upside matters, and Lupul's upside is better than Comrie's.

Depth is the answer. Not every draft pick is a blue-chipper, and NONE of them are Can't-Miss Kids. Trading one prospect doesn't mean trade them all. I'm not advocating a cookie-cutter approach to trading draft picks. Look at each opportunity. This one has merit.
Lupul's being a bit overrated right now, since he's new and exciting. It isn't likely he's the next Mike Bossy. As has been mentioned, we'd all be thrilled if he ended up being a 60 point guy. In that light, it makes more sense to trade for a guy who's already done it, and who may have more to give.

And his worst goal scoring season ever, no?

I don't believe that was the system's fault. Do you?

But it's not as if he's asking a huge amount of money, and if he were truly considered a star player, even financially-strapped Edmonton would love to have him at $3 mil or less.

He was asking for more earlier. And now acrimony is such that they probably couldn't reach a deal at any price.

I just think if you're going to trade Lupul, you might as well throw in more and land a real star player like we did in the original Selanne trade.

Comrie could be one. He may have hit his ceiling or he may not have. Lupul may or may not reach his upside. We win now because he's established, and we may even win later.

mmbt

11-10-2003, 05:01 PM

I don't believe that was the system's fault. Do you?

No, but I'm pretty sure most would agree that Edmonton plays a more open system than Anaheim does. And if Kariya was a bad fit, I don't see Comrie being a whole lot better.

He was asking for more earlier. And now acrimony is such that they probably couldn't reach a deal at any price.

True, but if reports were true, while Comrie may have been asking quite a bit, Edmonton was definitely lowballing him if he's really a budding star.

Comrie could be one. He may have hit his ceiling or he may not have. Lupul may or may not reach his upside. We win now because he's established, and we may even win later.

But this assumes that Comrie won't bust, either. Just because he scored 30 once doesn't mean he'll ever do it again, otherwise Jimmy Carson would have been the greatest center in the late 80's/early 90's outside of Gretzky and Lemieux.

I just don't think Comrie has any real star potential. Lupul does. If I'm going to give up on any of our prospects, it'll be Chistov long before Lupul, as I think Stan has far bigger bust potential.

Bobby Ryan Getzlaf

11-10-2003, 05:43 PM

I think it comes down to, who will benefit the team more, Lupul or Comrie. Both are young and full of potential. Comrie has had a 60 point season, Lupul hasn't. This is Lupul's rookie year though.

My opinion: BM should have his cake and eat it too. Lupul is going to be a gooder. Comrie is and will be too. So why not keep both? Alexei Smirnov sounds nice going for Comrie, and it can happen. I'm sure Lowe would like Smirnov, and Vitali Vishnevski. Hey, maybe throw in a couple picks and Lowe will send us Laraques. I think that Murray knows Garret Burnett is an AHL player, and will attempt to get Laraques with Comrie. Man I'd love the line-up then.

Comrie-Fedorov-Sykora
Prospal-Rucchin-Niedermayer
Chistov-McDonald-Lupul
Pahlsson-Krog/Johnson-Laraques

Ozolinsh-Simpson
Havelid-Carney
Salei-Sauer

Giguere
Gerber

Man, that would be awesome. I wish somehow we could lure Staios from there too, to better our blueline. He'd go well with Ozolinsh.

Duckstudd269

11-10-2003, 06:09 PM

I just don't think Comrie has any real star potential. Lupul does. If I'm going to give up on any of our prospects, it'll be Chistov long before Lupul, as I think Stan has far bigger bust potential.

THANK YOU! I agree completely. does anybody else think this deal would work?

To edmonton: Chistov, Vish, Smirnov, 3rd pick

To Anaheim: Comrie, Laraques

Bobby Ryan Getzlaf

11-10-2003, 06:26 PM

THANK YOU! I agree completely. does anybody else think this deal would work?

To edmonton: Chistov, Vish, Smirnov, 3rd pick

To Anaheim: Comrie, Laraques

Yeah, it works. I'd rather trade a first over Chistov, but whatever. With Comrie and Laraques a first likely wouldn't be too high. This draft isn't as deep as last year's anyway. Anyway, that's a bit too much. Cistov is worth Comrie straight up, maybe with the third, and Smirnov and Vish is probably worth around Comrie too, not Laraques. Smirnov, Vish, 2nd is probably worth Comrie and Laraques. Maybe have a condtional 2nd round dp next year, with the conditions being each have to have good point totals(Comrie:50-60pt, Laraques:15-20pt) and they both have to still be with the team before the 2005 draft.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 06:34 PM

No, but I'm pretty sure most would agree that Edmonton plays a more open system than Anaheim does. And if Kariya was a bad fit, I don't see Comrie being a whole lot better.

I don't think he was a bad fit. He had 81 damn points. His size and the system forced him to work harder than otherwise. I think Comrie's capable of that.

True, but if reports were true, while Comrie may have been asking quite a bit, Edmonton was definitely lowballing him if he's really a budding star.

Do you honestly believe that every offer a GM makes is in good faith? I'd expect them to start with a lowball offer. That's business.

But this assumes that Comrie won't bust, either. Just because he scored 30 once doesn't mean he'll ever do it again, otherwise Jimmy Carson would have been the greatest center in the late 80's/early 90's outside of Gretzky and Lemieux.

I just don't think Comrie has any real star potential. Lupul does. If I'm going to give up on any of our prospects, it'll be Chistov long before Lupul, as I think Stan has far bigger bust potential.

Lupul only has star potential because he hasn't played enough, not because he's done anything to warrant it. It's a circular argument.

Comrie has PROVED that he's capable of it. For every Jimmy Carson (a rather rare occurence) there are ten high-round busts. Comrie's a far better gamble as an asset.

I want to clarify that I really like Lupul and would hate to see him go, but I just think that idea that Lupul's a better player than Comrie is ridiculous. He's not better now, and he may never be. But then again he MAY.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 06:35 PM

Also at this point last year Chistov was "untouchable", two years ago Vishnevski was. Rookies are always overrated to begin with.

hunter orange

11-10-2003, 06:36 PM

Duckstud's proposal looks pretty handsome to me. Here's one guy hoping Lowe gives it a long look if something like that were on the table.

Duckstudd269

11-10-2003, 06:52 PM

I want to clarify that I really like Lupul and would hate to see him go, but I just think that idea that Lupul's a better player than Comrie is ridiculous. He's not better now, and he may never be. But then again he MAY.

I understand where u are coming from CFOB, Comrie is going to be a great player. but who would u rather trade chistov or Lupul? everyone says chistov is great, but IMO, he's not that great. Zetterburg is better by far. well i think so. I think nobody wants to trade Lupul, because look how early he's showing flashes. and it's not common to find a big, skilled, scorer. I mean yes, he's been invisible some games, but ive been keeping track when he has. and 90% of the time he has been is when he's with linemates, such has johnson. look what he did with Rooch. keep him there and u will see what this can do. i mean chistov has been with federov alot this year, and has done nothing really. compared to Lupul anyway.

Bobby Ryan Getzlaf

11-10-2003, 06:52 PM

Also at this point last year Chistov was "untouchable", two years ago Vishnevski was. Rookies are always overrated to begin with.

Boogs, I think that has to do with what we have. Chistov was our promising rookie, so he was untouchable. So Lupul is good in his rookie year+Chistov hasn't been too good in his rookie year+Lupul's name is tossed around in trade rumors=People want Chistov gone. I for one want Cheese gone before Lupul. But try to keep him if you can, BM. As for the Vishnevski case, he was loaded with potential since his draft year. He was supposed to be an awesome defenseman. A couple years of seeing him not reach his potential has lead to him being available. Simple as that.

But true, the same thing may happen to Lupul next year anyways. If Lupul has a slow start next year, Getzlaf has a great start for a rookie, and people start saying Getzlaf may be going somewhere, that could have people saying trade Lupul before Getzlaf. I just hope we keep all three.

I think Smirnov is the best option to go for Comrie. Only two years separate them, and already Comrie is well proven. Smirnov, with another guy who is potential-chocked, Vish, can get Comrie and a low pick maybe. Add in a decent pick or two, and we can hopefully get Laraques. That is the type of deal Murray makes, like in the Ozolinsh and Niedermayer trades, not trading off a good, young future superstar.

Hopefully this just ends soon, hopefully with Murray trading Smirnov and Vish and whatever else for Comrie and maybe Laraques, so the talk of Lupul an Chistov getting traded ends for a bit.

mmbt

11-10-2003, 07:16 PM

I understand where u are coming from CFOB, Comrie is going to be a great player. but who would u rather trade chistov or Lupul? everyone says chistov is great, but IMO, he's not that great. Zetterburg is better by far. well i think so. I think nobody wants to trade Lupul, because look how early he's showing flashes. and it's not common to find a big, skilled, scorer.

That's what it comes down to, IMO. Comrie types (small, skilled scorers) come on the market every year. Not that he's not one of the better ones of that type, but he doesn't stand out by that much.

Lupul may turn out to be nothing, but he's shown hints of being more than the one-trick pony we drafted him as.

I honestly wasn't expecting as good an all-around game as he's shown, I expected Lupul to just be a better version of Banham. Well, he's got the shot, but he's also shown excellent vision/passing, signs of physical play, etc..

I hearken back to when Dallas traded Iginla, who was "only," an unproven prospect at that point. But they didn't just get a small, skilled scorer, they got Joe Nieuwendyk, one of the best centers in the league. When we ponied up Oleg and Kilger, we didn't just get a decent top 6 player, we got a superstar winger.

To trade Lupul for Comrie almost straight up, I think either means one thinks Lupul is nowhere near being a blue-chip prospect, or that one thinks that Comrie's going to be a perennial 30 goal scorer. Maybe Lupul will bust, and Comrie will turn out to be a perennial all-star. But it's far from a given, and I've seen enough from Lupul to want to gamble on him.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 10:24 PM

Boogs, I think that has to do with what we have. Chistov was our promising rookie, so he was untouchable. So Lupul is good in his rookie year+Chistov hasn't been too good in his rookie year+Lupul's name is tossed around in trade rumors=People want Chistov gone. I for one want Cheese gone before Lupul. But try to keep him if you can, BM. As for the Vishnevski case, he was loaded with potential since his draft year. He was supposed to be an awesome defenseman. A couple years of seeing him not reach his potential has lead to him being available. Simple as that.

Well, that's my whole point. Today's gold is tomorrow's dross. You don't want to turn gold into silver, but you sure as hell would trade your dross for it.

Tverdovsky and Kilger were both high-end prospects. Niewendyk had been struggling and was losing favor in Calgary. Its not that dissimilar.

But whatever. You have a point. I'll just say that I'll be happy if we keep Lupul and happy if we trade him for Comrie and leave it at that.

Spankatola Jamnuts*

11-10-2003, 10:36 PM

On a related note (http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-duckrep11nov11,1,768000.story?coll=la-headlines-sports):

Asked after Sunday's game about Lupul's determination to shoot, Babcock said, "That's all he does. Every time he gets [the puck], he doesn't care who's yelling for the pass. I thought he was great."

Babcock then paused, smiled and said, "No, let's not say that in the paper, then he'll be a dog next game. Just say he was brutal, and he'll be fine."

190Octane

11-10-2003, 10:46 PM

I think some people are forgetting that Chistov is only going to get a lot better. The year before last he only played 9 games which stalled his development some. That has a huge effect on a 20 year old player, and it will take some time to overcome it. Granted he only has 5 assists so far this season but he also has one of the best +/- marks on the team and is one of the most skilled players on the team.

Trading him would be a huge mistake because when he does find his niche he's going to be an impact player. I don't understand why some people expect 2nd year players dominate. I wish people would give him and Smirnov a little more of a leash instead of expecting the world out of them right away. Trading Smirnov and Chistov for Comrie would be plain stupid.

McDonald19

11-10-2003, 11:07 PM

THANK YOU! I agree completely. does anybody else think this deal would work?

To edmonton: Chistov, Vish, Smirnov, 3rd pick

To Anaheim: Comrie, Laraques

I would be ok with that...but maybe:

To Edmonton:Vish,Smirnov,2004 1st round

To Anaheim:Comrie, Laraque

Pwnasaurus

11-11-2003, 04:14 AM

That's what it comes down to, IMO. Comrie types (small, skilled scorers) come on the market every year. Not that he's not one of the better ones of that type, but he doesn't stand out by that much.

Lupul may turn out to be nothing, but he's shown hints of being more than the one-trick pony we drafted him as.

I honestly wasn't expecting as good an all-around game as he's shown, I expected Lupul to just be a better version of Banham. Well, he's got the shot, but he's also shown excellent vision/passing, signs of physical play, etc..

I hearken back to when Dallas traded Iginla, who was "only," an unproven prospect at that point. But they didn't just get a small, skilled scorer, they got Joe Nieuwendyk, one of the best centers in the league. When we ponied up Oleg and Kilger, we didn't just get a decent top 6 player, we got a superstar winger.

To trade Lupul for Comrie almost straight up, I think either means one thinks Lupul is nowhere near being a blue-chip prospect, or that one thinks that Comrie's going to be a perennial 30 goal scorer. Maybe Lupul will bust, and Comrie will turn out to be a perennial all-star. But it's far from a given, and I've seen enough from Lupul to want to gamble on him.

Excellent post.

mmbt

11-11-2003, 04:53 AM

Tverdovsky and Kilger were both high-end prospects. Niewendyk had been struggling and was losing favor in Calgary. Its not that dissimilar.

Oleg and Chad were high-end prospects, but so is Lupul. You're talking about 3 players who were all picked in the top 10 of their respective drafts.

Not sure it's fair to say Nieuwy had struggled. He was still not too old, and the previous year he was still scoring over a point per game, and almost a goal every other game. Whereas Iginla, unlike Lupul, hadn't even played in the NHL yet.

Jshibley

11-11-2003, 04:53 AM

Excellent post.

agreed.

hunter orange

11-11-2003, 03:36 PM

McDonald19

11-11-2003, 04:19 PM

mmbt

11-11-2003, 04:48 PM

It's kind of funny that on the one hand the claim is that Comrie's worth a big return in a trade ("He's a 30 goal scorer!"), yet on the other hand Oil fans don't think he's worth what he was asking monetarily ("Let him sit!" was an oft-expressed stance if you poke around various Oiler fan hangouts on the net).

And Lowe seems to see it the same way, but you can't help but think that if Lowe really pegged Comrie as having major star ability, he would have had no problems ponying up. It's not like the kid was asking $5 mil a year. What they offered wasn't even a minor star player's salary.

hunter orange

11-11-2003, 05:19 PM

mmbt:

Turns out money has never really been the issue. Comrie's even agreed to sign for less than his qualifier IN ANOTHER CITY. Lowe criticized Comrie in the press after last season's playoffs for poor play. Comrie shouldn't have been singled out the way he was, but Lowe was setting things up for contract negotiations...ENTER WINTER. Comrie's agent IMO has been responsible for most of what has happened ever since. He has instilled a kind of "Lindros" mentality into the young man...damn shame is what it is! Hope Comrie fires him and has a fine career else where.

I'm not really sure how a trade might pan out between us but Chistov, Lupul or Getzlaf will HAVE to be coming back. If Laraque is included it will likely have to be one from EACH group.

I: Lupul, Chistov, Getzlaf
II: Smirnov, Popovic
III: Vishnevski, 1st rounder.

Personally, don't think Laraque will be moved in this deal. I'm thinking it will be something like Comrie for Lupul & 2nd - OR - Comrie for Getzlaf & Vishnevski

Randall Graves*

11-11-2003, 05:29 PM

Sorry, McDonald...Duckstud's proposal makes a lot more sense. Lowe will not trade Comrie for one unproven player and another underachieving one -- no matter where they went in the draft and how much potential they might have. Chistov or Lupul (hopefully the second) would have to be involved to interest the Oil.

Comrie & Laraque ----- for ----- Chistov, Smirnov, Vishnevski, 3rd

...looks just about right.
So we trade two guys with high ceiling potential a defensemen whose only 23 ANDa pick for one guy who has alot of potential and an overrated enforcer with a little skill?

that doesen't look right too me, BM rarely gets had in deals...this would be one of them...i'd prefere we keep Chistov,Smirnov and Vishnevski anyways...Smirnovs 21,Chistov JUST TURNED 20 GUYS! the expectations on Chistov have been totally unrealistic for 20 2-0 GUY! and now everyone wants to trade him?

what a fickle crowd you guys are(not you hunter orange)

lwvs84

11-11-2003, 05:51 PM

DO NOT TRADE CHISTOV, LUPUL, or GETZLAF! Comrie, as good as he is, he seems to have too much of an ego.

Duckstudd269

11-11-2003, 07:09 PM

mmbt:
Personally, don't think Laraque will be moved in this deal. I'm thinking it will be something like Comrie for Lupul & 2nd - OR - Comrie for Getzlaf & Vishnevski

I wouldnt do either of those deals if I were BM. We dont need Comrie, he would help the team, but its not a need right now.

FacelessButcher

11-12-2003, 10:04 PM

I was reading this story (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article.php?sid=6132&mode=threaded&order=0) about Getzlaf and this quote really stuck out at me-
"He has the potential to develop into a top first line center, a type of prospect the Ducks have been lacking. He describes himself as a hard hitting forward, saying "I just play hard, I’m a big kid, like to get in there. I’m a good two-way player." Although some of his favorite players are Mike Comrie and Peter Forsberg, he says he doesn't pattern his game after anyone in the NHL. He plans on working on his strength and conditioning this summer"

Does this kid have brain damage that is totally obscure reference Comrie is good but not who most players would typically pick as a role model or favourite player. Usually you will here Forsberg,Thorton,Yzerman,Blake and Sakic a million times. Just thought it was very wierd and thought I would share.

Brodeur

11-12-2003, 10:13 PM

Does this kid have brain damage that is totally obscure reference Comrie is good but not who most players would typically pick as a role model or favourite player. Usually you will here Forsberg,Thorton,Yzerman,Blake and Sakic a million times. Just thought it was very wierd and thought I would share.

My favorite baseball player growing up was Chili Davis. Because of him, I trained myself to be a switch hitter.

Probably the same thing with Getzlaf, Comrie just happens to be a good player on the local professional team.

JJTopper

11-13-2003, 02:23 AM

To Anaheim: Comrie and Isbister
To Edmonton: Chistov/Lupul and Vishnevski (+ a pick?)

Ya? No?

Looks like both sides could make out well in this deal IMO. Ducks get a young star at a cheap salary (Comrie said 500,000/yr right?) and a young power forward (I'm sure I'v read several Duck fans mention the need for one). The Oil get a kid with good upside and a defender to help our blueline. Thoughts? I doubt Laraque goes anywhere, being the fan fav he is and all. But I guess you never know..

Chistov-Fedorov-McDonald
Niedermayer-Comrie-Isbister
Sykora-Rucchin-Prospal
Ward-Pahlsson-Krog
or
Isbister-Fedorov-McDonald
Niedermayer-Comrie-Lupul
Sykora-Rucchin-Prospal
Ward-Pahlsson-Krog

(got your lines from yesterdays game thread...so maybe these wouldn't be your lineup choices. But that does look good to me!)

So what do you think? :dunno:

Kevin Forbes

11-13-2003, 05:03 AM

Rucchin a third-liner?

Yeahhhh that's why I don't like this....

Chistov and Vish?
nice talking to you...

JJTopper

11-13-2003, 05:40 AM

A good 2-way player on your third line? It's not that crazy. :p And you already have Sykora and Prospal on your third line, which is a lot more supprising then Rucchin on the third IMO. But like I said, those might not be what your personal lines would look like. They wouldn't even be my personal lines for you guys. They are just slightly adjusted lines from last nights game. Do what you like.

And it's Chistov or Lupul...you pick. If you don't like the proposal, thats fine. I can understand not wanting to trade certain players ect, but are you saying the value is so far off? Cause I thought it was pretty damn close. If there's no pick comming back to Edmonton in that deal, you could even argue the Ducks win that trade. A young proven cheap 60+point player and a power forward who if he breaks out could be just a great addition and if he doesn't, you still have a large physical guy who can play on the 2nd/3rd line and pot a 40points, for a kid who might be as good as Comrie or might not and a defender with top4 potential but hasn't hit that in Anaheim from what I hear and has no offencive skills to speak of. I dunno what's so bad about it. :dunno:

[Be back later tonight to check responces, if you do. Just so you don't expect a quick reply..hehe]

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 11:30 AM

Rucchin a third-liner?

Yeahhhh that's why I don't like this....

Chistov and Vish?
nice talking to you...
Whats wrong with Rucchin being a 3rd liner thats what he is best suited for being 3rd line does not make you less of a player its just according to his two-way style, good on face-offs, and pk ability.

not so disimilair to the Devils core

3 core (heart of the team) players
Rucchin- Madden
Carney- Stevens
Giguere- Brodeur

Kevin Forbes

11-13-2003, 11:36 AM

I would say, to sum up everything that has been said by both GMs, Murray asked about Comrie, Lowe mentioned Lupul or Getzlaf and Murray hung the phone up.
I can't see us getting Comrie, he just doesn't fit onto the team. Murray has consistently tried to get the team bigger and grittier and this is a step in the opposite direction
Rucchin is a top 6 centre, two-way? sure, but all our centres are two-way. Comrie is also a top 6 centre, but I can't see why we would acquire him to bump Rucchin down or use Comrie on the third line.
We don't have room for Comrie and we don't really have room for Isbister either. There isn't enough Ice-time to go around.

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 11:50 AM

I would say, to sum up everything that has been said by both GMs, Murray asked about Comrie, Lowe mentioned Lupul or Getzlaf and Murray hung the phone up.

link plz

Kevin Forbes

11-13-2003, 12:20 PM

Brodeur

11-13-2003, 12:39 PM

One thought I had........and this is probably way too early to think about this, but, say Fedorov is desperately unhappy in Anaheim by the end of next season and subsequently opts out of his contract. Might be good to have a guy like Comrie around.

When the Devils were awesome offensively, we had Arnott-Holik-Gomez-Madden down the middle. If Larry Robinson could find a way for that center rotation to work, I'm sure Babcock could find enough ice for Fedorov, Rucchin, and Comrie. And if Comrie is serious about taking 1.1 this season, there wouldn't be too much pressure for Comrie to be getting 20 minutes a game, especially after missing training camp.

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 12:40 PM

http://www2.ocregister.com/ocrweb/ocr/article.do?id=65915
http://spectorshockey.tripod.com/spectors_trade_rumours.html

that says they have been in contact and that Lupul's name was mentioned, the fact that this story is out in about and not an actualy trade basically means that this is probably not going to happen
I think you are being over-presumptious Lowe does not want to rush the trade(said so about 10 times) and is still fielding a lot of offers from a lot of teams he does not want to make a move until he is reasonably certain it is in the best interest of the Oilers. He is by no means forced to snatch up the offer immediately and saying Murray hung up on him is laughable, did he hang up before or after Lowe checked out Getzlaf in a Calgary Hitman game. Their is still interest and Lowe is still checking out his options e.g. Sharks proposed an offer today and Atlanta has a scout following the Oilers around. Us the fans may be impatient but Lowe is taking his time and making a calm, cool, and collected decision.

Dan Wood reports Anaheim Mighty Ducks GM Bryan Murray confirmed on Sunday he'd spoken with Kevin Lowe regarding Mike Comrie "a number of times." Murray said Lowe told him he's not in any hurry to move the disgruntled centre. Murray confirmed Lupul was one of the names mentioned in the talks, as well as prospect Ryan Getzlaf.

Hank

11-13-2003, 01:18 PM

Lowe does not want to rush the trade(said so about 10 times) and is still fielding a lot of offers from a lot of teams he does not want to make a move until he is reasonably certain it is in the best interest of the Oilers.

And you assume as much as the rest of us. "Fielding a lot of offers"? If that was really the case I think Comrie would have a new home already. In reality Lowe has probably gotten decent, but not great, offers from a handful of teams. Nobody wants to give up too much and Lowe would prefer dealing with an Eastern conference team. All things considered this will probably drag on longer than it should. And I don't see the Ducks as the team that finally lands Comrie.

Bobby Ryan Getzlaf

11-13-2003, 01:33 PM

To Anaheim: Comrie and Isbister
To Edmonton: Chistov/Lupul and Vishnevski (+ a pick?)

Laraques will some to Anaheim before Isbister.

Also, if Comrie comes here, don't you think he just might go to wing? I've heard he isn't great at wing, but playing with Fedorov and Sykora/McDonald will help a bit. Or how bout Fedorov on the wing? He might do decent enough there. I just don't like Rucchin on the third line, as he can be effective as a scorer as well as a shut-down artist.

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 01:47 PM

And you assume as much as the rest of us. "Fielding a lot of offers"? If that was really the case I think Comrie would have a new home already. In reality Lowe has probably gotten decent, but not great, offers from a handful of teams. Nobody wants to give up too much and Lowe would prefer dealing with an Eastern conference team. All things considered this will probably drag on longer than it should. And I don't see the Ducks as the team that finally lands Comrie.
Quantity of offers and discussion does not neccesarily equate to quality offers is true, he's waiting for a deal that "makes sense" .Yes I assume their is a lot of interest but their are nearly daily updates and new information on movement or other parties interested in Comrie's services their is plenty of discussion and was reported that over 7 teams were bidding for his services(I would call 7 "a lot" occasionally one drops out and another steps forward).My presumptions have backing evidence when Forbesy made a conjecture that Murray was not willing to give up either Lupul or Getzlaf and would promptly deny Lowe if he asked for them("Murray hung the phone up") when there has been no news stories I have seen to back this conclusion.

Shark's GM-"I talk to Kevin a lot," Wilson tells the Mercury News. "I don't know that he's in any great rush.

Kevin Lowe-"If we have to trade Mike, we'll make one when we're ready, when we're getting the type of trade that'll help the hockey club," Lowe told the Edmonton Journal.

Originally I think he was pushing for a center but now it seems he wants a defence man more so he is probably going to view his options some more before he makes a final decision.

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 02:02 PM

I just don't like Rucchin on the third line, as he can be effective as a scorer as well as a shut-down artist.
Scatchard,Marchant,Madden, Barnes, Ricci, and Linden all are atleast decent at scoring Rucchin may be the best offensively out of this bunch but I don't think he looks too far out of place. He is well suited to the roll, come playoff time I would rather have him on my 3rd line then Pahlsson or McDonald.

P.S. Niedermayer belongs on the 3rd line too

Hank

11-13-2003, 03:05 PM

Shark's GM-"I talk to Kevin a lot," Wilson tells the Mercury News. "I don't know that he's in any great rush.

Kevin Lowe-"If we have to trade Mike, we'll make one when we're ready, when we're getting the type of trade that'll help the hockey club," Lowe told the Edmonton Journal.

I don't see why you keep posting quotes saying Lowe is in no rush to deal, in my mind all it does is emphasize the lack of SERIOUS interest in Comrie at Lowe's over-inflated asking price.

Seven teams interested? I'd buy that (and call it a handful ;-) ) but I don't see any bidding war going on. Seven teams in a bidding war would have gotten a trade done by now. Instead we see reports out of Philly saying the rumors about them are all crap and stories like the Ducks where the GM has a talk or two just to check it out (what GM wouldn't do that much?).

Duckstudd269

11-13-2003, 04:29 PM

Kevin Forbes

11-13-2003, 05:22 PM

Niedermayer belongs on the 3rd line too
Niedermayer is our leading goal scorer (actually tied with Steve Rucchin)

also to continue on the whole "Kevin Lowe is in no rush", let's see here Edmonton isn't doing the greatest in the standings (Ducks suck...but we're ahead of youse guys, although with 2 more games...). Anyway, one would say a 60 point center would not hurt them. Anything that the Oilers get from any deal, would be an addition to the team, because Comrie isn't adding anything right now.
Plus having Comrie pour his heart out to Scott Oak/Bob McKenzie/Barbara Walsh etc and have this whole thing go on and on and on, can't help the family atmosphere in Edmonton much either.....similar to Detroit with Joseph, it's a headache that everyone would rather just go away.
I think if Lowe had found a deal he liked, he would of taken it. Therefore the fact that Mike Comrie isn't playing NHL hockey right now is because Lowe hasn't found a deal he liked.
Thus, Lowe's demands aren't being agreed upon by the inquiring teams. I do not think Lowe has 5 potential deals on hold that he'll pick and chose and pull the trigger on at his heart's consent.
There is a reason why there hasn't been a deal made yet, and it doesn't have anything to do with Lowe's patience, in my opinion. It doesn't make sense, what would he be waiting for? Any delay means it will be further into the season before a new character can be added into the dressing room, learn the system etc.
There can only be one reason why Lowe is waiting, and that's because he hasn't found a deal he likes, thus his demands aren't being agreed upon by the rest of the league (ie = too high demands). None of the other teams have to make a deal with Lowe, but Lowe has to deal Comrie.

Randall Graves*

11-13-2003, 11:03 PM

[QUOTE=Brodeur]One thought I had........and this is probably way too early to think about this, but, say Fedorov is desperately unhappy in Anaheim by the end of next season and subsequently opts out of his contract. Might be good to have a guy like Comrie around.
[\QUOTE]
If Fedorov decides to leave we have Getzlaf and Brent who will both be ready, or Murray could go out and sign someone to replace Fedorov.

I wouldn't part with Chistov,Getzlaf or Lupul that'll be a really good line to go with forwards like,Sykora,Prospal,Niedermayer,Rucchin etc.

Randall Graves*

11-13-2003, 11:11 PM

Scatchard,Marchant,Madden, Barnes, Ricci, and Linden all are atleast decent at scoring Rucchin may be the best offensively out of this bunch but I don't think he looks too far out of place. He is well suited to the roll, come playoff time I would rather have him on my 3rd line then Pahlsson or McDonald.

P.S. Niedermayer belongs on the 3rd line too
he averages almost 60 points per 82 games...he's not a third line center.
Niedermayer has 6 goals so far I have no problem with him on our 2nd line either...Scatchard and Marchant are like 30-40 pt players...Im happy with him on our 2nd line thank you very much/

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 11:32 PM

I don't see why you keep posting quotes saying Lowe is in no rush to deal, in my mind all it does is emphasize the lack of SERIOUS interest in Comrie at Lowe's over-inflated asking price.

Seven teams interested? I'd buy that (and call it a handful ;-) ) but I don't see any bidding war going on. Seven teams in a bidding war would have gotten a trade done by now. Instead we see reports out of Philly saying the rumors about them are all crap and stories like the Ducks where the GM has a talk or two just to check it out (what GM wouldn't do that much?).
I keep posting because its the truth he is not rushing around like a chicken with its head cut off trying to pitch Comrie for the first reasonable deal. He is trying to insure maximum return on his asset and for an asset that would best fullfill his teams needs. How do you know he was not been offered a serious deal(you tap his phone?) the only thing we know by him not making a deal yet is he has not been offered a deal so sweet that he would be forced to take it. Lowe needs to take time to identify his needs properly and decide exactly what he wants i.e.two-way center, power-play guy, grinder,stay-at-home defense man,goalie etc. and other teams need to be sure they need what Comrie brings before they start putting up any serious assets it's not a game of Jenga there is serious consequences to his and other Gm's actions there is no take backs and Comrie is a serious trading chip that a small market team needs to make sure we don't squander frivolously on something we don't need.

In the young season we also had to answer serious questions like is Ryan Smyth capable of playing center? Can Tommy Salo rebound or do we need a replacement? With Salo injured can Conklin carry the load? 2nd worst GAA in the league do we need defense? 5th best GFA in the league, fluke? new players can they cut it?and numerous other question we have to identify our situation we only get one shot at making the proper trade. We have also been scouting a lot of the potential players we might acquire, Edmonton usually goes for young cheap players and you need to identify their potential and current abilities and whether or not they fit our style which takes time not like a player who has been in the league for 3-5 years where you have a huge book on him and know exactly what your getting.

FacelessButcher

11-13-2003, 11:56 PM

he averages almost 60 points per 82 games...he's not a third line center.
Niedermayer has 6 goals so far I have no problem with him on our 2nd line either...Scatchard and Marchant are like 30-40 pt players...Im happy with him on our 2nd line thank you very much/
Points are a matter of what role your put in much of the time, Marchant averaged 35 points most of his career we put him on the 2nd line gave him some pp time bang 60pt season and Scatchard got 27 goals last year does that make either a 2nd line player no they are absolutely fantastic 3rd line checkers. Some times their is more important things than scoring too a good shut down line with offensive punch is very helpful, preventing goals is just as good as scoring them if your 3rd line can shut down the other teams top line and pop in the odd timely goal they will often be the difference between victory and defeat(What's Vancouver or Calgary team without their 1st line?Nothing). What are the two most succesful team in the past 14 years Detroit and New Jersey right? Do you think it is just a coincidence that they have the 2 best 3rd lines in the league?

Chistov/Leclerc-Rucchin-Niedermayer
does it stand up to-
Pandlfo-Madden-Langenbrunner
-or-
Maltby-Draper-McCarthy

I am not saying that either Rucchin or Niedermayer have to be on the 3rd line but is it such a poor alternative? Would they cease to be useful? 3rd line does not mean less ice-time it just means pre-dominantly checking role so shut-down and counter instead of score score score.

Jerky Leclerc

11-13-2003, 11:58 PM

I like how Lupul is handling all these trade rumors. The kid sounds like he got his head straight.

----------

From the LA Times today.

Rookie right wing Joffrey Lupul has reached several milestones, such as his first NHL point and first goal. To those he can add his first experience as the subject of a trade rumor.

Lupul last week was reported to be the price for the Ducks to acquire the rights to unsigned forward Mike Comrie from the Oilers. An Edmonton native and seventh overall choice in the 2002 entry draft, Lupul was more flattered than concerned.

"Mike Comrie is a really good player. I guess I've got to look at it as a compliment as much as anything," said Lupul, who has two goals and seven points in 16 games.

"I know there have been all those rumors, that Mike wants to get out of Edmonton, and the rumors have him going different places. My phone was ringing off the hook from friends saying, 'Hey, are you coming here?' But that's about as far as it went. It has died down, and I hope it stays that way."

--------------

duckhead3198

11-14-2003, 12:30 AM

FB...

Having Rucchin and Niedermayer on the 3rd line is NOT a poor alternative. Sometimes I just wish Oates came back. Personally I think this would be a lot of fun to watch.

Chistov - Fedorov - MacDonald
Sykora - Oates - Prospal
Lupul - Rucchin - Niedermayer
Krog - Pahlsson - Ward

And then when LeClerc comes back put him with Rucchin and Niedermayer, and then rotate MacDonald, Lupul, and Chistov among the top line wingers and that 4th line wing spot, depending on who needs a kick in the butt.

Personally, I'd rather not get Comrie, I don't want to give up anything on the big club to get him. Colorado tends to make trades where they somehow get good players for unproven guys, and unless the Ducks can do the same, I'd let another team get Comrie. The only good that can come out of any bidding war is if the Kings get jacked outbidding the Ducks.

FacelessButcher

11-14-2003, 12:41 AM

Niedermayer is our leading goal scorer (actually tied with Steve Rucchin)

also to continue on the whole "Kevin Lowe is in no rush", let's see here Edmonton isn't doing the greatest in the standings (Ducks suck...but we're ahead of youse guys, although with 2 more games...). Anyway, one would say a 60 point center would not hurt them. Anything that the Oilers get from any deal, would be an addition to the team, because Comrie isn't adding anything right now.
Plus having Comrie pour his heart out to Scott Oak/Bob McKenzie/Barbara Walsh etc and have this whole thing go on and on and on, can't help the family atmosphere in Edmonton much either.....similar to Detroit with Joseph, it's a headache that everyone would rather just go away.
I think if Lowe had found a deal he liked, he would of taken it. Therefore the fact that Mike Comrie isn't playing NHL hockey right now is because Lowe hasn't found a deal he liked.
Thus, Lowe's demands aren't being agreed upon by the inquiring teams. I do not think Lowe has 5 potential deals on hold that he'll pick and chose and pull the trigger on at his heart's consent.
There is a reason why there hasn't been a deal made yet, and it doesn't have anything to do with Lowe's patience, in my opinion. It doesn't make sense, what would he be waiting for? Any delay means it will be further into the season before a new character can be added into the dressing room, learn the system etc.
There can only be one reason why Lowe is waiting, and that's because he hasn't found a deal he likes, thus his demands aren't being agreed upon by the rest of the league (ie = too high demands). None of the other teams have to make a deal with Lowe, but Lowe has to deal Comrie.
Anaheim is supposed to win the cup this year not be "as good" as Edmonton your supposed to be dominant(we're tied now and you still have a game up on us :p. Having Carney back helps a lot,huh?). Edmonton is playing satisfactory by our standards we just hover around 8th-9th spot all year and make a hard push at the end to make sure we get into the play-offs. Yes Comrie is not traded because Lowe has not found a deal he likes but first he has to decide on what it is he would like which in the Oiler boards has shifted about 4 times since the start of the season their is no harm in waiting to make certain(when he is certain we will see what rumors come up and see what he identifies as the need). This situation is not similair to Joseph in the fact that we are not paying Comrie where Joseph will cost them 8 million to hold onto this year and dis-simlair in the fact that there is not that quantity of bitterness there or in the locker room, not toooo.. many people in Edmonton hate Comrie and we do partially put the blame on him for not winning a playoff round but he is not the central focal point like Joseph is for being the cause of the first round exit in Detroit. Lowe can wait as long as he likes he has the peoples support in Edmonton and managements support and we are not playing bad enough to force a deal. Yashin took a lot longer than this to trade before Ottawa found a trade they liked(very good return for him) and unlike Yashin, Comrie is only asking for $1.13 or less not $9 million(Yes Comrie is not quite the player Yashin was but Comrie is less or even in pain in the neck status and far cheaper) so he is easier to take-on for many teams. We hold his rights till free agency he is 23 now and the new CBA will make it 28-29 most likely so we have 5-6yrs to get a deal done(yes his value may start decreasing after the first year but we still have our asset). "Family atmosphere"? this isn't Romper Room buddy who cares? *raises hand* ooh! ooh! Not Me! :D.

I don't like being the only Oiler defending my position if you want to continue I will defend it in the big Comrie thread in the trade board.

Kevin Forbes

11-14-2003, 01:38 AM

"Family atmosphere"? this isn't Romper Room buddy who cares? *raises hand* ooh! ooh! Not Me! :D.

heh
bad choice of words I guess
I meant that, I always see Edmonton as having a pretty close dressing room and I don't think this distraction helps that.
The Joseph comment was just in reference to the fact that I'm sure both sides will be a lot happier when Comrie is out of town, and playing for another team.
If I was Lowe, I jump at the first deal that I liked. Given that the quarter way mark is now approaching, I guess he needs to lower his expectations to help his team.
Comrie practicing with that University team isn't helping the Edmonton Oilers and Lowe should focus on getting a player in the lineup as soon as possible, IMO.
Anyway, I think I'm gonna stop with this too. I really have no clue what I'm talking about

Hank

11-14-2003, 06:28 AM

How do you know he was not been offered a serious deal?

That question cuts both ways, as I said in my first post you assume just as much as the rest of us. With that said, my answer is simple: Comrie is still an Oiler.

Hank

11-14-2003, 06:40 AM

Points are a matter of what role your put in much of the time, Marchant averaged 35 points most of his career we put him on the 2nd line gave him some pp time bang 60pt season and Scatchard got 27 goals last year does that make either a 2nd line player no they are absolutely fantastic 3rd line checkers.

Rucchin was put in the role of either 1st or 2nd line center every year he's been a Duck and succeeded each time... but he's a 3rd line checker?

FacelessButcher

11-14-2003, 09:17 AM

That question cuts both ways, as I said in my first post you assume just as much as the rest of us. With that said, my answer is simple: Comrie is still an Oiler.

How do you know he was not been offered a serious deal the only thing we know by him not making a deal yet is he has not been offered a deal so sweet that he would be forced to take it.
Of course it cuts both ways I mearly asked you the question of how do you know when you obviously can not, then proceeded to point out the only certainy we have is that he has not been offered a sweetheart deal, otherwise he would of taken it. This does not state that he has or has not recieved a serious offer just that he has not recieved a great or undeniable offer and to surmize the seriousness of offers is something neither you nor I have any knowledge of, which you clearly pointed out. I don't see how my post gravitates away from these truths continued on the trade board plz.

McDonald19

11-17-2003, 09:31 PM

From TheFourthPeriod.com :

It is starting to become a daily routine – what’s the latest on the Mike Comrie situation out in Edmonton?

Various reports across the National Hockey League continue their claims that the Mighty Ducks of Anaheim are heavily pursuing the Oilers’ holdout. Sources, even to TFP, suggest the same.

One publication, the Arizona Republic, hint a trade is looming as Anaheim is waiting for Edmonton to complete a deal that would send the centerman to the Ducks.

While Oilers general manager Kevin Lowe is reluctant to make a trade without acquiring top-end talent, the team is reportedly have interest in 20-year-old Joffrey Lupul, while the likes of Andy McDonald, Stanislav Chistov and Ryan Getzlaf are also said to be attractive commodities.
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Why are we still interested in this guy?

Randall Graves*

11-17-2003, 10:10 PM

NO THANKS I'M HAPPY WITH CHISTOV,LUPUL,MCDONALD AND GETZLAF!!!!

when will this end?can the OIlers just traed this guy to the Kings already?I'm hoping BM does not ruin the chemistry that is finally starting to click.

but it also seems alot of moves that are made come out of the Blue (Oates signing with EDM,Fedorov signing here etc)

JUST SAY NO TO COMRIE!!!!

Pwnasaurus

11-18-2003, 04:13 AM

I heard he's going to Nashville for some combination of Legwand or Arkhipov and others...picks/prospects etc

FacelessButcher

11-18-2003, 06:59 AM

I heard he's going to Nashville for some combination of Legwand or Arkhipov and others...picks/prospects etc
Did you just read this off Spector's hockey or did you actually have some other source?

Pwnasaurus

11-18-2003, 07:58 AM

Did you just read this off Spector's hockey or did you actually have some other source?

I have a buddy who lives in the hockey hotbed of Tennessee and he says it's floating around there.

HughJass*

11-18-2003, 08:49 AM

I heard he's going to Nashville for some combination of Legwand or Arkhipov and others...picks/prospects etc

Wow, that would be interesting. Comrie is better than Legwand, and Arkhipov needs a shake up. If Poile can squeeze a pick or two also then this would be a sweet deal. But I doubt it will happen...

McDonald19

11-18-2003, 09:48 AM

I think Nashville should make that trade if possible. Comrie and one more skill player and they are a playoff team. Right now they have to many good grinding players like Walker,Hartnell etc. Add a couple of highly skilled players in with them and they could make the playoffs.

Chayos

11-18-2003, 11:14 AM

I would be ok with that...but maybe:

To Edmonton:Vish,Smirnov,2004 1st round

To Anaheim:Comrie, Laraque

There is no way that gets this deal done. The worrel deal showed the value of Top end enforcers and Laraque is the best in the game so he is a major component of this deal.

I would counter with Comrie and Laraque + a 2nd for Vishevski, Getzlaf and Chistov.

From an oiler standpoint this would work for us.

Comrie > Chistov

Laraque=Getzlaf

Vishnevski>2nd rounder.

It could also be Chimera or Horcoff instead of the 2nd.

Chayos

11-18-2003, 11:19 AM