11/21 Falcons vs. Albany

Doug
11-22-2003, 10:34 AM
Line combinations for those of you that are interested.
<PRE>
Sjostrom, Fredrik - Jaspers, Jason - Banham, Frank
Podlesak, Martin - McLeod, Kiel - Shuchuk, Gary
Stutzel, Mike - Ferraro, Chris - Ferraro, Peter
- Westrum, Erik - Lukes, Frantisek

Wilson, Mike - Bezina, Goran
Tselios, Nikos - Wood, Dustin
Knyazev, Igor - McCarthy, Jeremiah

Pelletier, Jean-Marc
LeNeveu, David

Scratches:
Gillies, Trevor (LW)
Schutte, Michael (D/F)
</PRE>

Gwyddbwyll
11-22-2003, 01:19 PM
Thanks Doug

It matches what Ive seen of how Lukes and Sjostrom are used.. it seems the Coyotes are grooming Podlesak and Sjostrom as LWs even though they are better known for playing C and RW respectively and Lukes was labelled a LW but I've only seen him play RW when he was here (and Eager too for that matter). Of course its also possible Phoenix just wants them to be multi-positional.

Chris L
11-22-2003, 02:46 PM
Why is Schutte so often scratched ? Is he playing so poorly ? Hasn't Knyazev been a healthy scratch as well for a few games ?

It seems McCarthy and Wood are playing better as they are regularly in the line up ! Not really great news for the Coyotes depth in defense...

Guest
11-22-2003, 09:25 PM
A big loss to Manchester tonight, Lenny let in 5-6 goals. He hasn't appeared to adjust well to the AHL thus far. It might not be the best place for him right now, or it might be an identical case to the NHL team not having adequate defensive experience.

scoob4093
11-23-2003, 05:43 AM
A big loss to Manchester tonight, Lenny let in 5-6 goals. He hasn't appeared to adjust well to the AHL thus far. It might not be the best place for him right now, or it might be an identical case to the NHL team not having adequate defensive experience.


Considering the teams lackluster play of late it is fair to say that a lot of these prospects are in over their head and belong in the E.

Gwyddbwyll
11-23-2003, 12:36 PM
Which ones belong in the E scoob ?

scoob4093
11-23-2003, 01:51 PM
Which ones belong in the E scoob ?


Roughly half of em. 3 games played this weekend and 3 losses. Not even close in any of em. Outshot today 40-19. I guess these so called prospects are all late bloomers eh Steve ?

Gwyddbwyll
11-24-2003, 10:04 AM
Roughly half of em. 3 games played this weekend and 3 losses. Not even close in any of em. Outshot today 40-19. I guess these so called prospects are all late bloomers eh Steve ?

Names please. If you're going to slag them off then at least be specific about who doesnt cut the grade... otherwise your criticism is basically both useless and meaningless.

scoob4093
11-24-2003, 10:31 AM
Names please. If you're going to slag them off then at least be specific about who doesnt cut the grade... otherwise your criticism is basically both useless and meaningless.


Gotcha. For what it's worth and noting the stats. Podlesak 12gp; 0 goals, Lukes 12gp; 0 goals, McLeod 18gp; 1 goal and reluctantly Sjostrom 17gp; 0 goals. Not exactly getting it done wouldn't you agree ? As for the defense keep Wilson, Tselios, Bezina and Knyazev. From McCarthy, Wood and Schutte you have 3 that don't belong.Also feel that LeNeveu would be better off in the E and apparently some who post here feel the same way. On the other hand you've gotta play the hand you're dealt and since the Yotes have zero depth and payroll problems that causes them to sell off players and keep ones that don't belong there from coming here (Simpson-Spiller) it looks like this season will be no different than the last 5; something you have posted would change dramatically for the better under the new regime.

Guest
11-24-2003, 11:23 AM
I believe McCarthy & Wood are signings by Springfield, not necessarily by the Coyotes. Unfortunately things are not looking up for either team connected at this point, and the longer things are bad for the Falcons, it'll be even more lasting that way for the Coyotes.

Gwyddbwyll
11-24-2003, 01:40 PM
Gotcha. For what it's worth and noting the stats. Podlesak 12gp; 0 goals, Lukes 12gp; 0 goals, McLeod 18gp; 1 goal and reluctantly Sjostrom 17gp; 0 goals. Not exactly getting it done wouldn't you agree ? As for the defense keep Wilson, Tselios, Bezina and Knyazev. From McCarthy, Wood and Schutte you have 3 that don't belong.Also feel that LeNeveu would be better off in the E and apparently some who post here feel the same way. On the other hand you've gotta play the hand you're dealt and since the Yotes have zero depth and payroll problems that causes them to sell off players and keep ones that don't belong there from coming here (Simpson-Spiller) it looks like this season will be no different than the last 5; something you have posted would change dramatically for the better under the new regime.

Thanks. To be honest I'm a bit disappointed.. I was hoping for more analysis than just looking at their stats if you are getting to see these guys play. But yes you're correct Podlesak, Lukes, McLeod and Sjostrom arent getting it done.

Personally although I admired Lukes battling against the odds, I always thought he might find the pro game harder than life in Toronto. Sjostrom doesnt belong in the E at all (!). Sjostrom and Leneveu have talent.. form is temporary but class will tell. Despite your sarcasm, yes Sjostrom is actually a slow starter and a late bloomer. Podlesak has missed a year and a half of hockey out of his last two years.. judging him now on his first 12 games back is somewhat premature? McLeod I have never seen but I doubt whatever organisation he was in would consider him ECHL material.

Might I ask exactly how did the Coyotes "keep" Todd Simpson from going to Springfield? He was taken by Anaheim in the waiver draft. Blaming Phoenix for not getting Simpson just sounds childish and frankly greedy. You expect former NHL captains on $1.5m+ a year? Hmm.

Seems to me the veterans are letting the team down more than these rookies you name. Where are the highly respected (and expensive, bought-by-Phoenix) Ferraros.. and others? Chris Ferraro, Banham and Jaspers more or less have the same points as Sjostrom, McLeod and Lukes. Well I hope Bryan Helmer comes back soon (also bought-by-Phoenix). Apparently he's good by AHL standards.

Wasnt last season the first time the Falcons reached the playoffs in a few years? Things have already changed mate.

scoob4093
11-24-2003, 03:46 PM
You misread my point on Simpson -Spiller. The point I was trying to make on Simpson was that rather than keep him and send Spiller to Springfield where many think he should be they made the salary dump and kept Spiller. I never expected to get a guy making bucks like Simpson sent here but most thought Spiller should have at least begin the season here but with Simpson dumped he had to stay. As far as making the playoffs last season the team finished 10th in a 14 team Conference. That is not making the playoffs; the AHL runs a completely bogus system whereby 10 teams in each conf. qualify and in theory you could be 6 or 7 games below .500 and still get in. As far as C. Ferraro and Banham's play is concerned you are right on target. Banham is -14 and C.Ferraro -13 and both seem to be playing, as Doug pointed out ,with a total lack of interest. If you had seen this squad on a regular basis over the last 5 season's and the beginning of this one I believe your opinion's would be somewhat different than those that you have posted. You posted "things have changed mate"; Are you quite sure of that statement ? Based on the results so far you would have quite a time of it convincing the ticket buying public here that any changes have been beneficial ones.

Gwyddbwyll
11-24-2003, 11:27 PM
You misread my point on Simpson -Spiller. The point I was trying to make on Simpson was that rather than keep him and send Spiller to Springfield where many think he should be they made the salary dump and kept Spiller. I never expected to get a guy making bucks like Simpson sent here but most thought Spiller should have at least begin the season here but with Simpson dumped he had to stay. As far as making the playoffs last season the team finished 10th in a 14 team Conference. That is not making the playoffs; the AHL runs a completely bogus system whereby 10 teams in each conf. qualify and in theory you could be 6 or 7 games below .500 and still get in. As far as C. Ferraro and Banham's play is concerned you are right on target. Banham is -14 and C.Ferraro -13 and both seem to be playing, as Doug pointed out ,with a total lack of interest. If you had seen this squad on a regular basis over the last 5 season's and the beginning of this one I believe your opinion's would be somewhat different than those that you have posted. You posted "things have changed mate"; Are you quite sure of that statement ? Based on the results so far you would have quite a time of it convincing the ticket buying public here that any changes have been beneficial ones.

OK fair enough I see your point. I didnt understand about Simpson. But then you could argue if the Coyotes didnt make the salary dump, they might not have been able to afford relatively expensive guys (for the AHL) like the Ferraros. ;) I just think if there is to be blame, it should be pointed at the veterans and ultimately at the coaches rather than the rookies.

As for not making the playoffs.. they did make it, regardless of bogus system or not. If the results are just like the last five years then any changes are better than none. Like GoCoyotes posted things wont come easily for either the Yotes or Falcons.

ulf
11-25-2003, 05:14 AM
with the talent we [the yotes poster] imagined was on the farm this year has been very dissappointing.glad to see it's everyone cause this might be an easier fix then one or 2 bad players.

is it the coaching or do our prospects and the yotes and falcon signings just suck.

tough thoughts....what do you think scoob

Guest
11-25-2003, 06:24 AM
with the talent we [the yotes poster] imagined was on the farm this year has been very dissappointing.glad to see it's everyone cause this might be an easier fix then one or 2 bad players.

is it the coaching or do our prospects and the yotes and falcon signings just suck.

tough thoughts....what do you think scoob

I know I'm not Scoob, but I'll respond...

I think our prospects are just too raw, and it might be a sign of the weakened development system the Coyotes inherited from the previous regime. They've had to throw guys into the AHL who probably were better off in Junior, College, or the ECHL at this point. Because of that, we are seeing too much development happen at the AHL level. It's similar to when you see struggling clubs sign a top draft pick and throw him into the NHL with no development. Often times these picks can be wasted as they are thrown into a losing environment into situations they are not prepared for. If they would have rose through the ranks they would have been able to fine tune their game along the way and had the confidence when they reached the NHL.

Habs4Cup
11-25-2003, 08:29 AM
Hi all, first post on the Yotes board...
just saw that JM Pelletier had 3 wins, 6 losses so far this season. Is this reflective of his play??
Do you folks think he's still in the plans of the team or he's just AHL material ?

RealFalconsSupporter
11-25-2003, 09:19 AM
Caution to Stevex and all of you. You may or may not be familiar to the Falcons Fan Forum which in all honesty is not very good when it comes to hockey discussion and you may or may not be familiar with a Tampa Bay supporter ignored by all Falcons fans named Ningfan who takes weekly shots at the Coyotes and the Coyotes prospects. Scoob4093 sounds just like Ningfan?uuuummmmm? Always negative and always negative towards Coyotes or Falcons players or anything the Phoenix organization does or tries to do no matter how well intended. He was a loyal supporter of the Tampa organization and resented Phoenix from the beginning. It's unclear why but I would recommend you put him on your ignore list as he really doesn't know very much about hockey but is an expert at posting negative and exagerated crap on boards without any foundation. This team is struggling right now and many of the prospects are not playing up to their potential but all of them are good players and just need some direction. The jury is still out on Marty as a coach and the veterans on this years team are not carrying the load like many of us thought they would but it's way too early to predict how this season will unfold. This team is in most games and the addition of a couple of players could make the difference between winning and losing close games.

hbk
11-25-2003, 11:03 AM
well in all fairness, we've thrown a slew of young but raw prospects down to the AHL and there is no sugarcoating it, a number of these prospects are underachieving. Expectations were high granted but nobody predicted the lack of scoring by such prospects like Sjostrom (who I beleive is playing well just not scoring goals), McLeod, etc. Things should improve but by then the playoffs may be out of the question which is tough for followers of the Falcons. As a Coyote fan I'm not as concerned with the record of the Falcons (but obviously making the playoffs is important) as I am with the development of our prospects. I'll be more concerned if things don't improve over the next month. I will agree with the post that this isn't fair to Falcon fans who want to see a competitive team. Things haven't panned out as well as hoped.

YoteFalconfan
11-25-2003, 12:31 PM
...testing

scoob4093
11-25-2003, 01:42 PM
with the talent we [the yotes poster] imagined was on the farm this year has been very dissappointing.glad to see it's everyone cause this might be an easier fix then one or 2 bad players.

is it the coaching or do our prospects and the yotes and falcon signings just suck.

tough thoughts....what do you think scoob


Good question and very hard to answer. This will sound like a copout but it may be a combination of all 3. The prospects so far have not lived up to expectations, especially the 4 I have noted. Banham and C. Ferraro look like players who know that they are on their last pro contracts with not much chance of making the show and will likely be pursuing other lines of employment after this season and are more or less going thru the motions.As far as the coaching goes there were rumors going around last season,that have not been completely dispelled that Marty like Don Cherry is to put it mildly not exactly enamored with the European players. Whether Sjostrom falls into this category I don't know but last season 3 Euro players now in the NHL had major rows with McSorley. It's only 18 games in but with Taffe gone things look mighty bleak at the present time for this team.

scoob4093
11-25-2003, 02:10 PM
Caution to Stevex and all of you. You may or may not be familiar to the Falcons Fan Forum which in all honesty is not very good when it comes to hockey discussion and you may or may not be familiar with a Tampa Bay supporter ignored by all Falcons fans named Ningfan who takes weekly shots at the Coyotes and the Coyotes prospects. Scoob4093 sounds just like Ningfan?uuuummmmm? Always negative and always negative towards Coyotes or Falcons players or anything the Phoenix organization does or tries to do no matter how well intended. He was a loyal supporter of the Tampa organization and resented Phoenix from the beginning. It's unclear why but I would recommend you put him on your ignore list as he really doesn't know very much about hockey but is an expert at posting negative and exagerated crap on boards without any foundation. This team is struggling right now and many of the prospects are not playing up to their potential but all of them are good players and just need some direction. The jury is still out on Marty as a coach and the veterans on this years team are not carrying the load like many of us thought they would but it's way too early to predict how this season will unfold. This team is in most games and the addition of a couple of players could make the difference between winning and losing close games.


Aside to RFS: I have no idea what you are talking about. This board and AHL Boards are the only ones I have ever posted on. You stated " all of the prospects are good players and just need some direction". Are there any that are not good players and if they are all good how do you explain this season's W-L record and that of the last 5 seasons ? Having said this I must also point out that it speaks volumes about a poster who makes his first foray onto a board a misinformed personal attack on someone, who as far as I can see, has never posted here.