All-Time Draft #8, Part III

All-Time Draft, Part I (http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=418111)

All-Time Draft, Part II (http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=422263)

The draft will last 24 rounds. You must draft 2 goalies, 6 defensemen, 12 forwards, a coach and 3 extra players.

Trading is allowed. Trades must be equal in numbers, 2 picks for 2 picks, 1 player and a pick for 2 picks, and so on. Really lopsided trades can be vetoed.

The time limit is 9 hours. Dropping by 1 hour for each skipped pick. If you miss 2 picks you become eligible for replacement.

You must PM the next GM after your selection.

GMs with previous skipped picks

vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - 1 skipped pick
Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - 1 skipped pick

GMs with reduced time limits

Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - 7 hours
seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - 7 hours
Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - 8 hours
LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - 6 hours
Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - 8 hours

Any player from any league or era are eligible, but their selection should be based on what they have done, and not what they will do in the future.

Draft Order

Round #1
1 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Bobby Orr
2 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Wayne Gretzky
3 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Gordie Howe
4 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Mario Lemieux
5 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Bobby Hull
6 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Maurice Richard
7 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Eddie Shore
8 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Jean Beliveau
9 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Doug Harvey
10 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Guy Lafleur
11 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Ray Bourque
12 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Mark Messier
13 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Plante
14 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Denis Potvin
15 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Patrick Roy
16 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Phil Esposito
17 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mike Bossy
18 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Red Kelly
19 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Nicklas Lidstrom
20 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Stan Mikita
21 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Terry Sawchuk
22 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dominik Hasek
23 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Howie Morenz
24 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Larry Robinson
25 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Bobby Clarke
26 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Steve Yzerman
27 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Ken Dryden
28 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Jaromir Jagr

Round #2
29 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Martin Brodeur
30 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Ted Lindsay
31 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Glenn Hall
32 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Viacheslav Fetisov
33 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Bryan Trottier
34 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Valery Kharlamov
35 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Scott Stevens
36 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Joe Sakic
37 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Milt Schmidt
38 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bill Durnan
39 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Brad Park
40 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Al MacInnis
41 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Chris Chelios
42 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Paul Coffey
43 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Turk Broda
44 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Tim Horton
45 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Dit Clapper
46 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Johnny Bower
47 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Pierre Pilote
48 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Bernie Geoffrion
49 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Billy Smith
50 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Bernie Parent
51 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Jari Kurri
52 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Earl Seibert
53 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Charlie Conacher
54 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Bill Cook
55 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Brian Leetch
56 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Chris Pronger

Round #3
57 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Scott Niedermayer
58 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Brett Hull
59 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Sprague Cleghorn
60 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Clint Benedict
61 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Frank Mahovlich
62 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Dickie Moore
63 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Henri Richard
64 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Peter Forsberg
65 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Ted Kennedy
66 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Syl Apps Sr.
67 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Max Bentley
68 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Vladislav Tretiak
69 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Bob Gainey
70 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Newsy Lalonde
71 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Joe Malone
72 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - King Clancy
73 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Borge Salming
74 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Andy Bathgate
75 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Marcel Dionne
76 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Frank Brimsek
77 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Gilbert Perreault
78 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Bill Gadsby
79 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Sergei Fedorov
80 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Fred "Cyclone" Taylor
81 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Grant Fuhr
82 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Rod Langway
83 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Jack "Blackjack" Stewart
84 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Aurel Joliat

Round #4
85 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Serge Savard
86 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Elmer Lach
87 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Peter Stastny
88 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Sergei Makarov
89 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Chuck Gardiner
90 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Jiri Holocek
91 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Guy Lapointe
92 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Butch Bouchard
93 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - George Hainsworth
94 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Nels Stewart
95 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Boris Mikhailov
96 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Ed Belfour
97 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Valeri Vasiliev
98 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Dale Hawerchuk
99 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Lionel “Big Train” Conacher
100 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Brendan Shanahan
101 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Johnny Bucyk
102 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Cam Neely
103 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Hector "Toe" Blake
104 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Jacques Laperriere
105 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Mark Howe
106 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ron Francis
107 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bill Quackenbush
108 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Frank Boucher
109 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Marcel Pronovost
110 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Rob Blake
111 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Cecil "Tiny" Thompson
112 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Tony Esposito

Round #5
113 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Busher Jackson
114 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Eric Lindros
115 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Gerry Cheevers
116 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Yvan Cournoyer
117 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Sid Abel
118 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Dave Keon
119 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ken Reardon
120 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Ebenezer "Ebbie" Goodfellow
121 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Doug Gilmour
122 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Guy Carbonneau
123 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Doug Bentley
124 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Alex Delvecchio
125 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Vladimir Konstantinov
126 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - George "Buck" Boucher
127 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Tom Johnson
128 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Adam Oates
129 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Darryl Sittler
130 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Lorne "Gump" Worsley
131 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Cy Denneny
132 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Teemu Selanne
133 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Pavel Bure
134 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Walter "Babe" Pratt
135 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Igor Larionov
136 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Larry Murphy
137 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Alexei Kasatonov
138 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Mike Gartner
139 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Norm Ullman
140 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Pat LaFontaine

Round #6
141 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Luc Robitaille
142 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Roy Conacher
143 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Lanny McDonald
144 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Bill Cowley
145 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Mike Modano
146 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Steve Shutt
147 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Carl Brewer
148 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - J.C. Tremblay
149 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Doug Wilson
150 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Frank Nighbor
151 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Anatoli Firsov
152 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mats Sundin
153 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Fern Flaman
154 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Jean Ratelle
155 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Harry Howell
156 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Leo Boivin
157 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Aleksandr Maltsev
158 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Allan Stanley
159 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Ching Johnson
160 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Vaclav Nedomansky
161 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Harry "Punch" Broadbent
162 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Jere Lehtinen
163 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Sergei Zubov
164 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Art Ross
165 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jarome Iginla
166 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Bill White
167 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Red Horner
168 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Bert Olmstead

Round #7
169 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Clark Gillies
170 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Sylvio Mantha
171 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Albert "Babe" Siebert
172 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Claude Provost
173 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - David "Sweeney" Schriner
174 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bill Barber
175 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Marty Pavelich
176 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Brian Propp
177 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Doug "Diesel" Mohns
178 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Vladimir Petrov
179 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Esa Tikkanen
180 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Michel Goulet
181 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Lemaire
182 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Pat Stapleton
183 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Adam Foote
184 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Alexander Ragulin
185 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Gary Suter
186 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Syd Howe
187 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Joe Primeau
188 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Joe Nieuwendyk
189 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Denis Savard
190 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Rod Brind'Amour
191 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Paul Kariya
192 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Randy Carlyle
193 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Vladimir Krutov
194 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Markus Naslund
195 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Richard Martin
196 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Phil Housley

Round #8
197 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Rod Gilbert
198 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - John Tonelli
199 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Glenn Anderson
200 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Eric Desjardins
201 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Craig Ramsay
202 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Scotty Bowman, coach
203 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dino Ciccarelli
204 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Eddie Gerard
205 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Woody Dumart
206 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Babe Dye
207 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Nikolai Sologubov
208 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Jimmy Thomson
209 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Harry Cameron
210 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Rick Tocchet
211 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Hooley Smith
212 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Butch Goring
213 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Theoren Fleury
214 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - George "The Chief" Armstrong
215 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Bryan Hextall Sr
216 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Art Coulter
217 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Claude Lemieux
218 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Bob Goldham
219 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Brent Sutter
220 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Vsevolod Bobrov
221 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Hap Day
222 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Ed Westfall
223 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Danny Gare
224 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dave Andreychuk

Round #9
225 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Kevin Stevens
226 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Jan Suchy
227 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Hod Stuart
228 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bobby Baun
229 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Tim Kerr
230 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Frantisek Pospisil
231 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Patrik Elias
232 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Joe Hall
233 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Bill Mosienko
234 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Alexander Yakushev
235 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Gus Mortson
236 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Derian Hatcher
237 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Rick Middleton
238 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Doug Jarvis
239 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Irvine "Ace" Bailey
240 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Wayne Cashman
241 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Gary Roberts
242 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels -Pete Mahovlich
243 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Joel Otto
244 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Joe Mullen
245 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Steve Larmer
246 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Don Luce
247 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Herb Gardiner
248 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Ernie "Moose" Johnson
249 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Eddie Giacomin
250 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Brian Sutter
251 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Sidney Crosby
252 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Bobby Smith

Round #10
253 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Terry Harper
254 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Didier Pitre
255 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Elmer 'Moose' Vasko
256 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Mark Recchi
257 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Ken Morrow
258 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Anders Hedberg
259 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Darragh
260 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Flash Hollett
261 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Brad McCrimmon
262 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Wendel Clark
263 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Georges Vezina
264 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Zdeno Chara
265 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Ken Hodge
266 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Bobby Bauer
267 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Ulf Samuelsson
268 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Jean-Guy Talbot
269 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Vladimir Lutchenko
270 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Terrible Ted Green
271 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Kevin Lowe
272 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Chuck Rayner
273 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Bobby Nystrom
274 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Paul Thompson
275 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Reggie Leach
276 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Reed Larson
277 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Joe Thornton
278 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Marty Barry
279 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Cecil Dillon
280 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Mickey MacKay

Round #11
281 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Walker
282 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Bernie Federko
283 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Frank Foyston
284 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Ed Litzenberger
285 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Ott Heller
286 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Alex Connell
287 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bob Pulford
288 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Bob Bourne
289 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Sid Smith
290 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Vincent Damphousse
291 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Buddy O'Connor
292 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Ralph Backstrom
293 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Lemaire, coach
294 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Rob Ramage
295 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Al Iafrate
296 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Rogie Vachon
297 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mike Richter
298 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Daniel Alfredsson
299 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Dick Duff
300 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Terry O'Reilly
301 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Walt Tkaczuk
302 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Vyacheslav Starshinov
303 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Peter Bondra
304 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Harry Lumley
305 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Dale Hunter
306 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Lennart Svedberg
307 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Bun Cook
308 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Mike Peca

Round #12
309 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Barclay Plager
310 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Toe Blake, coach
311 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Jeremy Roenick
312 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - John Leclair
313 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Kirk Muller
314 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Pat Verbeek
315 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Rick MacLeish
316 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Reg Noble
317 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Gordie Drillon
318 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Sergei Gonchar
319 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Dirk Graham
320 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Rick Vaive
321 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Herbie Lewis
322 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Kent Nilsson
323 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Dean Prentice
324 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Alexander Mogilny
325 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Trevor Linden
326 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Dave Taylor
327 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Craig MacTavish
328 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Neil Colville
329 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Craig Ludwig
330 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Mike Ramsey
331 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Phil Watson
332 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Billy Burch
333 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Al Arbour, coach
334 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Jim Schoenfeld
335 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Tom Phillips
336 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Crawford

Round #13
337 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Cy Wentworth
338 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Si Griffis
339 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Tony Leswick
340 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Vic Hadfield
341 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Alf Smith
342 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Ron Ellis
343 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ken Linseman
344 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Mats Naslund
345 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Don Marshall
346 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Brian Bellows
347 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Tommy Ivan, coach
348 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Bobby Holik
349 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Craig Hartsburg
350 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Bobby Rousseau
351 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Neal Broten
352 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Joe Klukay
353 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Keith Tkachuk
354 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Teppo Numminen
355 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bernie Nicholls
356 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Alexander Ovechkin
357 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Barry Beck
358 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Fred Shero, coach
359 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Martin St. Louis
360 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Dany Heatley
361 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Derek Sanderson
362 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Jiri Bubla
363 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Larry Aurie
364 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - John Ferguson

Round #14
365 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Lester Patrick, coach
366 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Lorne Chabot
367 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Owen Nolan
368 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Vincent LeCavalier
369 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Clarence "Taffy" Abel
370 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Steve Smith
371 VanIslander - New York Raiders - J. P. "Jeep" Parise
372 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Dave Poulin
373 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Ken Daneyko
374 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Jimmy Charles Watson
375 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Vitaly Davydov
376 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Punch Imlach, coach
377 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Vladimir Shadrin
378 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Adam Graves
379 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Don Marcotte
380 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Behn Wilson
381 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Stan Smyl
382 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Keith Primeau
383 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Tod Sloan
384 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Nick Metz
385 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Chris Drury
386 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ken Wharram
387 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Duke Keats
388 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Fleming Mackell
389 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Hap Day, coach
390 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Steve Kasper
391 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Cecil Hart, coach
392 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Bob Nevin

Round #15
393 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Dick Irvin Sr., coach
394 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Jiri Holik
395 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Jack Adams, coach
396 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Lionel Hitchman
397 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Odie Cleghorn
398 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Glen Sather, coach
399 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Mike Keenan, coach
400 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Jerry "King Kong" Korab
401 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Lars-Erik Sjoberg
402 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Jacques Demers, coach
403 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Dennis Hull
404 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Reijo Ruotsalainen
405 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Mark Tinordi
406 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Charlie Simmer
407 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Tomas Sandstrom
408 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Kris Draper
409 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Murray Oliver
410 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Johnny Gottselig
411 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Ryan Smyth
412 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Bill Barilko
413 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Yvon Lambert
414 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Badger Bob Johnson, coach
415 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Ivan Tregubov
416 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Steve Duchesne
417 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Stefan Persson
418 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Calle Johansson
419 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Leo Reise Jr.
420 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Graham Drinkwater

Round #16
421 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Cooney Weiland
422 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Edward Ivanov
423 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Mario Tremblay
424 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Pete Green, coach
425 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Ron Greschner
426 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Charlie Huddy
427 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Rene Robert
428 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Red Dutton
429 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Ed Van Impe
430 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Steve "Stumpy" Thomas
431 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Yuri Liapkin
432 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mike Vernon
433 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Wilf Paiement
434 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Petr Svoboda
435 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Troy Murray
436 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Ross Lonsberry
437 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Carol Vadnais
438 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF -
439 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
440 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
441 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
442 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
443 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
444 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
445 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
446 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
447 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
448 VanIslander - New York Raiders

Round #17
449 BM67 - New Jersey Devils
450 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
451 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
452 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
453 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
454 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
455 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
456 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
457 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
458 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
459 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
460 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
461 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
462 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
463 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
464 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
465 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
466 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
467 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
468 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
469 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
470 VanIslander - New York Raiders
471 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
472 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
473 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
474 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
475 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
476 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets

Round #18
477 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
478 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
479 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
480 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
481 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
482 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
483 VanIslander - New York Raiders
484 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
485 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
486 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
487 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
488 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
489 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
490 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
491 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
492 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
493 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
494 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
495 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
496 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
497 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
498 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
499 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
500 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
501 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
502 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
503 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
504 BM67 - New Jersey Devils

Round #19
505 BM67 - New Jersey Devils
506 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
507 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
508 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
509 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
510 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
511 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
512 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
513 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
514 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
515 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
516 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
517 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
518 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
519 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
520 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
521 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
522 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
523 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
524 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
525 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
526 VanIslander - New York Raiders
527 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
528 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
529 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
530 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
531 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
532 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons

Round #20
533 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
534 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
535 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
536 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
537 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
538 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
539 VanIslander - New York Raiders
540 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
541 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
542 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
543 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
544 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
545 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
546 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
547 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
548 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
549 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
550 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
551 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
552 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores
553 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
554 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
555 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
556 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
557 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
558 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
559 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
560 VanIslander - New York Raiders

Round #21
561 BM67 - New Jersey Devils
562 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
563 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
564 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
565 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
566 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
567 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
568 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
569 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
570 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
571 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
572 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
573 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
574 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
575 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
576 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
577 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
578 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
579 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
580 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
581 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
582 BM67 - New Jersey Devils
583 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
584 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
585 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
586 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
587 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
588 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets

Round #22
589 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets
590 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
591 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
592 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
593 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
594 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
595 VanIslander - New York Raiders
596 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
597 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
598 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
599 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
600 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
601 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
602 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
603 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
604 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
605 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
606 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
607 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
608 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
609 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
610 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
611 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
612 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
613 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
614 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
615 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
616 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks

Round #23
617 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
618 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
619 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
620 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
621 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
622 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
623 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
624 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
625 VanIslander - New York Raiders
626 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
627 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
628 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
629 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
630 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
631 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
632 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
633 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
634 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
635 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
636 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
637 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
638 VanIslander - New York Raiders
639 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
640 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
641 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
642 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles
643 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
644 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets

Round #24
645 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
646 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains
647 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
648 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers
649 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks
650 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators
651 VanIslander - New York Raiders
652 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers
653 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons
654 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts
655 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels
656 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs
657 arrbez - Aurora Tigers
658 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways
659 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens
660 murphy - Edmonton Oilers
661 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs
662 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF
663 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars
664 VanIslander - New York Raiders
665 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers
666 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke
667 reckoning - Ottawa 67s
668 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins
669 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers
670 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds
671 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals
672 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks

Trades:

Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals trade picks 55, 114 & 223 to Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators for picks 79, 90 & 191

doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains trade picks 27, 139 & 142 to nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds for picks 54, 59 & 115

BM67 - New Jersey Devils trade picks 1 & 225 to pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers for picks 4 & 165

Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals trade picks 58, 111 & 226 to arrbez - Aurora Tigers for picks 72, 97 & 209

Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins trades Bobby Hull and picks 52, 108 & 388 to pappyline - Guelph Biltmores for picks 9, 48, 104 & 384

shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars trades picks 66, 122, 178 & 215 to cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks for picks 80, 89, 192 & 201

BM67 - New Jersey Devils trade picks 112, 113, 616, 617 & 672 to cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks for picks 178, 248, 257, 304 & 313.

MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke trades picks 51 & 443 to cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks for picks 66 & 369

reckoning - Ottawa 67s trades picks 63 & 287 to MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke for picks 66 & 275

Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels trades picks 74 & 186 to Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals for picks 79 & 170

EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons trades picks 93 & 261 to Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins for picks 104 & 164

Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens trades picks 99, 126 & 182 to pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers for picks 109, 116 & 172

Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators trades picks 114 & 426 to VanIslander - New York Raiders for picks 134 & 302

pappyline - Guelph Biltmores trades picks 121, 625 & 664 to VanIslander - New York Raiders for picks 147, 414 & 427

pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers trades picks 126, 228 & 277 to seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts for picks 150, 187 & 243

The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways trades picks 127, 154 & 266 to EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons for picks 132, 149 & 244

EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons trades picks 154 & 412 to Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens for picks 172 & 267

Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators trades Igor Larionov and picks 247 & 359 to John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers for Bill Cowley and picks 249 & 361

Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins trades picks 173 & 261 to pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers for picks 182 & 243

Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs trades picks 180 & 292 to EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons for picks 188 & 267

MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke trades picks 622 & 667 to reckoning - Ottawa 67s for picks 623 & 666

doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains trades picks 195 & 419 to LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers for picks 204 & 301

BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles trades picks 199 & 255 to MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke for picks 219 & 230

Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels trades picks 207 & 263 to Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators for picks 223 & 249

BM67 - New Jersey Devils trade picks 224, 448 & 560 to VanIslander - New York Raiders for picks 259, 315 & 582

murphy - Edmonton Oilers trades picks 268 & 436 to EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons for picks 300 & 356

Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens trades picks 323 & 350 to pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers for picks 333 & 340

vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets trade picks 364, 477 & 532 to EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons for picks 373, 468 & 524

MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke trades picks 398, 499, 555 & 607 to shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars for picks 402, 495, 551 & 611

vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets trade picks 421 & 645 to pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers for picks 445 & 501

BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles trade picks 423 & 647 to EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons for picks 436 & 597

pappyline - Guelph Biltmores trades Rene Robert and picks 569 & 608 to LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers for picks 469, 525 & 540

Very nice...a fresh thread.

Surprised Talbot slipped this far, or slipped at all, for that matter. Trading up for him was nice move, Eagle. I doubt he'd have lasted much longer.

Biggest dropper of the draft so far: Anders Hedberg - 94 spots

Biggest riser of the draft: Jack Darragh - 266 spots

- both of these titles are looking pretty strong at this point. There are only a few more rounds in which any player even could climb as much as Darragh. Hedberg's 3+ round freefall may face some solid competition, however.

Arrbezz, good job reuniting the Nitro Line

<<Espo was the ultimate slotman. I've never seen anyone so strong and determined in the slot as Espo. He was no speed demon but he sure knew
how to score, even with one or two players draped on his back. Cashman was the mucker and grinder, extremely useful in tight situations. He was tough both with his fists and elbows. Hodge benefited greatly by playing alongside Cash & Espo. He wasn't a bad player but the fit with his linemates was the ultimate reward for him.>>

Eagle, fantastic job reuniting the Kraut Line, looking back, this is something I could have done. Maybe next draft...

Schmidt was the NHL's scoring leader in 1939-40, collecting 52 points, while Dumart and Bauer finished second and third in scoring with 43 points each."There are several reasons why we had success that year," divulges the modest Schmidt. "The three of us roomed together in Brookline, Massachusetts. We had one big room, so that we were always together. After practices, we discussed things that we should work on. After a game, we'd say. 'Well, we did this wrong or did that wrong.' There was no nightlife or anything like that. We were all just children, you might say. I was the youngest of the three," Milt mentions. "We really worked at it and I think that had more to do with the success of our line than anything else. To finish 1-2-3; I don't know of any other line that did that before us and we were quite proud of the fact. Hard work - that was it."

117 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Sid Abel
298 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Daniel Alfredsson
199 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Glenn Anderson
224 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dave Andreychuk
66 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Syl Apps Sr.
333 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Al Arbour, coach
214 GBC & raleh - Halifax RCAF - George "The Chief" Armstrong
363 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Larry Aurie

292 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Ralph Backstrom
239 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Irvine "Ace" Bailey
174 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bill Barber
278 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Marty Barry
74 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Andy Bathgate
228 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bobby Baun
266 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Bobby Bauer
357 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Barry Beck
96 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Ed Belfour
8 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Jean Beliveau
346 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Brian Bellows
60 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Clint Benedict
123 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Doug Bentley
67 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Max Bentley
103 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Hector "Toe" Blake
310 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Toe Blake, coach
110 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Rob Blake
220 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Vsevolod Bobrov
156 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Leo Boivin
303 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Peter Bondra
17 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mike Bossy
92 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Butch Bouchard
108 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Frank Boucher
126 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - George "Buck" Boucher
288 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Bob Bourne
11 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Ray Bourque
202 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Scotty Bowman, coach
46 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Johnny Bower
76 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Frank Brimsek
190 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Rod Brind'Amour
43 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Turk Broda
147 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Carl Brewer
161 Evil Sather & kruezer - NY Rangers - Harry "Punch" Broadbent
29 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Martin Brodeur
362 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Jiri Bubla
101 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Johnny Bucyk
332 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Billy Burch
133 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Pavel Bure















262 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Wendel Clark
209 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Harry Cameron
122 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Guy Carbonneau
192 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Randy Carlyle
240 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Wayne Cashman
264 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Zdeno Chara
115 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Gerry Cheevers
41 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Chris Chelios
203 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dino Ciccarelli
72 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - King Clancy
45 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Dit Clapper
25 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Bobby Clarke
59 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Sprague Cleghorn
42 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Paul Coffey
53 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Charlie Conacher
99 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Lionel “Big Train” Conacher
142 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Roy Conacher
54 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Bill Cook
216 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Art Coulter
116 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Yvan Cournoyer
144 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Bill Cowley
251 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Sidney Crosby

259 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Darragh
221 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Hap Day
124 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Alex Delvecchio
131 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Cy Denneny
200 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Eric Desjardins
75 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Marcel Dionne
27 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Ken Dryden
205 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Woody Dumart
38 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bill Durnan
206 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Babe Dye





231 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Patrik Elias
16 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Phil Esposito
112 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Tony Esposito

79 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Sergei Fedorov
32 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Viacheslav Fetisov
151 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Anatoli Firsov
153 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Fern Flaman
213 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Theoren Fleury
64 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Peter Forsberg
81 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Grant Fuhr
106 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ron Francis



78 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Bill Gadsby
69 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Bob Gainey
89 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Chuck Gardiner
247 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Herb Gardiner
223 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Danny Gare
138 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Mike Gartner
48 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Bernie Geoffrion
204 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Eddie Gerard
249 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Eddie Giacomin
197 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Rod Gilbert
169 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Clark Gillies
121 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Doug Gilmour
218 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Bob Goldham
120 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Ebenezer "Ebbie" Goodfellow
212 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Butch Goring
180 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Michel Goulet
270 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Terrible Ted Green
2 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Wayne Gretzky









93 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - George Hainsworth
31 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Glenn Hall
232 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Joe Hall
9 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Doug Harvey
253 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Terry Harper
22 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Dominik Hasek
236 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Derian Hatcher
98 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Dale Hawerchuk
258 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Anders Hedberg
215 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Bryan Hextall Sr
265 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Ken Hodge
260 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Flash Hollett
90 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Jiri Holocek
167 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Red Horner
44 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Tim Horton
196 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Phil Housley
105 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Mark Howe
3 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Gordie Howe
186 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Syd Howe
155 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Harry Howell
58 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Brett Hull
5 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Bobby Hull








165 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jarome Iginla

113 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Busher Jackson
28 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Jaromir Jagr
238 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Doug Jarvis
159 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Ching Johnson
248 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Ernie "Moose" Johnson
127 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Tom Johnson
84 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Aurel Joliat



191 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Paul Kariya
137 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Alexei Kasatonov
34 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Valery Kharlamov
18 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Red Kelly
65 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Ted Kennedy
229 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Tim Kerr
118 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Dave Keon
125 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Vladimir Konstantinov
193 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Vladimir Krutov
51 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Jari Kurri



86 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Elmer Lach
140 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Pat LaFontaine
10 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Guy Lafleur
70 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Newsy Lalonde
82 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Rod Langway
104 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Jacques Laperriere
91 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Guy Lapointe
135 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Igor Larionov
245 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Steve Larmer
55 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Brian Leetch
162 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Jere Lehtinen
181 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Lemaire
217 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Claude Lemieux
4 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Mario Lemieux
19 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Nicklas Lidstrom
114 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Eric Lindros
30 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Ted Lindsay
271 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Kevin Lowe
246 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Don Luce
269 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Vladimir Lutchenko








40 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Al MacInnis
61 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Frank Mahovlich
242 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels -Pete Mahovlich
88 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Sergei Makarov
157 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Aleksandr Maltsev
170 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Sylvio Mantha
195 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Richard Martin
261 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Brad McCrimmon
143 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Lanny McDonald
12 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Mark Messier
237 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Rick Middleton
20 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Stan Mikita
71 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Joe Malone
95 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Boris Mikhailov
177 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Doug "Diesel" Mohns
145 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Mike Modano
62 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Dickie Moore
23 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Howie Morenz
257 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Ken Morrow
235 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Gus Mortson
233 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Bill Mosienko
244 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Joe Mullen
136 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Larry Murphy







194 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Markus Naslund
160 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Vaclav Nedomansky
102 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Cam Neely
57 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Scott Niedermayer
188 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Joe Nieuwendyk
150 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Frank Nighbor
273 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Bobby Nystrom

128 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Adam Oates
168 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Bert Olmstead
1 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Bobby Orr
243 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Joel Otto


50 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Bernie Parent
39 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Brad Park
175 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Marty Pavelich
77 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Gilbert Perreault
178 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Vladimir Petrov
47 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Pierre Pilote
254 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Didier Pitre
13 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Plante
230 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Frantisek Pospisil
14 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Denis Potvin
134 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Walter "Babe" Pratt
187 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Joe Primeau
56 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Chris Pronger
109 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Marcel Pronovost
176 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Brian Propp
172 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Claude Provost







107 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bill Quackenbush

184 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Alexander Ragulin
201 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Craig Ramsay
154 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Jean Ratelle
272 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Chuck Rayner
119 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ken Reardon
256 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Mark Recchi
63 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Henri Richard
6 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Maurice Richard
241 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Gary Roberts
24 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Larry Robinson
141 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Luc Robitaille
164 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Art Ross
15 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Patrick Roy






36 La pierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Joe Sakic
73 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Borge Salming
267 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Ulf Samuelsson
189 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Denis Savard
85 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Serge Savard
21 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Terry Sawchuk
37 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Milt Schmidt
173 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - David "Sweeney" Schriner
52 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Earl Seibert
132 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Teemu Selanne
100 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Brendan Shanahan
7 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Eddie Shore
146 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Steve Shutt
171 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Albert "Babe" Siebert
129 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Darryl Sittler
211 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Hooley Smith
49 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Billy Smith
252 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Bobby Smith
207 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Nikolai Sologubov
158 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Allan Stanley
182 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Pat Stapleton
87 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Peter Stastny
225 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Kevin Stevens
35 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Scott Stevens
83 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Jack "Blackjack" Stewart
94 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Nels Stewart
227 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Hod Stuart
226 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Jan Suchy
152 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mats Sundin
185 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Gary Suter
219 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Brent Sutter
250 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Brian Sutter


268 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Jean-Guy Talbot
80 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Fred "Cyclone" Taylor
111 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Cecil "Tiny" Thompson
208 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Jimmy Thomson
179 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Esa Tikkanen
210 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Rick Tocchet
198 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - John Tonelli
148 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - J.C. Tremblay
68 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Vladislav Tretiak
33 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Bryan Trottier


139 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Norm Ullman

97 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Valeri Vasiliev
255 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Elmer 'Moose' Vasko
263 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Georges Vezina

222 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Ed Westfall
166 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Bill White
149 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Doug Wilson
130 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Lorne "Gump" Worsley

234 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Alexander Yakushev
26 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Steve Yzerman

163 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Sergei Zubov

274 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Paul Thompson
275 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Reggie Leach
276 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Reed Larson
277 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Joe Thornton


279 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Cecil Dillon
280 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Mickey MacKay

Round #11
281 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Walker
282 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Bernie Federko
283 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Frank Foyston
284 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Ed Litzenberger
285 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Ott Heller
286 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Alex Connell
287 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Bob Pulford

289 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Sid Smith
290 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Vincent Damphousse
291 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Buddy O'Connor

293 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Jacques Lemaire, coach
294 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Rob Ramage
295 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Al Iafrate
296 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Rogie Vachon
297 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Mike Richter

299 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Dick Duff
300 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Terry O'Reilly
301 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Walt Tkaczuk
302 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Vyacheslav Starshinov

304 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Harry Lumley
305 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Dale Hunter
306 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Lennart Svedberg
307 doctordark - Portage la Prairie Plains - Bun Cook
308 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Mike Peca

Round #12
309 vancityluongo & Tricolore#20 - Winnipeg Jets - Barclay Plager

311 BlueBleeder - St. Louis Eagles - Jeremy Roenick
312 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - John Leclair
313 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Kirk Muller
314 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Pat Verbeek
315 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Rick MacLeish
316 LapierreSports - Montreal Wanderers - Reg Noble
317 EagleBelfour - Detroit Falcons - Gordie Drillon
318 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Sergei Gonchar
319 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Dirk Graham
320 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Rick Vaive
321 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Herbie Lewis
322 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Kent Nilsson
323 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Dean Prentice
324 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Alexander Mogilny
325 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Trevor Linden
326 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Dave Taylor
327 shawnmullin - Victoria Cougars - Craig MacTavish
328 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Neil Colville
329 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Craig Ludwig
330 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Mike Ramsey
331 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Phil Watson


334 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Jim Schoenfeld
335 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Tom Phillips
336 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Jack Crawford

Round #13
337 BM67 - New Jersey Devils - Cy Wentworth
338 Nalyd Psycho & Sturminator - Oakland Seals - Si Griffis
339 nik jr & Agent Dale Cooper - Seattle Thunderbirds - Tony Leswick
340 Hockey Outsider - Montreal Canadiens - Vic Hadfield
341 Evil Speaker - Boston Bruins - Alf Smith
342 MXD - Castors de Sherbrooke - Ron Ellis
343 reckoning - Ottawa 67s - Ken Linseman
344 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Mats Naslund
345 pappyline - Guelph Biltmores - Don Marshall

347 God Bless Canada & raleh - Halifax RCAF - Tommy Ivan, coach
348 Frightened Inmate #2 - Calgary RCAF Mustangs - Bobby Holik
349 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Craig Hartsburg
350 pitseleh - Nanaimo Clippers - Bobby Rousseau
351 The_Hockey_Guy18 - Dartmouth Subways - Neal Broten
352 arrbez - Aurora Tigers - Joe Klukay
353 Leaf Lander - Toronto Maple Leafs - Keith Tkachuk
354 Wisent - Dubai Mighty Camels - Teppo Numminen
355 seventieslord - Regina Wildhearts - Bernie Nicholls
356 murphy - Edmonton Oilers - Alexander Ovechkin

358 VanIslander - New York Raiders - Fred Shero, coach
359 John Flyers Fan & Roger's Pancreas - Flin Flon Bombers - Martin St. Louis
360 cottonking - Dallas Blackhawks - Dany Heatley
361 Rick Middleton - Gwinnett Gladiators - Derek Sanderson





Last pick entered

273 Evil Sather & kruezer - New York Rangers - Bobby Nystrom


People have to stop missing your picks

check the draft when u wake up
at lunch
at dinner and 2 times b4 u go to bed

it takes just 2 minutes to see if your up.

and when you know you cant make it send a list of 2 players to someone like bm67 myself gbc vanislander or whoever you trust!

Even though his time limit has expired, Elvi is on-line now, so I'm going to wait about 15 minutes to announce my pick. I have mullin's pick, too.

The Calgary RCAF Mustangs select Vladimir Lutchenko

Very, very tough decision with this pick. But raleh's really sold on this guy, and you can never have enough tough, aggressive, rugged defensive defencemen. Halifax RCAF is pleased to select a blue-liner who won a Stanley Cup with the Boston Bruins in the early 1970s. He was one of the first prominent players to jump to the WHA, where he added more championship hardware:

D Ted Green

And I have mullin's pick. The Victoria Cougars are pleased to select the prototypical reliable, steady defenceman: Kevin Lowe.

Very, very tough decision with this pick. But raleh's really sold on this guy, and you can never have enough tough, aggressive, rugged defensive defencemen. Halifax RCAF is pleased to select a blue-liner who won a Stanley Cup with the Boston Bruins in the early 1970s. He was one of the first prominent players to jump to the WHA, where he added more championship hardware:

D Ted Green


Terrible Ted !

Coming off of his best season in 1969 (for which he was named to the Second All-Star Team), Green was involved in an infamous incident in an exhibition game in Ottawa versus the St. Louis Blues on September 21, 1969, engaging in a bloody stick fight with Blues' forward Wayne Maki. Green was struck in the head, suffering a fractured skull and brain damage, and missing the remainder of the 1970 season, during which Boston won the Stanley Cup.Green was left paralyzed and close to death with no expectations of ever resuming his career on ice.Though Green did not officially win the Cup, his teammates gave him his share of the prize money.

5 straight defensemen going...yipes

5 straight defensemen going...yipes
Teams are definitely loading up on defencemen in this draft. We already have our top four. There were quite a few forwards we were looking at with this pick, but we decided to finish our top four.

Green, like Gus Mortson, is a nice asset to have. He can gobble up those top four minutes. We can play the two of them together for a rock-solid tandem, or we can split them up. Versatility is a big factor for our defence. All four of our defencemen can play on a shut-down unit or anchor a penalty kill unit, and Green's the only one who wouldn't be able to run a power play unit.

5 straight defensemen going...yipes

Yup, no one wants a shaky defence corps to be their downfall. You can get away with a less than stellar 4th line but not a poor 3rd defensive unit.

And I have mullin's pick. The Victoria Cougars are pleased to select the prototypical reliable, steady defenceman: Kevin Lowe.

Mullins lucky I traded away my pick, Lowe was going to be mine!

I'm needing a 4th defenseman and with Green being selected, my list is toast!

Yup, no one wants a shaky defence corps to be their downfall. You can get away with a less than stellar 4th line but not a poor 3rd defensive unit.

I think most teams are still trying to complete their top four, or have just done so. Third pairing defensemen get limited icetime and so are lower-order priorities (imo) than second line forwards, but that #4 guy is going to be out there a lot and I think most GMs realize that any perceived weakness in the top 4 can be costly. Obviously Nalyd and I considered the second pairing important, as we were the second team to complete our top 4 (I think), just one pick behind Leaf Lander.

I'm getting all antsy in my pantsy to make these next two picks, like I was before we took Clancy and Bathgate. This seems to happen before I think I'm going to get a steal. Not saying who, other than that it is definitely not Wayne Gretzky, player-coach.

Wayne Gretzky, player-coach.What's the rule on player-coaches? Would I have to pick Reg Dunlop as a skater and then pick him again later as a coach? Or can I just say, "He's my coach too," and then have 4 extra players at the end of the draft instead of 3?

You have to use two picks to use a player as a skater and a coach.

And I have mullin's pick. The Victoria Cougars are pleased to select the prototypical reliable, steady defenceman: Kevin Lowe.

Greatpick with Lowe. Honestly I traded up to get either Talbot or Lowe and I found these two defenseman very much alike.

You have to use two picks to use a player as a skater and a coach.I'd be interested to see where a good/great player/coach combo would be taken if you could double up.

I'd be interested to see where a good/great player/coach combo would be taken if you could double up.

Blake would go in the 50-60 range, Lemaire maybe top-100

Blake would go in the 50-60 range, Lemaire maybe top-100Larry Robinson was 2 for 2 at putting the Devils in the Cup finals as a coach. Does that make him a top 10 player hypothetically?

Larry Robinson was 2 for 2 at putting the Devils in the Cup finals as a coach. Does that make him a top 10 player hypothetically?

Ne never been taken as a coach, so it wouldn't change his stock IMO.

And I have mullin's pick. The Victoria Cougars are pleased to select the prototypical reliable, steady defenceman: Kevin Lowe.

There goes the guy I wanted to pair with Zubov.

Boom Boom Geoffrion would actually see his stock go DOWN with this rule (unless we can just rule out Boom Boom's career as a coach)

When I saw Wisent picked Giacomin as his back up goalie, It made me nervous so I will pick my starter now.

Guelph selects Chuck Rayner

The New York Rangers are proud (and a bit nauseated) to select the "quintessential money player", owner of 4 playoff overtime game winning goals (second all-time) including the 1980 Cup clinching goal, a physical, fluid skating skating banger who could fight, defend, and score some too,

RW Bobby Nystrom.

Ottawa selects:

#274 Paul Thompson
#275 Reggie Leach

Ottawa selects:

#275 Reggie Leach

:cry:

Ottawa selects:

#274 Paul Thompson


:rant:

:cry:
:rant:

= Nice selections Reck

I was going to use one of those picks on a defenceman, but I wanted to complete my top line. Looks like it was the right decision if you guys had your sights on those two wingers.

D Reed Larson

Thanks for the kind words on Lowe. I'm a huge fan of the guy. He's who I based myself on as a player... wanted to be just like him. To make the smart, safe decisions and take care of your zone... but also help spur the forward with a good transition game. Not flashy but who doesn't need a Kevin Lowe on their team?

Always hesitant to take him 'cause I assumed I'd overrate him.

Thanks for the kind words on Lowe. I'm a huge fan of the guy. He's who I based myself on as a player... wanted to be just like him. To make the smart, safe decisions and take care of your zone... but also help spur the forward with a good transition game. Not flashy but who doesn't need a Kevin Lowe on their team?

Always hesitant to take him 'cause I assumed I'd overrate him.
Actually, you picked him later than he usually goes. Nothing wrong with picking your favorites, I do it myself. I wouldn't consider him at all at this point but several others would.

Actually, you picked him later than he usually goes. Nothing wrong with picking your favorites, I do it myself. I wouldn't consider him at all at this point but several others would.

We're kind of in a zone now in the draft where it's hard to point to right or wrong decisions. Do they suit your team or not is pretty much the only qualification.

Thanks for the kind words on Lowe. I'm a huge fan of the guy. He's who I based myself on as a player... wanted to be just like him. To make the smart, safe decisions and take care of your zone... but also help spur the forward with a good transition game. Not flashy but who doesn't need a Kevin Lowe on their team?

Always hesitant to take him 'cause I assumed I'd overrate him.

Bah, terrible GM, but would've been perfect with Housley.

Ottawa selects:

#274 Paul Thompson

Hate, vitriol, hate!

We're kind of in a zone now in the draft where it's hard to point to right or wrong decisions. Do they suit your team or not is pretty much the only qualification.

I disagree with that. In the tenth round or later, it is hard to identify truly bad picks without looking at the overall scheme, but didn't a bunch of the GMs just rip on Sidney Crosby?

As far as good picks go, there are still a few guys out there whose achievements dwarf their potential draft status as of now - ie. there are still players available who definitely should have already been drafted (based on demonstrable evidence) and can be called steals when taken at any point from here forward.

Paul Thompson was a very solid choice. Andy Bathgate would probably hit him with a stick for his coaching career in New York (I'm not worried about mentioning undrafteds here...Thompson as a coach was an almost hilariously overbearing tyrant and never won anything), but I'd still have liked to have Paul Thompson the player in Oakland.

As far as good picks go, there are still a few guys out there whose achievements dwarf their potential draft status as of now - ie. there are still players available who definitely should have already been drafted (based on demonstrable evidence) and can be called steals when taken at any point from here forward.
we are at the point that there are players who weren't drafted over 24 rounds of atd7 who are MORE WORTHY than some already drafted in this draft

that's why i always think rounds 10-16 are a third b.s. ... i just don't buy the judgement of several picks per round

after rounds 8-9 it's just a crap shoot... or so it seems ;)

we are at the point that there are players who weren't drafted over 24 rounds of atd7 who are MORE WORTHY than some already drafted in this draft

that's why i always think rounds 10-16 are a third b.s. ... i just don't buy the judgement of several picks per round

after rounds 8-9 it's just a crap shoot... or so it seems ;)

That downside of that is that it's really easy to make a mistake as, to make a good pick, it's all about your research. There are some players not even drafted in the last minor league draft that are better than some players I drafted last time...

(finally!)

seattle takes 1 of the best offensive players of the 30s, and a great playoff performer who led his team to back to back cups:

marty barry.



nalyd, you are up.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO O!

Give me a minute...

Nows your chance at Steve Buzinski!

Bah, terrible GM, but would've been perfect with Housley.

Terrible GM eh. It's go time!

Expletive, I was so certain that Barry was ours that, arrggghhhh!

I have three plans, weighing them out now...

For those waiting on me, BM67 won't be up for a while. I'm gonna wait an hour for Sturminator to reply to my messages, if nothing, then I have a plan that fits nicely in the Seal's game plan. But, isn't, you know, THE PLAN...

This draft has just been one big kick in the junk. The Moose Johnson pick by BM hurt me the most. My top 3 defenders were set in my mind. I thought for sure they would be Harvey, Johnson and Siebert...think again. This draft has easily been the most unpredictable I have seen.

i was trying to trade up a few spots, because i saw that several teams in front of us needed C's. we got lucky that barry wasn't picked.

i wanted moose johnson, too. his HHOF bio says he was a perennial all star, and when BM67 posted some retroactive award winners from ultimate hockey and trail of the stanley cup that had johnson winning a lot of hardware, i marked him down.

say, Evil Speaker, do you know how ultimate hockey got its info about players and decided who was the best, etc?

After much consideration, the Oakland Seals are proud to select a versitile Right Winger with a retroactive Conn Smythe, a 1st team all-star nod, 2 2nd team all-star nods and one of the best American born players ever.

RW Cecil Dillon

Overall goal scoring from 1931 through 1940:
#1 Busher Jackson (113 overall) 168 goals
#2 Charlie Conacher (53rd overall) 167 goals
#3 Nels Stewart (94th overall) 162 goals
#4 Cecil Dillon (279th overall) 160 goals

http://www.hhof.com/html/newsconn.shtml
Winger from the checking line was the dominant player in the playoffs. He had goals in his first five playoff games including the winner in the opener of the finals against Toronto, then picked up the first goal in a 3-2 loss to the Leafs and was selected one of the games stars in a 1-0 overtime winner for his work in holding the Primeau-Conacher-Jackson line to no goals in the final.

Another kick in the junk...Thanks Nalyd

Another kick in the junk...Thanks Nalyd
Not possible, I'm still in a ball on the floor after getting kicked there.

say, Evil Speaker, do you know how ultimate hockey got its info about players and decided who was the best, etc?

Somwhere in there I think they said Jesus Christ :dunno:...but seriously, there were 3 authors of the book, Glenn Weir, Jeff Chapman, and Travis Weir. In ther 'acknowledgments' page there are alot of names mentioned from around the hockey world. Hockey historians, statisticians and veteran hockey fans. I'm not exactly sure how they decided on the retroactive trophy winners and such, but it was likely from a vast team effort. Maybe BM67 can better answer your question..

Somwhere in there I think they said Jesus Christ :dunno:...but seriously, there were 3 authors of the book, Glenn Weir, Jeff Chapman, and Travis Weir. In their 'acknowledgments' page there are alot of names mentioned from around the hockey world. Hockey historians, statisticians and veteran hockey fans. I'm not exactly sure how they decided on the retroactive trophy winners and such, but it was likely from a vast team effort. Maybe BM67 can better answer your question..

ok, thank you.

I can tell you that they likely did not use arbitrary statistical rating systems like pnep and Ogopogo use. They do research like most of the rest of us, by using relative statistics, all-star selections, award voting, video tapes and other 'reliable' historical documents.

The Regina Wildhearts are proud to select Hart and Art Ross winner, and all-around elite franchise center, Joe Thornton.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to add a strong two-way player in a forgotten legend, a 10 time all-star in the PCHA, WCHL/WHL, "The Wee Scot"

Duncan "Mickey" MacKay (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?mem=p195205&type=Player&page=bio&list=ByName#photo)

A marvelous skater and goal scorer, Duncan "Mickey" MacKay was blessed with instinct and timing on the ice that was matched by few contemporaries. A star rover and center in a number of leagues during his career, he was particularly successful in the Pacific Coast Hockey Association, where his offensive heroics made him one of the Vancouver Millionaires' most popular stars.

In 1914 McKay was signed by the Vancouver Millionaires of the PCHA and he quickly embarked on the most fruitful period of his hockey career. MacKay dazzled the West Coast fans with a three-goal effort in his first league game on December 8, 1914, playing on a line with Frank Nighbor and Ken Mallen. His 33 goals in 17 games as a rookie exceeded all other rivals. During the Stanley Cup victory over Ottawa, MacKay continued to impress with four goals in the three-game series that his team dominated.

The scoring exploits of MacKay didn't abate during the coming years. He was sensational during Vancouver's heartbreaking loss to the Toronto Arenas in the 1918 Stanley Cup series, scoring five goals in as many games playing as a rover and right wing. - HHoF Bio

Born Duncan McMillan MacKay in Chesley Ontario, in 1894, by the time "Mickey" MacKay's playing days were over, he would be the all-time leading scorer in the Pacific Coast Hockey Association and would have been a member of two Stanley Cup winning teams.

Nicknamed "The Wee Scot", Mickey MacKay was just five-foot, nine inches tall and tipped the scales a 162 pounds. A gentleman on and off the ice, MacKay was a terror to opposing players and goaltenders with his speed, stick-handling abilities and his quick, accurate shot. - BC Hockey Hall of Fame (http://www.bchhf.com/Inductees/mackay.htm)

Hart: PCHA: 1915, 1923; Selke: PCHA: 1921, 1922, 1923; Art Ross: PCHA: 1915, 1924; WCHL: 1925

The Twenties
Best Stickhandler
Mickey MacKay was a master at handling the wood and rubber. Some say that MacKay was the single largest hockey influence on Fank Nighbor. The "wee Scot" was also a fabously frustrating poke-checker.

Duncan "Mickey" MacKay dazzled west coast audiences with his trademark blazing speed and unparalleled agility. One of the greatest rovers/centers of his time, history hasn't immortalized "The Wee Scot" quite like it has the man he was most often compared to - Cyclone TaylorWhen discussing the best stick-handlers of all-time, many names spring to mind - Mario Lemieux, Denis Savard, Jean Beliveau, Gilbert Perreault. But don't forget Mickey MacKay. Duncan McMillan "Mickey" MacKay was an expert handler of the disc during his 16 year career. He still tops the PCHA's all-time scoring list with 290 points in 247 games. And although he rivaled the great Cyclone Taylor as the best in the West, MacKay has drifted into obscurity.

An offensive genius, Mackay was a clean and gentlemanly player and a fine defensive forward, who was often asked to play rover so he could poke check to frustration. - Ultimate Hockey

He was the most polished stickhandler who ever played in the P.C.H.A. He led the goal scorers three times and is one of the select company who scored over two hundred goals in his career. He was a very unselfish player and set up many goals for others to score.

In the 1918 Cup finals at Toronto, the critics rated him as a better player than his teammate Fred Taylor. He was a very popular player with fans and enthusiasm ran high when he stepped on the ice in important games.

A very clean player, he was a phenomenal stickhandler and was idolized in the west. Modest and unassuming he had no hesitation in setting up other players for goals that he might have scored himself. In many ways he was like Frank Nighbor. - The Trail of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1

"MacKay was perhaps the greatest center we ever had on the coast." - Frank Patrick

"MacKay was a great crowd pleaser. He was clean, splendidly courageous, a happy player with a stylish way of going. He was sensational in making quick breakaways. He was a sure shot alone with the goalie. He could handle his stick and was almost as good a hook-check as Frank Nighbor. MacKay was one of those who helped make pro hockey a great game. He was outstanding in every way." - Lester Patrick

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to select the man credited with introducing the hook check to hockey

Jack Walker (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?type=Player&mem=P196003&list=ByName#photo)

He turned pro at the start of the 1912-13 season with the Toronto Blueshirts of the NHA but jumped ship after one game and traveled East to finish out the season with the Moncton Victorias of the Maritime Pro Hockey League. He was back in Toronto the following season and led the league with 16 assists in 20 games as the Blueshirts captured the Stanley Cup, the first of three in Walker's career.

He went West after completing the 1914-15 season with Toronto and hooked up with the Seattle Metropolitans of the PCHA, playing with the Mets for nine years, from 1915 to 1924. During that time he was noted as being an outstanding defensive forward and his play won him selections to the PCHA First All-Star Team in 1921, 1922, and 1924, to go with previous Second Team honours he received in 1917, 1919, and 1920. He played on his second Stanley Cup champion team while with Seattle in 1916-17 as the Mets became the first United States based team to win the Cup.

In 1924-25, Seattle dropped out of the PCHA, leaving the league with franchises in Vancouver and Victoria. These two clubs joined the Western Canada Hockey League and Walker signed with the Victoria Cougars on November 10, 1924. He led the league in penalty minutes with the modest total of 14, in 28 games played that season. More importantly, however, the Cougars went on to win the Stanley Cup when they defeated the Montreal Canadiens three games to one in the spring of 1925. The Cougars were the last non-NHL team to win the Cup. Walker had now won the Stanley Cup three times with three different teams in three different leagues. - HHoF Bio

1924-25 Jack Walker - Victoria
Led Victoria shooters with four goals and five points in the final. Had the game-winning goal in game one and two goals in game two. Had the first goal in each of the first two games and four unassisted tallies. He also had goals in each of the four league playoff games to reach the finals. Great sweep-check also limited the Canadiens scoring chances. - Would-be Conn Smythe (http://www.hhof.com/html/newsconn.shtml)

Selke: NHA: 1914; PCHA: 1916, 1917, 1918, 1920, 1924; WCHL: 1925

The Tens
Best Defensive Forward
Jack Walker was for many years the best defensive forward in the Pacific Coast Hockey Association, perhaps in all of hockey.
Best Shadow
Jack Walker shut down many a top gun with his jabbing poke-checks and sweeping hooks. Lalonde, Pitre, Morenz, Joliat... the "Old Fox" had their numbers.

Walker joined the Victoria Cougars for 1924-25 and figured in yet another Cup win, scoring four goals and two assists in four contests against the Montreal Canadiens. In that series, he shut down superstar Howie Morenz.

During his playing days and later as a coach, Walker spent hours helping the rookies, teaching them the art of the hook-check. Walker was as good at poke-checking as Frank Nighbor was. - Ultimate Hockey

This fine player is best remembered for his uncanny skill as a hook check artist and in this respect he was rival of Frank Nighbor.

In the Stanley Cup series that followed with Canadiens, the famed line of Morenz, Joliat and Boucher found Walker and his hookcheck the stumbling block. The veteran broke up their attacks time after time and scored four goals in the series and the Cougars won the Cup.

This small clean-playing but aggressive player was on seven championship teams, in as many Cup series and three Stanley Cup winners. - The Trail of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1

I dunno if Nalyd has PMed anyone a list, but please hold off on picking for the Seals if he has. We'll get things sorted out quickly (this won't be a nine hour ordeal, I promise), but we need just a moment. Thanks.

Great to see Barry and Dillon finally picked right about where they belong. Two excellent offensive forwards who are perfect for second line duty.

We all know about Barry. Outstanding offensive centre. Maybe the best one still available. Dillon is very underrated - one of the best players not in the HHOF, IMO.

Very surprising to see Thornton picked this late. Again, I think it's where he belongs (and he should be behind Marty Barry).

BTW, I should be around pretty much all weekend for anyone heading out of town/with family commitments who needs to PM a list to me.

I apologize for the delay, but we were not counting on Marty Barry disappearing one pick before us in the 10th. Oh well. Luckily, there was another high-end offensive center still out there who I almost didn't notice because he's already slipped so far...

The Oakland Seals are very pleased to select probably the last guy to be picked who has a statue erected in his honor, a hall of famer who knows what it means to play in Wayne Gretzky's shadow and the consensus third greatest hockey-playing Bernie of all time, centerman Bernie "The Magician" Federko.

Gretzky and Federko give the Seals the greatest 1-2 punch of playmaking, behind-the-net-camping Ukranian-descended centermen in the history of history. My grandmother would be so proud of me right now. Not really sure how Federko slipped this far, but like I said, I nearly overlooked him, myself, whilst preparing a letterbomb for nik jr. and agent dale. Ah well, securing a second line center of Bernie's talents takes away the sting of the previous blow to the Seals' collective testicles.

Federko's scoring achievements (five times in the top-10 in points, seven times top-10 in assists) are all the more impressive when one considers how dreadful his Blues were for many of the seasons in which he played in St. Louis. Had he played in any other time, Federko might have a legitimate claim to being the greatest playmaker of his era. The only consistent offensive "help" Federko had in his career was Brian Sutter, and he's really more of a 3rd liner in this format. The concept of a second line in St. Louis for much of the 80's was laughable considering that the franchise didn't even have a farm system for a couple of years. For the record, in addition to his scoring feats among the NHL leaders, Federko led the Blues in scoring nine times, eight of them consecutively, and almost every one of them by a wide margin.

Also worth noting is Federko's playoff record. Although he obviously never won a Cup, Bernie's 101 points in 91 career playoff games is bloody impressive, especially considering the underdog status of many of those Blues teams. He led the team in playoff scoring six times and basically carried the Blues on his back on several occasions. He even led the NHL in playoff scoring in 1986 (tied with teammate Doug Gilmour) despite the fact that the Blues were eliminated in the semi-finals.

I am very pleased to welcome Bernie Federko to Oakland.

nik jr sent me a list. It pains me to say this, but he selects F Frank Foyston. He actually took the players I had hoped to nab with my next two picks.

I'll have my pick in a few minutes. I need to make a decision.

Good pace so far today.

pappy may hate me for this, but the Clippers are proud to select RW Ed Litzenberger.

A big and tall winger, Litzenberger had the unfortunate circumstance of playing his peak during an era with the stiffest RW competition likely in history (Howe, Richard, Geoffrion, and Bathgate all were post season All-Stars during his prime). He was a top-10 goal scorer 4 times, including 3 top-5 finishes and fits in nicely on our second line.

pappy may hate me for this, but the Clippers are proud to select RW Ed Litzenberger.

A big and tall winger, Litzenberger had the unfortunate circumstance in playing his peak during an era with the stiffest RW competition likely in history (Howe, Richard, Geoffrion, and Bathgate all were post season All-Stars during his prime). He was a top-10 goal scorer 4 times, including 3 top-5 finishes and fits in nicely on our second line.

I had the feeling he would be gone for my pick, would have been a good fit on my 2nd line -- and Anderson would not have been out of place on my 3rd either.

I had the feeling he would be gone for my pick, would have been a good fit on my 2nd line -- and Anderson would not have been out of place on my 3rd either.Word for word, my sentiments exactly.

Great to see Barry and Dillon finally picked right about where they belong. Two excellent offensive forwards who are perfect for second line duty.

We all know about Barry. Outstanding offensive centre. Maybe the best one still available. Dillon is very underrated - one of the best players not in the HHOF, IMO.

Very surprising to see Thornton picked this late. Again, I think it's where he belongs (and he should be behind Marty Barry).

BTW, I should be around pretty much all weekend for anyone heading out of town/with family commitments who needs to PM a list to me.

Looks like we're having a little run on 2nd line-types eligible at center.

By talent, Joe Thornton probably belongs where he went in ATD#7, but he just hasn't had that long of a peak yet. Really only three dominant seasons so far. Considering he's only 28, I've no doubt that by the end of his career Big Joe will be a justifiable 6th - 8th rounder (or higher, if he can beat Crosby, et al out for some more hardware), but right now he's not. I wouldn't take him over Marty Barry and I wouldn't have taken him over Federko, either.

Cecil Dillon is a guy that's hard not to like. Great goalscorer and a guy who won a Conn-Smythe as a third liner in a checking role; he can pretty much do it all. Playing on a line with Kariya and Federko should make the most of his goal-scoring abilities, and like Syd Howe on the Gretzky line, he gives Oakland's 2nd line a solid defensive conscience.

Anyone who was counting on the really underrated players dropping this time around has got to be hurting.

Looks like we're having a little run on 2nd line-types eligible at center.

By talent, Joe Thornton probably belongs where he went in ATD#7, but he just hasn't had that long of a peak yet. Really only three dominant seasons so far. Considering he's only 28, I've no doubt that by the end of his career Big Joe will be a justifiable 6th - 8th rounder (or higher, if he can beat Crosby, et al out for some more hardware), but right now he's not. I wouldn't take him over Marty Barry and I wouldn't have taken him over Federko, either.



He would also need to be barely average in playoffs to reach 6th or 8th round.

pappy may hate me for this, but the Clippers are proud to select RW Ed Litzenberger.

A big and tall winger, Litzenberger had the unfortunate circumstance of playing his peak during an era with the stiffest RW competition likely in history (Howe, Richard, Geoffrion, and Bathgate all were post season All-Stars during his prime). He was a top-10 goal scorer 4 times, including 3 top-5 finishes and fits in nicely on our second line.

:rant: My all time fav player. I took a gamble and lost. He was my next pick at #289. At least he is being appreciated by others. I will know to pick him earlier next draft. Note the change in avatar.:madfire::madfire:

He would also need to be barely average in playoffs to reach 6th or 8th round.

As a Sharks fan (though perhaps not as an ATD GM), I feel the need to defend Thornton's playoff record. With the exception of his broken-rib goose egg in 2004 with the Bruins, Joe's playoff performances have been allright. By "allright" I mean that he has shown up and played acceptably well, though I don't think we've seen him elevate his game and carry a team yet. Thornton hasn't exactly been a playoff menace thus far in his career, but I think he gets a bum rap from a lot of Bruins fans who could never deal with the fact that he's not Cam Neely.

As a Sharks fan (though perhaps not as an ATD GM), I feel the need to defend Thornton's playoff record. With the exception of his broken-rib goose egg in 2004 with the Bruins, Joe's playoff performances have been allright. By "allright" I mean that he has shown up and played acceptably well, though I don't think we've seen him elevate his game and carry a team yet. Thornton hasn't exactly been a playoff menace thus far in his career, but I think he gets a bum rap from a lot of Bruins fans who could never deal with the fact that he's not Cam Neely.

As an Hab fan, I was pretty happy with Big Joe's performance the last time they faced the Bruins, actually.
He will continue to play, and get some solid seasons... Even if he never amounts to anything good in the playoffs, he could be drafted on the basis of his reg. seasons performance alone, because he is that talented. But so far, his peak is short, his career is short... Worth of a 2nd C spot in the lineup probably at this point, who's gonna need help from a solid 1st line (or at least extremely solid 1st C) playoff-wise.

As an Hab fan, I was pretty happy with Big Joe's performance the last time they faced the Bruins, actually.
He will continue to play, and get some solid seasons... Even if he never amounts to anything good in the playoffs, he could be drafted on the basis of his reg. seasons performance alone, because he is that talented. But so far, his peak is short, his career is short... Worth of a 2nd C spot in the lineup probably at this point, who's gonna need help from a solid 1st line (or at least extremely solid 1st C) playoff-wise.
Well, Joe was injured that year. And while most players are playing with pain by the time the playoffs roll around, Joe was battling a serious injury that would have sidelined him for six weeks if it had happened in November.

But Thornton's post-season record is underwhelming. For a player of his calibre, he should be better. He hasn't been bad the last couple years, but when the Sharks needed him to elevate his game in the post-season (the truest mark of greatness), especially when a certain teammate's game went south in the second round the last two years, Thornton did not.

Well, Joe was injured that year.

He wasn't injured both years, neither he was when his team faced the Devils in between.

Wow...because I like to know a lot of details about the careers of the guys I pick, I've been looking over the rosters of those 80's Blues teams for which Federko carried the banner. It's almost disturbing how bad they were, much like Bathgate's Rangers. We could put those two together and call it the "Lonely Hearts Club Line".

I've got a fun game: Let's Name the Blues' Second-Leading Scorer!

Here's how it works...we pick a peak year Federko was in St. Louis (except for 86-87..stupid Doug Gilmour) and I name the Blues' leading scorer and how many points he put up, then you name the Blues' second-leading scorer and how many points he scored. It's hours of fun for the whole family! Or...I could just do it myself. It is perhaps a bizarre tactic to illustrate how good a player is by ripping on his team, but the incompetence of those Blues teams is really quite striking - so striking, in fact, that aside from Sutter, Mullen and Gilmour (already-drafted players who will show up on the list) I have no fear of listing the Blues' second-leading scorers during the Federko era because no GM would be crazy enough to even consider drafting these guys. Here goes:

NHL Season|Federko's Point Total|Second-Leading Player|That Guy's Point Total
78-79|95|Brian Sutter|80
79-80|94|Mike Zuke|64
80-81|104|Wayne Babych|96
81-82|92|Blake Dunlop|78
82-83|84|Brian Sutter|76
83-84|107|Joe Mullen|85
84-85|103|Joe Mullen|92
85-86|102|Mark Hunter|74
87-88|89|Doug Gilmour|86

My apologies in advance to anyone who was planning on drafting Mike Zuke, Wayne Babych, Blake Dunlop or Mark Hunter. Were any of these guys even taken in the minor-league draft last time around? If so, I doubt they were deserving. A final note which I believe will help to put things in perspective: the infamous Robert Nordmark actually got his start on the Blues in 1987 and played regular shifts on the second pairing - this after St. Louis had allegedly "improved" (Gilmour, at least, was beginning to hit his stride).

My apologies in advance to anyone who was planning on drafting Mike Zuke, Wayne Babych, Blake Dunlop or Mark Hunter. Were any of these guys even taken in the minor-league draft last time around?

I wouldn't be surprised if Mark Hunter would be drafted in an MLD, but picking him could be a reach. Tough, but there were some better 4th liners available.

Good pace so far today.

Gah, thanks for cursing it. :sarcasm:

nik jr sent me a list. It pains me to say this, but he selects F Frank Foyston. He actually took the players I had hoped to nab with my next two picks.

I'll have my pick in a few minutes. I need to make a decision.

thanks, pitseleh, and sorry, again. :biglaugh: (just kidding.)
but you know we could throw foyston into that previous trade proposal for orr.....

but to be serious, sorry for taking so many players you wanted. i know it sucks.

foyston and barry i thought were maybe the 2 best offensive players left.
foyston might be better than barry, but i figured barry would be picked 1st, because he was an NHLer, while foyston played mostly in the PCHA.

a dazzling offensive player nicknamed "the flash," foyston could play any forward position, was a perennial all star, won 2 goal scoring titles, won several stanley cups and played for our city of seattle, so he should feel right at home.

I'm 15 picks away and I'll be gone for about 8 hours. I trust this will be OK?

should be.

The Boston Bruins select, in our opinion, one of the most underrated defensemen ever. He was one of the biggest, strongest and fastest defenseman of his era. He is also arguably the best all-around right handed defenseman remaining.Who? D Ott Heller.


Ott Heller was the pillar of the Rangers defense corps for 15 years. He was a big strapping German lad, who skated with the speed of a Greyhound and the stregth of a Clydesdale. In the 1933 playoffs his Rangers won the whole ball of wax. Heller, who scored three times in the post season, was lauded by coach Lester Patrick as 'the perfect hockey player'. Heller was the model of consistency on the blue-line, a master of guarding the fort. His breathtaking speed and skating, however, also allowed him the option of leading the odd rush. He was the definition of an all-around talent.

Les Castors de Sherbrooke selects :
G Alex Connell
LW Bob Pulford

The Boston Bruins select, in our opinion, one of the most underrated defensemen ever. He was one of the biggest, strongest and fastest defenseman of his era. He is also arguably the best all-around right handed defenseman remaining.Who? D Ott Heller.

I love that pick. He was on my list too.

I love that pick. He was on my list too.

Yeah, that was a good pick. However, I'd be willing to bet, over half of GM's have at least 6 defensemen out of 10 players on their lists. I think we'll probably see a stretch in the next 2-3 rounds, where every team will pick up one D. Which opens up a lot of opportunities to snag a couple forwards/a goalie/coach.

The Boston Bruins select, in our opinion, one of the most underrated defensemen ever. He was one of the biggest, strongest and fastest defenseman of his era. He is also arguably the best all-around right handed defenseman remaining.Who? D Ott Heller.

five of my seven d-men from last time gone by round 11 and my defense got no love...

Can't wait much longer for Evilsather & Kruezer to pick, So much for Co-GM's moving things quicker. Anybody on for a while that will announce my pick if ES & K do pick tonite? I like to keep things moving. Otherwise, see you in the morning.

You can send it to me pappy.

Been at work all day without access, leaving work right now, will pick in an hour but go ahead guys.

Been at work all day without access, leaving work right now, will pick in an hour but go ahead guys.

pappy is next so take your time

im pretty sure he went to bed

pappy is next so take your time

im pretty sure he went to bed

I think pits has pappy's pick. But yeah, you can take a little longer ES, pits is probably watching the Nucks game.

I'll be there for another couple of hours. So if it come to me, I'll select immediately.

I'm heading out, is there someone who I can forward pappy's picks to? If not, I'll make his pick later tonight.

I'm heading out, is there someone who I can forward pappy's picks to? If not, I'll make his pick later tonight.

I'll be around

I'm heading out, is there someone who I can forward pappy's picks to? If not, I'll make his pick later tonight.
I'll be around, too. I want to pick tonight.

Is Shawnmullin around? if so, after Evil Sather select, the selection of pappy is given, after GBC pick and after I pick ... could be a good late night run.

The New York Rangers are very pleased to select yet another playoff warrior, a 4 time Cup winner who scored 74 points in 74 games during that 4 year stretch and one with excellent chemistry with Bobby Nystrom. He is a great skater, an accomplished scorer, and is ready to anchor an excellent third line... C Bob Bourne.

The Guelph Biltmores select Sid Smith

Anybody got mullins pick?

I'm out for the night. Who's going to be here for the next 8-9hours?

Now that the core of the team is fully in place, I see no more reason to delay the inevitable. In a move that should surprise no one, the Oakland Seals are proud to name Wayne Gretzky team captain.

The first assistant captain will be Valeri Vasiliev. We believe his track record of leadership and winning speaks for itself.

We will wait to see how the rest of the roster shapes up before assigning the second A.

I dedicate this, the 99th post in the thread, to Seals captain Wayne Gretzky.

I dedicate this, the 99th post in the thread, to Seals captain Wayne Gretzky.

I dedicate #100 (or #30 + #40) to Wade Belak

Hey, can anyone take a shortlist from me?

Sorry guys, I expected to have internet access in Salmon Arm and didn't.

I'll get on my pick now.

Just out of curiosity, does anyone have a link to original (as opposed to later iterations) PCHL scoring tables? I know some fine players took the ice in that league (Taylor, Nighbor, Pitre, Foyston, et al) and a few PCHL teams won the Cup, but I'm kind of allergic to guys from leagues that don't have posted scoring tables available for inspection, nevermind the issue of the league having only three teams for much of the period in question. Wikipedia and hockeydb have not proven helpful.

I've googled the PCHA but because the acronym has been so often recycled, the search coughed up nothing of use, the most interesting site being this one (http://cgiha.org/cms/content/view/28/2/). Now I must wash my hands.

mullin's time is up, and I'm ready to pick, but I'll give him 15 minutes to make up his mind.

Sorry guys having some issues this morning.

Those bus trips always mess with ya, that's what I'll blame.

Ugh missing time limits, sorry. Thanks for the patience.

Victoria is proud to select a man who was a huge part in Montreal's 1993 Stanley Cup Victory. He scored 23 points in 20 games during the run to that Cup. A top line player in the regular season and playoffs who played at a more than PPG pace until slowed in his last few seasons. Played a strong two-way game while scoring over 1200 points in his long career. Only broke 40 goals once, but came close several times while showing a great ability to create chances and set up his line mates. Showed longevity with nearly 1400 games in a tough NHL and 140 games in the playoffs. Went out on a high note as the Sharks made a run to the Conference Finals and he put up 14 points to help lead them there.

C/LW Vincent Damphousse

Halifax RCAF is pleased to select a perennial raleh favourite. A slick, skilled playmaking centre to lead our second line. He became the first player to win the Hart Trophy and the Lady Byng Trophy in the same year in 1948. Won two Stanley Cup trophies with Montreal. He was coming into his own as a player when he was involved in a car accident, after which he was never the same player. Canada's athlete of the year in 1948:

C Buddy O'Connor

I was looking hard at Buddy but settled on Vinny. A couple other guys I had in mind too that I kind of changed my mind on last minute. That was part of the reason for my delay.

With our 12th pick, the 292nd overall in this year draft, the Detroit Falcons are very please to select center Ralph Backstrom.

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/gallery/000060/000095776.jpg

Ralph Backstrom was a swift skater with a deft scoring touch whose defensive and team-oriented play earned him accolades throughout his career. The most significant years of his pro tenure were spent with the Montreal Canadiens, with whom he won the Stanley Cup six times between 1959 and 1969. [...] Although he was overshadowed by Montreal's top two centers, Jean Beliveau and Henri Richard, Backstrom became an important two-way forward on six Stanley Cup-winning teams. He and teammate Claude Provost garnered reputations as two of the most dogged forwards in the game. Even though he often drew checking assignments, Backstrom produced five 20-goal seasons, including a personal high of 27 in 1961-62. Years later, Backstrom reflected on this period: "There were times in my career that I felt I could have played better statistically if I would have played on another team besides the Canadiens. But there was nothing like the team successes that the Canadiens had during the time I played with them."

Stanley Cup (1959, 1960, 1965, 1966, 1968, 1969)
Calder Memorial Trophy (1959)
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1958, 1959, 1960, 1962, 1965, 1967)

Backstrom is a good pick but that's not a flattering photo. Makes him look about 3 feet tall.

Backstrom is a good pick but that's not a flattering photo. Makes him look about 3 feet tall.

I'll change that just for ya!

I was looking hard at Buddy but settled on Vinny. A couple other guys I had in mind too that I kind of changed my mind on last minute. That was part of the reason for my delay.
You would have been able to hear my profanity if you would have picked O'Connor. He's one of raleh's all-time favourites, and I was waiting to pick him, knowing that raleh's the only GM who has ever picked him this soon. (He went late in the 14th round of the last draft). When raleh sent his list before leaving for Greece of who he wants, O'Connor was at the top of his list.

Eagle, Backstrom is a good pick. For the first time ever, he gets picked right around where he should. One of the top five two-way line centres in the draft. He's smart, he's quick and he's skilled, too. Would have put up excellent numbers if he wasn't playing behind some guys named Beliveau and Richard in Montreal. Better than quite a few guys picked ahead of him. Good news is there is still a lot of good centres of that ilk remaining.

Just out of curiosity, does anyone have a link to original (as opposed to later iterations) PCHL scoring tables? I know some fine players took the ice in that league (Taylor, Nighbor, Pitre, Foyston, et al) and a few PCHL teams won the Cup, but I'm kind of allergic to guys from leagues that don't have posted scoring tables available for inspection, nevermind the issue of the league having only three teams for much of the period in question. Wikipedia and hockeydb have not proven helpful.

I've googled the PCHA but because the acronym has been so often recycled, the search coughed up nothing of use, the most interesting site being this one (http://cgiha.org/cms/content/view/28/2/). Now I must wash my hands.
There's not much on the web, the best sites are defunct. Here's one via the wayback machine:

http://web.archive.org/web/20050714025454/http://www.ottawavalleyonline.com/sites/tomking_01/tkhtml/miscmajorleagues/PCHA-1.htm

I have this, cleaned up a bit, in a word doc if you want it.

http://www.hockeyleaguehistory.com/index.html has some info, but not yearly top 10 scoring leaders or such.

There's some great stuff here as well Backcheck: A Hockey Retrospective (http://www.collectionscanada.ca/hockey/index-e.html?PHPSESSID=5rvmv50ui67b6mb5l2vck7r9e5)

Get a copy of The Trail of the Stanley Cup by Charles L. Coleman if you can. A true treasure trove of info covering 1893 to 1967. I lucked in to a copy of all 3 volumes for $10, and don't even begrudge the dead arm I got lugging it around for an hour after I bought it. :)

Wow, EB has some ridiculous depth at center.

Eagle, Backstrom is a good pick. For the first time ever, he gets picked right around where he should. One of the top five two-way line centres in the draft. He's smart, he's quick and he's skilled, too. Would have put up excellent numbers if he wasn't playing behind some guys named Beliveau and Richard in Montreal. Better than quite a few guys picked ahead of him. Good news is there is still a lot of good centres of that ilk remaining.

The fact that he played with Claude Provost was a big reason why I selected him. Him and Provost won't have the chance yet again to play on the top-6, but they were so dominant on a third line role. EDIT (false statement!). I hope people will not only acknowledge their defensive dominance, but also their offensive productivity, as both were able to notch some goals from tiem to time: Provost had 9 15+ goals season and Backstrom 6 20+ goals season, all that when their first priority was to defend.

Wow, EB has some ridiculous depth at center.

Thank You! When your first two pick in the draft are center, you hope that centers will be one of your strenght :)

The fact that he played with Claude Provost was a big reason why I selected him. Him and Provost won't have the chance yet again to play on the top-6, but they were so dominant on a third line role. Together, they've participate to the All-Star game in 1958, 1959, 1960, 1962, 1965 and 1967. How rare does 2 defensive mind players participate in the all-star game, let alone 6 time as linemate? At the time, people recognize their work, as the best two-way duo of the 1960's. I hope people will not only acknowledge their defensive dominance, but also their offensive productivity, as both were able to notch some goals from tiem to time: Provost had 9 15+ goals season and Backstrom 6 20+ goals season, all that when their first priority was to defend.



Thank You! When your first two pick in the draft are center, you hope that centers will be one of your strenght :)
The reason they participated in five of those six all-star games together was because they won the Stanley Cup (exception being 1962), and the Cup champions played league all-stars in the all-star game back then. But to have those two together gives you a very dangerous two-way line, likely the best in the draft. Whoever plays you will need a healthy dose of depth, because you could have Sylvain Turgeon on that line, and still have one of the best two-way lines in the draft.

(I've wanted to see the league go back to that all-star format for a while. Frankly, I think the game would be a lot closer than people might think, especially if the NHL all-stars ignored defensive players).

Incidentally, Claude Provost has played in the most all-star games (11) among players eligible for the HHOF. And while some would question the validity of that stat, since he got on by being part of the Cup champs, I value that more than guys who get in the all-star game via fan balloting or the "every team must be represented" rule.

The reason they participated in five of those six all-star games together was because they won the Stanley Cup (exception being 1962), and the Cup champions played league all-stars in the all-star game back then.

My bad, I must of knew that! Thought those all-star thing ended in the 1950's, although it make so much sense that I can't believe it passed through my mind. I'm reading too much university stuff, need to read some good old hockey books to keep my reflexes!. Thanks for claring this out! I still think they were one of the better defensive duo of the 1960's though ;)

*Go hit the book, shameful* :speechles

Question: why 1962 the exception?

I have HO pick.

This might be the longest we've had to wait for Murph's pick in this, or any, draft. (With the exception of his infamous Thanksgiving "beer storm" from ATD #6).

At least with Murph you know he'll be prompt when he does come online.

I'm here!

The Edmonton Oilers select as their player coach: Jacques Lemaire

I'm here!

The Edmonton Oilers select as their player coach: Jacques Lemaire

Reggie Dunlop?

Hi EB,

Please pick Rob Ramage for me if you'll be around today.

Thanks,

- Peter

Thanks BM. Yeah, I wasn't getting very far in my research at the Colorado Gay Ice Hockey Association (http://cgiha.org/cms/content/view/28/2/) website, though a really nice guy named Lance did tell me that he could help me find out more about the league's top scorers. Pleasant, but strange - he kept asking me if I'm a butterfly goalie. Whatever. I gave him arrbez's e-mail address.

The PCHA is kind of the lost continent of hockey history. A good number of all-time greats played in the league, but finding reliable information about those old teams and skaters is remarkably difficult, and I'm way past the point of accepting what the HHOF says on face value.

Some interesting picks today...

- Damphousse has always been a strong playoff performer, even when he wasn't that great in the regular season. One real knock on Vinny is that he was absolutely terrible about taking cheap-ass penalties in the offensive zone, often nowhere near the play. It used to drive me nuts. A quick look at him PIMs over the years proves my point - they are grossly out of whack with what one would expect out of a soft scoringline forward (and Vinny was soft; I'm not sure I ever saw him throw a body check). Vinny had a good career and I guess he's useful as a low-end 2nd line left winger. As a center, I dunno...there's just a lot of talent at that position, and I wouldn't feel comfortable putting Damphousse on a 3rd line. He played well enough in his own zone, but I wouldn't call him anything close to elite defensively and he was the antithesis of a banger.

- O'Connor is an interesting pick. It's a shame he got hurt in the season after his Hart because maybe his career would have turned out differently. Seems like the Hart season was his only big offensive year, though, as the only other times he cracked 40 points were 42-45, and we all know what was going on in the league then. I could see using O'Connor as a 4th liner, but a second liner?! Tell me what I am missing here, GBC, because I don't see it and I have a lot of respect for you and raleh as GMs, so I assume that I must be missing something.

THG18 is now up. In his last post, he said to give him three hours (so until about 3 p.m. EST), and if he still hasn't picked, to skip him. BM, what's your call? Give him three hours? Nine hours? Or just skip him now? He hasn't been around since his last post.

i left my list with bm67 ill be atwork for another 4 hrs

I've go arrbez's list whenever we decide what to do with THG's pick.

Thanks BM. Yeah, I wasn't getting very far in my research at the Colorado Gay Ice Hockey Association (http://cgiha.org/cms/content/view/28/2/) website, though a really nice guy named Lance did tell me that he could help me find out more about the league's top scorers. Pleasant, but strange - he kept asking me if I'm a butterfly goalie. Whatever. I gave him arrbez's e-mail address.

The PCHA is kind of the lost continent of hockey history. A good number of all-time greats played in the league, but finding reliable information about those old teams and skaters is remarkably difficult, and I'm way past the point of accepting what the HHOF says on face value.

Some interesting picks today...

- Damphousse has always been a strong playoff performer, even when he wasn't that great in the regular season. One real knock on Vinny is that he was absolutely terrible about taking cheap-ass penalties in the offensive zone, often nowhere near the play. It used to drive me nuts. A quick look at him PIMs over the years proves my point - they are grossly out of whack with what one would expect out of a soft scoringline forward (and Vinny was soft; I'm not sure I ever saw him throw a body check). Vinny had a good career and I guess he's useful as a low-end 2nd line left winger. As a center, I dunno...there's just a lot of talent at that position, and I wouldn't feel comfortable putting Damphousse on a 3rd line. He played well enough in his own zone, but I wouldn't call him anything close to elite defensively and he was the antithesis of a banger.

- O'Connor is an interesting pick. It's a shame he got hurt in the season after his Hart because maybe his career would have turned out differently. Seems like the Hart season was his only big offensive year, though, as the only other times he cracked 40 points were 42-45, and we all know what was going on in the league then. I could see using O'Connor as a 4th liner, but a second liner?! Tell me what I am missing here, GBC, because I don't see it and I have a lot of respect for you and raleh as GMs, so I assume that I must be missing something.
raleh could probably tell you more about O'Connor than I could. raleh had him in two drafts, and he topped raleh's wish list that he left with me before he went to Greece.

O'Connor was an exceptional offensive centre, though. Keep in mind that in the late 40s/early 50s, nobody put up big point totals. He had a point-per-game in 48, and he finished one point behind Art Ross winner Elmer Lach. (And it wasn't like there was a derth of talent in the late 40s/early 50s). Definitely good enough to be a second-line centre in a 28-team draft. Slick, skilled centre who made those around him better.

He definitely wouldn't be a good fourth line centre, unless your fourth line is a miscellaneous line or another scoring line.

Thanks BM. Yeah, I wasn't getting very far in my research at the Colorado Gay Ice Hockey Association (http://cgiha.org/cms/content/view/28/2/) website, though a really nice guy named Lance did tell me that he could help me find out more about the league's top scorers. Pleasant, but strange - he kept asking me if I'm a butterfly goalie. Whatever. I gave him arrbez's e-mail address.

The PCHA is kind of the lost continent of hockey history. A good number of all-time greats played in the league, but finding reliable information about those old teams and skaters is remarkably difficult, and I'm way past the point of accepting what the HHOF says on face value.

Some interesting picks today...

- Damphousse has always been a strong playoff performer, even when he wasn't that great in the regular season. One real knock on Vinny is that he was absolutely terrible about taking cheap-ass penalties in the offensive zone, often nowhere near the play. It used to drive me nuts. A quick look at him PIMs over the years proves my point - they are grossly out of whack with what one would expect out of a soft scoringline forward (and Vinny was soft; I'm not sure I ever saw him throw a body check). Vinny had a good career and I guess he's useful as a low-end 2nd line left winger. As a center, I dunno...there's just a lot of talent at that position, and I wouldn't feel comfortable putting Damphousse on a 3rd line. He played well enough in his own zone, but I wouldn't call him anything close to elite defensively and he was the antithesis of a banger.

- O'Connor is an interesting pick. It's a shame he got hurt in the season after his Hart because maybe his career would have turned out differently. Seems like the Hart season was his only big offensive year, though, as the only other times he cracked 40 points were 42-45, and we all know what was going on in the league then. I could see using O'Connor as a 4th liner, but a second liner?! Tell me what I am missing here, GBC, because I don't see it and I have a lot of respect for you and raleh as GMs, so I assume that I must be missing something.

Damphousse isn't a physical player but he was a responsible two-way player who could handle things in the defensive zone. I wouldn't consider him one dimensional anyway. There's lots of talent at Centre sure, but again this is a player who scored 1200 points and a lot of his career was during the dead puck era. If Vinny was in his prime in the 80s his point totals would be even more impressive. A plus PPG player during the trap era until his age slowed him down. I definately wouldn't say he went early. Of course my line-up still has lots of room for changes. It's nice that he could play wing for the sake of vesitility.

I've go arrbez's list whenever we decide what to do with THG's pick.
I'm guessing he doesn't have internet access, so let's get the next two picks done now.

Damphousse isn't a physical player but he was a responsible two-way player who could handle things in the defensive zone. I wouldn't consider him one dimensional anyway. There's lots of talent at Centre sure, but again this is a player who scored 1200 points and a lot of his career was during the dead puck era. If Vinny was in his prime in the 80s his point totals would be even more impressive. A plus PPG player during the trap era until his age slowed him down. I definately wouldn't say he went early. Of course my line-up still has lots of room for changes. It's nice that he could play wing for the sake of vesitility.
Damphousse's best years came from 1989 to 1997. If you take a deeper look at 1993-94 and 1995-96, you'd see that the best players still got their points. One of the main reasons that scoring dipped was that expansion really diluted the depth of the league. Teams used to have two or three lines capable of putting the puck in the net, suddenly they had one scoring line and maybe one or two good offensive players on their second line. The "dead puck era" really didn't affect him that much.

I'm a big Damphousse fan. He was on our long list for the last two rounds. Excellent two-way play. Some of his best hockey was at LW, too, which is why he's such a valuable weapon. One reason he didn't put up more points: he was a notoriously slow starter. During his best years, he'd usually score at a 60-65 point pace in the first half, and then a 110-120 point pace in the second half.

raleh could probably tell you more about O'Connor than I could. raleh had him in two drafts, and he topped raleh's wish list that he left with me before he went to Greece.

O'Connor was an exceptional offensive centre, though. Keep in mind that in the late 40s/early 50s, nobody put up big point totals. He had a point-per-game in 48, and he finished one point behind Art Ross winner Elmer Lach. (And it wasn't like there was a derth of talent in the late 40s/early 50s). Definitely good enough to be a second-line centre in a 28-team draft. Slick, skilled centre who made those around him better.

He definitely wouldn't be a good fourth line centre, unless your fourth line is a miscellaneous line or another scoring line.

Ok, I'm looking forward to hearing raleh's take on O'Connor. I don't know anything about the guy outside of his stats and his HHOF bio, so there must be something I'm missing.

Of course I know that scoring in that era wasn't huge and that a point-per-game would often put you in the top-10. It's also clear that O'Connor was outstanding in 1948. But what about the other seasons? Looking over his career, outside of 1948 he seems like a good second line center on a real team, but on an all-time team? I'm not going to beat this one around any more than I already have. Perhaps we'll revisit the subject if Halifax and Oakland meet in the playoffs.

Allright then, arrbez sent me an almost hilariously hard-luck shortlist, but there is one player remaining on it, so here goes. The Aurora Tigers select goaltender Rogatien "Rogie" Vachon.

I'm a big Damphousse fan. He was on our long list for the last two rounds. Excellent two-way play. Some of his best hockey was at LW, too, which is why he's such a valuable weapon. One reason he didn't put up more points: he was a notoriously slow starter. During his best years, he'd usually score at a 60-65 point pace in the first half, and then a 110-120 point pace in the second half.

And I'm not very concerned about a slow starter given that he delivers when it really counts. I do think the original years of the trap era slowed his point totals. Montreal wasn't exactly run and gun from what I remember, either. I mean so much of stats can be situational. Different situations and I firmly belive he'd have had at least a few 100 point seasons while being a very strong two-way player.

Lots of what ifs of course, and it's not like his production was something to be ashamed of... 1200 points... I just think it could've been even more impressive in a different time and place.

Leaf Lander selects Stanley Cup and World Cup winning goaltender Mike Richter.

Dubai takes
Daniel Alfredsson

And I'm not very concerned about a slow starter given that he delivers when it really counts. I do think the original years of the trap era slowed his point totals. Montreal wasn't exactly run and gun from what I remember, either. I mean so much of stats can be situational. Different situations and I firmly belive he'd have had at least a few 100 point seasons while being a very strong two-way player.

Lots of what ifs of course, and it's not like his production was something to be ashamed of... 1200 points... I just think it could've been even more impressive in a different time and place.

You are correct that Damphousse never had the benefit of playing on a really strong offensive team. Vinny had some pretty decent wingers to work with during his career - Recchi, Mullen, Habs player xxx, Sharks player xxx - but certainly no one who could be characterized as elite, and generally he did play in defense-first systems.

I dunno about the Habs and Leafs, but certainly the Sharks never played the trap and I'd be shocked if anyone even considered the trap in Edmonton, though Vinny only played there for a year.

I always snicker at those who call 97-04 the "dead puck era." Truth be told, it had nothing on the late 20s (before the forward pass was allowed) or the late 40s or early 50s, when scoring dropped below five goals per game.

Elite players scored a point-per-game. In 46-47, there were six players who played at least 40 games who had at least a point-per-game. In 47-48, there were three. Same for 48-49. (In fact, O'Connor was the Rangers leading scorer that year despite the accident). In 49-50, there were two. Same with 50-51. Gordie was the only one to do it in 51-52. It was back up to two in 52-53 and 53-54.

Guys like Howe, Lindsay, Schmidt, Abel, Richard, Lach, the Bentleys and Kennedy reached that plateau. And Buddy O'Connor. He is absolutely good enough to play on a second line.


Ok, I'm looking forward to hearing raleh's take on O'Connor. I don't know anything about the guy outside of his stats and his HHOF bio, so there must be something I'm missing.

Of course I know that scoring in that era wasn't huge and that a point-per-game would often put you in the top-10. It's also clear that O'Connor was outstanding in 1948. But what about the other seasons? Looking over his career, outside of 1948 he seems like a good second line center on a real team, but on an all-time team? I'm not going to beat this one around any more than I already have. Perhaps we'll revisit the subject if Halifax and Oakland meet in the playoffs.

I always snicker at those who call 97-04 the "dead puck era." Truth be told, it had nothing on the late 20s (before the forward pass was allowed) or the late 40s or early 50s, when scoring dropped below five goals per game.

.

But it's still the 2nd lowest-scoring era, and it followed the highest-scoring one. Probably why it got named like this. And Dead Puck Era comes from Dead Ball Era (of baseball, which is roughly 1900 to 1919), but we gotta know when the term was used the first time.

Scoring didn't went up significantly before/after Late'20 and Late'40-Early'50 - and while players scored MORE goals, they were much less players on the roster too. Which probably explains why guys like Lalonde, Malone and al. could score so much, while "global" scoring didn't went up that much.

And DBA comes from rules that were different in the time (spitball, park dimensions, coaching approach). Kindof the same with the Football's DBA, which saw it's dawn with rules regarding WR-contact (amongst others) -- no wonder why Joe Namath got MUCH MORE INTS than TD's, even if he's in the HOF. The same parallel can be drawn with hockey's DPA -- Goalie stuffing, lax on clutch 'N grab, coaching tactics, and developpement of goaltending coaching, and, let's admit it, a relatively low talent-pool considering the number of teams, even if this very fact led to extremely high scoring in the early '90. Some teams had no chance winning by run n gun tactics, so they were advantaged by keeping score close enough to use a lucky bounce and score once in a while.

I always snicker at those who call 97-04 the "dead puck era." Truth be told, it had nothing on the late 20s (before the forward pass was allowed) or the late 40s or early 50s, when scoring dropped below five goals per game.

Elite players scored a point-per-game. In 46-47, there were six players who played at least 40 games who had at least a point-per-game. In 47-48, there were three. Same for 48-49. (In fact, O'Connor was the Rangers leading scorer that year despite the accident). In 49-50, there were two. Same with 50-51. Gordie was the only one to do it in 51-52. It was back up to two in 52-53 and 53-54.

Guys like Howe, Lindsay, Schmidt, Abel, Richard, Lach, the Bentleys and Kennedy reached that plateau. And Buddy O'Connor. He is absolutely good enough to play on a second line.

Well if you look at O'Connor's stats and I suspect that you are as likely none of us have ever seen him play - he had his best seasons during World War II, and we all should know that the level of competition dropped significantly during those years.... essentially his point production doubled overnight, now that could just be him developing as a player, but as soon as World War II ended and the regulars came back from their Army/Air Force/Navy teams, his point production took a significant hit... in fact it was halved to Pre-WWII levels... doesn't really bode well for O'Connor against elite level competition in my humble opinion... I would put him on the same level as a Crosby in terms of career achievements and we know how some people would rip Crosby if he was on a second line... personally I guess he could fit in on a second line but really it wouldn't be that strong of a second line in my opinion...

Although I guess his size or lack there of fits in really well with your teams mantra.

And...BTW, can we draft 2 coaches?

And...BTW, can we draft 2 coaches?
knock yourself out

an assistant coach or associate coach might be one way to use one of one's extra picks

Well if you look at O'Connor's stats and I suspect that you are as likely none of us have ever seen him play - he had his best seasons during World War II, and we all should know that the level of competition dropped significantly during those years.... essentially his point production doubled overnight, now that could just be him developing as a player, but as soon as World War II ended and the regulars came back from their Army/Air Force/Navy teams, his point production took a significant hit... in fact it was halved to Pre-WWII levels... doesn't really bode well for O'Connor against elite level competition in my humble opinion... I would put him on the same level as a Crosby in terms of career achievements and we know how some people would rip Crosby if he was on a second line... personally I guess he could fit in on a second line but really it wouldn't be that strong of a second line in my opinion...

Although I guess his size or lack there of fits in really well with your teams mantra.
No, he had his best season after World War II, ie: 1947-48, when he won the league MVP award, the Lady Byng, nearly won the Art Ross, and he was named Canada's Athlete of the Year. (And he led the Rangers in scoring the following year, despite missing a quarter of the season).

His point production doubling overnight was partly related to the war, but it was definitely related to his development as a player. One thing you failed to note in your, how should I say, incomplete argument, is that he had played only one season prior to the NHL's best leaving for war in 1942. 25 points in 36 games was very impressive for a rookie in 1941-42.

He played in four Allan Cups, and while some might scoff at that, keep in mind that the Allan Cup was very high calibre of hockey in the 30s and early 40s, not far off the Stanley Cup playoffs. A lot of players cut their careers short, or didn't even attempt a foray into the NHL, due to the Great Depression.

I'm not concerned about his production drop in 45-46. It went back up the following year, even though scoring dropped by a fair amount. And then he had the magnificent season in 47-48. (And it's not like he had a legendary sniper to work with the year he won the Hart. He was 13 points ahead of the Rangers next-best scorer - a country mile in those days.

His career is ahead of Crosby's right now. For one thing, O'Connor has a couple of Stanley Cup rings.

As for my team's lack of size, O'Connor was 5'7". So what? Fleury was 5'6". There are a lot more players than you might think in today's NHL who are 5'7". (Take it from someone who knows: a lot of the media guide lists are BS). Neely, Armstrong and Tikkanen were all over 6'0". Stanley is 6'2". And our other three defencemen are 5'11". And there are a lot of defencemen who are around 5'11" doing just fine.

knock yourself out

an assistant coach or associate coach might be one way to use one of one's extra picks

WEll, by COACHES, I meant an associate/assistant coach, obviously. I'll start by drafting a coach, and then we'll see.

6:51pm PST is going to put me right in the middle of my turkey dinner, C'mon Regina, make a pick.......

The Regina Wildhearts select a truly deserving :biglaugh: member of the hockey hall of fame. A multiple cup winner and playoff performer. An excellent two-way player and a helluva teammate.

Richard Duff.

Thanks for making my pick, EB. Rob Ramage gives my blueline some more size & toughness, great playmaking ability (60+ pts three times), and solid play in the defensive zone. He's versatile enough to be used on PK and PP.

The Regina Wildhearts select a truly deserving :biglaugh: member of the hockey hall of fame. A multiple cup winner and playoff performer. An excellent two-way player and a helluva teammate.

Richard Duff.

lol, that was quick, should have asked earlier.

The Edmonton Oilers select: Terry O'Reilly

The Regina Wildhearts select a truly deserving :biglaugh: member of the hockey hall of fame. A multiple cup winner and playoff performer. An excellent two-way player and a helluva teammate.

Richard Duff.

Bah. Nice pick.

Allright then, arrbez sent me an almost hilariously hard-luck shortlist, but there is one player remaining on it, so here goes. The Aurora Tigers select goaltender Rogatien "Rogie" Vachon.

Thanks for making my pick (I know I just kinda dumped it on you). Much appreciated.

The first 3 guys on my list were all gone, which is too bad (Pulford, Backstrom, Damphousse). At the same time, I'm very happy to solidify my goaltending situation. I have no problem with Thompson as my starter, but at the same time I realize he's at the lower end in this draft. Vachon gives me a guy who had considerable success as not only a starter, but in a backup and platoon role as well. A few Stanley Cups, a couple allstar selections, a Hart runner-up, and of course his legendary performance at the 1976 Canada Cup.

The fact that he was such a snappy dresser is just icing on the cake:

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/gallery/000045/000105518.jpg

Has either THG or dd shown up? I knew it would be slow today, because of Thanksgiving, but i didn't think it'd be this slow...

I'm up in about 8 picks, and I'm gone for the rest of the night, like I'm guessing most of you are...but is anybody going to be here, just in case doctordark, Middleton, BM and everyone else decides to coincidentally show up?

doctordark was here just over an hour ago but seems to have disappeared for now. I'll be in and out tonight so feel free to send me your list.

We are proud to select our 3rd line center, a player who could both score and dish but was used primarily for his stellar shutdown capabilities (rendering a prime Esposito goalless in the '72 Cup Final) - Samson strength, "Bulldog" resiliency, intelligent defense, excellent face-off talent, and great leadership. These are the hallmarks of the newest PlaP Plain...

Walt Tkaczuk

“The Tkaczuk line was the best defensive line I ever coached,” recalled (a former Ranger coach). “When they started ragging the puck, the other club just couldn’t get it back.”

"I remember in his first season," the coach recalled "when he was coming in on Bob Baun, one of the toughest checkers in the league and I thought 'Oh no, Walter!' But he kept going right at him and knocked Baun back ten feet, and kept going toward the net. That's the kind of strength he has. When he goes into a corner for the puck with two or three guys, he not only comes out with it most of the time, but he's not even off balance."

"I've never run into anyone tougher. Ever," said Espo of Tkaczuk. "Bobby Clarke of Philadelphia gives me fits because he's so fast and persistent. ## in Toronto was as strong as a horse but Tkaczuk had a combination of those qualities."

No, he had his best season after World War II, ie: 1947-48, when he won the league MVP award, the Lady Byng, nearly won the Art Ross, and he was named Canada's Athlete of the Year. (And he led the Rangers in scoring the following year, despite missing a quarter of the season).

His point production doubling overnight was partly related to the war, but it was definitely related to his development as a player. One thing you failed to note in your, how should I say, incomplete argument, is that he had played only one season prior to the NHL's best leaving for war in 1942. 25 points in 36 games was very impressive for a rookie in 1941-42.

He played in four Allan Cups, and while some might scoff at that, keep in mind that the Allan Cup was very high calibre of hockey in the 30s and early 40s, not far off the Stanley Cup playoffs. A lot of players cut their careers short, or didn't even attempt a foray into the NHL, due to the Great Depression.

I'm not concerned about his production drop in 45-46. It went back up the following year, even though scoring dropped by a fair amount. And then he had the magnificent season in 47-48. (And it's not like he had a legendary sniper to work with the year he won the Hart. He was 13 points ahead of the Rangers next-best scorer - a country mile in those days.

His career is ahead of Crosby's right now. For one thing, O'Connor has a couple of Stanley Cup rings.

As for my team's lack of size, O'Connor was 5'7". So what? Fleury was 5'6". There are a lot more players than you might think in today's NHL who are 5'7". (Take it from someone who knows: a lot of the media guide lists are BS). Neely, Armstrong and Tikkanen were all over 6'0". Stanley is 6'2". And our other three defencemen are 5'11". And there are a lot of defencemen who are around 5'11" doing just fine.

Pretty ironic for the man who ripped Crosby for a short peak to select Buddy O'Connor, who had a similar length peak against elite level competition, but didn't hit the same heights.

To wit:

O'Connor had an impressive season for a rookie - 6th in scoring on his team. Crosby had an all-time great one - 6th in scoring in the league, 2nd at his position..

Crosby won an Art Ross, O'Connor didn't. Missed by a point, but it is what it is.

O'Connor won the Hart during a time when, as has often been pointed out, the award was given to the most valuable player to his team, not the most outstanding player in the league as it was when Crosby won it. O'Connor's 2nd All-Star Team selection that year corroborates this. Meanwhile, Crosby had the overwhelming support of his colleagues and independent observers as the class of the league.

O'Connor has a couple of Cups because he played on an immensely talented, experienced team. Nobody questions Crosby's performance during the playoffs, because he was as good as he was during the regular season, even if the numbers don't bear that out. Sid hasn't had the benefit of playing on a team with anything close to the support of Lach, Blake, Richard, Bouchard, Drillon, Reardon, Durnan, etc. Even on the Rags, O'Connor didn't have any disadvantage compared to Crosby teammate-wise...but that certainly won't be a problem on Portage, since Crosby will be flanked by the illustrious Bill Cook instead of a geriatric Recchi and a hapless Ryan Malone.

The Allan Cup? Are we really going there? I might as well use Crosby's Memorial Cup and WJC performances in his defense.

Then there's that World Championship showing Crosby has. All-Tournament Team, Leading Scorer, and Top Forward. O'Connor didn't have that opportunity, but it does work in Crosby's favour to show that he's been dominant at the international level too.

My two cents for round 11th so far.

- I'm not, and never were a fan of Bernie Federko, but the truth is, he played in some really horrible Blues squads back in the day. 202 was early last draft, and 282 seems more like it, even though I wouldn't call this a steal. Him and Litzenberger have about the same problem : their era was rather stacked at their respective position, so they got somewhat underappreciated because of this.

- We gotta learn how people perceive Jacques Lemaire will be able to coach a, relatively speaking, aggressive team('cause I figure this is how this squad will be in the end), and a, relatively speaking, not very skilled team, offensively-speaking (raw skill isn't Murphy's priority, and everybody is well aware of this). I'm of the few that thinks the Devils teams were actually much more talented that everyone made them to be at the time. They have the making of a great Lemaire team with Gainey, Plante, and obviously, Lemaire himself.

- Maybe I missed something about this guy's career, but I don't understand why Rob Ramage gets so much love in ATD's...

- 197 was EXTREMELY early for Dick Duff, but 299 is good... By choosing Pulford, I know I couldn't draft Duff, which was something I considered... As long as he doesn't play on the Top-6, he's a great player.

- Damphousse, O'Connor and Backstrom was a terrific trio of pick, as is Rogie Vachon at this point. Vachon was my 2nd choice, but I think that, in this draft, his "status" is GREAT BACKUP, not STARTER.

pitseleh, you have a list for Winnipeg. Thanks sir.

We are proud to select our 3rd line center, a player who could both score and dish but was used primarily for his stellar shutdown capabilities (rendering a prime Esposito goalless in the '72 Cup Final) - Samson strength, "Bulldog" resiliency, intelligent defense, excellent face-off talent, and great leadership. These are the hallmarks of the newest PlaP Plain...

Walt Tkaczuk

.








Nice Pick.Had him earmarked as my 3rd line center. O'Well back to the drawing board.

Senior hockey was miles better in those days than it is now. For example, almost all members of the 61 Trail Smoke Eaters were asked to come and try out for the NHL, but most turned it down because they made such a good living at Cominco and got to play hockey on top of that.

Pretty ironic for the man who ripped Crosby for a short peak to select Buddy O'Connor, who had a similar length peak against elite level competition, but didn't hit the same heights.

To wit:

O'Connor had an impressive season for a rookie - 6th in scoring on his team. Crosby had an all-time great one - 6th in scoring in the league, 2nd at his position..

Crosby won an Art Ross, O'Connor didn't. Missed by a point, but it is what it is.

O'Connor won the Hart during a time when, as has often been pointed out, the award was given to the most valuable player to his team, not the most outstanding player in the league as it was when Crosby won it. O'Connor's 2nd All-Star Team selection that year corroborates this. Meanwhile, Crosby had the overwhelming support of his colleagues and independent observers as the class of the league.

O'Connor has a couple of Cups because he played on an immensely talented, experienced team. Nobody questions Crosby's performance during the playoffs, because he was as good as he was during the regular season, even if the numbers don't bear that out. Sid hasn't had the benefit of playing on a team with anything close to the support of Lach, Blake, Richard, Bouchard, Drillon, Reardon, Durnan, etc. Even on the Rags, O'Connor didn't have any disadvantage compared to Crosby teammate-wise...but that certainly won't be a problem on Portage, since Crosby will be flanked by the illustrious Bill Cook instead of a geriatric Recchi and a hapless Ryan Malone.

The Allan Cup? Are we really going there? I might as well use Crosby's Memorial Cup and WJC performances in his defense.

Then there's that World Championship showing Crosby has. All-Tournament Team, Leading Scorer, and Top Forward. O'Connor didn't have that opportunity, but it does work in Crosby's favour to show that he's been dominant at the international level too.

Do you know how good senior hockey was in the 30s and 40s? Allan Cup was once an outstanding tournament. The calibre of hockey there was nearly as good as the Stanley Cup, and during the war years, many said it was better.

Back in the 30s and 40s, people could make as good of a living, if not better, with a "normal" job instead of in the NHL. They'd work their shift, play senior hockey. A lot of really good players chose the senior hockey route instead of the NHL because of that. Fewer games, less travel, more time with the family, make better money.

Comparing 30s and 40s senior hockey to modern junior hockey shows that you have a lot to learn.

The Gwinnett Gladiators are proud to select, from Moscow, Russia

Vyacheslav Starshinov, C
http://www.habsinsideout.com/vyacheslavstarshinov.jpg

http://www.chidlovski.com/personal/1972/yroster/ru08.htm
Vyacheslav Starshinov is recognized as one of the most successful Soviet centers. He was ranked first on the list of the top scoring Soviet leader for decades till Boris Mikhailov broke his scoring record. As a part of the famous Spartak's line where he played with [other players], Starshinov was famous for his goals scored in front of the net and on the rebounds. His trademarks were wicked shot on the net from any angle and a feisty character, his love to play physical and hard-hitting hockey. As a player of Moscow Spartak, Starshinov was one of the most valuable players in its championships of the 1960's. On both national and club level, he was a team leader and enjoyed an enormous respect among his teammates.

http://www.habsinsideout.com/2006/11/forum_asterisk_enshrined_by_ii/
Vyacheslav Starshinov was a dominant forward in the Soviet League for nearly four decades beginning in 1957. He captained Spartak Moscow for many seasons, leading the team to three national titles and totaling 405 goals in 540 games. Starshinov played in 10 IIHF World Championships and won nine straight gold medals from 1963 - 1971, and was named the Best Forward in 1965. Two Olympic golds capped his medal haul. Starshinov coached Spartak from 1972 - 1974 but then moved to Japan as a playing coach, winning two more championships. He ultimately returned home to close his playing career with Spartak and retired as the second highest scorer in Russian league history

IIHF Awards
Best Scorer (Goals) 1963, 1966
Best Forward 1965

USSR Awards
Best Scorer (Points) 1968
Best Scorer (Goals) 1967, 1968
All Stars 1963 - 1970

The Gwinnett Gladiators are proud to select, from Lutsk, Ukraine

Peter Bondra, RW
http://www.volny.cz/vico/images/peto.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Bondra
Over his career, he has been renowned for his exceptional skills. In 14 years with the Capitals, he has scored 472 goals and has racked up 353 assists in 961 games. He holds Capitals team records in goals (472), points (825), power-play goals (137), game-winning goals (73), short-handed goals (32) and hat tricks (19). With the Caps he appeared in five all-star games (1993, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999). In 1997 and 1999 Bondra won the Fastest Skater Competition on All-Star weekend. In 2004, the Capitals held a vote for fans to determine the top 30 players in franchise history to celebrate their 30th season in the league. Bondra finished second with 2,018 votes. The winner, Olaf Kolzig, beat him by a mere 20 votes.

For his goal-scoring ability, he is nicknamed "Bonzai" and occasionally "The Slovakian Sniper" (for instance, he once scored a goal by shooting the puck off the glass boards behind the goal, which in turn bounced off the back of the attending goalie and into the net). During the 1994-1995 (with 34 in a lockout-shortened season) and 1997-1998 seasons (with 52), he led the league in goals scored.

Sure are taking that run-and-gun scheme to heart aren't you, Rick.

Do you know how good senior hockey was in the 30s and 40s? Allan Cup was once an outstanding tournament. The calibre of hockey there was nearly as good as the Stanley Cup, and during the war years, many said it was better.

Back in the 30s and 40s, people could make as good of a living, if not better, with a "normal" job instead of in the NHL. They'd work their shift, play senior hockey. A lot of really good players chose the senior hockey route instead of the NHL because of that. Fewer games, less travel, more time with the family, make better money.

Comparing 30s and 40s senior hockey to modern junior hockey shows that you have a lot to learn.

Condescend much? The junior comment was for hyperbole's sake. Cripes.

The Allan Cup may have been a great tournament, but it never had the prestige of the Stanley Cup, and I certainly wouldn't use it as a major qualification for ATD status, as has been done here. Has there ever been any notable HOFer who made it primarily on Allan Cup competition? Really, it's a nice supplement to O'Connor's career, but not much more.

There may be something to that comment norrisnick made in the Lidstrom vs. Coffey thread about some people only seeing greatness in sepia tones. Legends like Howe, Gretzky, and Messier speak about Crosby's huge talent in the present tense, without any age or experience qualifiers, so I wonder why it's so difficult for hockey history enthusiasts to acknowledge it. Crosby isn't "going to be" an outstanding player, he is one, despite his age, and his accomplishments in that short two year span vs. elite competition is greater than any comparable center available when I chose him. Likening him to a "kiddie" pick is setting up a straw man, since there's been no genuine comparable for Crosby's prodigious career since Gretzky (or at least Lemieux).

I took him over Federko's steady but unspectacular production, Barry's consistent top 10 placings and 2 Cups (though it was close, Crosby had more individual success, Barry never placed higher than 5th in Hart voting and also had a HUGE advantage in teammates), Thornton's similar individual accolades but regular playoff letdowns, and over O'Connor's lone Hart, Allan Cup successes, and wartime Cup victories on a stacked Habs team. I knew Crosby's competition when I chose him, and I don't regret it.

Crosby has proven near-impossible to stop when he hasn't had a suitable outlet for his playmaking. What's he going to do with an experienced, cerebral, all-time sniper like Cook? He may not have been the right pick for every squad, but on a team that can afford to push Bill Cook to the second line, Crosby can be an ideal top 6 option. He certainly doesn't suffer in comparison to O'Connor.

Come on, BM ... trying to hang in and make a pick before bed.

Well, I'm off to bed.

Anyone around to take a PM ???

I'll be around JFF.

Left a short list with pitseleh.

I'll be awake again in 5 hours, if I need to make any adjustements.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to select one of the most underrated NHL goalies of all-time in a two time 1st team all-star who retired as the NHL's all-time wins leader

Harry "Apple Cheeks" Lumley (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?type=Player&mem=P198001&list=ByName#photo)

Known as "Apple Cheeks" due to his ruddy complexion and full face, Lumley made his NHL debut during the 1943-44 season. At 17, he was the youngest goalie in NHL history.

He still qualified as an NHL rookie when he backstopped the Wings to a seven-game loss in the 1944-45 Stanley Cup final and was the first teenager in NHL history to tend goal in a Stanley Cup final game. A fiery netminder, Lumley once pummeled Montreal's Ken Reardon with punches when he invaded his crease and also went toe-to-toe with Toronto counterpart Turk Broda in a 1947 brawl between the Wings and Leafs. "The back of your legs had no padding and Lumley had the blade of his stick carving his initials in the calves of the opposition," remembered Red Wings announcer Budd Lynch.

Lumley's sensational goaltending lifted Detroit to the 1949-50 Stanley Cup. Down 3-2 in the semifinals against Toronto, Lumley posted consecutive shutouts to get the Wings to the final. He added another zero in the finals, as Detroit captured the championship with a seven-game verdict over the Rangers. Lumley's clutch nature is best exemplified by his 4-1 record with one shutout and a 1.60 goals-against average in seventh games of playoff series.

Lumley's only slip-up in 1949-50 was an injury which allowed hot prospect Terry Sawchuk to suit up for seven games, enough to show Detroit GM Jack Adams that he would be the team's goalie of the future. In July, Lumley was shipped to Chicago as part of a nine-player deal. His best season as a Red Wing turned out to be Lumley's last. - Wings of Legend (http://redwings.nhl.com/team/app?service=page&page=NHLPage&bcid=his_wol_wol-harrylumley)

Lumley should be considered in every discussion regarding the top goalies in NHL history. Unfortunately, this just not the case.

Lumley remains as one of the most underrated players ever. Only when he was inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame in 1980 did the big man from Owen Sound get the recognition he deserved. - Ultimate Hockey

He helped the Red Wings win the Stanley Cup in 1950, but was then sent to the Chicago Blackhawks to make room for Tery Sawchuck. His numbers suffered during two years with a weak Chicago team, but on September 11, 1952, Lumley was dealt to Toronto, where he enjoyed the best years of his career. In his first season with the Maple Leafs, Lumley tied for the NHL lead with 10 shutouts. He won the Vezina Trophy after posting a carrer-best 1.86 goals-against average in 1953-54. His 13 shutouts that year were a modern NHL record until it was broken by Tony Esposito's 15 in 1969-70. Lumley missed out on a second Vezina Trophy victory in 195455 because Toronto allowed one more goal than Detroit.

At the time of his retirement, Lumley's 330 victories were the most in NHL history. - Hockey's Glory Days The 1950s and '60s

Johnny Bower's Commentary on Lumley
"now Harry was a goaltender! He was technically sound and was a great competitor. We all know about Billy Smith taking control of his crease, but in the old days there was nobody who would come around the net when Harry was in goal. He was a big and tough goalie who would move guys from the front of the net himself. He was arguably one of the best big-game goaltenders of his era..."

The fact that he was traded a couple of months after winning the Stanley Cup had more to do with Terry Sawchuk's arrival than any misgivings about Lumley's puckstopping abilities. Although Howe exalts Sawchuk's stature, he says it's quite possible that the Red Wings Cup run in the fifties could have been accomplished with Lumley as the number one goaltender. "He had quality," says Howe. - Without Fear Hockey's 50 Greatest Goaltenders

The Flin Flon Bombers select ultra-gritty C Dale Hunter.

The Flin Flon Bombers select ultra-gritty C Dale Hunter.
Fantastic pick. One of the biggest steals of the draft. It's too bad that people let their feelings about Hunter cloud their judgement of how good of a player, a competitor and a leader he really was. The one guy who consistently delivered for the late 80s/early-to-mid 90s Capitals in the playoffs.

First O'Reilly and now Hunter. The top fourth line guys are starting to go.

Nice Pick.Had him earmarked as my 3rd line center. O'Well back to the drawing board.

I waffled on taking him in the 11th or letting him go another round, actually, so I'm glad I snagged him while I did.

It's 3rd line center time now, for sure.

Fantastic pick. One of the biggest steals of the draft. It's too bad that people let their feelings about Hunter cloud their judgement of how good of a player, a competitor and a leader he really was. The one guy who consistently delivered for the late 80s/early-to-mid 90s Capitals in the playoffs.

First O'Reilly and now Hunter. The top fourth line guys are starting to go.
I wouldn't touch Hunter. To me he is a goon with limited talent & never led a team anywhere..

I wouldn't touch Hunter. To me he is a goon with limited talent & never led a team anywhere..
That "goon with limited talent" had 1,000 points. He's the charter member of the 1,000 point/3,000 PIM club. Players with limited talent don't score 1,000 points. He consistently delivered in the playoffs. It was his teammates who let him down. He only topped a point-per-game once, but he was usually good for 70-75 points per year.

He's one of those guys you love or hate. I'm a big Hunter fan. But I know a lot of people aren't Hunter fans. He's a fantastic competitor, tough as nails, and he has underrated hockey sense. Best fourth line centre in the draft.

That "goon with limited talent" had 1,000 points. He's the charter member of the 1,000 point/3,000 PIM club. Players with limited talent don't score 1,000 points. He consistently delivered in the playoffs. It was his teammates who let him down. He only topped a point-per-game once, but he was usually good for 70-75 points per year.

He's one of those guys you love or hate. I'm a big Hunter fan. But I know a lot of people aren't Hunter fans. He's a fantastic competitor, tough as nails, and he has underrated hockey sense. Best fourth line centre in the draft.
I guess I fall in the hate category, He would never be on my team. 1000 pts isn;t a big deal to me. To me he is a loose cannon with no self discipline - a cancer to a team.

I wouldn't touch Hunter. To me he is a goon with limited talent & never led a team anywhere..I've never been a fan of Dale Hunter because he was always the guy after a whistle stirring things up, but that doesn't change the fact that he could play.I guess I fall in the hate category, He would never be on my team. 1000 pts isn;t a big deal to me. To me he is a loose cannon with no self discipline - a cancer to a team.According to his former Quebec Nordiques coach Michel Bergeron, even though Hunter was nicknamed the "Nuisance" on ice (La Petite Peste in French), he was known to be "humble" in the locker-room and a sort of "gentleman", close to all the players. He was the "perfect player", always the first to arrive at the training sessions and ready to do all his best for the team.Also, I'd be interested in seeing how many players went to the box with him. As I said earlier, a lot of his penalty minutes came after the whistle, which drew considerable ire from the opponents.

That "goon with limited talent" had 1,000 points. He's the charter member of the 1,000 point/3,000 PIM club. Players with limited talent don't score 1,000 points. He consistently delivered in the playoffs. It was his teammates who let him down. He only topped a point-per-game once, but he was usually good for 70-75 points per year.

He's one of those guys you love or hate. I'm a big Hunter fan. But I know a lot of people aren't Hunter fans. He's a fantastic competitor, tough as nails, and he has underrated hockey sense. Best fourth line centre in the draft.I won't judge "limited talent", but anyone whose answer to XXXXXX XXXXXXX stealing your puck and scoring in your face is a cheap-shot has no place on the Black Hawks.

XXX XXXXXXX made maybe the most egregious mistake in hockey history, and he didn't respond by attempting to murder XXXX XXXXXXXXX back in '72.

The Flin Flon Bombers select ultra-gritty C Dale Hunter.

Son of a.....

I wanted Hunter... but I suppose there's no way I'd have got him after taking Duff... I'd have had to trade up.

Good pick. A rock-solid 70-point player and heart and soul playoff guy. I can't even think of an active player who is the next Dale Hunter.

I won't judge "limited talent", but anyone whose answer to XXXXXX XXXXXXX stealing your puck and scoring in your face is a cheap-shot has no place on the Black Hawks.

XXX XXXXXXX made maybe the most egregious mistake in hockey history, and he didn't respond by attempting to murder XXXX XXXXXXXXX back in '72.
It was a cheap shot, although an overrated one. The only reasons Hunter got 21 games was:

a) It occurred during the playoffs on national TV.
b) The league was emerging from the disciplinary nightmare of the Gil Stein suspension (players were suspended for non-game day practices, and fined an equivalent to the amount of games they missed). The league needed a scapegoat to prove they meant business. Hunter was the perfect instance.

I've seen many incidents worse. If Hunter did that in say, the 1996 playoffs, he gets a couple games. I thought Claude Lemieux's hit from behind in the 1996 Western Conference Final was much worse than Hunter's.

I'd gladly have a guy on my team who can generate offence, backcheck, grind and lead like Hunter. "Cancer" is the last word that should ever be used to describe him.

Dale Hunter is a goon plan & simple & should not be picked at this point in an all time draft. Shocked that Pitseleh did so as he usually makes such astute picks.

Son of a.....

I wanted Hunter... but I suppose there's no way I'd have got him after taking Duff... I'd have had to trade up.

Good pick. A rock-solid 70-point player and heart and soul playoff guy. I can't even think of an active player who is the next Dale Hunter.Seeing as how cottonking just likened a dirty hit to attempted murder, Steve Downie seems appropriate, albeit with less talent.

Dale Hunter is a goon plan & simple & should not be picked at this point in an all time draft. Shocked that Pitseleh did so as he usually makes such astute picks.

I was picking on behalf of JFF and Roger's Pancreas. ;)

My opinion is that Hunter is good fourth line center and at this point is a decent pick. At the same time though I've always felt that he's been slightly overvalued. I never understood why he went so far before a guy like Tkaczuk or even Bourne.

It was a cheap shot, although an overrated one. The only reasons Hunter got 21 games was:

a) It occurred during the playoffs on national TV.
b) The league was emerging from the disciplinary nightmare of the Gil Stein suspension (players were suspended for non-game day practices, and fined an equivalent to the amount of games they missed). The league needed a scapegoat to prove they meant business. Hunter was the perfect instance.

I've seen many incidents worse. If Hunter did that in say, the 1996 playoffs, he gets a couple games. I thought Claude Lemieux's hit from behind in the 1996 Western Conference Final was much worse than Hunter's.

I'd gladly have a guy on my team who can generate offence, backcheck, grind and lead like Hunter. "Cancer" is the last word that should ever be used to describe him.He's not a "cancer". He's a "dirty player". Claude Lemieux's hit was -- if nothing else -- during the run of play, and against someone who had (or had just touched or something) the puck.

Hunter was playing on national television ... and he KNEW the league was cracking down on that stufff ... and it was game 4 of a sweep series where his team was being killed ... and it was after the game had been decided ... and it was so long after Turgeon scored that you'd need a calendar to time it.

A tough player like Gordie Howe or XXXX XXXXX is a great pick. But I can't respect cheap-shot artists, and that assault was one of the worst in NHL history.Seeing as how cottonking just likened a dirty hit to attempted murder, Steve Downie seems appropriate, albeit with less talent.A bigger mistake in '72 justifies a bigger cheap-shot, no?

I was picking on behalf of JFF and Roger's Pancreas. ;)

My opinion is that Hunter is good fourth line center and at this point is a decent pick. At the same time though I've always felt that he's been slightly overvalued. I never understood why he went so far before a guy like Tkaczuk or even Bourne.
MY mistake. You are back in my good graces

He's not a "cancer". He's a "dirty player". Claude Lemieux's hit was -- if nothing else -- during the run of play, and against someone who had (or had just touched or something) the puck.

Hunter was playing on national television ... and he KNEW the league was cracking down on that stufff ... and it was game 4 of a sweep series where his team was being killed ... and it was after the game had been decided ... and it was so long after Turgeon scored that you'd need a calendar to time it.

A tough player like Gordie Howe or XXXX XXXXX is a great pick. But I can't respect cheap-shot artists, and that assault was one of the worst in NHL history.A bigger mistake in '72 justifies a bigger cheap-shot, no?
The Hunter/Turgeon incident was one of the worst never.

Looking to trade down pick #310, if anyone's interested.

Crosby isn't "going to be" an outstanding player, he is one, despite his age, and his accomplishments in that short two year span vs. elite competition are greater than any comparable center available when I chose him. Likening him to a "kiddie" pick is setting up a straw man, since there's been no genuine comparable for Crosby's prodigious career since Gretzky (or at least Lemieux).

I took him over Federko's steady but unspectacular production, Barry's consistent top 10 placings and 2 Cups (though it was close, Crosby had more individual success, Barry never placed higher than 5th in Hart voting and also had a HUGE advantage in teammates), Thornton's similar individual accolades but regular playoff letdowns, and over O'Connor's lone Hart, Allan Cup successes, and wartime Cup victories on a stacked Habs team. I knew Crosby's competition when I chose him, and I don't regret it.

Crosby has proven near-impossible to stop when he hasn't had a suitable outlet for his playmaking. What's he going to do with an experienced, cerebral, all-time sniper like Cook? He may not have been the right pick for every squad, but on a team that can afford to push Bill Cook to the second line, Crosby can be an ideal top 6 option. He certainly doesn't suffer in comparison to O'Connor.

i'm not a thornton fan at all, but how are crosby's accomplishments greater than thornton's?

thornton: 2006--hart, art ross, pearson finalist (i don't remember if he was 3rd or 2nd); 2003--4th in hart, 3rd in scoring; 2007--5th in hart, 2nd in scoring

crosby: 2007--hart, art ross, pearson; 2006--6th in scoring

last season thornton was only 6 points behind crosby in scoring (in a tougher defensive conference)
i also think thornton is better defensively.

as you said in your previous post about o'connor, hart voting was based much more on value to his team, so barry's 5th place finish can't be compared to crosby's win. (although i do think crosby's 07 regular season was better than barry's 37 regular season.)

He's not a "cancer". He's a "dirty player". Claude Lemieux's hit was -- if nothing else -- during the run of play, and against someone who had (or had just touched or something) the puck.

Hunter was playing on national television ... and he KNEW the league was cracking down on that stufff ... and it was game 4 of a sweep series where his team was being killed ... and it was after the game had been decided ... and it was so long after Turgeon scored that you'd need a calendar to time it.

A tough player like Gordie Howe or XXXX XXXXX is a great pick. But I can't respect cheap-shot artists, and that assault was one of the worst in NHL history.A bigger mistake in '72 justifies a bigger cheap-shot, no?
Just to clarify, the Hunter hit was in Game 6, not Game 4. A series-ending loss, score was 5-3 at the time, Hunter knew it was over. But it wasn't a four-game sweep. Doesn't change the circumstances. Doesn't justify it. And Hunter's "I didn't know he had scored" comment made Hunter look like a cheap-shot artist and a schmuck.

Lemieux's cheap shot was directly from behind, knocking a player head-first into the boards in a play that could have very easily broken the victim's neck. Hunter's shot was from the side and sent his victim shoulder-first into the boards.

Leaf Lander selects Stanley Cup and World Cup winning goaltender Mike Richter.

Ty sir

Mike Richter was very consistent goalie who was a tremendously-fit athlete. Mike had good lateral movement, and played the angles very well by being very agressive coming out of the net to trim angles. Excellent footwork, lightning quick, and very acrobatic.His concentration was second to none, and his one on one ability, especially on clear cut breakaways, were other worldly. There may have been no goalie in history who was better on breakaways

"There aren't too many you'd rather have in goal with the Cup on the line." (ESPN Hockey 96, p. 67)


"The Rangers' most obvious strength is in goal, where they have reliable Richter, who has turned into superman at crucial times in his career - the 1994 playoffs, the World Cup, the 1997 playoffs." (The Hockey News 1997-98 Yearbook, p. 139)

A lifelong Ranger who will always be remembered as the goalie who stoned Canada during the 1996 World Cup. Richter can be as hot as any other netminder alive

Mike Richter - This saving grace may be the single most important player in USA Hockey history. He was the brick wall Team USA leaned on time and time again.

He played 666 career nhl games getting 301 wins and 258 losses World Cup All-Star Team (1996) Named World Cup MVP (1996) Played in NHL All-Star Game (1992, 1994, 2000) 1 Stanley cup 1994.

Lemieux's cheap shot was directly from behind, knocking a player head-first into the boards in a play that could have very easily broken the victim's neck. Hunter's shot was from the side and sent his victim shoulder-first into the boards.
Hunter's was still worse. Lemieux's cheap shot was a dirty disgusting play. Hunter's had nothing to do with hockey and was assault. It wasn't a cheap shot at all, it was assault. The play is very clearly dead.

I would say that in the war years, the hockey was better in the Allan Cup. Probably doesn't make it more prestigious than the Stanley Cup. But the hockey was better, with so many icons playing senior hockey. People just don't realize how good the Allan Cup competition was until after the war, just like people don't realize how good those western Canadian pro leagues were. (Equal or superior to the NHL until the last western league folded). Four trips to the 30s/40s Allan Cup is much more than just a compliment to a career.

I'm a big Crosby fan, and I absolutely think Crosby is an outstanding player. It's not just a skill thing; he has a work ethic and a desire to improve that will keep him among the game's elite. In a couple years, he will warrant a selection in the top 200, and one day, he'll warrant a top 50 pick. I just look at the draft, and since it's an all-time draft, I have a hard time picking a guy with two years under his belt, when there are so many great options out there, especially at centre.

I'd have a hard time picking Thornton, too, even though he's been in the league for 10 years. I just have a hard time picking a player who entered the league after I entered university. Minor league draft I wouldn't even think about it. (I picked Jay Bouwmeester in the last minor league draft).

You're right about Thornton's lack of playoff brilliance when it comes to the Thornton vs. Crosby debate. Crosby hasn't had the chance. He was on a team with a shoddy defence. (And still has a shoddy defence). Thornton has had chances. Hasn't delivered. On the flip side, there are few scoring centres with Thornton's size, strength and physical dimension.

I would have gone with Marty Berry myself. A first team all-star. Two time Cup champion. Great work ethic, marvellous hockey sense. Deserves to wear a letter. Good size, but not overly physical. A poor man's Syl Apps Sr., if you will. O'Connor was our top-rated centre available. (I actually would have Federko and Barry ahead of him, but I'd take O'Connor ahead of Crosby or Thornton. Can't top that Athlete of the Year Award).

BTW, you might want to work on your hyperbole writings.

Condescend much? The junior comment was for hyperbole's sake. Cripes.

The Allan Cup may have been a great tournament, but it never had the prestige of the Stanley Cup, and I certainly wouldn't use it as a major qualification for ATD status, as has been done here. Has there ever been any notable HOFer who made it primarily on Allan Cup competition? Really, it's a nice supplement to O'Connor's career, but not much more.

There may be something to that comment norrisnick made in the Lidstrom vs. Coffey thread about some people only seeing greatness in sepia tones. Legends like Howe, Gretzky, and Messier speak about Crosby's huge talent in the present tense, without any age or experience qualifiers, so I wonder why it's so difficult for hockey history enthusiasts to acknowledge it. Crosby isn't "going to be" an outstanding player, he is one, despite his age, and his accomplishments in that short two year span vs. elite competition is greater than any comparable center available when I chose him. Likening him to a "kiddie" pick is setting up a straw man, since there's been no genuine comparable for Crosby's prodigious career since Gretzky (or at least Lemieux).

I took him over Federko's steady but unspectacular production, Barry's consistent top 10 placings and 2 Cups (though it was close, Crosby had more individual success, Barry never placed higher than 5th in Hart voting and also had a HUGE advantage in teammates), Thornton's similar individual accolades but regular playoff letdowns, and over O'Connor's lone Hart, Allan Cup successes, and wartime Cup victories on a stacked Habs team. I knew Crosby's competition when I chose him, and I don't regret it.

Crosby has proven near-impossible to stop when he hasn't had a suitable outlet for his playmaking. What's he going to do with an experienced, cerebral, all-time sniper like Cook? He may not have been the right pick for every squad, but on a team that can afford to push Bill Cook to the second line, Crosby can be an ideal top 6 option. He certainly doesn't suffer in comparison to O'Connor.

I chose Ramage for a few reasons. He's a heart-and-soul kind of player, with a great work ethic. He was large, strong and tough. He had a great hip-check and was willing to drop the gloves to protect his teammates. Ramage didn't back down to anybody and consistently gave his smaller teammates room to maneuvre. And when pesty teammates like Fleury and Gilmour started trouble--Ramage was usually the one to finish it off with his fists or with his hipcheck.

He will be able to give my (admittedly small) forwards more room to maneuver. Considering my divisional opponents--some of the top forwards include Howe, Richard, Lindsay, Cook, Stewart, Lindros and Neely--Ramage's size and physical play are even more valuable. Ramage's size and toughness will allow him to neutralize those threats, while a small, non-physical defenseman like Quackenbush would be less effective in my division.

Ramage also stepped his game up during the playoffs. Ramage was the Flames' top defensive defenseman, and their best penalty killer, during the '89 playoffs. He finished in the top ten in defensemen scoring three times in the playoffs. He also provided leadership and solid, dependable depth on the '93 Habs, even though he was way past his prime.

His defensive game is underrated. He logged a huge amount of time on the penalty kill. He ranked 3rd overall in PK ice time during the 1980s, ahead of players like Langway, Bourque, McCrimmon, Potvin, Morrow, etc.

Ramage is not the best available but 1) he suits my teams' needs and 2) I think some of the better defensemen will be around for a while.

The St Louis Eagles are pleased to select swedish defensemen Lennart Svedberg.

Come on dd...make your pick, so I can make mine...

The Gwinnett Gladiators are proud to select, from Moscow, Russia

Vyacheslav Starshinov, C
http://www.habsinsideout.com/vyacheslavstarshinov.jpg

http://www.chidlovski.com/personal/1972/yroster/ru08.htm


http://www.habsinsideout.com/2006/11/forum_asterisk_enshrined_by_ii/


IIHF Awards
Best Scorer (Goals) 1963, 1966
Best Forward 1965

USSR Awards
Best Scorer (Points) 1968
Best Scorer (Goals) 1967, 1968
All Stars 1963 - 1970

)&/!!)=($§)$ expletive deleted
I thought for sure I would get him. Dammit.

)&/!!)=($§)$ expletive deleted
I thought for sure I would get him. Dammit.

I strongly considered him for the 2nd line center spot.

The Plains are tickled to be able to finish off their top 6 by selecting a player who finished top 10 in NHL scoring 3 times, a hard-working defensive specialist (essential, given that Howe and Richard are both in the division), innovator of the drop pass, and our perfect complementary LWer...

Bun Cook

http://www.newyorkrangers.com/images/featurepics150200/Cook_Bun_action.jpg

FYI, we now reserve the right to call our 2nd unit the "Wunder Bread Line".

Winnipeg take C Mike Peca and D Barclay Plager.

The Plains are tickled to be able to finish off their top 6 by selecting a player who finished top 10 in NHL scoring 3 times, a hard-working defensive specialist (essential, given that Howe and Richard are both in the division), innovator of the drop pass, and our perfect complementary LWer...

Bun Cook

http://www.newyorkrangers.com/images/featurepics150200/Cook_Bun_action.jpg

FYI, we now reserve the right to call our 2nd unit the "Wunder Bread Line".

There goes the other player I was considering when I picked Litzenberger. I figured you'd take him to play with his brother if I hadn't.

Having spent a year in Owen Sound I heard a fair amount about Harry Lumley. Terrific goalie and great guy from what I've heard.

It's not so much that Federko was a major steal (my opinion about my team's steals doesn't matter - it's what you all think that counts), it's that besides maybe Frank Foyston, Bernie was the last scoringline center available whose career really stands up to scrutiny, and he was taken after a couple of guys whose careers/peaks are so short they get seriously knocked for it.

It would be foolish for me to claim that Bernie Federko was a superior talent to Crosby or even Thornton, but I'll take his 101 career playoff points in 91 games on rotten teams and his regular appearances among the top 10 league scorers over any player who's peak performance lasted (or has lasted) no more than 2-3 seasons.

As to the "steady but unspectacular" charge, I would say that placing 10th in league scoring in 79-80 and a mere ten points behind the great Brian Trottier on a team that featured Mike Zuke's 64 points as the 2nd leading total is spectacular. Might having a different Mike than Zuke help carry the load over the course of a season account for another ten points? And again in 80-81, Federko actually beat Trottier in scoring for the season with the great Wayne Babych as his principal help, then went and put up 8-10-18 in 11 playoff games.

Bernie Federko's career absolutely was spectacular. He produced at a consistently elite level on godawful teams facing opposing checking lines on every shift, turned in an absolutely sparkling playoff resume and was the first player in NHL history to produce ten consecutive 50 assist seasons. He was steadily spectacular. Even without taking into account his playoff resume or his "bad team handicap" (looking at his accomplishments in a vacuum, then), Federko's five top-10 scoring and seven top-10 assists finishes make him a solid value where he was picked in this draft.

I won't say that Federko was a steal - that is up to the other GMs to decide - but I will say that I think he was well worth the pick even if extenuating circumstances are ignored and considerably better than the other options that were left. How good might Federko have been on a winning team? Are Nalyd and I the only GMs who take team strength into account whilst evaluating a player's scoring record?

- a quick note on Dale Hunter: he was a pretty good hockey player and serves his purpose, but man, there are still some great players left out there right now. It's not that I wouldn't pick Hunter, it's that I'm not sure I'd pick him right now.

Very little introduction required here, as his results speak for themselves. But naturally, I'll give one anyway. ;)

His impressive winning record aside, the Plains decided this was the man to direct their team because of his reputation as a player's coach who was tough but fair, his history of success with Lach and enigmatic French right wingers, and his ability when required to cool the hottest of tempers.

Our 8 time Stanley Cup winning coach:

Toe Blake

There goes the other player I was considering when I picked Litzenberger. I figured you'd take him to play with his brother if I hadn't.

Yeah, I pretty much had to, though there was one other I was seriously considering.

I think Peter Bondra is a very nice pick in the 12th round. Yes, he's one-dimensional, but that one dimension is quite impressive and on a line with Bill Cowley and a team with Leetch/Pratt/Sologubov anchoring the defense, Bondra will see a lot of juicy feeds/breakout passes.

Nalyd and I obviously preferred Dillon to Bondra, mainly because of Cecil's postseason heroics and the fact that he plays a very complete game, but Bondra was our second choice for a 2nd line right winger in the 10th/11th. The guy won two goalscoring crowns, placed in the top-5 twice more and in the top-10 twice more, and on some really bad Caps teams. If you dig into Bondra's scoring record (I have...we weren't sure of getting Dillon and were preparing to take Bondra), you'll find that he led the entire league in goals over a four year period from 94-98 and scored an almost unheard of percentage of his team's goals during that same span (23% if memory serves).

Yes, I'm looking at the record again...there was only one other Caps player - one! - who so much as broke twenty goals in any of Bondra's truly dominant seasons. Peter was the definition of a one-man show in Washington and deserves extra credit for it. He was also a good penalty killer, not so much because of superior defensive instincts, but because opposing defensemen were scared to take risks with one of the fastest players and best breakaway scorers in league history on the ice. Not small, either - Bondra's a solid 6'1" 200 lbs and could fight his way through high traffic areas during his prime.

I think it's a very solid pick, Rick. Some of those Foster Hewitt games are going to look like speed-skating competitions. Incidentally, I believe Peter Bondra is the correct answer to the trivia question "Name me a better skater than Mike Modano since 1990 who hasn't banged Anna Kournikova", though that perhaps makes an unrealistically charitable assumption about Ms. Kournikova's chastity.

Hmmm...looking over Oakland's roster for a moment, I just realized that the Seals have yet to draft a single French-Canadian player. We've already got a couple of great Ukranians (Gretzky and Federko), an Irishman (Clancy), a couple of Europeans (Holocek and Vasiliev), a Scot (Bathgate), a half-Scot/half-Japanese guy (Kariya), an American (Dillon) and a few Ontarian Anglos (Horner, Cameron and Howe), but not one single francophone on the team.

Considering how many of the all-time greats are French-Canadian, it's almost hard to get eleven rounds deep with an all-time team (nevermind a good one) and not have a single one. Even Wisent's team has got more Quebecois than the Seals. Unreal.

- oh, and I'm 99% certain I've got JFF/Pancreas' next pick nailed. We shall see.

My thoughts on Crosby are that he's obviously a generational talent - no one questions that - but he's a generational talent who's played in the NHL for two seasons. It's not seeing greatness in sepia tones to knock him down a peg or three for that. I'm the guy who just praised Peter Bondra as one of the greatest breakaway goal-scorers in history (at least at his peak) because I think it's true. Sure, we can project Crosby's career over the next twenty years and annoint him a hall of famer and 1st round pick right now, but then wouldn't we have done the same with Lindros had we only looked at his first two pro seasons?

It is not Gretzky or Lemieux to whom Crosby most recently compares, but, in fact, Eric Lindros - and here we see the potential downside to generational talent. Lindros' career was still pretty good, but it was considerably less impressive than it should have been given his abilities, and so, too, might Crosby's be.

As amazing a player as Sid is today, I just can't justify taking him over guys like Barry or Federko who, although never on Crosby's current level, were great players for an entire decade. I can't speak for the other GMs in the draft, but I'm not drafting on potential here. I don't pencil in Lidstrom for maybe another couple of Norris trophies and adjust his value accordingly. I'm not going to be disappointed if Paul Kariya (who is still a good player) retires tomorrow because I drafted him only for what he's already done.

To me a player is only as good as the seasons he's played, not the seasons he may play. The future, even for a stud like Crosby, is entirely too uncertain for me to get into that kind of speculation. If I had to put an over/under on where Crosby will deserve to be chosen after all is said and done, I'd guess he falls in the late 1st/early 2nd round. I absolutely believe he is that good. If you're drafting on speculation, maybe the first two years of that kind of career is worth a 9th round pick, I dunno, but to me he's worth no more than the sum total of his accomplishments from 2005 to 2007.

There are many questions of philosophy when evaluating players in this setting. The "great what if" that surrounds Babe Siebert's career and his common use as a defenseman in this format is another one of these. In the end, I think the dust-up over Crosby has a lot less to do with any disagreement over his present greatness and a lot more to do with how we believe players ought to be evaluated.

Although I would count among the conservatives on most issues of "projection", I seem to be one of the guys who looks most closely at strength of team/line/league when evaluating players, so I'm not completely innocent, myself, of projecting players to do something other than what they actually did (good or bad - it's one of the reasons I knock Clark Gillies) in this setting. I would argue, of course, that adjusting a player's rating up or down based on his teammates in seasons he's actually played is quite different from projecting future performance, but others may disagree. In the end, every GM has his own point of view and it all comes out in the wash of the playoffs, I suppose.

Dale Hunter is a goon plain & simple
No. Not so simply. Certainly not just a goon.

He was loved by fans and teammates alike and a captain for not one, not two, but five consecutive seasons, including a run to the stanley cup finals.

He was 'goonish' in the same way that Messier was (ref not looking? Mess straight arms a guy or spears a guy down), though to a nastier degree at times. But he wasn't just a goon. He was a skilled player for the first 13 of his 18 or so seasons.

I have been a longterm Capitals fan (gawd how i have hated the pens over the years) so I have been purvy to many appreciative conversations about Hunter. Fans of other teams have HATED him. Understandably. But to say he is a cancer? That is so wrong it ain't funny. He is all about the team in a warrior's mold. Loved the guy.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to select one of the most underrated NHL goalies of all-time in a two time 1st team all-star who retired as the NHL's all-time wins leader

Harry "Apple Cheeks" Lumley (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/LegendsMember.jsp?type=Player&mem=P198001&list=ByName#photo)

- Wings of Legend (http://redwings.nhl.com/team/app?service=page&page=NHLPage&bcid=his_wol_wol-harrylumley)

- Ultimate Hockey

- Hockey's Glory Days The 1950s and '60s

- Without Fear Hockey's 50 Greatest Goaltenders

There goes my backup goaltender.

Fantastic pick. One of the biggest steals of the draft. It's too bad that people let their feelings about Hunter cloud their judgement of how good of a player, a competitor and a leader he really was. The one guy who consistently delivered for the late 80s/early-to-mid 90s Capitals in the playoffs.

First O'Reilly and now Hunter. The top fourth line guys are starting to go.

He was more a swashbuckler than a hockey player, and MUCH more a swashbuckler than a goon, enforcer, or whatever you call them. This is a guy that NEVER dropped his stick.

I wouldn't touch Hunter. To me he is a goon with limited talent & never led a team anywhere..

He can have some use, but saying he's the best 4th line center of the draft is a bit like saying Rod Langway is the best offensive D-Men who wore CH.

Let's say he's a swashbuckler with some talent that never led a team anywhere.

The St Louis Eagles are pleased to select swedish defensemen Lennart Svedberg.

Hey! One of my gus making a BIIG leap!!!

I made my selection but it seems to have disappeared. i am on my cell. Can anyone see my last pick??

I made my selection but it seems to have disappeared. i am on my cell. Can anyone see my last pick??

Nope....send it again?

The St Louis Eagles are pleased to select C Jeremy Roenick.

JFF sent me a list last night. The Flin Flon Bombers select LW John Leclair.

BTW, you might want to work on your hyperbole writings.

But those emoticons are so obvious. :sarcasm:

I would say that in the war years, the hockey was better in the Allan Cup. Probably doesn't make it more prestigious than the Stanley Cup. But the hockey was better, with so many icons playing senior hockey. People just don't realize how good the Allan Cup competition was until after the war, just like people don't realize how good those western Canadian pro leagues were. (Equal or superior to the NHL until the last western league folded). Four trips to the 30s/40s Allan Cup is much more than just a compliment to a career.

I'd have to see some contemporary accounts and further evidence of this. Saying that senior hockey was great at the time is one thing, but stating that the Allan Cup was superior to the Stanley Cup is quite another.

The WHL/WCHL had the benefit of being one unified league that folded in one year, and the proof of their stars being in top form at the time can be easily gauged by looking at their place in the NHL scoring leaders for the following 2 years. And I think we can all agree that players aren't generally going to be putting forth the same time or "do-or-die" effort in a league where they already have a steady income from a regular job, no matter what the trophy.

I'm a big Crosby fan, and I absolutely think Crosby is an outstanding player. It's not just a skill thing; he has a work ethic and a desire to improve that will keep him among the game's elite. In a couple years, he will warrant a selection in the top 200, and one day, he'll warrant a top 50 pick. I just look at the draft, and since it's an all-time draft, I have a hard time picking a guy with two years under his belt, when there are so many great options out there, especially at centre.

I'd have a hard time picking Thornton, too, even though he's been in the league for 10 years. I just have a hard time picking a player who entered the league after I entered university. Minor league draft I wouldn't even think about it. (I picked Jay Bouwmeester in the last minor league draft).

I have no such qualms. I see talent, I see accolades, I judge what the player had to work with, I make my selection.

You're right about Thornton's lack of playoff brilliance when it comes to the Thornton vs. Crosby debate. Crosby hasn't had the chance. He was on a team with a shoddy defence. (And still has a shoddy defence). Thornton has had chances. Hasn't delivered. On the flip side, there are few scoring centres with Thornton's size, strength and physical dimension.

Well, Crosby had his chance, and he played superbly...I'd say he was the best player in the series. Nobody else but #### and Roberts bothered to show up, though (goalie) did what he could.

I would have gone with Marty Berry myself. A first team all-star. Two time Cup champion. Great work ethic, marvellous hockey sense. Deserves to wear a letter. Good size, but not overly physical. A poor man's Syl Apps Sr., if you will. O'Connor was our top-rated centre available. (I actually would have Federko and Barry ahead of him, but I'd take O'Connor ahead of Crosby or Thornton. Can't top that Athlete of the Year Award).

I thought hard about Barry, but like I said, he didn't have the same sort of peak as Crosby, and he had an almost unfair advantage in teammates to help him along. I wouldn't grudge anyone picking him there, because he warrants it, but he wasn't my choice.

And I like O'Connor where you got him too (though you probably wouldn't guess it). But I'd still take Crosby ahead of him. :dunno:

i'm not a thornton fan at all, but how are crosby's accomplishments greater than thornton's?

thornton: 2006--hart, art ross, pearson finalist (i don't remember if he was 3rd or 2nd); 2003--4th in hart, 3rd in scoring; 2007--5th in hart, 2nd in scoring

crosby: 2007--hart, art ross, pearson; 2006--6th in scoring

last season thornton was only 6 points behind crosby in scoring (in a tougher defensive conference)
i also think thornton is better defensively.

as you said in your previous post about o'connor, hart voting was based much more on value to his team, so barry's 5th place finish can't be compared to crosby's win. (although i do think crosby's 07 regular season was better than barry's 37 regular season.)

Ah, I never said Crosby had greater accomplishments, I said similar. And to be honest, Thornton gets the nod on straight accolades.

But he also had some help on his wings that Crosby didn't, and has a habit of coming down with a terminal case of drag ass when the playoffs roll around, which he's only beginning to turn around.

- We gotta learn how people perceive Jacques Lemaire will be able to coach a, relatively speaking, aggressive team('cause I figure this is how this squad will be in the end), and a, relatively speaking, not very skilled team, offensively-speaking (raw skill isn't Murphy's priority, and everybody is well aware of this). I'm of the few that thinks the Devils teams were actually much more talented that everyone made them to be at the time. They have the making of a great Lemaire team with Gainey, Plante, and obviously, Lemaire himself.

lol, it came pretty evident by the 11th round that this team isn't going to be a high flying bunch (actually after rd 3 it was becoming clear)

I think Lemaire became a must have for coach of this team and without him I'd be sunk. I've always liked hard to play against teams and hopefully with Lemaire at the helm the Oilers will be redicously hard to play against. They should have the most disciplined defensive system of the draft to say the least.

Count me in as a Dale Hunter detracter as well, but he does generate controversy, probably the most of any player selected here. For myself I just can't get over the assault on Turgeon. At the time Turgeon was playing the best hockey of his career and was dominating that series. I don't think he was ever the same player after that and all thanks to a chicken**** play on Hunters behalf.

Ummm, has Turgeon been selected yet? Hard to talk about Hunter without mentioning him....oops.

Ah, I never said Crosby had greater accomplishments, I said similar. And to be honest, Thornton gets the nod on straight accolades.

But he also had some help on his wings that Crosby didn't, and has a habit of coming down with a terminal case of drag ass when the playoffs roll around, which he's only beginning to turn around.

i guess i misunderstood this:

his accomplishments in that short two year span vs. elite competition are greater than any comparable center available when I chose him.

My thoughts on Crosby are that he's obviously a generational talent - no one questions that - but he's a generational talent who's played in the NHL for two seasons. It's not seeing greatness in sepia tones to knock him down a peg or three for that. I'm the guy who just praised Peter Bondra as one of the greatest breakaway goal-scorers in history (at least at his peak) because I think it's true. Sure, we can project Crosby's career over the next twenty years and annoint him a hall of famer and 1st round pick right now, but then wouldn't we have done the same with Lindros had we only looked at his first two pro seasons?

It is not Gretzky or Lemieux to whom Crosby most recently compares, but, in fact, Eric Lindros - and here we see the potential downside to generational talent. Lindros' career was still pretty good, but it was considerably less impressive than it should have been given his abilities, and so, too, might Crosby's be.

The problems here are that, first, I have explicitly stated that I am taking Crosby based on what he's already done and not what he's going to do, and second, that Eric Lindros' early career is not an adequate parallel to Crosby's, even if his hype was.

Crosby was the leading scorer on his team by considerable margins during both seasons, while Lindros was 3rd and 2nd. Attribute this partially to injuries for Lindros if you like, but that's not going to help his draft stock either. Regardless, nobody's going to suggest that having a prime Recchi flanking you is nearly the same as a 38 year old Recchi.

Crosby did finish 6th in league scoring one year, and won the Art Ross in the other. Lindros was 67th and tied for 11th.

Crosby did win the Hart Trophy.

Crosby did win the Pearson Trophy.

Crosby did lead his team to the 3rd best single-season improvement in league history, the playoffs for the first time in 5 years, and once there, led the Pens in post-season scoring too. Lindros, uh, didn't.

I'm comfortable in selecting Crosby where I did if he retired today, or ended up having a slow, steady decline. He's accomplished plenty in a tiny window, and it's got nothing to do with projection.

As amazing a player as Sid is today, I just can't justify taking him over guys like Barry or Federko who, although never on Crosby's current level, were great players for an entire decade. I can't speak for the other GMs in the draft, but I'm not drafting on potential here. I don't pencil in Lidstrom for maybe another couple of Norris trophies and adjust his value accordingly. I'm not going to be disappointed if Paul Kariya (who is still a good player) retires tomorrow because I drafted him only for what he's already done.

Again, not projection. Federko's a nice pick, but I wanted more gamebreaking "oomph", so I picked a player who had a much higher peak for a much shorter time. And putting him between 2 like-minded, creative, responsible, and immensely talented wingers like the Cooks will no doubt have nothing but a positive effect on a human sponge like Sid.

To me a player is only as good as the seasons he's played, not the seasons he may play. The future, even for a stud like Crosby, is entirely too uncertain for me to get into that kind of speculation. If I had to put an over/under on where Crosby will deserve to be chosen after all is said and done, I'd guess he falls in the late 1st/early 2nd round. I absolutely believe he is that good. If you're drafting on speculation, maybe the first two years of that kind of career is worth a 9th round pick, I dunno, but to me he's worth no more than the sum total of his accomplishments from 2005 to 2007.

That's right, he's not. But he's worth no less, either.

If we were to draft on projection, "worth a late 1st/early 2nd round pick" would be an understatement.

Although I would count among the conservatives on most issues of "projection", I seem to be one of the guys who looks most closely at strength of team/line/league when evaluating players, so I'm not completely innocent, myself, of projecting players to do something other than what they actually did (good or bad - it's one of the reasons I knock Clark Gillies) in this setting. I would argue, of course, that adjusting a player's rating up or down based on his teammates in seasons he's actually played is quite different from projecting future performance, but others may disagree. In the end, every GM has his own point of view and it all comes out in the wash of the playoffs, I suppose.

You wouldn't be arguing with me, because I agree completely.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to welcome an ultimate team player on C/LW "Captain Kirk"

Kirk Muller (http://www.hockeydraftcentral.com/1984/84002.html)

In 1983-84, the 18-year-old Muller was again having a sensational offensive year with the Platers in the Ontario Hockey League, and finished with 94 points despite playing in just 49 games. The balance of his year was spent with the Canadian National Team, where he suited up for 15 pre-Olympic games. Muller then dressed for all six of Canada's Olympic contests in Sarajevo, scoring two goals and an assist but the team returned home disappointed, failing to medal.

Although Muller still had two years of junior eligibility remaining, it was clear to the Guelph Platers that they were not going to have their star captain back in the lineup. Muller easily made the New Jersey Devils roster and in his rookie season appeared in all 80 games, recording 54 points on a talent-depleted team where he had very little offensive support. Muller was the model of consistency, not only steadily improving his offensive statistics in each of his first four years in New Jersey, but he proved to be extremely resilient, missing just four games in seven seasons with the team. His best offensive year came in 1987-88 when he had 94 points.

In September, 1991 Muller was part of a huge trade that had him and goalie Roland Melanson traded to the Montreal Canadiens in exchange for Stephane Richer and Tom Chorske. Although initially shocked at being traded, Muller was quoted as saying "It was time for a change. It's nice to be in the midst of a good hockey atmosphere." Muller quickly established himself as the team leader on and off the ice and he was named captain of the Canadiens. During his second year in Montreal in 1992-93, Muller matched his career high with 94 points and, along with goalie Patrick Roy and winger John LeClair guided the Habs to an unexpected Stanley Cup championship, defeating Wayne Gretzky and the Los Angeles Kings in five games. - Legends of Hockey Bio (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/SearchPlayer.jsp?player=11153)

Muller mixes physical and finesse skills to excellent results, scoring well and bashing bodies when the opportunity presents itself. He led all Montreal scorers during his first year with the Canadiens (36 goals, 41 assists), earning the respect of teammates and fans. He was the Habs scoring leader again last year. His eye-hand coordination is unparalleled, enabling him to deflect shots better than almost anyone in the NHL. - Hockey Almanac 1993-94

Perhaps the best-coordinated player in the NHL, Muller possesses uncanny hand-eye coordination. He has scored goals by batting the puck out of midair. His foot work is superb, his skating great, and his work ethic nearly unmatched in the league. Tough he's far from the flashiest player, there isn't an ounce of quit in him. - Hockey Almanac 1994-95

One of the better defensive forwards in the league. A tremendously hard worker, Muller is a natural team leader. Excellent face-off man and a great penalty killer. - The Sports Forecaster Hockey '97-98

i guess i misunderstood this:

Caught in my words. I only looked at my comment about Thornton and Crosby having similar accolades. When you write as much as I do, it's hard to keep up.

Anyway, cheerfully withdrawn. Thornton has the edge in individual accolades, but other factors like ATD chemistry, playoff performance, work ethic, and inferior linemates led me to select Crosby instead.

Better? :)

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to welcome an ultimate team player on C/LW "Captain Kirk"

Kirk Muller (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/SearchPlayer.jsp?player=11153)
Magnificent pick. One of my all-time favourites. Best-suited to a fourth line role, but Halifax was giving him a long look for our two-way line, and even our second line LW role. A candidate to wear an A. Not the BPA, but likely the MVPA. (Most valuable player available).

Every team needs a Muller.

The Gwinnett Gladiators are proud to select, from Sarnia, Ontario, the Little Ball of Hate

Pat Verbeek, RW
http://www.whalershockey.com/whalermania/images/photos/photoacopy1994verbeek.jpg

After filling our roster with offensively talented players, the braintrust behind the Gladiators figured it was time to add some sandpaper. As a Bruin fan I absolutely loathed Verbeek. He was a constant thorn in our sides. He would find a way to get under our skin and we'd end up taking stupid penalties when he was on the ice. Ergo, what better player to have on an ATD 3rd line. A player with enough talent to score 40, a great PK'r and solid hitter for his size. A bugger all around.

Verbeek was selected 43rd overall by the New Jersey Devils in the 1982 NHL Entry Draft. He helped the Devils to their first playoff berth in the 1987-88 season, when he scored a club record 46 goals during the regular season.

After the 1988-89 season, the Devils traded him to the Hartford Whalers (now the Carolina Hurricanes). In his first season, he led the team in goal scoring and in his second he was named team MVP. In 1991, he made the All-Star team for the first time and in the following season, Verbeek was named the Whalers captain. After a short stint with the Rangers, he signed with the Dallas Stars as a free agent, where he won his first Stanley Cup in 1999.

During the 1999-2000 season, he signed with the Detroit Red Wings. In Detroit, he passed the 1,000-point mark, scored his 500th goal, and moved into the top 25 in career goal scoring before returning to Dallas for his final NHL season in 2001-02.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to welcome an ultimate team player on C/LW "Captain Kirk"


Not if your team is the Islanders. Heyooooooooo.

Caught in my words. I only looked at my comment about Thornton and Crosby having similar accolades. When you write as much as I do, it's hard to keep up.

Anyway, cheerfully withdrawn. Thornton has the edge in individual accolades, but other factors like ATD chemistry, playoff performance, work ethic, and inferior linemates led me to select Crosby instead.

Better? :)

i'd probably rather have crosby.

The New Jersey Devils are pleased to add the leading playoff scorer in both of the Flyers Stanley Cup wins

Rick MacLeish (http://www.hockeydraftcentral.com/1970/70004.html)

NHL AWARDS AND HONORS
All-Star Game: 1976, 1977, 1980
Philadelphia Flyers Hall of Fame: Inducted 1990
100-Point Seasons: 1972-73 (100 points)
50-Goal Seasons: 1972-73 (50 goals)
Stanley Cup Finals (Lost): 1980
NHL Playoffs Points Leader: 1973-74 (22), 1974-75 (20)
NHL Playoffs Goals Leader: 1973-74 (13)
Philadelphia Points Leader: 1976-77 (97)
Philadelphia Goals Leader: 1972-73 (50), 1976-77 (49)
Philadelphia Playoffs Points Leader: 1973-74 (22), 1974-75 (20), 1976-77 (13), 1977-78 (16)
Philadelphia Playoffs Goals Leader: 1973-74 (13), 1974-75 (11), 1977-78 (7)
Philadelphia Playoffs Assists Leader: 1976-77 (9), 1977-78 (9)
Miscellaneous: Missed remainder of 1975-76 season and entire 1976 playoffs with torn knee ligaments, an injury suffered in February 1976. ... Scored Stanley Cup-winning goal in 1974. ... Winner of 1977-78 Hockey Night in Canada shootout competition. ... Severely injured in 1977-78 when his neck was cut by Marcel Dionne's skate for a gash that required 80 stitches to close.

Over his first 10 NHL seasons, 70-71 to 79-80, he was 3rd in playoff goals and 5th in points, while missing the entire 76 playoffs.

Blessed with a quick wrist shot and natural offensive instincts, he topped the 30-goal mark seven times in 14 big league seasons.

Over the next two season he continued to produce on offense but was asked to take on penalty killing and defensive responsibility. MacLeish's excellence was a key component on the Flyers' consecutive Stanley Cup wins in 1974 and 1975. During the first title run he led all playoff goal scorers with 13 goals and 22 points. Overall, MacLeish was named to play in the 1976, 1977 and 1980 NHL all-star games.

During the late 70s, MacLeish was a top two-way player for Philly. - Legends of Hockey Bio (http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/SearchPlayer.jsp?player=13476)

Youngest NHL player (23 at the time) to score 50 goals in a season...Dipped to 32 last season, but few complained as he polished other skills including face-offs and checking...Possesses one of the most devastating wrist shots in hockey - The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1975 Edition

Fast powerful skater with a lightning shot that explodes on goal...Possesses breakaway speed that makes defenders look as though they are moving in slow motion...Regarded as one of the league's best short and long-range wrist shooters...Always a great playoff scorer...Had a 50-goal, 100-point season and seven-point game in 1972-73 - The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1978 Edition

"MacLeish shook off that ankle injury very well," ***** explains, in recalling the incident. "But agaist the Hawks he got rapped on the head by a stick and the doctor told me not to play him after the first period."

"But he was doing everything for us, including winning faceoffs. I guess he plays okay when he's dizzy."

MacLeish also notched three goals that night as the Flyers beat the Hawks, 5-3. - Bobby Clarke and the Ferocious Flyers

"I don't know if there's a more natural shooter and skater anywhere." - coach

"Right now, he's Mr. Everything." - coach

"I've seen a lot of great hockey players, but I've never seen anyone as loose as Ricky. They just can't get the puck away from him." - Bobby Clarke

"MacLeish just stood there and slugged it out with me. I can honestly say I never lost a fight in junior, but that's one I didn't win." - teammate

I have Lappy's pick. The Montreal Wanderers are pleased to welcome back to the fold a gritty, multi-position player: Reg Noble.

Good run of picks. Muller, Verbeek and MacLeish were all high on our list. Verbeek and Muller were near the top of our long list for this round. MacLeish was near the top of our wish list for our two-way line. Smart picks, boys.

I have to run to Thanksgiving dinner in an hour. Can anyone take my list in case we get a big run going.

With our 13rd selection, the 317th overall, the Detroit Falcons feel very fortunate to land this offensive mind right winger this late in the draft: WWII Veteran Gordie Drillon.

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/members/splash/P197503S.jpg

Gord Drillon had a short but spectacular career in the National Hockey League playing mainly with the Toronto Maple Leafs. He was a first team all-star in 1938 and 1939, a second team all-star in 1942, and NHL scoring leader and Lady Byng Trophy winner in 1938. He played in the 1939 Babe Siebert Memorial Game and won a Stanley Cup with Toronto in 1941-42 when the Leafs made their legendary comeback against Detroit.

Drillon's style of hockey was to park himself in front of the net and tip shots and swat at rebounds, and not worry about back-checking. "I spent ten years playing in the slot before anyone invented a name for it," he said later.

Hall of Fame goaltender and teammate Turk Broda knew of Drillon's goal-scoring abilities firsthand during Leaf practices. "I don't think there's a player in hockey who can shoot the puck more accurately," Broda once said. "Even if you leave him an opening the size of the puck, he'll hit it every time."

Stanley Cup (1942)
Art Ross Trophy (1938)
Rocket Richard Trophy (1938*)
First All-Star Team (1938, 1939)
Lady Byng Memorial Trophy (1938)
Second All-Star Team (1942)
Hall of Fame (1975)

I have to run to Thanksgiving dinner in an hour. Can anyone take my list in case we get a big run going.

I can.

I have Lappy's pick. The Montreal Wanderers are pleased to welcome back to the fold a gritty, multi-position player: Reg Noble.

Good run of picks. Muller, Verbeek and MacLeish were all high on our list. Verbeek and Muller were near the top of our long list for this round. MacLeish was near the top of our wish list for our two-way line. Smart picks, boys.

I have to run to Thanksgiving dinner in an hour. Can anyone take my list in case we get a big run going.

Noble was multi-position? Thought he was only a LW.

Noble was multi-position? Thought he was only a LW.
I think he played C and D, too, although I'm sure that Lappy picked him to play LW with Sakic and the Mafia boy...er...Bure.

Eagle, I'll send you a list right away. Drillon is an outstanding pick. Best player available, IMO.

Re: Dale Hunter

Yes, his cheapshot against Turgeon is among the worst ever, but if we're not drafting anyone that dished out vicicous cheapshots, scratch off a number of players chosen in the top 25.

Also as a long time Flyers fan who saw the 80's/90's Caps .. and dynasty Isles teams continuously, I'll take Hunter 8 days a week over Bourne. Bourne was a nice player, but you never went into a game concerning yourself with Bob Bourne. Hunter was a player you always thought about.

It's not a coincidence that the Nordiques didn't top 70 points after trading Hunter, and went in the tank completely.

Muller and Verbeek are both excellent selections. Player i certainly considered and hoped that one of the two may slip to the following round.

Jeez, we're running out of elite offensive talent and good skating 2nd-pairing blueliners.... and I'm completely stuck as to which I should draft next...

I've never been a fan of Drillon. He had the reputation of being a terrible defensive player. Plus he was benched during the last four games of the Leafs comeback from the 3-0 deficit in the Finals and was subsequently shipped off because the team grew tired of his lack of defense.

That said, to get a player with his offensive talent at this point is good value. Plus Detroit has an abundance of defensively responsible forwards (the Kraut line, Mikita and Backstrom/Provost) so they have the personnel to compensate for Drillon's shortcomings.

I've never been a fan of Drillon. He had the reputation of being a terrible defensive player. Plus he was benched during the last four games of the Leafs comeback from the 3-0 deficit in the Finals and was subsequently shipped off because the team grew tired of his lack of defense.

That said, to get a player with his offensive talent at this point is good value. Plus Detroit has an abundance of defensively responsible forwards (the Kraut line, Mikita and Backstrom/Provost) so they have the personnel to compensate for Drillon's shortcomings.

Exactly, I drafted Drillon knowing is defensive flaws. I also read this story where he got benched in the 1942 finals. However, in a two team full of responsible defensive players (I would even add that both Goulet and Ross were responsible in their zone), I had no problem drafting him, considering no players left are close to the offensive abilities of Drillon. I was in need of a 1st line RW and I got one, however at this point in the draft, it's impossible to get a complete 1st liner with no flaws.

Oh yeah, he was also a fan favourite, which is always good to draw crowds :)

Drillon is a good pick, but he is often considered one of the worst defensive players of all time. Coach (name withheld) always had to pair him with a strong two-way teammate in Apps, and would rarely play him when the Leafs were hanging on to a narrow lead, especially in the playoffs.

This is a good fit for the Falcons, though, as the team has a lot of good defensive forwards. Mikita should be able to cover up for Drillon's defensive weaknesses (let's hope this doesn't detract too much from Mikita's offense, though).

====

Noble is very versatile; he can play centre, both wings, and defense. He is one of the best players available but there are two significant red flags. First, he is often described as a player that "often got himself into trouble by ignoring training schedules and team curfews". Players were relatively undisciplined during Noble's era, so the fact that he is remebered as being particularly unruly is troubling. Basically, that's a lot of headaches to have on a first line, especially if the other winger is Pavel Bure.

The other big problem with Noble is that his offense completely dried up in the playoffs. He scored just 8 pts in 34 games (24 pts in 99 games, adjusted). Given that he finished in the top ten in scoring seven times (including as high as 3rd), Noble's drop in offense makes Marcel Dionne look like Ted Kennedy. I realize Noble was a good two-way player and might have focused a more on defense in the postseason, but surely that can't explain such a huge drop in production.

Also as a long time Flyers fan who saw the 80's/90's Caps .. and dynasty Isles teams continuously, I'll take Hunter 8 days a week over Bourne. Bourne was a nice player, but you never went into a game concerning yourself with Bob Bourne. Hunter was a player you always thought about.


Bourne and Hunter are wholly different players... and who cares about "worrying"? Did teams gameplan around Dale Hunter because they were afraid of him two handing someones knees? If they didn't, then there's little deterrent value in having him.

(let's hope this doesn't detract too much from Mikita's offense, though).


It didn't hurt Apps offensive abilities, so I don't think it should be a problem for a more offensive talented Mikita. With two great goalscorer in Michel Goulet and Gordie Drillon, Mikita priority will be to feed is winger, as he was the ultimate playmaker.

It's not a coincidence that the Nordiques didn't top 70 points after trading Hunter, and went in the tank completely.

It has more to do with XXXXXX XXXXXXXXX, XXXXXX XXXXXX, XXXXX XXXXXXXXXX leaving, XXXXX XXXXXXXX 's game going south in the nets (or the lack of any competent goaltending for that matter).

The guy traded with Hunter was, in the end, more important to Nords success than Hunter himself. Especially considering the goaltending woes that plagued the team.

The guy traded with Hunter was, in the end, more important to Nords success than Hunter himself. Especially considering the goaltending woes that plagued the team.

I would say that the pick traded for Hunter also turned out pretty good :)

With our 13rd selection, the 317th overall, the Detroit Falcons feel very fortunate to land this offensive mind right winger this late in the draft: WWII Veteran Gordie Drillon.

http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/LegendsOfHockey/members/splash/P197503S.jpg



Stanley Cup (1942)
Art Ross Trophy (1938)
Rocket Richard Trophy (1938*)
First All-Star Team (1938, 1939)
Lady Byng Memorial Trophy (1938)
Second All-Star Team (1942)
Hall of Fame (1975)

Congrats, he's a good pick here for you.

I like the way your team is shaping up thus far. Right now, I'd probably place you near the top along with the Clippers and Bitmores, with the Tigers and Canadiens pulling up the rear.

Your centers are, to me, the most formidable in the draft, and should nab you a fair amount of votes. A hex on you, for taking Schmidt where you did (and he belongs).

Looking to move up, PM if interested.

I would say that the pick traded for Hunter also turned out pretty good :)

The Nords quite easily could have drafted Sakic and kept Hunter.

Sakic was their 2nd 1st round choice that year after selecting Bryan Fogarty a few picks earlier.

Hunter to me is not just a goon. He is skilled. Still I don´t like him. But taste is taste and he is not out of place in this position in an all-tiime draft.

who is up?

I strongly considered him for the 2nd line center spot.

Me too. For me (admittedly I am a fan of Societ hockey) he is one of the best players available at this point and wouldn´t have looked out of place 50-80 or so (just imaginative numbers) earlier.

who is up?

seventieslord is on the clock. He was around, but I guess he's trying to decide who to pick. Either that or he didn't realize he was up.

Drillon-Solid pick with the right linemate. Mikita should do fine. With the wrong linemates his defense and skating could sink a team.

Noble-Skill wise, I liked him on our 3rd line. Attitude wise, we do not want Harry Cameron's drinking buddy. That would be patently stupid...

Me too. For me (admittedly I am a fan of Societ hockey) he is one of the best players available at this point and wouldn´t have looked out of place 50-80 or so (just imaginative numbers) earlier.

For me it was a question of goal scorer vs playmaker, and since our RW was more of a scorer, we felt that a high end playmaker was more valuable than a high end goal scorer. Plus, I do have some reservations about a 5'9 garbage goal scorer.

Who is here for the night? I probably go to bed soon.

I'm gonna be on for most if not all of the night.

Who is here for the night? I probably go to bed soon.

I'll be here for another 5 hrs or so.

An interesting note on Reg Noble: he developed his reputation for practice-skipping and unruliness playing for the same team as Harry Cameron (as Nalyd noted), who was another guy not exactly known for his good training habits. I find the revelation that the two guys from that era with the worst reputations for bad behavior (Noble's problems even get mentioned in his HHOF bio) played for the same team rather interesting. Could it perhaps have had something to do with the coaching or the organizational philosophy, as a whole?

I dunno. In organizations with more than one problem player, I tend to cast a suspicious eye at management. To use a more modern example: I wouldn't invite Michael Irvin over for tea and crumpets, but I can only conclude that the Jerry & Jimmy show in Dallas made matters worse. Know what I mean? Once I realized that Cameron wasn't the only all-time great in Toronto with a reputation for unruliness, it kind of assuaged my fears about his off-ice behavior. Of course, drafting Noble was out of the question (don't want those two together again), but I think away from each other and the organization, Cameron and Noble may not be as hard to work with as their reputations suggest. At the very least, I don't think either guy was into dogfighting.

Hey guys, finally back home. Once again, sorry for the missed pick.

The Dartmouth Subways are pleased to select, hard shooting defenseman, Al Iafrate.

The Nords quite easily could have drafted Sakic and kept Hunter.

Sakic was their 2nd 1st round choice that year after selecting Bryan Fogarty a few picks earlier.

Hindsigh 20/20, as we say...
Should Nords management made better choices (such as not pairing him with John Kordic on the road (!!!) (don't think he'll get draft)), he could have turned out better, and be considered a steal at 8th (or was it 9th?) overall.
Didn't think it was about getting the first. They had to unload some players, and Hunter was sacrificed. Even if, in the end, they shouldn't have sent XXXXX XXXXXXXXXX for the sake of their team.