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-   -   Why is Simmonds still on the Powerplay (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1035805)

TarredandFeathered* 11-21-2011 09:33 PM

Why is Simmonds still on the Powerplay
 
Seriously, the guy had one or two powerplay goals in preseason action, and Laviolette thinks he is the next coming of John LeClair. He has hands of stone, and zero hockey sense. He usually messes up any chance in tight, and constantly loses control of the puck along the sideboards. All he is really good for is screening, but if the team can't doesn't even have a good shot from the point other than Pronger, then that is a practically useless attribute.. Plain and simple, the guy is a 3rd liner at best, and Laviolette is really expecting way too much at this point. Doubleshift Giroux on both units, or else plug in even a guy like Nodl to win board battles.

Mats88 11-22-2011 05:41 AM

Can't agree more with you buddy!!

mirimon 11-22-2011 06:33 AM

Of course, one could argue that the worse shots you get from the blue line, the more important the screening in front of the goalie gets... Double shift Simmonds on the pp!

The pp units last night was a little strange on paper, but they had to experiment a little with Pronger and Jagr out. Simmonds and Hartnell on the same line I think could work, they need to stay a little calmer though while creating havoc in front of goal.

This will never fly, but if we have the same injuries next game I wouldn't mind going with

JvR-Giroux-Couturier
Timonen-Read

Hartnell-Brière-Simmonds
Meszaros-Voracek

I don't think Carle had a bad game last night, some of the criticism he gets on this site is clearly over the top. He's not working on the pp at the moment however. With all the injuries, I would like to see what Couturier has in him offensively as well.

Kaktus* 11-22-2011 07:28 AM

been asking this question for a few weeks now.
also, why are we still trying to play JVR on point? Does not work.

JagerPuck 11-22-2011 08:22 AM

Here is the bigger question:
Even with Pronger out of the lineup, why was Matt Carle at the point on the powerplay?

Did anyone else notice him flub 4-5 shots from the middle of the offensive blueline?
Im 100% sure Bourdon and Marshall are both more capable of at least putting an effective shot toward the net.

I think I am as down on the Flyers defense as I ever have been.
Timonen, Lilja and Carle all need to go. STAT

mirimon 11-22-2011 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JagerPuck (Post 39793603)
Here is the bigger question:
Even with Pronger out of the lineup, why was Matt Carle at the point on the powerplay?

Did anyone else notice him flub 4-5 shots from the middle of the offensive blueline?
Im 100% sure Bourdon and Marshall are both more capable of at least putting an effective shot toward the net.

I think I am as down on the Flyers defense as I ever have been.
Timonen, Lilja and Carle all need to go. STAT

Timonen had a rough game last night, but until Meszaros, Coburn and Carle all show that they can be trusted upon in all situations, he stays. Timonen is still a top-pairing defenseman and honestly more important to this team than he should need to be.

Lilja has been up and down, he had a few good games in a row, but yesterday wasn't one of them. He's a 7th d though, can't expect to get 82 solid games out of him. If we could trade Carle+Nödl (or something like that) for two solid d's that would fit under the cap I would look at that though, to make sure that Lilja really is the 7th d (Gustafsson, Marshall and Bourdon to the AHL but could fill in if there's some serious injuries).

DrinkFightFlyers 11-22-2011 08:53 AM

Yeah, I'm a big fan of Simmonds, but at this point, he's not working there. Here what I would like to see (when everyone is healthy):

Top Unit:

JVR-Giroux-Jagr
Pronger-Mez

Second Unit:

Read-Briere-Voracek
Kimmo-Coburn

Maybe throw Hartnell on that second unit if they aren't clicking. He can't skate but he's pretty solid in front of the net.

JagerPuck 11-22-2011 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers (Post 39794313)
Yeah, I'm a big fan of Simmonds, but at this point, he's not working there. Here what I would like to see (when everyone is healthy):

Top Unit:

JVR-Giroux-Jagr
Pronger-Mez

Second Unit:

Read-Briere-Voracek
Kimmo-Coburn

Maybe throw Hartnell on that second unit if they aren't clicking. He can't skate but he's pretty solid in front of the net.

What has Voracek shown you at all to warrant him being on the powerplay?
0 net presence and no nose for the puck.

DrinkFightFlyers 11-22-2011 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JagerPuck (Post 39794355)
What has Voracek shown you at all to warrant him being on the powerplay?
0 net presence and no nose for the puck.

He has looked good, better than Simmonds, anyway. His game is offense. The power play is offense. I said that if the line isn't clicking to stick Hartnell out there because of his ability to play in front of the net. Who do you want in that situation, Couturier?

might2mash 11-22-2011 09:29 AM

He does do some great work screening in front of the net. However, having both him and Hartnell on the same unit last night made no sense. They both are most effective playing that role. I get that Jagr was out and they had trouble plugging anyone in, but that was possibly the least effective attempt.

RespectTheCouts 11-22-2011 09:47 AM

Oh this is easy because they don't have Superman Richards and Batman Carter on the PP duh

RIPRichardsCarter 11-22-2011 10:40 AM

If only Simmonds would simplify his game...he shows such promise when he isn't trying to do things outside of his abilities.

G Money 11-22-2011 11:26 AM

here's the #'s

G 4
Hartnell 4
Simmonds 2
Carle 2
Jagr 2
4 others tied with 1

i would like to see them go back to this unit

Jagr Giroux Simmonds
Pronger READ!!!!!

i thought they were looking great before Pronger went down and when he came back JVR was on that point wtf?

Telos 11-22-2011 02:05 PM

I was a little surprised to learn that he was still on the PP. He was never on the PP in LA, at least never a mainstay, he would occasionally see a little bit here and there mostly due to either injuries or team fatigue, but outside of being a temporary fill-in, he was always a bottom 6 high octane energy winger whom the opposition typically always underestimated which would give him the ability to step out of his role and take things to the next level from time to time and burn defensemen. I don't even really remember him getting any habitual penalty killing time. I think he was primarily always an even strength player for us, never special teams.

Even so, has he really been that bad at the role? With the offensive players the Flyers have, you would think that Simmonds would at least be serviceable in such a role. He doesn't have much finesse or playmaking ability, but he can should the puck well enough and is gritty and can get play in the tough spots and go to the net. If I were planning a powerplay with Simmonds, I would just stick him in front of the net and let everyone else work around him, he knows his role and will fight for space and bang in the occasional rebound.

JagerPuck 11-22-2011 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers (Post 39794815)
He has looked good, better than Simmonds, anyway. His game is offense. The power play is offense. I said that if the line isn't clicking to stick Hartnell out there because of his ability to play in front of the net. Who do you want in that situation, Couturier?

Simmonds or Couturier.. Voracek is useless on this team. He drifts in open space and waits for the puck. The only game the dude got up for was the one against his former team.
Couts is also more of a natural goal scorer than Simmonds or Voracek.

Prongo 11-22-2011 05:36 PM

I like simmonds on the Power play. He just needs to stick to his job and park his rear end right in front of the goalie and good things happen.

I also believe the main thing wrong with our Powerplay is the D-men that don't hit the net or can't get shots through to the net. I really don't like them taking wrist shots from the point. hey almost always are batted down and cleared. That is the most frustrating thing IMO

TarredandFeathered* 11-22-2011 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telos (Post 39806029)
I was a little surprised to learn that he was still on the PP. He was never on the PP in LA, at least never a mainstay, he would occasionally see a little bit here and there mostly due to either injuries or team fatigue, but outside of being a temporary fill-in, he was always a bottom 6 high octane energy winger whom the opposition typically always underestimated which would give him the ability to step out of his role and take things to the next level from time to time and burn defensemen. I don't even really remember him getting any habitual penalty killing time. I think he was primarily always an even strength player for us, never special teams.

Even so, has he really been that bad at the role? With the offensive players the Flyers have, you would think that Simmonds would at least be serviceable in such a role. He doesn't have much finesse or playmaking ability, but he can should the puck well enough and is gritty and can get play in the tough spots and go to the net. If I were planning a powerplay with Simmonds, I would just stick him in front of the net and let everyone else work around him, he knows his role and will fight for space and bang in the occasional rebound.

Yeah, he's been pretty horrid lately actually. He had a nice run in the preseason, and a few games into the regular season when they had Jagr, Giroux, Pronger and Read working as a unit. The biggest problem with Simmonds is that he tends to overthink things, which is a terrible attribute for a player of his skill level to have. He sets a good screen, but then if the puck is thrown behind the net, he usually loses the board battle, or mishandles the puck.
Has a lot of raw athleticism, speed, agility, even hand eye coordination, but he lacks the hands in tight to finish. He'll get a sure goal cross crease pass, and he'll send it wide... just needs to relax and start playing a simplified 3rd line grinding role, and if Laviolette took him off the PP, maybe he'd help him realize that.

G Money 11-23-2011 08:28 AM

how often does he really get to touch the puck on the PP? its always Giroux and Pronger playing pitch n catch at the point

thelos 11-23-2011 08:31 AM

Simmonds is fine as a net presence, the bigger question is why were he and Hartnell on the same unit last game?

Terence Peterman 11-23-2011 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telos (Post 39806029)
I was a little surprised to learn that he was still on the PP. He was never on the PP in LA, at least never a mainstay, he would occasionally see a little bit here and there mostly due to either injuries or team fatigue, but outside of being a temporary fill-in, he was always a bottom 6 high octane energy winger whom the opposition typically always underestimated which would give him the ability to step out of his role and take things to the next level from time to time and burn defensemen. I don't even really remember him getting any habitual penalty killing time. I think he was primarily always an even strength player for us, never special teams.

Even so, has he really been that bad at the role? With the offensive players the Flyers have, you would think that Simmonds would at least be serviceable in such a role. He doesn't have much finesse or playmaking ability, but he can should the puck well enough and is gritty and can get play in the tough spots and go to the net. If I were planning a powerplay with Simmonds, I would just stick him in front of the net and let everyone else work around him, he knows his role and will fight for space and bang in the occasional rebound.

It's not that he's been that bad, it's that he's been the same player he was for you as he has been for us. Extremely streaky. Looks brilliant when on, hard to notice when he's not.

McNasty 11-23-2011 11:30 AM

The problem with the PP is completely systemic. They play catch with it up high and look for the one timer to the RD, or they decide to try and have Briere walk it out from behind the net and feed the RD on the left post. It's the same as last year and I really don't see it getting much better (iirc they started out hot last year also).

SchennSational1022* 11-23-2011 11:32 AM

Not impressed with this guy at all, I have high hopes for Schenn and I feel he will pan out. He's dominated in every level so far. Otherwise this trade looks pretty bad.

Terence Peterman 11-23-2011 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captain richie18 (Post 39844491)
Not impressed with this guy at all, I have high hopes for Schenn and I feel he will pan out. He's dominated in every level so far. Otherwise this trade looks pretty bad.

You mean to say it looks bad because we don't know how the centerpiece for us is going to do yet?

96 11-23-2011 01:44 PM

Simmonds has definitely slowed since his impressive start. I'd shake up the PP units like this:

Hartnell - Giroux - Jagr
Pronger - Read

JVR - Briere - Voracek
Timonen - Meszaros/Carle

CTU2fan 11-23-2011 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Serge11 (Post 39838769)
Simmonds is fine as a net presence, the bigger question is why were he and Hartnell on the same unit last game?

That's the issue right there. I like Simmonds on the PP if only because he provides a little net presence and he's willing to go in the dirty areas and work...similar to Hartnell, and unlike every other forward we have. But neither guy is particularly strong away from the top of the crease so they're sort of redundant when they're on the PP together.


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