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-   -   Possible Trade Ideas Take IV... (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1088385)

thestonedkoala 01-23-2012 02:45 PM

Possible Trade Ideas Take IV...
 
Okay, we filled up the last one pretty fast.

Let's go at it again! GO GO GO!

forthewild 01-23-2012 02:47 PM

i wonder what nsh would want for blum. he seems to be on the outside given ellis and josi.

thestonedkoala 01-23-2012 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickschultzfan (Post 42973353)
Carter sucks in Columbus because he was brought to be a 1st line center, which he is not, and to play with Nash, who everybody knew would not mesh well with another shooter like Carter.

Carter is streaky and he'll probably a 70 point guy. But he's definitely a 30 goal guy. And he's definitely a top-6 guy. And he's definitely better than everybody currently in the Wild top-6 not named Koivu.

Carter = Koivu?

Be interesting. Carter can score more than Koivu...we could flip flop them around as well.

Minnesota 01-23-2012 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo (Post 42973639)
Carter = Koivu?

Be interesting. Carter can score more than Koivu...we could flip flop them around as well.

Don't know if I'd want Carter on the same team as Setoguchi. They both seem like party animals.

forthewild 01-23-2012 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo (Post 42973639)
Carter = Koivu?

Be interesting. Carter can score more than Koivu...we could flip flop them around as well.

koivu is better all around player, but carter and koivu would work well in theory, as carter is a shooter and koivu defers

thestonedkoala 01-23-2012 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnesota (Post 42973941)
Don't know if I'd want Carter on the same team as Setoguchi. They both seem like party animals.

We got the Yeo!

forthewild 01-23-2012 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnesota (Post 42973941)
Don't know if I'd want Carter on the same team as Setoguchi. They both seem like party animals.

in fairness he has picked up his play since

Teddy10Beers 01-23-2012 03:06 PM

If I were a GM, I'd want Carter's contract to include the following: contract becomes null and void if you dip your pen in company ink.

Jarick 01-23-2012 03:09 PM

Back to that point you had about not getting shots, it comes down to lacking skilled players.

Actually, we've had more shots on goal while losing compared to winning, yet we're losing.

My opinion is and has been the team plain lacks skill. Our "skill" guys are not skilled at all.

Koivu is a high end grinder who CAN make plays with his body and work ethic and hustle and decent set of hands...but he's not exactly an elite playmaker who's looking off the defender while seeing where his winger is going and executing a gorgeous saucer pass on to the tape. Demitra was that kind of guy. Koivu is not.

Same thing with Setoguchi...he's a "sniper" like Clutterbuck is a "sniper"...he's got a good shot, good speed, and that's it. He's not an elite shooter who gets multiple breakaways and scoring chances per game while also possessing the ability to make plays with the puck at or near full speed. Gaborik was that kind of guy. Seto is not.

Bouchard and Lats, like I said before, were our two skill guys, and without them in the lineup, it's dump and chase, grind, cycle, and try to bang in pucks. The more they try to shoot the puck, the worse it looks. Because they routinely shoot from terrible angles far from the goalie. They aren't making the defenders jobs difficult at all. I've been saying for three years they need puck movement deep in the offensive zone in order to pull defenders out of position and open up passing lanes that can actually create scoring chances. Havlat was a master at that and he had a phenomenal 1.5 seasons. Bouchard can do that. Nobody else can.

thestonedkoala 01-23-2012 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarick (Post 42974971)
Actually, we've had more shots on goal while losing compared to winning, yet we're losing.

That's true.

Quote:

My opinion is and has been the team plain lacks skill. Our "skill" guys are not skilled at all.
That as well. Hopefully that will be reversed soon.

Quote:

Koivu is a high end grinder who CAN make plays with his body and work ethic and hustle and decent set of hands...but he's not exactly an elite playmaker who's looking off the defender while seeing where his winger is going and executing a gorgeous saucer pass on to the tape. Demitra was that kind of guy. Koivu is not.
And why I would consider moving Koivu. Captain material is great and leadership is well but right now we need skill, not leadership.

nickschultzfan 01-23-2012 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarick (Post 42974971)
Back to that point you had about not getting shots, it comes down to lacking skilled players.

Actually, we've had more shots on goal while losing compared to winning, yet we're losing.

My opinion is and has been the team plain lacks skill. Our "skill" guys are not skilled at all.

Koivu is a high end grinder who CAN make plays with his body and work ethic and hustle and decent set of hands...but he's not exactly an elite playmaker who's looking off the defender while seeing where his winger is going and executing a gorgeous saucer pass on to the tape. Demitra was that kind of guy. Koivu is not.

Same thing with Setoguchi...he's a "sniper" like Clutterbuck is a "sniper"...he's got a good shot, good speed, and that's it. He's not an elite shooter who gets multiple breakaways and scoring chances per game while also possessing the ability to make plays with the puck at or near full speed. Gaborik was that kind of guy. Seto is not.

Bouchard and Lats, like I said before, were our two skill guys, and without them in the lineup, it's dump and chase, grind, cycle, and try to bang in pucks. The more they try to shoot the puck, the worse it looks. Because they routinely shoot from terrible angles far from the goalie. They aren't making the defenders jobs difficult at all. I've been saying for three years they need puck movement deep in the offensive zone in order to pull defenders out of position and open up passing lanes that can actually create scoring chances. Havlat was a master at that and he had a phenomenal 1.5 seasons. Bouchard can do that. Nobody else can.

So you are staying we should trade for Carter and sign Parise? :handclap:

forthewild 01-23-2012 03:18 PM

@koivu = high end grinder :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

sorry no mega facepalm.

koivu is a very skilled playmaker no ****ing high end grinder can turn mittens into a 30g* guy

*he missed about 15 open nets

squidz* 01-23-2012 03:46 PM

While I think Carter sounds like he'd look fantastic centering Granlund (and someone with size on the other wing?) I don't think I'd be willing to move the pieces Columbus would be seeking. Also, his contract terrifies me.

That said, delving into it, if we assume that Columbus would take a little less than what they paid for him, the cost might be a healthy Lats + 2012 1st (assuming 10th-16th overall) or perhaps Seto + 1st + ?? a third maybe? Haula? I think I might be able to live with that sort of deal, but the pain to our blue line would be palpable if we can't find at least two quality UFAs.

Heatley-Koivu-Bouchard
Lats/Seto-Carter-Granlund

That would be a respectable top 6 at the very least. Defensively responsible, but two lines that could legitimately score on every shift. However, moving our first would reduce the quality of our future blue line. If Brodin isn't ready for next season and we only pick up a single 2nd pairing caliber defenseman, we'll still ache on the back end with absolutely no relief in sight. The cap implications would be a bit imposing assuming the cap stays about level after next year's increase. Although, with Heatley, Zid, Schultz, and Backstrom coming off over the next two years, we'll have quite a bit to play with.

Kari Takko 01-23-2012 03:54 PM

No way. I don't want that contract anywhere near our cap.

nickschultzfan 01-23-2012 04:15 PM

If I was trading for Carter, I would offer:

Harding, Bouchard, and Coyle/Phillips/Zucker/Larsson for Carter.

That would be comparable to what they gave away.

Billy Mays Here 01-23-2012 04:34 PM

If the Wild were to talk trade with Columbus they'd better be talking Nash not Carter. Nash and Latandresse are very similar players. Only be fitting that Nash would be the new "Big Bear".

forthewild 01-23-2012 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WILDhockeyfan (Post 42979397)
If the Wild were to talk trade with Columbus they'd better be talking Nash not Carter. Nash and Latandresse are very similar players. Only be fitting that Nash would be the new "Big Bear".


**** that, him and his 8+ mil cap hit can suck it

nickschultzfan 01-23-2012 05:28 PM

I'd take Nash in a heartbeat if he was available. Yeah, that cap hit is huge. But Nash and Koivu would be a ridiculous line. And Heatley and Granlund would be a decent 2nd line.

Generic User 01-23-2012 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickschultzfan (Post 42981961)
I'd take Nash in a heartbeat if he was available. Yeah, that cap hit is huge. But Nash and Koivu would be a ridiculous line. And Heatley and Granlund would be a decent 2nd line.

You think Granlund would still be on the team if we traded for Nash? Also, if we're going to trade for someone with that cap hit (and what it would take to get them), why not just go all out? We'd already be giving up a **** ton for Nash, so why not add a little bit extra and grab someone better?

Surly Furious 01-23-2012 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickschultzfan (Post 42978483)
If I was trading for Carter, I would offer:

Harding, Bouchard, and Coyle/Phillips/Zucker/Larsson for Carter.

That would be comparable to what they gave away.

Yuck - glad you aren't the GM. :)

Surly Furious 01-23-2012 06:02 PM

If I were Fletch, I'd be very careful with the crown jewels until we've seen what they can do at the NHL level.

Why?

Nick Leddy. He is miles better than most folks thought he'd be. I'd hate to see him trade Zucker or Phillips thinking they were less valuable than Coyle or Larsson, and have those guys be the real studs and the Wild get stuck with the duds.

Generic User 01-23-2012 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bookman (Post 42984247)
Nick Leddy. He is miles better than most folks thought he'd be. I'd hate to see him trade Zucker or Phillips thinking they were less valuable than Coyle or Larsson, and have those guys be the real studs and the Wild get stuck with the duds.

I thought this too. I would tend to be a little more gun-shy after that. I could easily see whatever player he trades away, no matter who, becoming a great player.

Avder 01-23-2012 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo (Post 42986043)
Why shouldn't they be?

If this teams want to move forward then we shouldn't be limiting ourselves. Clutterbuck and Koivu could bring back good pieces to add with what we have.

I agree with Jarick's post that strip away Koivu's captaincy and what is he? A high level grinder. I mean really? When was the last time he hit 70 points? Two years ago? He's battled injuries and he has never hit 25 goals a season. Hell Bouchard got close to 70 himself but we don't consider him a first line winger.

I think a good comparison to Koivu is slightly better version of Jordan Staal.

Weve been over this. Koivu is much more valuable to the team than just his stats and production indicate. He is the heart and soul of the team. Hell he was in the booth last night, sitting next to the two press box coaches consulting and helping out, while injured.

thestonedkoala 01-23-2012 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avder (Post 42986919)
Koivu is much more valuable to the team than just his stats and production indicate. He is the heart and soul of the team. Hell he was in the booth last night, sitting next to the two press box coaches consulting and helping out, while injured.

And we've been over this before; Bruno was also a huge part of this team and organization but we didn't bring him back (twice now). Kurtis Foster was one of our babies and we let him go. Darby Hendrickson, Antti Laaksonen, John Madden, Brian Rolston, Derek Boogaard were all fan favorites and huge parts of this organization and team (hell Madden even said he was probably going to sign back to Minnesota or retire), and we moved them all. Dwayne Roloson and Manny Fernandez.

Brent Burns, Josh Harding, Stephane Veilleux...

So he's a good coach. He's just Wes Walz without the speed and a bit better hands. He's on pace for 57 points in 72 games this year.

57...

And he's got better teammates.

Mancini79 01-23-2012 09:13 PM

Think a deal could be made with Philly?

Brodz
Zidlicky
Johan Gustafsson (once he's signed to ELC)

For:

Voracek
Lilja


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