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-   -   Value of: Marc Staal (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1093555)

mpp9 01-30-2012 12:27 PM

Marc Staal
 
With the depth the Rangers have on D and the level they played at without Staal for most of the season, would he become available at some point?

Love to have him anchor the Pens second pairing. Guys on a steal of a contract, excellent 1 on 1 defender and has a bit of offense to his game.

Kershaw 01-30-2012 12:29 PM

Can Jordan Staal play left wing?

JeffMangum 01-30-2012 12:30 PM

No, and if he were, he'd be sent West.

Oroku Saki* 01-30-2012 12:30 PM

Mid first.

Kershaw 01-30-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Volchbot 3000 (Post 43294823)
Mid first.

The player drafted at that position would dream to have as good a career as Staal has thus far. Not to mention Staal was around a mid-first, but has drastically exceeded expectations in his career. A draft pick that isn't in the top 5 would be a bad deal for the Rangers.

mpp9 01-30-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zenith (Post 43294795)
No, and if he were, he'd be sent West.

Just a hypothetical. But Staal+ for Ryan?

x BEUKEBOOM x 01-30-2012 12:35 PM

The OP was in response to a half hearted proposal I made in the GLeason signing thread.

Seems the Gleason NTC doesn't kick in till the contract ext actually starts in July.


Gleason + Ruutu

for

Marc Staal.


Seems like equal value. Not to far of a downgrade on D + the LW top 6 depth we lack with a touch of toughness mixed in on both positions heading into the playoffs.


here is my post from the other thread:
Quote:

I cant speak for other NYR fans but I just floated it out there for ha ha's

Considering McDonagh has shown to be almost as good as Staal is defensively and ahead of Staal offensivly in only his 2nd year. Then you have Girardi cementing his place as a reliable defensive D-man with a touch of offense himself. Then we have MDZ a our 1 NHL PMD within the identified "core" players & Erixon who is a ppg AHL Dman who is expected to contribute full time NHL by next season, Sauer who is iffy health wise but a defensive stalwart with toughness, & his eventual replacement in McIlrath who NYR brass is very high on right now believing he is right on path to where they expected him to be. It wouldn't hurt in my eyes to swap Staal for Gleason and upgrade or LW top 6 depth for a run at the cup this year.

I'm not in a rush to off load Staal at all, just looking at it from a "asset" value standpoint.

Staal is a great player for us but our depth is pretty good and Gleason isn't a major step down and our current D got us into 1st place without Staal contributing this year.

Ruuttu + Gleason may be a bit of an overpayment for Staal but the 2 Dman contracts match up and Staal + Staal in CAR is a very attractive marketing tool and who knows what chemistry the two can have together.

Trxjw 01-30-2012 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpp9 (Post 43294961)
Just a hypothetical. But Staal+ for Ryan?

Ryan would likely be the expected caliber of player in return, yes.

x BEUKEBOOM x 01-30-2012 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpp9 (Post 43294961)
Just a hypothetical. But Staal+ for Ryan?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trxjw (Post 43295107)
Ryan would likely be the expected caliber of player in return, yes.

Gleason/Ruutu I would be iffy on, but could see the logic.


Staal+ for Bobby Ryan I'd be on board with easily. Aquiring BR with time left on his contract would take the sting out of moving Staal. Given the make up of our team you have to do roll the dice on that move as long as the (+) isn't a "core" player or blue chipper.

The Amity Affliction 01-30-2012 01:37 PM

Bobby Ryan better be coming back the other way. The Rangers would have to add, obviously, but Sather will not give up one of his assistant/alternate captains and all-star shutdown defenseman for anything less.

Exit Dose 01-30-2012 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by x CALLAHAN x (Post 43295491)
Gleason/Ruutu I would be iffy on, but could see the logic.

Staal+ for Bobby Ryan I'd be on board with easily. Aquiring BR with time left on his contract would take the sting out of moving Staal. Given the make up of our team you have to do roll the dice on that move as long as the (+) isn't a "core" player or blue chipper.

While a healthy Staal would be on our top pairing easily, right now, I just don't see us moving Ryan with a defenseman as a centerpiece. We currently have about 8.8 million tied up in stay-at-home types next season. Staal bumps it up to about 12.8 million. Sbisa and Beauchemin are locked into our top 4 at this point, while being paired up with Fowler and Lubo. Our organization is pretty high on Sbisa, he was the major prospect in the Pronger trade, and we're going to give him the opportunities to keep pushing for more minutes.

The Amity Affliction 01-30-2012 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by x CALLAHAN x (Post 43295037)
The OP was in response to a half hearted proposal I made in the GLeason signing thread.

Seems the Gleason NTC doesn't kick in till the contract ext actually starts in July.


Gleason + Ruutu

for

Marc Staal.


Seems like equal value. Not to far of a downgrade on D + the LW top 6 depth we lack with a touch of toughness mixed in on both positions heading into the playoffs.


here is my post from the other thread:

Tuomo Ruutu is not a significant enough upgrade to justify dealing Marc Staal away for, no matter what anyone says.

It seems that people have forgotten just how good he really is.

RyanCallahan24* 01-30-2012 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpp9 (Post 43294729)
With the depth the Rangers have on D and the level they played at without Staal for most of the season, would he become available at some point?

Love to have him anchor the Pens second pairing. Guys on a steal of a contract, excellent 1 on 1 defender and has a bit of offense to his game.

Give us James Neal and a 1st/2nd. Staal is an elite shutdown D. Neal is great but he's contract is expiring if I'm not wrong? Staal has got a low caphit and a few years left on it.


Edit: I wouldn't want to move Staal in the first place. And if we did I would like an elite LW to come back. Ryan or possibly Neal. Him or Bobby Ryan no more, no less. The only reason I would move such a great D as Staal is that we already got a bunch of great young d-men. What we don't have is an elite LW. That would only makes us better. Everyone has stepped up their game this year. I never expected our D to play this good without Staal. Giving up Staal who's a D for an elite LW would only make us better IMO. Although I would still miss Staal. But MDZ, Erixon, McD, Girardi, McIlrath (in the future), Sauer makes us quite set at D. So we could afford it. Add to boot a possible better powerplay and more skills up front never hurts. Which we would get with Ryan or Neal.

Punxrocknyc19* 01-30-2012 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coldshot (Post 43297573)
Tuomo Ruutu is not a significant enough upgrade to justify dealing Marc Staal away for, no matter what anyone says.

It seems that people have forgotten just how good he really is.

Change Ruutu to Sutter and it might work..:). Much rather have Sutter...Ruutu is more physical version of Wolski...when Ruutu ain't putting up points, not that noticeable unless he is playing physical which he doesn't do consistently

wej20 01-30-2012 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kershaw (Post 43294779)
Can Jordan Staal play left wing?

Yes but he's much more effective as a centre.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanCallahan24 (Post 43298945)
Give us James Neal and a 1st/2nd. Staal is an elite shutdown D. Neal is great but he's contract is expiring if I'm not wrong? Staal has got a low caphit and a few years left on it.


Edit: I wouldn't want to move Staal in the first place. And if we did I would like an elite LW to come back. Ryan or possibly Neal. Him or Bobby Ryan no more, no less. The only reason I would move such a great D as Staal is that we already got a bunch of great young d-men. What we don't have is an elite LW. That would only makes us better. Everyone has stepped up their game this year. I never expected our D to play this good without Staal. Giving up Staal who's a D for an elite LW would only make us better IMO. Although I would still miss Staal. But MDZ, Erixon, McD, Girardi, McIlrath (in the future), Sauer makes us quite set at D. So we could afford it. Add to boot a possible better powerplay and more skills up front never hurts. Which we would get with Ryan or Neal.

Neal's playing a lot of RW these days and while I'd love to have M.Staal on the Pens I wouldn't move Neal or J.Staal to get him, it just doesn't make sense. If I was the Rangers I wouldn't move him right now, McIlrath and Erixon have 13 NHL games between them.

SML 01-30-2012 03:13 PM

Count me among the minority of Rangers fans who would trade Staal. Bottm line is this. Even IF you think Staal is the best shutdown dman in the game, which I'm not saying, the fact is that the Rangers have played a top 5 defensive game all season without him. So even with him, they aren't going to be that much better defensively. I think the potential to win more games comes from dealing from organizational strength, defense, to add to shortcoming, goalscoring. That's before you even consider that Staal commands 25+ minutes of icetime a night, time which his fill ins have been flourishing getting and need to continue getting.

RyanCallahan24* 01-30-2012 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wej20 (Post 43301041)
Yes but he's much more effective as a centre.



Neal's playing a lot of RW these days and while I'd love to have M.Staal on the Pens I wouldn't move Neal or J.Staal to get him, it just doesn't make sense. If I was the Rangers I wouldn't move him right now, McIlrath and Erixon have 13 NHL games between them.

Okay didn't know he plays RW nowadays.

Well I'd only trade Staal if a great LW came back.

Girardi, McDonagh, Del Zotto, Sauer, Erixon, Woywitka, Eminger, Stralman, Bickel, Valentenko, McIlrath (in a few years) + Lundqvist, Biron. Makes a pretty good defence. Then add our playing style and hardworking guys backchecking like Callahan, Dubinsky etc.

We need goalscoring. We got great defense with some depth.

Bobby Ryan for Staal or we just sign Parise as a UFA (if he becomes one) or just give Kreider a spot next year :).

Edit: Wouldn't it be fun to see Jordan and Marc Staal on the same team? Maybe Eric as well in the future haha :naughty::D.

The Amity Affliction 01-30-2012 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 (Post 43300177)
Change Ruutu to Sutter and it might work..:). Much rather have Sutter...Ruutu is more physical version of Wolski...when Ruutu ain't putting up points, not that noticeable unless he is playing physical which he doesn't do consistently

I agree on Ruutu, but Sutter isn't exactly anything I'd trade Staal for either. We need a pure sniper on the left side. Someone capable of 30+ goals.

TheYuleGoat 01-30-2012 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coldshot (Post 43302421)
I agree on Ruutu, but Sutter isn't exactly anything I'd trade Staal for either. We need a pure sniper on the left side. Someone capable of 30+ goals.

Are you possibly hinting at Jussi Jokinen?

Kader 01-30-2012 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpp9 (Post 43294729)
With the depth the Rangers have on D and the level they played at without Staal for most of the season, would he become available at some point?

Love to have him anchor the Pens second pairing. Guys on a steal of a contract, excellent 1 on 1 defender and has a bit of offense to his game.

The Rangers have been playing very well without him, imagine them with him?

He's their cornerstone on Defense, Rangers would never trade him.

TOGuy14 01-30-2012 04:21 PM

Hasn't New York been even better since Staal came back?

I didn't know he was a guy the Rangers considered even remotely available.

What are their needs? Scoring winger with size a la MacArthur +?

azrok22 01-30-2012 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kader (Post 43303457)
The Rangers have been playing very well without him, imagine them with him?

He's their cornerstone on Defense, Rangers would never trade him.

Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity; sanity still exists.

wej20 01-30-2012 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanCallahan24 (Post 43301705)
Okay didn't know he plays RW nowadays.

Well I'd only trade Staal if a great LW came back.

Girardi, McDonagh, Del Zotto, Sauer, Erixon, Woywitka, Eminger, Stralman, Bickel, Valentenko, McIlrath (in a few years) + Lundqvist, Biron. Makes a pretty good defence. Then add our playing style and hardworking guys backchecking like Callahan, Dubinsky etc.

We need goalscoring. We got great defense with some depth.

Bobby Ryan for Staal or we just sign Parise as a UFA (if he becomes one) or just give Kreider a spot next year :).

Edit: Wouldn't it be fun to see Jordan and Marc Staal on the same team? Maybe Eric as well in the future haha :naughty::D.

Neal spent his years in Dallas at LW so shifting back wont be a problem. The top 4 is pretty strong even without Staal but I wouldn't put much faith in guys like Stralman, Bickel, etc come playoff time, imagine if Girardi got injured in the playoffs and that pushed one of the bottom pairing guys into the top 4.

RyanCallahan24* 01-30-2012 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kader (Post 43303457)
The Rangers have been playing very well without him, imagine them with him?

He's their cornerstone on Defense, Rangers would never trade him.

True. We do not want to trade Staal. With that said, our D has been great without him imagine it with him when he is 100% back to his old self. What Rangers needs is an elite LW. Ryan, Parise etc. If we got Ryan for Staal it would be worth it. Our D is so good we could (if we needed to, as the first half of the season has proved) survive without Staal. And a player like Ryan would be filling a gap on the LW we desperately need.

GeorgeHamiltonsTan 01-30-2012 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azrok22 (Post 43303891)
Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity; sanity still exists.

i second that...

look, because the rangers have far exceeded expectations on the blue line doesnt mean for one second that they are "deep" in the position. they have some kids who could scratch the lineup at some point down the road but when you've got the likes of Bickel, stralman and woywitka being the better option for a 3rd d pairing the last thing you want to do is trade away a proven, dependable dman. trading staal should not be an option...at all.

that said, this is sather we're talking about so ya never know we could wind up getting another washed up euro headcase... yay... cant wait for zherdev part deux


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