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-   -   Value of: Jamie McBain (CAR) to Vancouver? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1108083)

biturbo19 02-15-2012 07:39 PM

Jamie McBain (CAR) to Vancouver?
 
Carolina has a pretty good stockpile of young d-men and prospects, and with Gleason re-signing, it seems like there's the potential to move someone is there. I get the impression McBain is certainly not the first choice for Canes fans to move, but i don't get the impression that he's an untouchable at this point, particularly with Faulk emerging as he has. I think McBain has the potential to be a great fit with the Canucks style, and would provide us that RHS 'Salo-insurance' we're after. His superb cap-hit would certainly be of value this year as well, even though he's due for a raise this summer.

Is there a potential Raymond+ package that could get a deal done sending Jamie McBain to Vancouver at the deadline?

How much adding would Vancouver realistically be looking at? A pick? Decent prospect?

Would a 'close-to-ready' blueline prospect to replace McBain be of interest? Someone like Sauve + Raymond perhaps?

Or is their an alternative potential deal there without Raymond, without subtracting from the Canucks current roster? It seems to me as though Carolina is after players who can step in right away, or at least very soon, but if there's a deal to be made for futures, that could work as well. Maybe something around Schroeder?

Thoughts from Canes fans on the what you'd be looking for?

ZetterBurger 02-15-2012 07:40 PM

McBain won't be moved. So Hodgson. But what do I know?

YogiCanucks 02-15-2012 07:40 PM

McBain would fit the Vancouver system like a glove, I think it would take an awful lot to get him though.

Blob Mckenzie* 02-15-2012 07:45 PM

:laugh: Sauve + Raymond.


Gesus Christ. Try Raymond, Tanev ( Or Connauton) and a 2nd round pick maybe. Sauve is the 3rd best defensive prospect for the Canucks at best and you feel he and Raymond are enough to aquire a young top 4 D-man who is right handed and can move the puck?? I am a Canucks fan but that is ridiculous.

Blueline Bomber 02-15-2012 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YogiCanucks (Post 44211235)
McBain would fit the Vancouver system like a glove, I think it would take an awful lot to get him though.

Pretty much this. You want McBain, it'll cost you.

ReggieDunlop7 02-15-2012 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angelo Pignatti (Post 44211967)
:laugh: Sauve + Raymond.


Gesus Christ. Try Raymond, Tanev ( Or Connauton) and a 2nd round pick maybe. Sauve is the 3rd best defensive prospect for the Canucks at best and you feel he and Raymond are enough to aquire a young top 4 D-man who is right handed and can move the puck?? I am a Canucks fan but that is ridiculous.

What about Raymond and a 1rst?

biturbo19 02-15-2012 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angelo Pignatti (Post 44211967)
:laugh: Sauve + Raymond.


Gesus Christ. Try Raymond, Tanev ( Or Connauton) and a 2nd round pick maybe. Sauve is the 3rd best defensive prospect for the Canucks at best and you feel he and Raymond are enough to aquire a young top 4 D-man who is right handed and can move the puck?? I am a Canucks fan but that is ridiculous.

Just talking starting points. Trying to gauge the value there and get a dialogue going. Doesn't really make sense to start gauging value by throwing out an offer of 'the moon and kitchen sink for McBain' because you're never going to find the real value once the cat is out of the bag. And despite what some Canucks fans seem to feel, Raymond isn't a complete garbage throw-in piece. A fairly young potential top-6 forward with solid 2-way play isn't completely without value.

That said, i'd do Raymond + Connauton + 2nd, if that's what it took to get him here.

ReggieDunlop7 02-15-2012 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biturbo19 (Post 44213155)
Just talking starting points. Trying to gauge the value there and get a dialogue going. Doesn't really make sense to start gauging value by throwing out an offer of 'the moon and kitchen sink for McBain' because you're never going to find the real value once the cat is out of the bag. And despite what some Canucks fans seem to feel, Raymond isn't a complete garbage throw-in piece. A fairly young potential top-6 forward with solid 2-way play isn't completely without value.

That said, i'd do Raymond + Connauton + 2nd, if that's what it took to get him here.

Same, actually. He'd be the perfect guy to target.

jeromeo87 02-15-2012 08:01 PM

IF JR trades McBain I don't think it will be for picks and prospects. We have enough of those. If JR trades either one of McBain or Pitkanen its going to be for a SOLID first line winger, something we really need.

biturbo19 02-15-2012 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeromeo87 (Post 44213839)
IF JR trades McBain I don't think it will be for picks and prospects. We have enough of those. If JR trades either one of McBain or Pitkanen its going to be for a SOLID first line winger, something we really need.

That's certainly fair enough, if that's the desired return, there's just nothing the Canucks can offer. Although i'm not sure there are a whole bunch of 1st line wingers out there looking at a change of address these days (outside of Nash, maybe Semin). So Rutherford is going to have his work cut out for him if that's the plan.

Brock Anton 02-15-2012 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biturbo19 (Post 44219499)
That's certainly fair enough, if that's the desired return, there's just nothing the Canucks can offer. Although i'm not sure there are a whole bunch of 1st line wingers out there looking at a change of address these days (outside of Nash, maybe Semin). So Rutherford is going to have his work cut out for him if that's the plan.

The problem is, JR's definition of a first line winger could be anyone. He'll go out and acquire say, Dustin Penner and play it off as "Cole's replacement", similarly to what he did to Ponikarovsky and to an extent, Stewart. So he probably wouldn't be looking for a Nash or a Semin, more than likely he'll be looking for a Penner or someone like Raymond from Vancouver.

arsmaster 02-15-2012 10:52 PM

Anything more than Raymond for Mcbain is OVERKILL.

Is he not a 3rd pairing defenseman?

See no reason to move a productive forward a developing prospect and a pick for him.

Are we all that brainwashed by tsn that we want to trade everything for 3rd pairing defenseman.

Deadline come soon, the trade offers are sucking my will to live. Oh the humanity.

Royal Canuck 02-15-2012 10:57 PM

Git R' Done.

biturbo19 02-15-2012 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock Anton (Post 44229113)
The problem is, JR's definition of a first line winger could be anyone. He'll go out and acquire say, Dustin Penner and play it off as "Cole's replacement", similarly to what he did to Ponikarovsky and to an extent, Stewart. So he probably wouldn't be looking for a Nash or a Semin, more than likely he'll be looking for a Penner or someone like Raymond from Vancouver.

:laugh:

well, if that's the case, then we do have a '1st line winger' Raymond to potentially offer. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by arsmaster (Post 44231305)
Anything more than Raymond for Mcbain is OVERKILL.

Is he not a 3rd pairing defenseman?

See no reason to move a productive forward a developing prospect and a pick for him.

Are we all that brainwashed by tsn that we want to trade everything for 3rd pairing defenseman.

Deadline come soon, the trade offers are sucking my will to live. Oh the humanity.

He would land on the 3rd pairing in Vancouver to start with, yes. He's a young, developing top-4 guy though. And thus unlike most of the various other 'depth' rental guys fans seem to be after, McBain has upside and the potential to step right up to the top-4 when called upon, work the PP effectively, and move the puck well.

The most important aspect for me, is that i'd much rather make the extra outlay of assets to bring in someone who will have a promising future with the team and room to grow, rather than a pure rental band-aid who doesn't really fit the system, and will likely walk away in the summer.

ZetterBurger 02-15-2012 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arsmaster (Post 44231305)
Anything more than Raymond for Mcbain is OVERKILL.

Is he not a 3rd pairing defenseman?

See no reason to move a productive forward a developing prospect and a pick for him.

Are we all that brainwashed by tsn that we want to trade everything for 3rd pairing defenseman.

Deadline come soon, the trade offers are sucking my will to live. Oh the humanity.

Alex Edler was a third pairing defenseman at one point. So was Lidstrom. McBain has a ton of potential.

Bgav 02-15-2012 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZetterBurger (Post 44211209)
McBain won't be moved. So Hodgson. But what do I know?

Child please

arsmaster 02-16-2012 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZetterBurger (Post 44236105)
Alex Edler was a third pairing defenseman at one point. So was Lidstrom. McBain has a ton of potential.

Let's get real. He's been passed by Faulk already and isn't checking top lines.

He's on the 3rd pair in Carolina a bottom 3 team in the NHL all season.

I like him as a player and I'd even contemplate Raymond straight up but it's not like McBain is the guy you move prospects and picks + contributing roster players for IMO.

They'd have to be sure he could and will be a top 4 defenseman soon if that's the package. I'd just as soon call up young Tanev.

jeromeo87 02-16-2012 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock Anton (Post 44229113)
The problem is, JR's definition of a first line winger could be anyone. He'll go out and acquire say, Dustin Penner and play it off as "Cole's replacement", similarly to what he did to Ponikarovsky and to an extent, Stewart. So he probably wouldn't be looking for a Nash or a Semin, more than likely he'll be looking for a Penner or someone like Raymond from Vancouver.

I think JR just had X amount of dollars to use and he signed Poni and Stewart, hoping for the best. Granted, he could have saved some money by not signing Kaberle, but he was looking for a PP specialist AND no one really knew Faulk would play like he has.

JR HAS said that this may be the first offseason in franchise history where the organization goes out and signs one of top free agents. We'll see, I suppose...

impeach estaalo 02-16-2012 12:38 AM

McBain's not a top 4 defenseman at the present time and I'm not sure if he ever will be.

The only NHL defenseman worse along the boards is Tomas Kaberle. McBain gets absolutely manhandled.

He can make a good outlet pass if he has the time and space, but he's a turnover machine in the defensive zone with any sort of pressure.

He *is* an excellent player in the offensive zone , but with the huge, glaring flaws in his defensive game it's difficult to call him a Top 4 defenseman. And that's probably why he doesn't play in the Top 4 for one of the worst defensive teams in the league.


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