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-   -   News Article: Sports Illustrated Says: No Rebuild, Just a New GM + Retool (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1116307)

Hugo Sham 02-24-2012 12:21 AM

Sports Illustrated Says: No Rebuild, Just a New GM + Retool
 
relatively optimistic:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...tml?xid=cnnbin

habtastic 02-24-2012 12:27 AM

I agree strongly with it. Just need a readjustment. Look at Ott and NJ this year. I'm more worried that we do something stupid than don't do anything.

hogtownhabsfan* 02-24-2012 12:35 AM

Honestly I think Gauthier is doing a heck of a job, pretty much every move has been a win, and a one year tank is exactly what we need to acquire that one elite forward that has been eluding us. The on ice results are obviously disappointing, but thats not the GMs responsibility. Not sold on RC though.

Zorba 02-24-2012 12:39 AM

I liked the article right until he mentioned Enqgvist as depth. Everything else I agree with. Gomez will be gone, Im not so sure if Molson will get rid of Kaberle as well. Playing with other people money is easy. Im positive Gomez is a gonner

Frozenice 02-24-2012 12:39 AM

Why would a new GM go the tune-up route? If we are still a playoff bubble team in 2 years he'll be sent down the road, too. That's why GM's love the 5 year plan because it gives them 5 years to make something happen.

His knowledge on the Habs seems weak, like why would we even consider buying out Gomez and he's wrong big time about AK.

LyricalLyricist 02-24-2012 12:54 AM

You know, usually when a GM fires the assistant coach, then the head coach and even gets worse results while taking on a contract like kaberle's(who I find is a good player, just not what we need and not for that much) a change is made. It may not be, but I can only hope at least, that the GM position is at least analyzed from the owners. If there is a better fit, bye gauthier, if not, then keep him. He hasn't impressed me overall, he's been average at best in my eyes.

Strik_IX 02-24-2012 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frozenice (Post 44778859)
His knowledge on the Habs seems weak, like why would we even consider buying out Gomez and he's wrong big time about AK.

You buy out Gomez to free up some cap space, you suck it up, call it a mistake and move on.

As far as AK is concerned I think he's exaggerating a bit. One thing's for sure, AK definitely isn't your example of consistency.

I think the article reflects how I feel about what needs to be done with the team in order to get back on track. New GM, new coach, deal out some D and/or anyone that's not targeted as part of the team's future to get a forward or two that fit and find a way to deal with those god forsaken contracts.

Hopefully we actually do end up in the last spots and can pick up a young star, at this point I think it's worth it.

Honestly, I think it could all work out.

ECWHSWI 02-24-2012 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strik_IX (Post 44779591)
You buy out Gomez to free up some cap space, you suck it up, call it a mistake and move on.

As far as AK is concerned I think he's exaggerating a bit. One thing's for sure, AK definitely isn't your example of consistency.

I think the article reflects how I feel about what needs to be done with the team in order to get back on track. New GM, new coach, deal out some D and/or anyone that's not targeted as part of the team's future to get a forward or two that fit and find a way to deal with those god forsaken contracts.

Hopefully we actually do end up in the last spots and can pick up a young star, at this point I think it's worth it.

Honestly, I think it could all work out.

actually, you add to the cap by doing so as it becomes more years at a lesser cap...

might as well send him in the AHL.

Strik_IX 02-24-2012 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECWHSWI (Post 44780047)
actually, you add to the cap by doing so as it becomes more years at a lesser cap...

might as well send him in the AHL.

I'm not opposed to burying him in the minors though it's gonna cost the full amount of the contract and I'm not sure which option Molson would prefer. (IMO probably the one where he doesn't have to spend an NHL star salary on an AHL wash-up, but your guess is as good as mine)

Agnostic 02-24-2012 02:01 AM

Article boils down to this sentence from the article:

"A quick sense of order is possible if owner Geoff Molson brings in an astute GM who has a clear direction based on what this current team has."

Tick Tock Pierre, tick tock.

Shad 02-24-2012 02:04 AM

Still don't know where all the PG hate is coming from. Then again, Montreal fans won't be happy with any GM, coach, or player unless they have a season record of 82-0-0 and a playoff record of 16-0. Even then something would be found to complain about.:shakehead

Agnostic 02-24-2012 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shad (Post 44781377)
Still don't know where all the PG hate is coming from. Then again, Montreal fans won't be happy with any GM, coach, or player unless they have a season record of 82-0-0 and a playoff record of 16-0. Even then something would be found to complain about.:shakehead

Really, you have a computer and can read this forum, you've read this article, you must have TV and can hear comments from Lebrun and others. You think it's just irrantional Hab fans who have an opinion?

Gauthier is regarded as a sham GM, smartest man in the room as long as he's alone, the builder of Shady Acres, the rest home where bad contracts go to die. He's not a builder at all.

HockeyF3ind 02-24-2012 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strik_IX (Post 44781123)
I'm not opposed to burying him in the minors though it's gonna cost the full amount of the contract and I'm not sure which option Molson would prefer. (IMO probably the one where he doesn't have to spend an NHL star salary on an AHL wash-up, but your guess is as good as mine)

Source
Here's the difference.
If they bought him out they would save 3.34 million dollars in the end, than if they left him him in the NHL or AHL.
But if they buried him in the minors instead of a buyout they would save 11.375 millon in cap space over the next 4 years.

Frozenice 02-24-2012 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agnostic (Post 44781303)
Article boils down to this sentence from the article:

"A quick sense of order is possible if owner Geoff Molson brings in an astute GM who has a clear direction based on what this current team has."

Tick Tock Pierre, tick tock.

Here's the paradox: If you hire an "astute GM" do you really think he's going to put his reputation on the line in the oldest, most prestigious hockey franchise in the world by coming in here, adding and subtracting a few minor pieces and see what happens.

You can probably get someone like McGuire to shuffle around a few chairs under the direction of Gainey, Martin and Gauthier but I think you'd have a tough time getting a top GM candidate who's willing to do that.

WG 02-24-2012 06:08 AM

If PG goes I think a new GM has a chance to look really smart right away. You start by getting Markov and Gionta back so that's two pretty important additions you get for free. Draft Grigorenko and hopefully he can start right away with the Habs, he can play wing for now and get eased into a centre role over time. Make one FA splash to sign Ryan Suter, so the D is either adequately covered if you don't have Markov or becomes a real strength if you still have him. Sign a suitable 4th line centre (Gaustad, for example) and maybe a more feisty 4th liner, and rock n' roll.

DD-Cole-Max
Plek-Gionta-Grigorenko
Eller-Moen-Bourque
Gaustad-White-Asham
Darche

Markov-Suter
Subban-Gorges
Emelin-Kaberle
Diaz

As the season unfolds, give Kabs 1st pairing PP and try to get his stats up to make him tradeable then slide Diaz into a regular role. Trade Gionta at the deadline or offseason depending on how the team does, slide Leblanc/Gallagher into his slot.

Ideally, team gets Kabs gone and can manage to resign AK or similar scoring forward and drop Moen to 4th line with White.

hockeyfan2k11 02-24-2012 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hogtownhabsfan (Post 44778699)
Honestly I think Gauthier is doing a heck of a job, pretty much every move has been a win, and a one year tank is exactly what we need to acquire that one elite forward that has been eluding us. The on ice results are obviously disappointing, but thats not the GMs responsibility. Not sold on RC though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shad (Post 44781377)
Still don't know where all the PG hate is coming from. Then again, Montreal fans won't be happy with any GM, coach, or player unless they have a season record of 82-0-0 and a playoff record of 16-0. Even then something would be found to complain about.:shakehead

It's baffling that people have this view of PG's work. Absolutely baffling.

Ohashi_Jouzu 02-24-2012 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECWHSWI (Post 44780047)
actually, you add to the cap by doing so as it becomes more years at a lesser cap...

might as well send him in the AHL.

Wrong, and wrong, actually. You lower the cap hit, at least for every year that's left in the term of the bought-out contract. Sure, after that it's an "extra" hit for a player that's not there, but if the cap goes up by an amount similar to that extra hit (for example) then you can look at that as coming out "even" because...

... wait for it...

... if you send him to the AHL, that contract still counts toward your 50 max, and the point is to get rid of him so you can bring in a replacement/improvement and go in a different direction. Burying him in the minors does little to help the strength of the Habs team unless there's actually a better NHLer in Hamilton ready to take his spot. I think you forgot about that important detail, and I submit that currently there aren't any better options (just different ones) down there.

Also, buying him out at least gives him the option of possibly getting picked up by whichever NHL team might be willing to take a flyer on him (or letting him play in Europe, or whatever suits his fancy best), instead of "dooming" him to play for peanuts with a bunch of kids.

Lafleurs Guy 02-24-2012 07:06 AM

I agree with much of what he says. But when he says we don't need a rebuild... he's right if you're only talking abou the playoffs. We've definitely got a lot of pieces in place to be better in the near future and we have some up and coming prospects on the blueline that could be good. A lot of the pieces are there now to build around.

But if we want to put ourselves into cup contending position then I think we need to rebuild more aggressively. Not an Oilers style 'tank' but definitely more proactive than we have been.

Again, it's a question of goals. We can improve relatively quickly (I mean how much worse can we be than this year?) but cup contention is a whole different ballgame. Hopefully the new GM understands this.

Also, he's dead on right when he says that we can't count on Markov. We can't. Anything he gives us is gravy. Plan that he's not going to be healthy and take anything he gives you as a bonus. If he's healthy all the way and returns to form it just makes us that much better. Too often we assume the best case scenario and don't plan for the worst. And that's the path to failure because the best case scenario rarely happens for any team.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shad (Post 44781377)
Still don't know where all the PG hate is coming from. Then again, Montreal fans won't be happy with any GM, coach, or player unless they have a season record of 82-0-0 and a playoff record of 16-0. Even then something would be found to complain about.:shakehead

I read these kinds of quotes and just have to laugh.

We've been stuck in neutral for the better part of two decades and since PG has taken over it's been no better. If you can't see the clown show that's taken place behind the scenes this year then I don't think anyone can really explain it to you.

Hab fans have good reason to be annoyed. You should be demanding more from your GM man.

WeThreeKings 02-24-2012 08:33 AM

What we need is a young assistant GM who has a fresh approach to the game. Who understands the new facets and what it takes to win. A real visionary.

Our new GM needs to be someone who is stoic. Does not get influenced by the politics and the pressure of the city. Someone who can stand stone-faced in the throng of reporters who are trying to make stories out of nothing; call them out for what they are and run the operation the way the organization dictates it should be. Not through what the public pressure is.

The Gal Pals 02-24-2012 09:10 AM

I completely diasagree with the author's statement regarding Palushaj and Engqvist pushing to be regulars. We have a lot of D prospects in the cupboard but offensively it's dismal.

Miller Time 02-24-2012 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agnostic (Post 44781303)
Article boils down to this sentence from the article:

"A quick sense of order is possible if owner Geoff Molson brings in an astute GM who has a clear direction based on what this current team has."

Tick Tock Pierre, tick tock.

i swear, eliot must be trolling HFboards for material... i've been repeating that same line, almost word for word, for weeks now.


direction, astute. 2 qualities the new GM/Leadership need to bring, 2 qualities that PG CLEARLY lacks, no matter how much some people try to sugar coat his moves.


writing is on the wall, just a question of wether or not Molson knows how to read :naughty:

MathMan 02-24-2012 03:34 PM

In other news, water is wet. ;)

But it's nice to see that some MSM guys have enough sense to paint it like this.

MathMan 02-24-2012 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WG (Post 44784231)
If PG goes I think a new GM has a chance to look really smart right away.

I agree, for a new GM starting a career it's a perfect situation:

- Prestigious team
- Virtually unlimited budget
- Real NHL roster with strength at all positions and interesting youth
- High draft pick
- Ridiculously low expectations -- MSM will no doubt expect another lottery pick a la Edmonton

The next guy could probably just draft, fill in the roster with fillers, and even doing absolutely nothing else personnel-wise he'd still get credited for a gigantic turnaround. Nevermind that he'll have the space and funds to go hunting for top UFAs like Semin.

There will be one real, huge challenge though: finding a capable, analytical puck-possession coach who speaks French. This will be difficult, especially since the most qualified guys are either unavailable or were just fired by the organization.

Miller Time 02-24-2012 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MathMan (Post 44816825)
I agree, for a new GM starting a career it's a perfect situation:

- Prestigious team
- Virtually unlimited budget
- Real NHL roster with strength at all positions and interesting youth
- High draft pick
- Ridiculously low expectations -- MSM will no doubt expect another lottery pick a la Edmonton

The next guy could probably just draft, fill in the roster with fillers, and even doing absolutely nothing else personnel-wise he'd still get credited for a gigantic turnaround. Nevermind that he'll have the space and funds to go hunting for top UFAs like Semin.

There will be one real, huge challenge though: finding a capable, analytical puck-possession coach who speaks French. This will be difficult, especially since the most qualified guys are either unavailable or were just fired by the organization.

sort of like Gainey did...

Lafleurs Guy 02-24-2012 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MathMan (Post 44816825)
I agree, for a new GM starting a career it's a perfect situation:

- Prestigious team
- Virtually unlimited budget
- Real NHL roster with strength at all positions and interesting youth
- High draft pick
- Ridiculously low expectations -- MSM will no doubt expect another lottery pick a la Edmonton

The next guy could probably just draft, fill in the roster with fillers, and even doing absolutely nothing else personnel-wise he'd still get credited for a gigantic turnaround. Nevermind that he'll have the space and funds to go hunting for top UFAs like Semin.

There will be one real, huge challenge though: finding a capable, analytical puck-possession coach who speaks French. This will be difficult, especially since the most qualified guys are either unavailable or were just fired by the organization.

Please stop whining about Martin... he's gone and for good reason.


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