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-   -   OT:Pitchers to look for (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=113522)

Nikkowar 11-13-2004 10:29 PM

OT:Pitchers to look for
 
So who,out of these pitchers do you think we should go after this offseason?

Cuiff 11-14-2004 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PizzapieZeppelin18
So who,out of these pitchers do you think we should go after this offseason?


I would like to see them go after Pedro Martinez but this weeka$$ organization will not spend the money!

FlyHigh 11-14-2004 02:24 PM

I would go for Pavano, he dominated in Florida last year.

GKJ 11-14-2004 04:17 PM

Derek Lowe. He may be inconsistent, but the man knows how to win.

blah 11-14-2004 05:31 PM

Lowe has Boras for an agent, based on what'd it cost to sign him I'd rather they get Cory Lidle.

Pedro is on the decline, if it's only a 2 year deal fine, anything more than that and there's no way they should sign him. He'll probably resign w/ Boston though.

Milton and Morris they should avoid. Williams is kind of old and wants a multi-year deal.

I'd take Radke he's more of a number 2 but he's very consistant. Pavano would also be fine if the price isn't too high.

I wouldn't mind a season of David Wells or a season of Kevin Brown if the Yanks pay some of his salary.

stanley 11-14-2004 06:57 PM

Lidle would definitely be the cheapest, and I think he's a pretty good bargain. Good intrinsic stats. As for the list, the two who would hold my interest were I Phillie GM (note I didn't say "Ed Wade") would be Radke and Pavano, in order of choice. Radke has really good K/BB and WHIP numbers and has been consistent throughout his career. Pavano has a shorter resume and slightly poorer numbers, but I think he's going to command more money over a longer period of time.

Lowe had a great post-season, but he has been SO inconsistent that he will be very much overpaid this winter. His numbers over the past two years have been awful. Not bad - awful. If you watched the WS, you saw the 2002 version of D-Lowe, which has been the exception and not the rule. In my opinion, he's not that good, where "that" equals the amount of money his agent thinks he's worth. As has been suggested, Boras will extract cashola from somebody, and in a way that will make the buyer feel as though calling the police and his insurance company is the most appropriate thing to do. Don't get beer goggles from what you saw - $10M for a sinkerball pitcher with a 1.61 WHIP and a sub-2 K/BB is a bad deal eight days a week, and three good performances against reeling teams (although I must admit, his six and seven innings of Game 7 ALCS and Gm 4 WS, respectively, were about as unhittable as somebody has been in recent memory) do not a multi-million, franchise-handcuffing contract make.

Ask yourself this: Whom from that staff would you take? Lowe or Bronson Arroyo. It's a no-brainer even if we leave out the money. Arroyo has become - at this point in their respective careers - the better pitcher and BY FAR the better bargain. It sounds silly, but if you look who's more successful at getting outs, it's Arroyo and not by a slim margain.

I think the Phillies would do better to try and trade Howard for young pitching. Somebody would buy on that. They don't seem to have much of a plan right now.

Dr Love 11-14-2004 07:22 PM

Pedro and Radke would never come here. Frankly, I'd be completely shocked if they signed anyone better than Cory Lidle or Derek Lowe. Management has dropped the ball one too many times, I have lost nearly all interest in this team.

FlyerFire 11-15-2004 03:44 PM

I've got other names
 
rumored to be heading our way possibly.COL pitcher Chacon,CIN infielder LARKIN?

GKJ 11-15-2004 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebellionhellion2002
CIN infielder LARKIN?

not with Rollins here

FlyerFire 11-15-2004 08:27 PM

Larkin
 
saw that rumor a couple of times both in Philly papers and TSN.ca.also another name connected to the Phils- Kevin Brown :eek:

Blindside9711 11-15-2004 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Love
Pedro and Radke would never come here. Frankly, I'd be completely shocked if they signed anyone better than Cory Lidle or Derek Lowe. Management has dropped the ball one too many times, I have lost nearly all interest in this team.

Yeah, everybody knows that Delgado will become too expensive for Toronto's blood, so they'll cut ties with him and sign Radke instead. :D ;)

flyersrock1 11-16-2004 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blindside9711
Yeah, everybody knows that Delgado will become too expensive for Toronto's blood, so they'll cut ties with him and sign Radke instead. :D ;)

No one is worth 17 million a year. He is a great player but on this team (Jays) will not make us win. Let him go and spend the money on the Pitching.

Blindside9711 11-16-2004 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flyersrock1
No one is worth 17 million a year. He is a great player but on this team (Jays) will not make us win. Let him go and spend the money on the Pitching.

Stupid thing about it is that we traded away Phelps (who was supposed to be Delgado's replacement) at the deadline, and Hinske (who was supposed to have a good bat) has been average at best apart from his rookie year... So aside from Delgado and sometimes Wells, there's not a whole lot of power in the lineup anymore. Our pitchers don't scare anyone (even Doc was mediocre this season) and our infield is sketchy once you get past O-Dawg. The Jays need alot of help at every position, and 17-22 mil' ain't enough to get the quality AND quantity of talent necessary to beat out the Yanks/Red Sox.

Dr Love 11-16-2004 11:44 AM

The latest rumor is Carl Pavano. I'm not convinced that Carl Pavano is on the rise, simply that he had a career year. I have to look at his peripherals more, but he seems to me to be the FA bust of the year.

flyersrock1 11-16-2004 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blindside9711
Stupid thing about it is that we traded away Phelps (who was supposed to be Delgado's replacement) at the deadline, and Hinske (who was supposed to have a good bat) has been average at best apart from his rookie year... So aside from Delgado and sometimes Wells, there's not a whole lot of power in the lineup anymore. Our pitchers don't scare anyone (even Doc was mediocre this season) and our infield is sketchy once you get past O-Dawg. The Jays need alot of help at every position, and 17-22 mil' ain't enough to get the quality AND quantity of talent necessary to beat out the Yanks/Red Sox.

We need help almost everywhere. It's time that they just totally broke the team down and start over. Time to build around Wells. Hate to see Delrago go but if he wants more than 9 million it would be had to justify. We seem to have to many one year wonders as Jays. Hinske is turning into one. Almost makes me miss Kelly Gruber. :joker:

Blindside9711 11-16-2004 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flyersrock1
It's time that they just totally broke the team down and start over.

Disagree. It would be a good idea, except for the fact that we don't have all that much to build around. Aside from guys like Rios, Cash, Quiroz and maybe Griffin, there ain't that much in the cupboard.

FlyerFire 11-16-2004 01:59 PM

PHILS just resigned LIDLE
 
thats a good first step :handclap:

Nikkowar 11-16-2004 02:27 PM

seconded. Now,I would like Pavano,but I'm sure that hometown boy would rather go to his hometown..

FlyerFire 11-16-2004 03:16 PM

the PHILS
 
don't have enough to interest Pavano.You know Wade lowballed his offer. :shakehead

Blindside9711 11-16-2004 03:17 PM

Question for the Phils fans... What are your thoughts about Placido Polanco? Strengths, weaknesses, likelihood of re-signing with Philly?
Price range?
I'm just looking at the list of free agents at SS and he looks better than any of our utility players that have been manning the Jays middle infield for a while.

MASK 11-16-2004 06:57 PM

Radke is who I would target. Pavano would be to expensive for us and I don't really think he's worth it. Also signing Wells would be nice and if we could get Brown on the cheap I would do that too.

Nikkowar 11-16-2004 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blindside9711
Question for the Phils fans... What are your thoughts about Placido Polanco? Strengths, weaknesses, likelihood of re-signing with Philly?
Price range?
I'm just looking at the list of free agents at SS and he looks better than any of our utility players that have been manning the Jays middle infield for a while.

Polanco isn't comming back. Sorry guys. Wade's not going to resign him, and he's using Chase Utley instead. Although,maybe we'll keep Polanco,maybe. He's a hardworker, always gives 110% every game,not a whiner,doesn't complain,just comes to work everyday,and plays hard. The thing is,well,he's around what.....28-30(?),and Utley is 26,he's most likely to have Utley as the permanent 2nd baseman..


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