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Senor Rational 11-24-2004 12:17 AM

Shawn Belle
 
What does everybody see his future as being?

Rabid Ranger 11-24-2004 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senor Rational
What does everybody see his future as being?


He's been labeled as all tools and no toolbox, so we'll see if he can overcome that. Belle has alot of physical ability, especially his skating, but doesn't think the game all that well. He can be a solid four, and more if his brain catches up with the rest of his game.

espo* 11-24-2004 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rabid Ranger
He's been labeled as all tools and no toolbox, so we'll see if he can overcome that. Belle has alot of physical ability, especially his skating, but doesn't think the game all that well. He can be a solid four, and more if his brain catches up with the rest of his game.

Agree with this.He has the tools but he has a difficult time thinking the game correctly,it could come in time and i think some good coaching can go a long way in fixing this.If i was a coach i'd sure like to work with him because he's got the physical gifts to be a real good player.Skates like the wind,big shot,stong as an ox.Al Iafrate did'nt think the game very well when he came in the league either but he sure had the tools and in time he really improved to the the point where he was one dangerous guy.I think Belle can really be a player with some coaching and more experience but he's a bit of a project to be sure.

Hossa 11-24-2004 01:52 PM

Belle to me is a lot like Bret Hedican. Hedican's got a lot of offensive tools, but he has no offensive instincts. Belle can skate well, has a hard shot, but he doesn't have a great first pass, doesn't have a feel for how to jump into the rush, or how to run a powerplay. Personally, I think he could be coached into being a solid NHL blueliner, albeit a bit of a journeyman.

Senor Rational 11-24-2004 01:59 PM

Thanks for the input I have only seen hi for a few seconds in the WJC and didnt get a good feel for him. I wouldve liked the blues to trade him away for a forward prospect instead of a goalie. The boy can sure skate cant he?

Starsdude 11-24-2004 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hossa
Belle to me is a lot like Bret Hedican. Hedican's got a lot of offensive tools, but he has no offensive instincts. Belle can skate well, has a hard shot, but he doesn't have a great first pass, doesn't have a feel for how to jump into the rush, or how to run a powerplay. Personally, I think he could be coached into being a solid NHL blueliner, albeit a bit of a journeyman.

If Belle is Hedican, great. Hedican is solid and can skate. he gives you the idea he can be more than he is but is the kind of guy most teams would trade for at playoff time.

Fransson and Daley are likely NHlers IMO
Grossman, Erskine Jancevski Nickerson Fistric, if two make it along with Belle it means 5 homegrown d-men, That is awesome production given we went years without producing decent production from the farm .

Hossa 11-24-2004 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starsdude
If Belle is Hedican, great. Hedican is solid and can skate. he gives you the idea he can be more than he is but is the kind of guy most teams would trade for at playoff time.

Fransson and Daley are likely NHlers IMO
Grossman, Erskine Jancevski Nickerson Fistric, if two make it along with Belle it means 5 homegrown d-men, That is awesome production given we went years without producing decent production from the farm .

Belle's upside in my opinion is a Hedican type of player. I just don't see him being much better. And while I agree Hedican is solid and can skate and all that, Belle has to clean up his brain farts before being the "kind of guy most teams would trade for at playoff time." Hedican is succesful because he knows his limitations, despite good tools, and plays it simple. Belle's expectations (especially offensively) have been unrealistic thus far, and the key for him to be successful is to refine certain parts of his game and understand his offensive limitations, despite good skating ability. Hopefully he can do that, I like him.

Daley's more or less an NHLer in my books, but Fransson is by no means a likely NHLer. Defencemen touted to have stud potential (don't necessarily agree that Fransson possesses this, but that's another story) who are likely NHLers don't go in the 2nd round any year, let alone years like 2004, which was average at best.

Just my 0.02$.

Chaos 11-24-2004 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hossa
but Fransson is by no means a likely NHLer. Defencemen touted to have stud potential (don't necessarily agree that Fransson possesses this, but that's another story) who are likely NHLers don't go in the 2nd round any year, let alone years like 2004, which was average at best.

Just my 0.02$.

I certainly hope you're not trying to use draft position to try and 'put down'(the best phrase I can think of) a player. After all, Lidstrom was drafted in the 3rd round(I could go on about draft position all day). The reason he didnt go until the second was because he was a year older than the rest of the draft class, due to dropping out of the 2003 draft due to injuries.

Hossa 11-24-2004 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos
I certainly hope you're not trying to use draft position to try and 'put down'(the best phrase I can think of) a player. After all, Lidstrom was drafted in the 3rd round(I could go on about draft position all day). The reason he didnt go until the second was because he was a year older than the rest of the draft class, due to dropping out of the 2003 draft due to injuries.

I know draft position isn't that important, but he hasn't exactly lit up the scene this year either. He's a guy who people have talked about for a while as having good potential. This isn't a guy who has been rising up the charts lately, he's been on the scene for a while, and he hasn't been improving quite at the rate some would hope. Personally, I don't find it that surprising as the Swedish developmental system isn't exactly a well-oiled machine right now, but I'll refrain from heading off on that tangent.

All I'm saying is that Fransson may have potential, but he's not a likely NHLer. To group him with Daley as a likely NHLer is silly becuase Fransson has a ways to go before being considered a safe bet or a blue chipper. I'd also say that Belle is safer at this point, and I'd personally take Belle as a prospect long before Fransson, but that's just me.

Chaos 11-24-2004 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hossa
I know draft position isn't that important, but he hasn't exactly lit up the scene this year either. He's a guy who people have talked about for a while as having good potential. This isn't a guy who has been rising up the charts lately, he's been on the scene for a while, and he hasn't been improving quite at the rate some would hope. Personally, I don't find it that surprising as the Swedish developmental system isn't exactly a well-oiled machine right now, but I'll refrain from heading off on that tangent.

All I'm saying is that Fransson may have potential, but he's not a likely NHLer. To group him with Daley as a likely NHLer is silly becuase Fransson has a ways to go before being considered a safe bet or a blue chipper. I'd also say that Belle is safer at this point, and I'd personally take Belle as a prospect long before Fransson, but that's just me.

Ah I see your point, and I agree, simply because Fransson is a few years away. But among all the Stars defenseman prospects, he rather easily has the highest upside IMO. Sure he hasn't been lighting up the scoreboard, but from what the Swedish posters have been saying, he has been playing excellent, and has some people over there saying he is the best defenseman in all of Sweden, and drawing some comparisons to Lidstrom. Is Belle safer at this point? Maybe, simply because he is already used to the NA game. But in the long run, Fransson is going to be a much much better player than Belle IMO.

Hossa 11-24-2004 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos
Ah I see your point, and I agree, simply because Fransson is a few years away. But among all the Stars defenseman prospects, he rather easily has the highest upside IMO. Sure he hasn't been lighting up the scoreboard, but from what the Swedish posters have been saying, he has been playing excellent, and has some people over there saying he is the best defenseman in all of Sweden, and drawing some comparisons to Lidstrom. Is Belle safer at this point? Maybe, simply because he is already used to the NA game. But in the long run, Fransson is going to be a much much better player than Belle IMO.

Fair enough. Just for clarification, I'm guessing you aren't including Daley when you suggest he "rather easily has the highest upside" among Stars prospects. If you put Fransson ahead of Daley, then that is where I get off your ride. Personally, I'm just neither high on Fransson nor any Swedish prospects at the moment considering the status of the country's hockey program. Maybe I shouldn't "discriminate" against Fransson, but when a one-time superpower can't even get a player in the first round (not to bring up draft position again ;) ) or in my opinion put together a legitimate threat at the World Juniors anymore, I have reason to be concerned.

Chaos 11-24-2004 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hossa
Fair enough. Just for clarification, I'm guessing you aren't including Daley when you suggest he "rather easily has the highest upside" among Stars prospects. If you put Fransson ahead of Daley, then that is where I get off your ride. Personally, I'm just neither high on Fransson nor any Swedish prospects at the moment considering the status of the country's hockey program. Maybe I shouldn't "discriminate" against Fransson, but when a one-time superpower can't even get a player in the first round (not to bring up draft position again ;) ) or in my opinion put together a legitimate threat at the World Juniors anymore, I have reason to be concerned.

In the long term, I think Fransson has just a bit more upside than Daley, because he is just as good a skater and offensive player, while being a little bigger(the only time I really consider size is when you have two similar players) and slightly better defensively. I see Daley as a solid/above average #3 guy, where as I see Fransson as a solid #2 guy(and Im not the only one saying this. Alot of the Swedish posters see that as well). Obviously Daley has a better chance of reaching his potential because he is further along in his development than Fransson.


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