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-   -   Salary Cap: Offseason Discussion Part III (Contract/FA chart in post #1) (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1182737)

shureshot66 05-02-2012 11:48 PM

Offseason Discussion Part III (Contract/FA chart in post #1)
 
Keep in mind that cap projections are *extremely* sketchy right now with the CBA set to expire. Take it all with a grain of salt.


2012-13 LOOKAHEAD

As always, all figures are cap numbers, not salaries, and are taken directly from www.capgeek.com.


Estimated 2012-2013 salary ceiling: .~70,000,000
Projected cap spending: .....................59,566,667
Projected cap space: .........................10,433,333


PITTSBURGH PENGUINS
Forward.................
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Sidney Crosby
C
24
8,700,000
UFA
 
Evgeni Malkin
C
25
8,700,000
8,700,000
UFA
James Neal
LW
24
5,000,000
5,000,000
5,000,000
Jordan Staal
C
23
4,000,000
UFA
 
Chris Kunitz
LW
32
3,725,000
3,725,000
UFA
Tyler Kennedy
RW
25
2,000,000
RFA
 
Matt Cooke
LW
33
1,800,000
UFA
 
Pascal Dupuis
LW
32
1,500,000
UFA
 
Craig Adams
RW
34
675,000
UFA
 
Dustin Jeffrey
C
23
575,000
RFA
 
Joe Vitale
C
26
550,000
550,000
UFA
Defense.................
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Paul Martin
D
30
5,000,000
5,000,000
5,000,000
Zbynek Michalek
D
29
4,000,000
4,000,000
4,000,000
Brooks Orpik
D
31
3,750,000
3,750,000
UFA
Kris Letang
D
24
3,500,000
3,500,000
UFA
Deryk Engelland
D
29
566,667
566,667
UFA
Ben Lovejoy
D
27
525,000
UFA
 
Goalie....................
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Marc-Andre Fleury
G
27
5,000,000
5,000,000
5,000,000



WILKES-BARRE/SCRANTON PENGUINS
Forward...............
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Beau Bennett
RW
20
900,000
900,000
900,000
Brian Gibbons
C
23
900,000
RFA
 
Paul Thompson
LW
23
900,000
RFA
 
Adam Payerl
C
21
850,000
850,000
850,000
Nick Petersen
RW
22
566,667
RFA
 
Zach Sill
C
23
535,000
RFA
 
Defense...............
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Philip Samuelsson
D
20
900,000
900,000
RFA
Simon Despres
D
20
840,000
840,000
RFA
Goalie..................
Pos.
Age
2012-13
2013-14
2014-15
Patrick Killeen
G
21
548,333
RFA
 



UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
Player..................
Pos.
Age
2011-12
News & Notes
Steve Sullivan
LW
37
1,500,000
Seems to be a significant help to the power play
Arron Asham
RW
33
775,000
Suspension probably punched ticket out of town
Brent Johnson
G
34
600,000
Game suddenly fell off a cliff this winter
Steve MacIntyre
LW
31
600,000
Is Shero's stance on enforcers changing?
Alexandre Picard
D
26
600,000
Will likely move along for a better crack at the NHL
Jason Williams
RW
31
600,000
Disappointing as an NHL depth signing
Richard Park
RW
35
550,000
Reasonable option as a 13th/14th forward
Ryan Craig
C
30
525,000
WBS captain two years running
Colin McDonald
RW
27
525,000
Dropped off to just 14 goals this season
Scott Munroe
G
30
525,000
Veteran AHL option who can carry the load
Brad Thiessen
G
25
525,000
Group VI UFA -- Spring NHL audition underwhelming



RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
Player..................
Pos.
Age
2011-12
News & Notes
Matt Niskanen
D
25
1,500,000
Keep him around or make room for Despres and Co.?
Mattias Modig
G
24
875,000
Spent entire season in Europe rehabbing from injury
Keven Veilleux
C
22
854,167
Injured -- Typically cursed 2nd round pick
Casey Pierro-Zabotel
LW
23
850,000
Already banished from the organization
Carl Sneep
D
24
850,000
Still lagging behind many other defensive prospects
Brian Strait
D
24
850,000
A good bet to stick with the big club as a 6/7 option
Eric Tangradi
LW
23
845,833
Skillset sadly hasn't endeared him to Bylsma
Alex Grant
D
23
790,000
Likely saved pro career with showing on power play
Boris Valabik
D
26
550,000
Injuries ruined season -- just misses Group VI cutoff
Robert Bortuzzo
D
22
535,000
Pens like him, but will he make it through waivers?
Cal O'Reilly
C
25
525,000
Didn't make much of an impression after waiver claim



SIGNED PROSPECTS
Player
Pos.
Age
Current Team
Contract
Joe Morrow
D
19
Portland (WHL)
3 years/925,000 per
Scott Harrington
D
18
London (OHL)
3 years/925,000 per
Tom Kuhnhackl
F
20
Niagara (OHL)
3 years/850,000 per
Reid McNeill
D
20
Barrie (OHL)
3 years/TBA



UNSIGNED PROSPECTS
Player
Pos.
Age
Current Team (League)
Kenny Agostino
F
19
Yale (ECAC)
Josh Archibald
F
19
Nebraska-Omaha (WCHA)
Nick D'Agostino
D
21
Cornell (ECAC)
Patrick Ehelechner
G
27
Nürnberg (DEL)
Ben Hanowski
F
21
St. Cloud State (WCHA)
Alexander Pechurskiy
G
21
Klin (VHL)
Joe Rogalski
D
20
Sault Ste. Marie (OHL)
Bryan Rust
F
19
Notre Dame (CCHA)
Dominik Uher
F
19
Spokane (WHL)
Alex Velischek
D
21
Providence (HEA)
Scott Wilson
F
19
UMass-Lowell (HEA)

PensFan68 05-02-2012 11:56 PM

As much as I've been against moving Orpik, pretty much just because he'd be a great life-long Pen, I really think it's the best thing to do. We need to move him and Martin, which would free up some space on D. Also, let Lovejoy go. As much as most people are down on Michalek, I still think he was a good signing and want him back.

Letang-Michalek
Nisky (Despres if we don't resign Nisky)-Engelland
Bortuzzo/Strait-big defensive d-man (Allan, Sarich, etc)

Keep Bort/Strait on the roster and have Despres as the first callup or up here if we let Nisky go (rather not). I think having these two young guys plus a big d-man drastically improves our defensive zone toughness/ability.

kai123 05-03-2012 12:34 AM

I just noticed that this team is pretty old. I hope some shakeup is made to make it a bit younger at the very least.

SEALBound 05-03-2012 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PensFan68 (Post 49195287)
As much as I've been against moving Orpik, pretty much just because he'd be a great life-long Pen, I really think it's the best thing to do. We need to move him and Martin, which would free up some space on D. Also, let Lovejoy go. As much as most people are down on Michalek, I still think he was a good signing and want him back.

Letang-Michalek
Nisky (Despres if we don't resign Nisky)-Engelland
Bortuzzo/Strait-big defensive d-man (Allan, Sarich, etc)

Keep Bort/Strait on the roster and have Despres as the first callup or up here if we let Nisky go (rather not). I think having these two young guys plus a big d-man drastically improves our defensive zone toughness/ability.

As much as I want to believe in that lineup...thats not one we can rely on in the long run.

PensFan68 05-03-2012 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SEALBound (Post 49196789)
As much as I want to believe in that lineup...thats not one we can rely on in the long run.

As much as I agree that the D is looking quite young/inexperienced, the end result can't be worse than this year. While losing Martin/Orpik/Lovejoy and replacing with a d-man/Bortuzzo/Strait may make us more inexperienced, I think the end result would be better. Don't forget all the hate Scuds got and he became a shutdown D for us when given the chance.

While I know the end result is always to be better than the previous year, this lineup wouldn't make us finish worse than we did this year (my goal of course is the cup so I guess that's bad to say). We have the firepower to get us through the regular season, it's just adding the D to get us through the playoffs.

I really think subtracting the three and adding those three more (while inexperienced) makes us better. Bortuzzo/Strait/Despres are ready for the NHL, we need to get them in. Even if we have to get a d-man at the deadline to put us over the top, so be it, but we need to start getting these young d-men involved.

SEALBound 05-03-2012 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PensFan68 (Post 49196995)
As much as I agree that the D is looking quite young/inexperienced, the end result can't be worse than this year. While losing Martin/Orpik/Lovejoy and replacing with a d-man/Bortuzzo/Strait may make us more inexperienced, I think the end result would be better. Don't forget all the hate Scuds got and he became a shutdown D for us when given the chance.

While I know the end result is always to be better than the previous year, this lineup wouldn't make us finish worse than we did this year (my goal of course is the cup so I guess that's bad to say). We have the firepower to get us through the regular season, it's just adding the D to get us through the playoffs.

I really think subtracting the three and adding those three more (while inexperienced) makes us better. Bortuzzo/Strait/Despres are ready for the NHL, we need to get them in. Even if we have to get a d-man at the deadline to put us over the top, so be it, but we need to start getting these young d-men involved.

Bortz and Strait can be our 7-8 and I'd be ecstatic. Either one could take on a #6 role in the event of an injury...but they are not the solid dmen we need right now. If we were a couple years away from competing, then I'd be all for it. We need to win right now. You don't win with what we have and you can't win with 3 rookies. That should be a slow transition. Despres next year, Morrow after that, and perhaps Harrington a year or 2 after that. My god what a crop we'll have....

Letang-Despres
Morrow-Harrington
Niskanen-Engo

Looking 5+ years ahead...THAT could be a good dcore.

GFF 05-03-2012 03:32 AM

I may get shot down in flames and it may be that MAF has a no movement that I am not aware of but bear with me.

People keep talking about big moves this summer with suggestions about moving Geno or Staalsy, so I am going to counter that with a blockbuster proposal and reasons.

Our problem is D not offense. The sooner we stop trying to give Sid a winger and start solidifying at the back the better we will be. So why move the Art Ross winner as that will create a scoring problem or our best shutdown Forward when we NEED better D.

So:

To Pittsburgh:
Luongo $5333333
Hamhuis $5000000

To Vancouver:
MAF $5000000
Martin $5000000
Kennedy $2000000

I know Hamhuis has a NTC but maybe he would waive it for Shero (or maybe not since he didn't sign here 2 years ago!)
Luongo needs a fresh start Canucks I think want a fresh face, MAF is outstanding some nights and others he falls in with our shaky D and he looks distinctly average. This is not a swipe at MAF I would love to still have him in 5 years time but I'm thinking of Cups and how to package something so we can get the solid D we need.
Without a deal for Luongo there is no way Canucks would take Martin for Hamhuis but I think send TK there for some secondary scoring and MAF for 6 years younger and potential still to be a vezina standard goalie and they may be interested. Hamhuis had 80 more hits than Martin and Martin only blocked about 20 more shots, he had more Gs As Shots and +\- of +29 compared to martins +9.

Either team could win this trade but both teams need to shake things up after a good regular season and disappointing playoffs.

That would leave our D:
Orpik Letang
Michalek Hamhuis
Engo Nisky
Depres

Forwards
Neal Geno Duper
Kunitz Sid Sully
Tangradi Staal Cooke
Adams Vitale UFA

Goalies:
Luongo
UFA

Like I said probably a stupid idea and will never happen but I believe it could be what is needed and MIGHT be something like this that Shero is looking at.

Ugene Malkin 05-03-2012 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PensFan68 (Post 49195287)
As much as I've been against moving Orpik, pretty much just because he'd be a great life-long Pen, I really think it's the best thing to do. We need to move him and Martin, which would free up some space on D. Also, let Lovejoy go. As much as most people are down on Michalek, I still think he was a good signing and want him back.

Letang-Michalek
Nisky (Despres if we don't resign Nisky)-Engelland
Bortuzzo/Strait-big defensive d-man (Allan, Sarich, etc)

Keep Bort/Strait on the roster and have Despres as the first callup or up here if we let Nisky go (rather not). I think having these two young guys plus a big d-man drastically improves our defensive zone toughness/ability.

There's just one aspect I think you are overlooking. The Pens are in a win now mode for the foreseeable future and going that young will put them on a window of 2 or three years for challenging for the cup.

I don't have an issue with Niskanen moving up, but Engelland shouldn't be a part of your top four. Despres will be worked in like all the rest have, on the bottom pairing.

Orpik, although a rough season, can't be let go considering you are not adding the element he provides back into the mix. They need more of his ilk not eliminate it altogether.

Orpik, Letang
Niskanen, Michalek
___UFA/Trade___?, Engelland
Despres

Adding a (Allan, Sarich, Gill, etc) to be the go to player with Despres mixed in on a more permanent basis as all before him seems like the most appropriate course of action.




Thanks for the work up, Shureshot.

Much appreciated.

Giant Yankee Pens 05-03-2012 07:33 AM

So, question... Did HCDB change the defensive system since 2010-11??? or did the Martin Michalek pairing just not play well this yr and did that year??? I mean, does getting rid of Paul Martin and Ben LoveJoy make all of our defensive woes go away???

SprootsMasterFlex 05-03-2012 08:28 AM

Have you guys ever thought of the idea of swapping Martin for possibly Keith Ballard (who's struggled this season, has the same term as Martin except @ 4.2M instead)? He's very physical and lefthanded. He could flourish here. He more along the lines of what we're looking for in a D and should be attainable given his struggles in Vancouver. Perhaps both teams would benefit of swapping a very good D who needs a change of scenery. Worse comes to worse, we can just ship Ballard off to St. Louis for Stewart!!!

If not Ballard, David Booth is also a good candidate.

Ominous Grey 05-03-2012 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GFF (Post 49198371)
I may get shot down in flames and it may be that MAF has a no movement that I am not aware of but bear with me.

People keep talking about big moves this summer with suggestions about moving Geno or Staalsy, so I am going to counter that with a blockbuster proposal and reasons.

Our problem is D not offense. The sooner we stop trying to give Sid a winger and start solidifying at the back the better we will be. So why move the Art Ross winner as that will create a scoring problem or our best shutdown Forward when we NEED better D.

So:

To Pittsburgh:
Luongo $5333333
Hamhuis $5000000

To Vancouver:
MAF $5000000
Martin $5000000
Kennedy $2000000


I know Hamhuis has a NTC but maybe he would waive it for Shero (or maybe not since he didn't sign here 2 years ago!)
Luongo needs a fresh start Canucks I think want a fresh face, MAF is outstanding some nights and others he falls in with our shaky D and he looks distinctly average. This is not a swipe at MAF I would love to still have him in 5 years time but I'm thinking of Cups and how to package something so we can get the solid D we need.
Without a deal for Luongo there is no way Canucks would take Martin for Hamhuis but I think send TK there for some secondary scoring and MAF for 6 years younger and potential still to be a vezina standard goalie and they may be interested. Hamhuis had 80 more hits than Martin and Martin only blocked about 20 more shots, he had more Gs As Shots and +\- of +29 compared to martins +9.

Either team could win this trade but both teams need to shake things up after a good regular season and disappointing playoffs.

That would leave our D:
Orpik Letang
Michalek Hamhuis
Engo Nisky
Depres

Forwards
Neal Geno Duper
Kunitz Sid Sully
Tangradi Staal Cooke
Adams Vitale UFA

Goalies:
Luongo
UFA

Like I said probably a stupid idea and will never happen but I believe it could be what is needed and MIGHT be something like this that Shero is looking at.

Weeeee!

Done in a half a second. No take backsies.

Ominous Grey 05-03-2012 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SprootsMasterFlex (Post 49201273)
Have you guys ever thought of the idea of swapping Martin for possibly Keith Ballard (who's struggled this season, has the same term as Martin except @ 4.2M instead)? He's very physical and lefthanded. He could flourish here. He more along the lines of what we're looking for in a D and should be attainable given his struggles in Vancouver. Perhaps both teams would benefit of swapping a very good D who needs a change of scenery. Worse comes to worse, we can just ship Ballard off to St. Louis for Stewart!!!

If not Ballard, David Booth is also a good candidate.

Ballard could be a realistic option.


And people, we aren't getting Stewart. Please let it die a peaceful death.

Sivek 05-03-2012 09:20 AM

Ballard is as bad as Martin. Pens would be much, much better off moving Martin for some middling draft choice and taking advantage of losing his terrible cap hit (5 for 3 more years) than getting a slightly less bad contract in return.

SprootsMasterFlex 05-03-2012 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sivek (Post 49202621)
Ballard is as bad as Martin. Pens would be much, much better off moving Martin for some middling draft choice and taking advantage of losing his terrible cap hit (5 for 3 more years) than getting a slightly less bad contract in return.

Sorry but I forgot to mention that assuming that we cannot unload him for a very cheap salary, or less term, or a draft pick/prospect, this would be a good alternative given that he strived in Fld & Pho and played lots of hard top minutes.

SprootsMasterFlex 05-03-2012 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ominous Grey (Post 49201709)
Ballard could be a realistic option.


And people, we aren't getting Stewart. Please let it die a peaceful death.

I disagree. I think Stewart is definitely a viable option that Shero will consider. Trades very rarely happen spontaneously and clearly the Pens were heavily scouting the Blues (vice versa) leading up to the deadline. The Blues are looking for Ds which we have an excess of, and Stewart very much fits the bill of what Shero is looking for as an affordable asset to play with Sid or Geno.

Flat Stanley 05-03-2012 10:12 AM

Yeah, we're not trading Fleury. Sorry.

AEKaki 05-03-2012 11:18 AM

[QUOTE=Ey

How about trading him for C.Price

Flat Stanley 05-03-2012 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEKaki (Post 49206483)
How about trading him for C.Price

I don't know if I would trade him at all for any goalie.

Definitely not for Roberto Luongo though.

ds246pit 05-03-2012 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik (Post 49204289)
Yeah, we're not trading Fleury. Sorry.

Just curious why Fleury isn't tradable? Is it because after the playoffs his return is likely about as significant as a 1982 Honda Civic with 1.2 million miles on it? Or is he really that valuable to this organization that he shouldn't be moved?

Flat Stanley 05-03-2012 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ds246pit (Post 49206957)
Just curious why Fleury isn't tradable? Is it because after the playoffs his return is likely about as significant as a 1982 Honda Civic with 1.2 million miles on it? Or is he really that valuable to this organization that he shouldn't be moved?

I just think people are going overboard with this whole "trade Fleury" idea. The guy played one bad playoff series along with the rest of the team.

I think people are forgetting that Fleury is still a pretty good goalie and what we saw in the playoffs isn't what we saw in the regular season. It's not what we saw in the lengthy 2008 and 2009 playoff years.

It's every year. if Fleury is doing bad it's "trade him" but as soon as he starts playing well everyone's all over him saying how good he is.

No wonder why people call Pens fans bandwagon fans.

Shady Machine 05-03-2012 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik (Post 49207137)
I just think people are going overboard with this whole "trade Fleury" idea. The guy played one bad playoff series along with the rest of the team.

I think people are forgetting that Fleury is still a pretty good goalie and what we saw in the playoffs isn't what we saw in the regular season. It's not what we saw in the lengthy 2008 and 2009 playoff years.

It's every year. if Fleury is doing bad it's "trade him" but as soon as he starts playing well everyone's all over him saying how good he is.

No wonder why people call Pens fans bandwagon fans.

They are going overboard, but so are you in your defense of him. He's been brutal for two of the last 3 playoffs and mediocre last year. He also could barely play hockey for 15 games in the beginning of the 2010 season. He did rebound and played really well in the regular season after that. Point being, he is wildly inconsistent. He shouldn't be traded, but let's not pretend this playoffs was one outlier.

TheEdge27 05-03-2012 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik (Post 49207137)
I just think people are going overboard with this whole "trade Fleury" idea. The guy played one bad playoff series along with the rest of the team.

I think people are forgetting that Fleury is still a pretty good goalie and what we saw in the playoffs isn't what we saw in the regular season. It's not what we saw in the lengthy 2008 and 2009 playoff years.

It's every year. if Fleury is doing bad it's "trade him" but as soon as he starts playing well everyone's all over him saying how good he is.

No wonder why people call Pens fans bandwagon fans.

Wait, so you mean you dont wanna trade Fleury for a 33 year old goalie whos never won a cup and is signed at 5.5 million for the next 10 years?

Or you dont wanna sign a UFA whos been a backup their whole career?

So much for our cup chances....

Funk311 05-03-2012 12:25 PM

Obviously a ridiculous idea, but i was thinking last night:

Staal and Orps for Ovie and pick (3rd?)

Just made me say...hmmmm.

Crosby and Ovie...linemates. followed by Malkin Neal....or Crosby Neal, Russian Duo of make great pride.

Don't slaughter me, was just for poops.

66-29-33 05-03-2012 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funk311 (Post 49208971)
Obviously a ridiculous idea, but i was thinking last night:

Staal and Orps for Ovie and pick (3rd?)

Just made me say...hmmmm.

Crosby and Ovie...linemates. followed by Malkin Neal....or Crosby Neal, Russian Duo of make great pride.

Don't slaughter me, was just for poops.

Hell no! Don't need 3 players just shy of 10M cap hits. Also, if we got Ovechkin, Neal plays with Crosby, Ovy plays with Malkin.

Flat Stanley 05-03-2012 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shady Machine (Post 49208509)
They are going overboard, but so are you in your defense of him. He's been brutal for two of the last 3 playoffs and mediocre last year. He also could barely play hockey for 15 games in the beginning of the 2010 season. He did rebound and played really well in the regular season after that. Point being, he is wildly inconsistent. He shouldn't be traded, but let's not pretend this playoffs was one outlier.

I agree that he's been bad in the playoffs ever since we won the Stanley Cup, but that doesn't mean he's a bad goalie or that he will be bad in the playoffs for the rest of his career.

I don't like the idea that people want him traded. For what? There are better goalies out there but who is going to give up their starting goalie for Fleury? We're not going to get guys like Price, Rinne, Quick, etc. So what's the point?


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