HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   New York Rangers (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=24)
-   -   The 3 metro NYC teams should be (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=119818)

ATLANTARANGER* 12-21-2004 03:25 PM

The 3 metro NYC teams should be
 
well represented at the WJC's. NYR will have between 6 to 8 and the Isles have 3 confirmed. Anyone know how many the Devils will have playing?

ATLANTARANGER* 12-22-2004 08:22 AM

Apparently the answer to my question is
 
one.

Levitate 12-22-2004 08:25 AM

looks like bahensky didn't make it on to the czech team, so the rangers should have 7 guys i think

RangerBoy 12-22-2004 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levitate
looks like bahensky didn't make it on to the czech team, so the rangers should have 7 guys i think

Montoya,Korpikoski,Dawes,Baranka,Callahan,Furrer and Petruzalek

Melrose_Jr. 12-22-2004 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levitate
looks like bahensky didn't make it on to the czech team, so the rangers should have 7 guys i think

Where did you see that he was cut?

Dantonius 12-22-2004 01:27 PM

That's a nice attempt to bash the Devils, ATLANTARANGER, especially since you also asked the same question on the NJ forum, compared their representation at the WJCs to the other Metro teams' AND recently started a thread claiming that Parise and Ahonen are overrated.

Your intent is clever yet thinly veiled.

Levitate 12-22-2004 02:16 PM

http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.p...2&page=2&pp=15

midway down the page someone posted the final roster (i assume it's correct)

Levitate 12-22-2004 02:21 PM

though i just saw this WJC preview written yesterday and they still list him as being on the team

http://www.forecaster.ca/hockeynews/...jc2005-preview

:dunno:

the discussion today on the WJC boards started today i think, so he might have just gotten cut. it'd be nice if there was a place that displayed all the official rosters

Balej20* 12-22-2004 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dantonius
That's a nice attempt to bash the Devils, ATLANTARANGER, especially since you also asked the same question on the NJ forum, compared their representation at the WJCs to the other Metro teams' AND recently started a thread claiming that Parise and Ahonen are overrated.

Your intent is clever yet thinly veiled.


So what? You guys have owned us over the past 7 years and have been on top of the league for the past 10 years. I wouldnt get my panties in a bunch over a little jab here and there.

ATLANTARANGER* 12-22-2004 02:51 PM

I found it very odd for a fan base that claims they draft
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dantonius
That's a nice attempt to bash the Devils, ATLANTARANGER, especially since you also asked the same question on the NJ forum, compared their representation at the WJCs to the other Metro teams' AND recently started a thread claiming that Parise and Ahonen are overrated.

Your intent is clever yet thinly veiled.

so well that all you have is one. One would have thought that it would be the NYR's with only one, after all we draft so poorly, right?

As far as Parise & Moore, I was just struck by the comparison. Parise I think is by far the better prospect, at least that's what the experts say. But when you stop and look, he scored what, 4 goals in like the first 5 games and has only 1 since. Moore has had a consistant, yet unspectacular year.

Ahonen to me is a puzzle, I can't see how he's been in the minors for 4 years! NJ has had injuries with their backups and not once have they called up Ahonen. After all don't you give your top goalie prospect a chance? Now it seems that he's playing 2nd fiddle to Clemmensen. Labarbera is like maybe 4th or 5th in our prospect list, yet he's the raining AHL MVP and record holder. Funny how our terrible drafting has been able to stumble upon some late round jewels! Some experts say that that is truly the sign of a good organization. Imagine having 5 of your top 6 picks in your 1st draft having already played in the NHL. That Renney and Sather really stepped in it, you know!

One last thing, how's Danton like prison so far?

Fletch 12-22-2004 03:19 PM

The Devils do draft well..
 
but what they do better than draft is develop. The Rangers have more under 20 players considered for the WJCs, but the Devils have more NHL-caliber players in the 21-30 age group. Could this be a signal of changing times? Who knows, as these players at the WJCs have a ways to go before becoming NHLers.

Kovy274Hart 12-22-2004 04:20 PM

I kind of agree on Ahonen. This guy has been in the minors for 4 years already and the Devils never have started him once. They recalled him a couple of times as an emergency backup. But why didn't they have the confidence to play him? What was so bad that could have happened?

If Ahonen is so great, how come he isn't tearing up the AHL? He also seems to get hurt sometimes and sick a lot. This year being an example. And Clemmensen has already established himself as a reliable backup.

Makes ya wonder. Of course, NJ fans will argue that Ahonen has no chance of doing anything because Brodeur plays almost every game. So, it's better for his development to play in the AHL.

LaBarbera was drafted late and not much was expected. He has already been recalled a couple of times and started. Though he hasn't looked comfortable, he got experience. And now, he's working with our new goalie coach Allaire. This should only benefit him. And he's proving last year's MVP season in the 'A' wasn't a fluke. The only thing he needs to do now is take his game to the next level and prove he can play. Whenever that is, only God knows.

The other thing that works against Jason is that he's a couple of years older than Ahonen and has stiff competition in Lundqvist, Montoya and possibly Blackburn. When you factor in Dunham and Weekes if the NHL ever comes back, it's going to be tough for Jason to make it.

I kind of feel that the Devils should have dealt Ahonen already and gotten back something. His value can't be that high right now. And Brodeur shows no signs of slowing down. What's the point of carrying a guy considered to be a top goalie prospect if all he'll ever get in is 4-5 NHL games and toil in the minors? Better off trading him.

On our goalie situation, I see a trade coming whenever the NHL returns. Something has to give. And by the time it comes back, Montoya will probably be in Hartford signed and so will Lundqvist. Blackburn might be healthy enough to play too. That's a logjam and it doesn't even include Jason or the two goalies on the NHL roster. Valiquette too.


On the Parise vs Moore thing, there's no comparison. One guy is considered a "sure thing." The other was drafted a few years ago out of Harvard and had a solid college career and has played well for Hartford. He's developed into our best player. I'd have enough confidence to have him center a 3rd line. He competes hard all the time, skates like the wind and has great vision. His forechecking abilities are not that different from Parise. Moore always works hard. That's also the book on Parise. He never gives up on plays and can play in any facet. They do sound a lot similar. But Parise is supposed to have this skill that separates him from others. Both guys are small but use their size well. The difference aside from the talent is Moore is four years older. So, less is expected.

Thing is Moore showed in his debut against Montreal what he could do, tallying three assists. Only second Ranger to ever have that kind of start. Even sparked Lundmark.

So, what's Moore's ceiling? Hard to say. If he is given the kind of role he deserves, why can't he put up 18-20 goals and 25-30 assists? He has enough ability too. Maybe he taps out at 50 points. And I see him as a solid two-way player. Well isn't that special? You can never have enough players like that.


The other difference is this. Parise has these lofty expectations and tons of pressure. If he doesn't become an All-Star and put up 70-or-more points, he'll be considered a bust. He is supposed to be this 'franchise center.' Better than Gomez.

That's a lot of pressure.

I know he has 21 or 22 points in the 'A' but most of them have come on the power play. Nobody ever mentions it. I bet at least half his pts have come via it.


I'm sure he'll improve production at even-strength eventually. Just thought that was interesting.


Anyway, I think the real comparison should be Lundqvist vs Ahonen. One guy has risen his stock a ton and was taken way late (7th round, 2000) while the other was a 1st round pick with higher expectations.

As far as the other, we don't really have anyone similar that can compare to Parise. I suppose Jessiman will be unfairly compared because they took him over Zach. But they're different style players.

Maybe if Dawes makes it, he will be compared to Parise. They're similar in stature and Nigel was great last year for Canada. Had more pts than Parise in the WJC. If Dawes can duplicate last year's output on a better team, then he'll get more recognition.


We'll see how it goes.

Blueshirt13 12-22-2004 05:05 PM

IMO there is no comparison between Parise and Moore. I wouldn't even bother to bring it up. This is Parise's first year of pro and surrounded by less talent in Albany he has done pretty well. He is making the adjustment from college hockey to a more physical pro game pretty well.

As for consistancy, Moore had a huge slump as well during the Wolfpack's losing streak. McGill commented about his line and Lundmark's being non-existant on a few nights and benched Lundmark and Balej instead of Moore because it made more of a statement to the team.

Offensively Parise has far more weapons than Moore and still more time to develop them further. Part of the reason why Parise has more PP points is because he is just that good offensively and when he has room, obviously he can do something with it. Defensively, I put them on the same ground as they both pretty the puck very well. Moore gets the edge on the penalty kill simply because Parise usually isn't on the ice for it (River Rats have plenty of others for it).

As for the Ahonen vs LaBarbera argument... Ahonen certainly when draft was the better goalie. LaBarbera has surprised a lot of people down in the AHL. But to put it simply, I can never see him being a successful goalie in the NHL unless he improves his response time dramatically. I've seen him live a number of times and he just seems to move in slow motion at times. He has great positioning but his reflexes just seem so slow to me. Ahonen I have seen play twice. His positioning is pretty good but his reflexes are much better. I don't think he has that franchise label that people gave him when he was drafted (ala Brodeur, Belfour, Roy.. etc) but I think he could be a solid goalie like Thibault or Cechmanek, where he can play a solid game behind good defense. Ahonen still gets the edge in my book talentwise.

Comparing Ahonen to Lundqvist would be impossible for me, as I haven't seen Lundqvist in person but from everything I have read, at this point he might just be better than Ahonen. I am looking forward to hopefully seeing him on NA ice next year.

Dantonius 12-22-2004 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balej20
So what? You guys have owned us over the past 7 years and have been on top of the league for the past 10 years. I wouldnt get my panties in a bunch over a little jab here and there.

Sorry if I came across as feeling that way...I just wanted to let him know that I could see through what he was saying. I am actually looking forward to your team improving so the rivalry can be completely refueled, just to let you know. I'm pretty much wishing good luck to the Rangers, as weird as it might be.
:dunno:

SingnBluesOnBroadway 12-22-2004 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dantonius
That's a nice attempt to bash the Devils, ATLANTARANGER, especially since you also asked the same question on the NJ forum, compared their representation at the WJCs to the other Metro teams' AND recently started a thread claiming that Parise and Ahonen are overrated.

Your intent is clever yet thinly veiled.

You are aware that this is the Rangers' board, right?

Levitate 12-25-2004 11:22 AM

apparently bahensky is on the czech team...i was misinformed

http://www.ralphsworldjr.com/New2/in...=TP_In&cou=CZE

pleasemyboy 12-25-2004 12:19 PM

"Devils have more NHL-caliber players in the 21-30 age group. "


My butt. The Devils prospects are extremely poor right now. Like I said before. When you win you get credit for everything. They Devils do not have anywhere close to a good farm sytem at this moment.

Ronnie Bass 12-25-2004 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pleasemyboy
"Devils have more NHL-caliber players in the 21-30 age group. "


My butt. The Devils prospects are extremely poor right now. Like I said before. When you win you get credit for everything. They Devils do not have anywhere close to a good farm sytem at this moment.

Are you kidding??

Zach Parise
Aleksander Suglobov
Tuomas Philman
Travis Zajac
Petr Vrana
Ivan Khomutov
Barry Tallackson
Matt DeMarchi
Aaron Voros
Teemu Laine
Ilkka Pikkarainen
Ahren Nittel
Tyler Eckford

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/team.php?team=21

You really feel that this is extremely poor? Hate to break it to you but our farm system is still strong as ever, in fact it's nowhere close to being close to a poor farm system as you are suggesting.

Levitate 12-25-2004 01:05 PM

the devils farm system strength has always been the way they've been able to plug players in and have them perform their function at least adquetly. a strong system will help that, though i think it teneds to make their prospects seem better than they are when they play for the devils

Ronnie Bass 12-25-2004 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levitate
the devils farm system strength has always been the way they've been able to plug players in and have them perform their function at least adquetly. a strong system will help that, though i think it teneds to make their prospects seem better than they are when they play for the devils

I'm not sure I know what you mean, espicially since you look around the league and you will see alot of rosters filled with former Devils prospects or players (via trade, release, etc..). I mean I agree that they are groomed to play Devils hockey, but that also makes them a very wanted commodity among other teams in the league for some reason.

Ronnie Bass 12-25-2004 01:18 PM

By the way I think it's a good thing that the Rangers have finally taken into grooming their own propects seriously since a big part of the league success in the years ahead will rely on having a strong Ranger team in it and this is a good first step.

Levitate 12-25-2004 04:13 PM

actually i look again on that roster and now bahensky isn't there...makes me look like a fool :dunce:

he was there just this morning, i swear, must have just updated it

Edge 12-25-2004 04:19 PM

Heck I want the Rangers to follow the Devils approach. Respect where respect is due, the Devils have been doing it right and with success for a DECADE now. That is worth emulating.

Fletch 12-25-2004 07:30 PM

Please...
 
never said anything about prospects...I was talking NHL caliber players from 21-30. That's all.

Missionhockey 12-26-2004 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
so well that all you have is one. One would have thought that it would be the NYR's with only one, after all we draft so poorly, right?
Obviously the Rangers were going to have many players in the WJC after tearing apart their roster. I believe NYR had somewhere around six or seven picks in the first two rounds of the draft. I'm sorry but its hard to screw up that many times.
As far as Parise & Moore, I was just struck by the comparison. Parise I think is by far the better prospect, at least that's what the experts say. But when you stop and look, he scored what, 4 goals in like the first 5 games and has only 1 since. Moore has had a consistant, yet unspectacular year.
Moore has played more professional hockey than Parise. As a rookie leading his team in scoring he's not doing so bad.

Ahonen to me is a puzzle, I can't see how he's been in the minors for 4 years! NJ has had injuries with their backups and not once have they called up Ahonen. After all don't you give your top goalie prospect a chance? Now it seems that he's playing 2nd fiddle to Clemmensen. Labarbera is like maybe 4th or 5th in our prospect list, yet he's the raining AHL MVP and record holder. Funny how our terrible drafting has been able to stumble upon some late round jewels! Some experts say that that is truly the sign of a good organization. Imagine having 5 of your top 6 picks in your 1st draft having already played in the NHL. That Renney and Sather really stepped in it, you know!
Ahonen is a questionmark to me also. He seems to have the talent and the reflexes to succede in the NHL, but has not put them all together for him to make it on to the roster. Not that he would get any playing time anyway. But your team is not completely without fault as you want to make it seem. Don't you remember Dan Blackburn?

One last thing, how's Danton like prison so far?

Its a shame Danton had such an attitude against Lou. He could have been an above average agitator. However Lou managed to trade him to St. Louis for Ivan Khomutov, and he has some promising upside.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:04 PM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.