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-   -   Medvedev wants to expand to 64 teams (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1207321)

Sokil 06-13-2012 11:49 AM

Medvedev wants to expand to 64 teams
 
http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/n...ash=56629ca89d

In other news, Medvedev may have lost his mind

BalticWarrior 06-13-2012 12:23 PM

This is absolutley insane and idiotic.Thats all i have to say.

zorz 06-13-2012 01:11 PM

Im disappointed. Was hoping for at least 99 teams :sarcasm:

Theokritos 06-13-2012 01:16 PM

Quote:

After the KHL’s ambitious visions IIHF General Secretary Horst Lichtner compared with a Gagarin space flight
Gagarin's space flight? More like Icarus' flight close to the sun. The Gagarin Cup will be replaced by the Icarus Cup.

cska78 06-13-2012 02:36 PM

your choice Mr. Medvedev - http://talks.guns.ru/forums/icons/fo...17/1117571.jpg
smoking some good stuff, a lot of it, lol!

slovakiasnextone 06-13-2012 02:42 PM

In which season is the launch of a KHL team on the Moon expected? :sarcasm:

Propane Nightmares 06-13-2012 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helo (Post 50868905)
This is absolutley insane and idiotic.Thats all i have to say.

Yeah, Medvedev must be on crack.

If he wants to expand to countries like GB he's going to need to massively reduce the salary cap so they can compete. The big teams won't be able to throw around ridiculous money to attract NHL players, and the talent will be more widely spread across the league meaning the overall standard will drop.

If he wants to compete with the NHL; this is not the way to do it.

Shrimper 06-13-2012 05:24 PM

That's ridiculous and shouldn't happen.

I personally don't think any teams outside Russia should be in the tournament in the first place as it was brought in to replace the Russian Super League so I don't see why it's decided to branch out. I reckon it will in the future but 64 teams isn't viable at the moment.

Also, isn't there already a European Championship?

Robotic 06-13-2012 05:55 PM

Expansion to Sweden, Finland, Germany...ok

Expansion to France, Italy, Netherlands, Belgium, England...no way.

And 64 is way too many. Maybe 30 tops, but some teams are already are icing garbage products.

Dosing 06-13-2012 06:26 PM

So this basically proves then that he cares more about flexing his muscles as fast as possible toward america then he does about creating a stable high-end hockey league...

Same old quick fixes with no regard for consequenses but with promises of greatness, any historian wanna bet what happens next? :rolleyes:

Sokil 06-13-2012 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by khlman (Post 50882867)
Expansion to Sweden, Finland, Germany...ok

Expansion to France, Italy, Netherlands, Belgium, England...no way.

And 64 is way too many. Maybe 30 tops, but some teams are already are icing garbage products.

exactly

replace the # of garbage russian teams with high funded, top tier teams (maybe one or two from each of) sweden, finland, czech, germany, denmark & switzerland

sure, fantastic. top european teams get to be iced in all of the major european countries and have representation in an elite league. this would be great.


64 teams, extremely diluted talent pool and crazy travel? and then face the NHL at the end of the year and get BLOWN AWAY IN EPIC FASHION?

no thanks

i love KHL expansion but only if it means expanding the talent pool, not diluting it tenfold

VladNYC 06-13-2012 08:52 PM

I too think 64 teams is too much for the current state of European hockey. If we start including Scandinavian and Central European countries and a few teams from big cities in non traditional markets a number like 48 is more realistic.

I do applaud Medvedev for actually pushing for unified hockey in Europe. I think the KHL, under his guidance has done many many positive things for hockey, especially European hockey. I also think the KHL is the main positive force in hockey today, as the other league are either keeping with the status quo or in the case of the NHL, hurting hockey.

Fulcrum 06-13-2012 10:28 PM

Well, Russia wouldn't get to be the biggest country in the world (by a wide margin) without some (crazy?) unrealistically ambitious people, like Medvedev.

This should be the definition of setting high goals. I applaud him for the ambition, as unrealistic as it is in our day and age. But never say never.

Rumcajs 06-13-2012 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fulcrum (Post 50892909)
Well, Russia wouldn't get to be the biggest country in the world (by a wide margin) without some (crazy?) unrealistically ambitious people, like Medvedev.

This should be the definition of setting high goals. I applaud him for the ambition, as unrealistic as it is in our day and age. But never say never.

Sounds cool though. He seems to be wanting to make the KHL the "European League".

vorky 06-14-2012 02:01 AM

I hope IIHF, ET a co. will not try to rebirth Champions League style of competition. Make changes in Medvedevīs plan, it is best option. We need NHL style league in Europe not soccer Champions League style competition. History has an evidence of failure CHL.

CHL will not work without Russians, and Russian will not support CHL model as I understand.

Why not basketball model of paneuropean competition? You have clubs with licence to play this champions league for 3 years (based on attendance, revenues etc). Give 3 years or so licence to european clubs to join KHL as temporary member, you can change euro clubs after this period. So every euro club has a chance to join. You can also create parallel competition like in basketball (but KHL is against as I see, so wont work).

I like champions league model but I dont want it to be implemented into euro hockey. Why? No competition which is needed for such league. There is big gap among KHL and second best euro league (SWE or FIN it is up to you to choose). Best players from SWE or FIN goes to KHL every summer (or NHL), so these leagues are weaker and weaker. Finnish and swedish clubs dont have money to attract players, look at budgets - weakest KHL clubs have budget around 10-12 milions euro and it was said it is more than best finnish clubs!!! How do they want to compete in CHL? It is like soccer - imagine UEFA Champions League only with english clubs (imagine it as best league) and slovak/czech clubs (as second best league) - BIIIIIIG GAP. Wont work. This scenario in not in soccer, therefore UEFA Champions League is succesfull, but this scenario is involved in hockey, so CHL model of play wont work (plus IIHF does not have money to run it without Russians).

IIHF and ET should stop dreaming

yunost 06-14-2012 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dosing (Post 50883897)
So this basically proves then that he cares more about flexing his muscles as fast as possible toward america then he does about creating a stable high-end hockey league...

Same old quick fixes with no regard for consequenses but with promises of greatness, any historian wanna bet what happens next? :rolleyes:

Wow, you are a radical guy!

Unfortunately your message is a logical fallacy. Its so ridiculous that there is no point to even point out the flaw in your reply.

I am really curious to hear how the article "proves" that in your opinion. If you have the time, please reference the parts. :help:

Dosing 06-14-2012 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yunost (Post 50898465)
Wow, you are a radical guy!

Unfortunately your message is a logical fallacy. Its so ridiculous that there is no point to even point out the flaw in your reply.

I am really curious to hear how the article "proves" that in your opinion. If you have the time, please reference the parts. :help:

It takes no genius to understand what having 64 teams would do to any league, theres gonna be a bunch of top teams contending every year with the rest just being there as a gimmick. quality > quantity.
Only way it doesn't prove my point is if he honestly doesn't understand this :laugh:

yunost 06-14-2012 04:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dosing (Post 50898575)
It takes no genius to understand what having 64 teams would do to any league, theres gonna be a bunch of top teams contending every year with the rest just being there as a gimmick. quality > quantity.
Only way it doesn't prove my point is if he honestly doesn't understand this :laugh:

Wait, so what your saying is that by diluting teams, violating your 'quality > quantity' principle, and worsening hockey in Europe, he is "flexing his muscles as fast as possible toward america" ?

How does that happen?

Jeez 06-14-2012 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vorky (Post 50898027)
I hope IIHF, ET a co. will not try to rebirth Champions League style of competition. Make changes in Medvedevīs plan, it is best option. We need NHL style league in Europe not soccer Champions League style competition. History has an evidence of failure CHL.

CHL will not work without Russians, and Russian will not support CHL model as I understand.

Why not basketball model of paneuropean competition? You have clubs with licence to play this champions league for 3 years (based on attendance, revenues etc). Give 3 years or so licence to european clubs to join KHL as temporary member, you can change euro clubs after this period. So every euro club has a chance to join. You can also create parallel competition like in basketball (but KHL is against as I see, so wont work).

I like champions league model but I dont want it to be implemented into euro hockey. Why? No competition which is needed for such league. There is big gap among KHL and second best euro league (SWE or FIN it is up to you to choose). Best players from SWE or FIN goes to KHL every summer (or NHL), so these leagues are weaker and weaker. Finnish and swedish clubs dont have money to attract players, look at budgets - weakest KHL clubs have budget around 10-12 milions euro and it was said it is more than best finnish clubs!!! How do they want to compete in CHL? It is like soccer - imagine UEFA Champions League only with english clubs (imagine it as best league) and slovak/czech clubs (as second best league) - BIIIIIIG GAP. Wont work. This scenario in not in soccer, therefore UEFA Champions League is succesfull, but this scenario is involved in hockey, so CHL model of play wont work (plus IIHF does not have money to run it without Russians).

IIHF and ET should stop dreaming

I agree in your point about CHL (IIHF champions league).
I can't understand from the stuff, what IIHF thinks about Medvedev's plan?
Next I have no idea about support among Russians and IIHF. I like Medvedev visions, but in exactly this model (64 clubs and 62 games,or so) sounds unrealistic for me.

vorky 06-14-2012 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeez (Post 50899017)
I agree in your point about CHL (IIHF champions league). I can't understand from the stuff, what IIHF thinks about Medvedev's plan?

Lets look at IIHF website:

Quote:

The session ended with the moderator informally asking the attendance whether they prefer a parallel European club competition (IIHF+ET idea) or a permanent pan-European league (Medvedevīs idea). The vast majority of those who raised their hands opted for the parallel way.
now, you can imagine whatīs IIHF attitude to KHL plan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeez (Post 50899017)
Next I have no idea about support among Russians and IIHF. I like Medvedev visions, but in exactly this model (64 clubs and 62 games,or so) sounds unrealistic for me.

yes, it is. I think it is only model. Now we have two options: parallel league as CHL style (IIHF idea) OR one league (medvedevīs idea). Of course, it does not have to include 64 teams.. I dont know about 3rd option (something between IIHF and KHL idea as mentioned above).

Jeez 06-14-2012 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vorky (Post 50899121)
Lets look at IIHF website:



now, you can imagine whatīs IIHF attitude to KHL plan



yes, it is. I think it is only model. Now we have two options: parallel league as CHL style (IIHF idea) OR one league (medvedevīs idea). Of course, it does not have to include 64 teams.. I dont know about 3rd option (something between IIHF and KHL idea as mentioned above).

Of course, same problem as Czech Lev vs. APK (association professional clubs)in past. As also NHL fan, I vote for one league. IMO This is the only way to stop fall european leagues as whole. We need competition to NHL, not beat them, just competition.

Mory Schneideur* 06-14-2012 08:57 AM

Guys, with the ownership problems the Coyotes are facing & the new arena being built in St. Petersburg, do you think the Coyotes are going to relocate?






:D

Dosing 06-14-2012 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yunost (Post 50898769)
Wait, so what your saying is that by diluting teams, violating your 'quality > quantity' principle, and worsening hockey in Europe, he is "flexing his muscles as fast as possible toward america" ?

How does that happen?

The point is to give a first glance of "khl's greatness" having that many teams. Unless there's some secret tactic behind the idea we haven't heard of yet that is.
But barring a genius plan if he really wanted to create a good stable hockey league he would never suggest that many teams but try increase the quality of what he already have. If he had a better product right now it would be alot easier to expand the league. But as stated he wants quick fixes before the time is right completely ignoring any consequences. It's just normal human psychology that shows what his real intentions are. unless as i said he honestly doesn't understand it himself, and i doubt even you would prefer that scenario :laugh:

Vicente 06-14-2012 09:16 AM

I don't think there is any need for a 64 team league. Why not just having a 32 team KHL and let the two Gagarin Cup finalists play against the two finalists of ET (or some other Western European competition) for a Euro Cup.

vorky 06-14-2012 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicente (Post 50902021)
I don't think there is any need for a 64 team league. Why not just having a 32 team KHL and let the two Gagarin Cup finalists play against the two finalists of ET (or some other Western European competition) for a Euro Cup.

This is exactly what Medvedev said.


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