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-   -   C Mikhail Grigorenko - Quebec Remparts, QMJHL (2012 draft) III (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1217597)

Chainshot 06-26-2012 05:10 PM

C Mikhail Grigorenko - Quebec Remparts, QMJHL (2012 draft) III
 
Continuing from here: http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...159407&page=40

McTankel 06-26-2012 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlureb

The Toronto-centric, media-spearheaded 'spin' machine to have a shot at Grigorenko at the number 5 slot.*

I reckon Brian Burke wishes to re-'Matt Sundin-ize' the Toronto franchise, ...at the expense of a very possible Montreal 'Béliveau-like' renewal era. He's counting on the Habs neophyte GM's naivety and edginess to wrest the big prize away, and as supplementary benefits go, steamroll the Habs' future with a 'grand-theft' larceny.

You push the classic Russian narrative with the massive help of friendly media (the TSN Maple Leaf cohort in particular) , ...in the realistic expectations that people's prejudices will take over and in due time, hand over...at the number five slot... the generational, the prize Hockey player that is a healthy Michaïl Grigorenko.

We're witnessing completely made-up, make-believe character assassination here, a cynical operation worthy of the worst Hack the murky world of Politics has been capable of successfully bringing to fruition. Brian Burke doesn't believe a word of what's being spewed on Grigorenko. He'll amply prove it when he rides Grigorenko's coattails, and 'laughs' it all off when a Habs' fan suggests in retrospect that the hate fest had been Burke-engineered to steer the Habs' glorious legacy to a richly deserved ...Toranna rest area.
..... :laugh::laugh:

Stop Winnin 06-26-2012 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51565781)
..... :laugh::laugh:

LOL. That's hilarious. Burke is so clever, he even tricked himself into believing them! :sarcasm: :laugh:

Sundinisagod 06-26-2012 05:19 PM

We knew there was a good chance he was dropping out of the top 10, but who knew Forsberg would drop just as much?

Frank Drebin 06-26-2012 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51565781)
..... :laugh::laugh:

What a dip-shoot that guy was.

malkovsby 06-26-2012 05:25 PM

wasn't grigorenko worth the risk for burke at 5, given his calls for a big center

Leafs87 06-26-2012 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malkovsby (Post 51566513)
wasn't grigorenko worth the risk for burke at 5, given his calls for a big center

If Rielly wasn't on the board yes. But with Rielly on the board, I am happy he didn't risk it.

One scout called him the best defensive prospect since Doughty.
http://mapleleafshotstove.com/2012/0...-overall-pick/

Frank Drebin 06-26-2012 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malkovsby (Post 51566513)
wasn't grigorenko worth the risk for burke at 5, given his calls for a big center

If we were to give Grigs an arbitrary 50% chance of becoming a true #1 center and a 50% chance of busting, thats a lot of risk for a top 5 pick. Perfect pick for Buffalo as they picked again right at #14.

Would be tough to swallow for Toronto if Grigs failed and Rielly turned into a #4 dman, or more.

Just too many question marks for him to be a top 5 pick. Hopefully he works out and turns into a steal for the Sabres.

Thorton02 06-26-2012 05:38 PM

I still think Radulov's post season debacle scared every team off from selecting a Russian with "work ethic concerns" this year. If Radulov had a huge playoff series or two, Grigs would have gone #4 overall no doubt.

I remember Patrick Roy saying something to the effect that Grigorenko wasn't dogging it on the ice, but more that his conditioning wasn't where it needs to be. He's already started working out with the Sabres so the effort seems to be there.

The biggest concern IMO is not Grigorenko. It's Lindy "can't coach a Russian" Ruff. Seriously, do Sabres fans remember him screaming at Kalinin during practice to "show more emotion", or him benching Afinogenov during the last game of the season after we were already eliminated from the playoffs? Ruff better not screw this up.:rant:

MaxLacoste 06-26-2012 05:51 PM

Grigorenko is the kind of player that is an automatic bust in market like Toronto and Montreal. He lack work ethic and character, crucials elements for teams list above. This the reason Montreal didn't went his way. Maybe he will be better than Gally in Buffalo. But Gally/Montreal vs Grigo/Montreal, Gally is the best choice. Montreal Fans an Medias don't like soft talented player. We had enough.

But Grigorenko remind me of an other Quebec Remparts star : Angelo Esposito. Esposito put on 98 pts in 57 games at 17 years old. Grigorenko: 85 pts in 59 games, at 18. Esposito was supposed to be a top 10 pick but fell to 20th spot. Everyone in Pittsburg was calling him a real steal but look how he turn out. Passion and work ethic is crucial, player without it should always have huge question mark aside their name.

McTankel 06-26-2012 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxLacoste (Post 51567739)
Grigorenko is the kind of player that is an automatic bust in market like Toronto and Montreal. He lack work ethic and character, crucials elements for teams list above. This the reason Montreal didn't went his way. Maybe he will be better than Gally in Buffalo. But Gally/Montreal vs Grigo/Montreal, Gally is the best choice. Montreal Fans an Medias don't like soft talented player. We had enough.

But Grigorenko remind me of an other Quebec Remparts star : Angelo Esposito. Esposito put on 98 pts in 57 games at 17 years old. Grigorenko: 85 pts in 59 games, at 18. Esposito was supposed to be a top 10 pick but fell to 20th spot. Everyone in Pittsburg was calling him a real steal but look how he turn out. Passion and work ethic is crucial, player without it should always have huge question mark aside their name.

What makes you question is work ethic? I've watched him play quite a bit. Roy has nothing but good things to say about him. Its the perceived Russian=Lazy thing that made him fall nothing else. Tell that to Malkin or Ovi. :laugh:

Sundinisagod 06-26-2012 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51569183)
What makes you question is work ethic? I've watched him play quite a bit. Roy has nothing but good things to say about him. Its the perceived Russian=Lazy thing that made him fall nothing else. Tell that to Malkin or Ovi. :laugh:

If thats the case why didn't Yakupov fall?

McTankel 06-26-2012 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundinisagod (Post 51569395)
If thats the case why didn't Yakupov fall?

Because his stats were so high even without a playmaking center that no matter if he was Russian or not he was worth the risk. 170 points in 107 games is to good to not take first.

But 85 points in 59 games as well as 10 points in 11 games is not good enough. People saying he had a bad playoff... lawlz

Kevin Forbes 06-26-2012 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundinisagod (Post 51569395)
If thats the case why didn't Yakupov fall?

Yakupov also had an extra year of adjustment to North American game. And played in the OHL.

MaxLacoste 06-26-2012 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51569183)
What makes you question is work ethic? I've watched him play quite a bit. Roy has nothing but good things to say about him. Its the perceived Russian=Lazy thing that made him fall nothing else. Tell that to Malkin or Ovi. :laugh:

Do you live in our province? When did you see him play? Youtube? Anyway, of course Roy will say good thing about him, Grigo is in his team for at least another season. If people say he's lazy is because he look like it, not because he's russian. He takes lot of shifts off. He was supposed to lift his team in the playoff, but did'nt. Yeah, 10 pts in 11 games is good. But he should have done a lot better. He didn't play like Huberdeau or Mackinnon did. And I hate the story about his mono. Very easy too say AFTER a bad playoff performance and BEFORE your draft.

Sundinisagod 06-26-2012 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51569505)
Because his stats were so high even without a playmaking center that no matter if he was Russian or not he was worth the risk. 170 points in 107 games is to good to not take first.

But 85 points in 59 games as well as 10 points in 11 games is not good enough. People saying he had a bad playoff... lawlz

Stats alone do not get you drafted 1st overall. Yakupov plays the game with a certain enthusiasm and energy, Grigorenko not so much. It's not even a personal opinion, this is the consensus opinion in the scouting community.

Sundinisagod 06-26-2012 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Forbes (Post 51570223)
Yakupov also had an extra year of adjustment to North American game. And played in the OHL.


Even then, Yakupov's rookie jr season was more impressive than Grigorenko's...

With all due respect, not quite sure what you're point about the OHL is though?

Kevin Forbes 06-26-2012 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundinisagod (Post 51571731)
Even then, Yakupov's rookie jr season was more impressive than Grigorenko's...

With all due respect, not quite sure what you're point about the OHL is though?

Quite frankly, the OHL is viewed in a kinder light by NHL scouts than the QMJHL.

MaxLacoste 06-26-2012 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awwufelloff (Post 51569505)
Because his stats were so high even without a playmaking center that no matter if he was Russian or not he was worth the risk. 170 points in 107 games is to good to not take first.

But 85 points in 59 games as well as 10 points in 11 games is not good enough. People saying he had a bad playoff... lawlz

10 pts in 11 games is bad for a guy of his talent. Mackinnon had 28 pts in 17 games. And he is 1 year younger.

Bure 06-26-2012 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxLacoste (Post 51572087)
10 pts in 11 games is bad for a guy of his talent. Mackinnon had 28 pts in 17 games. And he is 1 year younger.

Grigorenko has Condtioning issues and mono didn't help either. Both things can be fixed.

Up until around feburary, it was very possible that grig could still go 1st but fatigue and various health problems created the he's lazy label while Galchenyuk who was far from overwhelming barley played and got all the praise in the world.

Kevin Forbes 06-26-2012 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxLacoste (Post 51571189)
of course Roy will say good thing about him, Grigo is in his team for at least another season.

That has never stopped Roy in the past for criticizing his players, especially Import players who didn't live up to his standards when it came to effort on the ice.

tsujimoto74 06-26-2012 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxLacoste (Post 51571189)
Do you live in our province? When did you see him play? Youtube? Anyway, of course Roy will say good thing about him, Grigo is in his team for at least another season. If people say he's lazy is because he look like it, not because he's russian. He takes lot of shifts off. He was supposed to lift his team in the playoff, but did'nt. Yeah, 10 pts in 11 games is good. But he should have done a lot better. He didn't play like Huberdeau or Mackinnon did. And I hate the story about his mono. Very easy too say AFTER a bad playoff performance and BEFORE your draft.

Have you actually listened to Roy talk about his players over the past several seasons? He's had no problem publicly calling out players that he did not feel were giving their best effort. And there's no guarantee Grgorenko goes back there either. He's a player that could make the NHL out of training camp this year, especially if he does well improving his conditioning and strength over the summer with Buffalo's trainers.

sba 06-26-2012 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thorton02 (Post 51567149)
The biggest concern IMO is not Grigorenko. It's Lindy "can't coach a Russian" Ruff. Seriously, do Sabres fans remember him screaming at Kalinin during practice to "show more emotion", or him benching Afinogenov during the last game of the season after we were already eliminated from the playoffs? Ruff better not screw this up.:rant:

Yup, if he busts, this will 100% be the reason why.

Woodhouse 07-18-2012 09:34 AM

It appears Grigorenko has signed his ELC:
Quote:

Buffalo Sabres ‏@BuffaloSabres
He signed! pic.twitter.com/UKSNJGWO

https://p.twimg.com/AyFrcJ0CMAAmfzB.jpg

Link: https://twitter.com/BuffaloSabres/st...79587755716608
EDIT - Confirmed with Link:
Quote:

Shawn Stepner ‏@StepnerWKBW
‪#Buffalo‬ ‪#Sabres‬ have signed 12th overall pick center Mikhail Grigorenko to his entry-level contract ‪#NHL‬

Chainshot 07-18-2012 09:57 AM

So much for all the "he'll bolt to the KHL!!" clamour, pre-draft. :biglaugh:


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