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-   -   Value of: Tobias Enstrom to Colorado? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1227589)

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 03:45 PM

Tobias Enstrom to Colorado?
 
What would it take from the Avs to pry Enstrom away from Winnipeg?

A little curious for this one. With Enstrom being a UFA in 2013 I wonder what the pricetag would be.

Gm0ney 07-09-2012 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FjordToBoard (Post 52346239)
What would it take from the Avs to pry Enstrom away from Winnipeg?

A little curious for this one. With Enstrom being a UFA in 2013 I wonder what the pricetag would be.

I wrote this on the Jets board last week in a discussion about whether the team should try to re-sign him or move him if he's set on testing the UFA market next summer:

Quote:

A healthy Enstrom is a Top 10 offensive D-man who can QB the PP and move the puck out of the zone. He plays a solid defensive game - he's not big, but he is smart and doesn't panic in his own zone. He's coming off a bad year - only 0.53 ppg, compared to 0.71 and 0.61 ppg in the two preceding seasons respectively. He's heading into the last year of his contract earning $4.5 million (cap hit: $3.75 million). He's a UFA at the end of the season and if he were on the UFA market today, he'd probably be looking at over $6 million/year on at least a 5 year deal...and that's a wildly conservative estimate. To compare offensive contributions, Garrison's best ppg is this year's at 0.43; Carle = 0.46; Wideman = 0.56; Suter = 0.58. So Enstrom's "bad year" offensively, is better than Garrison and Carle's. His good years are better than all of them. He probably better defensively than all of them except Suter.
Is that how you'd view him? Everyone targets guys who've had an off year. I think the Jets would like Duchene or Stastny - if the Avalanche think they're deep enough at C, have a shot at re-signing Enstrom and/or feel he's enough to take the team to the next level...

Chronos1337 07-09-2012 04:41 PM

It would take a younger top 6 C or RW preferably a playmaker

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gm0ney (Post 52348481)
I wrote this on the Jets board last week in a discussion about whether the team should try to re-sign him or move him if he's set on testing the UFA market next summer:



Is that how you'd view him? Everyone targets guys who've had an off year. I think the Jets would like Duchene or Stastny - if the Avalanche think they're deep enough at C, have a shot at re-signing Enstrom and/or feel he's enough to take the team to the next level...

The real dealbreaker would be the inability to resign him after this year. Parting with Stastny may be a possibility as we are deep at Center but with the uncertainty of Enstrom resigning after one year it would be hard to make that deal happen. The Avs really lack an offensive quarterback type defensemen at this moment and I believe he would work wonders for this team.

I think it would be a great deal for the Avalanche if it was a sure thing he would be around for more than a year.

Elever 07-09-2012 04:50 PM

I like ENstrom and I think he's the most underrated dman in the league, a guy who can be a decent no1 and an excellent top pairing dman which is what we need however I would not be prepared to trade even 1 asset for him unless there's guarantee that he'll re-sign.

Basically he's a guy that a contender needs to go for or a team like Detroit who's looking to win now. Avs are still rebuilding, it'd be pointless to move assets for only one possible yr of Enstrom. Might be enough to get us into the playoffs as long as the trade doesn't involve Stastny but it won't be enough to win.

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuietCompany (Post 52348915)
I like ENstrom and I think he's the most underrated dman in the league, a guy who can be a decent no1 and an excellent top pairing dman which is what we need however I would not be prepared to trade even 1 asset for him unless there's guarantee that he'll re-sign.

Basically he's a guy that a contender needs to go for or a team like Detroit who's looking to win now. Avs are still rebuilding, it'd be pointless to move assets for only one possible yr of Enstrom. Might be enough to get us into the playoffs as long as the trade doesn't involve Stastny but it won't be enough to win.

He will be cashing in next year as well. Which is why Winnipeg may have to accept less in a trade if they want value, unless they think they can resign him.

agreen23 07-09-2012 04:57 PM

I know this is a what if scenario... but if you guys know you will be unable to sign him when he hits FA and are not going to make the playoffs. What would you require of him at the deadline as rental to a cup contender? Would a first be enough since its a very deep draft?

Seanahue 07-09-2012 05:01 PM

The one I always throw out is:

To Winnipeg:
Stastny

To Colorado:
Enstrom
Conditional 2014 First

The pick is based around Enstrom resigning with the team.



That being said....I have no problem with Winnipeg signing him to a 5 year $6.5 mil/year contract.

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seanahue (Post 52349381)
The one I always throw out is:

To Winnipeg:
Stastny

To Colorado:
Enstrom
Conditional 2014 First

The pick is based around Enstrom resigning with the team.



That being said....I have no problem with Winnipeg signing him to a 5 year $6.5 mil/year contract.

I think this would work for both teams. Having that offensive force on the D would really make this Colorado team scary and Stastny would give Winnipeg a playermaker they sorely need.

Seanahue 07-09-2012 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FjordToBoard (Post 52349427)
I think this would work for both teams. Having that offensive force on the D would really make this Colorado team scary and Stastny would give Winnipeg a playermaker they sorely need.

It would be great but I would also like to see something like a conditional 2nd coming back Winnipegs way. I am really struggling with how close it is. Would like to hear some input from others as well. I kind of feel like Winnipeg might be giving up too much but am not really too sure.

bohlmeister 07-09-2012 05:40 PM

I think if Stastny was going the other way, the Avs would need a center back. The Avs have set their team up to run 3 scoring lines. They now, after the off season and deadline moves, have enough wingers to compliment 3 centers. I don't see them planning to move any of their centers. They need to add a top defender without moving a forward. Probably not going to happen without moving their 1st, which I would think about if I was Sherman.

That being said, I love Enstrom, and think he would be a great fit on the Avs. The deal in the OP is probably favoring the Avs depending on what the conditions of that 1st is.

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bohlmeister (Post 52351011)
I think if Stastny was going the other way, the Avs would need a center back. The Avs have set their team up to run 3 scoring lines. They now, after the off season and deadline moves, have enough wingers to compliment 3 centers. I don't see them planning to move any of their centers. They need to add a top defender without moving a forward. Probably not going to happen without moving their 1st, which I would think about if I was Sherman.

That being said, I love Enstrom, and think he would be a great fit on the Avs. The deal in the OP is probably favoring the Avs depending on what the conditions of that 1st is.

If the Avs would need a center back who would be on the Winnipeg roster they would be willing to throw in if the Avs offered someone like Tyson Barrie as a secondary piece with Stastny?

Hansen Brother 07-09-2012 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FjordToBoard (Post 52346239)
What would it take from the Avs to pry Enstrom away from Winnipeg?

A little curious for this one. With Enstrom being a UFA in 2013 I wonder what the pricetag would be.

There seem to be two schools of thought on what sort of return we would want if we were to trade Enstrom.

The first is a hockey trade, a straight player for player with tweeking if necessary. That would describe the Enstrom for Statsney trade. Personally I'm not too sold on this as we have a fairly young team and are probably 4-5 years away from realistically competing for the cup.

The second is we should trade Enstrom for futures. Using the Burns and Kaberle trades Enstrom should be worth something around a young roster player, a prospect, and a pick. I like this formula a little more as I think it suits the organizations time frame better.

I'm not sure what Denver would have that would fit that as you guys aren't that much further ahead in building your team than we are.

CobraAcesS 07-09-2012 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hansen Brother (Post 52352277)
There seem to be two schools of thought on what sort of return we would want if we were to trade Enstrom.

The first is a hockey trade, a straight player for player with tweeking if necessary. That would describe the Enstrom for Statsney trade. Personally I'm not too sold on this as we have a fairly young team and are probably 4-5 years away from realistically competing for the cup.

The second is we should trade Enstrom for futures. Using the Burns and Kaberle trades Enstrom should be worth something around a young roster player, a prospect, and a pick. I like this formula a little more as I think it suits the organizations time frame better.

I'm not sure what Denver would have that would fit that as you guys aren't that much further ahead in building your team than we are.

Colorado is a lot further ahead up front and Winnipeg has better defense. Pretty even in goal IMO

Honestly I wouldn't give up any more than Barrie + 1st for Enstrom and that is right now..

Do you really think Enstrom is going to get you the same return as Staal? Carolina KNEW they had a good chance of getting Staal to sign long term because of his brother. Any team trading for Enstrom wouldn't have that luxury. Besides for the fact that Staal is 23...

You want a similar return to what Richards and Cater got and they were on long term cap friendly deals. Ha.. NO WAY

Jets 07-09-2012 06:30 PM

Burmistrov + Enstrom

for

Duchene + Barrie

CobraAcesS 07-09-2012 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jets (Post 52353323)
Burmistrov + Enstrom

for

Duchene + Barrie

lol No..

I don't know how it's unclear as to the fact that Enstrom's lack of a contract kills his value. Burmistrov has not proven anything except for that he has strong potential.

And Barrie isn't a friggen throw in..

How about Stastny for E. Kane? :facepalm:

KodiakArrest 07-09-2012 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CobraAcesS (Post 52353643)
lol No..

I don't know how it's unclear as to the fact that Enstrom's lack of a contract kills his value. Burmistrov has not proven anything except for that he has strong potential.

And Barrie isn't a friggen throw in..

The only way I see the deal happening is with a 1st rounder with conditions for Enstrom resigning with Colorado. I was just curious to see what player would be thrown around the most from Colorado. I have heard a lot of Stastny and that would work WITH a pick as listed above but without that pick it would have to be a lot less than Stastny and would be less for ANY team pursuing Enstrom.

denniscasa 07-09-2012 06:51 PM

What about this:

To COL
Enstrom
Little
Conditional 1st round pick

To WPG
Duchene
Barrie

:handclap:

Hansen Brother 07-09-2012 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CobraAcesS (Post 52353153)
Colorado is a lot further ahead up front and Winnipeg has better defense. Pretty even in goal IMO

Honestly I wouldn't give up any more than Barrie + 1st for Enstrom and that is right now..

Do you really think Enstrom is going to get you the same return as Staal? Carolina KNEW they had a good chance of getting Staal to sign long term because of his brother. Any team trading for Enstrom wouldn't have that luxury. Besides for the fact that Staal is 23...

You want a similar return to what Richards and Cater got and they were on long term cap friendly deals. Ha.. NO WAY

I agree completely. When the Sharks traded for Burns they must have known he would resign with them otherwise they would have never given up what they did. That definitely would have a big impact on the return we could expect. However, I see no reason why something similiar could not be arranged with Toby. If it can, the return would be closer to Burns, if not, closer to Kaberle.

CobraAcesS 07-09-2012 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FjordToBoard (Post 52353723)
The only way I see the deal happening is with a 1st rounder with conditions for Enstrom resigning with Colorado. I was just curious to see what player would be thrown around the most from Colorado. I have heard a lot of Stastny and that would work WITH a pick as listed above but without that pick it would have to be a lot less than Stastny and would be less for ANY team pursuing Enstrom.

The pick would have to come with no conditions.. Because honestly with Stastny the Jets are not a bottom 10 team.

The pick wouldn't be high enough to justify the loss of BOTH Stastny & Enstrom even if it was top 5.

Stastny having two years left makes a whole hell of a lot more difference because after two straight years with a team you have a lot better chance of resigning a player than with only one year.

Stastny would cost you Enstrom + Burmistrov + Conditional 1st

If Enstrom walked then Colorado would still have Burmi and a mid round 1st.

Honestly IF IF IF the Jets wanted to make that trade I would probably do it. I could see Colorado adding a mid level prospect or a depth defenseman like Wilson. So..

This is what I would propose..

:avs:

Enstrom
Burmistrov
1st

:jets:

Stastny
Jones
2nd

We can afford to lose Jones with Stastny since we have Jones, PAP, Downie, & Hejduk down the right side. And to be honest Jones plays his best with Stastny anyways.

That would give the Jets a line of Kane - Stastny - Jones up front.

Paradise 07-09-2012 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CobraAcesS (Post 52354357)
The pick would have to come with no conditions.. Because honestly with Stastny the Jets are not a bottom 10 team.

The pick wouldn't be high enough to justify the loss of BOTH Stastny & Enstrom even if it was top 5.

Stastny having two years left makes a whole hell of a lot more difference because after two straight years with a team you have a lot better chance of resigning a player than with only one year.

Stastny would cost you Enstrom + Burmistrov + Conditional 1st

If Enstrom walked then Colorado would still have Burmi and a mid round 1st.

It's probably best for you to move onto another top pairing d-man.

Muffin 07-09-2012 07:15 PM

Stastny for Enstrom + conditional 1st is too much of a risk for the Avs, if Enstrom walks then the Avs are left with a 1st round pick for Stastny and 1 year of Enstrom.

CobraAcesS 07-09-2012 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paradise (Post 52355061)
It's probably best for you to move onto another top pairing d-man.

Fair enough..

I honestly would rather ADD to Stastny and try and get Yandle or Ryan anyways. The Jets are not the only team out there with Defense that is looking for a center.

Besides you guys just picked up a center..

denniscasa 07-09-2012 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CobraAcesS (Post 52355347)
Fair enough..

I honestly would rather ADD to Stastny and try and get Yandle or Ryan anyways. The Jets are not the only team out there with Defense that is looking for a center.

Besides you guys just picked up a center..

I found it surprising that none of us Jets fans mentioned this in this thread. We just got Jokinen. We don't need another centre :laugh:

Jets 07-09-2012 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speik (Post 52355633)
I found it surprising that none of us Jets fans mentioned this in this thread. We just got Jokinen. We don't need another centre :laugh:

Could always use another Centre. If we picked up another Centre, that fills our RW need, as we shift Little back out to the wing.


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