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-   -   Rosters and Ratings: NHL 13 player growth (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1263381)

Gusto73 09-23-2012 10:29 AM

NHL 13 player growth
 
Hey can someone shed some light on how player Development works

Few things

Does potential change (ie. will a 3 star guy who has a big year at age 20 have a chance to get a higher ceiling?)

Does performance effect player growth (should I be giving my young goalie starts to help him grow?)

Does assistant coach still effect developing players? It seems expensive to just give injury feedback but dosent say anything about it.

Thanks

Kellogs 09-23-2012 11:37 AM

I think potential changes is random, but I don't think it's connected to player performance, and unlike NHL 12, it appears less likely to occur.

EA claims it does, but I haven't seen it from young prospects. I have seen it happen with players that are close to, or have already reached their potential. If they have a really good season, they tend to go up a bit.

Probably yes. And like NHL 12, a high AC will probably help some of your prospects improve their potential over time.

LilySmoov 09-23-2012 11:41 AM

A player's ceiling will never change, though they're still capable of exceeding it. A player projected to max out at 3 stars could still end up a 3.5 star player, but he'll never project as a 3.5 star player.

Kellogs 09-23-2012 12:03 PM

Are you sure about that? I've seen player's ceilings change with players on the decline. I would assume it's possible but highly unlikely for the same to happen in the upwards direction.

EvoLu7ioN 09-23-2012 12:08 PM

Stamkos turns into a beast! lol.

LilySmoov 09-23-2012 12:11 PM

Therein lies the difference between white stars and non-white stars. Once a player has stopped growing, the stars will become white (as opposed to red/yellow/green), and thus no longer indicate their ceiling, rather simply their current rating (which itself can change).

^@Kellogs

Jack de la Hoya 09-23-2012 01:34 PM

Isles got screwed pretty good with Strome and Nino.

I simmed an entire season, forcing them onto the top-line with Tavares. The team went to the Finals, they finished with respectably 40+ point totals, and jumped a whopping 1 and 3 points respectively.

CanucksCupHopes* 09-23-2012 01:44 PM

Have any of the Canucks prospects like Jensen, Gaunce,Schroeder and Kassian became good Players after simmons seasons?

Kellogs 09-23-2012 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LilySmoov (Post 54529643)
Therein lies the difference between white stars and non-white stars. Once a player has stopped growing, the stars will become white (as opposed to red/yellow/green), and thus no longer indicate their ceiling, rather simply their current rating (which itself can change).

^@Kellogs

That would make sense...however it's not very consistent with what I'm seeing. Iginla went from 85 (4 white stars), to 84 (3 white stars) in the 2014 offseason. Yet Michalek, and Clowe still have 4 stars but are 83 and 82 respectively. Additionally, Spezza (87) is a 4.5 white star, while Gonchar (88) is 4.0 stars.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack de la Hoya (Post 54531773)
Isles got screwed pretty good with Strome and Nino.

I simmed an entire season, forcing them onto the top-line with Tavares. The team went to the Finals, they finished with respectably 40+ point totals, and jumped a whopping 1 and 3 points respectively.

Like I saw mentioned in the Dynasty topic, don't just look at overall points. This year's overall calculations heavily weighs defensive awareness, so they probably have still have a low value in that attribute which is why you didn't see the big jump. Maybe to get them to improve their defensive awareness, you need to play them in defensive situations (ie. the PK).

Kezia 10-07-2012 02:21 PM

What are the caps/max outs of the stars? Is 3 stars an 80 overall max out?(3 1/2 85, 4 90)

This should have been explained by EA.

Gusto73 10-08-2012 01:20 PM

Still a little confused, would love for someone to shed some light on it

I've read that it's "statistic based growth" but this kinda isn't adding up for me

Example:
I had a 20 year old rookie 79 4 stars potiental he went to an 82 in 2nd year

He had 31 goals 22 assists reg season and 8 goals 5 assists in postseason

Another guy 21 year old 69 overall 4 1/2 star guy who played mostly in AHL had 9 points in 17 games in NHL and 5 points in postseason

He got 2 overall

Seems a bit skewed I wish they would have kept player development thru season as well or explained it better

Kezia 10-08-2012 03:20 PM

Player growth seems completely random to me.

madcracker 10-10-2012 10:07 AM

Does anyone know if players' potential star colour can change? In my companion app the majority of players in the trade player section now have green potential stars. The potential rating itself didn't change, just the star colouring. I wonder if there's a problem with the app.

I haven't been in-game to check to see if the colours match the app yet.

http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...pseacdc166.png

Gusto73 10-10-2012 12:37 PM

Anyone seen any like breakout years from guys? Like someone getting 5+ overall points in an offseason all I ever see is 2 and 3

Grind 10-10-2012 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusto73 (Post 54889441)
Anyone seen any like breakout years from guys? Like someone getting 5+ overall points in an offseason all I ever see is 2 and 3

I traded for Baertshi and had him go up 5-6 points to an 84 in the second year. he was literally the only prospect i had go up more then 1 point.

Young nhlers rose well.. Bogosian and OEL both went up 4.

n00bxQb 10-10-2012 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusto73 (Post 54889441)
Anyone seen any like breakout years from guys? Like someone getting 5+ overall points in an offseason all I ever see is 2 and 3

Halischuk went from a 77 to an 85 after a 15-point "breakout" season in my BAGM :laugh:

Gusto73 10-10-2012 02:51 PM

Ok cool, now I assume potential has a large factor on this

That's good to hear I was starting to be afraid that 3 points was the max and anyone not drafted in the high 60s minimum was worthless

Also stats do have an effect on how much the gain correct?

I had a 20 year old score a little over 50 points in the reg season (79 overall snp first year) and he only went from 79 to 82

Also I drafted Malcolm subban and he did well his first year in nhl and went from 81 to 83

Good to hear there's a chance they can really skyrocket

Anyone else confirm this?

Grind 10-10-2012 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusto73 (Post 54892103)
Ok cool, now I assume potential has a large factor on this

That's good to hear I was starting to be afraid that 3 points was the max and anyone not drafted in the high 60s minimum was worthless

Also stats do have an effect on how much the gain correct?

I had a 20 year old score a little over 50 points in the reg season (79 overall snp first year) and he only went from 79 to 82

Also I drafted Malcolm subban and he did well his first year in nhl and went from 81 to 83

Good to hear there's a chance they can really skyrocket

Anyone else confirm this?

from reading on here it almost seems like its MORE dependent on how they perform (save for the above mentioned 15 point breakout season).

though baerschi jumped good i should note i had 3-4 other prospects who were 3.5+ stars and none of them increased by more then 1 or 2 points.

mind you, these prospects did struggle (and had bad ice time)

TheDrizzle81 10-10-2012 04:18 PM

eric wellwood jumps to an 80

Yokai 10-10-2012 04:20 PM

Player progression in this game is very difficult to boil down to an exact science.

From my experiences playing them in the AHL/NHL doesn't really matter. I've tested things multiple times and the guys that go up by a ton do it regardless of where they play.

That being said sometimes no matter how good a players season is they won't progress by a lot. For example I've got a "third line scorer" who is 81 OVR and put together a seventy point season only to fall by 1 OVR. Then I've got another player who put together a thirty-five point season in the AHL on the third line and he goes up by 3 OVR.

Kellogs 10-10-2012 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusto73 (Post 54892103)
Ok cool, now I assume potential has a large factor on this

That's good to hear I was starting to be afraid that 3 points was the max and anyone not drafted in the high 60s minimum was worthless

Also stats do have an effect on how much the gain correct?

I had a 20 year old score a little over 50 points in the reg season (79 overall snp first year) and he only went from 79 to 82

Also I drafted Malcolm subban and he did well his first year in nhl and went from 81 to 83

Good to hear there's a chance they can really skyrocket

Anyone else confirm this?

It all depends on which attributes go up. Certain attributes are very heavily weighted where as others have little to no impact on a player's overall. It could just be that you're seeing players that are having increases in attributes that are not heavily weighted, so they may not appear to be improving as much.

Things like defensive awareness have a massive impact on player overall. For example, I had a player who was 79 like you, and he put up 34 points in 48 games (roughly the same pace as your player), and he went up to 82 overall. However, his offensive attributes were already really high, but his defensive attributes are on the low end for an NHL player and didn't improve much. His overall increase is explained by his improvements in his offensive abilities which already had little room to grow.

On the other hand, I had a player who was 75 overall, and he had some really good offensive abilities (87 OA, 88 Passing), but the rest like shooting, puck control etc... were pretty average. He had 51 points winning the calder, and shot up to 81 overall. He had some good improvements in his offensive abilities (91 OA, shooting attributes in the low 80s, puck control attributes in the mid 80s), but the reason why he jumped higher is because his defensive awareness shot up from 79 to 92!

The difference between the two? The second player was given PK time. Now, there is a certain random element which determines how much individual attributes increase/decrease over time, however I suspect the type of ice-time you give a player impacts which attributes increase. If you want a player to truly develop, then they need to become a well rounded player which means they probably need significant PP & PK time to achieve their full potential.

plaaplaa72 10-11-2012 03:56 AM

I like the new potential system because even players with white stars can get their overall up.
Example Filppula went from 83 to 86 in my Be A GM because he had a 75-point season.

Gusto73 10-15-2012 03:53 PM

I love the idea of statistic based growth but it seems flawed,

Had that sniper (82 overall 21 years old 4stars) put up 60 points in 2nd year

He gained 0 overall.....

Had a 20 year old snp also on 3rd line put up 45 points same potential

He gained 0 overall as well

Had a playmaker play in AHL all year came up with 10 NHL games had 1 point in them and 55 points in minors

4 and a half stars 21 years old

He went from 73 to 77 overall

I'm just really confused by this I think statistic based growth is awesome but judging by this it seems screwy

Can anyone make sense of this? Maybe snipers have limited growth because they seem to improve shooting almost exclusively?

I'm going to reload right after the last game of post season to see if it comes out different and hopefully it hasn't factored improvements yet I'd like to re run it 10 or so times to see trends maybe I was just unlucky this time around

Anyone make sense of this it would really suck if such a good young guy wasted a year of improvement

Kezia 10-15-2012 08:01 PM

its pure randomness.

Petes2424 10-15-2012 08:14 PM

Im pretty convinced it's 75% random. I've put players in all types of situations and little changes. I've had guys jump 5+ ovr who's stats were low and guys not even progress with #1 minutes, etc.

What I have noticed is after ELC's if you look and see what it would take to sign them for 8 years, you can get an idea if that player's going to grow or not. For instance, I had my only #1 overall pick in roughly 2025. The guy played his ELC out in the AHL. Never hit 70. I then signed him for a two year deal for around 1.5 million. If I looked at what he wanted on an 8 year deal it went up over $10 million. He became a top2 defenseman another 6 years later, which coincided with where those dollar values increased dramatically.

So I now look at a guy who's ELC is expired. Even if he's a 64 for example. I look to see what giving him an 8 yr deal would be and if it jumps considerable at any point, I know he'll mature into an NHL player. Also, look at the guy's trade value. If it increases or stays the same, he'll probably progress. Beware of signing them to those long 1 way deals though. It might take another 3-5 years for the guy to progress.


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