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-   -   OT: Official 2012 Patriots/NFL Thread Part II (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1264131)

bruinsfan1970 09-25-2012 11:27 AM

Official 2012 Patriots/NFL Thread Part II
 
Have at it...

Mancini0518 09-25-2012 04:44 PM

70,000 voicemails left on the NFL headquarters phones.

GarbageGoal 09-25-2012 04:54 PM

All this over a drop in the bucket that will have ZERO impact on the league's profits. One less golden faucet in Jerry Jones mansion, anyway.......

Every NFL owner needs to hang their head in shame today, and yes, that includes the supposed "best owner in the league". He's Roger's BFF anyway....

bruinswincup 09-25-2012 05:48 PM

Nuts and bolts, we got screwed.

Donnie Shulzhoffer 09-26-2012 08:24 AM

As much as we need to blame the owners we have to give equal blame to the refs as well.

Therick67 09-26-2012 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donnie Shulzhoffer (Post 54594535)
As much as we need to blame the owners we have to give equal blame to the refs as well.

Why exactly?

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54594555)
Why exactly?

I'm guessing he thinks it's because they suck and are not qualified?

People always talk about athletes that get overpaid and how you cannot blame them for accepting bloated contracts (Crawford, Drew, Lapointe awhile back, etc.).

I agree with that sentiment, but this is a bit different. If my boss offered me the same job I had now for 10 times what I was currently making...no brainer. However, if he offered me a different job that was high-paying, but I knew that I was not really qualified, and would perform poorly in the position and make myself and the company look bad...I would pass.

Therick67 09-26-2012 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GloryDaze4877 (Post 54594833)
I'm guessing he thinks it's because they suck and are not qualified?

People always talk about athletes that get overpaid and how you cannot blame them for accepting bloated contracts (Crawford, Drew, Lapointe awhile back, etc.).

I agree with that sentiment, but this is a bit different. If my boss offered me the same job I had now for 10 times what I was currently making...no brainer. However, if he offered me a different job that was high-paying, but I knew that I was not really qualified, and would perform poorly in the position and make myself and the company look bad...I would pass.

I'm not sure if he's talking the replacements or the locked out officials.

The owners thought anyone could do the job, or they wouldn't let just anyone do it.

Confound 09-26-2012 08:56 AM

I got a sure thing feeling we are going to smoke the Bills this week.

No way BB and Brady lose three in a row, they are gonna be pissed and will run up the score circa 2007.

Kate08 09-26-2012 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54594905)
I'm not sure if he's talking the replacements or the locked out officials.

The owners thought anyone could do the job, or they wouldn't let just anyone do it.

I don't think the owners thought anyone could do the job, and after 3 weeks, they certainly know that's not the case.

They don't care about the product on the field as much as they care about their bank accounts. If and when the product on the field affects their bank accounts, they'll get to caring quite quickly.

This conversation in contrast with the lockout conversation is hillarious to me.

Therick67 09-26-2012 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate08 (Post 54594969)
I don't think the owners thought anyone could do the job, and after 3 weeks, they certainly know that's not the case.

They don't care about the product on the field as much as they care about their bank accounts. If and when the product on the field affects their bank accounts, they'll get to caring quite quickly.

This conversation in contrast with the lockout conversation is hillarious to me.

I think we agree. I do think they under valued the regualr guys thought. They didn't anticipate this being so out of control.

Penny wise and a pound foolish. The NFL makes 9 billion a year, most of these owners have 27 family members on the payroll who don't do a thing but they decided the officials are the place to cheap out.

Donnie Shulzhoffer 09-26-2012 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54594555)
Why exactly?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54594905)
I'm not sure if he's talking the replacements or the locked out officials.

The owners thought anyone could do the job, or they wouldn't let just anyone do it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate08 (Post 54594969)
I don't think the owners thought anyone could do the job, and after 3 weeks, they certainly know that's not the case.

They don't care about the product on the field as much as they care about their bank accounts. If and when the product on the field affects their bank accounts, they'll get to caring quite quickly.

This conversation in contrast with the lockout conversation is hillarious to me.

I am referring to the locked out officials. The owners made the mistake of not getting this done in the off season and the locked out officials are asking for way too much.

They are all to blame for this.

Therick67 09-26-2012 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donnie Shulzhoffer (Post 54595123)
I am referring to the locked out officials. The owners made the mistake of not getting this done in the off season and the locked out officials are asking for way too much.

They are all to blame for this.

I don't pretend to know all the issuues, but from what I understand they want to keep the pension plan the owners agreed to for the current guys and they agreed to 401K's for new officials going foward.

I heard the number for each team is something like 60K a year. The NFL makes 9 billion a year. Asking for way too much?

bruins309 09-26-2012 09:31 AM

The owners deserve blame for this referee mess, but only from the perspective that they have not gotten involved in these negotiations, reportedly at the insistence of the league office. So this isn't so much on Robert Kraft and Jerry Jones as it is on Roger Goodell.

They SHOULD get involved at this point to save their commissioner because this is a PR disaster. It's really harming the integrity of the games.

That being said, the referees are being a little too intransigent, don't you think? Not a whole lot of businesses offer part time employees pension benefits. They've budged a little but they gotta stop holding out for leverage because eventually they won't have as much of it. They should be trying to cut the best deal they can immediately.

Therick67 09-26-2012 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bruins309 (Post 54595399)
The owners deserve blame for this referee mess, but only from the perspective that they have not gotten involved in these negotiations, reportedly at the insistence of the league office. So this isn't so much on Robert Kraft and Jerry Jones as it is on Roger Goodell.

They SHOULD get involved at this point to save their commissioner because this is a PR disaster. It's really harming the integrity of the games.

That being said, the referees are being a little too intransigent, don't you think? Not a whole lot of businesses offer part time employees pension benefits. They've budged a little but they gotta stop holding out for leverage because eventually they won't have as much of it. They should be trying to cut the best deal they can immediately.

Why did they give them a pension in the first place? should they not want to keep that, since they were given it?
If the league doen't want them, fire them all and keep what they have. Its penny wise and a pound foolish IMO. I was a season ticket holder, I've spent a good deal of time and money on the Patriots and the NFL. They make 9 billion dollars, the officials aren't going to bankrupt the league. get a deal done.

Kate08 09-26-2012 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bruins309 (Post 54595399)
The owners deserve blame for this referee mess, but only from the perspective that they have not gotten involved in these negotiations, reportedly at the insistence of the league office. So this isn't so much on Robert Kraft and Jerry Jones as it is on Roger Goodell.

They SHOULD get involved at this point to save their commissioner because this is a PR disaster. It's really harming the integrity of the games.

That being said, the referees are being a little too intransigent, don't you think? Not a whole lot of businesses offer part time employees pension benefits. They've budged a little but they gotta stop holding out for leverage because eventually they won't have as much of it. They should be trying to cut the best deal they can immediately.

Not a whole lot of part-time employees effect the outcome/success of the business like the refs do.

They aren't going to get the monster salaries that the players get, and they shouldn't...but I don't think it's ridiculous for them to want a little piece of the pie. If anything, this whole....experiment....proves their worth to the players and the fans in a whole new way. The question is will the owners care about that enough to budge, and what will it take to get there?

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 09:48 AM

I think that the NFL wants full-time officials. I know part of the issue is that locked out refs are only part-time, don't have to report to the NFL except for weekends, and many place their priorities on their M-F 9-5 jobs. I can understand why the NFL might have an issue with this.

I believe this is less about money (given the small amount) and more about having full-time refs that can be sent for training and conditioning 7 days a week, and can be held more accountable for their performance. If it's a part-time job and the guy is a lawyer the rest of the week, is there that much incentive for him to get the calls right 100% of the time? If the NFL threatens to can him...oh well, I will just have to fall back on my lawyer's salary. Not very threatening.

Kate08 09-26-2012 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GloryDaze4877 (Post 54595617)
I think that the NFL wants full-time officials. I know part of the issue is that locked out refs are only part-time, don't have to report to the NFL except for weekends, and many place their priorities on their M-F 9-5 jobs. I can understand why the NFL might have an issue with this.

I believe this is less about money (given the small amount) and more about having full-time refs that can be sent for training and conditioning 7 days a week, and can be held more accountable for their performance. If it's a part-time job and the guy is a lawyer the rest of the week, is there that much incentive for him to get the calls right 100% of the time? If the NFL threatens to can him...oh well, I will just have to fall back on my lawyer's salary. Not very threatening.

That's true, but it is still kind of about money.

If you want FT guys, which I don't think is a horrible thing to want, you need to pay them a FT salary. Is there any information about there about what kind of compensation package would be offered for FT refs?

Therick67 09-26-2012 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GloryDaze4877 (Post 54595617)
I think that the NFL wants full-time officials. I know part of the issue is that locked out refs are only part-time, don't have to report to the NFL except for weekends, and many place their priorities on their M-F 9-5 jobs. I can understand why the NFL might have an issue with this.

I believe this is less about money (given the small amount) and more about having full-time refs that can be sent for training and conditioning 7 days a week, and can be held more accountable for their performance. If it's a part-time job and the guy is a lawyer the rest of the week, is there that much incentive for him to get the calls right 100% of the time? If the NFL threatens to can him...oh well, I will just have to fall back on my lawyer's salary. Not very threatening.

I was under the impression these guys did more than just show up on Sundays. I thought I heard they attend meetings and various things during the offseason as well as during training camp.

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate08 (Post 54595699)
That's true, but it is still kind of about money.

If you want FT guys, which I don't think is a horrible thing to want, you need to pay them a FT salary. Is there any information about there about what kind of compensation package would be offered for FT refs?

Not sure if they even offered FT as a possibility with this group because many are entrenched in their "regular" jobs?? I would guess that if they went FT, the compensation would be there?

No proof, but I think the NFL may want to break this group, then set up the job as FT going forward after this off season. They might get some of the old refs to do this and would likely be able to entice many top-notch guys from the big Div 1 conferences if the money is right.

Just a theory. Sucks because it would mean a whole season of this BS.

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54595719)
I was under the impression these guys did more than just show up on Sundays. I thought I heard they attend meetings and various things during the offseason as well as during training camp.

I am pretty sure I read that the league was pissed because a couple of times, they have asked the refs to go for various forms of training during the week and the refs said no?

I could be wrong?

I also thought I read that in regular game weeks, the officials are not beholden to the NFL until Friday evening or Saturday morning?

Therick67 09-26-2012 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GloryDaze4877 (Post 54595751)
I am pretty sure I read that the league was pissed because a couple of times, they have asked the refs to go for various forms of training during the week and the refs said no?

I could be wrong?

I also thought I read that in regular game weeks, the officials are not beholden to the NFL until Friday evening or Saturday morning?

If thats the case, I have less issue with the league.

You would think with all the talk over this situation someone somewhere could break things down a little better? It feels like the media is just lazy.

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 10:03 AM

Also, just heard that the refs and the NFL did come to an agreement about adding officials, and will compromise with a "development league" for new refs.

Still have to come to an agreement on the pension stuff.

Donnie Shulzhoffer 09-26-2012 10:08 AM

The locked out ref's were offered to be full time employees and they rejected it.

GloryDaze4877 09-26-2012 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Therick67 (Post 54595843)
If thats the case, I have less issue with the league.

You would think with all the talk over this situation someone somewhere could break things down a little better? It feels like the media is just lazy.

I was looking and there are a couple of places that break it down. Here's one that offers some insight:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/what...-need-to-know/

Most places say the refs spend between 20-25 hours per week prepping for and reffing games, not incl travel (which I am guessing the NFL pays for).

Only losers are fans and players in this deal.


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