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BeliveauFan4ever 09-26-2012 10:35 PM

Serge Savard, the player, a question
 
Watching the Summit Series this evening made me wonder.

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

I seem to recall he was a terrific skater as a rookie...not that he wasn't a very good skater in '72 and the years following.

I was just 7 when he broke into the NHL, so my recollections are less than great and I never saw him play, in person.

:help: Anyone?

Estimated_Prophet 09-26-2012 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeliveauFan4ever (Post 54609813)
Watching the Summit Series this evening made me wonder.

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

I seem to recall he was a terrific skater as a rookie...not that he wasn't a very good skater in '72 and the years following.

I was just 7 when he broke into the NHL, so my recollections are less than great and I never saw him play, in person.

:help: Anyone?


He was an incredible skater well after the '72 series. One of the most underated d-men of all time.

SherbrookeW 09-26-2012 11:02 PM

Yes, he certainly lost a step, or a stride, after the broken leg. Before then, he was widely, and not stupidly -- if not correctly -- compared to Bobby Orr. He often , Orr-like, went end to end. After, no one would have made that comparison. He remained a superb defenseman however, owing to the rest of his skill set -- the "patented spin-o-rama move" that Danny Gallivan loved to described -- and , as the years went by, to his vision and grasp of the game. He once set up Peter Mahovolich for a two-man shorthand goal, in a game against Buffalo in 1976 or so, that was a thing of beauty and just that vision. But after the broken leg, he was no longer in the fastest-d-man-on-the-ice competition.

BeliveauFan4ever 09-26-2012 11:34 PM

Thank You, both.

Sherbrooke,

The Orr thing...that's what I was thinking of when I posted. I seem to recall that comparison was a part of more than one analyst's discussion of him in '68, '69, those pre-injury years.

When he broke in, I remember thinking he as going to be my all-time fav Hab, he was simply electric and just too good to not be No. 1 in my book.

His injury was the first sports injury to upset me, that told me the game could be hazardous. I felt bad for him...but he had guts galore, and intelligence and cool///he did more than alright, and he was a winner.

Thanks for all you did, Serge...the memories...they're all good. :)

Mats86 09-27-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeliveauFan4ever (Post 54609813)
Watching the Summit Series this evening made me wonder.

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

I seem to recall he was a terrific skater as a rookie...not that he wasn't a very good skater in '72 and the years following.

I was just 7 when he broke into the NHL, so my recollections are less than great and I never saw him play, in person.

:help: Anyone?

Good place to ask this would be history of hockey forum. A lot of old school posters in there. Including Todd Denault

thom 09-27-2012 03:15 PM

After the 74-75 season he was never the same he had one knee and his point total was poor.Look at the stats nothing to look at.Poor Serge was also booed heavily in montreal in his final 3 seasons

onice 09-27-2012 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeliveauFan4ever (Post 54609813)

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

Actually that's injuries not injury. He shattered his ankle, was off for a year came back and shattered the same ankle within a few weeks.

And yes he lost a step. According to me Savard was as good as Orr before those injuries. He had everything Orr had. He went from a generational talent to a regular superstar. He was great.

bsl 09-28-2012 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeliveauFan4ever (Post 54609813)
Watching the Summit Series this evening made me wonder.

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

I seem to recall he was a terrific skater as a rookie...not that he wasn't a very good skater in '72 and the years following.

I was just 7 when he broke into the NHL, so my recollections are less than great and I never saw him play, in person.

:help: Anyone?

Savard did lose a step, but he was still better and smarter than any D of his generation except Orr.

Robinson was truly great. Lapointe was superb. But the MAN was Savard. He was the most calm, collected, and competent D man I have ever seen. He NEVER lost the puck in our zone. Never.

I think Savard was close to Orr level if he had not broken both of his legs.

Edit: Sorry, same leg twice as poster above said.

bsl 09-28-2012 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 54622249)
Actually that's injuries not injury. He shattered his ankle, was off for a year came back and shattered the same ankle within a few weeks.

And yes he lost a step. According to me Savard was as good as Orr before those injuries. He had everything Orr had. He went from a generational talent to a regular superstar. He was great.

I compared to Orr as well, without seeing your post. That's how good Savard could have been I think, almost as good as Orr, maybe even better in his own end. Maybe.

bsl 09-28-2012 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thom (Post 54621933)
After the 74-75 season he was never the same he had one knee and his point total was poor.Look at the stats nothing to look at.Poor Serge was also booed heavily in montreal in his final 3 seasons

Yeah. Right. We booed Lafluer as well sometimes. (Actually I never did, I don't boo.) But Habs fans were incredibly spoiled then.

Savard adjusted his game the last few years and became one of the most dependable D zone Dman I have ever watched play.

We could only dream of having Savard, adjusted for today's game, in our D lineup now. He was a tremendous hockey player.

toshiro 09-29-2012 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 54622249)
Actually that's injuries not injury. He shattered his ankle, was off for a year came back and shattered the same ankle within a few weeks.

And yes he lost a step. According to me Savard was as good as Orr before those injuries. He had everything Orr had. He went from a generational talent to a regular superstar. He was great.

No offense but to compare anyone with Orr is ridiculous. Paul Coffey was compared to Orr after scoring 46 in one year and said the comparison was ridiculous. Orr wasnt just about speed. He was amazing. Orr Lemieux Gretzky Howe Richard

Estimated_Prophet 09-29-2012 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsl (Post 54634873)
Savard did lose a step, but he was still better and smarter than any D of his generation except Orr.

Robinson was truly great. Lapointe was superb. But the MAN was Savard. He was the most calm, collected, and competent D man I have ever seen. He NEVER lost the puck in our zone. Never.

I think Savard was close to Orr level if he had not broken both of his legs.

Edit: Sorry, same leg twice as poster above said.

True enough!

For those who really understand the game, Savard was the best of the big three. Robinson might have the Norris trophies but that was due to his flashy style and offensive totals. Robinson was a beast but he was also prone to major gaffes whereas Savard was a defensive juggernaut who would have had much better offensive numbers if Lapointe and his incredible slapshot wasn't around to take up PP time alongside Robinson.

Another d-man who was a defensive God who gets overlooked is Jacques Laperriere. An incredible skater with a huge wingspan and an unparallelled understanding of the defensive game. We were soooo spoiled in the 70's it is a shame that most posters on this board weren't around to see it.

Estimated_Prophet 09-29-2012 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toshiro (Post 54654217)
No offense but to compare anyone with Orr is ridiculous. Paul Coffey was compared to Orr after scoring 46 in one year and said the comparison was ridiculous. Orr wasnt just about speed. He was amazing. Orr Lemieux Gretzky Howe Richard

I agree that Orr was one of a kind but IMO Savard was better than Coffey. Paul Coffey is the most overrated d-man to ever play the game. He played almost his entire career with Gretzky and Lemieux in their primes. He was really a 4th forward as he almost entirely neglected his defensive duties and was always joining the rush in a time when goalscoring was at an all-time high in the NHL due to a watered down league from expansion and a lack of European talent to fill the newly created jobs. You also have to take into consideration that the science of goaltending was on it's last legs of it's version of the flat earth society (stand up) and the equipment was still tiny.

Savard was just as capable as Coffey was of putting up those numbers in the same circumstance but they were in completely opposite ends of the spectrum when the discussion turns to defensive prowess. Paul Coffey was in the the two most advantagious places in the history of the NHL for an offensive defenceman and he certainly made the most of it. He was still a great talent but people need to view his accomplishments with a little more perspective.

Give me Savard over Coffey every day of the week.

Matteus 09-29-2012 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeliveauFan4ever (Post 54609813)
Watching the Summit Series this evening made me wonder.

Longtime Hab fans...did Serge lose a step or at least some speed, IYO, after his leg injury?

I seem to recall he was a terrific skater as a rookie...not that he wasn't a very good skater in '72 and the years following.

I was just 7 when he broke into the NHL, so my recollections are less than great and I never saw him play, in person.

:help: Anyone?

I was only 10-years old when he broke into the the league in '67 so I may be embellishing my memories but my perception as a young hockey fan was that he was a fast and powerful skater when he broke in and that his skating was never quite the same after his first injury. For what it's worth.

onice 09-29-2012 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toshiro (Post 54654217)
No offense but to compare anyone with Orr is ridiculous. Paul Coffey was compared to Orr after scoring 46 in one year and said the comparison was ridiculous. Orr wasnt just about speed. He was amazing. Orr Lemieux Gretzky Howe Richard


Did you see Savard play? I did. And if you ask anyone that saw him play before his injuries, they'd tell you he was comparable to Orr.

Et le But 09-29-2012 01:46 PM

I still don't understand how Savard didn't make THN's top 20 defensemen.

Scary to think of what he could have been without that injury.

Estimated_Prophet 09-29-2012 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Et le But (Post 54658165)
I still don't understand how Savard didn't make THN's top 20 defensemen.

Scary to think of what he could have been without that injury.

THN like virtually all sport publications is a joke now. If you are looking for interviews and behind the scenes reporting then there are some interesting articles. If you are looking for informed opinions look elsewhere.

The fact is that sports journalists are journalists who cover sports. They are not experts in any sense of the word. There are countless posters on these boards who are far more knowledgeable than the majority of the hacks who write for sporting publications like THN or SI. Don't get me wrong, the majority of the posters here are very unknowledgeable but there are a significant number of very bright hockey minds floating around this site......you just have to know where to look ;)

Canadiens1958 09-29-2012 08:01 PM

Serge Savard
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by toshiro (Post 54654217)
No offense but to compare anyone with Orr is ridiculous. Paul Coffey was compared to Orr after scoring 46 in one year and said the comparison was ridiculous. Orr wasnt just about speed. He was amazing. Orr Lemieux Gretzky Howe Richard

Serge Savard actually outplayed Bobby Orr in the 1969 playoffs on his way to winning the Conn Smythe for leading the Canadiens to the SC.

Before suffering two broken legs in the NHL, Savard was an elite skater even though he had suffered a knee injury in junior which set him back.

Chili 10-02-2012 06:18 PM

I can remember watching I believe the second broken leg when Savard crashed into the goalpost. The Joe Theisman injury in the NFL reminded me of it.

But Savard came back and had a hall of fame career. He adjusted his game accordingly.

And importantly, for player safety, I believe the injury was one of the main inspirations of the league adopting the 'Megg net' posts.

tinyzombies 10-02-2012 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili (Post 54726585)
I can remember watching I believe the second broken leg when Savard crashed into the goalpost. The Joe Theisman injury in the NFL reminded me of it.

But Savard came back and had a hall of fame career. He adjusted his game accordingly.

And importantly, for player safety, I believe the injury was one of the main inspirations of the league adopting the 'Megg net' posts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjYbtijeSWs

deandebean 10-02-2012 10:46 PM

Serge was the best defenceman over the other 2 parts of the big Three. Robinson was flash all the way, but made gzillion mistakes in his zone. You would see Brisebois-like passes sometimes. But he was still great.

Lapointe was all offence. He was murder on the PP.

But Serge was the workhorse. I remember a game where Bowman had Serge doubleshifting ALL GAME LONG. He sometimes gave him a rest with a rare shift from Chartraw. Serge was the guy to take the puck out of the zone. His passes were seldom in the skates. He was superb.

A very intelligent human being, who understood EVERYTHING there is to understand in the business world. No other hockey player, except maybe Dickie Moore, had such great success in business afterwards.


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