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-   -   Wheres Harry?? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1281387)

OLD51JOHN 11-09-2012 05:49 PM

Wheres Harry??
 
When you need him?The hockey news says its wonderful to take a working vacation in Switzerland.. The poor lads that are locked out of their jobs have to suffer the cruelty of playing in Europe.. Where is the picket line???It is a union. They better learn to yodel

Fire Julien 11-09-2012 06:15 PM

"We will not capitulate." Harry Sinden 1994

Looks like his spirit is alive as Bettman is once again ready to wipe out an entire season.

GordonHowe 11-09-2012 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD51JOHN (Post 55651763)
When you need him?The hockey news says its wonderful to take a working vacation in Switzerland.. The poor lads that are locked out of their jobs have to suffer the cruelty of playing in Europe.. Where is the picket line???It is a union. They better learn to yodel

In H E double hockey sticks, where he belongs.

eightspokedb 11-09-2012 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GordonHowe (Post 55654631)
In H E double hockey sticks, where he belongs.

QFT

I was going to try to be more elegant but this nails it -

Artemis 11-10-2012 12:15 AM

It's a lockout, not a strike. Anyone not being allowed to ply his trade has the right to go elsewhere.

And speaking of Harry, it's blowhards like him treating players like garbage who put pro sports in this situation in the first place. You reap what you sow.

ODAAT 11-10-2012 07:05 AM

Sinden`s first half of his Bruin days were good, solid vision

Second half---utter disaster and THAT, is the Sinden that, because of my age, I was subjected to which will forever paint him in a light unflattering, I miss him as much as I miss having that nasty Planter`s wart last year

Dennis Bonvie 11-10-2012 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODAAT (Post 55663415)
Sinden`s first half of his Bruin days were good, solid vision

Second half---utter disaster and THAT, is the Sinden that, because of my age, I was subjected to which will forever paint him in a light unflattering, I miss him as much as I miss having that nasty Planter`s wart last year

28 seasons as the Bruins GM.

Two seasons with a losing record.

Disaster?

Morris Wanchuk 11-10-2012 09:06 AM

Drunk

Artemis 11-10-2012 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie (Post 55664307)
28 seasons as the Bruins GM.

Two seasons with a losing record.

Disaster?

More days in first place!

GordonHowe 11-10-2012 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eightspokedb (Post 55655053)
QFT

I was going to try to be more elegant but this nails it -

What's QFT? "Quite ********** True"? :)

eightspokedb 11-10-2012 12:50 PM

quote for truth - but I like yours better

ODAAT 11-10-2012 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie (Post 55664307)
28 seasons as the Bruins GM.

Two seasons with a losing record.

Disaster?

Please, the record or consecutive playoff trips are not at all of which I speak and knowing you a bit from your posts, I'm certain you know what I mean and others when referencing the "bad" Harry, and it nothing to do with wins and losses

Dennis Bonvie 11-11-2012 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODAAT (Post 55668507)
Please, the record or consecutive playoff trips are not at all of which I speak and knowing you a bit from your posts, I'm certain you know what I mean and others when referencing the "bad" Harry, and it nothing to do with wins and losses

I'm willing to leave Harry in the past. But posters seem to want to go back to what they remember of the guy and then let everyone else that's too young to remember pile on. I won't allow it.

I was a fan when the Bruins were the laughing stock of the NHL. Harry Sinden was instrumental in making them Stanley Cup champions (coached the first one) and then kept them contenders for the next 30 odd years. Keep bringing him up, I'll keep giving the history lessons.

DaBroons 11-12-2012 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie (Post 55696959)
I'm willing to leave Harry in the past. But posters seem to want to go back to what they remember of the guy and then let everyone else that's too young to remember pile on. I won't allow it.

I was a fan when the Bruins were the laughing stock of the NHL. Harry Sinden was instrumental in making them Stanley Cup champions (coached the first one) and then kept them contenders for the next 30 odd years. Keep bringing him up, I'll keep giving the history lessons.

Revisionist history.

Milt Schmidt built that Bruins' team that won 2 cups. He made the trade to get Esposito, Stanfield, and Hodge.

The previous regime signed Bobby Orr.

Sinden was a great, great coach, but he wasn't a great GM by any stretch of the imagination. Greating coaching job on Team Canada in 72.

28 seasons as GM, ZERO cups. Count 'em, ZERO.

Z E R 0

ODAAT 11-12-2012 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie (Post 55696959)
I'm willing to leave Harry in the past. But posters seem to want to go back to what they remember of the guy and then let everyone else that's too young to remember pile on. I won't allow it.

I was a fan when the Bruins were the laughing stock of the NHL. Harry Sinden was instrumental in making them Stanley Cup champions (coached the first one) and then kept them contenders for the next 30 odd years. Keep bringing him up, I'll keep giving the history lessons.

I didn`t pile on, the wreckage left behind by Harry has done that for me. His ability to put just enough talent on the ice to make post season appearances was impressive, his acute allergy to treating players fairly, alienating many, and not forcing Bruin fans to consistently have to read/hear about, yet another player who was in contract disputes with him is what I refer to when Harry comes up.

What he did was great in the 70`s, his inability or outright refusal to treat players well or fairly is undeniable, and regardless of all the consecutive years in the playoffs, it took years, some could argue, a decade or more for the Bruins organization to tear down the public perception of being the kind of franchise they were, you know, the franchise that HAD to overpay, the franchise who treated it`s players so poorly, nobody other than the odd scrub would sign on, but strong, top shelf talent wouldn`t so much give the B`s a sniff.

THAT, is what Harry helped create, and being only 43, I didn`t understand his positive impact, what I was fed, were lineups that got to a few cup finals, but always seemed to be one, maybe two players away from being able to win er all, from time to time Harry would make a move and snag a Goring/Poulin but....

DaBroons 11-12-2012 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODAAT (Post 55709217)
I didn`t pile on, the wreckage left behind by Harry has done that for me. His ability to put just enough talent on the ice to make post season appearances was impressive, his acute allergy to treating players fairly, alienating many, and not forcing Bruin fans to consistently have to read/hear about, yet another player who was in contract disputes with him is what I refer to when Harry comes up.

What he did was great in the 70`s, his inability or outright refusal to treat players well or fairly is undeniable, and regardless of all the consecutive years in the playoffs, it took years, some could argue, a decade or more for the Bruins organization to tear down the public perception of being the kind of franchise they were, you know, the franchise that HAD to overpay, the franchise who treated it`s players so poorly, nobody other than the odd scrub would sign on, but strong, top shelf talent wouldn`t so much give the B`s a sniff.

THAT, is what Harry helped create, and being only 43, I didn`t understand his positive impact, what I was fed, were lineups that got to a few cup finals, but always seemed to be one, maybe two players away from being able to win er all, from time to time Harry would make a move and snag a Goring/Poulin but....

Other than perhaps the trades for Moog and Propp, he never made the deals to get the team over the top.

One thing he was excellent at doing was recognizing when a player had shown the first signs of slowing down, and trading them while their value was high. He did that with Espo and also with Barry Pederson.

I, for one, don't give a hoot about how many years in a row the team made the playoffs. That's an accomplishment for Jacobs' bank account, not the fans.

The Cup or nothing.

Dennis Bonvie 11-12-2012 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODAAT (Post 55709217)
I didn`t pile on, the wreckage left behind by Harry has done that for me. His ability to put just enough talent on the ice to make post season appearances was impressive, his acute allergy to treating players fairly, alienating many, and not forcing Bruin fans to consistently have to read/hear about, yet another player who was in contract disputes with him is what I refer to when Harry comes up.

What he did was great in the 70`s, his inability or outright refusal to treat players well or fairly is undeniable, and regardless of all the consecutive years in the playoffs, it took years, some could argue, a decade or more for the Bruins organization to tear down the public perception of being the kind of franchise they were, you know, the franchise that HAD to overpay, the franchise who treated it`s players so poorly, nobody other than the odd scrub would sign on, but strong, top shelf talent wouldn`t so much give the B`s a sniff.

THAT, is what Harry helped create, and being only 43, I didn`t understand his positive impact, what I was fed, were lineups that got to a few cup finals, but always seemed to be one, maybe two players away from being able to win er all, from time to time Harry would make a move and snag a Goring/Poulin but....

Considering those teams were competeing against the dynasty Canadiens, Islanders and Oilers for Cups its no surprise they came up short. And Sinden's teams were never just good enough to make the playoffs. They were contenders for the majority of his GM years. 13 seasons with over 100 points (which was a lot in the pre-OT & shootout days).

Last winter I had the great priviledge of having dinner with two Bruins stars from the 80s. I asked them both haw tough it was playing for Sinden. Both of them said they never had a problem with him. One said he actually liked it when Harry would get behind the bench because he was always a better coach than the guy he just fired.

DaBroons 11-13-2012 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie (Post 55722517)
Considering those teams were competeing against the dynasty Canadiens, Islanders and Oilers for Cups its no surprise they came up short. And Sinden's teams were never just good enough to make the playoffs. They were contenders for the majority of his GM years. 13 seasons with over 100 points (which was a lot in the pre-OT & shootout days).

Last winter I had the great priviledge of having dinner with two Bruins stars from the 80s. I asked them both haw tough it was playing for Sinden. Both of them said they never had a problem with him. One said he actually liked it when Harry would get behind the bench because he was always a better coach than the guy he just fired.

Sinden WAS a great coach, no doot a-boot it.

None of his teams, other than 74 were SERIOUS contenders. They were NEVER just short.

If not for Gilles Gilbert, the 79 team would have been swept by Montreal. He had 52 saves in Game 7. The 90 team was blown out by Edmonton; they could barely score 1 goal a game. That team had 1 good line and 2 3rd lines, no match for Edmonton's depth, even w/o Gretzky.

You never had the feeling they would actually win the Cup, because they were never the best team.

BlackNgold 84 11-13-2012 05:56 AM

At the bottom of a well somewhere, hopefully. The fact that man was near the ice when the bruins won the cup is insulting to me. Nevermind the fact that he got his name on the cup in 2011. **** him.

GordonHowe 11-13-2012 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eightspokedb (Post 55667521)
quote for truth - but I like yours better

They both work for me. :)

sjaustin77 11-13-2012 05:32 PM

There is a lot to dislike about Sinden but I have to thank him for the Neely trade. By itself; Pederson for Neely & a 1st is one of the greatest trades of all time.

If you follow the path of it though Sinden did help the Bruins win a cup because Lucic, Horton & Campbell are all parts of the Neely trade.

Neely is my favorite player ever
&
The 1st turned into:

Wesley who turned into 3 1sts (Samsonov, Aitken, McLaren)
Samsonov turned into Reasoner, Stastny, 2nd round pick
2nd round pick turned into Lucic.

McLaren + 4th rounder turned into Hackett & Jillson
Jillson turned into Boyes
Boyes turned into Wideman
Wideman and 2010 1st turned into Horton and Campbell

So Thanks for the Neely trade and some contribution to a cup. Wish I could have seen Neely & Bourque hoist the cup together with the B's though.

GordonHowe 11-13-2012 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackNgold 84 (Post 55731509)
At the bottom of a well somewhere, hopefully. The fact that man was near the ice when the bruins won the cup is insulting to me. Nevermind the fact that he got his name on the cup in 2011. **** him.

As noted previously, he forgets in an hour more than I will ever know about the game. Even so, in total agreement with the above.

He wasn't even professional enough (never mind considerate enough) to inform Espo of the NYR trade to his face. *That's* why Phil feels as he does abou the Bruins organization. Nor was he man enough to let Tommy McVie go in person; rather, he skipped town & left the unpleasant task to an underling. :rant:

ODAAT 11-13-2012 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GordonHowe (Post 55746035)
As noted previously, he forgets in an hour more than I will ever know about the game. Even so, in total agreement with the above.

He wasn't even professional enough (never mind considerate enough) to inform Espo of the NYR trade to his face. *That's* why Phil feels as he does abou the Bruins organization. Nor was he man enough to let Tommy McVie go in person; rather, he skipped town & left the unpleasant task to an underling. :rant:

yep, did Harry get results??? Depends on what your description of results is. Harry lost any slight bit of respect I had for him by repeatedly treating those in the organization like trash

Neely08 11-14-2012 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaBroons (Post 55709047)
Revisionist history.

Milt Schmidt built that Bruins' team that won 2 cups. He made the trade to get Esposito, Stanfield, and Hodge.

The previous regime signed Bobby Orr.

Sinden was a great, great coach, but he wasn't a great GM by any stretch of the imagination. Greating coaching job on Team Canada in 72.

28 seasons as GM, ZERO cups. Count 'em, ZERO.

Z E R 0

Had the B's drawn anyone but Edmonton in 1988 and 90. They likely win a couple of Cups. Edmonton was a machine of a team that hasn't been matched since, and probably never will be. Same can be said for the 91 pens.

They don't even get there w/o genius trade no one else in hockey saw, Cam Neely for Barry Pederson. Not sure if it's true, but I've heard Harry intervened at the draft table to insist on Ray Bourque.

Acquiring Dave Poulin wasn't an effort to better the team? That's coming from someone who absolutely loved "the Rat". Dave Christian? Adam Oates for Craig Janney?

After Neely was hurt, Harry did try to improve the team. Someday Bruins fans will realize 50 goal scorers are simply irreplaceable. Especially ones that make the opposition's nuts crawl up their insides and hide. Kevin Stevens, Iafrete deals both blew up in his face like a bomb. He even trades for a Vezina winning goalie, Jim Carey, and his career fizzles out before our eyes. No argument, those deals hurt more then they helped. We have something he didn't, hindsight. After that, the guy was damned if he did, damned if he didn't. He should have walked right there.

I have my beefs w/ Harry, and JJ for that matter, but to say Harry never gave us a chance to win is revisionist history.

Neely08 11-14-2012 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODAAT (Post 55746231)
yep, did Harry get results??? Depends on what your description of results is. Harry lost any slight bit of respect I had for him by repeatedly treating those in the organization like trash

Now this is hard to argue with.


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