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-   -   The VINCE SHOW--simply dazzling! (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1282235)

hawksfan50 11-12-2012 09:43 AM

The VINCE SHOW--simply dazzling!
 
I came.. I saw.. he conquered....I have seen "The Saviour" ....TT who?

Yes--I saw (on t.v.) the incedible performance put on by Hawks 6th round 2012 draftee VINCENT HINOSTROZA who captained Team USA to a 6-3 win over Canada West to win the Gold at the world JR. A Challenge last night...

VH had already had a terrific tournament but last night he put on the COUP DE GRACE with not just any 4 point night --but a 4 point night that included 2 --count 'em --2 WORLD CLASS HILIGHT-REEL GOALS (both are already candidates for Goal of The Year from all of hockey played anywhere this season---even PAT KANE would be hard-pressed to duplicate such gals showing both incredible skill and incredible determination...IN addition his 2 nearly behind the back passes to set up goals were things of beauty --just incredible hockey sense and skill.. IN addition he
had a blistering shot that clinged of the post --in addition he kills penalties and moves the puck so well on pp's...he also used his body to check guys onto the boards and to fight for pucks ...HE is a complete hockey player in all phases --terific skill,terrific speed, great shot and hands,great hockey sense-but best of al--VERY VERY DRIVEN ...

I have criticized Stan for many draft goofs--but in this case he hit the jackpot...a 6th round STEAL--plus the marketing dept. will love that he is a local kid from Bartlett Illinois...

EVEN BETTER NEWS: the knock on VH when drafted was his size--listed at just 5'9 170 -well he did not look that small to me --he looked a lot bigger than that to me -perhaps he's grown a few inches since the draft? On the other hand --one of his linemates--TAYLOR CAMMARATA lists at just 5'7 156--so maybe not--but there were a couple of 6'3 d-men out there for tem USA and I did not think VH looked 6 inches shorter than them --he looked closer to a 5'11-6'0 guy by my guess...but TEAM uSA did have a shrimpy roster of forwards--the tallest few being just 6'0 --so again maybe VH looked taller because the forwards around him were not that tall either?
BUT -IF he has already put on some height that is good news--if not --we can hope --because he has EVERYTHING ELSE but size to be a very veey very good impact player in future in the NHL...a very dynamic exciting player,playing hard 2-ways ,very good in all facets of the game...WE got a STEAL in the 6th round--book it Dano!

BTW: VH led the tournament in scoring with 6g 2a =8pts in just 4GP ...

Sevanston 11-12-2012 09:54 AM

I know we sometimes criticize HF50's favorite prospects, but this echoes every scouting report I have ever read about Hinostroza.

EDIT: Well, "echoes" them once you cut through the shots at Kane.

RomersWorld* 11-12-2012 10:09 AM

Wow, Vince Hinostroza>Pat Kane, book it...HF50 said so. He was the one that made me look so smart in front of my friends when I said "Kyle Turris>>>Pat Kane" and the vaunted Hawks' management was stupid for picking Kane.

Yes, clearly Kane is not capable of putting up 4 points in the USHL, a much inferior league to the OHL.

Draft years
Pat Kane(OHL): 58 games, 62 goals, 83 assists, 145 points, +42
Vince Hinostroza(USHL): 55 games, 20 goals, 24 assists, 44 points, +11

Yes, clearly Kane could never do what Hinostroza did in the USHL even though Kane was busy putting up 70 points at Vince's age while Vince is doing "good" in the USHL.

but... I do ask the question myself... why is Vince Hinostroza not at Notre Dame? did stan and his vaunted scouting staff make a mistake here? clearly vincey was not good enough to play at notre dame this year and had to play another year in the ushl. could this be a goof by stan? i ask myself this QUESTION and ponder it upon hfboards today WITH you all. afterall vinceyboy is small and WEAK do we not already have enuff of this? i do PONDER this question as well and wonder if stan and his vaunted scouting staff really did THINK this pick through-- afterall... vince hinostroza is only FOURTH on his team in scoring-- and this guy is supposed to be a skilled guy? hmmm..even a projected 3rd rounder taylor Cammarata has been producing at a much HIGHER rate than Vincey boy. so should we ASK this question about the 6th rounder or should we talk about the vaunted draft pick pat kane because i am obsessed with how dumb he makes me look every year since i wanted kyle turris INSTEAD. i am stupid. but i do have plenty more questions TO ASK about the PLAYERS i know nothing about -- except indeed that i read a scouting report online--but even though i do not watch said player.. i do believe my success rate is impeccable and stan would be wiser if he came on hfboards and read my posts like i hope he does....

Sevanston 11-12-2012 11:40 AM

Some more recapping of Hinostroza's gold medal game and tourney:

http://unitedstatesofhockey.com/2012...ms-go-4-for-4/
Alex Kile converted on another beautiful passing play from Hinostroza who later scored the goal of the night to put the game out of reach. After getting hauled down at the offensive blue line, Hinostroza quickly got up, collected the puck and made a devastating fake on the goalie before slipping the puck in the net.

After last year’s disappointing third-place finish, the U.S. returned to the championship game and reclaimed the title with authority.

After being a part of last year’s disappointment and serving as the captain this year, Hinostroza was Team USA’s best player all tournament. He finish tied for the tournament scoring lead with eight points, including a tournament best six goals.

Ian Brady tied Hinostroza with eight points, all assists, which set the World Junior A Challenge record. Both Hinostroza and Brady were named to the tournament All-Star Team.

hawksfan50 11-12-2012 01:11 PM

I saw Kane destroy the OHL in his Jr. days in London- but he had a stacked team and his line mates wre lest you forget Sam Gagner and Sergei Kostitsyn...so sure Kane put up 145 pts that year but Kostitsyn had 131 and Gagner had 118 (including 83 assists tying him with Kane in assists)--so that was a SUPER LINE --you could not say KANE alone "shone" ...

I am not saying Hinostroza could or could not have done that in the OHL at age 18 -but if he had such talented linemates and got the minutes and featured PP time kane did-maybe he could. He skates as well as Kane..his shot is better. The assists would have also piled up if playing with 2 talents like Gagner and Kostitsyn..

I can tell you that --even despite Kanes great offense in Llondon-I still questioned his defensive abilities or lack of --including DESIRE to check and play hard 2 ways ..I GUARANTEE HINOSTROZA is not a slacker in that area...


ALSO--HINOSTROZA was 5 months younger than Kane in his draft year.. for some kids whther you were born in th Fall of your draft year or in the Spring IS a big factor in where your development stage is -so it is a bit unfair comparing on 'the same year" basis given the age difference..


IN any case -it matters nothing what HINOSTROZA did last year-the fact is he has PROGRESSED to a higher level THIS YEAR ...I'm not sure KANe ever got back to his "magic hands" level of the London year ..it looked like he could score 40 goals in the NHL -but as we have seen --whle his passing has remained "elite" his goal scoring is at best good but not elite level .the magic hands do not seem to translate into filling the net as we all were led to believe by the expert scouts. As to Kane's defensive lay-it did get better- again no where near what we would like -but I guess at least acceptable..oVERALL a $6.3 million a year player_I guess with hockey salary inflation maybe alas he is worth that (because if he was a 100 point player (let alone the 88 we expected AT LEAST but got only 66 last year) then Rocky would need to pay Kane $10 million a year -it seems today you get $1million for every ten points or near that ...

ALSO --KANE was the first overall pick in his draft --you EXPECT "GREATNESS" from first overall picks..you expect NOTHING from 6th rounders ...yet WHATEVER we get from HINOSTROZA loloks like a BONUS --and so how can you dare criticize his awesome performance at the WJAC --it is hard to imagine KANE doing any better
--and nobody but an insamne coach would ever use Kane on the PK -so I don't see that VH's "value" is diminished by your statistical comparison of Kane's draft year(in the oHL) to Hinostroza's draft year (in the USHL) ... and yes KANE made the NHL rght after his draft year,Hinostroza obviously did not -but that is not to say the player I saw play last night couldn't make the NHL and impact if he fot the chance (which he won't) --99% of NHL'ers -including our favourite Blackhawks--are NOT as determined/driven as the kid I saw play last night. THIS ia a reverse "ESPOSITO" (Angelo Esposito whose lack of drive despite talent scouts ascribed to him made me
right away dismiss him when i recognized that lack of desire ) but HINOSTROZA attacks with a fire you can see oozes from every fibre in him ..it --apart from talent-is what will make him a great NHL'er once he gets there.

YOU all know mucomplaint on Kane's slacker performance last year --he showed way too much disinterest far too many games and periods of games last year ,,HE DID SLACK -and did not live up to his own talent ...Many nights one assist and out and he seemed satisfied he had done enough work for the evening . It was disgusting to watch suck lack of desire carried out for so few minutes in a game or even some games not existantat all ..He owes us more than that when hockey returns.

I have NO DOUBT I will ever question HINOSTROZA's desire -but maybe $$$$ will corrupt and counting one's bank account ahead of giving 100% most of the time will eventually corrupt him too-but somehow I do not think so..

With Kane -you could not miss the talent --but the fire to turn on the talent-well you could get by on talent alone at the JR. level --but at the pro level losing the fire inyour fibre produces 66 pts instead of the 88 normally expected in a sleepwalk or the 100+ he should have IF he got motivated ...

Maybe HINOSTROZA could never produce 100 point seasons in the NHL --but NEITHER IS KANE ! MAYBE HINOSTROZA has to work his butt off to ever produce the 66 points KANE gets in his sleep --but somehow I bet he'd ramp up the desire EVEN MORE to get that 66 up into the 80's...

I"m not saying VH has more talent than KANe--I'm saying the TALENT+DESIRE he has WILL provide impact once he gets to the NHL ..

Talent goes a long way-but as we see over and over in the NHL --so does desire..
BUT--nobody who saw the performance VH put on last night could doubt he ALSO posesses a lot of TALENT.

brtriad 11-12-2012 01:42 PM

I don't believe I've ever seen Fiddy respond to his own post.

Good to see our prospects do well. Say what you will about quality of competition, but it never hurts to have a bunch of high risk-high reward players in the system.

ChiGuySez 11-12-2012 01:52 PM

Always good to see homegrown Chicago area kids do well.

Hawkaholic 11-12-2012 02:07 PM

We are talking about a 5'-9" guy playing in some league where there is very little in the means of NHL prospects. He should be doing what he is doing right now.

To even compare him to Kane in anyway, is pretty laughable.

Serious question though, does this kid have any chance at all at being invited to Team USA WJC try out, let along making the team?

ChiGuySez 11-12-2012 04:30 PM

WJC invite, good question. Dunno but Im sure hes in consideration.

Prospects forum has this thread for the US WJC. Last page (8) has several predictions.

Team USA World Junior Championship Evaluation Camp Predictions

Hawkaholic 11-12-2012 05:36 PM

Judging by that thread, he's a long shot to even be invited. (not on anybodies mock team)

I will take this performance at the Jr A challenge with a grain of salt.

Sevanston 11-12-2012 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkaholic (Post 55720165)
Judging by that thread, he's a lonA challenge with a grain of salt.

What's there to salt?

He had an all-star performance in a big international tournament. It's as simple as that.

Does that mean he's destined for NHL greatness? Of course not. Anyone calling him an NHL lock at this point is obviously optimistic beyond reason. It's just a very positive sign, especially for a 6th round pick.

ChiGuySez 11-12-2012 07:25 PM

The predictions in the thread were made before the tournament.

Hawkaholic 11-12-2012 09:51 PM

Big International tournament? Hardly.

He dominated a bunch of nobodies, not really worth hyping him up.

Sevanston 11-12-2012 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkaholic (Post 55727087)
Big International tournament? Hardly.

He dominated a bunch of nobodies, not really worth hyping him up.

There is no hype.

He dominated a tournament. It's a Good Thing. End of story.

EbonyRaptor 11-12-2012 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sevanston (Post 55727177)
There is no hype.

He dominated a tournament. It's a Good Thing. End of story.

I believe fiddy used the word "saviour" - that's hype.

But I agree with you regarding it's a good thing he dominated a tourney.

McNeill - WHL player of the week - that's no guarantee of future greatness - but it's a good thing.

Caruth - WHL goalie of the week - that's no gaurantee of future greatness - but it's a good thing.

Beach - AHL player of the week - that's no gaurantee of future greatness - but it's a good thing.

Shalunov - one of the top players for the Russian Jr team - no guarantee of future greatness - but it's a good thing.

It's nice to get some good reports on some of our guys.

Sevanston 11-13-2012 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EbonyRaptor (Post 55729607)
I believe fiddy used the word "saviour" - that's hype.

But I agree with you regarding it's a good thing he dominated a tourney.

I didn't even see that.

Nowadays I try to boil HF50's posts down to one sentence after skimming the first paragraph or two. It saves both time and sanity. This one came down to "I thought Vince Hinostroza put on an incredible display in the WJAC Gold Medal game." Clearly I missed the skimmed over the word "saviour."

But that's the kind of thing I meant when I said that people who expect amazing things from Hinostroza after just this tournament are optimistic beyond reason. No one should expect amazing things from him yet, but his play in this tournament is nothing but a good thing. No salt is necessary.

Marotte Marauder 11-13-2012 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sevanston (Post 55727177)
There is no hype.

He dominated a tournament. It's a Good Thing. End of story.

Agree 100%, it is quite an accomplishment for the young man. What the future holds is still unknown.

Hawkaholic 11-13-2012 09:08 AM

I'm not saying it isn't a good thing he dominated the tourament, i'm simply stating it's not worth comparing him to Kane, or hyping him up as much as 50 just did. That's all.

krazyhawk 11-13-2012 02:25 PM

No one other than 50 is over-hyping him.However I am looking forward to seeing how he does against better competition next year.I managed to catch a couple of the US games(including the gold medal) on TV.Even with the limited viewing the cameras gave me,it was obvious Hinostroza was the best forward on the ice.A smooth skater with decent speed he showed very good on-ice awareness and anticipation.Not sure his shot is as good as 50 thinks but his vision and passing are outstanding.He constantly found open men with hard tape to tape passes.He also showed good stickhandling,hustle and determination.Just seemed to want it more than anyone else.

I came away very impressed with his game.I want to see him playing a higher level before I form a more concrete opinion of him,but he's off to a damn good start.I would also like to know his actual present physical stats.He's listed at 5'9" 170+ but like 50 said,he looks bigger than that now.I know the US sent a rather small team(only 2 or 3 over 6')but he seemed to compare well size-wise to the opposition too.His stature was a major factor in where he was drafted.If he somehow gains 1or 2 inches and 15/20lbs he could very well turn out to be a steal.

EbonyRaptor 11-13-2012 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sevanston (Post 55730121)
I didn't even see that.

Nowadays I try to boil HF50's posts down to one sentence after skimming the first paragraph or two. It saves both time and sanity. This one came down to "I thought Vince Hinostroza put on an incredible display in the WJAC Gold Medal game." Clearly I missed the skimmed over the word "saviour."

But that's the kind of thing I meant when I said that people who expect amazing things from Hinostroza after just this tournament are optimistic beyond reason. No one should expect amazing things from him yet, but his play in this tournament is nothing but a good thing. No salt is necessary.

I hear ya. Reading fiddy is a slog. Even when he manages a cogent point it is rarely the takeaway from the clutter and Kane hate.

Jeffrey Lebowski 11-14-2012 09:37 AM

He capitalizes all NAMES, plus WORDS he wants to EMPHASIZE. ALTHOUGH-- it's very hard to UNDERSTAND his points because all of the CAPITALIZATION muddles the cohesiveness of his post.

That and it doesn't seem like he understands that something can be good and bad at the same time. Like Kane is small and not good defensively, so obviously that means he can't be good offensively and make up for it in other ways.

hawksfan50 11-14-2012 12:19 PM

NO, KANE can be good offensively--it is just that last season's "effort" of 66 points was neither "GOOD" nor "DAZZLING" in the quality of entertainment provided...

Last season we got mostly routine ho-hum "I got my assist ,that's enough work for the night " games from Kane... Occaisionally a few games he got a goal in--very few multipoint games ..very few highlight reel goals or assists.. MOstly the ho-hum --stop up on the half-board--make a pass--sometimes a first assist ,sometimes only a second assist on the play -but if he got his point for the night-that's it--shut it down--enough "work" for the evening--very self-satisfied..
The indictment reads (just on his offense): 1. Failure to produce enough points to be much of a difference-maker for the team let alone (heaven forbid) DOMINATE a game all by himself and his "special" talent ;2. Failure to provide much excitement
because he wouldn't or couldn't go through opposition defenses --refused to ATTACK the net enough ---too often pulling up to slow the play instead of going full bore at the net or AROUND d-men ...tht's what we get for $6.3 million? WE should be demandng more from him than "routine' -don't you think?

Ae you not sick of all the highlight reel stuff pulled of by other "little guys" --like Claude Giroux , or Jordan Eberle going though around and past defenders to attack the net --instead we got Kane standing at the side boards hoping his pass results in a goal or his pass back to the point gets him at least a 2nd assist and with one "dazzling' play like that--that is enough to pad his stats and bilk the crowd paying top dollar to pay his big fat paycheck ...

Kane-I believe NEEDS to be more dazzling -not just with total points but in the entertainment value/quality of the offense he should produce .I saw "dazzling" ability and drive from Hinostroza which is why I have hope he won't be a 'routine' player...

Jeffrey Lebowski 11-14-2012 12:49 PM

If you're responding to my post, please know that I only used the Kane bit as an example...

Sir Psycho T 11-14-2012 01:25 PM

Trade Kane NOW! We don't need him anymore because some 6th round pick had a few good games. Why stop there to, trade Toews and Sharp we don't need them either, this kid will be our entire first line and will dominate, want to know why, because he had a few good games in a not top level tournament. That's all the proof I need to know he will be the best player in NHL History, pffff Gretzky who?

EbonyRaptor 11-14-2012 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawksfan50 (Post 55763341)
NO,
...

Two pieces of unsolicited advice:

1. Brevity is the soul of wit.

2. Everyone is tired of your constant Kane harangue. For the benefit of everyone, including yourself - pretend Kane doesn't exist.


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