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-   -   Proposal: Tor-det (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1299591)

ROBERTSMITH 11-29-2012 11:47 PM

Tor-det
 
:leafs
2014 1st
Smith
Helm


:wings
Jake Gardiner

Avs44 11-29-2012 11:51 PM

Why would Toronto do this??? If they are trading someone as good as Gardiner, it better be for a #1 C or #1G, either in a package or straight up. Why would they trade him for a 3rd line center and a 2014 1st? Helm is a very nice player, but there is no way Toronto would do this. Never mind the value, which for a top young D is bad, but it fills no needs, and sets them back.



Edit: You added Smith. Well now its bad...just in the opposite direction.

Christ 11-29-2012 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56133591)
Why would Toronto do this??? If they are trading someone as good as Gardiner, it better be for a #1 C or #1G, either in a package or straight up. Why would they trade him for a 3rd line center and a 2014 1st? Helm is a very nice player, but there is no way Toronto would do this. Never mind the value, which for a top young D is bad, but it fills no needs, and sets them back.

That pretty much says all that needs to be said for this proposal.

Bourne Endeavor 11-30-2012 12:02 AM

The Leafs have Grabovski, Bozak, Connolly, Kadri and Lombardi? Why would they need another center, never mind this is significant overpayment. Helm may be good but he is far from worth that kind of a return.

Edit: So now Detroit gives up their best prospect? Quit well you're not so ahead, mate.

The Red Line 11-30-2012 12:07 AM

So the Wings give up their best D prospect, which they've watched develop for the past 5 years for a slight upgrade at the position.... AND they have to add Helm, their best PKer and 3rd line center, AND a 1st?

I can see why Leafs say no as well, but this is absolutely brutal for the Wings.

Wingsfan2965* 11-30-2012 12:10 AM

Good Lord... Detroit gets fleeced.

The Newfoundlander 11-30-2012 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBERTSMITH (Post 56133537)
:leafs
2014 1st
Smith
Helm


:wings
Jake Gardiner

I'd do this as a Leafs fan. Quite easily in fact

NaiveLeafsFan 11-30-2012 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weak5holeguy (Post 56134025)
I'd do this as a Leafs fan. Quite easily in fact

Yep, me too.

WeridAl 11-30-2012 12:31 AM

The Wings get shafted with this one.

Wingsfan2965* 11-30-2012 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WeridAl (Post 56134309)
The Wings get shafted with this one.

More like raw-dogged.

The Zetterberg Era 11-30-2012 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBERTSMITH (Post 56133537)
:leafs
2014 1st
Smith
Helm


:wings
Jake Gardiner



A huge no way from the Wings. I wouldn't trade Smith for Gardiner. I know Gardiner played in the league blah blah blah, Smith plays in Toronto the last two years. Smith was better than him at Wisco and still in my opinion has a higher ceiling. The fact is at least you can go back and forth on who might be better and who is better so the add for that is Helm and a 1st, get out of here:shakehead

Crazy8oooo 11-30-2012 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56133591)
Why would Toronto do this??? If they are trading someone as good as Gardiner, it better be for a #1 C or #1G, either in a package or straight up. Why would they trade him for a 3rd line center and a 2014 1st? Helm is a very nice player, but there is no way Toronto would do this. Never mind the value, which for a top young D is bad, but it fills no needs, and sets them back.

Sorry, but Gardiner is not returning a #1C straight up.

Avs44 11-30-2012 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo (Post 56134775)
Sorry, but Gardiner is not returning a #1C straight up.

Hence the "or the package part " added in. Wow.

Crazy8oooo 11-30-2012 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56134807)
Hence the "or the package part " added in. Wow.

So the "or straight up" didn't actually mean 'straight up'? Wow, is right...

Avs44 11-30-2012 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo (Post 56134897)
So the "or straight up" didn't actually mean 'straight up'? Wow, is right...

Also mentioned #1 goalie in there...I'm honestly shocked that you picked that out of my post and created an issue out of it. It's not even related. I guess some people are looking for an argument.


Edit: if you wish to continue talking about that, have fun doing so by yourself. I've better things to do than argue with someone on the Internet about something not even on topic.

thadd 11-30-2012 01:41 AM

Proven checking line center who would be Toronto's 2nd best center, a damn good defenseman who was expected to play 2nd pairing minutes this year and a 1st round pick?

Toronto takes this and runs if they've got any sense. Smith will be more valuable than Gardiner in a few years and Toronto is getting way more value back.

Crazy8oooo 11-30-2012 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56134991)
Also mentioned #1 goalie in there...I'm honestly shocked that you picked that out of my post and created an issue out of it. It's not even related. I guess some people are looking for an argument.

Sorry if that's what you think, but pointing out that Gardiner won't return a #1C wasn't meant to stir an argument. I was just stating it because I don't think his value is near that high. When you decided to respond sarcastically, that is what created an argument.

Sundinisagod 11-30-2012 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56133591)
Why would Toronto do this??? If they are trading someone as good as Gardiner, it better be for a #1 C or #1G, either in a package or straight up. Why would they trade him for a 3rd line center and a 2014 1st? Helm is a very nice player, but there is no way Toronto would do this. Never mind the value, which for a top young D is bad, but it fills no needs, and sets them back.



Edit: You added Smith. Well now its bad...just in the opposite direction.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo (Post 56134897)
So the "or straight up" didn't actually mean 'straight up'? Wow, is right...

I'll go out on a limb and say that"either in a package or straight up" does not mean 'straight up'. It's pretty conveniant to pull whichever words you like out of a sentence and change their context.

First proposal bad for Leafs, 2nd bad for Detroit.

Crazy8oooo 11-30-2012 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundinisagod (Post 56137533)
I'll go out on a limb and say that"either in a package or straight up" does not mean 'straight up'. It's pretty conveniant to pull whichever words you like out of a sentence and change their context.

First proposal bad for Leafs, 2nd bad for Detroit.

If he simply said, "in a package", then I'd agree that he meant, "in a package"...however, he included, "or straight up", which in plain English would mean, "or straight up." If he didn't mean that part, then why on earth would he include it?

Nyquist 11-30-2012 10:27 AM

I wouldn't touch this deal. I have full confidence in Smith. Even though Gardiner is much more proven, I think I'd rather just keep Smith over him. Adding our first and fan favorite Helm makes it that much worse.

sgupca 11-30-2012 10:30 AM

i'd take that deal and run as a leaf fan, i personally don't see too much of a difference between Smith and Gardiner.

Gardiner might be a tad better (still unknown - too small of a sample size) but adding Helm and a 1st just puts this over the top for the leafs.

Sundinisagod 11-30-2012 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy8oooo (Post 56139113)
If he simply said, "in a package", then I'd agree that he meant, "in a package"...however, he included, "or straight up", which in plain English would mean, "or straight up." If he didn't mean that part, then why on earth would he include it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs44 (Post 56133591)
Why would Toronto do this??? If they are trading someone as good as Gardiner, it better be for a #1 C or #1G, either in a package or straight up. Why would they trade him for a 3rd line center and a 2014 1st? Helm is a very nice player, but there is no way Toronto would do this. Never mind the value, which for a top young D is bad, but it fills no needs, and sets them back.


Edit: You added Smith. Well now its bad...just in the opposite direction.

Read the bolded and lets leave it at that...I don't feel like being removed from a thread again over such nothingness.

Halpysback 12-01-2012 06:19 PM

Gardiner for Smith makes more sense.

Toronto gets an all situations RD to put with Rielly, while Detroit gets an LD who is more proven and could be a better PMD.

palindrom 12-01-2012 06:36 PM

would you rather want Detroit's 2013 1st or 2014 1st?

jiggy35 12-01-2012 06:42 PM

Gardiner could be one of the greatest Leafs in HISTORY. Smith would be merely a repeat of Dmitri Yushkevich.


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