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-   -   Proposal: Tor-Chi (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1301459)

Blackhawkswincup 12-04-2012 09:40 PM

Tor-Chi
 
Took from the Leafs board but it is good idea ( I believe it was rdawg1234 that posted it over there)

To Hawks
C Tyler Bozak
Mid round pick

To Leafs
D Niklas Hjalmarsson

Leafs get a defensive dman

Hawks get a passable 2nd line C who can win faceoffs to play with Sharp/Hossa

With Hawks glut of dmen (Good or bad) they likely send one packing and Hammer makes most sense from financial standpoint

Thoughts?

seanlinden 12-04-2012 09:43 PM

Nope.

Hjalmarsson would be an almost perfect addition for the Leafs, but there's just no way they can afford to trade their #1 centre for a middle-of-the-lineup defenceman.

Kris Chreider 12-04-2012 09:45 PM

It digs a deeper hole for TO at center. They'd be playing Grabovski as their #1C and have no depth under him, unless JVR, MacA, or Kulemin gets moved to center.

seanlinden 12-04-2012 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kris Chreider (Post 56248935)
It digs a deeper hole for TO at center. They'd be playing Grabovski as their #1C and have no depth under him, unless JVR, MacA, or Kulemin gets moved to center.

None of those are competent centres.

Pinto 12-04-2012 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanlinden (Post 56248867)
Nope.

Hjalmarsson would be an almost perfect addition for the Leafs, but there's just no way they can afford to trade their #1 centre for a middle-of-the-lineup defenceman.

Pretty much agreed.

Value is fine but we need Bozak more.

I am Canadian 12-04-2012 09:48 PM

I think Holzer is good enough to play in a defensive role and in difference between Holzer and Hjalmarsson is not big enough to create a hole in our lineup that would be filled by Tim Connolly (Bluhhg)

Blackhawkswincup 12-04-2012 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kris Chreider (Post 56248935)
It digs a deeper hole for TO at center. They'd be playing Grabovski as their #1C and have no depth under him, unless JVR, MacA, or Kulemin gets moved to center.

Connolly and Lombardi are still on Leafs are they not?

Grabovski #1
Connolly #2
Lombardi #3

Also didn't they talk about moving JVR to center after his trade?

y2kcanucks 12-04-2012 09:48 PM

I don't see why Chicago does this. Bozak is worse than Bolland.

seanlinden 12-04-2012 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I am Canadian (Post 56249029)
I think Holzer is good enough to play in a defensive role and in difference between Holzer and Hjalmarsson is not big enough to create a hole in our lineup that would be filled by Tim Connolly (Bluhhg)

:facepalm:

Holzer is an AHL defenceman, Hjalmarsson is a bonafide top 4 NHL defenceman.

I'm not saying the Leafs can make this deal, but you're nuts if you think it's a good idea to slot Holzer into our vacant 2nd pairing spot.

Blackhawkswincup 12-04-2012 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by y2kcanucks (Post 56249051)
I don't see why Chicago does this. Bozak is worse than Bolland.

Bozak is alot better then Kruger/Kane at C

Hawks keep Bolland at #3 C and put Bozak between Hossa/Sharp

Also Bozak is light years better then Bolland at faceoffs a major issue with Hawks

seanlinden 12-04-2012 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup (Post 56249041)
Connolly and Lombardi are still on Leafs are they not?

Grabovski #1
Connolly #2
Lombardi #3

Also didn't they talk about moving JVR to center after his trade?

The problem isn't quantity of centres, it's that Tyler Bozak is our #1. Grabovski can't play with Kessel. He simply cannot be moved unless a better centre is coming to Toronto though another trade.

Wolverine Wings 12-04-2012 09:55 PM

As someone who dislikes both teams, I can say with a high degree of objectivity that this is an overpayment by Toronto. Hjalmarsson is a pretty solid defenseman, but he isn't worth a top-6 center and a pick, especially when after Grabovski there isn't another guy who can play top-six C.

Chicago would definitely do this trade though--if that means anything.

Jax Teller 12-04-2012 10:27 PM

I'd probably make this trade if it was a 1 for 1 swap.

Wolverine Wings 12-04-2012 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinnybaby (Post 56250335)
I'd probably make this trade if it was a 1 for 1 swap.

Toronto doesn't offer because they can't replace Bozak. Who is going to play with Kessel? Graboviski hasn't demonstrated that he can.

This is not a big enough trade to warrant a third team giving a top-six center to Toronto to make it happen, imo. :shakehead

RealisticLeaf55 12-04-2012 10:37 PM

Whoa now, hold on. I am game for this if the leafs can rid ourselves of Komi or Holzer. The idea that we "Need" Bozak is a little bit of an overstatement here. We do this trade we have a great partner for either Gardiner or Neuf as well as free up a cluttered position to have Colborne come up. Despite his performance in the AHL he was pretty good for us when he was in the NHL with Frattin so I would certainly do this trade.

New centers:
Grabo
Connolly (re-sign to 1 year deal)
Colborne
Mcclement

Phion Keneuf 12-04-2012 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealisticLeaf55 (Post 56250615)
Whoa now, hold on. I am game for this if the leafs can rid ourselves of Komi or Holzer. The idea that we "Need" Bozak is a little bit of an overstatement here. We do this trade we have a great partner for either Gardiner or Neuf as well as free up a cluttered position to have Colborne come up. Despite his performance in the AHL he was pretty good for us when he was in the NHL with Frattin so I would certainly do this trade.

New centers:
Grabo
Connolly (re-sign to 1 year deal)
Colborne
Mcclement

Rid ourselves of Holzer lol? He hasn't even played yet and he looks super solid in the AHL

As for this deal, no thanks. Not bad but I never really liked Hammer

HockeySensible 12-04-2012 10:43 PM

No from Chicago. Bozak isn't a 2nd line centre; he's a fringe guy. If Chicago's trading Hammer, they should go big and get a guy that legitimately fills the hole now and going forward.

And, I'm sorry, but even if Bozak was significantly better at faceoffs than Bolland (which he's not; 48% vs 52%), that would still be no reason to trade for him.. there are alot of centres that are better on faceoffs than Bolland.. get a true 2nd line centre if you're giving up a significant piece.

Mystifo 12-04-2012 10:45 PM

I am fine with it as Bozak is great and all but he is not a great number one center. Really I do not think it is Bozak that works well with Kessel it is more or less Lupul. When Lupul was out of the line up Kessel was not preforming like he should be. When you look at Toronto D it is pretty light on the defensive minded players.

- Gunnarsson
- Komisareak
- Holzer (Still not 100% on him.)

The only true player I trust is Gunnar as Komisareak play has dropped and I see no reason for it to pick up and Holzer is a rookie who has not seen any real play time in the NHL.

Gunnarsson - Phaneuf
Gardiner/Liles - Hjalmarsson
Gardiner/Liles - Holzer/Franson
Holzer/Franson


Seems to me that is makes our D core much more stable. My only problem is Hjalmarsson is not as rugged as I would like but he is still defensively sound. Something that would work well with Liles or Gardiner.

Phion Keneuf 12-04-2012 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup (Post 56249087)
Bozak is alot better then Kruger/Kane at C

Hawks keep Bolland at #3 C and put Bozak between Hossa/Sharp

Also Bozak is light years better then Bolland at faceoffs a major issue with Hawks

Bozak beside Hossa and Sharp would be something fun to see

Bozak could possibly be a consistent 50ish point guy. Would not be as relied on defensively when playing with Kessel/Lupul.

Value wise is pretty good, but the statement I just said above is the reason why the leafs don't do it

Blackhawkswincup 12-04-2012 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossTheBoss (Post 56250829)
No from Chicago. Bozak isn't a 2nd line centre; he's a fringe guy. If Chicago's trading Hammer, they should go big and get a guy that legitimately fills the hole now and going forward.

And, I'm sorry, but even if Bozak was significantly better at faceoffs than Bolland (which he's not; 48% vs 52%), that would still be no reason to trade for him.. there are alot of centres that are better on faceoffs than Bolland.. get a true 2nd line centre if you're giving up a significant piece.

What significant piece are Hawks moving?

Hammer wont net a big caliber player. Bozak type guys are what you will get for Hammer

Hawkaholic 12-04-2012 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossTheBoss (Post 56250829)
No from Chicago. Bozak isn't a 2nd line centre; he's a fringe guy. If Chicago's trading Hammer, they should go big and get a guy that legitimately fills the hole now and going forward.

And, I'm sorry, but even if Bozak was significantly better at faceoffs than Bolland (which he's not; 48% vs 52%), that would still be no reason to trade for him.. there are alot of centres that are better on faceoffs than Bolland.. get a true 2nd line centre if you're giving up a significant piece.

Disagree. Hammer is not a significant piece. You wont get someone much better if at all than Bozak for him. I understand why Leaf fans wouldn't do it, but the value is fair.

TurdFerguson 12-04-2012 11:08 PM

Bozak (along with many others) could likely become a UFA before Burke ever even gets a chance to negotiate with his agent. I guess we could sign him if Zajac, Weiss, Roy and Ribeiro sign elsewhere.

The Podium 12-04-2012 11:27 PM

I would do it for the sole reason that it would force Burke to get a competent #1 C. Also i really like Hjalmarsson, he would fit well in our top 4 either with Phaneuf or Gardiner.

Gunnarsson/Hjalmarsson - Phaneuf
Gardiner - Gunnarsson/Hjalmarsson

Is a pretty good top 4 especially with Rielly on his way.

Jax Teller 12-04-2012 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2MGoBlue2 (Post 56250535)
Toronto doesn't offer because they can't replace Bozak. Who is going to play with Kessel? Graboviski hasn't demonstrated that he can.

This is not a big enough trade to warrant a third team giving a top-six center to Toronto to make it happen, imo. :shakehead

Connolly can replace Bozak, through this shortened season. As of now there are some solid options through free agency, although that number will drop. There could be a center or two available through trade at that time aswell. If a replacement can't be found re-sign Connolly or Lombardi, whomever plays better. Bozak was never going to be the long-term #1 center, although he could be kept around as a solid 3C when a higher calibre center is acquired. The Leafs don't have much for defensive defenseman in the system (Holzer, Granberg, Nilsson, MacWilliam, Loov) and only Komisarek and Gunnarsson on the roster. Hjalmarsson is young and good enough to be part of the Leafs top-4 for a number of years.

HockeySensible 12-05-2012 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup (Post 56251013)
What significant piece are Hawks moving?

Hammer wont net a big caliber player. Bozak type guys are what you will get for Hammer

A 25-year-old top-4 Dman. How anyone could say Hammer isn't a siginificant piece is beyond me. Although Hammer wouldn't net a great 2nd line centre by himself, as part of a package the Hawks could get a legitimate centre to fill the hole now and going forward as opposed to getting a player like Bozak who would merely be a stopgap until the Hawks could upgrade (costing likely another roster player/prospects) at the position or until one of their prospects developes.


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