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-   -   Player A vs Player B (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1314963)

Stephen 01-02-2013 07:56 PM

Player A vs Player B
 
Looking at Player A vs Player B

Player A was drafted 15th overall
Right Wing
Played for four organizations, has compiled 1024 points in 1302 games, with 428 goals and 596 assists with a PPG average of 0.78.

Has one season in the 90-100 point range
Has one season in the 80-90 point range
Has one season in the 70-80 point range

Has one Stanley Cup win
Has played in 123 playoff games and 100 playoff points.

Zero major awards.
One Second All-Star Team


Player B was drafted 23rd overall
Left Wing
Played for seven organizations, has compiled 1003 points in 1229 games, with 365 goals and 638 assists with PPG average of 0.81

Has zero seasons in the 90-100 point range
Has one season in the 80-90 point range
Has four seasons in the 70-80 point range

Has one Stanley Cup win
Has played in 103 playoff games and 53 playoff points.

Has Zero major awards
Zero All-Star Teams

How close is the gap between the two, if there is one?

Chalupa Batman 01-02-2013 07:57 PM

Without knowing which era each player played in, it's impossible to compare (fairly, at least).

Every single criterion that you listed is influenced by the player's era.

Stephen 01-02-2013 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur (Post 57030981)
Without knowing which era each player played in, it's impossible to compare (fairly, at least).

Every single criterion that you listed is influenced by the player's era.

Same era, same draft, same age.

No identification bias.

tjcurrie 01-02-2013 08:20 PM

I wouldn't say there's much of a gap if any at all just based on that. The only stat differential that kind of stands out is the playoff points. 100 in 123 games compared to 53 in 103. Bit of a gap there.

Overall though there's still some variables besides era so it's still not a perfect way to compare, but just looking at the numbers I'm not sure anyone can say that there is much of a gap. Even if the variables were known and taken in to account, at the end of the day they look pretty close still.

TheDevilMadeMe 01-02-2013 08:24 PM

If it's the same era, it's too close to call without knowing either player's defensive ability, toughness, leadership, or linemates. But assuming all those are exactly the same, I'd take player A because his playoff numbers are better (assuming player B's numbers aren't weighed down by very few games in his prime and a lot of non-prime games).

tjcurrie 01-02-2013 08:29 PM

And besides, without knowing who the players are, I can't pick which player I like better so that's not fair.

mco543 01-02-2013 08:31 PM

I chose A due to his playoffs like the others and then cheated and looked them up, very very surprising.

Hardyvan123 01-02-2013 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen (Post 57030941)
Looking at Player A vs Player B

Player A was drafted 15th overall
Right Wing
Played for four organizations, has compiled 1024 points in 1302 games, with 428 goals and 596 assists with a PPG average of 0.78.

Has one season in the 90-100 point range
Has one season in the 80-90 point range
Has one season in the 70-80 point range

Has one Stanley Cup win
Has played in 123 playoff games and 100 playoff points.

Zero major awards.
One Second All-Star Team


Player B was drafted 23rd overall
Left Wing
Played for seven organizations, has compiled 1003 points in 1229 games, with 365 goals and 638 assists with PPG average of 0.81

Has zero seasons in the 90-100 point range
Has one season in the 80-90 point range
Has four seasons in the 70-80 point range

Has one Stanley Cup win
Has played in 103 playoff games and 53 playoff points.

Has Zero major awards
Zero All-Star Teams

How close is the gap between the two, if there is one?

Well the 1st guy is Kovalev as we are talking about him in another thread but like Taco says we need context here.

Hardyvan123 01-02-2013 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mco543 (Post 57032093)
I chose A due to his playoffs like the others and then cheated and looked them up, very very surprising.

I looked him up to, it's Ray Whitney who has aged better but doesn't bring any intangibles to beat Kovalev's playoffs or anything else for that matter

TheDevilMadeMe 01-02-2013 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mco543 (Post 57032093)
I chose A due to his playoffs like the others and then cheated and looked them up, very very surprising.

I just looked it up, and knowing the players, I stand by my answer. Player 1, but only because of the playoffs. Regular season probably isn't much different.

tjcurrie 01-02-2013 08:41 PM

You may see Kovalev ranked ahead of Whitney on most player-ranking lists, but I would take Whitney on my team ahead of Kovalev any day. Except for some of those days Kovalev decided to give a damn. But Kovalev is a wheelbarrow and Whitney is the guy that grabs the wheelbarrow and goes to work without hesitating. No not in that way.

Stephen 01-02-2013 09:02 PM

Well the other is Ray Whitney.

TheDevilMadeMe 01-02-2013 09:03 PM

By the way, Whitney actually was a 2nd Team All Star last season.

OrrNumber4 01-02-2013 09:19 PM

Trying to answer this without looking at the multitude of posts that have divulged the identities...

I know that the first statline is Kovalev. So I am guessing that this comparison is meant to show how Kovalev is statistically similar to some other "scrub" despite having a much better reputation (of course, that reputation being almost solely build of his offensive contribution), thereby bringing into question the reputation itself.

Kovalev looks to have the clearly superior playoff numbers, though he did play for some high-octane teams. Also, player B's statline kind of looks like that of a compiler to me..no 90+ point seasons. Again, if he is a defensive stalwart then it changes things...but you likely would have mentioned that. Still, some kind of context (teammates, ice time, games played) would be needed.

Lastly, I'll finish off by saying that Kovalev's reputation was gained through watching him. His ability to take over games was (is?) unquestionable.

OrrNumber4 01-02-2013 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe (Post 57033205)
By the way, Whitney actually was a 2nd Team All Star last season.

Changes my opinion a little bit, because Whitney has had a fairly underrated career.

Stephen 01-03-2013 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by superroyain10 (Post 57033909)
T
Lastly, I'll finish off by saying that Kovalev's reputation was gained through watching him. His ability to take over games was (is?) unquestionable.

My point is Kovalev's reputation is severely inflated by flash, even though all told he didn't really do any more than a Ray Whitney level player.

kmad 01-03-2013 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by superroyain10 (Post 57033945)
Changes my opinion a little bit, because Whitney has had a fairly underrated career.

Last season wasn't too remarkable. There just wasn't much competition for the 2nd spot.

seventieslord 01-03-2013 11:24 AM

player A for sure, both before and after figuring out who they were.

more goals, better playoffs.


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