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-   -   Value of Malkin (compared to Crosby)? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1326331)

Jaymond Flurrie 01-18-2013 07:00 AM

Value of Malkin (compared to Crosby)?
 
As an outsider to Penguins, I have been wondering that how much worse Malkin is compared to Crosby? To me it looks like that Malkin is badly underrated, but is it really so?

For example, on either-or scale, if you lose one of them today to retirement, which one would you rather lose? Is your decision easy?

Or, let's hypothetically say that Malkin plays for Blue Jackets (a random example) and Crosby for Penguins. Would you do the hypothetical one-on-one trade as either the Penguins or as the Blue Jackets?

Also, what are the main things that Malkin misses that Crosby has?

#2eddieshore 01-18-2013 07:14 AM

Crosby is better defensively than Malkin.

I think Crosby is more valuable but not by much.

od71 01-18-2013 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymond Flurrie (Post 57777401)
As an outsider to Penguins, I have been wondering that how much worse Malkin is compared to Crosby? To me it looks like that Malkin is badly underrated, but is it really so?

For example, on either-or scale, if you lose one of them today to retirement, which one would you rather lose? Is your decision easy?

Or, let's hypothetically say that Malkin plays for Blue Jackets (a random example) and Crosby for Penguins. Would you do the hypothetical one-on-one trade as either the Penguins or as the Blue Jackets?

Also, what are the main things that Malkin misses that Crosby has?

You are about to begin another Holy War.

wgknestrick 01-18-2013 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymond Flurrie (Post 57777401)
As an outsider to Penguins, I have been wondering that how much worse Malkin is compared to Crosby? To me it looks like that Malkin is badly underrated, but is it really so?

For example, on either-or scale, if you lose one of them today to retirement, which one would you rather lose? Is your decision easy?

Or, let's hypothetically say that Malkin plays for Blue Jackets (a random example) and Crosby for Penguins. Would you do the hypothetical one-on-one trade as either the Penguins or as the Blue Jackets?

Also, what are the main things that Malkin misses that Crosby has?

Recently Malkin has been better defensively and more consistent than Crosby IMO. Crosby's highs are higher than Malkin's. They are very, very close.

Jaymond Flurrie 01-18-2013 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgknestrick (Post 57778633)
Recently Malkin has been better defensively and more consistent than Crosby IMO. Crosby's highs are higher than Malkin's. They are very, very close.

This is how I have seen this too, but also, Malkin seems to be way more reliable (or if you want "consistent") than Crosby. That is, Crosby's injuries are telling me that if you want to bet in a game X that which one plays better, as sad as it is, changes are Crosby is not even playing.

zhenya71 01-18-2013 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgknestrick (Post 57778633)
Recently Malkin has been better defensively and more consistent than Crosby IMO. Crosby's highs are higher than Malkin's. They are very, very close.

I'd argue that Malkin's highs are higher than Crosby's, but his lows are lower.

AZPenguins 01-18-2013 08:17 AM

I don't think DGeno could be the true face a franchise. If I was starting a team and had to pick 1 it would be Sid 10/10 times.

NastyNick 01-18-2013 08:33 AM

Malkin tends to play a more emotional game. He can get frustrated at times if hes being shut down. Committed defenses can take away his space and really neutralize him. When he finds room or momentum his game really shines though. He might be the most overall talented NHLer since Jagr.

Crosby plays more to the Penguins system. He is still very good on the rush, but he can also produce in the zone. Even when the defense is tight he can still find ways to generate offense. His creativity is exceptional. I think the fact he is North American in a North American league gives him the edge over Malkin. As a leader on the team most other guys identify with him easier then Geno.

Both guys are good defensively, at the top of their class. I don't buy arguments that Crosby is better or neither is very good. They both backcheck and play defense effectively. Unlike someone like.. Ovechkin or Kovalchuk.

Shady Machine 01-18-2013 08:46 AM

This question is too difficult to legitimately answer so I always tend to go with the guy I have more fun watching: Geno. I love both of them and they are the 2 best players in the game. However, there is just something about watching Malkin take over a game that can't be beat in my eyes. In my opinion, when he is motivated and at the top of his game, no one can stop him. I believe Sid has more consistent drive to be the best, but Geno has upped that passion last year.

I guess if I'm looking for a leader, captain to start my team, I'd take Sid. If I'm looking for an electrifying star player to fill the building, I'm taking Geno.

wgknestrick 01-18-2013 08:52 AM

We should hopefully find out the true answer to the question this year. Probably the first year both are healthy and have been playing well.

Jaymond Flurrie 01-18-2013 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NastyNick (Post 57779467)
Crosby plays more to the Penguins system.

Does Crosby play to Penguins-system, or is Penguins-system playing to Crosby? I mean Crosby was considered so important player that I wouldn't be surprised if the whole system would be built around Crosby. Whether it actually is so is a totally different thing.

Rectify 01-18-2013 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zhenya71 (Post 57778915)
I'd argue that Malkin's highs are higher than Crosby's, but his lows are lower.

This is a very interesting way to put it, and while I don't disagree I think Crosby's pre concussion season was the highest I have seen either player at.

On the whole though I agree with the statement, and I think Malkin is my favorite player, and most exciting to watch on this team. That being said I would still pick Crosby if a gun were aimed at my head, old habits die hard I guess.:dunno:

Sidney BrOSSby* 01-18-2013 09:15 AM

You've asked a good question, but you haven't asked it in the proper manner.

BigBenSF* 01-18-2013 09:16 AM

Malkin plays a bit sloppier with the puck in the neutral zone but really made few mistakes last year. You will know when Malkin is on the ice more than Crosby, Malkin is a guy who will drive a snapshot from the point or deke through 10 guys, Crosby will be invisible for a second or two but he's always there to make that big play. One other thing is that I think that a lotofMalkin's success came from Crosby's absence, I think he shines with the spotlight focused on him and not so much when he's in the passenger seat.

BlindWillyMcHurt 01-18-2013 09:16 AM

I guess I'm about where Shady is.

Realistically, injury concerns aside, Crosby is the more "valuable" player. Captain, as well... which shouldn't be understated. And despite the legions of naysayers, he largely handles those duties with aplomb. Something Malkin, by all accounts, has very, very little interest in doing.

But Malkin is simply, at least to me, so much more fun to watch. And that's really all it's about, right? Entertainment? When he's truly at the top of his game... it's simply awesome to behold. Everyone... and I mean everyone... on the ice looks sloppy, amateurish, clumsy and completely out of their element in comparison.

I know that doesn't help answer the question. But oh well... we'll likely get to watch both for a very long time in black and gold. So it's a nice question to ruminate on.

od71 01-18-2013 09:21 AM

Geno is a most spectacular player in the world. The way he plays with the puck, his stickdangling is amazing to watch.
But what I like about him most is his ability to carry the team as it was in 2009 PO run when he scored more points than anybody else in the history 36 pts, only less than Gretzky (Wayne had 40 pts in the spring 1993) and last season when he carried the team we all remember

wolffy66 01-18-2013 09:24 AM

Not saying which I'd pick but Sid is very good on faceoffs as well where Malkin, well not so much. Im just glad they are both here, I'd probably flip a coin.

wgknestrick 01-18-2013 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by od71 (Post 57781111)
Geno is a most spectacular player in the world. The way he plays with the puck, his stickdangling is amazing to watch.
But what I like about him most is his ability to carry the team as it was in 2009 PO run when he scored more points than anybody else in the history 36 pts, only less than Gretzky (Wayne had 40 pts in the spring 1993) and last season when he carried the team we all remember

What history are you referring to?

36pts is great, but hardly 2nd best to "just" Gretzky.

Mario had 44pts in 23 games and 34pts in 15 games.

UnderratedBrooks44 01-18-2013 09:43 AM

I think Crosby is half a notch better but you also factor in publicity and it's a no-brainer. If Malkin magically appeared on Calgary or Florida you still wouldn't see them that much. Not the case if it was Crosby.

BlindWillyMcHurt 01-18-2013 09:49 AM

I will say this re: value.

I hear a lot of other team's fans say things like "The Penguins need to trade Malkin to help balance their offense." Or some variation thereof.

There is nothing the Penguins could realistically get in return for him that would make them a better team. Nothing. That is a trade they lose 10 times out of 10.

od71 01-18-2013 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgknestrick (Post 57781723)
What history are you referring to?

36pts is great, but hardly 2nd best to "just" Gretzky.

Mario had 44pts in 23 games and 34pts in 15 games.

Sorry, Mario hit 38 pts in 1991 PO. But still, it's a good company for Geno to be third on this list only after Gretzky and Lemieux

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=425583
http://hockeypyramid.blogspot.ru/201...o-lemieux.html

Kinda hard to beat 20-years-old records. In a modern hockey it's almost impossible

mrzeigler 01-18-2013 09:53 AM

As an aside, it was nice to be in the arena for the scrimmage Wednesday night and see the banners updated to include Geno's 2012 MVP and scoring title.

Shady Machine 01-18-2013 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 (Post 57781881)
I think Crosby is half a notch better but you also factor in publicity and it's a no-brainer. If Malkin magically appeared on Calgary or Florida you still wouldn't see them that much. Not the case if it was Crosby.

That has more to do with the media and less to do with the player. Malkin deserves all the hype Crosby gets but the Canadian media and consequently, the American media, has pimped as the face of the league.

UnderratedBrooks44 01-18-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shady Machine (Post 57782417)
That has more to do with the media and less to do with the player. Malkin deserves all the hype Crosby gets but the Canadian media and consequently, the American media, has pimped as the face of the league.

Well of course but it still matters.

#66 01-18-2013 09:59 AM

Huge Sid fan but he has something to prove moving ahead. Look at Forsberg, Lindros and even Lemieux. You don't get credit for games you don't play in.

Right now Malkins done more.


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