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-   -   P.K. Subban Thread - Edition 6.0 - #BlameSubban (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1331621)

PricePkPatch 01-24-2013 09:00 AM

P.K. Subban Thread - Edition 6.0 - #BlameSubban
 
Continue from here

Seriously, who does he thinks he is? Better than the team? No accepting a 1.5M$ contract?


#Blamesubban

Madevilz 01-24-2013 09:03 AM

4M, 2Y

http://cdn.overclock.net/c/c3/c3ce7940_do-it.png

Kriss E 01-24-2013 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 417 (Post 58220383)
Agreed...like I said, PK will have to wrap his head around the idea that he's not going to get a long term deal right now

But Habs need to recognize that offering him anything under 4M, at the very least, is just not a fair starting point.

PK has always spoken from his heart, never seemed dishonest about anything.
Hearing him speak about his demand and how he isn't unreasonable, and repeating how he just wants his fair value, gave me the feeling he really wanted to divulge the numbers being offered as opposed to his demands to really prove he isn't asking for the moon here.

onebighockeyfan 01-24-2013 09:04 AM

I think he's worth about 4 right now, max. If the two clans are ~ 3 million appart PK might be after a little bit too much.

onebighockeyfan 01-24-2013 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madevilz (Post 58220681)

That would be a great deal for both parties. PK goes back to do what he loves and gets 1.5 years to increase is value to the 6-7 per year range.

No Team Needed 01-24-2013 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onebighockeyfan (Post 58220723)
I think he's worth about 4 right now, max. If the two clans are ~ 3 million appart PK might be after a little bit too much.

So you think he's worth Cam Fowler money?

Seriously folks, Cam Fowler received a five year, $4M per season extension with the Ducks only because he put up decent offensive numbers. His defensively play is not up to NHL par but he puts up points so the Ducks are paying him for it.

Subban puts up similar points, is unbelievably superior in the defensive game and will pay more taxes in Montreal but he's worth 4 million max?

habs03 01-24-2013 09:09 AM

What worries me the most is that it seems like management doesn't seem to see much value in Subba, IMO on a 2 year deal he should be getting 4M to 4.5 per.

And if they are only offering 2.5, and they want to move him, doubt they even ask for much.

I really wish we knew the details to make judgement but from what Subban said, it seems like he is ok with a short term deal at fair price, which should be 4-4.5.

I can't believe a deal isn't done, I literally am just lost, its as likely to see a heading on TSN or Subban traded as it is for a Subban re-signs header.

Habitants 01-24-2013 09:10 AM

repost from other thread since it got closed:

Ok this is getting rediculous. I have the answer to end it all.


Bergevin wants 2 yr bridge contract at say 3 million, total 6mil


Subban want 6 yr mega deal at say 6 million, total 36mil



Just give him an 8 yr contract for 42million and the avg annual cap hit comes to 5.25mil.

I can live with that.

End the maddness

416Leafer 01-24-2013 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by No Team Needed (Post 58220917)
Subban puts up similar points, is unbelievably superior in the defensive game and will pay more taxes in Montreal but he's worth 4 million max?

He's probably comparable to Dan Hamhuis at the moment, ~4.5M

But since you're also paying for "potential", it should be higher than that. So IMO Subban is probably worth something like:

~9.5M on a two year deal (4.75M/year)

or

~27.5M on a five year deal (5.5M/year)

And that 5.5 would still arguably be low if he breaks out offensively and becomes a ~45+ point two-way physical defenceman. Those types of players get 6+ typically

skule123 01-24-2013 09:13 AM

Unsigned PK is really keeping me from enjoying the end of the lockout and the young hockey season. Like a few people have said, every trade tracker from TSN has me fear the worst.

waffledave 01-24-2013 09:14 AM

Well, I truly feel we are passed the point of no return.

PK will inevitably be traded. I am furious that it has come to this.

This contract dispute has pissed off his teammates. It has pissed off PK as well. We are done here. For whatever reason, Bergevin and his inexplicable obsession with low ball bridge contracts WILL cost us the most dynamic defenceman that we've had in a long, long time.

Mr. Bergevin, Mr. "supreme talent evaluator", does not seem to be a big fan of PK's talent. He had an opportunity to sign this kid long term, keep the guy in the organization for a long time and at a cap hit that in a few years will seem like nothing.

I'm telling you right now, PK will be traded. At BEST, he will stay here until he's UFA and bolt. He's been disrepected by the organization, and his teammates have soured on him for holding out.

It's a toxic situation. This is done.

Goodbye PK.

Hopefully goodbye Bergevin if he ****s this up anymore than he already has.

habs03 01-24-2013 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Habitants (Post 58220989)
repost from other thread since it got closed:

Ok this is getting rediculous. I have the answer to end it all.


Bergevin wants 2 yr bridge contract at say 3 million, total 6mil


Subban want 6 yr mega deal at say 6 million, total 36mil



Just give him an 8 yr contract for 42million and the avg annual cap hit comes to 5.25mil.

I can live with that.


End the maddness

That is a gap of 30M in the first offers, that is a lot.

If that is what the offers are, I think they should meet in the middle.

3 years at 3.5M, 3 years 11.5M

Habs get their short term, Subban a contract that takes him to 1 year away from being a UFA.

417 01-24-2013 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 58220715)
PK has always spoken from his heart, never seemed dishonest about anything.
Hearing him speak about his demand and how he isn't unreasonable, and repeating how he just wants his fair value, gave me the feeling he really wanted to divulge the numbers being offered as opposed to his demands to really prove he isn't asking for the moon here.

No doubt, I really find it unfortunate some fans have turned against him...though I guess it's not surprising, he's a polarizing figure.

I don't think there's anything wrong with determining your own value, he's well within his right to get paid what he thinks he's worth

He's not holding out while under contract...there's nothing wrong with what he's doing.

Just like I also respect the Habs for sticking to their guns on the bridge deal...but I don't support both sides being unflexible on the money issue.

Habskrieg 01-24-2013 09:16 AM

Hard to believe a deal isn't inked yet. I don't know if PK's being too demanding. Or if Bergevin isn't giving what PK deserves.

Personally, I hope PK stays a Hab. But it all depends on his contract and his performances on and off the ice. If he doesn't stay, I hope it depends on the return, which has the same ifs. Subban would be the safer of the two imo.

The real annoying part is we're more than likely not going to know what was offered if a deal doesn't pull through. And you just know fans are going to be convinced in their baseless beliefs no matter the position. And we'll have unrest over it.

C'mon Bergie and PK. Get this deal signed!

Kriss E 01-24-2013 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onebighockeyfan (Post 58220723)
I think he's worth about 4 right now, max. If the two clans are ~ 3 million appart PK might be after a little bit too much.

Bobby Mac said Habs are offering PK 2.75M. He also said they are about 2-3M apart.
That means PK, at the most, is asking between 4.75-5.75M.
However, Stubbs just said PK isn't asking for Doughty money, at all. Meaning, he's probably not asking for 5.75M.
So what gives?? How is PK the one vilified here?? Not going to blame the RDS guys for riding on the Bergevin side, they finally get access to the GM and coach, they love them for taking part in their shows and being so open to them, so very easy to predict they would back him up.

But fans?? I don't get it. I also don't understand how any fan would want PK to sign on a cheap long term deal. Really, doesn't make any sense. People should want this kid locked up on a long term deal at a decent price, which is what he's apparently asking for.

Pierre Dagenais 01-24-2013 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waffledave (Post 58221193)
Well, I truly feel we are passed the point of no return.

PK will inevitably be traded. I am furious that it has come to this.

This contract dispute has pissed off his teammates. It has pissed off PK as well. We are done here. For whatever reason, Bergevin and his inexplicable obsession with low ball bridge contracts WILL cost us the most dynamic defenceman that we've had in a long, long time.

Mr. Bergevin, Mr. "supreme talent evaluator", does not seem to be a big fan of PK's talent. He had an opportunity to sign this kid long term, keep the guy in the organization for a long time and at a cap hit that in a few years will seem like nothing.

I'm telling you right now, PK will be traded. At BEST, he will stay here until he's UFA and bolt. He's been disrepected by the organization, and his teammates have soured on him for holding out.

It's a toxic situation. This is done.

Goodbye PK.

Hopefully goodbye Bergevin if he ****s this up anymore than he already has.

Don't be so dramatic. It's a negotiation.

Vinny Bombatz 01-24-2013 09:18 AM

Don't make the same mistake twice.
 
Chris Chelios now P.K Subban

It's as if history is trying to repeat itself. Both play a similar style, both have strong characters and there is no doubt in my mind that by the time Subban retires they will both be Norris trophy winners.

Draw the comparables for fun...its scary how many there are.

Andrighetto Fabolous 01-24-2013 09:20 AM

Subban's value is at the lowest it can possibly be as he hasn't played all year and every game is so important at this point, not to mention teams won't give up as much due to the uncertainty of how much money he wants.

I just hope Bergevin signs him and isn't stupid enough to trade him as it'll take YEARS to find another top pairing defenseman like him.

Habskrieg 01-24-2013 09:22 AM

As far as I remember, the reason Chelios was dealt was for his behavior. I may be wrong on this. But if I recall, Chelios had gone partying (don't remember if it was during playoffs or not) and got himself injured. Enough that it ruined the Habs chances. But this is what I remember and I may be wrong. But all in all, I know that it was for his behavior.

The current situation is more about contract details.

waffledave 01-24-2013 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre Dagenais (Post 58221383)
Don't be so dramatic. It's a negotiation.

I was called dramatic when I brought this up during training camp and everyone assured me PK would obviously sign before the season started and that it was an absurd notion that he wouldn't.

Habtchum* 01-24-2013 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 58220715)
PK has always spoken from his heart, never seemed dishonest about anything.
Hearing him speak about his demand and how he isn't unreasonable, and repeating how he just wants his fair value, gave me the feeling he really wanted to divulge the numbers being offered as opposed to his demands to really prove he isn't asking for the moon here.

Subban sounds more like a selfish, immature brat. He certainly comes out as not being a team player at all.

The guy should entertain the idea of playing over in Europe for the next couple of years.

Dr Gonzo 01-24-2013 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YourBuddy (Post 58221401)
Created by the media really.

Par for the course in Montreal.

No Team Needed 01-24-2013 09:26 AM

If anything he's a combination of Chris Chelios and Claude Lemieux.

He has the talent to be Chelios but people vilify him like Claude Lemieux.

Monctonscout 01-24-2013 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waffledave (Post 58221193)
Well, I truly feel we are passed the point of no return.

PK will inevitably be traded. I am furious that it has come to this.

This contract dispute has pissed off his teammates. It has pissed off PK as well. We are done here. For whatever reason, Bergevin and his inexplicable obsession with low ball bridge contracts WILL cost us the most dynamic defenceman that we've had in a long, long time.

Mr. Bergevin, Mr. "supreme talent evaluator", does not seem to be a big fan of PK's talent. He had an opportunity to sign this kid long term, keep the guy in the organization for a long time and at a cap hit that in a few years will seem like nothing.

I'm telling you right now, PK will be traded. At BEST, he will stay here until he's UFA and bolt. He's been disrepected by the organization, and his teammates have soured on him for holding out.

It's a toxic situation. This is done.

Goodbye PK.

Hopefully goodbye Bergevin if he ****s this up anymore than he already has.

Not sure how you get that it has "passed the point of no return". Pk hasn't asked for a trade or said he wouldn't play for MT.

Mats NAslund 01-24-2013 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 58221317)
Bobby Mac said Habs are offering PK 2.75M. He also said they are about 2-3M apart.
That means PK, at the most, is asking between 4.75-5.75M.
However, Stubbs just said PK isn't asking for Doughty money, at all. Meaning, he's probably not asking for 5.75M.
So what gives?? How is PK the one vilified here?? Not going to blame the RDS guys for riding on the Bergevin side, they finally get access to the GM and coach, they love them for taking part in their shows and being so open to them, so very easy to predict they would back him up.

But fans?? I don't get it. I also don't understand how any fan would want PK to sign on a cheap long term deal. Really, doesn't make any sense. People should want this kid locked up on a long term deal at a decent price, which is what he's apparently asking for.

It's not about wanting or not wanting this kid...

Price Pacioretty Gorges and on and on all followed Management business rule of a transition contract.....Why should PK not have to as well?

I'll argue that Price is MUCH MUCH more important to this team then PK and he didn't fuss. He signed and played out his transition contract and got rewarded for it in the end.

I say if PK doesn;t want to sign a transition contract then trade him.
Montreal has the likes of Tinordi, Beaulieu and Ellis waiting in the wings and bringing in a guy ala Benn would suit thsi team just fine.

From al the suggested comments from players and news outlets it's not like Subban is apprecited in his own locker room either. This guy thinks he'sigger then the team.

While I'd love to keep PK, I would not keep him at any cost.

Signing him to a long term big money deal now would send the wrong message to the other young stars on this team and more then likely create some anomisty in the dressing room.

If PK doesn't want to be part of the Montreal Canadiesn then let's move on and get someone that does want to be part of a TEAM!

Maybe Edmonton would be interested!


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