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-   -   Value of: Derek Stepan (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1339121)

I Eat Crow 02-01-2013 01:39 PM

Derek Stepan
 
Half of the Rangers board seems to want to trade him. I'm curious to see what would be your team's offer for a 22 year old center that scored 50 points last season?

Dr Jan Itor 02-01-2013 01:45 PM

If our (Minnesota's) 1st rounder falls in the 15-30 range, I'd offer that up as a starting point. Might add another pick or mid-prospect if needed.

The Sweetness 02-01-2013 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor (Post 58834845)
If our (Minnesota's) 1st rounder falls in the 15-30 range, I'd offer that up as a starting point. Might add another pick or mid-prospect if needed.

Stepan would demand more than a mid-late first rounder despite his recent struggles. He is pretty much the best case scenario in regards to what a team hopes to end up with a pick in that range. Even if you did a redraft of the 2008 draft he might end up in the top 15 in what has proven to be a good draft. Given he is obviously an established NHL player and further along than a new pick there is no reason a team would accept a mid-late first for Stepan and you'd need to add a good prospect or 2nd round pick.

Machinehead 02-01-2013 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor (Post 58834845)
If our (Minnesota's) 1st rounder falls in the 15-30 range, I'd offer that up as a starting point. Might add another pick or mid-prospect if needed.

The Rangers would want an upgrade on Stepan NOW, not futures.

Trxjw 02-01-2013 02:13 PM

Trading Stepan would be idiotic unless it was for a clear upgrade in the short term, with comparable or higher upside in the long-run. What GM would want to make that trade? Very few, if any, I'd imagine.

TheJuxtaposer 02-01-2013 02:16 PM

I have no clue why the Rangers would consider trading Stepan.

EDIT: Stepan is rocking a 4.35 on-ice shooting%. The numbers will come.

Vatican Roulette 02-01-2013 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer (Post 58836601)
I have no clue why the Rangers would consider trading Stepan.

EDIT: Stepan is rocking a 4.35 on-ice shooting%. The numbers will come.

Out of curiosity, do they list his off ice shooting %?

Zuuuuc 02-01-2013 02:39 PM

Considering the Rangers are in a win now mode, a trade including Derek Stepan would either be a win win trade where the Rangers trade Stepan for a similar age/skill/potential 2nd line centre drafted between 2007-2009 where both players just need a change of scenery. Or the Rangers could use Stepan in a package with a 2nd rounder and a prospect or maybe even Zuccarello's rights for an upgrade, although the later would mean less cap space moving forward

Erixon53 02-01-2013 02:43 PM

Ryan O'Reilly

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 02-01-2013 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer (Post 58836601)
I have no clue why the Rangers would consider trading Stepan.

EDIT: Stepan is rocking a 4.35 on-ice shooting%. The numbers will come.

Rangers aren't. Only a couple of dumb fans who have absolutely no concept of the word patience.

dkny1121* 02-01-2013 03:03 PM

lol, trade him? Its 7 games into the season. Should the Bruins trade Seguin as well since he is not PPG?

TheJuxtaposer 02-01-2013 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vatican Roulette (Post 58837359)
Out of curiosity, do they list his off ice shooting %?

Not that I know of, but I'm sure you could calculate it based on relative ice-time and team shooting percentage fairly easily if you really cared.

Trxjw 02-01-2013 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer (Post 58836601)
I have no clue why the Rangers would consider trading Stepan.

EDIT: Stepan is rocking a 4.35 on-ice shooting%. The numbers will come.

He's slow, and a handful of armchair GM's on our board have decreed that it must be so. Therefore, it shall be.

I believe the asking price right now, according to some, is one Jussi Jokinen. Do I hear one Jussi Jokinen?

HankTheTankYoLo 02-01-2013 03:08 PM

No need of trading him, look with MDZ so bad one year, everyone wanted him gone, now he is like the best D in Rangers..

Kris Chreider 02-01-2013 03:09 PM

Why would we trade Stepan? We're not that deep at C, JT Miller isn't ready yet, and Sather likely sees him as Richards' long term replacement.

No holes could be filled without creating a new one at 2C.

BPD 02-01-2013 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erixon53 (Post 58838095)
Ryan O'Reilly

Now...here's an idea...

Talk about your deals with the devil.

Stepan for O'Reilly...how about them apples?

Exit Dose 02-01-2013 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trxjw (Post 58839469)
He's slow, and a handful of armchair GM's on our board have decreed that it must be so. Therefore, it shall be.

I believe the asking price right now, according to some, is one Jussi Jokinen. Do I hear one Jussi Jokinen?

No allowances given there was a lockout an it's clear that many in this league aren't playing at 100%, or that he's a young player that's still developing?

TheJuxtaposer 02-01-2013 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BPD (Post 58840217)
Now...here's an idea...

Talk about your deals with the devil.

Stepan for O'Reilly...how about them apples?

You're going to have to add. O'Reilly is younger, elite defensively, and similar offensively.

Besides, if the Avs trade O'Reilly, the last thing they're going to trade him for is another young center. They want elite wingers or a #2LHD.

Trxjw 02-01-2013 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exit Dose (Post 58840407)
No allowances given there was a lockout an it's clear that many in this league aren't playing at 100%, or that he's a young player that's still developing?

Surely you jest. :p:

It's your run of the mill scapegoating. No goals in X number of games. Too slow. First two seasons were anomalies. Yada yada yada. We had the same issues last season when he posted 1 assist in his first 8 games.

Kris Chreider 02-01-2013 05:39 PM

Start of the season is always brutal for us.

rockinghockey 02-01-2013 05:45 PM

It is early in the season, I am sure that CBJ hope that the NYR don't make the playoffs and stay where they are at. Could you imagen if LA doesn't make the playoffs also. Nice draft for CBJ.

smoneil 02-01-2013 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer (Post 58840505)
You're going to have to add. O'Reilly is younger, elite defensively, and similar offensively.

Besides, if the Avs trade O'Reilly, the last thing they're going to trade him for is another young center. They want elite wingers or a #2LHD.


No, they really wouldn't. First off, O'Reilly is only 6 months younger, so it's not exactly a big deal. Second, you're right. They are "similar offensively." They've scored almost the same number of goals and points. Only difference is O'Reilly needed an extra 65 games to get there. RO'R is as "similar" offensively to Stepan as Step is "similar" defensively to RO'R. In other words, while offense is clearly Stepan's forte and defense is clearly RO'R's, neither guy is THAT much better at his skill than the other.

Finally, O'Reilly seems to want to be paid like a regular 50+ point guy. There's no point in trading for a guy who Sather won't sign, and Sather ain't giving a guy 5+ million per when two of his three seasons are sub 30 points.

Added note--if I hear "It's Depot time" one more time, I'm going to kick a cute animal. This site's advertizing gets more and more obnoxious with each passing week.

Pierce Hawthorne 02-01-2013 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoneil (Post 58847419)
No, they really wouldn't. First off, O'Reilly is only 6 months younger, so it's not exactly a big deal. Second, you're right. They are "similar offensively." They've scored almost the same number of goals and points. Only difference is O'Reilly needed an extra 65 games to get there. RO'R is as "similar" offensively to Stepan as Step is "similar" defensively to RO'R. In other words, while offense is clearly Stepan's forte and defense is clearly RO'R's, neither guy is THAT much better at his skill than the other.

Finally, O'Reilly seems to want to be paid like a regular 50+ point guy. There's no point in trading for a guy who Sather won't sign, and Sather ain't giving a guy 5+ million per when two of his three seasons are sub 30 points.

Added note--if I hear "It's Depot time" one more time, I'm going to kick a cute animal. This site's advertizing gets more and more obnoxious with each passing week.

LOL

You wouldn't get Oreilly for just Stepan, not even close. Stepan is playing on a much more offensively gifted team, Oreilly was forced into a Defensive role for his first 2 years and it wasn't until last year he was given the chance to play a more offensive role and he went out and lead the Avs in points. Not even brining Defensive play into consideration, the two players are close with there being a legitimate argument for Oreilly being the better Offensive player(not saying he is, but the argument is for sure there). And then like I said when you add each players ability away from the puck, Oreilly runs away.

And Oreilly might ony be 6 months younger, but that 6 months is enough to translate into a full year of Hockey development. Stepan was drafted a year earlier and has had a full year more of development, that's fairly significant considering both players current ages.


Also Oreilly isn't asking for 5+M, that rumor was proven false a while ago for the most part. He wants something between 4 and 5 Million, if its a 2 or 3 year deal he wants 4M, if its a 6 or 7 year deal he would want 5M. Not 5+

Now I would actually be quite interested in a Stepan+ for Oreilly deal. I like Stepan a lot and think he would play well for Colorado, but Sherman would laugh at a 1 for 1 swap.

I don't know how highly you guys value MDZ, but I would do Oreilly + Elliott for Stepan + MDZ.

The Sweetness 02-01-2013 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoneil (Post 58847419)
No, they really wouldn't. First off, O'Reilly is only 6 months younger, so it's not exactly a big deal. Second, you're right. They are "similar offensively." They've scored almost the same number of goals and points. Only difference is O'Reilly needed an extra 65 games to get there. RO'R is as "similar" offensively to Stepan as Step is "similar" defensively to RO'R. In other words, while offense is clearly Stepan's forte and defense is clearly RO'R's, neither guy is THAT much better at his skill than the other.

Finally, O'Reilly seems to want to be paid like a regular 50+ point guy. There's no point in trading for a guy who Sather won't sign, and Sather ain't giving a guy 5+ million per when two of his three seasons are sub 30 points.

Added note--if I hear "It's Depot time" one more time, I'm going to kick a cute animal. This site's advertizing gets more and more obnoxious with each passing week.

The Rangers would definitely have to add to get O'Reilly. O'Reilly is already one of the best defensive forwards in the game, an great forechecker and he produced very comparable numbers to Stepan despite playing on a poor Avs team and playing in a far more defensive role. I'm a Rangers fan but I'm sure O'Reilly has more value than Stepan, and I'd do a straight up swap in a heartbeat.

smoneil 02-01-2013 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avsare1 (Post 58848571)
LOL

You wouldn't get Oreilly for just Stepan, not even close. Stepan is playing on a much more offensively gifted team, Oreilly was forced into a Defensive role for his first 2 years and it wasn't until last year he was given the chance to play a more offensive role and he went out and lead the Avs in points. Not even brining Defensive play into consideration, the two players are close with there being a legitimate argument for Oreilly being the better Offensive player(not saying he is, but the argument is for sure there). And then like I said when you add each players ability away from the puck, Oreilly runs away.

And Oreilly might ony be 6 months younger, but that 6 months is enough to translate into a full year of Hockey development. Stepan was drafted a year earlier and has had a full year more of development, that's fairly significant considering both players current ages.


Also Oreilly isn't asking for 5+M, that rumor was proven false a while ago for the most part. He wants something between 4 and 5 Million, if its a 2 or 3 year deal he wants 4M, if its a 6 or 7 year deal he would want 5M. Not 5+

Now I would actually be quite interested in a Stepan+ for Oreilly deal. I like Stepan a lot and think he would play well for Colorado, but Sherman would laugh at a 1 for 1 swap.

I don't know how highly you guys value MDZ, but I would do Oreilly + Elliott for Stepan + MDZ.

5 million for a guy with what very well could be one fluke season? Thanks, but no. I'd rather keep the guy whose career low is higher than your guy's career average.

As for your delusion that you would get Stepan AND Del Zotto for inferior versions of each (drastically inferior in Elliott's case), I don't even know what to say to that. I actually like O'Reilly's game, but he's rapidly become the most overrated player on these boards.


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