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-   -   At what point does Semin prove himself for a contract extension? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1343295)

Beardy* 02-06-2013 02:58 PM

At what point does Semin prove himself for a contract extension?
 
For me, personally, that time has already come. Just seeing what he's doing for the top line, and what he's doing for Eric Staal's game... its just absolutely incredible to watch on a nightly basis. The two of them paired together long term would be AWESOME for this organization and the city of Raleigh. Having Staal, Staal, Skinner, and Semin locked up long-term would be a foundation upon which we should be contending for Cups again in the near future.

What say you?

WWAD 02-06-2013 03:03 PM

It would probably be prudent to make sure we're not in last place at the trade deadline first.

I'd have no problem getting it done before the off-season though.

Chicago Made Punk 02-06-2013 03:04 PM

Right now.

PaulProteus 02-06-2013 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beardy (Post 59172611)
The two of them paired together long term would be AWESOME for this organization and the city of Raleigh. Having Staal, Staal, Skinner, and Semin locked up long-term would be a foundation upon which we should be contending for Cups again in the near future.

The nucleus created by those players is indeed astounding, especially when you include Faulk in the mix -- not as a long-term signed guy but as a piece of the delicious pie. What team wouldn't want that to build around?

Personally if the Canes were able to extend Semin even for 2 more years I'd probably do cartwheels most of the way out to PNC. I'd be all for putting ink to paper, today, regardless that I know it's not practical or rational.

That said I just can't see Semin sitting down to even listen to a deal until the offseason, knowing full well that many GMs are going to be looking at this season as his resume... maybe even more than his years with the Caps.

Blueline Bomber 02-06-2013 03:11 PM

Give it time. I think the trade deadline would be a perfect time to decide one way or the other.

Beardy* 02-06-2013 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaulProteus (Post 59173229)
The nucleus created by those players is indeed astounding, especially when you include Faulk in the mix -- not as a long-term signed guy but as a piece of the delicious pie. What team wouldn't want that to build around?

Personally if the Canes were able to extend Semin even for 2 more years I'd probably do cartwheels most of the way out to PNC. I'd be all for putting ink to paper, today, regardless that I know it's not practical or rational.

That said I just can't see Semin sitting down to even listen to a deal until the offseason, knowing full well that many GMs are going to be looking at this season as his resume... maybe even more than his years with the Caps.

Honestly, I say start the negotiating now. Semin chose to come to Raleigh, and its paying dividends for him. We stuck our neck out for this guy, gave him an elite center to anchor his line, gave him the time on the PK he wanted, and we're letting him just go out there and have fun. More importantly, the fanbase really truly appreciates his play on the ice, and we want him to sign long term.

Lets put it this way. Last year, Eric Staal finished the season dead last in +/-. Through 8 games this year, all with Semin on his wing, he's currently third. THAT is the value he brings to the team, and its something JR should not let walk away.

PaulProteus 02-06-2013 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beardy (Post 59173599)
Honestly, I say start the negotiating now. Semin chose to come to Raleigh, and its paying dividends for him. We stuck our neck out for this guy, gave him an elite center to anchor his line, gave him the time on the PK he wanted, and we're letting him just go out there and have fun. More importantly, the fanbase really truly appreciates his play on the ice, and we want him to sign long term.

Lets put it this way. Last year, Eric Staal finished the season dead last in +/-. Through 8 games this year, all with Semin on his wing, he's currently third. THAT is the value he brings to the team, and its something JR should not let walk away.

I'm all for seeing where he's at right now, and it makes me wonder just what sort of activity is going on behind the scenes.

Giving Semin more responsibility has proven to be fruitful in ways I never even saw coming, honestly.

Semin has made a liar out of me this season, partially. I told my wife when they signed him it would either make us never want to see him play in another sweater or hate his guts, and I had most of a foot over in the "Guts: hate" camp. ;)

Finlandia WOAT 02-06-2013 03:36 PM

If we signed Semin to a 2/3 year deal at 7 million per, we would have 42 million tied up in 7 players by 2014-2015 (Staal's, Skinner, Ward, Semin, Ruutu and Gleason).

Factor in Faulk raise: Let's say he gets a 5 year, 25 million dollar deal. That's 47 million in 8 players.

Now,

Dwyer at 1 million.
Jokinen (resigned) at 3 million.
Pitkanen (resigned) at 3.5 million.
McBain/Harrison at 2 million.
Jiri Tlusty/LaRose at 1.75 million.
Bowman at 1 million.

63 million in 16 players. We still need:

2 forwards.
1/2 defenseman.
A backup goalie.

(bare minimum to ice an NHL roster)

At around 5-8 million dollars, or an average of less than a million per player.

Given how our prospect pipeline looks, only Rask and Murphy will contribute as anything above solid NHL'ers on cheap ass contracts, so I would be wary of signing Semin to 7 million a year. If he regresses at all, we are screwed. We need him to be a PPG winger. So far, he has done slightly below that, but given the amount of iron he has hit, the woeful success of our power play and general learning curve, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

But enough beating around the bush: if we sign Semin, then this is going to be our core for the next 5 years. No turning back. The question is, do we want to go into April year in, year out with an offensive attack that features the Staal's, Skinner and Semin? Are we comfortable with the defense as it stands? If we sign Semin to a longer term deal, then we simply won't have the money to get a significant upgrade to our defense, which is concerning given that Pitkanen is close to 30. His freakish stamina won't last forever.

caniac247 02-06-2013 03:39 PM

I saw an article yesterday that was on my twitter feed about JR getting more than expected from Semin and he's very impressed with his 2-way play. So JR is happy, if Semin's happy (which he seems to be), I say get it done.

We've been looking for years for a guy to play with Ericl. And although it's only a small sample size, he's doing wonders for Eric on that line.

Gr8Dan 02-06-2013 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plan The Parade (Post 59174519)
If we signed Semin to a 2/3 year deal at 7 million per, we would have 42 million tied up in 7 players by 2014-2015 (Staal's, Skinner, Ward, Semin, Ruutu and Gleason).

Factor in Faulk raise: Let's say he gets a 5 year, 25 million dollar deal. That's 47 million in 8 players.

Now,

Dwyer at 1 million.
Jokinen (resigned) at 3 million.
Pitkanen (resigned) at 3.5 million.
McBain/Harrison at 2 million.
Jiri Tlusty/LaRose at 1.75 million.
Bowman at 1 million.

63 million in 16 players. We still need:

2 forwards.
1/2 defenseman.
A backup goalie.

(bare minimum to ice an NHL roster)

At around 5-8 million dollars, or an average of less than a million per player.

Given how our prospect pipeline looks, only Rask and Murphy will contribute as anything above solid NHL'ers on cheap ass contracts, so I would be wary of signing Semin to 7 million a year. If he regresses at all, we are screwed. We need him to be a PPG winger. So far, he has done slightly below that, but given the amount of iron he has hit, the woeful success of our power play and general learning curve, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

But enough beating around the bush: if we sign Semin, then this is going to be our core for the next 5 years. No turning back. The question is, do we want to go into April year in, year out with an offensive attack that features the Staal's, Skinner and Semin? Are we comfortable with the defense as it stands? If we sign Semin to a longer term deal, then we simply won't have the money to get a significant upgrade to our defense, which is concerning given that Pitkanen is close to 30. His freakish stamina won't last forever.

I really doubt Faulk gets 5m per, Subban only got a 2 year 5.75m deal. I also read that Semin would take a salary cut if it were a longer deal, maybe 6-6.5m a year for 5 years?

Blueline Bomber 02-06-2013 03:58 PM

As great as Semin is playing right now, I'd like to see him keep it up for a good portion of the season before making an extension offer. I'd also like him to score a little more (maybe a little less post hits :laugh:).

And as already mentioned, if Semin's going to be asking anywhere near what he's making now, we're stuck with the defense we have now. And I know no one is (or should be) content with the defense we have now.

Lazyking 02-06-2013 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber (Post 59175619)
As great as Semin is playing right now, I'd like to see him keep it up for a good portion of the season before making an extension offer. I'd also like him to score a little more (maybe a little less post hits :laugh:).

And as already mentioned, if Semin's going to be asking anywhere near what he's making now, we're stuck with the defense we have now. And I know no one is (or should be) content with the defense we have now.

I think JR is content with our defense.

Blueline Bomber 02-06-2013 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazyking (Post 59175751)
I think JR is content with our defense.

And that's a huge problem.

HisIceness 02-06-2013 04:14 PM

Eric is in the prime of his career (Semin is too) and getting another legit first line winger to play with him should we let Semin walk is going to be difficult, sure it can be done but we'd have to give up a lot to get that kind of player and since we got Semin in the FA market, I say the time for JR to talk with him about staying with the Hurricanes for years to come should be within the next 4-6 weeks.

Boom Boom Anton 02-06-2013 04:25 PM

Do you pop the question after only a couple of dates when the parties are both on their best behavior? I'd wait until later in the year after the team (and Semin) face some sort of adversity.

Beardy* 02-06-2013 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plan The Parade (Post 59174519)
If we signed Semin to a 2/3 year deal at 7 million per, we would have 42 million tied up in 7 players by 2014-2015 (Staal's, Skinner, Ward, Semin, Ruutu and Gleason).

Factor in Faulk raise: Let's say he gets a 5 year, 25 million dollar deal. That's 47 million in 8 players.

Now,

Dwyer at 1 million.
Jokinen (resigned) at 3 million.
Pitkanen (resigned) at 3.5 million.
McBain/Harrison at 2 million.
Jiri Tlusty/LaRose at 1.75 million.
Bowman at 1 million.

63 million in 16 players. We still need:

2 forwards.
1/2 defenseman.
A backup goalie.

(bare minimum to ice an NHL roster)

At around 5-8 million dollars, or an average of less than a million per player.

Given how our prospect pipeline looks, only Rask and Murphy will contribute as anything above solid NHL'ers on cheap ass contracts, so I would be wary of signing Semin to 7 million a year. If he regresses at all, we are screwed. We need him to be a PPG winger. So far, he has done slightly below that, but given the amount of iron he has hit, the woeful success of our power play and general learning curve, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

But enough beating around the bush: if we sign Semin, then this is going to be our core for the next 5 years. No turning back. The question is, do we want to go into April year in, year out with an offensive attack that features the Staal's, Skinner and Semin? Are we comfortable with the defense as it stands? If we sign Semin to a longer term deal, then we simply won't have the money to get a significant upgrade to our defense, which is concerning given that Pitkanen is close to 30. His freakish stamina won't last forever.

Semin isn't getting $7m a year for his extension... He only got that this year as incentive to sign one year. If he extends, it'll likely be in the $5m-$6m per year over 5 years, and he'll be happy with that.

Faulk will get around what Subban just got. That contract set the market for these players. Will be short term relatively cheap so they can get the big payday when their play starts to round to form.

To answer your question, hell yes I'm content with an offensive core like that. Not many teams can match 2 lines like that, especially with young players who have yet to hit their peak. Set that up and really all JR has to focus on going forward is defense and who we can plug and play on the 3rd and 4th lines.

Mr America 02-06-2013 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plan The Parade (Post 59174519)
If we signed Semin to a 2/3 year deal at 7 million per, we would have 42 million tied up in 7 players by 2014-2015 (Staal's, Skinner, Ward, Semin, Ruutu and Gleason).

Factor in Faulk raise: Let's say he gets a 5 year, 25 million dollar deal. That's 47 million in 8 players.

Now,

Dwyer at 1 million.
Jokinen (resigned) at 3 million.
Pitkanen (resigned) at 3.5 million.
McBain/Harrison at 2 million.
Jiri Tlusty/LaRose at 1.75 million.
Bowman at 1 million.

63 million in 16 players. We still need:

2 forwards.
1/2 defenseman.
A backup goalie.

(bare minimum to ice an NHL roster)

At around 5-8 million dollars, or an average of less than a million per player.

Given how our prospect pipeline looks, only Rask and Murphy will contribute as anything above solid NHL'ers on cheap ass contracts, so I would be wary of signing Semin to 7 million a year. If he regresses at all, we are screwed. We need him to be a PPG winger. So far, he has done slightly below that, but given the amount of iron he has hit, the woeful success of our power play and general learning curve, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

But enough beating around the bush: if we sign Semin, then this is going to be our core for the next 5 years. No turning back. The question is, do we want to go into April year in, year out with an offensive attack that features the Staal's, Skinner and Semin? Are we comfortable with the defense as it stands? If we sign Semin to a longer term deal, then we simply won't have the money to get a significant upgrade to our defense, which is concerning given that Pitkanen is close to 30. His freakish stamina won't last forever.

You're right, we shouldn't hope JR spends too much on Semin, and somehow manages to opt back towards mediocrity.

Sasha Cares 02-06-2013 04:45 PM

his 2.9% shooting can't hold up... He's due to bust out

Wolfpuck 02-06-2013 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seminal Velocity (Post 59177671)
his 2.9% shooting can't hold up... He's due to bust out

And with his 200 ft game, we'll be seeing Semin all over the ice.

Citizen Cane 02-06-2013 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber (Post 59175619)
As great as Semin is playing right now, I'd like to see him keep it up for a good portion of the season before making an extension offer. I'd also like him to score a little more (maybe a little less post hits :laugh:).

.

We were joking about that last night. By my count he has rung iron four times in 9 games. You know some of those are gonna stop finding the pipes at some point.

Boom Boom Anton 02-06-2013 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citizen Cane (Post 59177959)
We were joking about that last night. By my count he has rung iron four times in 9 games. You know some of those are gonna stop finding the pipes at some point.

Leafs fans are saying the exact same thing about Kessel.

TheBigKahuna 02-06-2013 05:00 PM

If you watch Semin in practice, he always aims for the corners. And quite often he banks them in off the posts. I think he's really aiming for the edges, where a lot of guys just fling it towards the goalies chest. He'll start sneaking more pucks into the net.

Cam Ward was on XM radio today, and one of the topics was Semin, and how he was blamed for a lot of the shortcomings of the Caps during his time there. Rutherford talked to several former teammates of Semin, including Corvo as we all know by now. They asked a lot of people if the rumors were true, and came to the conclusion that they might not be. It's very likely that he wasn't happy there, or with the coaches, etc. That's not to say he won't sour on being a Cane, but right now he sure looks happy. I think a HUGE part of whether or not he signs here again, will come down to Semin. What's more important to him, a little more money, a longer contract, or playing somewhere where he really likes the team/organization. I think that will be the biggest factor, does he want to stay, or chase the pay. Even Pitkanen, could have left Raleigh for a bigger payday. There's a lot to be said for being in a low-key market for some of these guys. They enjoy the daily anonymity.

Finlandia WOAT 02-06-2013 05:13 PM

I wonder how much Semin enjoys being out of Ovie's shadow. I still can't wait for the first Caps game. In that, we'll get a read of just how good Semin can be.

If I were JR, I wait until 2 weeks before the season ends. If Semin has performed, offer a 3 year, 16.5 million contract with a NTC. Offer stability and the opportunity to be a core part.

Finlandia WOAT 02-06-2013 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr America (Post 59177245)
You're right, we shouldn't hope JR spends too much on Semin, and somehow manages to opt back towards mediocrity.

It's not about mediocrity, it's about opportunity cost.

If we resign Semin, and that precludes us from getting Marc Staal, is that a fair trade off? Such a think has happened, for example, with Boston. Boston let Joe Thornton go, but used his cap space to sign Zdeno Chara some time later.

On the other hand, if we let Semin go and don't reinvest the money he left on the table at all, then that is obviously a huge blow. We saw this with the 'Canes and Erik Cole, where the money he left wasn't properly reinvested, and we lost his money.

We need to consider who will be available, whether UFA or trade, and if a hypothetical Semin signing would preclude us from that.

TheBigKahuna 02-06-2013 05:17 PM

When it comes down to money....and if the Canes are up against the cap, etc....I'l be looking at Gleason and Ruutu, and shaking my head in disgust.


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