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-   -   Butch Goring: if Elias gets in HHOF, so should he. (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1357341)

Missionhockey 02-22-2013 08:17 AM

Butch Goring: if Elias gets in HHOF, so should he.
 
http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...s_a_futur.html

Quote:

"If he gets in, I should be in," said former NHL center Butch Goring, now an Islanders color commentator. "Our stats are the same, and I have four Stanley Cups and a Conn Smythe Trophy."
I didn't get to see Butch play, but Elias played on a lot of teams where he had no offensive help, unlike Goring.

TheDevilMadeMe 02-22-2013 08:26 AM

Apparently nobody told Goring that scoring a point-per-game in the 21st century is much more difficult than it was in the 1980s.

Goring finished top 20 in points twice - both times finishing 12th.
Elias? 3rd, 6th, 10th, 20th. And currently 8th this season.

Darth Yoda 02-22-2013 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missionhockey (Post 60238467)
http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2...s_a_futur.html



I didn't get to see Butch play, but Elias played on a lot of teams where he had no offensive help, unlike Goring.

What a Bozo and unclassy guy they let on TV these days. Not only did he for sure gain from playing with those guys he played with, but he also scored his during a very much so higher scoring era.

Funny thing from the article though:

Elias, in the last year of his contract, will be 37 on April 13. If he scores another 40 points this season — he has 19 through the Devils’ first 16 games — the 1,000-point milestone will be within reach next season, wherever he plays.

Why the heck would he have to score 40 more this season to have a chance at 1000 next season? And this coming from a NJ newssource. I guess they went by his average this season so far, but god cant just sport journalists know something about their field?

Epsilon 02-22-2013 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe (Post 60238749)
Apparently nobody told Goring that scoring a point-per-game in the 21st century is much more difficult than it was in the 1980s.

Goring finished top 20 in points twice - both times finishing 12th.
Elias? 3rd, 6th, 10th, 20th. And currently 8th this season.

Not only that but Goring got to play with far more offensively talented teammates, whereas Elias was frequently the Devils' top offensive threat.

CerebralGenesis 02-22-2013 08:41 AM

He sounds more bitter about not being in already than anything else.

TheDevilMadeMe 02-22-2013 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epsilon (Post 60239115)
Not only that but Goring got to play with far more offensively talented teammates, whereas Elias was frequently the Devils' top offensive threat.

Elias led the team in scoring 8 times I believe, and he led them in points-per-game in 2005-06 after missing the first half of the season with Hepatitis thanks to Russian food during the lockout.

Darth Yoda 02-22-2013 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe (Post 60239183)
Elias led the team in scoring 8 times I believe, and he led them in points-per-game in 2005-06 after missing the first half of the season with Hepatitis thanks to Russian food during the lockout.

All right that's good to know. I always thought he had wandered down the russian red light district or something, or at least that's how i remember it now. No, i actually thought that.

TheDevilMadeMe 02-22-2013 08:44 AM

To be fair to Goring, after seeing his teammate Clark Gillies get inducted, I don't blame him for wondering why he's not in himself.

revolverjgw 02-22-2013 08:50 AM

Butch is as deluded as he is dumb

unknown33 02-22-2013 09:00 AM

They should rather worry about inducting the best Russian forward from that era, not the 6th Islander.

pdd 02-22-2013 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missionhockey (Post 60238467)
I didn't get to see Butch play, but Elias played on a lot of teams where he had no offensive help, unlike Goring.

Bryan Trottier? Mike Bossy? Denis Potvin?

All three were more talented offensively than anyone Elias has gotten to play with (*good* Gomez, Kovalchuk, Parise, Rafalski, and Niedermayer being the big ones).

Epsilon 02-22-2013 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eva unit zero (Post 60241541)
Bryan Trottier? Mike Bossy? Denis Potvin?

All three were more talented offensively than anyone Elias has gotten to play with (*good* Gomez, Kovalchuk, Parise, Rafalski, and Niedermayer being the big ones).

I'm pretty sure you are agreeing with him, read his post again.

saskganesh 02-22-2013 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eva unit zero (Post 60241541)
Bryan Trottier? Mike Bossy? Denis Potvin?

All three were more talented offensively than anyone Elias has gotten to play with (*good* Gomez, Kovalchuk, Parise, Rafalski, and Niedermayer being the big ones).

Yeah but those fine players couldn't get it all together until Goring joined the team in '80. I reference Islanders playoff upsets in 78 and 79.

Butch was clutch, two way and a leader. He was essential to the makeup of that team. If I had it my way, he would get in the HHOF just because of his helmet.

Of course, we could compromise and just get his helmet in. We could hide Dick Duff to make space. No one would know.

As for Elias he is a fine player. As a grumpy old man broadcaster Goring should be more gracious. But hey Cherry is still working, so why not stir the broadcast pot?

Darth Yoda 02-22-2013 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saskganesh (Post 60242313)
Butch was clutch, two way and a leader. He was essential to the makeup of that team.

So was Elias. Plus he was distinctively better offensively than Goring.

vadim sharifijanov 02-22-2013 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe (Post 60239257)
To be fair to Goring, after seeing his teammate Clark Gillies get inducted, I don't blame him for wondering why he's not in himself.

but i think there's also a sense that goring, tonelli, and morrow probably should look at gillies' induction as representing them too. like it could have been any of them, but they can't all go on, so they just picked one to stand for the group. maybe bourne and maybe even brent sutter too.

Elever 02-22-2013 11:55 AM

He's in the hall of infamy for having one of the ugliest helmets used in the NHL.

I'm in favour of more lean HOF standers, guy's like Fleury or Lindros should be in there. But Goring wasn't much of a star.

isles52480 02-22-2013 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe (Post 60239257)
To be fair to Goring, after seeing his teammate Clark Gillies get inducted, I don't blame him for wondering why he's not in himself.

Yes, that's relevant to the conversation. :shakehead

Trebek 02-22-2013 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by isles52480 (Post 60250879)
Yes, that's relevant to the conversation. :shakehead

Of course it's relevant.

vadim sharifijanov 02-22-2013 01:17 PM

goring was a really good player, but spent most of his prime as an extremely productive second line center behind an MVP/scoring champ-calibre #1 (dionne, then trots). on different team, i don't know that he's a hall of famer, but could he have been some other, less star-heavy team's brian propp or nifty middleton?

as a second line center, he finished 12th in points twice-- part of that was probably boosted by playing with dionne on the PP, and those were his best PP years, but he was also taking on heavy defensive assignments, PK time, and probably didn't get nearly the prime offensive icetime that dionne's line did.

Mad Habber 02-22-2013 01:59 PM

Goring should get in. Yeah, the bathroom is down the hall to the left. Please pay the entry fee first.

eddytheeagle20 02-22-2013 02:17 PM

i cant believe goring player over 1100 games and had only 98 pim

tarheelhockey 02-22-2013 02:41 PM

Safe to say that comments like that aren't going to help his cause.

jkrx 02-22-2013 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarheelhockey (Post 60258635)
Safe to say that comments like that aren't going to help his cause.

I dont get why he is comparing himself to Elias? Is it just something he said to get some Devils - Islanders rivalry going?

BamBamCam* 02-22-2013 03:25 PM

Man, alot of you are talking like Goring was a bum. And what's this, he states an opinion and 1/2 of you call him stupid and dumb. Some of you need to back of the hyperbolic nonsense. Because you don't agree with someone, doesn't mean they are stupid, because Butch has done more than any of you ever will in your lifetime. So, what's that make you? He's such a dummy, he's been an NHL coach to 2 teams :help:

Is he HoF material? I don't think so, but as someone mentioned how did Clark Gillies get in and Goring who had the better career get skipped over? Goring has some serious hardware, Conn Smythe, Lady Byng, Masterson plus was a champion at every level he played.

But than again, I don't think Ellias should be in HoF either.

BamBamCam* 02-22-2013 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkrx (Post 60259217)
I dont get why he is comparing himself to Elias? Is it just something he said to get some Devils - Islanders rivalry going?


They are similar players, in style and in overall points.


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