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-   -   A little love for Joe Sacco?? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1357989)

Heebs21* 02-22-2013 11:23 PM

A little love for Joe Sacco??
 
Think about it for a moment...last year we tanked Dec but were well on our way to the playoffs even with loads of injuries.

This year we lose our top line and top two D-men and are still only sitting two points out of a playoff spot.

What more can Sacco do? I have been hard on the guy but damn, he is still putting out a quality team comprised of half an AHL team.

I would like to see what he can do with a healthy squad and a team with more than 1 capable NHL defender.

Thoughts?

Hans Landaskog 02-22-2013 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heebs21 (Post 60286155)
Think about it for a moment...last year we tanked Dec but were well on our way to the playoffs even with loads of injuries.

This year we lose our top line and top two D-men and are still only sitting two points out of a playoff spot.

What more can Sacco do? I have been hard on the guy but damn, he is still putting out a quality team comprised of half an AHL team.

I would like to see what he can do with a healthy squad and a team with more than 1 capable NHL defender.

Thoughts?


He could step-down as head coach. That'd be his biggest contribution to the team.

Av-merican 02-22-2013 11:26 PM

Honestly, if the Avs aren't going to engage in a real search for a head coach, I'm fine with them sticking with Sacco for another season. If nothing else it gives Quinn one more year of NHL experience.

cyberfan 02-22-2013 11:33 PM

Might two biggest problems with Sacco are:
1. Hunwick constantly going from being a healthy scratch to 22 mins per game. You don't see this kind of reversal with any other coaches.
2. Dump and chase style which I have to admit they are doing a lot less. The change also seems to coincide with when Duchene said in an interview that they had to start making plays.

Foppa2118 02-22-2013 11:39 PM

Nope.

He can't get top guys like Stasnty and Jones to play to the level and consistency needed. PP and PK aren't good enough. He can't find a balance between generating offense and good nuetral zone, and defensive play.

He's a good guy and a players coach, but he can't teach this team how to be better. That's the problem. They need tutelage.

avs1dacup 02-22-2013 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foppa2118 (Post 60286773)
Nope.

He can't get top guys like Stasnty and Jones to play to the level and consistency needed.

Disagree with this. Jones yes, but Stastny has been pretty consistent this year. His linemates simply can't finish. He's also been a bit of a streaky player throughout his career. I think we'll see a pretty significant increase in not only scoring chances but points with him playing with Landy.

Quote:

PP and PK aren't good enough.
Agree. There's simply no excuse how bad both have been this year. Although, imo, the pk has only been awful for a handful of games. They've had a few games that they've given up tons of PP goals. In the others, none. So it ends up equaling out to the middle.

Quote:

He can't find a balance between generating offense and good nuetral zone, and defensive play.
This I actually disagree with. There have been plenty of periods throughout his tenure that the team has played strong in all three zones. They are very capable of playing a strong game, however, we haven't seen it for a full 60 minutes nor stretches of games. I think this falls onto a bigger reason that he's not a good coach and that's his inability to adjust both on the fly in between periods.

Foppa2118 02-23-2013 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avs1dacup (Post 60287069)
Disagree with this. Jones yes, but Stastny has been pretty consistent this year. His linemates simply can't finish. He's also been a bit of a streaky player throughout his career. I think we'll see a pretty significant increase in not only scoring chances but points with him playing with Landy.

Stastny is always consistent. It's his seeming inability to ratchet his game up when the team needs him that I have a problem with. I've never been a Stastny basher since he came on the team, but it comes to a point where what you see is what you get with a guy.

Unless he plays with highly talented players, he underperforms most of the time. Obviously everyone plays better with better players, but he plays basically the same all the time, it just depends on if his linemates can cash in. That's not good enough for a guy with the kind of expectations he has. He needs to make plays happen. He needs to step up really. His mild mannered personality doesn't help him in this regard.

He crosses the blueline with the puck the same way every game, he makes the same little plays behind the net every game, he makes the same inaccurate swipes at loose pucks every game. If Jones is being his natural inconsistent self, then nothing is gonna click. A centerman doesn't have that luxury. He needs to drive the play, and make things happen.

Sacco can't seem to push him in the way that this team needs from him. He's just basically the same every game. Not bad, but not terribly great either. Just Staz. They need more, and he's capable of more, and I put that on both Sacco and Stastny.

Quote:

Originally Posted by avs1dacup (Post 60287069)
This I actually disagree with. There have been plenty of periods throughout his tenure that the team has played strong in all three zones. They are very capable of playing a strong game, however, we haven't seen it for a full 60 minutes nor stretches of games. I think this falls onto a bigger reason that he's not a good coach and that's his inability to adjust both on the fly in between periods.

I really disagree with this. They're lucky if they can play one period of solid all around hockey. Otherwise they're being too aggressive and too wide open, leading to break downs and too many quality chances against, or they're playing too simple and dumping it in, and getting no real quality chances of their own.

He can't find a balance to save his life. He lets them open it up when it wins games, and then when it naturally starts to lose them games, he has them tighten it up, and then they can't score. He has no strategy or system. He's not proactive, he's reactive, and can't get them to play consistent winning hockey.

CalderKing21 02-23-2013 12:02 AM

no, no love whatsoever.
he's been the coach for too long for this team to look clueless on offense, defense, power play and penalty kill.
we have a 2 on 1 or 3 on 2 and dump the puck in instead of creating on offense.

Hans Landaskog 02-23-2013 12:04 AM

This team lacks intensity from the people they need intensity from, Sacco included. As was said, Stastny is just Stastny, and Sacco shows little to no emotion.

Av-merican 02-23-2013 12:22 AM

Too many of his moves scream "amateur hour" to me, which wouldn't bother me if this were his first season, but he's still doing them in his FOURTH year.

1. Rewards effort over smart play. This is the only explanation as to why Hunwick keeps getting big minutes.

2. Never, ever, EVER changes a lineup after a win, no matter how bad some players may have played in that win. Only when injuries force his hand does he switch players out following a W.

I'll at least give him credit for employing a fun brand of hockey when given the right tools to do so. I don't think there are many here who can say he's been given the proper talent to succeed, especially this year. That all said, it's just my opinion that he's not the guy to take them to the next level. Barring another plummet to the bottom of the standing, I imagine he'll be the guy once again come 2013-14. But if he stumbles THEN, I don't think he'll last long at all. Injuries, Varlamov's play, and the boundless determination of Matt Duchene have more or less saved his job so far this season.

Bonzai12 02-23-2013 12:23 AM

Sacco does a hell of a job collecting top picks for us. He should get credit where it's due.

Hans Landaskog 02-23-2013 12:24 AM

The way this team plays sometimes, I'd swear Sacco slipped them some Xanax or something.

squirrelbait 02-23-2013 01:39 AM

Yeah just need to watch the team play to understand how well the team is being coached.

We can look at numbers, like the hunwick playing time, or breaking up the barrie hedja pairing when it was playing well to put barrie with hunwick. things like that are obvious.

But from shift to shift we look underdone. Not enough quality practice is going on. The number of off-target passes, fumbled pucks, turnovers and giveaways. Inability to get set up in the offensive zone, inability to clear pucks. Poor transition game, poor breakouts. The slow or non-existent or regression of unfortunately most players, or at least the streakiness. The fact that so many people hit posts or miss nets with shots. Then the powerplay and penalty killing. So passive on the penalty kill, then when we are on the powerplay we are either struggling out of our own zone or playing along the boards as though we were at five on five.

Complete inability to change and adjust gameplans to suit the flow of the game. And how often are we getting scored on at the end of the period? Sometimes at the end of every period in a game. How often do we come out after a break and get scored on. Look at the flow of most games this year. We will play at the start but if we go a goal up we switch off. That attitude can be coached out of the team. That game against Edmonton we were up 4-1 and getting hammered. Sacco let them sit back and play placid for 2 periods before the got to 4-4, then he calls a timeout to talk to the team. He should have called a time out when it was 4-3 and we were obviously struggling with only minutes to go. But no. It's clear Sacco isn't saying the right things, he's not drilling them correctly at practice. Just need to look at the quality of every other opposition when it comes to passing. That's the stuff you get better at with proper, effective practice. You can't really practice high energy, you just have to get out there and do that. It's hard to coach talent as well. But you can coach players to have more finesse and to get passes right. Just compare our passing game to any other team. There's a world of difference and the difference is adequate coaching.

I think he's not a great coach.

The Kingslayer 02-23-2013 01:42 AM

He's terrible

JoemAvs 02-23-2013 02:00 AM

Yeah give some love to the worst coach in the league...

Now he even fails at tanking.....

Av-merican 02-23-2013 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoemAvs (Post 60290123)
Yeah give some love to the worst coach in the league...

Now he even fails at tanking.....

I can't do anything wrong...

http://thepolkadotpalace.files.wordp...ce_dating1.jpg

Avsboy 02-23-2013 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foppa2118 (Post 60286773)
Nope.

He can't get top guys like Stasnty and Jones to play to the level and consistency needed. PP and PK aren't good enough. He can't find a balance between generating offense and good nuetral zone, and defensive play.

He's a good guy and a players coach, but he can't teach this team how to be better. That's the problem. They need tutelage.

There's the problem. He also can't figure out how to engage the defence in moving the puck.

dahrougem2 02-23-2013 02:38 AM

He can't figure out how to beat the NW division. If Sacco's family was kidnapped and the only way to get them back was to have a winning record against the NW division I fear he would never be able to see his family again. The guy just does not make adjustments, be it before games, in-game, or after games that lead up to the next meeting; he sticks with the same game plan and its no wonder we are the Canucks' whipping boys, used to be the Flames' whipping boys as well, are the Oilers' whipping boys in Edmonton, and are ok against Minnesota somehow which boggles my mind

Grackle Party 02-23-2013 02:41 AM

Look at Sacco's division record.

Colorado Avalanche 02-23-2013 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grackle Party (Post 60290601)
Look at Sacco's division record.

This. We need to get better against our own division. We suck. That's already reason to fire him.

Ceremony 02-23-2013 07:26 AM

This teams wins in spite of Sacco, not because of him.

Razor29 02-23-2013 08:21 AM

The only reason he is over 0.500 is because of Anderson.

Not a good coach, has no idea what he is doing a lot of the time.

"4th line player made a good play, hell he sure would look great next to Stastny" - Sacco
"Stastny is a ****ing bum" - HF

the_fan 02-23-2013 08:52 AM

The biggest issue with Sacco is consistency. Some games Avs come out and play a solid game where it looks like the team has been properly practiced and ready to play.

But most games this team looks clueless. Their PP and PK is awful where they give up easy PP goals against, yet when they get a PP they have no clue what to do, and in general the team just lacks effort and heart. And all this is on coaching.

If this team shows they can put in solid effort as some games shown they can, they should be doing it more often. Sacco's problem is, he can't get his team to play solid in more consistent bases, and that's why this team needs a new coach.

And in games where Avs can't get anything going, i think Sacco might be the worst coach in the league who makes adjustments during games.

Heebs21* 02-23-2013 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foppa2118 (Post 60286773)
Nope.

He can't get top guys like Stasnty and Jones to play to the level and consistency needed. PP and PK aren't good enough. He can't find a balance between generating offense and good nuetral zone, and defensive play.

He's a good guy and a players coach, but he can't teach this team how to be better. That's the problem. They need tutelage.

So you think a coach who has to throw out Palushaj - Mitchell - Hedjuk as a 2nd unit should be able to make them have success?

This team does not have the players needed to contend especially on the back end. If anyone should get blame it's Sherman for not giving Sacco the players needed to succeed. That and we have an owner who refuses to spend money and is happy with a team being at the cap floor.

I think it is amazing that we are still a .500 team with the players we have lost and our terrible D- corps.

Sacco is not the one playing an he cant turn a piece of ***** into a diamond.

Razor29 02-23-2013 09:33 AM

He doesn't have to put out those 3 as a unit. There is nothing wrong with Duke or Palushaj on the 2nd unit anyways.

McGinn - Duchene - Parenteau
Palushaj/Hejduk - Stastny - Jones

Landeskog is back now so he will push out someone.


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