HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   Prospects (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Is Yakupov really the best player [highest potential ceiling] out of the 2012 draft? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1359917)

Riddum 02-25-2013 11:49 AM

Is Yakupov really the best player [highest potential ceiling] out of the 2012 draft?
 
I've watched a lot of Oilers games this year and I honestly don't feel like Yakupov will as good as he's touted to be. Also, his potential isn't as high as people claim. Before I get flammed to death, listen to me.

He reminds me of a poor man's Ovi who doesn't have the size. It's kind of like how Afinogenov was a bankrupt man's Pavel Bure. We all know how difficult it is to score goals these days. The way he played in the OHL won't translate well into the NHL. He does have an amazing nose for the net. Great speed and a great shot.

I look at his play away from the puck and it's not very impressive either. [Yes, he's only 19 and has PLENTY time to improve]. But I see him as a 30-35G 40-45A 70-75 pts guy MAX at the peak of his career.

People were saying that this guy is a future multiple times 50G+ and 50A+ type of talent but I don't see it. Not in this era of hockey.

SephF 02-25-2013 11:53 AM

He's had a better start to his rookie year then Taylor Hall if that eases your concerns at all. I think he has all the tools to be the best goal scorer on the Oilers.

Riddum 02-25-2013 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SephF (Post 60438759)
He's had a better start to his rookie year then Taylor Hall if that eases your concerns at all. I think he has all the tools to be the best goal scorer on the Oilers.

But guys like Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin are good but they simply are not in the same class as guys like Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin ect... these guys are at least 2 or 3 levels above.

Pay Carl 02-25-2013 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60438941)
But guys like Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin are good but they simply are not in the same class as guys like Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby, ect... these guys are at least 2 or 3 levels above.

Were people even saying Yakupov would be on the Stamkos level?

I dont think so

Morlu 02-25-2013 11:59 AM

No Galchenyuk, Reily, Murray, Grigorenko and a few others have extremely high ceilings. If they reach them they will be better than Yukapov. Nail is the best player at the moment but that may or may not change.

Christmas Izzy 02-25-2013 12:00 PM

Murray has a higher ceiling.
Yak is a safer pick though.

Defense are a risky pick as it takes longer for them to develop.

WarriorofTime 02-25-2013 12:02 PM

Actually got very strong numbers for a rookie playing on the 2nd line. His ice time gets limited because RNH, Eberle, and Hall are all already there not to mention Hemsky, Horcoff, and Gagner are all currently ahead of him in terms of Powerplay Ice time. I would expect his ice time to rise in the upcoming years and then we can really see his potential. Comparing him to players who were put on the 1st line right away is unfair.

AUAIOMRN 02-25-2013 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60438941)
But guys like Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin are good but they simply are not in the same class as guys like Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin ect... these guys are at least 2 or 3 levels above.

None of those players are from the 2012 draft. Maybe you forgot what you actually asked?

Riddum 02-25-2013 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wKetch22 (Post 60438987)
Were people even saying Yakupov would be on the Stamkos level?

I dont think so

Most expert predicted a rookie season hovering around 30+goals and 35+ assists. (for a full 80)

They also predicted a sophomore season of around 50 goals and 40+ assists. This is the general consensus. That would put him at Stamkos level.

Riddum 02-25-2013 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morlu (Post 60439001)
No Galchenyuk, Reily, Murray, Grigorenko and a few others have extremely high ceilings. If they reach them they will be better than Yukapov. Nail is the best player at the moment but that may or may not change.

I honestly don't even think he's the best player right now. And he's in a better situation than other players.

Dr Gonzo 02-25-2013 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60439261)
Most expert predicted a rookie season hovering around 30+goals and 35+ assists. (for a full 80)

They also predicted a sophomore season of around 50 goals and 40+ assists. This is the general consensus. That would put him at Stamkos level.


I don't remember any experts predicting a PPG rookie year for Yakupov. Some fans said it for sure, but fans say crazy things.

I also don't remember any 100 point sophomore year predictions either to be honest.

Marlo Stanfield 02-25-2013 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fst6 (Post 60439021)
Murray has a higher ceiling.
Yak is a safer pick though.


Defense are a risky pick as it takes longer for them to develop.

Wasn't the bolded the other way around with Murray being an overall safe bet and Yak having high ceiling/potential?

jmart21 02-25-2013 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fst6 (Post 60439021)
Murray has a higher ceiling.
Yak is a safer pick though.

Defense are a risky pick as it takes longer for them to develop.

I wouldn't say this is the case at all. Murray's ceiling isn't as high as any of the other top 5 picks, but he was essentially a guaranteed quality NHL'er.

Lebanese Leaf 02-25-2013 12:15 PM

Galchenyuk and Rielly have higher ceilings.

Christmas Izzy 02-25-2013 12:15 PM

The way a defenseman develops late, its way more of a shot in the dark as to how good they become. Murray is more ahead of other defense in terms of NHL calibre play than Yak is for other forwards. But, making a roster as a forward is slightly easier coming out of the draft.

Toydarian 02-25-2013 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60439261)
Most expert predicted a rookie season hovering around 30+goals and 35+ assists. (for a full 80)

They also predicted a sophomore season of around 50 goals and 40+ assists. This is the general consensus. That would put him at Stamkos level.

And yet Stamkos had a rookie season of 23G, 46PTS in 79 games as a rookie (also -13). Yakupov is actually tracking to have an identical rookie season (pro-rated 79 games).

I'm not posting this to say Yakupov will be as good as Stamkos. I am posting this, because nobody has any idea how good Yakupov will or won't be.

BobDobolina 02-25-2013 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60438615)
People were saying that this guy is a future multiple times 50G+ and 50A+ type of talent but I don't see it. Not in this era of hockey.

Stuff like this is extremely subjective. "People" say all kinds of things around here.

Show me examples of actual hockey people saying that please.

deckercky 02-25-2013 12:23 PM

A large factor in the consensus #1 overall is their current NHL readiness. It reduces the total bust risk to very little. They obviously also have a high ceiling, but not necessarily the highest.

Yakupov doesn't strike me as the kind of player who'll be a 100 pt player, but there's the potential. However, I think he's very likely to have some 70-80 pt seasons, which is about all you can hope for.

I also think last year's draft was strange in that a lot of highly ranked players who were expected to challenge for #1 were injured, many with serious injuries.

But in terms of hype, Yakupov wasn't anywhere near the level of Tavares, who was granted exceptional status to enter the OHL early, nor did he have the hype of Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, etc.. He may end up being on or near that level - I don't think Stamkos had as much hype as the above players but he's certainly proven that he's on their level.

4ORRBRUIN 02-25-2013 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf (Post 60439733)
Galchenyuk and Rielly have higher ceilings.

Is this a joke ?

GordieHoweHatTrick 02-25-2013 12:29 PM

It's nearly impossible to tell a rookies career trajectory. All I know is that he is a fitness freak and dedicated to being in the gym so he may take a Stamkos-like next step

5RingsAndABeer 02-25-2013 12:32 PM

No, somehow 15 productive NHL games have gone against what every professional scout at the draft thought regarding Yakupov's career potential.

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=142
Quote:

Originally Posted by nexttothemoon
For the hell of it I looked up a few of the various ranking services (note to the mods... found all these ranks listed online (including on NHL.com so I'm not violating any copyrights here).


Here's 12 various ranking lists:

A Craig Button
B Bob Mackenzie (aggregate of ~10 NHL scouts)
C ISS
D MyNHLDraft
E Future Considerations
F NHL Central Scouting
G Redline Report
H Hockey Prospectus
I The Scouting Report
J The Hockey Writers
K The Hockey News
L McKeen’s Hockey


Yakupov
A 1
B 1
C 1
D 1
E 1
F 1 NA skater
G 1
H 1
I 1
J 1
K 1
L 1
Average: 1.0

Forsberg
A 7
B 4
C 2
D 5
E 5
F 1 Euro Skater
G 2
H 4
I 2
J 5
K 2
L 3
Ave: 3.5

Murray
A 13
B 3
C 3
D 2
E 3
F 2 NA Skater
G 4
H 8
I 4
J 3
K 4
L 4
Ave: 4.42

Galchenyuk
A 4
B 6
C 14
D 3
E 2
F 4 NA Skater
G 6
H 3
I 3
J 6
K 7
L 2
Ave: 5.0

Grigorenko
A 20
B 2
C 4
D 4
E 4
F 3 NA Skater
G 8
H 2
I 5
J 4
K 3
L 9
Ave: 5.67

Dumba
A 2
B 5
C 6
D 6
E 10
F 11 NA Skater
G 3
H 6
I 7
J 2
K 5
L 6
Ave: 5.75

Rielly
A 3
B 9
C 7
D 9
E 9
F 5 NA Skater
G 7
H 7
I 6
J 8
K 6
L 8
Ave: 7.0

Teravainen
A 5
B 10
C 8
D 8
E 8
F 2 Euro Skater
G 5
H 5
I 11
J 7
K 12
L 5
Ave: 7.17

Reinhart
A 6
B 8
C 10
D 7
E 7
F 10 NA Skater
G 9
H 15
I 10
J 9
K 8
L 7
Ave: 8.83

Trouba
A 12
B 7
C 5
D 10
E 6
F 9 NA Skater
G 11
H 12
I 9
J 13
K 9
L 10
Ave: 9.42



Notice a common trend with Yakupov compared to everyone else?


He's CLEARLY and unanimously the #1 pick. It's not even close to being close. When you do hear someone say something about the gap between Yak and the rest of the pack they sometimes say the gap isn't as big as some suggest, but literally NO reputable source says that there isn't a gap there... large or small it certainly exists as he's the CLEAR #1.


dss97 02-25-2013 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebanese Leaf (Post 60439733)
Galchenyuk and Rielly have higher ceilings.

:laugh:

Sure though, Galch could end up being the best player from the draft, but there is no way the Oilers were going to use a 1st overall pick on a player that played 2 regular season games. The only players the Oilers considered at all for 1st overall were Yak, Murray, Grigorenko, and I think Reinhart.

Riddum 02-25-2013 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toydarian (Post 60439897)
And yet Stamkos had a rookie season of 23G, 46PTS in 79 games as a rookie (also -13). Yakupov is actually tracking to have an identical rookie season (pro-rated 79 games).

I'm not posting this to say Yakupov will be as good as Stamkos. I am posting this, because nobody has any idea how good Yakupov will or won't be.

Stamkos' coach was trying to make it a point to show that "Stamkos wasn't NHL Ready". He was completely wrong and that's why he was fired.

Yakupov is in a much better environment to work in though. The Oilers basically gave the team to the young guns.

PumpkinBomb 02-25-2013 12:43 PM

As a scout you look at a few things:

1.) Who has the biggest toolbox
2.) are they currently putting it together
3.) will they put it together in the future

Yakupov probably has the best shot of any players in the draft. (I don't know this for sure because i haven't seen the whole draft, but his shot is amazing)

He can play with the puck at top speed. (there are a few other players in the draft that can do this too but there speed isn't the same as Yak so i would put him top at this category as well.)

His size is pretty good (only 5'11' height but his legs are like tree trunks)

He actually plays ok defensively. He's often in the wrong position, but is fast enough to make up fpr it in speed. (He can close gaps really quickly and angle players to the outside, and isn't afraid to get physical.)

I think, for these reasons, that he is the best player in the draft as no one else has all those tools available to them to such a high degree.

Some may argue that Galchenyuk's play making ability will win out, but it all depends on how the player is used, and a one-shot scorer is very hard to come by.

He's actually at his best when he's rushing the puck through the neutral zone. (He's too fast to be the late high guy, coming in for the 1 timer, so he's best used to rush the puck, dish it off and then get in a spot for the return pass)

The problem is on line 1 that's Hall's role, and on line 2 the Oilers' use Hemsky to rush the puck, and Gagner is their set-up man.

Quokka 02-25-2013 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCantHandleMyRiddum (Post 60440985)
Stamkos' coach was trying to make it a point to show that "Stamkos wasn't NHL Ready". He was completely wrong and that's why he was fired.

Yakupov is in a much better environment to work in though. The Oilers basically gave the team to the young guns.

I don't think Yakupov is in as good of an environment as you seem to suggest. Yakupov plays most games on his off-wing and had been playing with Gagner and Hemsky who make nearly as many defensive errors as Yakupov does. If he was playing on RW with at least one defensively responsible forward then maybe you could say he has it easy.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:51 AM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.