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-   -   Speculation: In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) XXXIII ‎ (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1363783)

RockLobster 03-01-2013 01:32 PM

In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) XXXIII ‎
 
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S E P H 03-01-2013 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronaldo (Post 60741133)
Im talking about when leaf fans made proposals avs fans laughed at them and now those proposals are considered more than fair. If I were the leafs I wouldnt trade gardnier for stastny.

Sorry, but IMO I want no part of the MaCarthurs', Kulemins', Fransons', Holzers', Gunnarssons', Kostkas, and Liles' of that team and I think Stastny is worth much more than all those players the Leaf fans kept demanding to trade.

Also cancel the good value from Habs, I didn't realize they were that old.

TwoPadStack 03-01-2013 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freaky Styley (Post 60741231)
If anything, O'Reilly should fire his agent. He let him play those games in Russia which made him privy to this rule, and still allowed him to negotiate and offer sheet when he really had no power to. Could have ended up playing 2 years in Columbus, a team he didn't negotiate with at all.

That's crazy. If I'm Ryan O'Reilly, I might give my agent a contract for the rest of my playing career. They stuck to their guns and he's either going to get a $6.7m qualifying offer next summer, or become the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age.

Why in the world would he fire him?

Av-merican 03-01-2013 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60741681)
That's crazy. If I'm Ryan O'Reilly, I might give my agent a contract for the rest of my playing career. They stuck to their guns and he's either going to get a $6.7m qualifying offer next summer, or become the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age.

Why in the world would he fire him?

Agreed. That's just silly talk. I don't think O'Reilly would've cared if he ended up in Columbus. That's a team with three first rounders in this year's draft and one of the best talent evaluators in NHL history now running the show.

O'Reilly's agent apparently schooled TWO front office bosses. If anything, that's grounds for a bigger cut.

Bubba Thudd 03-01-2013 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60741681)
That's crazy. If I'm Ryan O'Reilly, I might give my agent a contract for the rest of my playing career. They stuck to their guns and he's either going to get a $6.7m qualifying offer next summer, or become the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age.

Why in the world would he fire him?

Unless he lives up to the hype, I don't know that he'll become "the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age".

26, 26, and 55 points isn't the kind of production that will have people lining up to pay 6.7M, regardless of his other intangibles or character.

RockLobster 03-01-2013 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60741681)
That's crazy. If I'm Ryan O'Reilly, I might give my agent a contract for the rest of my playing career. They stuck to their guns and he's either going to get a $6.7m qualifying offer next summer, or become the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age.

Why in the world would he fire him?

I hope you'll answer this question, and I hope that it hasn't been asked (I've been at work all morning and had no time to skim the threads).

In your opinion only, based on what limited talks you've had with Ryan, he's saying the right words publically, that he's happy to be back playing for the Avalanche fans. Do you feel that there's a legitimate chance that whatever "bad blood" that had come up during negotiations CAN be smoothed over?

TwoPadStack 03-01-2013 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubba Thudd (Post 60741877)
Unless he lives up to the hype, I don't know that he'll become "the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age".

26, 26, and 55 points isn't the kind of production that will have people lining up to pay 6.7M, regardless of his other intangibles or character.

He will be an UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENT. The $6.7m is irrelevant at that point; that was the number the Avs would choose not to submit a QO for. He could sign a 10 year/$50m contract with a team, the $6.7m is irrelevant.

As a UFA, he hits the market and is instantly the most attractive UFA at that age... EVER. No bones about it. Schultz multiplied by 10.

TwoPadStack 03-01-2013 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockLobster (Post 60741925)
I hope you'll answer this question, and I hope that it hasn't been asked (I've been at work all morning and had no time to skim the threads).

In your opinion only, based on what limited talks you've had with Ryan, he's saying the right words publically, that he's happy to be back playing for the Avalanche fans. Do you feel that there's a legitimate chance that whatever "bad blood" that had come up during negotiations CAN be smoothed over?

The bad blood is with Sherman and the suits.

I've said it many times... Sacco loves O'Reilly and O'Reilly loves playing for Sacco. How Sacco values players is VERY DIFFERENT from how our management values them. They are not on the same page with that.

I don't think the bad blood goes away just like that, but the faces he will be seeing are those of people who appreciate him and recognize his importance; not the suits.

Bubba Thudd 03-01-2013 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60741941)
He will be an UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENT. The $6.7m is irrelevant at that point; that was the number the Avs would choose not to submit a QO for. He could sign a 10 year/$50m contract with a team, the $6.7m is irrelevant.

As a UFA, he hits the market and is instantly the most attractive UFA at that age... EVER. No bones about it. Schultz multiplied by 10.

Really? Even if he stays on the 3rd line, and puts up another 26 point season next year?

Av-merican 03-01-2013 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubba Thudd (Post 60742069)
Really? Even if he stays on the 3rd line, and puts up another 26 point season next year?

He won't.

Avs 03-01-2013 01:44 PM

O'Reilly better put up 35 points the rest of this season and be a damn PPG player next year.

I still don't think in any universe is this guy worth $6.5 mil.

TwoPadStack 03-01-2013 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubba Thudd (Post 60742069)
Really? Even if he stays on the 3rd line, and puts up another 26 point season next year?

Based on several posts of yours today, it's clear that you want to send a message and prove a point as opposed to winning hockey games.

- Put O'Reilly on the wing
- Give him crap wingers

Now this 26 point season crap... what's the point? Did he put up 26 points last year? No, he didn't, and I didn't see Stastny and Duchene out all year. Ryan O'Reilly EARNED the first line centre spot last year, right from day one of training camp.

Put the emotions to the side, BT. This is a business. It's unfortunate the way you're looking at things.

Av-merican 03-01-2013 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs (Post 60742161)
O'Reilly better put up 35 points the rest of this season and be a damn PPG player next year.

I still don't think in any universe is this guy worth $6.5 mil.

Sucks to be you then. I think I'll just ask that O'Reilly make this team substantially better. I don't give a damn how many or how few points he puts up.

RockLobster 03-01-2013 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60742045)
The bad blood is with Sherman and the suits.

I've said it many times... Sacco loves O'Reilly and O'Reilly loves playing for Sacco. How Sacco values players is VERY DIFFERENT from how our management values them. They are not on the same page with that.

I don't think the bad blood goes away just like that, but the faces he will be seeing are those of people who appreciate him and recognize his importance; not the suits.

Well obviously I don't expect him to show up to Denver today and shake Greg Sherman's, and all the other "suits" as you put it, hand and have a smile on his face and say "All is now forgiven".

But I guess mine was more of a question of you knowing him and if you believe if there's a chance that he and the Avs can now be grown ups about this and move forward, keeping him on the team as a legitimate Core player (as Sherman even identified him as last night)?

Basically I'm glad he's back with us, but in 2 years I don't want to go through this again, and I doubt Ryan or the Avs Brass do either, so I was curious your opinion on if it can be smoothed over over that time?

Avs 03-01-2013 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Av-merican (Post 60742291)
Sucks to be you then. I think I'll just ask that O'Reilly make this team substantially better. I don't give a damn how many or how few points he puts up.

I mean, I like the guy. His defensive game will definitely make the Avs a better team as a whole IMO. But you don't pay a forward that much money just for his defensive game.

Side note: does he have any experience playing on the wing? Because of how our lines seem to to be starting to click, I don't see Sacco bumping Stastny down to 3C. Obviously we aren't going to start ROR off playing a major role, rather than slowly increasing his role as he starts playing again. But I don't see us getting everything we can out of him if we put him on the third line with 'ehh' wingers.

I really hope I am proved wrong and he shows us that he is worth this contract. I definitely think he has the potential, but he is certainly going to have to earn it.

Lonewolfe2015 03-01-2013 01:52 PM

It's a 6.5mil QO, not 6.7mil. Just fyi...

Avs 03-01-2013 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockLobster (Post 60742305)
Well obviously I don't expect him to show up to Denver today and shake Greg Sherman's, and all the other "suits" as you put it, hand and have a smile on his face and say "All is now forgiven".

But I guess mine was more of a question of you knowing him and if you believe if there's a chance that he and the Avs can now be grown ups about this and move forward, keeping him on the team as a legitimate Core player (as Sherman even identified him as last night)?

Basically I'm glad he's back with us, but in 2 years I don't want to go through this again, and I doubt Ryan or the Avs Brass do either, so I was curious your opinion on if it can be smoothed over over that time?

I think we will definitely be going through this again. If he thinks he was worth $5M before, and now has this contract, I can only imagine what he will want in 2 years if he keeps up his play from last year.

Av-merican 03-01-2013 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockLobster (Post 60742305)
Well obviously I don't expect him to show up to Denver today and shake Greg Sherman's, and all the other "suits" as you put it, hand and have a smile on his face and say "All is now forgiven".

But I guess mine was more of a question of you knowing him and if you believe if there's a chance that he and the Avs can now be grown ups about this and move forward, keeping him on the team as a legitimate Core player (as Sherman even identified him as last night)?

Basically I'm glad he's back with us, but in 2 years I don't want to go through this again, and I doubt Ryan or the Avs Brass do either, so I was curious your opinion on if it can be smoothed over over that time?

Winning fixes everything, mainly because it saves peoples' jobs. If the Avs start winning, and O'Reilly is a big part of that, they'll work something out. If Sherman is stupid and petty enough to actually stick it to the guy he's forking out $9 million to over the next year, then he never deserves another job in hockey at any level.

S E P H 03-01-2013 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avs (Post 60742161)
O'Reilly better put up 35 points the rest of this season and be a damn PPG player next year.

I still don't think in any universe is this guy worth $6.5 mil.

6.5 is far from the bad part considering it evens to the 10 million. The QO is the brutal part and have no idea why effin Feaster would do that, to screw his team (Not in terms of ROR, but their cap situation and the amount of NTC/NMC on that team) over if we didn't match.

Avs 03-01-2013 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S E P H (Post 60743211)
6.5 is far from the bad part considering it evens to the 10 million. The QO is the brutal part and have no idea why effin Feaster would do that, to screw his team (Not in terms of ROR, but their cap situation and the amount of NTC/NMC on that team) over if we didn't match.

I have a feeling they made this offer knowing almost certainly the Avs would match it....

Freaky Styley 03-01-2013 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwoPadStack (Post 60741681)
That's crazy. If I'm Ryan O'Reilly, I might give my agent a contract for the rest of my playing career. They stuck to their guns and he's either going to get a $6.7m qualifying offer next summer, or become the most coveted Unrestricted Free Agent ever at 23 years of age.

Why in the world would he fire him?

It seems pretty clear to me that his agent was in the same boat as Feaster and Sherman with being oblivious to the rule. You don't think he would have been pissed to have to go through waivers and end up with a team that he never intended being on?

Plus, if Sherman and/or Feaster weren't so naive, Sherman could have used this as a huge negotiating tool to get O'Reilly to sign to his demands because IF every team knew the rule, there is no chance they would have signed him to an offer sheet (unless it was Columbus as they are currently 1st in the waiver wire). So basically, it would have been sign with us, or sit. We can trade you, but know you can't sign an offer sheet so there is really no rush for us. Seeing how it's his agent that let him play those 2 KHL games, you'd have to think there could be some backlash for his agent not doing his job.

Top 6 Spaling 03-01-2013 02:20 PM

I assume Stastny is available now? If he is,what are you looking for?

Ellis/Blum+Gaustad+____ as a start from Nashville. We can add more if you eat some salary.

henchman24 03-01-2013 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling (Post 60744277)
I assume Stastny is available now? If he is,what are you looking for?

Ellis/Blum+Gaustad+____ as a start from Nashville. We can add more if you eat some salary.

I'm sure a deal with Nashville could be worked out, but including Gaustad is probably a non starter. Ellis + is a good start though IMO.

Freaky Styley 03-01-2013 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling (Post 60744277)
I assume Stastny is available now? If he is,what are you looking for?

Ellis/Blum+Gaustad+____ as a start from Nashville. We can add more if you eat some salary.

I can't imagine Stastny being available. We are a much better team with our 3 top centers, the only way he is available is what happens with contract negotiations with ROR and him come next year. We can't afford to trade him away, only to have O'Reilly leave at the end of next season.

henchman24 03-01-2013 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freaky Styley (Post 60744443)
I can't imagine Stastny being available. We are a much better team with our 3 top centers, the only way he is available is what happens with contract negotiations with ROR and him come next year. We can't afford to trade him away, only to have O'Reilly leave at the end of next season.

ROR can't leave so easily with him still being a RFA, but the point stands... until we know what both Stastny and ROR want for extensions, it probably isn't wise to trade Stastny.


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