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-   -   Gagner NEEDS to stay an Oiler . . . (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1374027)

oil10 03-12-2013 11:47 AM

Gagner NEEDS to stay an Oiler . . .
 
Gagner's name has been thrown around a lot in trade rumors but I think he NEEDS to stay in Edmonton.

He had a great season last year and has been the best player on the team this year. He is still young, has the experience in the NHL to be a good leader for the new kids ( good veteran for the team) and fits into the future. The Oilers have been developing him from the beginning so why trade him. He shows up every game and he has a lot of heart.

I know that the top 6 needs to get bigger but I would keep Gagner as the #2 C and bring in the big gritty guy to play on the LW.

So ..... they need to look at dealing Hemsky+ for that bigger L-Winger for the 2nd line.

Gagner is a true Oiler !!!

worraps 03-12-2013 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oil10 (Post 61495393)
Gagner's name has been thrown around a lot in trade rumors but I think he NEEDS to stay in Edmonton.

He had a great season last year and has been the best player on the team this year. He is still young, has the experience in the NHL to be a good leader for the new kids ( good veteran for the team) and fits into the future. The Oilers have been developing him from the beginning so why trade him. He shows up every game and he has a lot of heart.

I know that the top 6 needs to get bigger but I would keep Gagner as the #2 C and bring in the big gritty guy to play on the LW.

So ..... they need to look at dealing Hemsky+ for that bigger L-Winger for the 2nd line.

Gagner is a true Oiler !!!

To me: it depends on what he's looking for in his next contract.

oilersfan11 03-12-2013 11:54 AM

Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

KlimasLoveChild 03-12-2013 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

I agree. He can stick around for now but once we become serious he is going to have to go. Sad to say because I love his attitude but too many holes in his game.

worraps 03-12-2013 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KlimasLoveChild (Post 61496015)
I agree. He can stick around for now but once we become serious he is going to have to go. Sad to say because I love his attitude but too many holes in his game.

If he signs a long term deal for $4-$4.5 million he can be a very useful player. No one is trading the Oilers a 2nd line center and anyone drafted is going to need time to develop.

If he signs a decent deal and we are able to draft a replacement for him he can shift over to wing, 3C, or get traded.

Psycho Dad 03-12-2013 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

No, you actually should KEEP your skill players if you ever want to make the playoffs.

Halibut 03-12-2013 12:12 PM

It would be nice if he did but I dont think it's a need. At this point the team has been horrendous for an awful long time, nobody is untouchable. If you can find a deal that fills some of the holes on this team you do it of course the problem is trade him away and 2nd line center just became a massive hole so you better be filling in the right holes and have a plan to fill in the one you are creating.

Booya42 03-12-2013 12:23 PM

Hmm 2nd line C that's sitting tied for 28th overall in pts in the entire league...at a .92 ppg pace....F** it, he's worthless on a Stanley Cup challenging team.

Oh...he's only 23 with 6 years of NHL experience already...nope don't need him. He's not going to get any better...it's not like he hasn't improved over last year...wait... he has? That much huh....?
Oh well...he's too small to be effective..what? he's 5'10-5'11 but weighs in at 199lbs? Nah, he's useless...seriously. We'll never win with him in the lineup.

Declassified 03-12-2013 12:32 PM

Agreed, he must have a place on this team going forward

Replacement 03-12-2013 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Booya42 (Post 61497311)
Hmm 2nd line C that's sitting tied for 28th overall in pts in the entire league...at a .92 ppg pace....F** it, he's worthless on a Stanley Cup challenging team.

Oh...he's only 23 with 6 years of NHL experience already...nope don't need him. He's not going to get any better...it's not like he hasn't improved over last year...wait... he has? That much huh....?
Oh well...he's too small to be effective..what? he's 5'10-5'11 but weighs in at 199lbs? Nah, he's useless...seriously. We'll never win with him in the lineup.

The sarcasm button is stuck..;)

Koto 03-12-2013 12:37 PM

Yeah, he does. Not because hes that great or anything, but because we need to keep all our actual NHL players.

Now for most of these guys you could theoretically say "we could trade him for another actual NHL player" but Gagner is complicated, because hes a center, and a bona-fide (if inconsistent) top-6C. So if we traded him, that would immediately become our biggest hole and its pretty hard to imagine being able to trade him for an upgrade at that exact position.





Quote:

Originally Posted by worraps (Post 61495513)
To me: it depends on what he's looking for in his next contract.

To a certain extent yes, but we can't just say we'll live without him, because he doesnt take a discount and stay at the 4M cap number we all thought was reasonable previous to this year.


If he keeps this pace up he will be looking for minimum 5 in the summer, and if we dont give him that with term, he will go to arbitration, and be a UFA next summer.

If he kept this pace up again next year, he'd be taking a discount to settle for the 6M, and could fetch 7M on the open market.


I know this doesn't coincide very well with many of the posters thoughts, but if he played at .9 PPG for a year and a half, and was coming off a 70P season as a 25YO UFA, he'd get a hell of a deal from many teams in the league.


I was really hoping last summer we would lock him into some sort of 4x4.5. Well the price has certainly gone up, and i think we'd be wise to give him something like 5x5 this summer.


Could be 8x6 the year after. Hell even if regresses next year to only 50P, he'll still be getting at minimum 5x5 as a UFA.



Pay the man now, its the best deal your going to get, and losing him (like Smid) would be a big step back. You aren't just going to be able to pick up UFA's to replace him (them).

Koto 03-12-2013 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by worraps (Post 61496421)
If he signs a long term deal for $4-$4.5 million he can be a very useful player. No one is trading the Oilers a 2nd line center and anyone drafted is going to need time to develop.

If he signs a decent deal and we are able to draft a replacement for him he can shift over to wing, 3C, or get traded.



good luck getting that deal. if he says no to that, takes you to arbitration, then goes ufa, what are you going to do? put another rookie in? sell for futures?



pay up. the sooner the better.

Six in O6 03-12-2013 12:58 PM

Dead wrong. He can stay if he likes 4.0 to 4.5M x 3, 4, 5, 6 years. He is clearly part of the future with this team, but as a second line centre. If he recognizes that and wants to play the part, good. The problem is right now he is carrying a lot of the load offensively, which is great but he is ultimately a complementary player (albeit an important one).

5RingsAndABeer 03-12-2013 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

Disagreed.

I'm guessing you think we need size in the top 6. http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...s-slow-big-ice

jadeddog 03-12-2013 01:01 PM

the second we make a trade that involves gagner and *doesn't* bring back a 2nd line C, is the second we start looking for a replacement for gagner, and the #2 C becomes the teams biggest need

unless we are trading gagner plus somebody else, and in return getting a larger #2 C back with some offence to his game, it's a stupid move

the wrench in all this is of course what he wants for a contract... if he think's he should be paid like the hall/eberle, then we obviously have to look at trading him... but if we can sign him for around 4-4.5, then you simply have to sign that contract

OiledUp 03-12-2013 01:23 PM

Yeah it's strange. On one hand everyone says we need veterans and guys who are solid NHLers so that the prospects won't get thrown into the fire and on the other hand a lot of guys want to trade away our almost PPG 2C with six years of NHL experience who rarely gets injured and is finally finding consistency because he's "too small" which is kind of an exaggeration to start with.

He still needs to improve his defensive positioning and overall defensive play but other than that he's starting to really come around. And he's 23. Unless we get something really good back we shouldn't trade him and unless he demands a clear overpayment we need to resign him.

It's a shame he's having the year he's having since he might be looking for a bit of a payday. Hopefully he takes a hometown discount since he's played here for so long and/or that they can sell him the "once the kids grow up we'll be an annual contender" mantra.

AlowlyOilersfan 03-12-2013 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if he ever wants to win a cup.


subtle fix ;)

loller12 03-12-2013 01:33 PM

Yup, typical oiler fans wanting to trade your #1 goal scorer away so we can tank again ffs. without Gags the oilers would be dead last and probably 10 points below Florida.

Tad Mikowsky 03-12-2013 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

Trade him for more draft picks right?

Let's trade one of the skilled guys for the never ending rebuild.

Great logic.

jukon 03-12-2013 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

I would like to keep Gagner but for him to stay he needs to be:
1- Better at faceoffs
2- Better defensively
3- Reasonably priced

Neilio 03-12-2013 01:38 PM

"Our center depth is terrible! We need to get rid of one of our best centers to fix it!"

Without Gagner, this team is at the bottom with a bullet. As much as I'd like to see us have a big 2C that everyone dreams of, its not going to happen. There aren't any available, and if there were Tambo wouldn't pull the trigger.

That leaves the draft, but chances are, even if we get one of the top guys, we're not going to be able to depend on them for 3-4 years. Realistically, Ganger is here for another contract. I don't mind that. We haven't seen his best years yet and he's getting close to delivering them.

Tad Mikowsky 03-12-2013 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loller12 (Post 61500841)
Yup, typical oiler fans wanting to trade your #1 goal scorer away so we can tank again ffs. without Gags the oilers would be dead last and probably 10 points below Florida.

Seriously that is the one guy's prerogative

Matt19Oilers 03-12-2013 01:41 PM

Who says we can't win with Gagner? His game has taken a big step this year, i wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility for him to keep rounding out his overall game to the point where he is adequate on faceoffs and defensively. The guy is still only 23 years old and seemingly has an endless amount of desire to improve his game. His faceoffs are still a cause for concern of course, but even if he can't improve them, who's to say he can't play the wing long term with a bigger 2C.

Either way, I think this guy looks like an ideal 2nd line player, whether it be at center with a big winger or on the wing with a big center: of course provided that he can improve his two way play, which I think he can. Despite the need for size here you can't just go blindly selling off players that can give you 65 points.

Koto 03-12-2013 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jadeddog (Post 61499259)
the second we make a trade that involves gagner and *doesn't* bring back a 2nd line C, is the second we start looking for a replacement for gagner, and the #2 C becomes the teams biggest need

unless we are trading gagner plus somebody else, and in return getting a larger #2 C back with some offence to his game, it's a stupid move

the wrench in all this is of course what he wants for a contract... if he think's he should be paid like the hall/eberle, then we obviously have to look at trading him... but if we can sign him for around 4-4.5, then you simply have to sign that contract

Quote:

Originally Posted by Six in O6 (Post 61499119)
Dead wrong. He can stay if he likes 4.0 to 4.5M x 3, 4, 5, 6 years. He is clearly part of the future with this team, but as a second line centre. If he recognizes that and wants to play the part, good. The problem is right now he is carrying a lot of the load offensively, which is great but he is ultimately a complementary player (albeit an important one).

Quote:

Originally Posted by jukon (Post 61501091)
I would like to keep Gagner but for him to stay he needs to be:
1- Better at faceoffs
2- Better defensively
3- Reasonably priced

So if doesn't submit to your every demand and sign below market value, you are prepared to sell him for futures and go with Horcoff, Belanger, and Lander as our 2-4C next year?

meanwhile there is no help in sight (maybe another rookie...or 5)


We sure know the fix isn't coming coming from UFA's.

oil10 03-12-2013 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilersfan11 (Post 61495799)
Gagner needs to go if we ever want to win a cup.

LOL ...... :laugh: ........ I don't think Gagner is the problem there.

You probably were thinking of Smyth, Belanger or Whitney.

Don't worry mistakes happen . . . .

Usually you try to keep the better players on the team.


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