HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=3)
-   -   Thank Holmgren for the Flyers Poor Performance (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1375563)

Accelleratii 03-14-2013 01:28 AM

Thank Holmgren for the Flyers Poor Performance
 
The Flyers are a wreck. Anyone who watches hockey can see it. They have ZERO transition game, their team D is terrible and Timonen is the second highest scoring Dman in za league because...well, he's the only one capable of moving the puck up ice from the back end.

Who can we blame?

Paul Holmgrem. He has mismanaged this hockey club. Going hard for Parise and Suter (we all knew they were signing in Minny) and that offer sheet Nashville had to match, he completely overlooked what he had. Matt Carle, albeit prone to turnovers, could move the puck up ice and they simply let him walk. In the NHL you absolutely need a good transition game and the Flyers deserve to be in the bottom third of the league because the simply lack it.

In Richards and Carter he traded offense for offense. He could've easily requested the services of J Johnson from LA in the Richards deal instead of the pick and Simmonds. Schenn, Simmonds and Voracek are all great hockey players and have provided plentiful offense but sheesh, that D sure looks bad!

Yet again a Flyers GM has overlooked the defense and he ought to fix it sooner then later for our sake and his own.

So if you were GM of Flyers, what would you do?

Vankiller Whale 03-14-2013 01:29 AM

Trade Couturier + Coburn for Yandle

Or go after someone like Byfuglien. Basically an impact 40+ point defenseman.

Marlo Stanfield 03-14-2013 01:35 AM

Jack Johsnon, Keith Yandle, Mike Green, Dustin Byfuglien, Dmitri Kulikov.

Get one for something around Couts+ or your 1st+

LORD COMCAST 03-14-2013 01:38 AM

hate how you want. they deserve it. the team sucks at the moment.

but recognize that the roster's great. their top 9 forwards annihilate pretty much the rest of the league's.

the team needs a new goaltending tandem, some defensive help, and a new gameplan. but they're still closer to a Cup than most of the teams ahead of them.

danishh 03-14-2013 01:43 AM

i think the roster is fine. The issue is goaltending and a system that doesnt fit the roster. The dmen arnt that bad, they just need a coach who's going to make them look good.

My bet would be a coaching change first, and maybe amnesty bryz, if snider can swallow that pill.

Tender Rip 03-14-2013 01:43 AM

Niskanen for Simmonds. Helps the transition game and diminishes the cap-headaches of next season.

You're welcome, Paul :).

Juxtaposer 03-14-2013 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Rip (Post 61621819)
Niskanen for Simmonds. Helps the transition game and diminishes the cap-headaches of next season.

You're welcome, Paul :).

If Shero got Neal and Simmonds for Goligoski, I might cry and quit being a hockey fan. :laugh:

Seriously, who's available?

King'sPawn 03-14-2013 01:55 AM

Bear in mind at the time Richards was traded, Doughty was still unsigned and Johnson was the cornerstone defenseman until Doughty was locked up. Voynov was also unproven. It wasn't until training camp, when Voynov filled in nicely during Doughty's absence, that the Kings brass were comfortable with calling him up and eventually shipping Johnson out.

So... the Flyers likely would not have been able to acquire Johnson at the time of the Richards trade. Pronger was also healthy at the time.

I still think the Flyers made a mistake by trading Richards and Carter, and instead gave the reigns to Pronger for leadership. However, I don't think it was necessarily a bad move on Holmgren's part not insisting on getting Johnson back at the time.

Reverend Mayhem 03-14-2013 02:02 AM

Would something Ballard/Talbot-centric be worth talking about? Ballard has his shortcomings, but one thing he can do is a get a puck from one end of the ice to the other. If he doesn't pass until already in the offensive zone.

Schenn Bros Pizza* 03-14-2013 02:10 AM

Lavy needs to go. We need a new coach and system. We need to focus more on defense. Look at Bobrovsky with a good defense in front of him. It doesn't matter who our goalie is they will still suck until we play good defense and reduce the turnovers. We need to get rid of Briere. And its way past the time to trade one of our forwards + for a top or a potentially top flight dman that can move the puck. Homer should be on thin ice as well. He went all in for Bryzgalov and did not even get a capable backup goalie after watching Bryz under perform all last season. Bruno Gervais and Kurtis Foster LOL

deckercky 03-14-2013 02:12 AM

They also have a major cap squeeze coming in 2 years when Giroux, Couturier and Schenn are all free agents. Probably eats up a lot of the money coming off the cap from Timonen, and doesn't leave room for a lot of improvement on the back end.

Ziggy Stardust 03-14-2013 02:14 AM

Look at the bright side, they relinquished the contracts they gave to Richards and Carter and upgraded to Ilya Bryzgalov's contract that has seven additional years left on it. That's $51 million well spent.

I hope the Flyers never fire Holmgren, just so we can all be entertained by what stupid maneuver he will do next. The summer isn't too far behind, I'm sure he'll do something grandiose then.

Defense 03-14-2013 02:19 AM

:flyers

Jake Gardiner

:leafs

Sean Corturier

As a Leafs fan don't want to trade Gardiner but Leafs are not even bothering to utilize him. I think a blockbuster trade can be made between these 2 teams.

DKQ 03-14-2013 02:50 AM

I think Laviolette needs to go. When you look at the Flyers roster, they actually have the personnel to play a St. Louis style game: most of their forwards are good defensively, they have some grit throughout the lineup, and they are able to roll four lines pretty well. They just play a run-and-gun style, which could work except they can't breakout and their goalie isn't consistent enough for them to always rely on. If they fired Lavy and got one more puckmoving D, I could see them having success as a defensively-oriented team

Shellz 03-14-2013 02:51 AM

Snider...Homer...Lavi...they all need to go.

Superpest 03-14-2013 02:52 AM

Trading Couturier would contradict everything the Flyers are trying to do.

Win.

JABEE 03-14-2013 03:03 AM

Can't agree with you completely. I think the JVR trade was bad, but I place most of the blame on Peter Laviolette's inability to adjust to the way the powerhouses in the Eastern conference play. I think a new voice and strategist in the locker room will help the team greatly. There needs to be some personel overhaul. This team right now doesn't have enough youth and depth at defense. Coburn is really letting the team down and Timonen isn't getting any younger.

LuigiStone* 03-14-2013 03:06 AM

They should have fired Lavy and hired Randy Carlyle. Problem solved.

Richards18Forever 03-14-2013 03:29 AM

Lindy Ruff is out there

rumrokh 03-14-2013 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xavier Ouellet (Post 61622827)
Trading Couturier would contradict everything the Flyers are trying to do.

Win.

Except center is their one position of strength. They have Laughton on the way. Cousins, too. Moving one of Giroux (not happening), Schenn, or Couturier makes perfect sense as the way to address their need for puck-moving defense.

Look at their other positions. There's no chance they move Voracek, Simmonds, or Hartnell. And neither Read nor Briere (as the core of the deal) will land a player of the quality they need.

If they can stack prospects, picks, and depth players on a rebuilding team whose rebuild stands to take longer than they'll be able to keep a veteran puck-moving d-man, it could work - but you'd think they would have done that already if such a move were available.

Giroux tha Damaja 03-14-2013 03:43 AM

His name is Holmgren. Tough to bother reading the rest of it and expecting an informed opinion when you haven't even gotten that right.

Giroux tha Damaja 03-14-2013 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Rip (Post 61621819)
Niskanen for Simmonds. Helps the transition game and diminishes the cap-headaches of next season.

You're welcome, Paul :).

Niskanen's run-of-the-mill and we're not sending Simmonds anywhere for a run-of-the-mill anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by danishh (Post 61621811)
i think the roster is fine. The issue is goaltending and a system that doesnt fit the roster. The dmen arnt that bad, they just need a coach who's going to make them look good.

My bet would be a coaching change first, and maybe amnesty bryz, if snider can swallow that pill.

I think that's bang on. We have a defense that could be pretty damn smothering in another system. I don't know whether to blame Laviolette for not coaching to his roster, or Holmgren for hiring one coach and then building a team that suits another style. There's probably blame enough for both, considering that if either had managed to adjust to the other's misstep it would be a non-issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xavier Ouellet (Post 61622827)
Trading Couturier would contradict everything the Flyers are trying to do.

Win.

I agree, but I think Couturier is a couple years from delivering offensively. If they wanna wait that long to become a real force (they should be willing to) then it makes sense to hang onto him. If they stick to their usual MO of trying to win every single year, then trading him is a defensible idea if the player coming back has similar long term value.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JABEE (Post 61622909)
Can't agree with you completely. I think the JVR trade was bad, but I place most of the blame on Peter Laviolette's inability to adjust to the way the powerhouses in the Eastern conference play. I think a new voice and strategist in the locker room will help the team greatly. There needs to be some personel overhaul. This team right now doesn't have enough youth and depth at defense. Coburn is really letting the team down and Timonen isn't getting any younger.

Hockey is still hockey. I think, danishh observed, what he's failed to adjust to is his D-personnel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuigiStone (Post 61622943)
They should have fired Lavy and hired Randy Carlyle. Problem solved.

No! Please be joking?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Richards 18 (Post 61623139)
Lindy Ruff is out there

Nah.

MISC* 03-14-2013 04:13 AM

Edler
Raymond
1st

for

Simmonds
Coburn

Tender Rip 03-14-2013 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja (Post 61623337)
Niskanen's run-of-the-mill and we're not sending Simmonds anywhere for a run-of-the-mill anything.

Well, in yet other words, we are talking about a young second pairing puck moving D-man for a young second line winger.

Also, you can have one of these to even out any discrepancy:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...VagrKSPPbSGt6A

Giroux tha Damaja 03-14-2013 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MISC (Post 61623459)
Edler
Raymond
1st

for

Simmonds
Coburn

This is pretty tempting. If I were going to move those players at all, it wouldn't take anymore value than this coming back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Rip (Post 61623499)
Well, in yet other words, we are talking about a young second pairing puck moving D-man for a young second line winger.

Also, you can have one of these to even out any discrepancy:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...VagrKSPPbSGt6A

I want to dismiss this quickly also, but alas the monkey is tempting.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:25 AM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.