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-   -   Value of: David Desharnais (for anything)? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1388967)

One Man Rock Band 03-29-2013 01:43 PM

David Desharnais (for anything)?
 
This discussion has come up in the Desharnais thread in the Habs section.

Some posters think that Desharnais wouldn't garner draft picks in return. Other posters think that most teams would be interested in Desharnais if the price was right.

So... would you take Desharnais from the Habs for a 2nd or 3rd? Or even a roster player / prospect?

Or is it true that most NHL teams wouldnt want him?

Blind Gardien 03-29-2013 01:45 PM

I know you don't want posts from Habs fans. Sorry. :) But just for the record, I will say that I don't think any team ideally wants a 5'7" center, and they don't pay anything remotely commensurate with his value as a player. It's reasonable. Just the way it is. Habs aren't hurt by keeping him, he was a UFA signing that panned out as a reasonably productive NHL player. I'm happy with that and don't need to look for any serious trade value in him.

One Man Rock Band 03-29-2013 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind Gardien (Post 62711545)
I know you don't want posts from Habs fans. Sorry. :) But just for the record, I will say that I don't think any team ideally wants a 5'7" center, and they don't pay anything remotely commensurate with his value as a player. It's reasonable. Just the way it is. Habs aren't hurt by keeping him, he was a UFA signing that panned out as a reasonably productive NHL player. I'm happy with that and don't need to look for any serious trade value in him.

I agree we'll never get his actual value in a trade due to his size and mediocre defensive play. But just getting a little proof for the thread would go along way.

There are legitimately people there who are saying we couldn't even get a draft pick for him.

I like DD a lot, so maybe I'm blind. Maybe it's true that a team really wouldn't even give a 4th rounder for him and I'm just bias thinking he'd be tradeable (even for a below value return).

Buckets and Gloves 03-29-2013 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB (Post 62711715)
I agree we'll never get his actual value in a trade due to his size and mediocre defensive play. But just getting a little proof for the thread would go along way.

There are legitimately people there who are saying we couldn't even get a draft pick for him.

I like DD a lot, so maybe I'm blind. Maybe it's true that a team really wouldn't even give a 4th rounder for him and I'm just bias thinking he'd be tradeable (even for a below value return).

A team would give up a 4th and beyond pick no problem... 3rd and above I can't say as I know my team has no interest, but other teams may so perhaps those fans would offer better evaluation.

Myself though he would get SOMETHING not just waiver wire fodder

Blind Gardien 03-29-2013 01:56 PM

I would add that it's also why, if I was Habs' GM, I would have hardballed him mercilessly on his contract negotiations. There's no sense in paying him more than Subban, say. He is a good player and puts up points. But he's not going anywhere and you have the hammer on him, so pay him $2.5M instead of $3.5M. He's actually worth $3.5M. But so what. Subban is worth $5M+. Habs could have hammered him instead of giving him a fair gift, considering IMHO his trade value is not high. It's higher than a 4th round pick IMHO. But not much. 2nd maybe. He's just too smart and too goood to give up for anything like that. And I would have given him tough love long before giving it to PK.

habs03 03-29-2013 02:03 PM

Would be on pace for about 48 points in a full season, and he has actually struggled this year, a 50-60 point centre, he is being paid like a good 3rd liner, 3.5M actually only takes up 5.4% of the cap I believe. Issue is that he isn't a number 1 centre, but is used in that role for the time being.

Elliotte Friedman recently said on his 30 thoughts, that a GM said he wasn't surprised at all that DD got signed long term because centre are so hard to find. So there would be interest around the league.

Irving Zisman 03-29-2013 02:13 PM

DD would definitetly get something of value in a trade. It would be total hyperbole to say you couldn't a pick for a 2nd line center, no matter how small or soft he may be.

Dharvey33 03-29-2013 02:15 PM

Late first IMO if he was traded at the deadline and there would be a bidding war. He is still a great pp player and has great vision. He is not soft and not intimated easily just ask boston fans. But mtl needs a tougher center for sure in the long term.

habs03 03-29-2013 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind Gardien (Post 62712183)
I would add that it's also why, if I was Habs' GM, I would have hardballed him mercilessly on his contract negotiations. There's no sense in paying him more than Subban, say. He is a good player and puts up points. But he's not going anywhere and you have the hammer on him, so pay him $2.5M instead of $3.5M. He's actually worth $3.5M. But so what. Subban is worth $5M+. Habs could have hammered him instead of giving him a fair gift, considering IMHO his trade value is not high. It's higher than a 4th round pick IMHO. But not much. 2nd maybe. He's just too smart and too goood to give up for anything like that. And I would have given him tough love long before giving it to PK.

First he actually isn't paid more than Subban

DD makes 800K this year, and 3.5M next year, Subban makes 2M this year and 3.75M next year.

Also DD has 3 UFA years on his deal

habs03 03-29-2013 02:17 PM

He would be an amazing fit with the Hawks, Toews, DD, Bolland, and Shaw moves to the wing.

Blind Gardien 03-29-2013 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by habs03 (Post 62713173)
First he actually isn't paid more than Subban

DD makes 800K this year, and 3.5M next year, Subban makes 2M this year and 3.75M next year.

Also DD has 3 UFA years on his deal

If you want to get technical, then, there's no point in giving him a cap hit that's higher than Subban's cap hit? For next season, for any season. DD had no leverage, no more than Subban. And there is absolutely no comparison between them in value to the team. I even agree that DD is worth $3.5M per. But if you can get away with hardballing RFAs, why not take it across the board? :dunno:

Pyrophorus 03-29-2013 02:25 PM

Even as a Leaf fan, I like Desharnais...he an assist machine.

One Man Rock Band 03-29-2013 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind Gardien (Post 62713595)
If you want to get technical, then, there's no point in giving him a cap hit that's higher than Subban's cap hit? For next season, for any season. DD had no leverage, no more than Subban. And there is absolutely no comparison between them in value to the team. I even agree that DD is worth $3.5M per. But if you can get away with hardballing RFAs, why not take it across the board? :dunno:

He could have hardballed.. But then he wouldn't have got a long-term deal, which obviously Bergevin wanted.

If he signed him for 1 year @ 2.5, then DD goes on to have an incredible playoffs, he'd have regretted losing him.

habs03 03-29-2013 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind Gardien (Post 62713595)
If you want to get technical, then, there's no point in giving him a cap hit that's higher than Subban's cap hit? For next season, for any season. DD had no leverage, no more than Subban. And there is absolutely no comparison between them in value to the team. I even agree that DD is worth $3.5M per. But if you can get away with hardballing RFAs, why not take it across the board? :dunno:

Agree that you could hardball RFA because its the only time you can do it but DD only had 1 RFA year, so its really hard to compare them. I mean you hard ball him and he'll turn around and ask for a 1-2 year deal, making him a UFA and have no control over him.

Halifaxhab* 03-29-2013 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyrophorus (Post 62713657)
Even as a Leaf fan, I like Desharnais...he an assist machine.

Im shocked a leaf fan could recognize a playmaking centre.:sarcasm:

Fleury14 03-29-2013 02:35 PM

This year is Desharnais's 2nd full season. He may have been a later starter but the some idea of a sophomore slump applies (unknown in the 1st year, the league adjusts to the player/player overconfident in the 2nd year).

I don't see a reason why he wouldn't get a return of more than a 2nd. It's not like there's an excessive amount of legitimate scoring centers in the league.

Pyrophorus 03-29-2013 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halifaxhab (Post 62714035)
Im shocked a leaf fan could recognize a playmaking centre.:sarcasm:

I know, we only have playmaking wingers

Domino11 03-29-2013 02:50 PM

DD is a assist beast ... DD would look good in Chicago as Their 2 line center or even in Vancouver since Kessler is injured !! DD will become a consistent 50-60 point center witch meen a 2 line center .. 3.5 cap hit is very good and many team would take him !! A team like Phoenix who lack of center would fit perfectly

If Roy leave I think he would be a good fit in Dallas , Dallas is looking for cheap and productive center !even in Winnipeg they would need is skill set !

If DD on the market he will attract a lot of attention !

untouchable21 03-29-2013 02:53 PM

I would definitely take him on the JETS if all it cost was a 2nd, I might even add a prospect like Klingberg or something. Kane could use a good playmaking centre on his line.

Domino11 03-29-2013 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by untouchable21 (Post 62715347)
I would definitely take him on the JETS if all it cost was a 2nd, I might even add a prospect like Klingberg or something. Kane could use a good playmaking centre on his line.

It would take more then that to get him !! I could see mtl and jets doing something but it would likely take more !! I see him too with Kane ! How about u change klingberg by trouba :) ?? U have too many right handed dman anyways hehhehehe ...

Halifaxhab* 03-29-2013 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyrophorus (Post 62714385)
I know, we only have playmaking wingers

And measuring tape that goes oast 6ft;):laugh:

greenstickytoes 03-29-2013 03:17 PM

i say that even if you don't get something super amazing for DD
it would still be good to trade him. You got Pleky, Eller, Chucky
for centers. Eller looks like he's soon going to be forcing Therrien to move him
up atleast 2nd and we all know that Chucky will be our future #1 center.
when this happens. whether we trade Pleky or not, DD can't play on 3rd.
he wont be able to play that role since his defense isn't anything good.
and you can't put him as winger because your basically taking his strong
point away.
that being said even if Bergy gave him a long term contract.
Because of his size and the talent and potential coming up in our
centers like Eller and Chucky. DD will finish off by getting traded.
Dumont is already ready to take a 3rd line center responsibility
and he's also short. and so is Gally. so the chances all fall against
him because of so many reasons..

habs03 03-29-2013 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenstickytoes (Post 62716797)
i say that even if you don't get something super amazing for DD
it would still be good to trade him. You got Pleky, Eller, Chucky
for centers. Eller looks like he's soon going to be forcing Therrien to move him
up atleast 2nd and we all know that Chucky will be our future #1 center.
when this happens. whether we trade Pleky or not, DD can't play on 3rd.
he wont be able to play that role since his defense isn't anything good.
and you can't put him as winger because your basically taking his strong
point away.
that being said even if Bergy gave him a long term contract.
Because of his size and the talent and potential coming up in our
centers like Eller and Chucky. DD will finish off by getting traded.
Dumont is already ready to take a 3rd line center responsibility
and he's also short. and so is Gally. so the chances all fall against
him because of so many reasons..

I think you can, and at the end that where he'll end up, on a scoring 3rd line.

Most teams specially Mtl doesn't really put their 3rd line vs other teams 1st line, they like to go with a head to head match up, Plek line vs other teams top line, so as long as a guy like Plek, or Eller are there it shouldn't be a problem,

greenstickytoes 03-29-2013 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by habs03 (Post 62717493)
I think you can, and at the end that where he'll end up, on a scoring 3rd line.

Most teams specially Mtl doesn't really put their 3rd line vs other teams 1st line, they like to go with a head to head match up, Plek line vs other teams top line, so as long as a guy like Plek, or Eller are there it shouldn't be a problem,

who are you going to pair DD with tho?
Paches isn't going to play on a 3rd line.. never!

glenbuis 03-29-2013 03:35 PM

Desharnais put up 60pts in his first full season. This is his sophomore slump year and is on pace for 48 over 82. He will get back to 60 plus next year and will climb to a point a game center in the last two years of his deal. At that stage Galenchuk will have a center role as will Eller. For a team lacking in scoring Desharnais will be an attractive piece. At that time he may be viewed as a keeper.


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