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-   -   Speculation: Scott Niedermayer was almost a Philadelphia Flyer (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1406355)

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 03:44 PM

Scott Niedermayer was almost a Philadelphia Flyer
 
http://thehockeywriters.com/scott-ni...hat-never-was/

I don't want anyone to take this out of context. I am not here to chastise Bobby Clarke at all.

Furthermore, I didn't write this to tarnish David Strehle or Bill Meltzer. I respect both writers immensely. Both are fantastic guys. I was just speaking with Strehle yesterday in the pressbox and this topic came up. I never heard the rumor before, but it was great to talk to Dave about and really got me thinking on what could have been.

What are your thoughts? Always like to hear other opinions.

Jack de la Hoya 04-17-2013 03:48 PM

"Where's the beef?"

That's a very, very thinly sourced article.

Classic Devil 04-17-2013 03:48 PM

I seriously, seriously doubt it. The Devils offered Niedermayer maximum money against the cap for a long duration in 2005. I doubt very much he'd have switched allegiances when money wasn't an issue, and either way he was always going to play with his brother.

Now, he's always been so waffley on the whole contract thing that I could see Philadelphia thinking he was all set to come to Philly, though.

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classic Devil (Post 64130717)
I seriously, seriously doubt it. The Devils offered Niedermayer maximum money against the cap for a long duration in 2005. I doubt very much he'd have switched allegiances when money wasn't an issue, and either way he was always going to play with his brother.

Now, he's always been so waffley on the whole contract thing that I could see Philadelphia thinking he was all set to come to Philly, though.

Didn't he go to arbitration? I remember Lamouriello didn't think he deserved that much money, but Niedermayer ended up winning a 1-year deal for $7 million. Unfortunately that happened to be the year of the lockout so he never saw any of that money.

I could be wrong though.

CanadianFlyer88 04-17-2013 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classic Devil (Post 64130717)
I seriously, seriously doubt it. The Devils offered Niedermayer maximum money against the cap for a long duration in 2005. I doubt very much he'd have switched allegiances when money wasn't an issue, and either way he was always going to play with his brother.

Now, he's always been so waffley on the whole contract thing that I could see Philadelphia thinking he was all set to come to Philly, though.

The OP article touches on this seemingly in passing, but the bold is correct.

Scott always wanted to play with Rob; the Flyers had no chance of bringing Niedermayer to the team in 2005/06.

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack de la Hoya (Post 64130697)
"Where's the beef?"

That's a very, very thinly sourced article.

It was simply brought up in conversation. I value Strehle's and Meltzer's opinions since they definitely know what they're talking about. I don't necessarily claim that it was fact.

Classic Devil 04-17-2013 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShawnTHW (Post 64130823)
Didn't he go to arbitration? I remember Lamouriello didn't think he deserved that much money, but Niedermayer ended up winning a 1-year deal for $7 million. Unfortunately that happened to be the year of the lockout so he never saw any of that money.

I could be wrong though.

Yeah. Neidermayer and the Devils had always had a bit of a grating relationship on contracts. He'd held out in 2001 with Arnott, and then went to arbitration in 2004. But all this was while he was an RFA. Lou was always tough on RFA contracts.

Coming out of the lockout, Lou offered him maximum money against the cap for something like seven years. Which, at the time, was $7.8M/year.

Again, though, the only team Niedermayer was going to play for in 2005 was Anaheim.

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 (Post 64130917)
The OP article touches on this seemingly in passing, but the bold is correct.

Scott always wanted to play with Rob; the Flyers had no chance of bringing Niedermayer to the team in 2005/06.

Even more speculation: If Scott signed here for a few years, you think Rob would've came over to Philly?

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classic Devil (Post 64130939)
Yeah. Neidermayer and the Devils had always had a bit of a grating relationship on contracts. He'd held out in 2001 with Arnott, and then went to arbitration in 2004. But coming out of the lockout, Lou offered him maximum money against the cap for something like seven years.

Understood. Was unsure about the exact details since I knew Scott and Lou had their falling out over contract disputes over the years.

FreshPerspective 04-17-2013 03:58 PM

Regardless of whether this speculation had "legs," I was pretty livid at the time at Clarke for going after "legless" Hatcher and Rathje with the way the league was moving to open up the game. In fact, he got them, I believe, the season right after they made the rule changes to elminate the trap. Hatcher in his first year definitely didn't adjust quickly. The following season he did better and had a good playoff but then his knees failed him. Rathje of course became a quick medical basket case and cap anchor....

All in all, I got to experience 2/3 of Clarke's GM career (stints 1 and 2) and I wasn't the biggest fan for various reasons including not addressing the goaltending properly...something that seems to continue to haunt us. I'm hoping it has run its course with Bryz and that Mason and hopefully Stolarz make it less volatile but remains to be seen. Bob also better not be a Vezina nominee in consecutive years or I may just have to smash some things...

Classic Devil 04-17-2013 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShawnTHW (Post 64130971)
Even more speculation: If Scott signed here for a few years, you think Rob would've came over to Philly?

Rob had signed an extension with Anaheim in 2004, he wasn't going anywhere.

Edit: Whoops, I misremembered this. Rob signed a contract in tandem with his brother; although Anaheim had extended him in 2004, that contract got wiped with the lockout. I think Rob was RFA though.

CanadianFlyer88 04-17-2013 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Classic Devil (Post 64131173)
Rob had signed an extension with Anaheim in 2004, he wasn't going anywhere.

Four years, too, I think. Scott/Rob were never coming to Philly.

ShawnTHW 04-17-2013 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt (Post 64131163)
Regardless of whether this speculation had "legs," I was pretty livid at the time at Clarke for going after "legless" Hatcher and Rathje with the way the league was moving to open up the game. In fact, he got them, I believe, the season right after they made the rule changes to elminate the trap. Hatcher in his first year definitely didn't adjust quickly. The following season he did better and had a good playoff but then his knees failed him. Rathje of course became a quick medical basket case and cap anchor....

All in all, I got to experience 2/3 of Clarke's GM career (stints 1 and 2) and I wasn't the biggest fan for various reasons including not addressing the goaltending properly...something that seems to continue to haunt us. I'm hoping it has run its course with Bryz and that Mason and hopefully Stolarz make it less volatile but remains to be seen. Bob also better not be a Vezina nominee in consecutive years or I may just have to smash some things...

Something tells me you weren't the only Flyers fan.

Beef Invictus 04-17-2013 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack de la Hoya (Post 64130697)
"Where's the beef?"

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-loJQ1F_Kju...s1600/igor.gif

You summoned??

Bill_Meltzer 04-18-2013 05:58 AM

To be precise about what I said to Dave, around that time, there were rumors the Flyers were among the teams most serious about going after S. Niedermayer.

However, I don't know that they were ever close to the frontrunners, as it was said (and, of course, came to fruition) that he wanted to join his brother in Anaheim. But what is also true is that the Flyers switched gears and signed Hatcher and Rathje.

GoneFullHextall 04-18-2013 12:08 PM

Clarke was gambling the league would go back to smashmouth clutch and grab hockey quickly. It backfired rather badly.
I suppose once again we can chalk that up to hindsight like with any Flyers bad/questionable decision.
they are either great moves or its a bad move in hindsight.

BernieParent 04-18-2013 01:14 PM

Scott who?

ShawnTHW 04-18-2013 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill_Meltzer (Post 64168837)
To be precise about what I said to Dave, around that time, there were rumors the Flyers were among the teams most serious about going after S. Niedermayer.

However, I don't know that they were ever close to the frontrunners, as it was said (and, of course, came to fruition) that he wanted to join his brother in Anaheim. But what is also true is that the Flyers switched gears and signed Hatcher and Rathje.

Thanks Bill. Certainly didn't want to seem like I took it out of context. Will make the correct adjustments. My apologies.

EDIT: Fixed

Clyde Donovan 04-18-2013 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren (Post 64178827)
Clarke was gambling the league would go back to smashmouth clutch and grab hockey quickly. It backfired rather badly.
I suppose once again we can chalk that up to hindsight like with any Flyers bad/questionable decision.
they are either great moves or its a bad move in hindsight.

I remember having the Hockey News season preview issue after the lockout and Forsberg is on the cover and they predicted the Flyers to win the Cup. I don't think Clarke was the only one who thought the league was talking out of their ass about cracking down on obstruction.


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