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-   -   Ot:hockey alberta eliminates body checking in peewee division (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1424377)

Lacaar 05-08-2013 11:06 AM

Ot:hockey alberta eliminates body checking in peewee division
 
Looks like Hockey in Alberta is following in pursuit of some other provinces.

I can't remember which ones exactly eliminated this. I think Ontario?

Perhaps someone here can clarify.

I have two sons and the first one is starting initiation this year.
I think overall this is good news and I support it.

Probably pisses the Dads that are in the process of training their kids from birth to be NHL players though. I've seen a Dad timing his son doing laps public skating. The kid wasn't more than 7 years old. That wasn't so bad until he started laying into his son for slowing down.

joestevens29 05-08-2013 11:11 AM

Gregor had some guy on his show a long time ago, there was a studying suggesting that having hitting earlier would actually better.

The reasoning was at peewee kids bodies are changing far too much and aren't on an even playing field. Add hormones and it was suggested that kids that learn to hit when there is less testostrone would learn the safe way to hit.

Slats432 05-08-2013 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lacaar (Post 65602135)
Probably pisses the Dads that are in the process of training their kids from birth to be NHL players though. I've seen a Dad timing his son doing laps public skating. The kid wasn't more than 7 years old. That wasn't so bad until he started laying into his son for slowing down.

These are the guys that are going to be angered by the decision for sure.

I coach and have a son going to be in 2nd year Peewee. He is going to be pissed. Me..not so much. ;)

Oilception 05-08-2013 11:19 AM

I dont like this
Listening to Nielson and Fraser this morning they were talking like one of the reason they did this is to not discourage kids from quitting because they dont want to hit?
I remember when I played hockey me and all my friends were pumped for peewee so we could finally start hitting
Its part of the game that you must learn, and I feel that peewee hockey is an acceptable time to start learning it. At peewee I dont think they are really hitting hard enough to hurt each other anyways?

Bobblehead 05-08-2013 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oilception (Post 65602867)
I dont like this
Listening to Nielson and Fraser this morning they were talking like one of the reason they did this is to not discourage kids from quitting because they dont want to hit?
I remember when I played hockey me and all my friends were pumped for peewee so we could finally start hitting
Its part of the game that you must learn, and I feel that peewee hockey is an acceptable time to start learning it. At peewee I dont think they are really hitting hard enough to hurt each other anyways?

This is a good idea. I'm very much in favor. There is no need for hitting in pee wee hockey.

This ruling doesn't mean we should stop teaching body checking at clinics to pee wee age kids and let them get comfortable and used to it. Just means they can't apply the skill for a while. Think of it as a graduated drivers licence.

Just because kids are "pumped", doesn't mean its a good thing. I remember being pumped about my first BB gun, drinking and my buddies car. Getting bruised from close range BB guns, barfing all over myself and driving my friends car without a licence because he was too drunk.... not good ideas, but I was pumped. Maybe I took a few too many hits to the head in peewee?

Arguing they need to learn to take a hit and keep their head up is garbage also. They need to learn to keep their head up regardless of hitting or not. Keeping your head up while stickhandling is a skill that needs to be taught from tyke on up.

LoudmouthHemskyfan#1 05-08-2013 11:51 AM

Supposing he's inclined to play hockey, my son will be learning how to give and take a check shortly after he learns how to skate. This is important in terms of protecting yourself and learning to play the game correctly. It is unfortunate that hockey is changing so much for the worse (from getting rid of full-ice Micro Mites and not allowing teams to finish games that are delayed to coaches teaching kids to turn their backs due to the hitting from behind rule and this recent change) when it has the potential to be improved instead. They're focusing on completely the wrong things.

joestevens29 05-08-2013 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobblehead (Post 65604115)
This is a good idea. I'm very much in favor. There is no need for hitting in pee wee hockey.

This ruling doesn't mean we should stop teaching body checking at clinics to pee wee age kids and let them get comfortable and used to it. Just means they can't apply the skill for a while. Think of it as a graduated drivers licence.

Just because kids are "pumped", doesn't mean its a good thing. I remember being pumped about my first BB gun, drinking and my buddies car. Getting bruised from close range BB guns, barfing all over myself and driving my friends car without a licence because he was too drunk.... not good ideas, but I was pumped. Maybe I took a few too many hits to the head in peewee?

Arguing they need to learn to take a hit and keep their head up is garbage also. They need to learn to keep their head up regardless of hitting or not. Keeping your head up while stickhandling is a skill that needs to be taught from tyke on up.

I don't think it's like a graduated listen at all. The parents control a kids driving. Teaching a kid how to hit and then tell him not to is like taking a viagra and telling your penis to go to sleep.

Oilception 05-08-2013 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobblehead (Post 65604115)
This is a good idea. I'm very much in favor. There is no need for hitting in pee wee hockey.

This ruling doesn't mean we should stop teaching body checking at clinics to pee wee age kids and let them get comfortable and used to it. Just means they can't apply the skill for a while. Think of it as a graduated drivers licence.

Just because kids are "pumped", doesn't mean its a good thing. I remember being pumped about my first BB gun, drinking and my buddies car. Getting bruised from close range BB guns, barfing all over myself and driving my friends car without a licence because he was too drunk.... not good ideas, but I was pumped. Maybe I took a few too many hits to the head in peewee?

Arguing they need to learn to take a hit and keep their head up is garbage also. They need to learn to keep their head up regardless of hitting or not. Keeping your head up while stickhandling is a skill that needs to be taught from tyke on up.

but why is it a good idea? i dont think hitting is causing injuries in peewee? they aren't big or strong enough to hurt each other with a normal body check. Its part of the game, good to learn and peewee is a fine age IMO,

402 05-08-2013 12:02 PM

How old is peewee like 10?

I'm not to happy with the idea personally lol

Seedling 05-08-2013 12:10 PM

Brutal. Oh well, it's not like you are allowed to hit in the NHL anymore anyway.

Mr Forever 05-08-2013 12:11 PM

This is pretty dumb. Considering the elite stream of AA and AAA technically begins in Bantam, players will have no idea how to protect themselves or use clean hits. Also, at the bantam level there's a waaaay bigger gap between size and strength of the kids playing. You'll have the 14 year old 6'1 200 pounder and the 5'3 140 pounder who doesn't know how to take a hit. Stupid.

Bobblehead 05-08-2013 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oilception (Post 65605073)
but why is it a good idea? i dont think hitting is causing injuries in peewee? they aren't big or strong enough to hurt each other with a normal body check. Its part of the game, good to learn and peewee is a fine age IMO,

Are you a brain specialist? How do you know they're not big enough and strong enough to hurt each other? They're saying every blow now has a cumulative effect. I'm not a brain specialist, but what they're learning about concussions and the brain scares me. We used to do king of the ring. We used to put bounties on other guys heads and try to send them out on stretchers. I'd like to think we're smarter now.

My son is in novice. I will teach him how to take a hit and protect himslef before bantam. I will not teach to turn his back. I am constantly on him and his teammates to skate with their heads up. He will be ready for contact, if he decides to keep playing until then.

timekeep 05-08-2013 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 402 (Post 65605469)
How old is peewee like 10?

I'm not to happy with the idea personally lol

11 and 12

CornKicker 05-08-2013 12:15 PM

as a coach of atom and timbit aged players i think this is going to have the opposite effects of what they are trying to accomplish. Taking hitting out of the game @11/12 years old and allowing it in bantam 13/14 is going to be the result of many more injuries. the correct approach to this issue is to introduce the kids to body checking in novice. their bodies are still rubber and there isnt a lot of mass flying around.

When you start timbits and play what will now be 8 years of hockey without body checking the habits of skating with your head down and not being ready to get hit will result in thousands of more injuries to teenage kids. Its not just getting hit. Not knowing how to properly throw body checks will also increase injuries. when you have kids hitting puberty and throwing their newly found weight around kids are going to get hurt unless they know how to protect themselves. this is a poor decision by Hockey alberta and i am honestly surprised by their lack of foresight.

Petro Points 05-08-2013 12:20 PM

maybe it'll be gone at bantam level in a couple yrs too..

CornKicker 05-08-2013 12:21 PM

its a typical knee jerk reaction

kids are getting hurt - take it away form them for one more year...........

how about exposing the real cause to the problem, which is players turning their backs and skating with their heads down as well as the glorification of headhunting hits.

hockey is a contact sport, guys in mens league still get hurt, its a risk you take when you play. this decision is just deferring the risk to a higher age group that has more potential to injure someone.

timekeep 05-08-2013 12:22 PM

This is definitely a step in the wrong direction if we want to keep hitting in the game. Pretty soon there will be none at all. I had heard they were looking at putting hitting in the game earlier again, at the atom level. This would be a better level as the game really isn't that fast, most ideally it would be from Novice. The most important thing is knowing how to give and take a hit safely. If you learn it from the start it would not be so hard to learn at PeeWee or now Bantam. The numbers for Bantam will be dropping significantly in the next two years. As it is now there are so many players, including the big leagues, that hit with their arms up protecting themselves, rather than hitting with their body/shoulder.

For the kids/parents don't want hitting, there are leagues like the NHL(Non Hit League) in Edmonton that don't have body checking. Its my understanding that their teams in the outlying areas as well now. If this was such a concern they should be expanding this option.

Bobblehead 05-08-2013 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joestevens29 (Post 65604793)
I don't think it's like a graduated listen at all. The parents control a kids driving. Teaching a kid how to hit and then tell him not to is like taking a viagra and telling your penis to go to sleep.

The general consensus is we're producing safer drivers with graduated licences. You viagra analogy is stupid. Get them comfortable, get them used to it. BTW this is coming next year we're going to work on it so when evaluations come up next Septmeber the second years are killing the first years because the whole dynamic of the game has changed! There are smarter ways to do it.


How does a parent control a kid running another kid on the ice? My analogy is that you're easing them into it so they can get comfortable and used to it slowly, rather than tossing kids who played Atom last year onto the ice with kids that have a full season of contact under their belt + an additional year of growth and development. You can introduce checking in peewee in clinics, run full practices and even scrimmages on your team with contact in preparation for contact in bantam.

Its a HUGE adjustment to how the game is played, why not take your time. I appluad the decision.

joestevens29 05-08-2013 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CornKicker (Post 65606413)
as a coach of atom and timbit aged players i think this is going to have the opposite effects of what they are trying to accomplish. Taking hitting out of the game @11/12 years old and allowing it in bantam 13/14 is going to be the result of many more injuries. the correct approach to this issue is to introduce the kids to body checking in novice. their bodies are still rubber and there isnt a lot of mass flying around.

When you start timbits and play what will now be 8 years of hockey without body checking the habits of skating with your head down and not being ready to get hit will result in thousands of more injuries to teenage kids. Its not just getting hit. Not knowing how to properly throw body checks will also increase injuries. when you have kids hitting puberty and throwing their newly found weight around kids are going to get hurt unless they know how to protect themselves. this is a poor decision by Hockey alberta and i am honestly surprised by their lack of foresight.

This is exactly what the guy gregor had on said. Some doctor out of Buffalo I believe.

Bobblehead 05-08-2013 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CornKicker (Post 65606413)
as a coach of atom and timbit aged players i think this is going to have the opposite effects of what they are trying to accomplish. Taking hitting out of the game @11/12 years old and allowing it in bantam 13/14 is going to be the result of many more injuries. the correct approach to this issue is to introduce the kids to body checking in novice. their bodies are still rubber and there isnt a lot of mass flying around.

When you start timbits and play what will now be 8 years of hockey without body checking the habits of skating with your head down and not being ready to get hit will result in thousands of more injuries to teenage kids. Its not just getting hit. Not knowing how to properly throw body checks will also increase injuries. when you have kids hitting puberty and throwing their newly found weight around kids are going to get hurt unless they know how to protect themselves. this is a poor decision by Hockey alberta and i am honestly surprised by their lack of foresight.

They're necks are strong enough for their massive heads! That's why they're finding more and more concussions in female hockey players!! Their bodies are ready for it. Their heads snap back becuase their necks aren't ready for it.

Skating with your head down, arguement. Whatever. Kids should have their head up whether there's checking or not!! how do you spot a teammate for a pass with your head down? How do you stickhandle around an oppenent with your head down. Head up when skating is primary skill that all kids need to play hockey. Hitting or not.

joestevens29 05-08-2013 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobblehead (Post 65606979)
The general consensus is we're producing safer drivers with graduated licences. You viagra analogy is stupid. Get them comfortable, get them used to it. BTW this is coming next year we're going to work on it so when evaluations come up next Septmeber the second years are killing the first years because the whole dynamic of the game has changed! There are smarter ways to do it.


How does a parent control a kid running another kid on the ice? My analogy is that you're easing them into it so they can get comfortable and used to it slowly, rather than tossing kids who played Atom last year onto the ice with kids that have a full season of contact under their belt + an additional year of growth and development. You can introduce checking in peewee in clinics, run full practices and even scrimmages on your team with contact in preparation for contact in bantam.

Its a HUGE adjustment to how the game is played, why not take your time. I appluad the decision.

How is taking something away allow them to gradually get comfortable?

randylahey 05-08-2013 12:31 PM

I think a lot of people here are missing the boat on another huge reason this was done. Numbers of hockey players are dropping and a huge reason is safety. Parents don't like the hitting aspect. Now this gives the kids another 2 years of playing without hitting. In reality hitting should probably only be in the elite stream and make the rest no-hitting. That's my opinion at least

bucks_oil 05-08-2013 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joestevens29 (Post 65602415)
Gregor had some guy on his show a long time ago, there was a studying suggesting that having hitting earlier would actually better.

The reasoning was at peewee kids bodies are changing far too much and aren't on an even playing field. Add hormones and it was suggested that kids that learn to hit when there is less testostrone would learn the safe way to hit.

I agree with this approach.

12 thru 14 is the wrong age to introduce hitting. You either wait until the growing is done, or you introduce it earlier.

A bunch of 10 & 11 year old boys learning to hit strikes me as the perfect time... Still young enough to be similar in size and young enough to listen to instruction without hormones taking over entirely. Plus you can still scold a (particularly aggressive) 10 year old and have a positive outcome from it.

joestevens29 05-08-2013 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randylahey (Post 65607627)
I think a lot of people here are missing the boat on another huge reason this was done. Numbers of hockey players are dropping and a huge reason is safety. Parents don't like the hitting aspect. Now this gives the kids another 2 years of playing without hitting. In reality hitting should probably only be in the elite stream and make the rest no-hitting. That's my opinion at least

Where does it stop though? I mean if parents are really that concerned why would they allow there kids in sport that allows hitting at 16 or 17? Aren't you generally enrolling your kids into something that they are going to play for most of their childhood?


I'd be curious what football numbers are.

timekeep 05-08-2013 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randylahey (Post 65607627)
I think a lot of people here are missing the boat on another huge reason this was done. Numbers of hockey players are dropping and a huge reason is safety. Parents don't like the hitting aspect. Now this gives the kids another 2 years of playing without hitting. In reality hitting should probably only be in the elite stream and make the rest no-hitting. That's my opinion at least

There are non hit leagues, they can play there if they don't want to hit.


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