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-   -   Why not Kopitar for Selke? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1430595)

Purple N Gold 05-16-2013 09:03 AM

Why not Kopitar for Selke?
 
To me, Kopi's one of the best crease to crease forwards in the game. Is Kopi's offensive talent and prowess keeping him from consideration for the Selke? He's not the quintessential "defensive forward", but Kopi's a great defender as a centerman.

Scottkmlps 05-16-2013 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purple N Gold (Post 66137623)
To me, Kopi's one of the best crease to crease forwards in the game. Is Kopi's offensive talent and prowess keeping him from consideration for the Selke? He's not the quintessential "defensive forward", but Kopi's a great defender as a centerman.

East.....coast.....bias.

Purple N Gold 05-16-2013 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottkmlps (Post 66137957)
East.....coast.....bias.

Gotcha!!!

johnjm22 05-16-2013 09:32 AM

Kopitar is a fine defensive forward, and I wholeheartedly believe there is an East Coast Bias, but I still don't think Kopitar is Selke worthy.

Purple N Gold 05-16-2013 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjm22 (Post 66138605)
Kopitar is a fine defensive forward, and I wholeheartedly believe there is an East Coast Bias, but I still don't think Kopitar is Selke worthy.

Maybe it's the definition of the Selke award.....like is it the Most "Valuable" Player or the Most "Outstanding" Player. No, Kopi doesn't "fit" the definition of "defensive forward", but to me he's one of the best, if not the best, "all around" forwards in the game.

johnjm22 05-16-2013 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purple N Gold (Post 66138697)
Maybe it's the definition of the Selke award.....like is it the Most "Valuable" Player or the Most "Outstanding" Player. No, Kopi doesn't "fit" the definition of "defensive forward", but to me he's one of the best, if not the best, "all around" forwards in the game.

Based on his play this season, I certainly wouldn't call him one of the best all around forwards in the league.

By defintion, you have to be good offensively to be well rounded. Kopitar rarely created scoring chances this year (for himself or others), and most of his points were the result of being gifted coincidental assists.

Anze is playing some of the worst hockey of his career, and shouldn't be considered for any award other than Lady Byng IMO. It's very disappointing.

etherialone 05-16-2013 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottkmlps (Post 66137957)
East.....coast.....bias.

I came in to post this exact same thing.

Put Kopi on an east coast team and he is one of the nominees without any doubt.

onlyalad 05-16-2013 10:27 AM

This season he wasnt the best
East coast bias
Do we really want him to get it?
Let him be overlooked by the media and other teams. Ok really just the media. The other teams know his game

Stupid Sexy Flanders 05-16-2013 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjm22 (Post 66138605)
Kopitar is a fine defensive forward, and I wholeheartedly believe there is an East Coast Bias, but I still don't think Kopitar is Selke worthy.

Agreed.

deeshamrock 05-16-2013 11:13 AM

Quote:

Kopitar is a fine defensive forward, but I still don't think Kopitar is Selke worthy.
For this year, I would agree, but he's only 25 and his time will come and he will take one home. But this year the nominees are all very good defensive players. Bergeron has always been good and until last year, didn't get the ink for it. Toews is probably the most complete player in the game, and Datsyuk is Datsyuk.

I read in March that Toews was leading the league in takeaways 'no close second' they also mentioned his blocked shots being at the top of hte list and his defensive Zone faceoffs wer ehigh. Those are (esp takeaways) critical areas that are taken into consideration

And what East Coast Bias??? Two of the nominated players are in the West. Conf....

Maybe the bias isn't on their end.

DaAnimal 05-16-2013 11:32 AM

There are media east coast bias

But when it comes down to the EOY awards, they are not biased at all. They are nominated and voted by the GMs of each team and I full heartily believe that they don't look at a player based on their team/location.

Kopi is still young and still developing. I think he will win an award in his lifetime. The guy is a very well balanced forward and that's what our team is built on. No one really has any extreme upsides or downsides, everyone is pretty much down the middle.

johnjm22 05-16-2013 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deeshamrock (Post 66142515)
And what East Coast Bias??? Two of the nominated players are in the West. Conf....

Maybe the bias isn't on their end.

You're really going to play that card? Do I need to state the obvious?

Dave33 05-16-2013 11:43 AM

I think LeBrun said he had him 2nd, so some are noticing. He'll get one eventually.

KingKopitar11* 05-16-2013 12:30 PM

This is probably the year where he doesn't deserve it.

damacles1156 05-16-2013 12:34 PM

Kopitar doesn't get enough takeaway's for him to be in the top 3.

Dat's and Patrice are always the league's top thief's.

They are always going to be 1/2 in Selke voting.

Face Wash 05-16-2013 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjm22 (Post 66139561)
Based on his play this season, I certainly wouldn't call him one of the best all around forwards in the league.

By defintion, you have to be good offensively to be well rounded. Kopitar rarely created scoring chances this year (for himself or others), and most of his points were the result of being gifted coincidental assists.

Anze is playing some of the worst hockey of his career, and shouldn't be considered for any award other than Lady Byng IMO. It's very disappointing.

It has been 87 games (playoffs included) since Kopitar scored a Power Play goal. That's 311 Straight Kings PP opportunity since AK11 scored on one.

Kopitar has just 3 goals in his last 33 games.

Kopi has won just 43.7% of his faceoffs in the playoffs.

After being a +14 during the regular season, Kopi is Even in +/- in 7 Playoff Games

These aren't the numbers of an elite centerman.

johnjm22 05-16-2013 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face Wash (Post 66148627)
It has been 87 games (playoffs included) since Kopitar scored a Power Play goal. That's 311 Straight Kings PP opportunity since AK11 scored on one.

Kopitar has just 3 goals in his last 33 games.

Kopi has won just 43.7% of his faceoffs in the playoffs.

After being a +14 during the regular season, Kopi is Even in +/- in 7 Playoff Games

These aren't the numbers of an elite centerman.

It goes back even further than that. He didn't even look good playing for Mora.

The guy never makes any attempt to generate offense.

nki 05-16-2013 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face Wash (Post 66148627)
It has been 87 games (playoffs included) since Kopitar scored a Power Play goal. That's 311 Straight Kings PP opportunity since AK11 scored on one.

Kopitar has just 3 goals in his last 33 games.

Kopi has won just 43.7% of his faceoffs in the playoffs.

After being a +14 during the regular season, Kopi is Even in +/- in 7 Playoff Games

These aren't the numbers of an elite centerman.

His shots are also way down from his previous career average. That's the big elephant in the room isn't it, better hope this season is an outlier.

Reclamation Project 05-16-2013 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 (Post 66145951)
This is probably the year where he doesn't deserve it.

I agree. He's playing injured in a shortened season.

Face Wash 05-16-2013 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjm22 (Post 66149109)
It goes back even further than that. He didn't even look good playing for Mora.

The guy never makes any attempt to generate offense.

I couldn't care less about Mora...He's not performing in the big leagues at the highest level on the biggest stage. I can think of a lot of legitimate reasons why he wouldn't go all out for Mora.

markisonfire 05-17-2013 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deeshamrock (Post 66142515)
For this year, I would agree, but he's only 25 and his time will come and he will take one home. But this year the nominees are all very good defensive players. Bergeron has always been good and until last year, didn't get the ink for it. Toews is probably the most complete player in the game, and Datsyuk is Datsyuk.

I read in March that Toews was leading the league in takeaways 'no close second' they also mentioned his blocked shots being at the top of hte list and his defensive Zone faceoffs wer ehigh. Those are (esp takeaways) critical areas that are taken into consideration

And what East Coast Bias??? Two of the nominated players are in the West. Conf....

Maybe the bias isn't on their end.

Datsyuk and Toews both had 56 takeaways, with Hossa and E. Staal next closest with 48. Datsyuk was 48th in the league amongst forwards in blocked shots with 30, Toews a stellar 209th with 16. Not that those stats really mean a ton. It's a really subjective award. Kopitar averaged more SH TOI than either Datsyuk or Toews. This all means basically nothing. :help:

Slycer 05-17-2013 06:12 AM

That PP stat is quite worthless. Every powerplay I see him screening the goalie and retaining the puck. Hardly ever shoots, just passes the puck to others and gets back to his post in front of the net. And I guess Sutter doesn't mind him doing that since he keeps sending him out there. It's fans that think they ought to dictate what a player should do.

Telos 05-17-2013 10:13 AM

Kopitar dipped the last quarter of the season or so. He might be slightly overlooked but he is on everyone's radar after winning the cup last year. 2 of the 3 candidates reside currently in the east coast, so it is hard to shout that bias. It is a little bit of a popularity contest. Remember that they are selected by the media, and when was the last time we've trusted the media with anything substantial? Not a big deal, there is only one trophy that matters. Individual awards be damned.

tsanuri 05-17-2013 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deeshamrock (Post 66142515)
For this year, I would agree, but he's only 25 and his time will come and he will take one home. But this year the nominees are all very good defensive players. Bergeron has always been good and until last year, didn't get the ink for it. Toews is probably the most complete player in the game, and Datsyuk is Datsyuk.

I read in March that Toews was leading the league in takeaways 'no close second' they also mentioned his blocked shots being at the top of hte list and his defensive Zone faceoffs wer ehigh. Those are (esp takeaways) critical areas that are taken into consideration

And what East Coast Bias??? Two of the nominated players are in the West. Conf....

Maybe the bias isn't on their end.

Playing for O6 teams and sitting in the central and eastern time zones.
He didn't deserve it this year. But the east coast bias is very much alive and well especially with the hockey writers.

KingKopitar11* 05-17-2013 12:41 PM

Next year when kopitar is supposed to be in his prime and healthy. And if he doesn't win the selke or get nominated than he probably never will.


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