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-   -   The Out of Town Thread part LX - All Talk From Around the League Here (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1434419)

Crimson Skorpion 05-23-2013 06:16 AM

The Out of Town Thread part LX - All Talk From Around the League Here
 
Continue here.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 06:42 AM

Like against us, Ottawa looks like a lottery team when Anderson isn't standing on his head.

Kriss E 05-23-2013 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66473859)
Like against us, Ottawa looks like a lottery team when Anderson isn't standing on his head.

I find it rather amusing how people still talk about size when discussing our series versus them. It's a lot tougher for Anderson to hold the fort down when he's facing Plekanec, Gallagher, unhealthy Gionta and MaxPac than arguably the two best players in the world that are also surrounded by other Elite talents like Iginla and Neal, the skill of th depth in Pittsburgh is just nuts. It's like Miami in the NBA.
I mean, how can a team lose Crosby and really feel no effect? Nuts.
Ottawa is a bubble team if Anderson doesn't stand on his head.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 66473949)
I find it rather amusing how people still talk about size when discussing our series versus them. It's a lot tougher for Anderson to hold the fort down when he's facing Plekanec, Gallagher, unhealthy Gionta and MaxPac than arguably the two best players in the world that are also surrounded by other Elite talents like Iginla and Neal, the skill of th depth in Pittsburgh is just nuts. It's like Miami in the NBA.
I mean, how can a team lose Crosby and really feel no effect? Nuts.
Ottawa is a bubble team if Anderson doesn't stand on his head.

The size thing probably doesn't even get brought up A-if we win that series because goaltending was even and not heavily slated in their favor B-Emelin Eller were not out and Prust and Pacioretty were not playing hurt.

I agree the Habs do need more size to be a top contender, but it has to be done without sacrificing skill. Most teams in the playoffs are carried for the most part by "non-giants".

Kriss E 05-23-2013 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66474051)
The size thing probably doesn't even get brought up A-if we win that series because goaltending was even and not heavily slated in their favor B-Emelin Eller were not out and Prust and Pacioretty were not playing hurt.

I agree the Habs do need more size to be a top contender, but it has to be done without sacrificing skill. Most teams in the playoffs are carried for the most part by "non-giants".

I think having Galchenyuk-Eller instead of Plek-DD as the top 2 centers would already be a huge game changer for us. I think Eller should have been ahead of DD even last year, alas we were stuck with one big time clueless coach in RC that pretty much just rolled with one line (DD-MaxPac-Cole). Therrien gave me a huge scare when he scratched Eller for game 2 of the season. That was just dumb imo. But as the season progressed, he did get more opportunities. However, DD did get some special treatment. Pretty sure Eller would have been scratched more than once if he had a DD type season.
In any event, Eller should be used as a top 2 center next year with PP time.
Plekanec was still the best center on our team because of his complete game, but Eller finished the year as the most efficient center in terms of production. Offensively, I can see him really flourish next year if he's used properly.

Galchenyuk may not be ready. It's always tough to predict when you have such a talented young player. But he isn't that far off. Already scoring at about a 50pt pace as 19yo third liner averaging 12min with very little PP time.

So, I'm not ready to say that these two will take over the top 2 center positions as of next year, but it should definitely happen the year after. With MaxPac-Bourque-Gallagher in our top 6 as well, finding another big body with skill up front (hopefully one that is punishing physically), we should be pretty good, assuming Bourque keeps performing as he did in the POs and MaxPac is healthy.

We're not that far off imo.

Habs 4 Life 05-23-2013 07:49 AM

Wow that 3rd period when the Pens want to play it's almost like watching an all star game

And what a beauty of a goal by Sid, spectacular !!

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 66474721)
I think having Galchenyuk-Eller instead of Plek-DD as the top 2 centers would already be a huge game changer for us. I think Eller should have been ahead of DD even last year, alas we were stuck with one big time clueless coach in RC that pretty much just rolled with one line (DD-MaxPac-Cole). Therrien gave me a huge scare when he scratched Eller for game 2 of the season. That was just dumb imo. But as the season progressed, he did get more opportunities. However, DD did get some special treatment. Pretty sure Eller would have been scratched more than once if he had a DD type season.
In any event, Eller should be used as a top 2 center next year with PP time.
Plekanec was still the best center on our team because of his complete game, but Eller finished the year as the most efficient center in terms of production. Offensively, I can see him really flourish next year if he's used properly.

Galchenyuk may not be ready. It's always tough to predict when you have such a talented young player. But he isn't that far off. Already scoring at about a 50pt pace as 19yo third liner averaging 12min with very little PP time.

So, I'm not ready to say that these two will take over the top 2 center positions as of next year, but it should definitely happen the year after. With MaxPac-Bourque-Gallagher in our top 6 as well, finding another big body with skill up front (hopefully one that is punishing physically), we should be pretty good, assuming Bourque keeps performing as he did in the POs and MaxPac is healthy.

We're not that far off imo.

How was scratching Eller dumb? It got him working harder and he made more progress this year than any year in the NHL.

MB and MT seem to believe in 3 offensive lines so I wouldn't get as preoccupied with top 6 and more about top 9. All 3 centers will get a chance to play in offensive situations.

otto bond 05-23-2013 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66474051)
The size thing probably doesn't even get brought up A-if we win that series because goaltending was even and not heavily slated in their favor B-Emelin Eller were not out and Prust and Pacioretty were not playing hurt.

I agree the Habs do need more size to be a top contender, but it has to be done without sacrificing skill. Most teams in the playoffs are carried for the most part by "non-giants".

If we had won....well that's not the case. What I do see is Ottawa's defense having more trouble clearing the crease and pickup Anderson's rebounds like on one of Igny's goal.
It's not a dick competition, I get it but it's pretty darn close. The Pens are a well ballence team with good size, grit and topend skills. Montreal is a smaller team lacking grit with nice skills.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otto bond (Post 66475377)
If we had won....well that's not the case. What I do see is Ottawa's defense having more trouble clearing the crease and pickup Anderson's rebounds like on one of Igny's goal.
It's not a dick competition, I get it but it's pretty darn close. The Pens are a well ballence team with good size, grit and topend skills. Montreal is a smaller team lacking grit with nice skills.

The Habas definitely didn't lack grit, if they lacked anything against Ottawa it was goaltending and healthy bodies. If Vokoun ***** the bed and 3-4 of their core players are out of seriously compromised physically it's a different series.

People love to twist things around to fit their agenda.

Kriss E 05-23-2013 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66474975)
How was scratching Eller dumb? It got him working harder and he made more progress this year than any year in the NHL.

MB and MT seem to believe in 3 offensive lines so I wouldn't get as preoccupied with top 6 and more about top 9. All 3 centers will get a chance to play in offensive situations.

Really? Is that what you really think? That Eller came into the season with no training camp after learning a new system in Europe, and now had to learn a new one here, and decided to slop it out in game 1? That he needed a wake up call after one game when pretty much the whole team looked like garbage?

Eller started playing much better last season. Martin was starting to use him versus tougher opponents, and he was doing fairly well. His line with Moen and AK was arguably our most dominant one when put together. Then Martin gets fired, RC comes in, splits up this solid trio, makes Eller face guys like Datsyuk and when he sees he can't keep up, he benches him. It all was a lot more difficult for him when RC took over. But he was ready to blossom last year, we just had one of the worst coaches I've ever seen.

This year I give zero credit to Therrien for Eller. None. I'm not a Therrien hater, I give him a lot of credit for the season as a whole, and other players, but just not for Eller.
This kid always had it tough. Nothing was ever given to him unlike others. I mean, Gallagher and Galchenyuk come in as rookies and they get better treatment than Eller. Galchenyuk never had to prove himself by playing with Moen and White, yet Eller had to do that after he being reinserted. DD was always given some offensive wingers. Heck, Therrien before the season starts says this is a make-break year for Eller, yet scratches him after the first game because he didn't like 12min of action on the bottom line. What does he do to help him out?? Keeps him on the 4th line, and gives him 0 pp ice time. After that when injuries occur, he gets a shot as a winger on the top 6, a position he clearly is just not comfortable with.
It wasn't until he was given a little more ice time, on the 3rd line, with more offensively capable wingers (even though they were rookies), that he really started shining again. Surprise surprise, give him a little more ice time, with better wingers, and he starts to play much better (just like with AK a year ago).

I give all the credit to Eller, the kid worked harder than anybody else on this team, and the coaches never made it easy for him.
The scratch was dumb because he was singled out when the whole team was crap.
The team had no training camp, I mean wait a couple of games before perhaps.


As for top 6, I'm referring to that in terms of ice time and PP. I want Eller to be one of the two most used centerman, top 6 among forwards, and this includes a regular shift on the PP.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 10:24 AM

Dan Rosen ‏@drosennhl 1m Brad Richards says he is not playing tonight. He said Tortorella called him this morning to tell him.

hototogisu 05-23-2013 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66478921)
Dan Rosen ‏@drosennhl 1m Brad Richards says he is not playing tonight. He said Tortorella called him this morning to tell him.

Redden...Drury...Gomez...Gaborik...Richards...

Can't wait to watch them try and unload Nash next year.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 66478889)
Really? Is that what you really think? That Eller came into the season with no training camp after learning a new system in Europe, and now had to learn a new one here, and decided to slop it out in game 1? That he needed a wake up call after one game when pretty much the whole team looked like garbage?

Eller started playing much better last season. Martin was starting to use him versus tougher opponents, and he was doing fairly well. His line with Moen and AK was arguably our most dominant one when put together. Then Martin gets fired, RC comes in, splits up this solid trio, makes Eller face guys like Datsyuk and when he sees he can't keep up, he benches him. It all was a lot more difficult for him when RC took over. But he was ready to blossom last year, we just had one of the worst coaches I've ever seen.

This year I give zero credit to Therrien for Eller. None. I'm not a Therrien hater, I give him a lot of credit for the season as a whole, and other players, but just not for Eller.
This kid always had it tough. Nothing was ever given to him unlike others. I mean, Gallagher and Galchenyuk come in as rookies and they get better treatment than Eller. Galchenyuk never had to prove himself by playing with Moen and White, yet Eller had to do that after he being reinserted. DD was always given some offensive wingers. Heck, Therrien before the season starts says this is a make-break year for Eller, yet scratches him after the first game because he didn't like 12min of action on the bottom line. What does he do to help him out?? Keeps him on the 4th line, and gives him 0 pp ice time. After that when injuries occur, he gets a shot as a winger on the top 6, a position he clearly is just not comfortable with.
It wasn't until he was given a little more ice time, on the 3rd line, with more offensively capable wingers (even though they were rookies), that he really started shining again. Surprise surprise, give him a little more ice time, with better wingers, and he starts to play much better (just like with AK a year ago).

I give all the credit to Eller, the kid worked harder than anybody else on this team, and the coaches never made it easy for him.
The scratch was dumb because he was singled out when the whole team was crap.
The team had no training camp, I mean wait a couple of games before perhaps.


As for top 6, I'm referring to that in terms of ice time and PP. I want Eller to be one of the two most used centerman, top 6 among forwards, and this includes a regular shift on the PP.

Paint it how you want but it got results, Eller was working much harder and was a better player when he got back in which was the goal. Maybe MT was trying to send a message to veterans, and it worked. He's not there to win a popularity contest, he's there to win and get the most out of guys.

Habs 1909 05-23-2013 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hototogisu (Post 66478981)
Redden...Drury...Gomez...Gaborik...Richards...

Can't wait to watch them try and unload Nash next year.

It comes to a point where management has to be held accountable and it starts with Sather.

Monctonscout 05-23-2013 10:44 AM

steve simmons ‏@simmonssteve 8m Ran into Daniel Briere last night. He's pretty sure the Flyers are going to buy him out. He wants to stay.

thewall 05-23-2013 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hototogisu (Post 66478981)
Redden...Drury...Gomez...Gaborik...Richards...

Can't wait to watch them try and unload Nash next year.

you can also add Naslund, Frolov ... a few years earlier they had Lindros, Jagr that didnt pan out like they originally plan.

PyrettaBlaze 05-23-2013 10:54 AM

So will NYR fire Sather or what? This is getting ridiculous.

shutehinside 05-23-2013 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66478921)
Dan Rosen ‏@drosennhl 1m Brad Richards says he is not playing tonight. He said Tortorella called him this morning to tell him.

He'd thrive in a non Torts system as would any other offensive player they have.

He'll do well next year in a new system once Torts gets canned in the off season.

Habsawce 05-23-2013 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze (Post 66480085)
So will NYR fire Sather or what? This is getting ridiculous.

Torts gets fired for sure I think, and Sather stays with maybe adding another executive to work with him at most.

Richards gets bought out and Sather fleeces someone else in a trade to extend his stay another 5 yaers.

Ezpz 05-23-2013 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutehinside (Post 66480395)
He'd thrive in a non Torts system as would any other offensive player they have.

He'll do well next year in a new system once Torts gets canned in the off season.

Like Gomez, Redden, Drury etc? People just don't care when they have 50 million dollars in the bank.

Habs 4 Life 05-23-2013 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Habsawce (Post 66480401)
Torts gets fired for sure I think, and Sather stays with maybe adding another executive to work with him at most.

Richards gets bought out and Sather fleeces someone else in a trade to extend his stay another 5 yaers.

If Sather stays it's because he was able to unload Gomez and Gaborik and lucky he has the 2 buyouts to play with. He should have been fired a long time ago, the Rags are a joke if not for Lundqvist

WeThreeKings 05-23-2013 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monctonscout (Post 66479707)
steve simmons ‏@simmonssteve 8m Ran into Daniel Briere last night. He's pretty sure the Flyers are going to buy him out. He wants to stay.

Want DD, Flyers? We can make a salary type deal.

Roulin 05-23-2013 12:09 PM

Sather has found a way to get out of all the bad contracts without crippling the team. They have a very good, young nucleus. Like the Flyers, the Rangers have been fearless in their management. It leads to some embarrassing contract situations, but generally has worked out well for both teams.

hototogisu 05-23-2013 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roulin (Post 66483195)
Sather has found a way to get out of all the bad contracts without crippling the team. They have a very good, young nucleus. Like the Flyers, the Rangers have been fearless in their management. It leads to some embarrassing contract situations, but generally has worked out well for both teams.

When was the last time the Rangers got out of the second round? 1997? That kind of mediocrity gets blasted when it comes to the Habs, yet the Rangers should be lauded for it?

habtastic 05-23-2013 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hototogisu (Post 66483433)
When was the last time the Rangers got out of the second round? 1997? That kind of mediocrity gets blasted when it comes to the Habs, yet the Rangers should be lauded for it?

I vaguely recall the Conference Finals last year.


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