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Akhockeyguy 06-08-2013 03:19 AM

Off season workouts
 
I've been sticking to this workout routine that I came up with for about 3-4 weeks. I am beat after every upper body workout days. On leg days I don't get tired, but pretty sore about an hour later. I think I am doing too much on upper body days because I can barely get through them. Here's what I'm doing right now. All are in the same order that I go through it.
Mondays are chest, triceps and shoulders
DB bench press
DB Skullcrushers
DB incline/decline bench press (alternate every week)
Triceps push downs
Bench press
Triceps extensions
Lateral raise
Incline/decline bench press (alternate every week)
Shoulder press
Burnouts on wide chest machine.

Tuesdays are leg days. I think I'm good here, but I'll post anyways
10 minute warmup
Leg extensions
Leg curls
Hip abductor
Hip adductors
Sitting calf raises
Squats
Deadlifts
Power cleans
Lunges
Flutter kicks
Lying leg raise and hold (burnouts with clutter kicks)

Wednesdays: back and biceps; sprint work
10 minute warmup
DB bicep curls
One arm DB rows
Wide grip lat pull downs
Preacher curls
Close grip lat pull downs
Hammer curls
Burnout on high row machine
Sprint work On agility ladder (15 ft). Go through and do little acelleration 5-8 step sprint when I get through the ladder. I go through 5 times (there-back-there-back-there) 3 times each excersise.
Sprints 1 foot in each
Lateral sprints
Sprint hops both feet
Lateral sprint hops
Skier hops
1 foot skier hops


Thursdays: leg day again(same exact workout as Tuesdays)

Fridays: upper body
DB Bench press
DB bicep curls
DB One arm rows
Bench press
Triceps push downs
Preacher curls
Seated rows
Lateral rows
Wide chest machine
Triceps extensions
Close grip pull downs
Push-ups til failure

Saturday: sprint ladder only, same as on Wednesday.
And I throw in 2 core excersises at the end of every workout.

So that's what I have right now. If it seems like I'm doing too much please let me know. I thought it was odd that I had two completely different feelings after legs and upper body workout days. Oh, and all excersises are 3 sets of 8. Thanks for any feedback!

Thesensation19* 06-08-2013 05:57 PM

Seems to me like your weekly routine is focused around a split training routine and for athletes I do not agree with this. Before I continue, yes doing any form of fitness will improve your fitness (even if its a slight increase) so good job in being so dedicated to your sport and your health.

Yet, as research and studies show, split work outs have a ton of disadvantages for athletes. You only have so much energy in a day or a week and I dont see the reason for you to split your muscles into a group and work on them desperately. Especially when sports like hockey are requiring you to use your entire bodily functions to use when playing.

Basically any trainer I have talked to or read about has said that split work outs can create muscle imbalances in your body. Trainers which include Charles Poliquin, Gary Roberts and Andy O'Brien.

Types of full body work outs include Olympic weightlifting, plyometrics, gymnastics

Olympic weightlifting consists of clean and jerks, snatches, squats, deadlifts. I see you have a lot of that in your work out already but try to incorporate these more than just once a week. They work on your whole body, they teach you how to transfer your physical energy, teaches you about your bodies center of gravity when an external load is applied and it works on your power rather than just strength. Clean and jerks and snatches are two of the most underrated work outs for athletes.

Plyometrics are important as well. Teaching your muscles reaction time and increasing its speed. Sprinting is great and I like that you set aside time for that but you can work on this more during the week. Long distance sprinting and short spurts of stops and goes. Notice how sprinters are pretty jacked... There is a reason why. stationary jumps, lateral jumps, stairs, box jumps, hurdles. All great especially for hockey. Increases your explosion, your speed and your quickness. Both physically and mentally.

Gymnastics. Also some of the rippest guys I know. Also flexibility is obv insane. I could be wrong but I dont see simple work outs like push ups, air squats, air lunges, dips, pull ups in your work out. THATS CRAZY!


All you need is 45 minutes to an hour of an extreme work out involving 1,2 or all 3 of these work outs. No more than 45 minutes. 3 days of full body on, 1 day of rest. 3 days back on.

No more than an hour of working out. Rest your body. If you feel like you want to work more specifically on a certain muscle group later on in the day or night than you can do so with proper rest after you PROPERLY did a full body work out.



I think its just more efficient ( a lot more actually) to spend your time and energy on (for example) pull ups than pull downs. Pull ups forces your body to work on MORE muscles. WItha pull down your focusing your energy and movement on a specific part of your back and some shoulders and lats. A pull up your working on your abs, your entire back, your lats, your biceps, your full shoulders, your hips (trying to keep them up).

Why have a whole day of energy focused on bicep curls? Especially for a hockey player. If your working on full body 3 days on then your gonan be hitting your biceps a lot more.

I like to hold onto a bar, parrallel to the floor and pull myself up. 3 sets of that 15x I find that my biceps are pumped. My chest is attacked too. Im working on my core by keeping it up.



Your rest day can involve long jogs/bike riding or yoga? stretching. Rest day doesnt mean you sit on a couch all day

Thesensation19* 06-08-2013 05:58 PM

Oh another great thing over split workouts is a full body routine allows you to burn more calories. If your doing bicep curls and your burning calories... your only burning the fat that pertains to that muscle group. A full body routine burns your entire bodies fat and getting use to that style will keep your fat burning up even when your on a rest day.

Wooty 06-09-2013 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thesensation19 (Post 67217391)
your only burning the fat that pertains to that muscle group. A full body routine burns your entire bodies fat

As far as I understand it, this is not true.

Jarick 06-10-2013 09:31 AM

Yeah, I would not listen to that advice. For all intents and purposes, you can't spot-reduce body fat.

To the OP, what are you trying to achieve? You've got a bodybuilder workout with a bit of agility sprinkled in and IMO too many exercises. If you're pushing any large amount of weight with your lifts, I'd bet you're not getting enough rest. If you're not, it's probably holding you back.

Thesensation19* 06-10-2013 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wooty (Post 67266013)
As far as I understand it, this is not true.

The only way I would agree with you is if you are pertaining to the word only... I might have been strict in that statement but let me explain further.

If you are doing an exercise such as a bicep curl, will you burn calories and fat? Yes. Will you be burning the fat that pertains to your legs as much as if you were doing a leg exercise? No. I dont believe so.

Doing full body work outs will help burn fat throughout your entire body AS WELL AS burn more fat and calories in general.

Thesensation19* 06-10-2013 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarick (Post 67282859)
Yeah, I would not listen to that advice. For all intents and purposes, you can't spot-reduce body fat.

To the OP, what are you trying to achieve? You've got a bodybuilder workout with a bit of agility sprinkled in and IMO too many exercises. If you're pushing any large amount of weight with your lifts, I'd bet you're not getting enough rest. If you're not, it's probably holding you back.

So do not listen to my advice of full body work outs over split work outs because I said that it can reduce specific body fat in specific areas?

So are you saying work outs that incorporate your entire body unlike the schedule he has listed above does not...

1) burn more fat
2) create muscle imbalances
3) would be more efficient for a hockey player in his strength and conditioning?

Because if you are saying that any of those are false than I believe trainers such as Gary Roberts, Charles Poliquin, Mark Verstegen, Andy O'Brien and many other professional trainers would highly disagree with you.

**
Either way, I agree with your final statement. His schedule is similar to a modern day body builder, even if you account for the days effort of sprinting and running. It also seems to specific and no variety from week to week.

Like my previous advice stated, I would recommend 3 days on of full body work outs and 1 day rest then 3 days on and 1 day rest again and so on and so on...

The full body work outs should incorporate on a weekly basis (especially for a hockey player) the basic but powerful lifts of 1) Dead Lift 2) Squat 3) Clean and Jerks 4) Snatch 5) Bench press 6) pull ups 7) pull ups. Could be missing some big ones.

Try to aim for 45 minutes in your daily work out. Definately no longer than an hour. If you go more than an hour you over pushing your body or your not intense enough and thus not as much gains.

I would say stay away from machines too. For example, dont go on the gravitron pull up machine. Studies show that bigger gains are followed through doing pull ups/chin ups until you "die" (cant do anymore) rather than using the machine itself.

I would save time by doing chin ups rather than bicep curls too.

The 45 minutes of workout does not correlate with a proper 15 minute warm up and stretch.

Thesensation19* 06-10-2013 12:05 PM

Look at what Gary Roberts has Steve Stamkos and his other clients do... (the same things he has amateurs or junior players or even CEO of companies who want to get healthy)

They have a larger gym. They do a ton of pull ups, jumps, resistant movements, sprints, dead lifts, squats. The entire bio steel camp, never seen any of them (in 3 years so far) work on bicep curls.

Andy O'Brien has Crosby, Duchene and others working on sprints, jumps, core work, glute work and many of the same exercises that you can sprinters like Usain Bolt work on in his yearly routines.

Charles Poliquin is a world renown trainer whose also taught Olympians and athletes of all sports and hes actually been the trainer or mentor at some point to both of these trainers above. Highly successful but highly knowledgable and can find so many of his ideals online in small articles with references

Jarick 06-10-2013 12:37 PM

You don't burn "bicep fat" by doing bicep curls. That's not how the body works.

Akhockeyguy 06-10-2013 03:48 PM

Ok so did you mean something like this:
Monday compound lifts
Tuesday compound lifts
Wednesday compound lifts
Thursday off
Friday, Saturday and Sunday compound lifts
Or something like this?
Monday, Wednesday, Friday compound lifts
Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday plyometrics or sprints

Jarick 06-10-2013 04:40 PM

AK, what are you trying to do? Gain weight, lose weight, improve strength, improve endurance, improve quickness, look good for the beach?

Akhockeyguy 06-10-2013 04:45 PM

I am trying to improve quickness and stamina.

Jarick 06-10-2013 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thesensation19 (Post 67297741)
If not explain further rather than end everything on a one liner because saying yes or no to something doesnt really help me or him or anyone reading this.

Fat isn't "burned" off through exercise. The body is constantly turning food into fatty acids (among other things) which enter and exit fat deposits 24 hours a day. You either gain or lose fat depending on how much more or less food you take in versus what you expend through activities.

Fat storage is done throughout the body but different people are prone to storing fat in different areas. You can't pick and choose where your body wants to store or release fat.

It can get a lot more complicated if hormones are out of normal levels, which is why sleep, stress, and other factors may be considered. But for most people, it's diet first, then exercise.

I would read here if you want to learn as much as possible about the science behind fat loss.

Jarick 06-10-2013 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhockeyguy (Post 67303273)
I am trying to improve quickness and stamina.

For hockey stamina, interval training is excellent if you're already in decent shape. Sprints, biking, jump rope, kettlebells, etc. Do that twice a week.

For lifting, I would check out Starting Strength and focus on those key exercises. I like the key lifts, like squats, deadlifts, power cleans, bench press, overhead press, rows/pullups. I think if you do one big lift and one accessory lift per day properly, like 2-3 warmup sets and then 3 work sets with 5-10 reps, that should be PLENTY.

But I wouldn't be so aggressive in adding weight and eating so many calories. That can lead to injury and fat gain. That happened to me last year. Was squatting and deadlifting and adding pounds every day like the book said, but then I hurt my back and had to take time off. And I gained about 15 pounds, only half of which was muscle, over a few months.

On the ice I was quicker and had better recovery on the bench. The workouts helped quite a bit. If I were to do it again I'd do the workouts but with maybe 6-8 reps and add weight once a week, not every time I lifted. And don't get so excited about eating, we're not power lifters or football players, we're hockey players and need to try and be lean for endurance.

Thesensation19* 06-10-2013 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhockeyguy (Post 67300715)
Ok so did you mean something like this:
Monday compound lifts
Tuesday compound lifts
Wednesday compound lifts
Thursday off
Friday, Saturday and Sunday compound lifts
Or something like this?
Monday, Wednesday, Friday compound lifts
Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday plyometrics or sprints


I am assuming (though your not specific) that your referring to my suggestion.

I am also going to assume your trying to be a little funny with this statement. Yet its as simple as this...

Look at the pros, you ever see any of the top guys focus a whole day on biceps, a whole day on shoulders. Then rest that muscle group for 7 days?? Your original post is a split routine. For hockey strength and conditioning, that is inefficient and not really sport specific.

They workout 7 days a week including a proper rest day, for 45 minutes or so. High intensity, working on full body. With a little more focus on work outs like Dead lifts (single leg, both legs, dumbbell, barbell...), squats (front, back, overhead, air, kettlebell, full, parallel), lunges, pull ups (wide grip, close grip, weighted) chin ups, rope climbing... basically work outs that mainly focus on legs, back, core (abs, glutes).

You say compound like its boring and ineffective but its pretty simple.

Like today I started with sets of dead lifts. I did about 5 real sets (varying weight) and to finish off on it I did a set of 1 rep each for about 3 more times.

I then when onto doing back extensions. 3 sets and in between each set (varying loads added) i was doing as many pull ups as I can. Then I did parallel lifts 3x to failure(dk the name of it, but its where I was parallel to the ground and grabbed a bar that was like 3-4 feet off the ground, kept my feet stationary and using my arms to pull myself up)

I then worked on some lunges quickly. After that I held onto the pull up bar for as long as I can, two hands, then one hands. 2 rounds each.

I finished with superman back extensions starting from the floor, some ab work outs, hand stand push ups (i basically held it for 15 seconds then tried to do as many as I can 3x) and forearm curls.



Tomorrow I will work more on body weight techniques and gymnastic style training. calve work outs, body weight squats (high reps), some wide pull ups, and some more ab work outs, maybe lateral lunges. Anything to work on balance, improve my flexibility. I may even go for a 3 mile run.

Yesterday I did some plyometrics. Sprints. 300 meters, 100 meters, 20 meters, and cone work. Jumps.

Thesensation19* 06-10-2013 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarick (Post 67304369)
For hockey stamina, interval training is excellent if you're already in decent shape. Sprints, biking, jump rope, kettlebells, etc. Do that twice a week.

For lifting, I would check out Starting Strength and focus on those key exercises. I like the key lifts, like squats, deadlifts, power cleans, bench press, overhead press, rows/pullups. I think if you do one big lift and one accessory lift per day properly, like 2-3 warmup sets and then 3 work sets with 5-10 reps, that should be PLENTY.

But I wouldn't be so aggressive in adding weight and eating so many calories. That can lead to injury and fat gain. That happened to me last year. Was squatting and deadlifting and adding pounds every day like the book said, but then I hurt my back and had to take time off. And I gained about 15 pounds, only half of which was muscle, over a few months.

On the ice I was quicker and had better recovery on the bench. The workouts helped quite a bit. If I were to do it again I'd do the workouts but with maybe 6-8 reps and add weight once a week, not every time I lifted. And don't get so excited about eating, we're not power lifters or football players, we're hockey players and need to try and be lean for endurance.

Very well said.
I also took time in reading the crossfit introduction book. Not entirely bought into Crossfit but their guides are great.

They suggested the 3 days on, 1 day off. Where I use to do 5 days a week an 1 day off. I personally found it better especially since I increased my intensity.

They split the types of workouts into gymnastics, weight lifting, cardio. (gymnastics is part of plyometrics because its considered body weight exerc)

And day 1 you would do only Oly Weights. Where you mainly focus on a specific type of work out or two.
Day 2, you do oly weights and gymnastics. So you increase your variety. Like squats then mix it in with dips.
Day 3 you mix in all 3. So you would do like shoulder presses, pull ups and then jump rope.

Take a rest day in day 4where you would go for a bike rideor something
Day 5 you then do a full day of gymnastics
day 6 you mix gymnastics and cardio
day 7 you mix in all 3 again

day 8 you have rest day and you do swimming.


I have not incorporated any of this fully buy I have tried to go 3 days then rest and incorprorate a lot of this ideology. Just havnt done it fully because of time.

I found it to be more effective in my hockey training and overall fitness levels to work on lifts like the clean and jerk and other compound training. Then spend time on dumbells and be more specific muscles when I have time and I feel up to it.

lokomotiv15 06-10-2013 09:39 PM

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/berardi52.htm

Hockey gladiator work-out. Got me through many junior camps.

Thesensation19* 06-11-2013 08:17 AM

Here are some work outs you should also do that would be great for hockey...

1) Side-way lungs up hill: find a nice hill, preferably grassy or dirt. Start from the bottom and do side way lunges up it. You can perform downwards as well but try to really focus on the up hill.

I learned somewhere that hockey kinematics needs you to be impacting the ice (with your skates) as much as possible or you lose speed. We perform so many lateral exercises and jumping exercises that our body gets use to getting off the ground. Exercises like sled pulls and pushes (car pushes as well) and even up hill work is great for hockey skaters.

2) Hurdles. As much as I agree with the point i tried to make above, we also have to work on quick reactions and setting up like 3-7 or whatever hurdles for high knees and jumps is a great thing for hockey speed.

Look up some well known speed skaters. Check out their olympic work outs. There job is to get faster on ice through skating. So its great template too. Apollo has a sick routine. His insanity asylum tapes are pretty generic but good to incorporate for that 1-3 months in the off-season as well.



Its the summer. Try to swim a lot. Vince Wilfork said it perfectly. He just recently started to swim a lot for his offseason routine and hes noticed not only a great difference in his strength and flexibility but he feels better entering the summer camps because its less stress on his body. Hockey is not much different in this sense.

TheSkatingDead 06-11-2013 08:43 AM

I've done some research on this as I was wondering the same... from that I've learned you should incorporate three main parts: Cardio, plyometrics and weights. You can check out my plan HERE and a nice thread over at ModSquadHockey HERE.

Good luck, be safe and have fun!

Wooty 06-11-2013 11:27 AM

If you want to lose fat anywhere on your body the ideal place to focus on your body would be to exercise and build the largest muscle. The butt or thigh muscles would be a good place - that is why so many want you to do squats, deadlifts etc.

Working many muscles, including the big ones will cause more fat loss all over the body because bigger muscles burn more calories and more muscles burn more calories.

The issue about full body vs split body workouts is not related to this.

hersky77 06-11-2013 07:29 PM

My offseason routines, consists of pure core exercises, and plyo. I only tend to spend one day on upperbody, I want to become more explosive and I feel its working already.

rokkinman139 06-11-2013 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hersky77 (Post 67355995)
My offseason routines, consists of pure core exercises, and plyo. I only tend to spend one day on upperbody, I want to become more explosive and I feel its working already.

It really all depends on what you're looking to do. I needed to gain mass this offseason for juniors, so I do a lot of lifting instead of plyo. If you're looking for what Hersky is looking for, then do what he does.

Akhockeyguy 06-11-2013 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hersky77 (Post 67355995)
My offseason routines, consists of pure core exercises, and plyo. I only tend to spend one day on upperbody, I want to become more explosive and I feel its working already.

So are you saying that you do plyometrics, core and one day of upper body? Any leg weights days?

hersky77 06-11-2013 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhockeyguy (Post 67360523)
So are you saying that you do plyometrics, core and one day of upper body? Any leg weights days?

By core I mean, back squats, dead lifts, lunges etc.., exercises that work out both the legs and core at the same time.

Akhockeyguy 06-12-2013 12:10 AM

Oh ok


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