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-   -   Proposal: EDM and CLB (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1468453)

oilinblood 07-13-2013 06:16 AM

EDM and CLB
 
Ok. This is based on me knowing Hemsky and Perron are both roving wingers. Hemsky worked best with Samsonov --who was a roving winger-- and hasnt had a real chemistry with any other player before or since. I catch 15-20 STL games a year and feel the same about Perron. He likes to roam and stick handle and normally ends up boxing himself to limited options. I think they might work well together, having seen Sammy and Hemmer click instantly.
So as much as i would have loved to have sold Hemmer and gotten out of the circle and give away game... since we picked up Perron id love to see if they mesh. Which means I need to trade Gags AND get a centre back. We have no shortage of offense so we can drop the offensive upside of incoming C who isnt over his head in a top 6 role... i just need a dependable C in draws and a physical winger.

I propose

TO CLB
Gagner


TO EDM
Dubinsky
Foligno


I am also keeping in mind CLB acquired Horton and being a big Bs fan I think if Gags ever was his pivot, Horton would make Gags better and in return feed perfect passes to Horts.
close?

ZeroPT 07-13-2013 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilinblood (Post 69160049)
Ok. This is based on me knowing Hemsky and Perron are both roving wingers. Hemsky worked best with Samsonov --who was a roving winger-- and hasnt had a real chemistry with any other player before or since. I catch 15-20 STL games a year and feel the same about Perron. He likes to roam and stick handle and normally ends up boxing himself to limited options. I think they might work well together, having seen Sammy and Hemmer click instantly.
So as much as i would have loved to have sold Hemmer and gotten out of the circle and give away game... since we picked up Perron id love to see if they mesh. Which means I need to trade Gags AND get a centre back. We have no shortage of offense so we can drop the offensive upside of incoming C who isnt over his head in a top 6 role... i just need a dependable C in draws and a physical winger.

I propose

TO CLB
Gagner


TO EDM
Dubinsky
Foligno


I am also keeping in mind CLB acquired Horton and being a big Bs fan I think if Gags ever was his pivot, Horton would make Gags better and in return feed perfect passes to Horts.
close?

Alot more will have to be going the other way for this to happen. CBJ is getting fleeced

nzoilerfan 07-13-2013 07:22 AM

Ummm yea we would have to add quite a bit to Gagner to make this deal. I like it as a start though.

CBJ used to be rumoured to be interested in Hemsky. Would they take him at 2.5m along with say a 3rd then a conditional 2014 3rd if he doesn't resign

TaketheCannoli 07-13-2013 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nzoilerfan (Post 69160543)
Ummm yea we would have to add quite a bit to Gagner to make this deal. I like it as a start though.

CBJ used to be rumoured to be interested in Hemsky. Would they take him at 2.5m along with say a 3rd then a conditional 2014 3rd if he doesn't resign


No

I suggest everyone go back to the drawing board. The OP made a trade from the Oilers perspective with barely a cursory glance at Columbus's needs. Additionally, while no one is untouchable Dubinsky is a team leader who is as likely as anyone to be named captain.

Putting Hemsky in the deal just makes it worse. Edmonton fans have been trying to ship Hemsky to Columbus for years. I think this started because supposedly Scott Howson just loves Hemsky's game. If so, then everything is right with Hemsky because Howson is back with the Oilers. A match made in heaven (or hell.)

Columbus needs a young scoring left wing. Center is a position of strength.

Edmonton needs leadership and grit.

Try again

Matt Foley 07-13-2013 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaketheCannoli (Post 69160879)
Edmonton needs leadership and grit.

Some decent defensemen and an upgrade in goal wouldn't hurt, either.

Turrican* 07-13-2013 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Foley (Post 69161189)
Some decent defensemen and an upgrade in goal wouldn't hurt, either.

What's wrong with Dubnyks stats?

Matt Foley 07-13-2013 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turrican (Post 69161219)
What's wrong with Dubnyks stats?

Nothing - I just don't believe that he's the guy that will take your team to the next level. Just my opinion - if I'm wrong, so be it.

Leadership, grit and better defense are higher priorities for the Oil, though.

Otherwise...

Agreed re: Cannoli's point about the Jackets needing a winger (with grit, preferably) more than a center.

Also, can the ideas of Hemsky to Columbus please stop? Howson is no longer GM of the Jackets, which Oiler fans of all people should realize by now.

Petes2424 07-13-2013 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilinblood (Post 69160049)
Ok. This is based on me knowing Hemsky and Perron are both roving wingers. Hemsky worked best with Samsonov --who was a roving winger-- and hasnt had a real chemistry with any other player before or since. I catch 15-20 STL games a year and feel the same about Perron. He likes to roam and stick handle and normally ends up boxing himself to limited options. I think they might work well together, having seen Sammy and Hemmer click instantly.
So as much as i would have loved to have sold Hemmer and gotten out of the circle and give away game... since we picked up Perron id love to see if they mesh. Which means I need to trade Gags AND get a centre back. We have no shortage of offense so we can drop the offensive upside of incoming C who isnt over his head in a top 6 role... i just need a dependable C in draws and a physical winger.

I propose

TO CLB
Gagner


TO EDM
Dubinsky
Foligno


I am also keeping in mind CLB acquired Horton and being a big Bs fan I think if Gags ever was his pivot, Horton would make Gags better and in return feed perfect passes to Horts.
close?

You only move guys like Dubinsky and Foligno in that type of package if you're getting a game changer. Like I could've seen that package go for Gaborik let's say.

Now, Gagner is extremely underrated on these boards. The guy is still only 23 and accomplished more in the NHL than the majority of 23 year old young players discussed around here. That said though, he's going to be tough to move right now to get what the Oilers need in return. They'll need another C for sure.

So you look at the teams that have that or a top pairing D for sale and there's just not many out there. StL would've been a great fit until they signed Roy. Dallas might still be a good fit. Depends if they are convinced Seguin can play C or not. Maybe the Islanders would like more now than later and peddle Nelson (although I wouldnt) and Matt Martin or the rights to Ullstrom.. It would have to be a trade like that at this point. Fair value but teams that just might be looking for a different element.

pete goegan 07-13-2013 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nzoilerfan (Post 69160543)
CBJ used to be rumoured to be interested in Hemsky. Would they take him at 2.5m along with say a 3rd then a conditional 2014 3rd if he doesn't resign

There has never, ever, been a trade proposal regarding Hemsky to Columbus started by a CBJ fan. Fine player, and all, but not what the Jackets need or want, he just does not fit with what is being built in Columbus by Davidson and Kelelainen. As for the original proposal, both Dubinsky and Foligno are highly valued by the CBJ for their attitudes, work ethic, and toughness. Both were a bit disappointing on offense this past season, but a rebound is expected (hoped?) for both. Center is not a position of need, at the moment, so Gagner doesn't make much sense.

bizzz 07-13-2013 09:32 AM

The Oil should trade for Nikitin from the CBJ. Him and Belov were combined on the top pair in Omsk during the lock-out.
Won't trade neither Foligno nor Duby for Gagner.

pete goegan 07-13-2013 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bizzz (Post 69162283)
The Oil should trade for Nikitin from the CBJ. Him and Belov were combined on the top pair in Omsk during the lock-out.
Won't trade neither Foligno nor Duby for Gagner.

Nikitin could be available, bizzz, who would you think the Jackets would want from EDM for him?

bizzz 07-13-2013 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete goegan (Post 69162329)
Nikitin could be available, bizzz, who would you think the Jackets would want from EDM for him?

I'm not good at making trade proposals. But Nikitin is UFA next summer, so I don't think he could fetch high value from Edmonton. I don't think the Jackets need Hemsky or Gagner, they just don't fit the new team's identity. So I guess it could be for picks or prospects.

96 07-13-2013 09:53 AM

Do the Jackets need another RW? Wouldn't Hemsky be going from a situation where he's stuck as the 3rd line RW (and not suitable for 3rd line duties) to another? Columbus has Gaborik and Horton, both of whom are probably above Hemsky on the depth chart.

bizzz 07-13-2013 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 96 (Post 69162675)
Do the Jackets need another RW? Wouldn't Hemsky be going from a situation where he's stuck as the 3rd line RW (and not suitable for 3rd line duties) to another? Columbus has Gaborik and Horton, both of whom are probably above Hemsky on the depth chart.

You've answered your question.

Mayor Bee 07-13-2013 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaketheCannoli (Post 69160879)
No

I suggest everyone go back to the drawing board. The OP made a trade from the Oilers perspective with barely a cursory glance at Columbus's needs. Additionally, while no one is untouchable Dubinsky is a team leader who is as likely as anyone to be named captain.

Putting Hemsky in the deal just makes it worse. Edmonton fans have been trying to ship Hemsky to Columbus for years. I think this started because supposedly Scott Howson just loves Hemsky's game. If so, then everything is right with Hemsky because Howson is back with the Oilers. A match made in heaven (or hell.)

Columbus needs a young scoring left wing. Center is a position of strength.

Edmonton needs leadership and grit.

Try again

The last five years on these boards, summed up in one post.

Double-Shift Lassť 07-13-2013 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 96 (Post 69162675)
Do the Jackets need another RW? Wouldn't Hemsky be going from a situation where he's stuck as the 3rd line RW (and not suitable for 3rd line duties) to another? Columbus has Gaborik and Horton, both of whom are probably above Hemsky on the depth chart.

You are correct, I think. If, that is, your point is "The Jackets do not want Ales Hemsky. Stop bringing him up in propsals that involve the CBJ."

Viqsi 07-13-2013 11:19 AM

I have to admit, as soon as I saw the name "Hemsky" be the first player mentioned I was shaking my head and saying "this will not end well"...

* * *
Quote:

Originally Posted by bizzz (Post 69162583)
I'm not good at making trade proposals. But Nikitin is UFA next summer, so I don't think he could fetch high value from Edmonton. I don't think the Jackets need Hemsky or Gagner, they just don't fit the new team's identity. So I guess it could be for picks or prospects.

...and if we trade Nikitin, I want an NHLer. Preferably a LW.

96 07-13-2013 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť (Post 69163595)
You are correct, I think. If, that is, your point is "The Jackets do not want Ales Hemsky. Stop bringing him up in propsals that involve the CBJ."

Honestly, I just saw the Hemsky stuff at the top of the thread and thought the proposal was for Hemsky to CBJ. Probably because I've seen that proposed about a million times on here.

supert 07-13-2013 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilinblood (Post 69160049)
Ok. This is based on me knowing Hemsky and Perron are both roving wingers. Hemsky worked best with Samsonov --who was a roving winger-- and hasnt had a real chemistry with any other player before or since. I catch 15-20 STL games a year and feel the same about Perron. He likes to roam and stick handle and normally ends up boxing himself to limited options. I think they might work well together, having seen Sammy and Hemmer click instantly.
So as much as i would have loved to have sold Hemmer and gotten out of the circle and give away game... since we picked up Perron id love to see if they mesh. Which means I need to trade Gags AND get a centre back. We have no shortage of offense so we can drop the offensive upside of incoming C who isnt over his head in a top 6 role... i just need a dependable C in draws and a physical winger.

I propose

TO CLB
Gagner


TO EDM
Dubinsky
Foligno


I am also keeping in mind CLB acquired Horton and being a big Bs fan I think if Gags ever was his pivot, Horton would make Gags better and in return feed perfect passes to Horts.
close?

Funny i was going to post this trade . Only thing it was going to be a one for one deal Gags for Dubinsky . I think is fair Gags is better on offence . Dubinsky is bigger better on the D side of things . I think it would be a good trade for both teams . I am not sure how CBJ feels as i do not watch them enough to know their needs .

Crede777 07-13-2013 11:52 AM

If it hasn't already been stated...

NO from a CBJ perspective. Dubinsky and Gagner are similar (if not equal) in value so why would they add Foligno?

It's essentially a 2nd line center and a 2nd line winger for a 2nd line center. That's terrible value.

Viqsi 07-13-2013 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by supert (Post 69164995)
Funny i was going to post this trade . Only thing it was going to be a one for one deal Gags for Dubinsky . I think is fair Gags is better on offence . Dubinsky is bigger better on the D side of things . I think it would be a good trade for both teams . I am not sure how CBJ feels as i do not watch them enough to know their needs .

Gagner is of some small interest - additional scoring skill is generally always welcome. Giving up Dubinsky is very much against our interests - he's arguably our best defensive forward and one of the frontrunners for the C. So... not really.

richardsequalscup* 07-13-2013 03:12 PM

Sorry, but the Oilers don't need to add anything more in this deal. Foligno at best will be a 30 point, checking center. Dubinsky more often than not is a fat, out of shape slob who goes into 20-30 game stretches where he does squat. IMO, he has little desire to be a very good NHL player. Gagne is by far the best player in this deal. He's also the youngest player in this deal. If I was the Jackets, I would make this deal in a second. Considering the amount of picks they had this year, you can easily find a Foligno in the draft. So basically it's Gagne for Dubinsky which is a clear win for the Jackets.

Crede777 07-13-2013 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by setkreiderfree (Post 69171831)
Sorry, but the Oilers don't need to add anything more in this deal. Foligno at best will be a 30 point, checking center. Dubinsky more often than not is a fat, out of shape slob who goes into 20-30 game stretches where he does squat. IMO, he has little desire to be a very good NHL player. Gagne is by far the best player in this deal. He's also the youngest player in this deal. If I was the Jackets, I would make this deal in a second. Considering the amount of picks they had this year, you can easily find a Foligno in the draft. So basically it's Gagne for Dubinsky which is a clear win for the Jackets.

1. Foligno doesn't play center. He's a winger.
2. He has already surpassed 30 points last year when he got 47.
3. Dubinsky is actually in very good physical shape.
4. It's Gagner not Gagne.

You basically are wrong on every point except for stating that Gagner is the youngest player in the deal. I would recommend learning a bit more about the players and lurking the forum before posting more comments.

HeavyHitter99 07-13-2013 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by setkreiderfree (Post 69171831)
Sorry, but the Oilers don't need to add anything more in this deal. Foligno at best will be a 30 point, checking center. Dubinsky more often than not is a fat, out of shape slob who goes into 20-30 game stretches where he does squat. IMO, he has little desire to be a very good NHL player. Gagne is by far the best player in this deal. He's also the youngest player in this deal. If I was the Jackets, I would make this deal in a second. Considering the amount of picks they had this year, you can easily find a Foligno in the draft. So basically it's Gagne for Dubinsky which is a clear win for the Jackets.

Everything about this is wrong and that's coming from an Oiler fan. We need to add to Gagner here easily.

stevo61 07-13-2013 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by setkreiderfree (Post 69171831)
Sorry, but the Oilers don't need to add anything more in this deal. Foligno at best will be a 30 point, checking center. Dubinsky more often than not is a fat, out of shape slob who goes into 20-30 game stretches where he does squat. IMO, he has little desire to be a very good NHL player. Gagne is by far the best player in this deal. He's also the youngest player in this deal. If I was the Jackets, I would make this deal in a second. Considering the amount of picks they had this year, you can easily find a Foligno in the draft. So basically it's Gagne for Dubinsky which is a clear win for the Jackets.

We'll just take our chances with our fat slob and our checking center that doesn't play center


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