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-   -   Proposal: Toronto - Pittsburgh (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1475019)

CMammoliti81 07-24-2013 07:16 PM

Toronto - Pittsburgh
 
Doubt something like this would ever happen considering how deep the Leafs are with wingers, but what would Penguins fans think of this?

To Toronto:

LW - James Neal
D - Matt Niskanen

To Pittsburgh:

LW - Nikolai Kulemin
D - Jake Gardiner
D - John-Michael Liles
LW/RW - Tyler Biggs
1st Round Pick in 2014

Again, this is just for value purposes, I know it doesn't really address either team's needs and I know it may not make sense in terms of cap space. This is just a proposal for discussion of fair or unfair value.

Drennan57* 07-24-2013 07:17 PM

Enough with the Toronto proposals. At least wait until tomorrow.

Roo Mad Bro 07-24-2013 07:20 PM

Terrible for the Leafs.

Leafs don't have a Dallas Brad Richards or a Malkin to center a line with Neal on it so he can do nothing except fire shots all game dished by elite centers.

Mo Wanchuk 07-24-2013 07:20 PM

James Neal is a non-starter. He is attached to Malkin's hip for the foreseeable future. He's on a great contract and has amazing chemistry with Geno. Easy no from the Pen's perspective.

mr sidney crosby 07-24-2013 07:22 PM

No keep up the Toronto proposals. We have to put up with 50 Edmonton proposals a day. Also, I like the value going back to the penguins. Leafs get a 40 goal scorer and a guy that can give them minutes. The penguins get a lot of pieces meaning that can add some depth to the penguins roster.

officialmark7* 07-24-2013 07:23 PM

Leafs fan saying no thanks.

FishManSam 07-24-2013 07:24 PM

Please stop, awful for Toronto.

416Leafer 07-24-2013 07:25 PM

If we're trading a package that includes Gardiner, Kulemin, 1st round pick, and 1st round prospect (Biggs)... We better be getting a young(ish) #1 C back. And a pretty good one, that package is decently better value than what either Richards or Carter got given the value of Simmonds/Voracek at the time of the trade.

Leafs have NO reason to trade for a winger. We probably have top 5 winger depth in the league. Its considered the least important position in hockey. We DONT need to give up valuable pieces to add a winger.

orby 07-24-2013 07:34 PM

This benefits neither team. Leafs aren't looking for a top-6 winger, Pens aren't looking for even more defensemen. Easy pass from both sides.

As far as value goes, I would have to say Toronto is giving up much more in this proposal. This would be brutal for the Leafs.

CMammoliti81 07-24-2013 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orby (Post 69579893)
This benefits neither team. Leafs aren't looking for a top-6 winger, Pens aren't looking for even more defensemen. Easy pass from both sides.

I don't think I asked if it benefits either team or not, I asked purely for fair value.

Jaromir Jagrbombs 07-24-2013 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orby (Post 69579893)
This benefits neither team. Leafs aren't looking for a top-6 winger, Pens aren't looking for even more defensemen. Easy pass from both sides.

As far as value goes, I would have to say Toronto is giving up much more in this proposal. This would be brutal for the Leafs.

This is my thinking also. Pittsburgh literally has 0 reason to move Neal for fair value, he's a perfect fit playing on Malkin's wing. And as others have said, Toronto doesn't need more wingers. Doesn't really make sense for either team. But purely looking at the value without addressing needs or anything, I would say Toronto is giving up a bit too much, although it's not like JML has any value at all.

WilliamNylander 07-24-2013 07:50 PM

Would do this for malkin


Not Neal though

TorstenFrings 07-24-2013 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMammoliti81 (Post 69579987)
I don't think I asked if it benefits either team or not, I asked purely for fair value.

It's a bit of a weird question though, because it isn't some money transfer where you have an objective value printed on it. Gardiner has less value to Pittburgh than he may have to another team and Liles and his bad contract have negative value to them. You are trying to sell French spring water to a drowning man and get fair value.

Besides, we don't know where the 1st will even fall, so I wouldn't even be sure that Gardiner + late 1st + Biggs (the other three basically cancelling out) is that good an offer for Neal to begin with.

Zirakzigil 07-24-2013 08:00 PM

Gardiner and Liles are worthless for the Penguins. They wont trade Neal ever. Hes on a solid contract and a perfect fit for Malkin.

Rowdy Roddy Peeper 07-24-2013 08:04 PM

The rare proposal that's terrible for both teams.

Man Bear Pig 07-24-2013 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zirakzigil (Post 69580699)
Gardiner and Liles are worthless for the Penguins. They wont trade Neal ever. Hes on a solid contract and a perfect fit for Malkin.

Malkin and Kulemin have ridiculous chemistry in all fairness. And Gardiner is far from worthless to the Pens. Having Letang and Gardiner on your first and second pairing would be filthy.

LeafsNation149 07-24-2013 08:26 PM

Toronto does this why? they already have a locked top 6 they don't need another goalscorer especially when giving up one of our best players being gardiner

3074326 07-24-2013 08:28 PM

Pens get worse on the wing and add more defenders. Absolutely not. Dealing from an organizational weakness to get an organizational strength is bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMammoliti81 (Post 69579987)
I don't think I asked if it benefits either team or not, I asked purely for fair value.

Value and team benefit might as well be the same thing.

BigBenSF* 07-24-2013 08:28 PM

Pens would win this trade hands down but Neal is locked down on a good contract and has insane chemistry with Malkin, so it's a nogo.

orby 07-24-2013 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMammoliti81 (Post 69579987)
I don't think I asked if it benefits either team or not, I asked purely for fair value.

Why is value important if you know the proposal is absurd? There's not really any way to gauge the value of pieces of a trade that neither team would do.

Quares27 07-24-2013 09:03 PM

Why sacrifice all that depth for James Neal when we already have some good scoring wingers? makes no sense

Waffle Fries 07-24-2013 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Man Bear Pig (Post 69580879)
Malkin and Kulemin have ridiculous chemistry in all fairness. And Gardiner is far from worthless to the Pens. Having Letang and Gardiner on your first and second pairing would be filthy.

Gardiner is a great player, but he'd be redundant on the Penguins. We have a plethora of PMDs both on the current roster and in the pipeline.

The chemistry Kulemin has with Malkin does not compare to the chemistry Malkin has with Neal. (Which is more proven over a bigger sample size)

As for the rest of the deal, the Pens would be moving Niskanen for cap space and because we currently have 8 dmen on the big league roster, and some other defensive prospects who could be fighting for NHL time but are waiting in the minors. So why would they trade Niskanen for a more expensive, arguably worse version of him who's signed for three years?

I know the OP keeps saying he's asking about value, but value is relative to team need and this doesn't help either team.

EscapeGoat 07-24-2013 09:20 PM

James Neal isn't great without Malkin. Pass.

BeerMe 07-24-2013 09:59 PM

They say that you know a trade is good when both fan bases hate it. I believe this is the exception to that rule.

JVRIELLYKADRI 07-24-2013 10:04 PM

What an awful trade for the Leafs, another top 6 winger would be redundant, I wouldn't trade Gardiner straight up for Neal, let alone add all those pieces.


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